Did I come on too strong?
January 30, 2018 10:08 PM Subscribe
I met a person I’d like to be friends with, and we hung out and had a good time, but now I think I did something wrong.
I met this person at a bar, and relevant details include that I’m a cishet man with a partner (with whom I have a newly minted agreement, initiated by her, that we should be free to seek physical intimacy with other people although our emotional partnership should remain between just us), she’s a cishet woman that I mentioned my partner to without detailing that agreement, and our orientations align attraction-wise. Anyway, she initiated contact the first time we met on the basis of my being with my dog at the bar, and I engaged on a limited basis since it seemed like she was with a date, although it was clear we had shared interests. Then we met again incidentally at the same place and talked more in depth about some shared activist interests and she proposed meeting up later in the week to discuss the matter more in detail.
Anyway, we did meet up, accompanied by some of her friends near her home. I thought it went really well, I got along with all of them, and we related on the basis of both having had kind of difficult lives, and at the end of the evening when she said she needed to check out and I set out to leave she told me that she trusted me. In the course of that hangout she shared with me some of her serious and unresolved medical issues, and mentioned that she had a doctors appointment the day after that she’d update me on if I was cool with that (I said I was). She also suggested meeting up the next weekend to do some stuff pertaining to our common interest. She didn’t update me, which is totally fine, but so the day after that I texted and wished that she got some answers from the doctor and suggested that we hang out some time in the coming week.
So now I’m dealing with the fact that I’ve got a read receipt and no response a day later contrary to the communication patterns we’d established. I’ll grant that I felt some romantic attraction, but during our hangout I specifically avoided that sense out of caution, out of the realization that I’d be happy to be just platonic friends, and because she was already preoccupied with her medical situation and it seemed shitty to put that sort of emotional effort on someone who was dealing with a serious health concern.
So my question is: should I follow up? Did I cross a line of trying to be too intimate in spite of her willingness to share details about her struggles? I should note that I have fewer friendships than I’d like in the city that I’ve been living in for the past few years, and so might be over-intense in how I present to new people, but this person seemed willing to share their internal life to the same extent. I don’t have the perspective to tell if I’ve become overbearing, so I’d appreciate some feedback.
I met this person at a bar, and relevant details include that I’m a cishet man with a partner (with whom I have a newly minted agreement, initiated by her, that we should be free to seek physical intimacy with other people although our emotional partnership should remain between just us), she’s a cishet woman that I mentioned my partner to without detailing that agreement, and our orientations align attraction-wise. Anyway, she initiated contact the first time we met on the basis of my being with my dog at the bar, and I engaged on a limited basis since it seemed like she was with a date, although it was clear we had shared interests. Then we met again incidentally at the same place and talked more in depth about some shared activist interests and she proposed meeting up later in the week to discuss the matter more in detail.
Anyway, we did meet up, accompanied by some of her friends near her home. I thought it went really well, I got along with all of them, and we related on the basis of both having had kind of difficult lives, and at the end of the evening when she said she needed to check out and I set out to leave she told me that she trusted me. In the course of that hangout she shared with me some of her serious and unresolved medical issues, and mentioned that she had a doctors appointment the day after that she’d update me on if I was cool with that (I said I was). She also suggested meeting up the next weekend to do some stuff pertaining to our common interest. She didn’t update me, which is totally fine, but so the day after that I texted and wished that she got some answers from the doctor and suggested that we hang out some time in the coming week.
So now I’m dealing with the fact that I’ve got a read receipt and no response a day later contrary to the communication patterns we’d established. I’ll grant that I felt some romantic attraction, but during our hangout I specifically avoided that sense out of caution, out of the realization that I’d be happy to be just platonic friends, and because she was already preoccupied with her medical situation and it seemed shitty to put that sort of emotional effort on someone who was dealing with a serious health concern.
