This volunteering policy seems fishy
July 19, 2018 4:14 PM Subscribe
I work for one of the larger employers in my region, and each year they publish a report to show their philanthropic contributions and community impact. Now they're asking for employees to track and report volunteer time outside of work. This seems fishy to me, but is it actually unethical?
The report has included charitable donations and sponsorships in the past, mostly at a corporate level. Like where we'd have the company logo on the t-shirt at a 5K for the Kiwanis Club, that kind of thing. So it seems weird that they also want employees' individual efforts to be included now, especially if employees are doing this outside of work on their own time. It is not a "once a month, the team does a Habitat for Humanity build together" situation. That seems appropriate to include on such a report. Instead, it is "I spend 3 hours at the animal shelter every weekend." There is no mention of reimbursing employees for time, mileage, etc. for any volunteer time.
It rubs me the wrong way that the company wants to take credit for employees' individual efforts. And if they report what we do outside of work--what does that prove? That they hire "good" people?
Am I just being cranky about it, or is there something actually wrong with this that I can articulate to my manager?
The report has included charitable donations and sponsorships in the past, mostly at a corporate level. Like where we'd have the company logo on the t-shirt at a 5K for the Kiwanis Club, that kind of thing. So it seems weird that they also want employees' individual efforts to be included now, especially if employees are doing this outside of work on their own time. It is not a "once a month, the team does a Habitat for Humanity build together" situation. That seems appropriate to include on such a report. Instead, it is "I spend 3 hours at the animal shelter every weekend." There is no mention of reimbursing employees for time, mileage, etc. for any volunteer time.
It rubs me the wrong way that the company wants to take credit for employees' individual efforts. And if they report what we do outside of work--what does that prove? That they hire "good" people?
Am I just being cranky about it, or is there something actually wrong with this that I can articulate to my manager?
Am I just being cranky about it
Well, yeah. These reports are for positive PR. That's it - there's nothing beyond it. They are searching for any positive PR they can get. This isn't going to change their taxes or have a broader impact on society.
If this matters to you, don't claim any volunteering. Nothing will change in the grand scheme of things.
what does that prove? That they hire "good" people?
Basically. They're also going for the person who doesn't read the report very carefully and concludes the company does a net social good. Is this a problem? I don't really think so; every other corporation is going to do the same thing. Effectively no company does charity for the heck of it; they do so for tax benefits and social PR.
posted by saeculorum at 4:24 PM on July 19, 2018 [9 favorites]
Well, yeah. These reports are for positive PR. That's it - there's nothing beyond it. They are searching for any positive PR they can get. This isn't going to change their taxes or have a broader impact on society.
If this matters to you, don't claim any volunteering. Nothing will change in the grand scheme of things.
what does that prove? That they hire "good" people?
Basically. They're also going for the person who doesn't read the report very carefully and concludes the company does a net social good. Is this a problem? I don't really think so; every other corporation is going to do the same thing. Effectively no company does charity for the heck of it; they do so for tax benefits and social PR.
posted by saeculorum at 4:24 PM on July 19, 2018 [9 favorites]
I'd tell them to fuck themselves. What I do when I'm not at the office is none of their business.
What tilde said above is legit - if you are volunteering during work hours, that's something they can and should report. If it's after you come home from work it's none of their business in the slightest.
posted by natteringnabob at 4:25 PM on July 19, 2018 [18 favorites]
What tilde said above is legit - if you are volunteering during work hours, that's something they can and should report. If it's after you come home from work it's none of their business in the slightest.
posted by natteringnabob at 4:25 PM on July 19, 2018 [18 favorites]
Are they matching funds? Even if your service is not money, they can donate to that or a similar cause for $X/hr? Are they claiming that volunteering for tax purposes?
posted by I'm Not Even Supposed To Be Here Today! at 4:36 PM on July 19, 2018
posted by I'm Not Even Supposed To Be Here Today! at 4:36 PM on July 19, 2018
Are they claiming that volunteering for tax purposes?
Employee volunteer time is not a tax-deductible expense (whether or not the employees are paid for the time).
posted by saeculorum at 4:40 PM on July 19, 2018 [1 favorite]
Employee volunteer time is not a tax-deductible expense (whether or not the employees are paid for the time).
posted by saeculorum at 4:40 PM on July 19, 2018 [1 favorite]
I know it's not supposed to be, that's why I asked, to see if they're being that type of shady.
posted by I'm Not Even Supposed To Be Here Today! at 4:44 PM on July 19, 2018
posted by I'm Not Even Supposed To Be Here Today! at 4:44 PM on July 19, 2018
"what does that prove? That they hire "good" people? "
Yes, basically - they want to be able to tell people who are considering working there or companies/organizations considering partnering with them that "93% of our staff volunteer with charitable organizations" or whatnot.
