landlord gave me formal notice
January 12, 2018 5:31 AM   Subscribe

My landlord inspected my apartment yesterday and found it to be in such disarray that I am in voilation of my lease.

I've asked a few questions over the last year of falling behind in cleaning until my apartment looks like shit. I'll recover, and then it will happen again. It's happened again, and now my landlord is angry because I'm in violation of my lease. I pay my rent on time every month so he's not inclined to evict me but he says that my apartment has reduced his property value (he has been trying to sell the building).

I'll be cleaning all day today but I expect even once I get it in pristene shape the landlord won't want me to stay.

Practical questions:
How do I move when this landlord will probably not give me a stellar reference?
I freelance but I also am living off of an inheritance. How do I prove to a new landlord that I am capable of paying on time? I have 1099s, etc, but how do I show the inheritance?

Help. Clearly my mental health is not in good shape at the moment. I'm frightened. I'm freaking out.
posted by thereemix to Home & Garden (47 answers total) 6 users marked this as a favorite
 
I’ll speak to your last question. I’ve had tenents wirh no credit history prepay the lease in the past. That plus bank statements has been a common solution.

Can you throw money at the problem? Pay someone to come clean?

I’m sorry that you’re having such a rough time.
posted by snickerdoodle at 5:34 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


I'll be cleaning all day today but I expect even once I get it in pristene shape the landlord won't want me to stay.

Has he said this? If he's selling the building anyway why would he want to go through the bother of getting you out and another tenant in?
posted by bunderful at 5:43 AM on January 12


I feel like the relationship with the landlord has probably been ruined by this. He's been trying to sell the building for over a year and failing (due to many actual problems with the building - issues with the furnace, with the common areas being half-renovated, with one apartment that doesn't have a floor) but even if I make the place look great I think he probably feels like he can't trust me; I also get the feeling that he might blame me for him not having sold the building yet.

He's not a great landlord in general and I don't trust him to not take this out on me.
posted by thereemix at 5:51 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


I don’t have a lot of experience with renting so I may not understand how this works but I’m thinking of how your apartment’s messiness could reduce the building’s property value and wondering if it’s something like pet waste getting into the flooring or food left out and attracting pests. If your problems are of this nature is it possible you might be suited for assisted housing? There are places in my area where people have their own apartments but get a little help with things as needed. This kind of housing is in short supply, unfortunately, but they’d also probably be understanding of how it is that you won’t have a good reference.
posted by lakeroon at 5:53 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Don't freak out. (Easier said than done, I know.)

1. Google "cleaning services my area"
2. Click on the top result
3. Call the number (or email and fill out the form)
4. "I need a full, one-time cleaning. My apartment has (this many) rooms and is approximately (this many) square feet. I am available at (these times).
5. Schedule the appointment. If possible, arrange to leave them a key so you don't have to be there.
6. Take yourself to lunch.
7. Come home. Take photos of your clean apartment and send them to the landlord.
8. If you generally like the vibe of the cleaning service, set up regular cleaning appointments monthly, weekly, or whatever you can afford.

Objections:

1. It's too expensive!

The one-time cleaning will probably be around $200, which is cheaper than moving.

2. But my landlord hates me now!

Nah, he probably doesn't. But even if he does, it doesn't matter. This is a business relationship. He told you to clean your apparent, so you cleaned it. If he wants to make it personal or keep fighting about it (bet you $10 he won't) that's his business.

3. Help, I'm a disgusting garbage person, I'm so ashamed, I'll never be a real adult, I am terrible and everything is terrible I want to to die.

Yup, I feel you. Cleaning issues get tangled up with mental health issues. I can feel the shame radiating off this question and I identified so hard with it, it hurts. But you deal with mental health issues by getting help with your mental health. You deal with a cleaning issue by getting help with cleaning, and the first step is to separate them out. Cleaning is no reflection of your worth as a human, it's just a job youre not good at, so you're paying someone else to help out. That's it. Everything else, all the messy feelings surrounding cleaning, will sort themselves out in time.

Call the cleaning service
posted by pretentious illiterate at 6:01 AM on January 12 [99 favorites]


Thanks for everyone's suggestion so far.