So my question is: should I follow up? Did I cross a line of trying to be too intimate in spite of her willingness to share details about her struggles? I should note that I have fewer friendships than I’d like in the city that I’ve been living in for the past few years, and so might be over-intense in how I present to new people, but this person seemed willing to share their internal life to the same extent. I don’t have the perspective to tell if I’ve become overbearing, so I’d appreciate some feedback.
Sorry to sound harsh but your entire problem seems only based on the fact that you haven’t received a reply to your text after one day. Unless you are younger than 25, if you’re concerned about her, just ring her. Otherwise, let her live her life and get back to you when she gets a chance.
I’m one generation before texting but still, I find it annoying when people expect me to answer their message right away, regardless of what’s going on in my life. Instant communication is what telephones were made for.
posted by Kwadeng at 10:40 PM on January 30, 2018 [28 favorites]
I’m one generation before texting but still, I find it annoying when people expect me to answer their message right away, regardless of what’s going on in my life. Instant communication is what telephones were made for.
posted by Kwadeng at 10:40 PM on January 30, 2018 [28 favorites]
Best answer: So now I’m dealing with the fact that I’ve got a read receipt and no response a day later contrary to the communication patterns we’d established.
You've met her three times if I counted right -- you haven't established anything. you are in the process of making friends, if it continues to go as you want it to; you aren't friends yet. you do not have a relationship with established patterns.
you know she has detailed medical troubles, which is a lot for her to have told a stranger or even a new friend. maybe she regrets having told you, or maybe she is just having medical troubles and has higher priorities on her to-do list than making plans with a guy she's just started to get to know and who has a girlfriend but seems very interested (which is usually trouble and, per your agreement that you told us but not her, is definitely trouble for her if she's interested in you since you made a pact to not get emotionally involved.)
you say and I believe that you simply want to make friends, but if you are past early twenties women will not take well to unilaterally imposed expectations from men they just met. you are not yet at any level of intimacy where she owes you a response in a certain timeframe to keep you from worrying. you haven't done anything wrong yet, but if you get huffy because she doesn't call you for a week or doesn't mention her doctor stuff, you will have. save that for when you've been friends for a year and she drops out of contact for two months.
posted by queenofbithynia at 11:22 PM on January 30, 2018 [28 favorites]
You've met her three times if I counted right -- you haven't established anything. you are in the process of making friends, if it continues to go as you want it to; you aren't friends yet. you do not have a relationship with established patterns.
you know she has detailed medical troubles, which is a lot for her to have told a stranger or even a new friend. maybe she regrets having told you, or maybe she is just having medical troubles and has higher priorities on her to-do list than making plans with a guy she's just started to get to know and who has a girlfriend but seems very interested (which is usually trouble and, per your agreement that you told us but not her, is definitely trouble for her if she's interested in you since you made a pact to not get emotionally involved.)
you say and I believe that you simply want to make friends, but if you are past early twenties women will not take well to unilaterally imposed expectations from men they just met. you are not yet at any level of intimacy where she owes you a response in a certain timeframe to keep you from worrying. you haven't done anything wrong yet, but if you get huffy because she doesn't call you for a week or doesn't mention her doctor stuff, you will have. save that for when you've been friends for a year and she drops out of contact for two months.
posted by queenofbithynia at 11:22 PM on January 30, 2018 [28 favorites]
Best answer: Yup, you need to chill. I’d send another text in a week and then leave it alone. Also, I strongly recommend separating potential dates from potential friends as you appear to be in a newly open relationship. If you want more friends, focus on that. Like, go crazy chasing potential sex partners too, I’m non-monogamous, no judgment there, but focus on what matters to you most to start. Friendships take time; you need to be in it for the long-haul. Perhaps this woman may become a friend over time at a pace that works for her. You haven’t done anything wrong yet. But it also sounds like you may be crushing on her, so watch your step.
posted by Bella Donna at 12:03 AM on January 31, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by Bella Donna at 12:03 AM on January 31, 2018 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Honestly? You seem confused about the nature of your agreement with yourself, and with your partner. You two agreed not to become emotionally intimate with others, and this entire situation is emotionally intimate. And then you say this: " it seemed shitty to put that sort of emotional effort on someone who was dealing with a serious health concern." It's also kind of shitty that you feel like this woman -- who is essentially a stranger -- owes you anything at all: a text back, emotional effort, anything.
