Brother's ex keeps trying to contact us after years - what to do?
October 12, 2018 10:15 AM Subscribe
My brother’s ex-girlfriend won’t stop trying to connect with him and our family. What’s the best course of action? They’ve been broken up for years and not only is he married to someone else, but so is she. The concern is I’ve always thought she was crazy and she is acting particularly crazy now.
Apologies for the wall of text but I want to give some clear details on the situation. Thanks in advance for reading...
So, my brother dated and lived with this girl who I'll call Jane. Jane seemed a little off to me, when I first met her, needy and self-centered, but normal enough. Slowly, her mental state declined. She became a ball anxiety, constantly yelled at my brother/became unnecessarily defensive about the tiniest things he said, she had some sort of OCD where she'd be in the bathroom for hours "getting ready" which forced her and my brother to constantly miss flights and appointments, etc. She seemed helpless and overwhelmed by the smallest things – my brother had to do everything for her and coach her through simple things, like packing. She couldn't hold down a job because she got so overwhelmed – she had a good office job that she got fired from for performance reasons and I don't think she's ever had a full-time job since. She also developed an eating disorder and the final straw in their relationship was that she lied to my brother repeatedly about getting treatment for it while she secretly continued to get worse.
That was five years ago. Since then, my brother has met someone else, who he married last year. Jane also married someone else – ironically, her wedding was the same day as my brother. But since then, Jane has constantly tried to make contact with my siblings and my parents. She claimed she wanted to hire a company my sister works for and asked for her help, but constantly tried to turn the text conversation to personal chit-chat. She saw my mom had surgery on Facebook and messaged my sister and my parents about it, and then tried to keep the conversations going. Then, she emailed my sister claiming she is writing a "book" and wanted permission to mention my brother, if my sister could pass along the message to him. She sent pictures of the handwritten pages of her "book" and it read like a diary – she's not a writer and it's not a book. After that weird email, my parents (finally) unfriended her on Facebook and we all blocked her on all social media channels. She noticed within hours and emailed my parents about it saying there was no need to unfriend her and asked if she could call to talk about it. My parents ignored her, but this leads me to believe she was checking my parents' Facebook pages on a daily basis – how else would she know so quickly? (What makes it even weirder is that for the past two years, I set my parents' “audience” for all posts to “Friends, except: Jane” so for all Jane knows, my parents hadn’t posted anything new in two years. Weird, right?
We tried our best not to bring our brother into her efforts to connect with us, but then we recently found out she has been writing him letters this whole time, saying she misses him. In the letters she referenced talking to her current husband about my brother – yikes. My brother has ignored her.
Things stopped for a couple months, but just yesterday, my mom had a missed call from her. No voicemail. (The timing may be purely coincidental, but I happened to stumble upon her wedding video on Vimeo recently because I was curious and nosy about her and her husband, given that she has openly admitted she still loves my brother. After I watched her video, I noticed she had a "pro" account on Vimeo, which is weird – it's her only upload and she's not a videographer or content creator of any sort. I checked to see what "pro" accounts do and they offer analytics about who watches your videos and how they find them – she may have seen someone in my city watched the video. Given that my family is spread out in different cities outside of hers, I figure she knows it was me if she is checking the analytics. It only had like 30 views. I hope me watching that video didn't spur her on, but I truly believe the only reason she put that video online in the past month and got a "pro" account was in the hopes that my brother or someone might find it and watch it.)
Anyway, all of this is to say, what is the best course of action? For my part, I won't google her anymore or do anything she might be able to see. (She's never tried to actually contact me because I think she could tell I never liked her.) We obviously don't want anything to do with her and yet she keeps trying. It's like she's obsessed – it's veering into stalker territory. My brother said he is sticking to no-contact, ignoring her, and not rewarding her behavior. It sounds like he has dealt with a lot of attempts to contact him and he is afraid that responding, even if to tell her to leave us alone, might undo all that and reward her efforts. But what about the rest of the family? Should they also ignore or tell her to leave us alone? We've all blocked and ignored her, so our wishes are obvious to any sane person, but I'm not sure anyone has ever directly asked her to stop contacting us.
She lives in the same city as my brother, but it's a huge metropolitan city. I don’t like that she knows where my brother works, although it's a huge company and a huge building. My parents, my siblings and I all live in different cities. She hasn't shown to be violent in any way, but I definitely don't think she is of sound mind. Her emails, to me, sound sort of panicked and stream of conscious. It obviously isn't normal behavior for her to constantly try to connect with us five years after my brother dumped her after we keep ignoring her. I don't want to freak out too much about this or be alarmist. It may be wishful thinking, but the ideal scenario is that she would stop. As upsetting as it is for us, I am sure it's far more upsetting for my brother and his wife, so I want them to be okay.