If I do decide to move, how do I deal with the fact that my current landlord likely will not give me a good reference? I've lived here since December 2014 and this is the first time he's had issue with me.
posted by thereemix at 6:11 AM on January 12


Step one: hire a regular cleaning service. You can have them do the initial cleaning too, but if you don't want to pay for that, get them set up to come in regularly in the future so this doesn't happen again.

Step two: don't worry about your landlord. He's not going to evict you. And if you tell him you now have a cleaning service, he will be glad that you solved the problem permanently.

Step three: how much difficulty you'll have in finding a new apartment depends a huge amount on where you live. But unless you think he's going to actually lie about you, he'll say that you consistently paid rent, and you can tell them you're willing to make a professional cleaning service part of your lease, which should minimize other concerns.
posted by metasarah at 6:14 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


If you get the cleaning service be sure to make a copy of the receipt and send that to the landlord.
posted by brujita at 6:22 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Have you heard the phrase, Don't borrow trouble? Don't borrow trouble. You don't know that you're going to have to move, and you don't know if your landlord will refuse to give you a good reference, and you don't know how your landlord's imagined bad reference is going to affect the decision of the imagined apartment you might be moving into yet. You can't deal with that because there are too many unknowns.

But, if it really helps to imagine yourself through this scenario, you can picture it playing out like this: your landlord mentions in his reference that once in four years of generally being a good tenant and paying your rent on time, he came into your apartment and told you to get it cleaned, so you did. You tell your new landlord that you now have a cleaning service that you use regularly, and offer to put down a slightly higher security deposit than usual if he's concerned. The end.
posted by pretentious illiterate at 6:27 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


If the common areas are half renovated and there’s an apartment WITHOUT A FLOOR (WTF?!), if your landlord IS blaming you for his problems with selling the building, he’s probably not being rational. Unless you’ve got something like a room full of medical waste, your apartment isn’t the reason why he can’t sell the building.

I’m not sure this will help you in any way other than maybe making you feel better- convincing him of this would be difficult and might not do you much good. But there it is.
posted by Anne Neville at 6:33 AM on January 12 [26 favorites]


I don’t know that I’ve ever had references from last Landlord’s. I have good credit history and that’s always been enough. I’ve also lived out of the country for half of the last 8 years so they wouldn’t really be able to follow up with landlords if they wanted to. I wouldn’t worry about landlord references.
posted by raccoon409 at 6:33 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


DO landlords require references in your area? They don’t do that everywhere.
posted by Anne Neville at 6:35 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I've never had a new landlord ask for a reference. It sounds like you are spiraling a little and worrying about an impending move when you don't have to, but to address one of your questions: some management companies will ask for bank statements as well as pay stubs, so if they see you have your inheritance money in the bank they will understand that you are solvent.
posted by cakelite at 6:47 AM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Hi. All of this is Not A Thing. I suspect you are being harassed.

- People who buy and sell apartment buildings don't care what the units look like. THEY DO CARE IF A BUILDING IS VACANT OR NOT. Is it possible the landlord is trying to make the property vacant?

- Clean your home for your sake.

- Landlords who want to get rid of tenants give EXCELLENT references! He wants you to move! He will lie! Anyway, you have all the bank receipts to show you paid on time, right? That's all you need.

- Tell perspective landlords you are moving because the building is being sold. It's the truth.

With all of that out of the way, clean without anxiety. Put on music you like and get to work! Make a pile of things to throw out or recycle in preparation for a move and do that. Purge.

Friend, reach out and get help for your feelings . It's worth it, you don't have to live this way. That said, I think the main problem here is that your landlord is harassing you into moving and that feeld 1000% rotten and will eat away at your wellbeing like no other stress can. Get away from this man. Good luck!
posted by jbenben at 6:57 AM on January 12 [31 favorites]


What kind of formal notice did he give you? Has he actually started an eviction process?

What does your lease say exactly about apartment cleanliness? Is it related to when you turn over keys or that you must keep it clean while occupied?

In your updates here, you’re not responding to the cleaning suggestions but focusing on moving. Wherever you go, you’ll have this issue with cleanliness until you address it. The suggestion to hire a cleaning person is your solution to this, whether you stay or go.
posted by vivzan at 7:01 AM on January 12


- People who buy and sell apartment buildings don't care what the units look like. THEY DO CARE IF A BUILDING IS VACANT OR NOT. Is it possible the landlord is trying to make the property vacant?

