How do I stop anxiously over analyzing everything?
April 29, 2018 8:21 PM Subscribe
First, let's just point out that I'm an INTP. That's half of the problem right there. For an example, I'll be watching a hockey game, and I'll see how passionate everyone is about it, and then I will think how strange it is that everyone is so passionate about something so trivial. I'll question why people like sports... is it because we need an outlet for our animal instincts, to fulfil some primal need to compete and conquer? Is it healthy to get aggressive with things like sports, or does that take us away from a more thoughtful path?
I mean, I guess it makes sense. People want community and we are hardwired to form groups and to fight for those groups. But isn't that what leads to war? Is the way to stop war to recognize that it's all trivial and we have to have higher thinking? Or would this just depress us? Maybe we are not meant to overcome our need for this primal attachment to groups. Maybe war will always be inevitable. Do people pretend to like sports just to fit in? Why do people feel the need to pretend? Why does our society have so many people who are uncertain of who they are? Am I the messed up one for thinking these things, or are they all missing something? Should I stop thinking these thoughts and just enjoy the game, or is this leading me to some truth? Why can't I stop thinking these thoughts even though I want to? And it goes on... and on... It's very exhausting. I'd love to just enjoy things, because I realize it's all a bit ridiculous as I don't know if I'll ever come to satisfying answers but at the same time I can't stop questioning things. Any advice?
I mean, I guess it makes sense. People want community and we are hardwired to form groups and to fight for those groups. But isn't that what leads to war? Is the way to stop war to recognize that it's all trivial and we have to have higher thinking? Or would this just depress us? Maybe we are not meant to overcome our need for this primal attachment to groups. Maybe war will always be inevitable. Do people pretend to like sports just to fit in? Why do people feel the need to pretend? Why does our society have so many people who are uncertain of who they are? Am I the messed up one for thinking these things, or are they all missing something? Should I stop thinking these thoughts and just enjoy the game, or is this leading me to some truth? Why can't I stop thinking these thoughts even though I want to? And it goes on... and on... It's very exhausting. I'd love to just enjoy things, because I realize it's all a bit ridiculous as I don't know if I'll ever come to satisfying answers but at the same time I can't stop questioning things. Any advice?
Could it be that you're doing this because you're bored? I know that when I'm bored, and watching sports makes me feel VERY BORED, my brain will amuse itself by thinking about what it's looking at. If you don't like watching sports but everyone else around you is, there's nothing wrong with amusing yourself.
If it's not just this one thing and you feel like you're overthinking a lot, you can go to the dr and get medicine for unwanted thoughts. I think you'd be well served also by reading all the books where they talk about stuff like this. You're not the only one who thinks about things like that.
posted by bleep at 8:33 PM on April 29, 2018 [3 favorites]
If it's not just this one thing and you feel like you're overthinking a lot, you can go to the dr and get medicine for unwanted thoughts. I think you'd be well served also by reading all the books where they talk about stuff like this. You're not the only one who thinks about things like that.
posted by bleep at 8:33 PM on April 29, 2018 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: Redstart, I think it is because it prevents me from enjoying the game. The thoughts make me feel anxious, like there is some answer I have to get to before I can allow myself to let go and enjoy the game, but I can't get to an answer. I feel terrible anxiety all the time, and I feel like these thoughts contribute to it.
posted by oracleia at 8:34 PM on April 29, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by oracleia at 8:34 PM on April 29, 2018 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Given that, and some of your past questions, I'd suggest that your anxiety is in part prompting your discomfort with these thoughts, as opposed to these thoughts increasing your anxiety. I have the sort of thoughts that you have all the time - they're interesting thoughts, which can tell you a lot about how you relate to people! - but my response to them, and how they affect my mood and behaviour, depends a lot on if and how well I'm managing my anxiety.
I'd say starting to figure out how to live a less anxious life should be your priority - so that you can *enjoy* ruminating on interesting ideas, and not find it just another stressor.
posted by sagc at 8:38 PM on April 29, 2018 [9 favorites]
I'd say starting to figure out how to live a less anxious life should be your priority - so that you can *enjoy* ruminating on interesting ideas, and not find it just another stressor.
posted by sagc at 8:38 PM on April 29, 2018 [9 favorites]
This is why I drink. It is neither a permanent nor long-term solution, but it sure works in a pinch.
posted by Jon_Evil at 8:43 PM on April 29, 2018 [5 favorites]
posted by Jon_Evil at 8:43 PM on April 29, 2018 [5 favorites]
I have thoughts like this all the time and I don't have anxiety. I agree with sagc. I think the thoughts and the anxiety are two separate things.
posted by Redstart at 8:43 PM on April 29, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by Redstart at 8:43 PM on April 29, 2018 [3 favorites]
This feels like something that mindfulness/meditation might be able to help with? My anxiety manifests in this way as well sometimes and using techniques I learned through meditation (focusing on the breath or physical reality, counting things, noting my thoughts as they come in and detaching from them like “oh that is something I’m thinking,” making a habit of noticing specific activities that sort of interrupt my racing thoughts) are all useful tools in my toolbox. You can do all those things without a meditation practice at all but I find it’s a nice addition— Headspace has a free trial...