What I personally fail to see is what she is going to get out of getting involved with you. Sorry. She is a fully autonomous person who has her own things going on. She hung out with you once. There's no mutual agreement and there certainly isn't any reason to say things like "contrary to the communication patterns we’d established." Man, if some other human I spent a few hours with was holding me to this kind of standard, I would be out of there so fast. And if it was some guy who seemed like I had a romantic spark with but he told me he had a partner and I didn't know they had an open arrangement yet and yet he seemed interested maybe in me? Yeah, no.
Don't mix the idea that you need friends with the idea of getting into physical relationships with people who aren't your partner. That is literally what you and your partner agreed upon. It's interesting that you fell into this situation so quickly after you and your partner made this decision. Why is that, do you think? Food for thought.
posted by sockermom at 2:32 AM on January 31, 2018 [59 favorites]
What I personally fail to see is what she is going to get out of getting involved with you. Sorry. She is a fully autonomous person who has her own things going on. She hung out with you once. There's no mutual agreement and there certainly isn't any reason to say things like "contrary to the communication patterns we’d established." Man, if some other human I spent a few hours with was holding me to this kind of standard, I would be out of there so fast. And if it was some guy who seemed like I had a romantic spark with but he told me he had a partner and I didn't know they had an open arrangement yet and yet he seemed interested maybe in me? Yeah, no.
Don't mix the idea that you need friends with the idea of getting into physical relationships with people who aren't your partner. That is literally what you and your partner agreed upon. It's interesting that you fell into this situation so quickly after you and your partner made this decision. Why is that, do you think? Food for thought.
posted by sockermom at 2:32 AM on January 31, 2018 [59 favorites]
Best answer: What would you do if this was a man instead of a woman you were attracted to? Do that. If you want to make friends, make friends. If you want a romantic or sexual relationship, be honest with yourself about that. Saying you’re “happy to be just friends” is usually a warning sign that you are not in a spot to be friends with someone. Friendship is a different type of relationship, not a lesser degree of one.
It’s concerning that you have romantic feelings for someone so soon after your relationship opened up, especially since “romantic” is exactly the kind of thing you’ve agreed not to have outside of your relationship. It’s not wrong to have feelings, but you need to proceed in a way that doesn’t compromise the health of your relationship, and you need to be clear with potential new partners.
posted by Metroid Baby at 4:00 AM on January 31, 2018 [10 favorites]
It’s concerning that you have romantic feelings for someone so soon after your relationship opened up, especially since “romantic” is exactly the kind of thing you’ve agreed not to have outside of your relationship. It’s not wrong to have feelings, but you need to proceed in a way that doesn’t compromise the health of your relationship, and you need to be clear with potential new partners.
posted by Metroid Baby at 4:00 AM on January 31, 2018 [10 favorites]
Another perspective - I'm generally wary of anyone who by the 2nd meeting is divulging a difficult life and serious health issues with me. I tend to regard that sort of sharing to be inappropriate until I have know someone longer than a few meetups. Maybe look at it this way: she got really emotionally intimate with you, really quickly. She said she trusted you after the first hangout. You were receptive to that and eager to hear about outcomes... and then she sort of spaces out on you and pokes you about a potential meet-up for a shared interest. I just smell bad things brewing here. She already has you "on a hook" and hungry for more and you have met a few times in a very casual way.