Thanks for any thoughts or insight.
Apologies for the wall of text but I want to give some clear details on the situation. Thanks in advance for reading...
So, my brother dated and lived with this girl who I'll call Jane. Jane seemed a little off to me, when I first met her, needy and self-centered, but normal enough. Slowly, her mental state declined. She became a ball anxiety, constantly yelled at my brother/became unnecessarily defensive about the tiniest things he said, she had some sort of OCD where she'd be in the bathroom for hours "getting ready" which forced her and my brother to constantly miss flights and appointments, etc. She seemed helpless and overwhelmed by the smallest things – my brother had to do everything for her and coach her through simple things, like packing. She couldn't hold down a job because she got so overwhelmed – she had a good office job that she got fired from for performance reasons and I don't think she's ever had a full-time job since. She also developed an eating disorder and the final straw in their relationship was that she lied to my brother repeatedly about getting treatment for it while she secretly continued to get worse.
That was five years ago. Since then, my brother has met someone else, who he married last year. Jane also married someone else – ironically, her wedding was the same day as my brother. But since then, Jane has constantly tried to make contact with my siblings and my parents. She claimed she wanted to hire a company my sister works for and asked for her help, but constantly tried to turn the text conversation to personal chit-chat. She saw my mom had surgery on Facebook and messaged my sister and my parents about it, and then tried to keep the conversations going. Then, she emailed my sister claiming she is writing a "book" and wanted permission to mention my brother, if my sister could pass along the message to him. She sent pictures of the handwritten pages of her "book" and it read like a diary – she's not a writer and it's not a book. After that weird email, my parents (finally) unfriended her on Facebook and we all blocked her on all social media channels. She noticed within hours and emailed my parents about it saying there was no need to unfriend her and asked if she could call to talk about it. My parents ignored her, but this leads me to believe she was checking my parents' Facebook pages on a daily basis – how else would she know so quickly? (What makes it even weirder is that for the past two years, I set my parents' “audience” for all posts to “Friends, except: Jane” so for all Jane knows, my parents hadn’t posted anything new in two years. Weird, right?
We tried our best not to bring our brother into her efforts to connect with us, but then we recently found out she has been writing him letters this whole time, saying she misses him. In the letters she referenced talking to her current husband about my brother – yikes. My brother has ignored her.
Things stopped for a couple months, but just yesterday, my mom had a missed call from her. No voicemail. (The timing may be purely coincidental, but I happened to stumble upon her wedding video on Vimeo recently because I was curious and nosy about her and her husband, given that she has openly admitted she still loves my brother. After I watched her video, I noticed she had a "pro" account on Vimeo, which is weird – it's her only upload and she's not a videographer or content creator of any sort. I checked to see what "pro" accounts do and they offer analytics about who watches your videos and how they find them – she may have seen someone in my city watched the video. Given that my family is spread out in different cities outside of hers, I figure she knows it was me if she is checking the analytics. It only had like 30 views. I hope me watching that video didn't spur her on, but I truly believe the only reason she put that video online in the past month and got a "pro" account was in the hopes that my brother or someone might find it and watch it.)
Anyway, all of this is to say, what is the best course of action? For my part, I won't google her anymore or do anything she might be able to see. (She's never tried to actually contact me because I think she could tell I never liked her.) We obviously don't want anything to do with her and yet she keeps trying. It's like she's obsessed – it's veering into stalker territory. My brother said he is sticking to no-contact, ignoring her, and not rewarding her behavior. It sounds like he has dealt with a lot of attempts to contact him and he is afraid that responding, even if to tell her to leave us alone, might undo all that and reward her efforts. But what about the rest of the family? Should they also ignore or tell her to leave us alone? We've all blocked and ignored her, so our wishes are obvious to any sane person, but I'm not sure anyone has ever directly asked her to stop contacting us.
She lives in the same city as my brother, but it's a huge metropolitan city. I don’t like that she knows where my brother works, although it's a huge company and a huge building. My parents, my siblings and I all live in different cities. She hasn't shown to be violent in any way, but I definitely don't think she is of sound mind. Her emails, to me, sound sort of panicked and stream of conscious. It obviously isn't normal behavior for her to constantly try to connect with us five years after my brother dumped her after we keep ignoring her. I don't want to freak out too much about this or be alarmist. It may be wishful thinking, but the ideal scenario is that she would stop. As upsetting as it is for us, I am sure it's far more upsetting for my brother and his wife, so I want them to be okay.
