How do you budget?
August 3, 2017 11:16 AM   Subscribe

We are a married couple, with 2 kids. Husband makes 6 figures, I stay at home with the littles, and we live in an expensive suburb of NYC. We have always just kept an eye on expenses as they happen, but now, 3 years into being a one-income family, we are feeling broke. We want to start using a REAL budget for the first time, to reduce our debt and build our savings. Can you recommend one? More snowflakey info after the jump.

We do not use cash very much, and are unlikely to use one of those cash-in-an-envelope type systems.
We have three bank accounts: Shared Checking (we both use our debit cards associated with this account as our primary way of paying for life), shared savings account (linked to the checking account, it rarely has much cash in it) and an online savings account with our "real" savings in it.
We also have 401(k) accounts that we don't touch other than automatic contributions into them.
We have four credit cards:

1. Discover "More" card that we use for online purchases plus "we need to procure this thing, but theres a week until a paycheck and we are down to $19 in our "debit card" checking account. This card has a significant balance (13.49% interest)
2. Bank of America Card that husband uses for reimbursable work expenses, gets paid off every month (14.99% interest) **We definitely want to continue keeping his work expenses on a completely separate card ***
3. Chase Slate Card with no balance that we do not use any longer (22% interest)
4. Discover "It" card with no balance that we do not use any longer (23.24% interest)

We both have iphones, and are comfortable using apps to help us.
We have monthly payments for student loans, mortgage, car payments and quite a bit of revolving consumer debt.
We have an account with mint, but I haven't figured out how to actually use it on a day-to-day or week-to-week basis in order to help me/us stay on budget. I use it to look back and see where we have spent, but it doesnt seem like a system that he and I can intuitively use to sort of hold our hands in creating achievable budgets, and sticking to them. I would love to figure out how to use it like that, though.

We would like to:
- Identify & Reduce unnecessary spending
- Make sure we are using credit cards that aren't screwing us over
- Pay down consumer debt & avoid adding to it
- Not pay an annual/ monthly fee to subscribe to a budgeting software or app (one time purchase is ok, but we are unlikely to spend more than $20, so "You Need A Budget and the like are going to be a hard sell)

So... what system worked for you, ESPECIALLY if you have decent income, hang-ups about "maintaining your lifestyle" and have never used a budgeting system before.

Thanks, smart people!
posted by waterisfinite to Work & Money (27 answers total) 20 users marked this as a favorite
Honestly, the best way to do your first thing (identify and reduce unnecessary spending) is to pick some period of time - a month would be ideal - and then using a simple pen and paper to write down everything you spend over the course of that month. And I do mean everything - your mortgage payments and water bills, groceries, starbucks' runs, 50 cents for gum, everything. Do nothing but capture that information for that month. And then, at the END of that month, sort all those expenses into categories like utilities, housing, food, etc. and add each category up.

This will help you get a better perspective of how much you're currently spending in each category, which is half the battle. A lot of people jump into making a budget by arbitrarily deciding how much they SHOULD spend in each category, without taking a look at what they ARE spending. and if you set your food budget way lower than you already are spending, it'll be too big a jump down, and it'll be harder to stick to it.

Also, you may see some categories jump at you as being somewhere you could obviously cut back (one time I did this and discovered I was spending $200 a month just on books, and that was really easy for me to say "yeah, that I can cut back on").

But yeah, spend a month tracking what you are spending first. You'll have a much better picture of what you can do from there.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:27 AM on August 3, 2017 [8 favorites]

The free trial for YNAB is 34 days. That's plenty of time to try out the software, log all of your transactions for a month or so, and get an idea as to whether it would work for you. I loved YNAB4, still trying to adjust to the new online software because the logic is different. I have decent income, wanted to maintain my current lifestyle, and had never had a budget before I started using YNAB about 3 years ago. Now I've navigated two moves, refinanced my car, and paid down a bunch of debt, all with feeling CONFIDENT about the way I'm spending my money. That's the best thing about a budget to me. I know where all my money went and is going, so there are no surprises. There really is that $500 set aside for a car repair, and even if I have another emergency this hypothetical month, I know I don't have to dip into that money until I actually need it. I feel like I make more money now than I did then, way out of proportion to my actual income change over that period.
posted by possibilityleft at 11:36 AM on August 3, 2017 [7 favorites]

So, when you look at mint and see how much you spent on what, does it look like it makes sense? Do you have a sense of where your money is going? Is it even going to things that you can realistically cut back on in the short term? If like 75% of your income is going to mortgage payments and car payments and property tax, drinking less Starbucks isn't going to make a big difference.

