"Asian" massage?
October 25, 2018 3:42 PM Subscribe
I'm looking to have a garden-variety, aboveboard massage of my neck, shoulders, and maybe hands and feet. I googled "massage" and my zip code. It turns out that I'm within walking distance of a couple of places that show up under the heading "Asian massage." Does that come with..."connotations"?
Even if so, is it possible to just go to one of these to get a regular massage (the location and the hours work for me -- n.b., I'm a straight woman with a nonstandard schedule)? Logistically, how do you request that? And is there any reason why this would be weird/bad/wrong/unethical?
I asked a similar question a while back. It seems some of these places are connected with human trafficking and some are perfectly legit, but I don't know really how you figure out which is which...one thing I did a couple of years ago was go to a place that had chair massages in the brightly lit front area where connotations would have been impossible.
Oh hey another thing I can totally recommend, though, depending on where you are: some towns have massage schools where the students, once they've received all their training, have to complete some hours, and the schools will have a "clinic" where they offer massage for MUCH less than you'd pay a pro in private practice. I do this somewhat frequently and it ranges from fine to great with zero possibility of connotations.
posted by Smearcase at 3:52 PM on October 25, 2018 [4 favorites]
Oh hey another thing I can totally recommend, though, depending on where you are: some towns have massage schools where the students, once they've received all their training, have to complete some hours, and the schools will have a "clinic" where they offer massage for MUCH less than you'd pay a pro in private practice. I do this somewhat frequently and it ranges from fine to great with zero possibility of connotations.
posted by Smearcase at 3:52 PM on October 25, 2018 [4 favorites]
Check Yelp. There's always going to be people bitching (they are often thinly-veiled in their racism and/or trying to insist on their champagne tastes in a beer-grade environment) but read between the lines to see if women are generally posting reviews a) at all b) that are generally good c) and not creepy or fakey.
The tough part of this, even relatively legit, is that if the services are cheap the workers are probably exploited to some extent and maybe still trafficked but maybe not primarily for the purposes of prostitution. Tip well and discretely directly to your service provider in cash, and then tip a nominal amount when you pay on the way out to cover up the cash tip.
posted by Lyn Never at 3:55 PM on October 25, 2018 [11 favorites]
The tough part of this, even relatively legit, is that if the services are cheap the workers are probably exploited to some extent and maybe still trafficked but maybe not primarily for the purposes of prostitution. Tip well and discretely directly to your service provider in cash, and then tip a nominal amount when you pay on the way out to cover up the cash tip.
posted by Lyn Never at 3:55 PM on October 25, 2018 [11 favorites]
Check out the storefront, either in person or on Street View. Most of the sketchy ones will give a sketchy vibe.
posted by Candleman at 4:06 PM on October 25, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by Candleman at 4:06 PM on October 25, 2018 [2 favorites]
In my area there are plenty of these. No "connotation"; it's all chair massage in a common room. I tip heavily straight to the provider in small bills, and feel fine about it.
posted by fingersandtoes at 4:37 PM on October 25, 2018
posted by fingersandtoes at 4:37 PM on October 25, 2018
Even if they don't offer "extras", a lot of these places are highly exploitative, and not getting "sketchy" vibes doesn't mean that they are not contributing to human trafficking or just generally
taking advantage of people who don't have much of a choice. Just like how you can't always tell that food is spoiled just by smelling it. It's more complicated than that.
posted by Aranquis at 4:53 PM on October 25, 2018 [3 favorites]
taking advantage of people who don't have much of a choice. Just like how you can't always tell that food is spoiled just by smelling it. It's more complicated than that.
posted by Aranquis at 4:53 PM on October 25, 2018 [3 favorites]
check the windows
blinds closed/curtains drawn = sketchy
you can see inside = legit massage
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:53 PM on October 25, 2018 [2 favorites]
blinds closed/curtains drawn = sketchy
you can see inside = legit massage
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:53 PM on October 25, 2018 [2 favorites]
In NYC I looked for specific things like "Tui-Na" and acupuncture-adjacent places, and I would definitely read Yelp reviews. I found them very helpful when I was having extreme tension-related headaches. I think it's sort of clear when it has a more 'medical' sort of vibe (and related reviews).
posted by bquarters at 6:21 PM on October 25, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by bquarters at 6:21 PM on October 25, 2018 [1 favorite]
My reflexology place is in a mall and very above board, with a wall that has everyone's massage certificates and a nice big sign on the wall with all the laws against trafficking. There is another non-mall place off post that also has the signs up. Also both places I go to have a mix of female and male masseuses? Which might be something to look out for. But I'm in SF which has had such a history of sketchy-ness in massage places that the non-sketchy places have their own vibe in a way to draw people in legit-ly.