Thanks for any thoughts or insight.
I think each person should, the next time she contacts them, reply saying I do not want to maintain a relationship. Do not contact me. and then, ignore her. Block on social media. Filter email direct to spam. If she escalates mildly, and she might, keep ignoring If she shows any sign of threat, contact police.
posted by theora55 at 10:38 AM on October 12, 2018 [9 favorites]
posted by theora55 at 10:38 AM on October 12, 2018 [9 favorites]
I do think stating outright to that person to go away is important. She does not pick up on normal social cues. My actual stalker told me that ignoring them was a sign that something was wrong and that they had to reach out by showing up to my apartment states away.
posted by cobaltnine at 10:39 AM on October 12, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by cobaltnine at 10:39 AM on October 12, 2018 [3 favorites]
I think if you ever need to involve the police in stopping her it would be good to have a record of everyone explicitly stating that they want no contact with her at all.
I would also research what the stalking/harassment laws are in the states where your family lives so you can understand when she has crossed into law-breaking and what you can do about it.
posted by brookeb at 10:46 AM on October 12, 2018 [4 favorites]
I would also research what the stalking/harassment laws are in the states where your family lives so you can understand when she has crossed into law-breaking and what you can do about it.
posted by brookeb at 10:46 AM on October 12, 2018 [4 favorites]
The gold standard advice from The Gift of Fear is zero contact, this might involve changing numbers or other inconveniences. This is a person who needs some help. I’m sorry this is happening to your family.
posted by machinecraig at 10:47 AM on October 12, 2018 [11 favorites]
posted by machinecraig at 10:47 AM on October 12, 2018 [11 favorites]
Agreed that the words "do not contact me anymore" are important, and everyone she contacts should say this very explicitly before blocking. Based on my family's history with a stalker, I'd also recommend:
-checking in with elderly relatives who share your last name, if it's at all an unusual one. Our family's stalker was getting all kinds of info in weekly friendly chats with a distant relative, who was in turn getting info in their friendly chats with a close relative. Later, the distant relative said that the stalker seemed like a sweet lonely person, and they hadn't seen the harm in giving out information that led the stalker to find minors and stalk them too. This also applies to workplaces that don't make a habit of giving out personal info.
-If you live in a small community, stopping by the police station to inform them of the situation and ask about recommended next steps (cobaltnine's story is similar to ours; the stalker assumed that no contact meant their ex was in danger. They didn't have an exact address so they contacted the town's police with a story that the ex's new partner was being abusive and not allowing them to contact friends and family. The police took it seriously the first time and then had to deal with semiweekly calls. This may not be practical in a big city though.)
-Saving any communications if they are needed later for a restraining order. Taken together, the information you have paints a pretty damning story, but it will not be as strong if all the evidence is gone.
posted by tchemgrrl at 11:05 AM on October 12, 2018 [4 favorites]
-checking in with elderly relatives who share your last name, if it's at all an unusual one. Our family's stalker was getting all kinds of info in weekly friendly chats with a distant relative, who was in turn getting info in their friendly chats with a close relative. Later, the distant relative said that the stalker seemed like a sweet lonely person, and they hadn't seen the harm in giving out information that led the stalker to find minors and stalk them too. This also applies to workplaces that don't make a habit of giving out personal info.
-If you live in a small community, stopping by the police station to inform them of the situation and ask about recommended next steps (cobaltnine's story is similar to ours; the stalker assumed that no contact meant their ex was in danger. They didn't have an exact address so they contacted the town's police with a story that the ex's new partner was being abusive and not allowing them to contact friends and family. The police took it seriously the first time and then had to deal with semiweekly calls. This may not be practical in a big city though.)
-Saving any communications if they are needed later for a restraining order. Taken together, the information you have paints a pretty damning story, but it will not be as strong if all the evidence is gone.
posted by tchemgrrl at 11:05 AM on October 12, 2018 [4 favorites]
I think telling a stalker explicitly that you want no contact at all is best done early. At this point you have all had no contact for years. Don't break that streak just to tell her you want no contact. It'll just teach her that you're watching and paying attention to her and that her long term efforts are paying off with a response (even if the response is asking for no contact.)