But they're kind of being jerks if they don't reward or compensate you for it at all. The company I work for does ask staff to track our personal volunteer hours for basically that reason, but there are incentives for doing it, including paid time off. So if you don't want to track and report it, don't.
posted by capricorn at 5:07 PM on July 19, 2018 [5 favorites]
Yes, basically - they want to be able to tell people who are considering working there or companies/organizations considering partnering with them that "93% of our staff volunteer with charitable organizations" or whatnot.
But they're kind of being jerks if they don't reward or compensate you for it at all. The company I work for does ask staff to track our personal volunteer hours for basically that reason, but there are incentives for doing it, including paid time off. So if you don't want to track and report it, don't.
posted by capricorn at 5:07 PM on July 19, 2018 [5 favorites]
It does prove that at least some portion of their employees have enough time off to live full lives and contribute to their community. At least.
posted by amtho at 5:10 PM on July 19, 2018 [5 favorites]
posted by amtho at 5:10 PM on July 19, 2018 [5 favorites]
Is anyone going to be penalised for not turning in reports that show they spend their weekends being active and do-goodering? I mean, volunteering is great and well done to those who do but my time outside work is my own and if I chose to spend it laying on the sofa in my jammies, would that be held against me? I feel like this could have unforeseen negative repercussions for people. Or people are just going to make shit up.
I'd be super cranky too.
posted by kitten magic at 5:29 PM on July 19, 2018 [9 favorites]
I'd be super cranky too.
posted by kitten magic at 5:29 PM on July 19, 2018 [9 favorites]
Grant funding, taxes and nonprofit status can be affected by reported charitable donations, which include in-kind donations, which includes volunteer time, which is valued at (in my experience) a median of the hourly rates those volunteers earn at the company. Ethical companies count only hours spent during the workday or that they offer comp time for. An exception (in my experience) is when someone sits on a nonprofit board in the same industry and those hours are counted toward the corporate total; the person's service benefits the company's image and is viewed as part of the job. Another exception (ime) is when the job/company is a lifestyle job, very networky and event-focused. Those hours blend a lot so the company claims them. If your company is just skimming off your personal extracurricular menschness at no cost to them and with no benefit to you, then that is not what I would consider ethical.
posted by headnsouth at 5:39 PM on July 19, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by headnsouth at 5:39 PM on July 19, 2018 [1 favorite]
Now they're asking for employees to track and report volunteer time outside of work.
Doing that work, tracking this work, is work, outside fo the volunteer work that you are already doing. if they are asking for, like, a yearly or even monthly estimate, I can see that not being too onerous. If they are asking for you to keep a log, that is WORK and not work that is reimbursed/paid for by them. So I would explain this, that logging and tracking hours is also work, and ask if you'll be paid for that time. If so, consider it a new part of your job. If not, tell them it's an additional demand on your time for something that doesn't benefit you at all.
And, really, it's a little invasive. If I volunteer at the Terrible Disease Charity once a week, I don't want some rando speculating on why I'm doing that. Private/peronal time is private/personal. This information could be misused and I wouldn't necessarily want to share it.
Many places offer sponsorhsip. This company is confiused about how they are supposed to be supporting workplace charitable good works. Not like this.
posted by jessamyn at 6:06 PM on July 19, 2018 [7 favorites]
Doing that work, tracking this work, is work, outside fo the volunteer work that you are already doing. if they are asking for, like, a yearly or even monthly estimate, I can see that not being too onerous. If they are asking for you to keep a log, that is WORK and not work that is reimbursed/paid for by them. So I would explain this, that logging and tracking hours is also work, and ask if you'll be paid for that time. If so, consider it a new part of your job. If not, tell them it's an additional demand on your time for something that doesn't benefit you at all.
And, really, it's a little invasive. If I volunteer at the Terrible Disease Charity once a week, I don't want some rando speculating on why I'm doing that. Private/peronal time is private/personal. This information could be misused and I wouldn't necessarily want to share it.
Many places offer sponsorhsip. This company is confiused about how they are supposed to be supporting workplace charitable good works. Not like this.
posted by jessamyn at 6:06 PM on July 19, 2018 [7 favorites]
I work at a company that develops corporate social responsibility software. This is common. Target, Lockheed Martin, and Citizens Bank are three companies off the top of my head that do this.
Most companies that use our volunteering module do so in the context of Dollars for Doers/volunteer grant programs, usually as part of a larger CSR program including matching gifts and stuff. You do your volunteering, and the company pays out a grant at like $5/hour, usually with a minimum of like 50 hours. Bank of America, Starbucks, and a bunch of others do this.