I agree, btw, that there’s nothing wrong with being curious and thoughtful. But I hate feeling TRAPPED in deep analysis of everything around me, especially when that analysis is anxiety-flavored, so it’s good for me to have ways not to do it.
posted by peppercorn at 8:43 PM on April 29, 2018 [7 favorites]
I agree, btw, that there’s nothing wrong with being curious and thoughtful. But I hate feeling TRAPPED in deep analysis of everything around me, especially when that analysis is anxiety-flavored, so it’s good for me to have ways not to do it.
posted by peppercorn at 8:43 PM on April 29, 2018 [7 favorites]
Best answer: but I can't get to an answer.
no, and you won't. you're not going to find an answer as long as you're only looking inside your own head. your example is only an example, I realize, but sports fans have done plenty of thinking and writing about this topic and you can get any number of perspectives if you're interested in doing so. I can't tell from your framing of the question whether you consider yourself to be one or not -- do you know why you like sports? if not, are you sure that you really do?
t.h. white said, and he was right, that the best thing for being sad is to learn something. it's also the best thing for being anxious. thoughts spinning fruitlessly around and around are like the starving stomach trying to digest itself for lack of anything else to work on. you need external stimuli. cold water to the face, a brisk walk outside, or just simply making these pretend-questions into real questions: by posing them to any real person and listening to the answer. stop a monologue either through self-conditioning or by changing it into a dialogue.
you're not caught in insoluble mysteries and you're not questioning too much, you're just questioning the wrong person when you interrogate your own brain exclusively: you don't know everything. not all the answers are already in there; that doesn't mean they don't exist. questions about the diversity of human behavior are best explored with the help of other human beings. psychiatry may offer you some immediate help and a consultation with a professional should be your first step. but to whatever extent your anxiety reflects a real personality style and not a disorder, these truths are vital to recognize and accept.
posted by queenofbithynia at 8:51 PM on April 29, 2018 [19 favorites]
no, and you won't. you're not going to find an answer as long as you're only looking inside your own head. your example is only an example, I realize, but sports fans have done plenty of thinking and writing about this topic and you can get any number of perspectives if you're interested in doing so. I can't tell from your framing of the question whether you consider yourself to be one or not -- do you know why you like sports? if not, are you sure that you really do?
t.h. white said, and he was right, that the best thing for being sad is to learn something. it's also the best thing for being anxious. thoughts spinning fruitlessly around and around are like the starving stomach trying to digest itself for lack of anything else to work on. you need external stimuli. cold water to the face, a brisk walk outside, or just simply making these pretend-questions into real questions: by posing them to any real person and listening to the answer. stop a monologue either through self-conditioning or by changing it into a dialogue.
you're not caught in insoluble mysteries and you're not questioning too much, you're just questioning the wrong person when you interrogate your own brain exclusively: you don't know everything. not all the answers are already in there; that doesn't mean they don't exist. questions about the diversity of human behavior are best explored with the help of other human beings. psychiatry may offer you some immediate help and a consultation with a professional should be your first step. but to whatever extent your anxiety reflects a real personality style and not a disorder, these truths are vital to recognize and accept.
posted by queenofbithynia at 8:51 PM on April 29, 2018 [19 favorites]
Response by poster: Peppercorn I've tried mindfulness and meditation, but I feel then it's almost like I'm fighting against my impulses to think and it takes so much effort to be present and focus on my breath. I still don't feel like I'm connected to what's going on around me because now I'm focused on what I'm focusing on. It's like a constant barrage that I can't stop. Maybe I'm doing mindfulness wrong, lol. I will check out the headspace thing though.
And yes that's exactly it. I feel trapped in analysis, when I want to be engaged and connecting with what's going on around me at an emotional level.
posted by oracleia at 8:52 PM on April 29, 2018
And yes that's exactly it. I feel trapped in analysis, when I want to be engaged and connecting with what's going on around me at an emotional level.
posted by oracleia at 8:52 PM on April 29, 2018
INTP doesn’t mean ‘constantly fraught with anxiety’.
Also for that matter Meyers-Briggs personality letters have lots of problems, and maybe you are putting too much stock in them.
Likewise with ‘higher thinking’ — what does that even mean. Some of the greatest scientists and philosophers and artists and musicians and poets and engineers like or even love sports; don’t make the callow assumption that they are somehow simplistic or less than because of your notion of elevated thought.
Some people do pretend to like sports to fit in, some people pretend to be a lot of things to fit in.
I wonder how old you are, and if part of the answer is learning to relax and slow down and watch and listen, rather than analyze and judge.
Many things about the world will are not easily worked out with a few minutes of brainstorming and abstract logic, no matter how clever your are.
posted by SaltySalticid at 8:54 PM on April 29, 2018 [23 favorites]
Also for that matter Meyers-Briggs personality letters have lots of problems, and maybe you are putting too much stock in them.
Likewise with ‘higher thinking’ — what does that even mean. Some of the greatest scientists and philosophers and artists and musicians and poets and engineers like or even love sports; don’t make the callow assumption that they are somehow simplistic or less than because of your notion of elevated thought.