If you do want to keep track of her for your own security, always use incognito mode on your browser.
posted by quince at 11:27 AM on October 12, 2018 [13 favorites]
If you do want to keep track of her for your own security, always use incognito mode on your browser.
posted by quince at 11:27 AM on October 12, 2018 [13 favorites]
I'm on team "once and never again." Next time she attempts contact, tell her flatly and unsympathetically, "Please never attempt to contact me again. All future attempts to contact me are unwelcome," and then block her everywhere. It will hurt her feelings, but sometimes you just have to hurt someone's feelings. This is one of those times.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 12:00 PM on October 12, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 12:00 PM on October 12, 2018 [2 favorites]
If you decide to state "do not contact me" for the record, you each have to be prepared to say and do the same exact thing, and never, ever respond in any way to her attempts to argue or sidle her way back in--can and will you all do that? (I say this because I know in my family there are some hotheads who would agree to the no contact plan, but then pop off if provoked the right way. Hopefully not the case for you.)
You all just need to be UTTER dead ends to her until the end of time. Don't even google her, don't even talk to anyone about her-- you never know who she's befriended. Unfortunately, this may involve changing numbers, emails, social media accounts, and even where your brother receives the letters, if by letters you mean mail (have him get a PO box?) Assume she knows some passwords, assume she's memorized everyone in all of your circles and thoroughly googled all of them as well. Assume any unidentified caller is her, and screen.
Are you familiar with the term "extinction burst?" Basically, before she realizes it's all a dead end, she will definitely ramp way up before moving on. Be prepared for that and again, make sure you're all consistent and stick to the plan. I learned that from Gift of Fear.
Gift of Fear is just plain interesting, not at all fear-mongery, and might give all of you some useful insight. I know I fall back on its advice often in all kinds of situations.
posted by kapers at 12:13 PM on October 12, 2018 [2 favorites]
You all just need to be UTTER dead ends to her until the end of time. Don't even google her, don't even talk to anyone about her-- you never know who she's befriended. Unfortunately, this may involve changing numbers, emails, social media accounts, and even where your brother receives the letters, if by letters you mean mail (have him get a PO box?) Assume she knows some passwords, assume she's memorized everyone in all of your circles and thoroughly googled all of them as well. Assume any unidentified caller is her, and screen.
Are you familiar with the term "extinction burst?" Basically, before she realizes it's all a dead end, she will definitely ramp way up before moving on. Be prepared for that and again, make sure you're all consistent and stick to the plan. I learned that from Gift of Fear.
Gift of Fear is just plain interesting, not at all fear-mongery, and might give all of you some useful insight. I know I fall back on its advice often in all kinds of situations.
posted by kapers at 12:13 PM on October 12, 2018 [2 favorites]
this leads me to believe she was checking my parents' Facebook pages on a daily basis – how else would she know so quickly?
I have a browser plug-in for managing Facebook to make it less annoying. One of its default features is to throw up a little pop up that tells me the name of anyone who has un-friended me since my last visit. So that's a possible explanation.
posted by Secret Sparrow at 2:01 PM on October 12, 2018 [5 favorites]
I have a browser plug-in for managing Facebook to make it less annoying. One of its default features is to throw up a little pop up that tells me the name of anyone who has un-friended me since my last visit. So that's a possible explanation.
posted by Secret Sparrow at 2:01 PM on October 12, 2018 [5 favorites]
ironically, her wedding was the same day as my brother
One note on this, my immediate thought was, I wonder if it was ironic or actually just her hedging in some kind of way, so at some time down the line, if they reconnected, she could point to that as some kind of amazing coincidence. Or it could be even more basic than that and just be copycat behavior. Either way, that's weird and doesn't seem like an actual coincidence.
posted by limeonaire at 4:30 PM on October 12, 2018 [2 favorites]
One note on this, my immediate thought was, I wonder if it was ironic or actually just her hedging in some kind of way, so at some time down the line, if they reconnected, she could point to that as some kind of amazing coincidence. Or it could be even more basic than that and just be copycat behavior. Either way, that's weird and doesn't seem like an actual coincidence.
posted by limeonaire at 4:30 PM on October 12, 2018 [2 favorites]
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If your brother is uncomfortable, he might want to consider contacting someone (law enforcement?) to see if he is eligible for any sort of restraining order. However, you are not your brother and it sounds like he's comfortable with ignoring her and/or has taken action to protect himself and his spouse.
posted by lucy.jakobs at 10:32 AM on October 12, 2018 [2 favorites]