Back up, take a breather and talk this situation over with your partner. This is emotional investment at its very beginning. Your partner may actually be able to help you see that any person who drops that much detail and then ghosts a bit is not really what you are looking for. It's a crap dynamic for a friendship and an even crappier dynamic for consensual sex.
posted by missh at 4:21 AM on January 31, 2018 [7 favorites]
Back up, take a breather and talk this situation over with your partner. This is emotional investment at its very beginning. Your partner may actually be able to help you see that any person who drops that much detail and then ghosts a bit is not really what you are looking for. It's a crap dynamic for a friendship and an even crappier dynamic for consensual sex.
posted by missh at 4:21 AM on January 31, 2018 [7 favorites]
Best answer: You don't sound like someone who is setting up NOT to have an emotionally meaningful relationship with this person. You need to get right about that ASAP or you're likely to cause harm to everyone involved, including yourself.
It's possible to have sex without substantial emotional involvement but not if you're also getting to be friends.
What you're doing here is setting up a situation where you can either tell this woman that she should have known not to don't on you when she tries to lean on you more than you want but that you have UNTIL THAT POINT signaled her to expect DESPITE your words, OR you'll have to go back to current partner and tell her oops, I accidentally friends this other person. Except it's not an accident.
posted by spindrifter at 5:05 AM on January 31, 2018 [6 favorites]
It's possible to have sex without substantial emotional involvement but not if you're also getting to be friends.
What you're doing here is setting up a situation where you can either tell this woman that she should have known not to don't on you when she tries to lean on you more than you want but that you have UNTIL THAT POINT signaled her to expect DESPITE your words, OR you'll have to go back to current partner and tell her oops, I accidentally friends this other person. Except it's not an accident.
posted by spindrifter at 5:05 AM on January 31, 2018 [6 favorites]
Best answer: DUDE. You need to chill.
I texted and wished that she got some answers from the doctor and suggested that we hang out some time in the coming week. So now I’m dealing with the fact that I’ve got a read receipt and no response a day later
Serious question: what type of response do you think you were owed to this message? A thank you? An immediate list of possible times to meet up? Because neither one of those expectations seems reasonable to me. (PS this is a thing a lot of dudes do: send messages that are hard to answer easily or right away and then get pissed when a woman takes time to answer. Just FYI. A pattern to avoid.)
-Maybe the appointment went terribly and she’s still processing and “dude she just met” is not top of her list of people who will help her with that.
-Maybe she has a weird work situation so she’s still figuring out her schedule, and so she is waiting to respond to your question about meeting up until she knows when she can.
-Maybe she doesn’t want to hang out with you that soon and she is trying to find a way to say so that won’t make you mad (as you may have heard on this very website, many men become VERY ANGRY when women say things like “no” or “not this week”).
-Maybe she met the love of her life two hours after she said goodbye to you at your last meeting and they’re holed up in a B&B three hours away eating chocolate covered strawberries.
-Maybe she lost her phone.
-Maybe she has zero interest in getting involved in your poly situation and is starting to figure out that you don’t want to just be her friend.
-Maybe she IS interested in dating a poly dude, but she’s (understandably) reluctant to be your first foray outside of your marriage, because you seem to be champing at the bit right now and she needs you to be less intense before she wants to deal with you.
-Maybe she WAS interested in dating a poly dude, but then you had a good talk and now she is trying to figure out whether she might prefer to have you as a friend rather than a sex buddy.
-Maybe she would rather talk to you about the activism thing you all discussed and is worried that the lines are getting blurred.
-Maybe she overshared in the moment and now she feels self-conscious about it and doesn’t know what to say.
-Maybe she had a great idea for a painting and she has been working on a painting.
-Maybe she is an adult who believes that other adults can deal with gaps in texting conversations with people they just met because that is 100% normal with asynchronous communication.
You need to CALM DOWN and stop trying to extrapolate anything from the big bag of nothing you have right now. Just reading your question gave me anxiety on this lady’s behalf, because it seems like her failing to respond in exactly the way that you want sends you into a tailspin, and that is a recipe for disaster.