Some people do pretend to like sports to fit in, some people pretend to be a lot of things to fit in.
I wonder how old you are, and if part of the answer is learning to relax and slow down and watch and listen, rather than analyze and judge.
Many things about the world will are not easily worked out with a few minutes of brainstorming and abstract logic, no matter how clever your are.
posted by SaltySalticid at 8:54 PM on April 29, 2018 [23 favorites]
Yeah, this is what mindfulness practice is for. Practice and fail and practice some more.
posted by lazuli at 8:55 PM on April 29, 2018 [6 favorites]
posted by lazuli at 8:55 PM on April 29, 2018 [6 favorites]
Have you ever tried writing these thoughts down, not in a way that assumes there is something wrong with you, but as an exploratory essay? It's fine to have an analytic mind, and to step back from society to wonder why. You are not the only one who does this, but it is making you feel alone because it stops you from being immersed in the moment with everyone else. You could gently tell yourself at the hockey game: " Why do people do this sports thing ... I am getting anxious but I going to explore this question in writing later when I get home. Right now, I'll just practice paying attention. It will actually give me more understanding and detail when I go to write about it later. I don't need to figure everything out now."
Don't forbid yourself from thinking about it. It will make it loom larger. Just decide gently that you'll think about it later.
At the same time, if you choose to write about it later, you can remind yourself: I don't need to figure this all out now. It is impossible to do that. I can speculate if I want, but many people have been exploring these kinds of questions in philosophy, evolutionary science, and so on, and there is not deadline to figuring it out. Just wondering about it in a clear way is ok."
posted by flourpot at 8:56 PM on April 29, 2018 [2 favorites]
Don't forbid yourself from thinking about it. It will make it loom larger. Just decide gently that you'll think about it later.
At the same time, if you choose to write about it later, you can remind yourself: I don't need to figure this all out now. It is impossible to do that. I can speculate if I want, but many people have been exploring these kinds of questions in philosophy, evolutionary science, and so on, and there is not deadline to figuring it out. Just wondering about it in a clear way is ok."
posted by flourpot at 8:56 PM on April 29, 2018 [2 favorites]
I also like to remind people who are into MBTI (and I am one of them!) that the actual point is to work toward being XXXX -- to be so balanced on each axis that you're not distorting reality to your pre-conceived preferences. So if it's hard to be mindful and present: Awesome! You just found the thing you need to get better at.
posted by lazuli at 8:57 PM on April 29, 2018 [5 favorites]
posted by lazuli at 8:57 PM on April 29, 2018 [5 favorites]
First, I play hockey and watch hockey. I do so for the competition, the exercise and for the camaraderie. I watch it for the strategy aspects, to watch really gifted athletes be really gifted athletes, and to root for "my" team. At a professional game it is also an excuse to hang out with friends and drink copious amounts of beer.
Having said that, I do not think your thoughts are in anyway wrong. I think it is how you are reacting to your own thoughts that is an issue. I pile on the wagon with the people saying mindfulness, meditation and other stress reducing tactics.
posted by AugustWest at 8:58 PM on April 29, 2018 [2 favorites]
Having said that, I do not think your thoughts are in anyway wrong. I think it is how you are reacting to your own thoughts that is an issue. I pile on the wagon with the people saying mindfulness, meditation and other stress reducing tactics.
posted by AugustWest at 8:58 PM on April 29, 2018 [2 favorites]
I drop into Deep Thought all. the. time. I've accepted that it's just who I am. I totally 100% understand this inner monologue of yours. I'm also a fairly devout Buddhist and this gives me somewhere to park the "big picture" feels. Life as a karmic cycle, tra la la.
In a worldly way, What helps is to realize that A) the ultimate tidy explanation I seek is unfindable; truth is in multitudes, everyone has their own correct narrative, B) we are in this life for such a finite amount of time, so let me be the violinist on the Titanic, bringing joy and beauty and love to as many people as possible, therefore C) get in there and have at 'er. Connecting with others in whatever activity they enjoy IS the enjoyment for me, and being half hearted about it is a kill joy. It allows me to take off my coat and get messy. Don't worry. You won't lose yourself if you do. xo
posted by St. Peepsburg at 9:03 PM on April 29, 2018 [3 favorites]
In a worldly way, What helps is to realize that A) the ultimate tidy explanation I seek is unfindable; truth is in multitudes, everyone has their own correct narrative, B) we are in this life for such a finite amount of time, so let me be the violinist on the Titanic, bringing joy and beauty and love to as many people as possible, therefore C) get in there and have at 'er. Connecting with others in whatever activity they enjoy IS the enjoyment for me, and being half hearted about it is a kill joy. It allows me to take off my coat and get messy. Don't worry. You won't lose yourself if you do. xo
posted by St. Peepsburg at 9:03 PM on April 29, 2018 [3 favorites]
Also in a mundane way - when I started playing team sports I totally understood watching sports and now I can watch almost any sport with rapture. It's about the mastery, in the moment focus, training, pushing yourself to your best, the crush if you fail, the joy if you do, ahhhh it's so great.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 9:09 PM on April 29, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by St. Peepsburg at 9:09 PM on April 29, 2018 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Saltysalticid I agree it's a callow assumption. And yes I think the whole problem is the analyzing and judging, I don't like that I do it, and want to stop it. I always feel this need to arrive to a definitive answer, I guess because I feel it's necessary to have an answer so that I can know who I am and where I stand. When I don't have that answer, I judge myself for not knowing where I stand, whereas most people just ponder these questions and don't need the answer. Now that I'm considering this, I see what you are saying, that I need to recognize that I probably can't come to an answer about these things and that's okay.