I bought a multi-unit property last year, and I'm not sure this is strictly true. I wouldn't care if the apartments weren't tidy, but I would be concerned if the cleaning were compromised to such an extent that it seemed to invite bugs, rodents, etc. When I was looking at rental properties for sale, I saw a few that seemed to be in this condition, and I passed on them. As I said, it would take a lot, though, and it wasn't about aesthetics.

Also, and I hate to say this, but are you paying market rate? At least in my area, it is not necessarily considered an asset to have the building occupied with tenants when you buy it. If it's a hot rental market and if the apartment is renting at below market rate with long-term tenants, especially if the lease has a long time to go until it finishes, it's possible that it would be significantly more advantageous for him to sell it vacant, so that the new landlord can do any aesthetic improvements quickly and rent it at the top of what the market will bear. Thus I'm suggesting that there's an off-chance that he's using the cleaning issue to get you out so that he can advertise the property vacant.
posted by ClaireBear at 7:07 AM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Thanks again everyone - I am cleaning now and have some friends coming to help, and have hires a service to come do a deeper clean next week.

I have been wanting to move to a smaller apartment because I don't really need to be in a 2BR and it's obviously too hard for me to keep clean, in addition to the shoddy state of the building. If this is the thing that galvanizes me out of a living situation that is not optimal for me that wouldn't be the worst thing. But cleaning first.
posted by thereemix at 7:12 AM on January 12 [17 favorites]


I have literally never needed or used a reference from a landlord to rent a new place. I haven't even really heard of such a thing?

But I think you should move, because your landlord sucks, and being in a new space might help you to stop falling into old patterns (this has helped me in the past, someone who has also gotten in trouble with rental offices for a place being too messy).
posted by a fiendish thingy at 7:12 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


I had a 2 family home and sold it, so it's somewhat familiar territory. You must keep your apartment clean enough to be safe. No fire hazards like piles of paper, clear access to doors and windows in case of fire, no food lying about to attract pests. Your landlord wants you to keep your apartment especially tidy for showing it to potential buyers. Are you getting any rent discount for this? When you rent a place, you may not have to provide access to prospective buyers; it's quite a violation of your privacy to have people in your home, and in many locations, your landlord would have to provide 24 hours notice except in an emergency like leaking pipes.

I used to call previous landlords. I asked about payment history and noise, not about housekeeping. I suspect you are actually a good tenant.

You are really hard on yourself. Yeah, that's what depression does to us. You might find UFYH helpful. Wishing you the best.
posted by theora55 at 7:20 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Can you say why you haven't hired a regular cleaning service in the past, when you've recognized this as an ongoing problem for some time? Knowing more about what you find to be barriers to that might help us get you past them, and it seems like it could make a significant difference to your life.
posted by metasarah at 7:44 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


I feel like the relationship with the landlord has probably been ruined by this.

This is a business relationship for the landlord and you should treat it the same way. You aren't helping yourself by worrying about your landlord's personal opinion of you, you're just giving them power over you that you don't need to give them.

I have had many conflicts with landlords over the years over various maintenance issues, unauthorized entry, etc., some quite heated. But I have always paid my rent and when I've given those same landlords as references I've had no problems renting other apartments. I don't know what those landlords said about it, but it wasn't enough to stop people renting to me. I think most prospective landlords will care that you paid your rent and didn't get evicted, and will take your landlord's judgements about your housekeeping habits with a large grain of salt. You can provide bank statements if you're worried your income won't look sufficient.

I also agree with others' suspicion that your landlord may be trying to harass you to leave so that it's easier for them to sell the building. If the location info in your profile is correct, I recently lived a few miles from you and there is a ton of investor interest in rental housing in that area, as well as interest from wealthy people looking to turn multi-family buildings into single-family houses. Both kinds of buyers will likely prefer buildings which can be "delivered vacant."