(Also she should turn of her read receipts. They are poison.)
posted by a fiendish thingy at 6:46 AM on January 31, 2018 [13 favorites]
I texted and wished that she got some answers from the doctor and suggested that we hang out some time in the coming week. So now I’m dealing with the fact that I’ve got a read receipt and no response a day later
Serious question: what type of response do you think you were owed to this message? A thank you? An immediate list of possible times to meet up? Because neither one of those expectations seems reasonable to me. (PS this is a thing a lot of dudes do: send messages that are hard to answer easily or right away and then get pissed when a woman takes time to answer. Just FYI. A pattern to avoid.)
-Maybe the appointment went terribly and she’s still processing and “dude she just met” is not top of her list of people who will help her with that.
-Maybe she has a weird work situation so she’s still figuring out her schedule, and so she is waiting to respond to your question about meeting up until she knows when she can.
-Maybe she doesn’t want to hang out with you that soon and she is trying to find a way to say so that won’t make you mad (as you may have heard on this very website, many men become VERY ANGRY when women say things like “no” or “not this week”).
-Maybe she met the love of her life two hours after she said goodbye to you at your last meeting and they’re holed up in a B&B three hours away eating chocolate covered strawberries.
-Maybe she lost her phone.
-Maybe she has zero interest in getting involved in your poly situation and is starting to figure out that you don’t want to just be her friend.
-Maybe she IS interested in dating a poly dude, but she’s (understandably) reluctant to be your first foray outside of your marriage, because you seem to be champing at the bit right now and she needs you to be less intense before she wants to deal with you.
-Maybe she WAS interested in dating a poly dude, but then you had a good talk and now she is trying to figure out whether she might prefer to have you as a friend rather than a sex buddy.
-Maybe she would rather talk to you about the activism thing you all discussed and is worried that the lines are getting blurred.
-Maybe she overshared in the moment and now she feels self-conscious about it and doesn’t know what to say.
-Maybe she had a great idea for a painting and she has been working on a painting.
-Maybe she is an adult who believes that other adults can deal with gaps in texting conversations with people they just met because that is 100% normal with asynchronous communication.
You need to CALM DOWN and stop trying to extrapolate anything from the big bag of nothing you have right now. Just reading your question gave me anxiety on this lady’s behalf, because it seems like her failing to respond in exactly the way that you want sends you into a tailspin, and that is a recipe for disaster.
(Also she should turn of her read receipts. They are poison.)
posted by a fiendish thingy at 6:46 AM on January 31, 2018 [13 favorites]
Best answer: Seconding that it's been a day and you should chill out and not follow up. If/when she responds, if it's with anything other than friendly enthusiasm, you should back off and let her take the lead in organizing hangouts.
(Sidenote: that you even mention your arrangement with your partner here is a bit odd - if you're purely interested in this woman as friends, then the arrangement you have with your partner vis a vis sleeping with others is irrelevant. Are you sure about your intentions? Perhaps this woman is sensing mixed messages from you and, not knowing that you have an arrangement with your partner, is feeling awkward for that reason.)
posted by too bad you're not me at 7:32 AM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
(Sidenote: that you even mention your arrangement with your partner here is a bit odd - if you're purely interested in this woman as friends, then the arrangement you have with your partner vis a vis sleeping with others is irrelevant. Are you sure about your intentions? Perhaps this woman is sensing mixed messages from you and, not knowing that you have an arrangement with your partner, is feeling awkward for that reason.)
posted by too bad you're not me at 7:32 AM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
Best answer: I know this is tangential to your question, but you REALLY need to clarify your open relationship parameters with your partner. If sex without an emotional component is your agreement, that means Tinder and/or sex workers, not getting close with new friends and hoping to have sex with them. That is likely to end in you hurting your partner AND your friend-with-benefits, since your partner is likely to shut that down right quick and leave Friend feeling used and abandoned.