Lazuli - that's interesting, I've never thought of the MBTI that way - approaching it as a way to show you what you need to become balanced.
Thank you everyone for the answers so far, I'm going to give mindfulness another go.
posted by oracleia at 9:12 PM on April 29, 2018 [2 favorites]
Lazuli - that's interesting, I've never thought of the MBTI that way - approaching it as a way to show you what you need to become balanced.
Thank you everyone for the answers so far, I'm going to give mindfulness another go.
posted by oracleia at 9:12 PM on April 29, 2018 [2 favorites]
I have a hard time getting into my feelings. I just do.
Things that help me are little emotion charts. I needed them to be like oh yeah I'm bored, or Oh yeah I'm anxious, or maybe I'm happy? Once I have the word then I can think about it, but also feel it a little better.
Instead of mindfulness being just breath, it can be a bit more... like textures and temperature and how comfortable you are. Are you relaxing or tense? Some mindfulness is acceptance that brains just do, and that's OK.
posted by AlexiaSky at 9:13 PM on April 29, 2018 [4 favorites]
Things that help me are little emotion charts. I needed them to be like oh yeah I'm bored, or Oh yeah I'm anxious, or maybe I'm happy? Once I have the word then I can think about it, but also feel it a little better.
Instead of mindfulness being just breath, it can be a bit more... like textures and temperature and how comfortable you are. Are you relaxing or tense? Some mindfulness is acceptance that brains just do, and that's OK.
posted by AlexiaSky at 9:13 PM on April 29, 2018 [4 favorites]
I can do thought spirals now by choice to amuse myself when bored, but I can also just enjoy things. The difference is the tiny dose of anti-anxiety medication I take daily. It's not a solution for everyone, but you'll pry it from me with a crowbar.
I can control my anxiety reasonably now - I just missed an important test paper date and have sat down and thought about why I postponed finishing it and realised I hated the paper, hated the thought of taking the course that led to, and so now I'm going to write to the professor and ask for either a retake or a withdrawal and then... go about my day. Previously I'd spend the entire day going through every wretched reason, over-analysing it and I'd have over prepared and still missed the test.
Mindfulness is a good first line to try. I was waking up in the middle of the night with overthinking and the only times I was in the moment were when I was utterly exhausted or had a fever. It was very very tiring.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 9:20 PM on April 29, 2018 [4 favorites]
I can control my anxiety reasonably now - I just missed an important test paper date and have sat down and thought about why I postponed finishing it and realised I hated the paper, hated the thought of taking the course that led to, and so now I'm going to write to the professor and ask for either a retake or a withdrawal and then... go about my day. Previously I'd spend the entire day going through every wretched reason, over-analysing it and I'd have over prepared and still missed the test.
Mindfulness is a good first line to try. I was waking up in the middle of the night with overthinking and the only times I was in the moment were when I was utterly exhausted or had a fever. It was very very tiring.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 9:20 PM on April 29, 2018 [4 favorites]
Are you certain that these thoughts are what's giving you anxiety, or could it be that you're feeling anxious over having them when you think you're not supposed to, or supposed to be enjoying something else (something that you don't actually enjoy but feel you should), or supposed to be thinking /feeling like others do.
I'm only asking because I score evenly/alternately between INTP/INFP so i actually relate to all of these thoughts, and thoughts about my thoughts, and then thoughts about my thoughts compared to what others thoughts may be.. and on and on etc,
And well, I personally would find a conversation with someone about these things a lot more fun and interesting than the game itself, and experience anxiety only at the realization that I am completely alone in that preference in the people I have in my life.
It's a lonely, alienating feeling, and most certainly I've spent just as much time trying to analyze all of the things that must be "wrong" with me to be so different from others.
So I do apologize For giving you yet another angle to reanalyze it all from,
but really,
are you sure it makes more sense that your anxiety is coming from:
your natural curiosity and interest about all of the workings of life and the world and people in it, and wanting to discuss these big explorative ideas with others who find it every bit as fascinating....
Instead of coming from the fact that you're in a room of people with whom you can't share and enjoy that part of yourself with, mentally frustrated/bored to the point of anxiety, and wondering why you can't just shut yourself off or change yourself to fit in better with people who (also incredibly confusing to me) actually do get enjoyment and find fulfillment on some level from participating in sports culture?
posted by OnefortheLast at 9:42 PM on April 29, 2018 [2 favorites]
I'm only asking because I score evenly/alternately between INTP/INFP so i actually relate to all of these thoughts, and thoughts about my thoughts, and then thoughts about my thoughts compared to what others thoughts may be.. and on and on etc,
And well, I personally would find a conversation with someone about these things a lot more fun and interesting than the game itself, and experience anxiety only at the realization that I am completely alone in that preference in the people I have in my life.