If you want to move, I would see if you can negotiate some kind of buy-out from the landlord. If you don't, I would not hesitate to try to stay put.
posted by enn at 7:50 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


I think it will really depend on the landlord situation. I am moving into a new place in a few weeks and am renting from a private individual owner. She is much more particular about who she rents from to the point where she personally spent an hour interviewing me in her living room after I filled out an application and paid the application fee. She briefly showed me that she uses some sort of online program that did some kind of investigation into my background and showed that I had a 98% approval rating as a potential renter. Then that wasn't enough - she asked for my previous landlord's contact info (it was a property management company) and spoke to them at length about me as well after the interview. It was only after that final step that she chose me over the other handful of people who had submitted an application and came for a personal interview.

In my previous rental which was run for a property management company, all I did was fill out an application form, gave them $ for the application fee and I got the apartment because I was the first one who showed up and could pay the security deposit and first month's rent - in other words, first come, first served.
posted by HeyAllie at 8:14 AM on January 12


Hey, your profile says you live in NYC, so a lot of this advice doesn't apply. It's VERY likely your landlord wants an empty building to sell, this is a big deal here. But you have a lot of legal protection in the city. Unless you want to move, I'd do a good clean either yourself or on hire, and at the same time get a tenant's rights lawyer ( I can give you the name of a good one if you want). I'm willing to bet a single strongly-worded letter from such a lawyer will stop this whole thing. Your landlord is betting on you not knowing your rights.
posted by overhauser at 8:15 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Former small-building landlord here. Any landlord who actually does check prior-landlord references knows that the current landlord's report is automatically suspect - landlords will and do lie to get rid of a bad tenant. A landlord reference is next-to-worthless. A reference-checking landlord will put much more stock in the employer reference and personal reference. But really, the best things to speak for you are clean credit and proof of income (or assets).
posted by Ardea alba at 8:22 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


It's actually quite hard to evict a tenant over a disorderly apartment in NYC. Are you in a rent-stabilized apartment? If so, the landlord may be looking to evict you so he can plump up the rent roll a little (the price is usually based on a multiple of the rent roll).
posted by praemunire at 8:22 AM on January 12


Oh, and you will show the inheritance by showing documentation of your assets--bank and brokerage accounts. It may be a little harder for you to find a place if your income doesn't meet the 40x rule and you have to persuade someone to make an exception based on significant assets. You might have to prepay a few months. But, assuming we are talking about some real money, it shouldn't be impossible.
posted by praemunire at 8:25 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


The asker's profile indicates they are not in NYC.
posted by enn at 8:30 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I am one hour north of NYC, in a very hip town filled with people who have been priced out of Brooklyn. Property values here are inflated. My landlord is a notorious asshole, known to most of the town as such. He has been trying to sell this building for 18 months and had it listed at 3.6 million dollars, which is ludicrous even for this trendy NYC Metro town.
posted by thereemix at 9:10 AM on January 12


to answer metasarah's question re: not hiring a regular cleaner: lack of money.
posted by thereemix at 9:12 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Datapoint: I'm in a competitive rental market and so far not one landlord has ever called my references. I've been asked for them and given them - but they've never actually verified, I assume since nothing else on my application threw up red flags. While that's not a guarantee of anything, it's far from impossible to rent without a reference.
posted by mosst at 9:40 AM on January 12


I would guess that even a straight-up 14-dead-cats hoarder apartment would affect the price of a $3.6 million apartment building by like 1%. If that. Your landlord is being a drama queen.

There are plenty of places that don't ask for (or really check) references, especially outside the city itself.
posted by praemunire at 9:41 AM on January 12


I get into this cycle. I wasn't able to break out of it until I hired a cleaning service. I can't afford a weekly cleaner, so I have them come every two weeks. I could probably cut back to monthly, if money gets tighter in the future, now that my place is clean again.

Could you recruit a friend to help you keep the clutter down in between cleanings? Or even if they came to your place once a week just to keep you company and motivated while you do what needs to be done. It doesn't need to be the same friend every time.

Or if a hired cleaner is impossible, maybe a friend would be willing to help you clean once a week in exchange for you making them dinner. Having a scheduled time and friend support might make this easier.
posted by rakaidan at 10:29 AM on January 12


Thank you again for your advice everyone.