Your question (worrying about not getting a reply to a text a day later from someone you barely know) shows that you're already emotionally invested in her. From what you said about your agreement with your partner, I think that means that sex is off the table.
posted by metasarah at 8:27 AM on January 31, 2018 [11 favorites]
Your question (worrying about not getting a reply to a text a day later from someone you barely know) shows that you're already emotionally invested in her. From what you said about your agreement with your partner, I think that means that sex is off the table.
posted by metasarah at 8:27 AM on January 31, 2018 [11 favorites]
Best answer: I agree with those who've mentioned that you seem confused about what you want out of this new relationship, and the agreement you made with your partner. For example, these sentences don't go together:
• I met a person I’d like to be friends with
• our emotional partnership should remain between just [my g/f and I]
• I felt some romantic attraction
You probably won't doom your relationship with your girlfriend but if you're simply looking for friends as per "I have fewer friendships than I’d like", you're going the wrong way about this because it sounds you're either a) persuing a romantic relationship, or b) don't know how to uncomplicated sex with other people without forming a emotional attachment. In which case this agreement, while it might suit your partner, will not suit you, and you might have to have another conversation with her.
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 11:33 AM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
• I met a person I’d like to be friends with
• our emotional partnership should remain between just [my g/f and I]
• I felt some romantic attraction
You probably won't doom your relationship with your girlfriend but if you're simply looking for friends as per "I have fewer friendships than I’d like", you're going the wrong way about this because it sounds you're either a) persuing a romantic relationship, or b) don't know how to uncomplicated sex with other people without forming a emotional attachment. In which case this agreement, while it might suit your partner, will not suit you, and you might have to have another conversation with her.
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 11:33 AM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: This has been some great advice, if difficult to read. I think everyone saying I’m a little confused about what I’m actually looking for is on the money, and I realize I need to think that through a lot more before potentially involving someone else in it. I will avoid any further follow ups, and definitely drop any romantic intention if we do talk again.
Some things I feel could use clarification: I don’t feel entitled to a response, per se, I just have a lot of anxiety in general about whether I’m still in good standing given this type of non-response (atypical for my age group), which I certainly could understand reflects a different and deeper sense of entitlement, but that confusion is why I asked in the first place. Secondly, I can see how this could be interpreted as oversharing, but it’s not *that* out of the ordinary in the milieu that she and I operate in. Anyway, thank you all.
posted by Two Stranger at 9:17 PM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
Some things I feel could use clarification: I don’t feel entitled to a response, per se, I just have a lot of anxiety in general about whether I’m still in good standing given this type of non-response (atypical for my age group), which I certainly could understand reflects a different and deeper sense of entitlement, but that confusion is why I asked in the first place. Secondly, I can see how this could be interpreted as oversharing, but it’s not *that* out of the ordinary in the milieu that she and I operate in. Anyway, thank you all.
posted by Two Stranger at 9:17 PM on January 31, 2018 [1 favorite]
I'm not sure this will help you feel better, but if you're NOT in good standing, not following up is DEFINITELY the right thing to do!
posted by spindrifter at 12:40 PM on February 1, 2018
posted by spindrifter at 12:40 PM on February 1, 2018
Response by poster: Update: she followed up much later saying she’d been very distracted. I have dropped all romantic intentions and it seems like we’re getting along quite well as friends, and I’m very happy with that outcome.
posted by Two Stranger at 12:16 AM on April 5, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by Two Stranger at 12:16 AM on April 5, 2018 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
Maybe she got some news that wasn't great and she's dealing with that. Maybe she feels as if she over-shared, and now she's embarrassed. Maybe she sensed you were attracted and she didn't reciprocate, or she DID reciprocate but didn't want to get more involved for whatever reason. Maybe she's just been really busy. Whatever happened, I doubt the problem was that you were a jerk.
posted by Ursula Hitler at 10:38 PM on January 30, 2018 [11 favorites]