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 6:27 PM on October 25, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 6:27 PM on October 25, 2018 [2 favorites]
As a registered massage therapist, it negatively impacts me and my profession when people undervalue our education, training, and responsibility to the public.
Massage therapy is very physically demanding and the profession has a very high burnout rate, with many people burning out before they can pay off their student loans from massage school.
It is hard to make a living as a massage therapist even if you aren't working in a cut-rate environment. It is unstable employment in an unreliable, yet demanding, industry, and part of the reason burnout is so common is massage therapists taking low-paying jobs that offer stability but require them to work more than they are physically and mentally capable of to make ends meet.
Widespread availability of cut-rate massage incentivises businesses to pay less to their employees or contractors in order to stay competitive, and makes the rest of the industry even more unstable.
People who do this work deserve to earn more than minimum wage or minimum wage +, which is what places like that often offer their workers.
It also negatively impacts me and my profession when the public conflates massage therapy and sex work, and places that are unclear about the licensure status of their massage professionals and the nature of services that they provide promote that confusion, even when they are not involved in sex work, as your question demonstrates.
I strongly encourage you to visit a licensed/registered massage therapist at standard rates and with unambiguous marketing practises if they exist in your area.
posted by windykites at 7:40 PM on October 25, 2018 [17 favorites]
Massage therapy is very physically demanding and the profession has a very high burnout rate, with many people burning out before they can pay off their student loans from massage school.
It is hard to make a living as a massage therapist even if you aren't working in a cut-rate environment. It is unstable employment in an unreliable, yet demanding, industry, and part of the reason burnout is so common is massage therapists taking low-paying jobs that offer stability but require them to work more than they are physically and mentally capable of to make ends meet.
Widespread availability of cut-rate massage incentivises businesses to pay less to their employees or contractors in order to stay competitive, and makes the rest of the industry even more unstable.
People who do this work deserve to earn more than minimum wage or minimum wage +, which is what places like that often offer their workers.
It also negatively impacts me and my profession when the public conflates massage therapy and sex work, and places that are unclear about the licensure status of their massage professionals and the nature of services that they provide promote that confusion, even when they are not involved in sex work, as your question demonstrates.
I strongly encourage you to visit a licensed/registered massage therapist at standard rates and with unambiguous marketing practises if they exist in your area.
posted by windykites at 7:40 PM on October 25, 2018 [17 favorites]
I notice many of the suggestions here don't take into account that you have a nonstandard schedule. I think the possibility of connotations has been covered well, so in case you decide not to check these places out, I'll offer a suggestion that works with nonstandard schedules: in-home massage apps. There are 2 main ones, Zeel and Soothe, both work in most major US cities, and both will deliver a massage therapist to your home until midnight local time in most places.
posted by rhiannonstone at 9:24 PM on October 25, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by rhiannonstone at 9:24 PM on October 25, 2018 [1 favorite]
If there are any women anywhere near the front of the store calling out "Massage?" or similar, it's a brothel.
posted by praemunire at 10:16 PM on October 25, 2018
posted by praemunire at 10:16 PM on October 25, 2018
I go to a registered massage therapist, trained by the local community college's massage professional program. We were talking about those quasi-prostitution "massage parlors" and I said, like: surely those are downtown, not in this boring-ass suburb. And he rattled off the names of three places I recognized from driving past strip malls nearby.
A "real" massage therapist (even a Western-style one) with years of experience in the area will know which "Asian" joints are legit and which ones are hinky. That knowledge comes from being part of the scene, networking with other local therapists, and hearing reports from new clients who say "you're much better than that other place I went to last year..." and spill the beans.
(When I decided I did want to try some real Asian massage, he recommended this small woman with strong muscles who crushed and yanked my body all over the place, "Shiatsu-Thai" style. Once I recovered, I was happy!)
posted by Harvey Kilobit at 11:43 PM on October 25, 2018
A "real" massage therapist (even a Western-style one) with years of experience in the area will know which "Asian" joints are legit and which ones are hinky. That knowledge comes from being part of the scene, networking with other local therapists, and hearing reports from new clients who say "you're much better than that other place I went to last year..." and spill the beans.
(When I decided I did want to try some real Asian massage, he recommended this small woman with strong muscles who crushed and yanked my body all over the place, "Shiatsu-Thai" style. Once I recovered, I was happy!)
posted by Harvey Kilobit at 11:43 PM on October 25, 2018
blinds closed/curtains drawn = sketchy
you can see inside = legit massage
At a glance, this, although as mentioned above there’s no reason to assume involuntary human trafficking is present at or limited to the sketchy ones. A few years ago it turned out my favorite busboy at an Indian restaurant was being held in slavery by his relatives who owned the place. People suck sometimes.