Not to keep prolonging the thread, but my landlord, in his email to me about the cleanliness, basically insinuated that it would cost him many thousands of dollars to deal with "damage" that I had caused. I see no evidence of damage - my kitchen sink was filled with dirty dishes, my bathroom sink had a few marks from a makeup spill (which I just wiped up), and my bathtub has a few grout stains that have been there since before I moved in. Aside from that, I'm really only guilty of a cluttered coffee table and unfolded laundry on my bed. I am not sure what he is getting at by insinuating that there has been damage, unless he just wants to keep the security deposit whenever I do move out?

He is generally an unresponsive landlord and I've often had to go days before having significant issues with the place addressed (roof leaking into my bedroom, radiator not working, etc). Prospective buyers have been brought to my apartment with less than 20 minutes notice at least 30 times. Not to say that I am therefore justified to live in filth - but perhaps to say that I was not happy about my living situation for a while and I should have done something about it months ago.

I am cleaning with some friends now but I also have made an appointment to look at a smaller apartment and started filling out a rental application, which asks for the name/phone number of my current landlord. :/ Worried about that

I feel like once I get past this cleaning hump I will tell my landlord that it would be best for me to move out.
posted by thereemix at 10:42 AM on January 12


All the applications I've ever filled out have asked for previous landlord information and no one has ever called my previous landlords.
posted by AFABulous at 11:49 AM on January 12


As a counter-example, I have literally just gotten an email from the prospective next landlord of one of my current tenants, asking me to elaborate on my experience with him as a tenant. This runs contrary to others' experience upthread, so it's clearly a YMMV situation. If you're trying to move in a hurry and if think you might get a negative landlord reference, OP, it would presumably be in your best interest to apply to a few different apartments in the hope that one/some won't contact your current landlord.
posted by ClaireBear at 12:29 PM on January 12


I am cleaning with some friends now but I also have made an appointment to look at a smaller apartment and started filling out a rental application, which asks for the name/phone number of my current landlord. :/ Worried about that

I rent in the similarly-trendy market that is Washington, DC and this is an extremely standard application question, but no one will actually call this number. They mostly just want to know that you have a rental history. Best of luck with the apartment hunt!
posted by capricorn at 12:35 PM on January 12


I lease in a tight market, (california, so housing crisis) and do call/fax/email landlords and rental companies when I'm verifying rental history on applications. But even if I get a negative response, that doesn't disqualify a prospective. We have a sort of strikes/bumper system; rough/nonexistent rental history is one, and just affects the amount of the deposit.

I hope he did some sort of walkthrough when you moved in, to note things like the grout stains. It sounds like, without a paper trail/proof, he may try to charge you for that in your dispo when you do move.
posted by Warmdarksky at 4:14 PM on January 12


I smell a rat here. I don’t think your apartment is messy enough to attract rats, other than the one you’re renting it from.
posted by Anne Neville at 4:35 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


l feel like once I get past this cleaning hump I will tell my landlord that it would be best for me to move out.

Please only do this once you have a new place secured, or you know you can be moved out of this apartment on the last day of your notice period, and then tell him with your official termination notice.

I understand this is an upsetting situation, but your description is not clear. Even if the notice of violating your lease was legitimately served to you, it is grounds for eviciton, not the actual eviction.

So it doesn't sound as if your landlord has evicted you? It will be on you to terminate the contract, you want to do it by the book.

This often means paying double rent for a period, not getting the deposit back in a timely fashion, or going to small claims court ... it sucks but think of how much better it will be once you are clear of this person's blamey drama. Please take special care to establish proof of the condition of the apartment when you do move out. Understanding the law on your side will increase your chance of recouping what you are owed.

In the meantime, don't tip your hand.
posted by Rube R. Nekker at 6:02 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


The landlord hasn't evicted me and my place is looking pretty good now (thanks local cleaning-helping friends who did not judge or shame me as I feared they would!). I also know that if he wanted to evict me it's not like I'd be on the street tomorrow.

That said, throughout the course of today as I've been going in and out to bring things to the dumpster, I noticed that 1) suddenly there is a new laminate floor in the foyer (the floor previously was pretty dingy and had some uneven spots) and 2) the apartment I mentioned upthread that didn't have a floor?
Someone has been in there working on it all day.