It's a lonely, alienating feeling, and most certainly I've spent just as much time trying to analyze all of the things that must be "wrong" with me to be so different from others.
So I do apologize For giving you yet another angle to reanalyze it all from,
but really,
are you sure it makes more sense that your anxiety is coming from:
your natural curiosity and interest about all of the workings of life and the world and people in it, and wanting to discuss these big explorative ideas with others who find it every bit as fascinating....
Instead of coming from the fact that you're in a room of people with whom you can't share and enjoy that part of yourself with, mentally frustrated/bored to the point of anxiety, and wondering why you can't just shut yourself off or change yourself to fit in better with people who (also incredibly confusing to me) actually do get enjoyment and find fulfillment on some level from participating in sports culture?
posted by OnefortheLast at 9:42 PM on April 29, 2018 [2 favorites]
I don't think that thinking about things like this in and of itself is the problem. But like, in your example, I'd argue the tribal thinking you saw isn't what leads to war - in fact, what you were witnessing was a replacement for things like war. The hockey game was a positive way for humans to redirect their passion and their energy and investment into something that isn't fighting wars like they probably did thousands of years ago, and that's awesome. So, go team!
Maybe you can train yourself or challenge yourself to land on a positive note and move on. Because I will say, I think about things in this way all the time too. This is how I am. I am struck by things that don't seem to occur to other people who are usually just looking at things at face value. I've accepted this is how I am, but I let myself ponder the thoughts and them let them float out of my brain as fast as they entered and I move on.
You touched on whether people pretend to like sports to fit in. I wouldn't knock that 'til you try it. I would say, like what you like - it's ok if hockey doesn't float your boat. But in general, there is something to be said about "fake it 'til you make it." I know that isn't exactly what that expression means, but sometimes playing along with something helps you understand it and feel comfortable it, and then it becomes genuine, at least to a degree. I've found it works for me.
posted by AppleTurnover at 11:40 PM on April 29, 2018 [1 favorite]
Maybe you can train yourself or challenge yourself to land on a positive note and move on. Because I will say, I think about things in this way all the time too. This is how I am. I am struck by things that don't seem to occur to other people who are usually just looking at things at face value. I've accepted this is how I am, but I let myself ponder the thoughts and them let them float out of my brain as fast as they entered and I move on.
You touched on whether people pretend to like sports to fit in. I wouldn't knock that 'til you try it. I would say, like what you like - it's ok if hockey doesn't float your boat. But in general, there is something to be said about "fake it 'til you make it." I know that isn't exactly what that expression means, but sometimes playing along with something helps you understand it and feel comfortable it, and then it becomes genuine, at least to a degree. I've found it works for me.
posted by AppleTurnover at 11:40 PM on April 29, 2018 [1 favorite]
I have a tattoo with a quote from the movie Pi. It says, "There will be no order, only chaos."
I too struggle with anxiety. I like to know WHY?!? for everything. I have a 100 step plan with backups for everything. I also think sports are almost all super dumb.
But, having thoughts about WHY things are, isn't exactly anxiety. I agree, that you need to work on the anxiety part. Not the curiosity and sociology part. Because humans and life are fascinating and weird. But you have to realize that you won't find A Truth in most of it - because it's all subjective. There's not way to totally predict the future or understand the past.
So, get help for the anxiety. Work on coming to peace with not knowing the answer to everything. I always suggest therapy for everyone because I think it's super helpful. But you have to do the work on your own.
And lastly, Oh No Ross and Carrie did a couple of podcasts on the MB personality stuff. It's very good and informative. It's just a general sense of how you respond, sometimes, to certain types of thoughts or situations. It's not very useful beyond "I have these overall traits sometimes" sort of stuff. (Coming from a mostly INTJ/INFJ that often scores near 50/50 on most things depending on my mood.)
posted by Crystalinne at 12:02 AM on April 30, 2018 [3 favorites]
I too struggle with anxiety. I like to know WHY?!? for everything. I have a 100 step plan with backups for everything. I also think sports are almost all super dumb.
But, having thoughts about WHY things are, isn't exactly anxiety. I agree, that you need to work on the anxiety part. Not the curiosity and sociology part. Because humans and life are fascinating and weird. But you have to realize that you won't find A Truth in most of it - because it's all subjective. There's not way to totally predict the future or understand the past.
So, get help for the anxiety. Work on coming to peace with not knowing the answer to everything. I always suggest therapy for everyone because I think it's super helpful. But you have to do the work on your own.
And lastly, Oh No Ross and Carrie did a couple of podcasts on the MB personality stuff. It's very good and informative. It's just a general sense of how you respond, sometimes, to certain types of thoughts or situations. It's not very useful beyond "I have these overall traits sometimes" sort of stuff. (Coming from a mostly INTJ/INFJ that often scores near 50/50 on most things depending on my mood.)
posted by Crystalinne at 12:02 AM on April 30, 2018 [3 favorites]
I think it would help to stop assuming that you are the only one who has these sorts of thoughts and/or that these sorts of thoughts make you weird and unique.