As a first step, I would figure out a zero-line budget based on what you absolutely can't get out of spending right now, and only then think about what you can do with the rest.
posted by mskyle at 11:55 AM on August 3, 2017

I use and love YNAB, and have used it since it was a weird little spreadsheet. It's now a web app (with iPhone/Android apps for inputting expenses) which is more than worth what I pay for it (it works out to a couple of quid a month). It's gotten myself and my wife out of a ton of debt, through five years with a single income and into our nominally stable financial situation now. I can't recommend it enough. If you work with the steps and the system they recommend and go through some of their online classes, I think it does a great job of overcoming a lot of the mental blocks and emotional baggage tied up in money and how we think about it.
posted by Happy Dave at 11:58 AM on August 3, 2017

My wife took over the budgetting about two years ago due to my untimely handling of bills.

Initially I worked with a very simple spread sheet where I took total income (that was two of us, but also some government money because we have kids and live in Canada), and I subtracted all known expenses from, and budget'ed best attempts of tracking groceries, and creating sub-budget items such as for birthdays, family entertainment, date nights, and personal allowance (my wife and I each have cash and a credit card which are fully ours to do with as we want).

After about 6 months of ms. nobeagle hating the spreadsheet (even after she added some pages to get more detail and actually track everything), she set this up in YNAB. It essentailly is the same thing, except much better (E.G. you can find the actual average of all electrical payments, so I can see that $300 was actually too much to budget and indstead was can do $250 safely), it is easier for tracking sub-saving accounts (so saving for a new pool liner can be it's own thing instead of needing a giant "household mid-term savings" line item).

Yeah, I'm not super into paying a yearly expense for this, but it works, she likes it and we're not paying stupid late fees because I'm a week late on the gas bill. Definitely give a look at YNAB.

Note, apparently searching google for "spreadsheet like ynab" turnss up some results.

But essentially, you must track and know and categorize all of your spending. If you've exhausted eating out for the month, you either need to allocate from another item, or you don't eat out. Simple. Laying it all out in front of you makes it easier to say eating out will only be X per month. If both of you are on board, it makes it easier to not suggest grabbing convenience food because you know how it will impact the budget for the rest of the month.
posted by nobeagle at 12:02 PM on August 3, 2017

YNAB is the answer we use, but I don't pretend it's easy to understand. The way we use it (and what I think is key) is that the second money comes in, someone logs in to YNAB and budgets all of that money (gives it a job) in the different spending categories we set up. And every single day, without fail, we log in and enter the transactions that happened since the last time we logged in. That includes manually entering things that haven't been processed by the bank yet (so they do not automatically import) and checking every single manually-entered thing from earlier days that was automatched to an imported transaction (because YNAB isn't always great at that), then reconciling the account.

EVERY DAY. A budget needs that level of scrutiny. For me, the reason why YNAB works and why a budget is important isn't the trends. That stuff is eventually relevant, but the key to reigning in spending is to carefully and consciously examine every single transaction and determine its category and whether that transaction was really necessary.

It changes things when I go to the store and look on the YNAB app and see I have $87.14 in my grocery budget right now. That's ALL I can spend without consequence. If I want more, I have to take that money out of something else (the way YNAB forces this is why you want to pay for it instead of a free spreadsheet), and that forces the hard choices that I SHOULD have to make.

Plus, do it together, don't make one person responsible for this. It makes it easy for the other person to just wash their hands of the responsibility, which is not ideal for either party.
posted by Pacrand at 12:06 PM on August 3, 2017 [2 favorites]

When my husband got laid off and we were figuring out how to live on one income for a while, we started by making a google sheet with categories for all our expenses (mortgage, cash for spending out and about, groceries, regular bills, etc). Then, we sat down with our last three months of bank and credit card statements and figured out how much we actually spent in each one and noted that on the spreadsheet. Then we went through and thought about annual/irregular expenses (vet visits for the dog, holiday tipping), figured out our annual average for those and budgeted them out monthly on the same sheet.

That process probably took a whole afternoon, but it was worthwhile - we found about $150/month that we could save completely painlessly because we were wasting it on stuff we weren't even enjoying (unused subscriptions, etc).