Interesting.

I have some theories about the timing of his "you are a problem tenant who devalues my property with her clutter" email (and the very dramatic language contained therein now. I also have an appointment to look at another smaller apartment tomorrow. Fingers crossed, but in the meantime should he come look into my apartment it looks way less cluttered than before. (And clean dishes!)

Thank you again to everyone for their kind words, advice, and encouragement during a situation that was basically tailor-made to activate my depression-dependent feelings of shame. One of my friends who helped me today kindly gave me a reference to a local cleaning company. No matter what happens, if I stay in this apartment or if I leave, I will start scheduling a regular cleaning service, even if I can only afford to do so once a month.

I am also optimistic that moving will jolt me out of my bad habits. This apartment has always been a bit too much for me to handle, and it also carries a lot of painful memories (two years ago I was severely depressed and suicidal and didn't leave the apartment for nearly a month). I think I've just been stuck, in a lot of ways. This might be a good opportunity to start anew.

Sometimes it takes a really extreme situation to galvanize ones self to take steps to improve their lives. I think this was one for me. Thank you all again for your support and kindness. This is why this community is so awesome.
posted by thereemix at 7:09 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


With regard to your anxiety and fear ("freaking out"), the book "SOS Help for Emotions" by Lynn Clark was of great value to me with my self talk and dealing with life's pressures. It is not at all "dry" and is very down to earth in my opinion. I realize this is only a portion of the question, but I think one way or the other you will be going through some kind of changes, so acquiring new coping skills will be of benefit. FWIW, ignore this advice if you don't think it is relevant.
posted by forthright at 7:17 PM on January 12


but in the meantime should he come look into my apartment it looks way less cluttered than before.

Okay, the other responses have made it clear that your landlord's a lemon, but you should know more about your rights as a tenant in NY:

"Right to Privacy

"Tenants have the right to privacy within their apartments. A landlord,
however, may enter a tenant’s apartment with reasonable prior notice,
and at a reasonable time, with the tenant’s consent, either to provide
routine or agreed upon repairs or services, or in accordance with the
lease. If the tenant unreasonably withholds consent, the landlord may
seek a court order to permit entry. In an emergency, such as a fire or
water leak, the landlord may enter the apartment without the tenant’s
consent or prior notice.
"

Entering your apartment while you're out to do a white-glove check is not an emergency.
posted by Iris Gambol at 8:00 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Hello! Here's my comment on another thread talking about how I learned to keep my house clean. I have been where you are! Hope it's helpful.
posted by 8603 at 10:51 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


Last update: moving to a new apartment imminently is a very likely possibility at this point, a prospective landlord in a new building is reviewing my application as we speak.

For anyone still reading: if this new place comes through, what verbiage should I use with my current landlord to give him notice? (In case my ask history doesn't convey this enough, let it be known that I really like being prepared with scripts for awkward situations.) I'm on a month-to-month currently and need to give him 30 days notice. New potential landlord would be cool with me moving in Feb 15.
posted by thereemix at 11:29 AM on January 13


I, thereemix intend to move out of [address] on x date.
posted by brujita at 12:54 PM on January 13


If you pay rent on the first, the landlord may not accept the mid-month notice/moveout date. This article suggests checking your lease.

Not to say that you should alter your timeline, but be prepared for 1. giving notice again on Feb. 1, and 2. being liable for the full last month's rent (whether due on the first or already held in your deposit).

I agree with brujita's script. May it be that he doesn't act the jerkface and accepts your mid-month departure for minimum friction on both sides.

Good luck!
posted by Rube R. Nekker at 1:52 PM on January 13


Thanks brujita and Rube!

At this point if there is no other way I would be fine with paying the full month's rent if it means being out of this building and away from this jackass landlord.

But of course I will not volunteer this info when I give notice.

I hope that he will be happy to be rid of me just as I am happy to be rid of him. After all, once me and my clutter is gone, some enterprising rich Manhattanite will obviously swoop in and pay $3.6 million for a badly maintained building in a non-central location in a town north of Westchester County that no one has heard of, because I was clearly the only obstacle for the last 18 months. /sarcasm
posted by thereemix at 2:10 PM on January 13


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