For some reason, other companies don't want to give volunteer grants, but still want employees to log volunteer hours for no apparent reason. (We always laugh at these because their employees seem to be the most meticulous about logging hours, even though it's meaningless.)
I'll recuse myself from the ethical discussion, but I will say that I've never heard of such a logging program being compulsory. Our software, at least, does not have a mechanism for compelling an employee to log volunteer hours. (Although someone could always run an activity report to see who has participated, I guess.)
In my experience, the aggregated hours are generally used as PR. Companies will release a yearly report saying something like "look how great our employees (or 'team members') are; they do all this volunteering".
All of this is to say, it's a really common thing that big companies do. Doesn't make it right or wrong, of course, but your company is definitely not the only one.
posted by kevinbelt at 6:34 PM on July 19, 2018 [8 favorites]
Most companies that use our volunteering module do so in the context of Dollars for Doers/volunteer grant programs, usually as part of a larger CSR program including matching gifts and stuff. You do your volunteering, and the company pays out a grant at like $5/hour, usually with a minimum of like 50 hours. Bank of America, Starbucks, and a bunch of others do this.
For some reason, other companies don't want to give volunteer grants, but still want employees to log volunteer hours for no apparent reason. (We always laugh at these because their employees seem to be the most meticulous about logging hours, even though it's meaningless.)
I'll recuse myself from the ethical discussion, but I will say that I've never heard of such a logging program being compulsory. Our software, at least, does not have a mechanism for compelling an employee to log volunteer hours. (Although someone could always run an activity report to see who has participated, I guess.)
In my experience, the aggregated hours are generally used as PR. Companies will release a yearly report saying something like "look how great our employees (or 'team members') are; they do all this volunteering".
All of this is to say, it's a really common thing that big companies do. Doesn't make it right or wrong, of course, but your company is definitely not the only one.
posted by kevinbelt at 6:34 PM on July 19, 2018 [8 favorites]
My company does this, but does a donation match for a certain amount of hours or certain number of employees volunteering at a particular charity... I'd ask why they need that information.
posted by larthegreat at 7:09 PM on July 19, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by larthegreat at 7:09 PM on July 19, 2018 [2 favorites]
My paid professional job is as a volunteer coordinator, and I'm just co-signing what saeculorum said:
These reports are for positive PR. That's it - there's nothing beyond it. They are searching for any positive PR they can get. This isn't going to change their taxes or have a broader impact on society.
If this matters to you, don't claim any volunteering. Nothing will change in the grand scheme of things.
posted by nuclear_soup at 7:17 PM on July 19, 2018 [1 favorite]
These reports are for positive PR. That's it - there's nothing beyond it. They are searching for any positive PR they can get. This isn't going to change their taxes or have a broader impact on society.
If this matters to you, don't claim any volunteering. Nothing will change in the grand scheme of things.
posted by nuclear_soup at 7:17 PM on July 19, 2018 [1 favorite]
My company does it, and at the end of the year will give money to my designated charity based on the number of hours worked as an incentive. They also match employee charitable contributions, give $50 if I do a charity walk/run, support volunteer days and do food drives and similar. I see it as one piece of a very generous charitable program, and like that it’s publicized, since I think its attractive to recruits and may get other area employers to also be generous. And while the tracking is a pain, it’s nice to have a check for $100 or $200 sent to one of my tiny organizations at the end of the year. Completely voluntary, and I’ve never had the sense anyone is running a report on me individually.
posted by Sukey Says at 7:57 PM on July 19, 2018
posted by Sukey Says at 7:57 PM on July 19, 2018
Nothing in your question indicates why you believe the company is going to "take credit" for employees' outside volunteering in their annual corporate charitable report.
posted by JimN2TAW at 8:46 PM on July 19, 2018
posted by JimN2TAW at 8:46 PM on July 19, 2018
Am I just being cranky about it ...
Hell no. They can go fuck themselves, for very obvious reasons. They're trying to ride your coattails.
posted by smcameron at 9:16 PM on July 19, 2018 [2 favorites]
Hell no. They can go fuck themselves, for very obvious reasons. They're trying to ride your coattails.
posted by smcameron at 9:16 PM on July 19, 2018 [2 favorites]
My company matches volunteer hours with a donation to a non-profit I volunteer at occasionally. If your company has a similar program, I'd encourage you to do that. If they just want you to track it for the PR and aren't doing a donation to the org, then I'd say that they have no need to know that unless you want them to.