I think it would help because it sounds like you make yourself feel more and more lonely as you get further into a thought spiral, because you get deeper and deeper into the idea that everyone else is (for example) just enjoying the game while you are wrestling with the nature of truth, war, human social interactions, etc.
In terms of dealing with anxiety, I've learned you can either feed anxiety or starve it. You are currently feeding it every time it roars. To starve it, you can try the following: next time you feel pressure to solve some huge question before letting yourself relax and enjoy something, stop interrogating the huge question and instead ask yourself, "What will happen if I stop trying to solve this problem and just focus more on enjoying the game? What disaster am I trying to avert by hyper-focusing on this thing?" And if you can let it go, then focus on the game for a while. When your thoughts start spiraling again, just acknowledge to yourself that you're spiraling again, and try and re-focus on the game.
Incidentally, that is how I was taught meditation works. You don't control your mind perfectly while meditating. You focus on your breathing until your monkey mind starts wandering, and then you say to yourself, without judgment, "I am thinking about how everyone I know is going to die instead of on my breath," and then you start focusing on your breathing again.
posted by colfax at 12:34 AM on April 30, 2018 [4 favorites]
I think it would help because it sounds like you make yourself feel more and more lonely as you get further into a thought spiral, because you get deeper and deeper into the idea that everyone else is (for example) just enjoying the game while you are wrestling with the nature of truth, war, human social interactions, etc.
In terms of dealing with anxiety, I've learned you can either feed anxiety or starve it. You are currently feeding it every time it roars. To starve it, you can try the following: next time you feel pressure to solve some huge question before letting yourself relax and enjoy something, stop interrogating the huge question and instead ask yourself, "What will happen if I stop trying to solve this problem and just focus more on enjoying the game? What disaster am I trying to avert by hyper-focusing on this thing?" And if you can let it go, then focus on the game for a while. When your thoughts start spiraling again, just acknowledge to yourself that you're spiraling again, and try and re-focus on the game.
Incidentally, that is how I was taught meditation works. You don't control your mind perfectly while meditating. You focus on your breathing until your monkey mind starts wandering, and then you say to yourself, without judgment, "I am thinking about how everyone I know is going to die instead of on my breath," and then you start focusing on your breathing again.
posted by colfax at 12:34 AM on April 30, 2018 [4 favorites]
FWIW, there's no conflict between sport and "higher" thinking, or any other kind of thinking. This blog is one of my favourites on the subject: http://www.davidpapineau.co.uk/blog
There are a lot of different ways to enjoy the game - as a spectacle, as a display of skill, as an intellectual exercise, as a ritual of identity & belonging - and they don't conflict with each other. Same goes for all sorts of other things - art, music, food, love, science, whatever. That's one the wonderful things about being a person who's engaged in the world - there's just so much stuff to get interested in, and so many ways of furthering your interest in it. Let the awesomeness fill you up & overflow. It's all good.
posted by rd45 at 2:21 AM on April 30, 2018 [1 favorite]
There are a lot of different ways to enjoy the game - as a spectacle, as a display of skill, as an intellectual exercise, as a ritual of identity & belonging - and they don't conflict with each other. Same goes for all sorts of other things - art, music, food, love, science, whatever. That's one the wonderful things about being a person who's engaged in the world - there's just so much stuff to get interested in, and so many ways of furthering your interest in it. Let the awesomeness fill you up & overflow. It's all good.
posted by rd45 at 2:21 AM on April 30, 2018 [1 favorite]
I tend to fall into similar thought spirals, and my therapist always likes to recommend meditation. But meditation doesn't work for me -- not at this point. The only thing that gets me to quiet my anxious analytical mind is getting outside into nature and doing something energizing, like hiking, or yard work or cycling.
The thoughts make me feel anxious, like there is some answer I have to get to before I can allow myself to let go and enjoy the game, but I can't get to an answer.
How much time do you spend internet surfing? As a kid, I was a voracious book reader, but when the internet came around (in my late teens), I stopped reading books and started reading internet articles. These days, I spend hours every day exclusively reading internet articles. I strongly believe excessive internet use has rewired my brain to make me compulsively information-seek every time a random thought enters my brain. You might find this book to be interesting.
posted by houseofleaves at 5:16 AM on April 30, 2018 [3 favorites]
The thoughts make me feel anxious, like there is some answer I have to get to before I can allow myself to let go and enjoy the game, but I can't get to an answer.
How much time do you spend internet surfing? As a kid, I was a voracious book reader, but when the internet came around (in my late teens), I stopped reading books and started reading internet articles. These days, I spend hours every day exclusively reading internet articles. I strongly believe excessive internet use has rewired my brain to make me compulsively information-seek every time a random thought enters my brain. You might find this book to be interesting.
posted by houseofleaves at 5:16 AM on April 30, 2018 [3 favorites]
I'm not an INTP and I do this. I look at things form a global perspective. I'm a Do I dare to eat a peach person. Which peanut butter should I buy? Why does it have to be in plastic? But I can re-use the plastic container? Am I contributing to Climate Change? etc.
