Tied up in knots/ascots/cravats/puff ties/whatevs...
January 26, 2018 12:04 AM   Subscribe

I am an intermediate sewist and I have been tasked with sewing a men's Victorian-style puff tie. I am loathe to spend money on a pattern if I could actually make my own pattern. Is a puff tie the same item as a cravat? I am seeing some stuff like this but it doesn't look authentic (not to mention it looks like more trouble to sew than it's worth). Any guidance would be most appreciated!
posted by shalom to Clothing, Beauty, & Fashion (6 answers total) 2 users marked this as a favorite
 
I'm not 100% on the terms but I think all puff ties are a cravat but not all cravats are puff ties? The people who would know this are reenactment folks, theater folks, and maybe victorian history nerds - are you near a liberal arts university? This would be the kind of question you could ask of faculty and get a range of helpfulness anywhere from a yes/no to a "here's my pattern"/"Take my five extra puff ties we don't use anymore".

Anyway the website from the image you link, Historical Emporium, has some good pictures and a how-to video that shows a lot of detail, maybe enough for you to make your own pattern from.

Here's the video and here's a picture from the product page.

It's made of three pieces. A long thin strip with a clasp on the ends to go around the neck - since this is presumably for one person you wouldn't have to make it super adjustable and could do buttons or snaps . The tie part isn't actually tied at all but is just a long rectangle held to the neck strip in the center via another piece that loops around both pieces and holds them in a little pocket. That third piece needs to be long enough to cover the shirt buttons, and the rectangular piece just tucks into the vest layered on top. You can see in the video how it all slides along the neck strip. I'm not sure if the long rectangular piece is actually attached to the third piece or if it's just tucked in along it and could be pulled from side to side or not - maybe for puffiness control it's gathered and tacked? But I imagine that would be adjusted like one adjusts the dimple in a contemporary tie's knot.

The hardest part seems to be fabric selection, you'll want something with nice volume so it will remain "puffed" but not so stiff as to be uncomfortable and make wrinkles under the close fitting vest. Probably silk of some kind - let your budget be your guide. The ones I've seen worn in person by my old reenactment buddies and theater people (I was always tech so I didn't get into the menswear much) were made of different fabrics for different types of characters and didn't always stay put without a bevy of pins.
posted by Mizu at 3:08 AM on January 26, 2018 [2 favorites]


Google seems to think that cravats = puff ties. If you aren't near a uni or other place where there are experts in this area, perhaps the free pattern and info will help:

https://www.folkwear.com/blogs/news/cravat-free-pattern-plus-history-and-a-tutorial
posted by methroach at 5:13 AM on January 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


I would second that all puff ties are cravats, but not all cravats are puff ties. They can be made with just a single width piece of fabric, the look comes from how it is tied. Anything modified beyond that is to make it easier/less of a hassle to tie (akin to clip-on ties).

The look you have linked above is considered a Wedding or Formal cravat, so that might help looking for how-to tutorials.
posted by RhysPenbras at 5:49 AM on January 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


Based on the video Mizu shared, I would not think an intermediate sewer would need a pattern--just some measurements and three basic pieces: 1) the neck strap; 2) the tails; 3) the small triangle. Fabric weight should be something with a good weight, not too drapey, no real stretch, I would think, to get that puffed effect with only tucking and pinning.

1. The strap around the neck with closure--Looks like half inch double fold bias strip. I probably would not even bother to sew it closed, cause I'm lazy. Just press it firmly in place. But you could do a turned strip. I agree with Mizu that I'd not make it adjustable if it's going to be worn by just one person and I'd go with a button or snap rather than hook because I find hooks never stay closed.

2. The two tails--Look like a single piece (your basic irritating turned rectangle where you stitch up a rectangle, leaving a bit of seam open, then turn it rightside-out through the opening and slipstitch it closed). Three-four inches wide? I'm not good with guessing size, but it looks about palmwidth. Hangs down to the second button on the vest--so 9 inches in length, plus two to three to cross under the triangle? Length does not seem critical, however, since it's not tied, just tucked and pinned in place.

3. The small triangle to conceal the shirt front--It looks like the tails pass through the small triangle which is stitched down to the neck strap, making the pleats where they all connect and holding the pieces together. I can't tell from the picture whether the crease on the triangle (where it meets the neck strap) is a line of stitching or not, though). The small triangle is definitely narrower than the tails.

I would cut the triangle as a single piece of fabric, folding at the top. Then I would stitch it (right sides together), leaving the pass-through part unstitched with the seams pressed in place--So stiched up the sides from the bottom point of the triangle on each side to about an inch from the fold. Then I'd turn it, pass the strap and the tie through it. Then I'd adjust the folds at the pass through, then stitch along under the strap--parallel to the chin, horizontal, leaving the sides unstitched. Possibly catch-stitched?

Does that make sense?
posted by crush at 6:12 AM on January 26, 2018 [2 favorites]


Possibly some interfacing in the rectangular dangling parts.
posted by SemiSalt at 9:56 AM on January 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


Response by poster: Thank you for helping clarify this for me. I was finding the terminology really confusing. If I had more time I would contact my local university but the event is in a week. I will make sure to post pics! (And I see from a previous Ask I also have to post pics of a certain wedding hat so I will get on that, too!). I found the perfect silk tie material at a local salvage shop so now I just have to get down to the sewing. :-)
posted by shalom at 1:22 PM on January 26, 2018


« Older Fire gloves!   |   Two different photos for a Facebook Page's cover-... Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.