posted by Aleyn at 9:26 PM on July 19, 2018
posted by Aleyn at 9:26 PM on July 19, 2018
I work for one of the larger employers in my region
This information is likely going to be aggregated into some nice feel-good kind of message like, "The employees of Acme Widget Co. spent X,000 hours volunteering last year, which reflects the commitment of those of us at Acme to our community." It's the carrot to the we-could-take-all-the-taxes-our-employees-pay-in-elsewhere stick. So if it doesn't make sense why this would help PR, it's because it's usually not about selling more stuff, it's about trying to get people thinking, "Well, I guess it's a good thing we have Acme in town," so that your company gets favorable local government treatment or at least so that nobody starts really asking too many questions about whether the company is paying its fair share.
posted by Sequence at 9:41 PM on July 19, 2018 [3 favorites]
This information is likely going to be aggregated into some nice feel-good kind of message like, "The employees of Acme Widget Co. spent X,000 hours volunteering last year, which reflects the commitment of those of us at Acme to our community." It's the carrot to the we-could-take-all-the-taxes-our-employees-pay-in-elsewhere stick. So if it doesn't make sense why this would help PR, it's because it's usually not about selling more stuff, it's about trying to get people thinking, "Well, I guess it's a good thing we have Acme in town," so that your company gets favorable local government treatment or at least so that nobody starts really asking too many questions about whether the company is paying its fair share.
posted by Sequence at 9:41 PM on July 19, 2018 [3 favorites]
My company does this and yes, it’s for good PR. They get to say “look how many millions of hours our people volunteered!!” My company does incentivize this with grants to top volunteers, and through that, I was able to provide my local food bank with $10,000 a few months ago. So, I’m ok with this. YMMV.
posted by greermahoney at 10:11 PM on July 19, 2018
posted by greermahoney at 10:11 PM on July 19, 2018
You know how some things are totally legal but bullshit anyway? This is one of those things. Unless your company has written down what you and other employees get for tracking your off-work volunteer time–and what you get is something you approve of–fuck this shit. It is most likely a PR thing and, in reality, has nothing to do with the company (unless it does and the company is being terrible at internal communications, which is also a thing). Honestly, capitalism owns most of us in most ways already. Personally, I would absolutely ignore this. Is it unethical? Not like murder. But just generally? Sure. But in no way is it surprising and it must be common, I imagine, given that capitalism (corporations, bosses) seeks to own as much of our time as possible, often without any compensation, usually without fair and appropriate compensation.
posted by Bella Donna at 3:22 AM on July 20, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by Bella Donna at 3:22 AM on July 20, 2018 [1 favorite]
...they will also be able to notice which political orgs people report volunteering for...
posted by amtho at 7:04 AM on July 20, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by amtho at 7:04 AM on July 20, 2018 [3 favorites]
My big corporation does this. Several years ago they pushed the work groups and managers to urge employees to log our volunteer hours outside of work. Enough people either ignored them, said none of your business, or politely told them to get fucked that it was never brought up again.
Agreed that they can go fuck themselves. If companies want to be the good guys they can pay taxes, pay employees a living wage, not pollute, etc. ad nauseum.
posted by Orange Dinosaur Slide at 7:19 AM on July 20, 2018 [1 favorite]
Agreed that they can go fuck themselves. If companies want to be the good guys they can pay taxes, pay employees a living wage, not pollute, etc. ad nauseum.
posted by Orange Dinosaur Slide at 7:19 AM on July 20, 2018 [1 favorite]
This is probably something where you can complain reasonably safely if you don't like it, with eve a chance of (eventually) making a (small) difference.
Presumably there's someone coordinating this who is not your boss or in your line of command at all. If you send a polite e-mail saying that you volunteer so you support others doing it etc. etc. but that monitoring kind of rubs you the wrong way when the company is not supporting employees for volunteering with time off or matching donations to the organizations, it will probably be brought up by someone as an argument to increase contributions or something.
posted by mark k at 7:26 AM on July 20, 2018
Presumably there's someone coordinating this who is not your boss or in your line of command at all. If you send a polite e-mail saying that you volunteer so you support others doing it etc. etc. but that monitoring kind of rubs you the wrong way when the company is not supporting employees for volunteering with time off or matching donations to the organizations, it will probably be brought up by someone as an argument to increase contributions or something.
posted by mark k at 7:26 AM on July 20, 2018
"they will also be able to notice which political orgs people report volunteering for"
Almost all of my company's clients prohibit logging volunteer hours for political organizations. Not just parties, but politically controversial organizations like Planned Parenthood or the Boy Scouts. The search mechanism automatically filters them out so that it's not even an option.
posted by kevinbelt at 8:46 AM on July 20, 2018 [2 favorites]
Almost all of my company's clients prohibit logging volunteer hours for political organizations. Not just parties, but politically controversial organizations like Planned Parenthood or the Boy Scouts. The search mechanism automatically filters them out so that it's not even an option.
posted by kevinbelt at 8:46 AM on July 20, 2018 [2 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by tilde at 4:20 PM on July 19, 2018 [4 favorites]