Follow your natural interest in how the world works and what you can reasonably do to not make it worse and maybe make it better. Do what you can. Remind yourself that other people see the world differently, have other points of view, other priorities.
Keep being mindful/ meditating; the point is to train your mind to stop chasing those thoughts, to let go. It takes practice.
Read. Read anthropology, history, sociology, psychology, current events. Join a book group. Your mind is active, engaged, curious - that's a great thing - feed it good material to ponder.
posted by theora55 at 6:30 AM on April 30, 2018 [2 favorites]
Follow your natural interest in how the world works and what you can reasonably do to not make it worse and maybe make it better. Do what you can. Remind yourself that other people see the world differently, have other points of view, other priorities.
Keep being mindful/ meditating; the point is to train your mind to stop chasing those thoughts, to let go. It takes practice.
Read. Read anthropology, history, sociology, psychology, current events. Join a book group. Your mind is active, engaged, curious - that's a great thing - feed it good material to ponder.
posted by theora55 at 6:30 AM on April 30, 2018 [2 favorites]
I used to get stuck in these loops and then I realized it was kind of essentially self-protective...a lot of my thinking was not actually quality, informed thinking or what I think of as essay-worthy thoughts, but a way of engaging with the world in my mind to distance myself from whatever was going on in front of me.
Once I realized it's okay to just do what I'm doing, and enjoy it (or not) for what it is without making it part of An Epic Tale of One Woman's Search for Meaning, I was able to relax a bit. I still have those thoughts but they are transient. Mostly. Then I answer AskMes.... :)
posted by warriorqueen at 6:37 AM on April 30, 2018 [5 favorites]
Once I realized it's okay to just do what I'm doing, and enjoy it (or not) for what it is without making it part of An Epic Tale of One Woman's Search for Meaning, I was able to relax a bit. I still have those thoughts but they are transient. Mostly. Then I answer AskMes.... :)
posted by warriorqueen at 6:37 AM on April 30, 2018 [5 favorites]
Regularly inhabiting the state of simply being or doing, rather than being/doing while simultaneously thinking about how we/others are being or doing, is valuable and necessary for all humans. If you're a thinky and analytical person, it's much harder for you do find that state while doing passive things.
What you need is something complicated and absorbing: body experiences like dancing or lifting weights, mind-focusing activities like writing or math problems, breath-focusing activities like singing (meditation works for some people but doesn't for me, yet), social experiences of whatever kind that completely absorbs you into it - for me, it's hosting parties or volunteering, and multi-sensory hands-on activities like gardening or woodworking. Ideally you'd do a little of all of these types of things on a regular basis.
Stop wasting time on leisure activities that don't fully absorb you. When I started feeling the way you do while watching TV, I gave up watching sports (and indeed gave up watching TV almost entirely) and started doing things that interest me more.
posted by MiraK at 7:16 AM on April 30, 2018 [2 favorites]
What you need is something complicated and absorbing: body experiences like dancing or lifting weights, mind-focusing activities like writing or math problems, breath-focusing activities like singing (meditation works for some people but doesn't for me, yet), social experiences of whatever kind that completely absorbs you into it - for me, it's hosting parties or volunteering, and multi-sensory hands-on activities like gardening or woodworking. Ideally you'd do a little of all of these types of things on a regular basis.
Stop wasting time on leisure activities that don't fully absorb you. When I started feeling the way you do while watching TV, I gave up watching sports (and indeed gave up watching TV almost entirely) and started doing things that interest me more.
posted by MiraK at 7:16 AM on April 30, 2018 [2 favorites]
The other reason you may want to deal with this is because you're probably projecting this need for analytical rigor into your understanding of people in your life. Like, you may subconsciously (or worse, consciously with a barrage of "why?" questions) expect people around you to justify their likes and dislikes. If someone isn't too familiar with you, and you have a bit of natural charm this can be mistaken for clumsy but healthy curiosity at first. In the long run, though, it's destructive to relationships and exhausting to be around because no one wants to feel like they have to constantly explain themselves to someone who isn't doing the work of getting to know them.
TBH, the most difficult people to deal with on a social level are those who assume that everyone's just pretending to like something that they're not into themselves. It's a massive red flag that you don't want to or can't relate to other people. If you MeFi mail me I can write you a novel on how that's even intergenerationally damaging.
Something like people being passionate about a sports match, from your question, is interesting to think about on an anthropological or sociological macro-level. You're not messed up for thinking these things. But you need to be careful of ecological fallacies and you shouldn't necessarily distill that kind of analysis to dealing with people on a one-on-one level. Watch, listen, observe, engage, but don't barrage with judgy questions.
posted by blerghamot at 7:18 AM on April 30, 2018 [3 favorites]
TBH, the most difficult people to deal with on a social level are those who assume that everyone's just pretending to like something that they're not into themselves. It's a massive red flag that you don't want to or can't relate to other people. If you MeFi mail me I can write you a novel on how that's even intergenerationally damaging.