Even if so, is it possible to just go to one of these to get a regular massage?
Yes, but it probably won’t be a good one. The normal deal with these places is for the (usually somewhat shady) organization to provide sponsorship and paperwork to attractive young women in exchange for indentured servitude. Some of the women invest their downtime in learning real massage techniques, but most don’t.
Logistically, how do you request that?
It would be the default. They have to worry about the vice squad, so they wait for some pretty clear signals.
And is there any reason why this would be weird/bad/wrong/unethical?
Possibly. Virtually everything paid at the front desk and a percentage of the tip goes to the house. The "tip" for "services" usually has a lower bound of the original price of the massage. You won’t be tipping anywhere near that so the woman will end up with very little. On the other hand some work is better than no work. YMMV.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 9:00 AM on October 26, 2018 [1 favorite]
you can see inside = legit massage
At a glance, this, although as mentioned above there’s no reason to assume involuntary human trafficking is present at or limited to the sketchy ones. A few years ago it turned out my favorite busboy at an Indian restaurant was being held in slavery by his relatives who owned the place. People suck sometimes.
Even if so, is it possible to just go to one of these to get a regular massage?
Yes, but it probably won’t be a good one. The normal deal with these places is for the (usually somewhat shady) organization to provide sponsorship and paperwork to attractive young women in exchange for indentured servitude. Some of the women invest their downtime in learning real massage techniques, but most don’t.
Logistically, how do you request that?
It would be the default. They have to worry about the vice squad, so they wait for some pretty clear signals.
And is there any reason why this would be weird/bad/wrong/unethical?
Possibly. Virtually everything paid at the front desk and a percentage of the tip goes to the house. The "tip" for "services" usually has a lower bound of the original price of the massage. You won’t be tipping anywhere near that so the woman will end up with very little. On the other hand some work is better than no work. YMMV.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 9:00 AM on October 26, 2018 [1 favorite]
> Check Yelp. There's always going to be people bitching (they are often thinly-veiled in their racism and/or trying to insist on their champagne tastes in a beer-grade environment) but read between the lines to see if women are generally posting reviews a) at all b) that are generally good c) and not creepy or fakey.
The tough part of this, even relatively legit, is that if the services are cheap the workers are probably exploited to some extent and maybe still trafficked but maybe not primarily for the purposes of prostitution. Tip well and discretely directly to your service provider in cash, and then tip a nominal amount when you pay on the way out to cover up the cash tip.
This is EXACTLY what I was coming here to say. I have gotten perfectly decent massages from storefront Chinese acupressure places to relieve back/shoulder or hand/wrist tension. The placed I have gone were less costly than more spa places but not outrageously cheap. (Like, $75/hour rather than $90-$110/hour.)
I don't think that "blinds drawn" is a reliable indicator, given that, uh, sun glare coming through windows is a thing. Now, if the windows are actually blacked out and they're advertising "full body shampoo" with pictures of pretty women, then sure, it's prostitution.
posted by desuetude at 10:35 AM on October 26, 2018 [1 favorite]
The tough part of this, even relatively legit, is that if the services are cheap the workers are probably exploited to some extent and maybe still trafficked but maybe not primarily for the purposes of prostitution. Tip well and discretely directly to your service provider in cash, and then tip a nominal amount when you pay on the way out to cover up the cash tip.
This is EXACTLY what I was coming here to say. I have gotten perfectly decent massages from storefront Chinese acupressure places to relieve back/shoulder or hand/wrist tension. The placed I have gone were less costly than more spa places but not outrageously cheap. (Like, $75/hour rather than $90-$110/hour.)
I don't think that "blinds drawn" is a reliable indicator, given that, uh, sun glare coming through windows is a thing. Now, if the windows are actually blacked out and they're advertising "full body shampoo" with pictures of pretty women, then sure, it's prostitution.
posted by desuetude at 10:35 AM on October 26, 2018 [1 favorite]
Wouldn't it be better to conduct a search for a particular Asian style of massage versus "Asian massage", and if Googled storefronts can't specify what type is being done, to shy away?
posted by koucha at 11:00 AM on October 26, 2018
posted by koucha at 11:00 AM on October 26, 2018
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Seriously, I wouldn’t assume any shennanigans
posted by polkadot at 3:48 PM on October 25, 2018 [1 favorite]