Something like people being passionate about a sports match, from your question, is interesting to think about on an anthropological or sociological macro-level. You're not messed up for thinking these things. But you need to be careful of ecological fallacies and you shouldn't necessarily distill that kind of analysis to dealing with people on a one-on-one level. Watch, listen, observe, engage, but don't barrage with judgy questions.
posted by blerghamot at 7:18 AM on April 30, 2018 [3 favorites]
One thing that goes with anxiety is perfectionism, and another thing that goes with perfectionism is stopping trying if we're not "good" at something. So, yes, mindfulness is especially hard for the anxious mind-spinners, and it's easy to therefore abandon it as something we're not good at. But we are also among those who need it most. Also, professionals like therapists can help a lot, too.
posted by ldthomps at 9:39 AM on April 30, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by ldthomps at 9:39 AM on April 30, 2018 [4 favorites]
Peppercorn I've tried mindfulness and meditation, but I feel then it's almost like I'm fighting against my impulses to think and it takes so much effort to be present and focus on my breath.
Literally that is the entire point of meditation
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 10:05 AM on April 30, 2018 [7 favorites]
Literally that is the entire point of meditation
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 10:05 AM on April 30, 2018 [7 favorites]
I want to point out that there's a difference between mindfulness and meditation, though they are being used interchangeably here.
Mindfulness is an anxiety reducing tool that is backed up by research and implemented into many psychiatric programs and therapies. It's purpose is to focus your thoughts on one single act and all the sensory information available to you, to help you refocus your thought train from spinning out of control.
It is an act of having deliberate thoughts.
Meditation is more of a spiritual practice, where you "let go" of thoughts and try to remanin present in the moment. More of the evidence points towards it actually being anxiety inducing and even harmful for people with trauma realted memory loss, or those who experience dissociation.
It is an act of deliberately having no thoughts.
I really wanted to make that clear, because a person with anxiety is likely to worry that they are "doing it wrong" or even push on and try harder, making matters worse, if and when they attempt meditation and it doesn't work for them.
posted by OnefortheLast at 6:24 PM on April 30, 2018 [1 favorite]
Mindfulness is an anxiety reducing tool that is backed up by research and implemented into many psychiatric programs and therapies. It's purpose is to focus your thoughts on one single act and all the sensory information available to you, to help you refocus your thought train from spinning out of control.
It is an act of having deliberate thoughts.
Meditation is more of a spiritual practice, where you "let go" of thoughts and try to remanin present in the moment. More of the evidence points towards it actually being anxiety inducing and even harmful for people with trauma realted memory loss, or those who experience dissociation.
It is an act of deliberately having no thoughts.
I really wanted to make that clear, because a person with anxiety is likely to worry that they are "doing it wrong" or even push on and try harder, making matters worse, if and when they attempt meditation and it doesn't work for them.
posted by OnefortheLast at 6:24 PM on April 30, 2018 [1 favorite]
^^ not the definition of meditation, I must correct.
Mindfulness: being aware of the contents of your mind, without latching on to any one thought
Meditation: single-pointed concentration on one thought or experience eg. Loving-kindness
posted by St. Peepsburg at 9:41 PM on April 30, 2018 [1 favorite]
Mindfulness: being aware of the contents of your mind, without latching on to any one thought
Meditation: single-pointed concentration on one thought or experience eg. Loving-kindness
posted by St. Peepsburg at 9:41 PM on April 30, 2018 [1 favorite]
The thoughts aren't making you anxious. You have social anxiety and what you call "over analyzing" provides some relief and you judge yourself for needing it. I suggest group therapy.
posted by Obscure Reference at 9:38 AM on May 1, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by Obscure Reference at 9:38 AM on May 1, 2018 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thank you everyone for the responses. They have been very helpful to me.
I definitely think that I tend to assume I'm doing mindfulness wrong, which has led to more anxiety. The fact that it takes so much effort for me made me think that maybe I was suppressing something or doing it wrong, but I guess it just means that it's harder for me because of the nature of my anxious mind and that's exactly why I need to keep doing it.
It's nice to know that other people analyze things like I do, and that it's not necessarily a bad thing. As long as you have some control over it, which comes from practicing mindfulness and meditation :) I'm recognizing now that my anxiety is something apart from the analytical thoughts and not caused by them.
posted by oracleia at 10:12 AM on May 1, 2018 [1 favorite]
I definitely think that I tend to assume I'm doing mindfulness wrong, which has led to more anxiety. The fact that it takes so much effort for me made me think that maybe I was suppressing something or doing it wrong, but I guess it just means that it's harder for me because of the nature of my anxious mind and that's exactly why I need to keep doing it.
It's nice to know that other people analyze things like I do, and that it's not necessarily a bad thing. As long as you have some control over it, which comes from practicing mindfulness and meditation :) I'm recognizing now that my anxiety is something apart from the analytical thoughts and not caused by them.
posted by oracleia at 10:12 AM on May 1, 2018 [1 favorite]
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posted by Redstart at 8:31 PM on April 29, 2018 [7 favorites]