You'll notice that all this was just tracking what is, not what should be. Then, we went through and talked about which categories seemed high and where we had ideas for lowering them. We went through and set goals for each category so that the total added up to my take home pay + his unemployment benefits (luckily our housing was affordable enough to make this possible). We included money in the budget for going out with friends, buying clothes, etc. There wasn't so much extra money that we could both do all those things all in one month, but we did make sure that we each could have some fun/lifestyle money to help stick to the budget long-term.

Then, we tracked every dollar we spent each month on that google spreadsheet (it's set up as follows: Col A, category, Col B, budget goal, Col C, my spending, Col D, husband's spending, Col E, total spending, Col F, difference between budgeted and actual). Our rule for going over the limit in one category is that you have to take it from another. That worked for us because our budget was based on our real spending, so we just had to be careful, not fanatical, about not spending too much. It worked well for us, and we're still using it, even though my husband is back at work.

Some big picture things to think about: would it make sense for you to move to a less expensive home/neighborhood? Have you shopped around for home/car insurance lately to see if you can get a better price? If you own your house, are there any state/local energy efficiency programs you can take advantage of to lower your utility costs? Can you move your credit card balance to a lower-interest card (without getting burned by a rate hike on the 0% interest balance transfers)?
posted by snaw at 12:23 PM on August 3, 2017

You're going to get a lot of people trying to sell YNAB, and there's a reason for that -- it really is that good. You don't have anything to lose by watching some of their online tutorials, trying the free trial, taking it for a spin. I had never budgeted before and was in SO MUCH DEBT when I decided something had to change, and let me just tell you, YNAB is a TOTAL GAME CHANGER. It has saved my butt so many times, I can't even begin to tell you. I now have zero debt aside from my small mortgage and healthy emergency funds. It's SO nice knowing exactly how much money you have for every little thing, and it's great at discouraging spending, because instead of seeing your bank balance and thinking that's what you have to spend, you see tiny little bits of discretionary spending money because everything else has jobs already. It's also really easy to use in the moment because you can just open the app and see exactly what you can spend -- and then when you spend, you can easily enter the transaction so your budget is real-time. I can't tell you how many new users on the Facebook page say that YNAB saved them the cost of the subscription many times over just in the first month. Seriously, try it.
posted by rabbitrabbit at 12:26 PM on August 3, 2017 [3 favorites]

The money management thing that has had the most impact on our financial well-being is done with a spreadsheet. I looked at the previous 12 months of spending on things where the amounts change month-to-month (some utilities, daycare, car maintenance, home maintenance, etc...), subtotalled those amounts and divided by 12. So, let's say I spend on average $1200/year on car repairs/oil changes/general vehicular stuff. That's $100 a month but obviously I don't spend it like that. But every month, I put $100 into savings and mark on my spreadsheet that I have done so. Same with electric (high in the summer, low in the winter), natural gas (the reverse), child care, etc etc etc etc. When the bill for the month is less than the monthly average, I put the difference in savings. When I get a bill for one of those things that is over my monthly average, I pull out the remainder from savings (mark on spreadsheet). So the monthly outflow is basically always the same. The destination of the money changes--sometimes to savings, sometimes to the actual payee, but it turns our finances into a predictable system.

That's kind of the foundation upon which a budget that deals with more discretionary spending can rest, because there's no fudging about how "really this month it's okay that we overspent xyz because next month the electric bill will be less." The electric bill is always the same. The childcare bill is always the same.

(I know you said you are fairly well-off and I stand by this system also working in that context but it also works awesome when you are less well-off and are in a constant state of panic about unanticipated car troubles or a weirdly high water bill etc... We're doing better now, but in our making-it-but-in-a-paycheck-to-paycheck-way years it saved our bacon so. many. times.)
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:52 PM on August 3, 2017 [1 favorite]

I know you ruled out YNAB based on the price being $40 higher than you want to pay, but what you're asking for is one of the below options:
a) a lot of leg work that, no offense, hasn't come naturally to you so far (likely would need to create a custom spreadsheet designed for your needs, update it daily, and then establish daily communication about your budget with your husband), or
b) is YNAB and costs approximately $40 more/year than what you'd like to pay.

YNAB is designed to help couples like you. My husband does not pay attention to the details, but I update YNAB daily and it makes all the difference in our ability to save toward mid-term and major expenses.

I strongly recommend you consider the free trial. Even if you only use the free trial period to set up your initial budget, and then create your own spreadsheet based on YNAB, you will be better off than you are now.
posted by samthemander at 12:57 PM on August 3, 2017 [3 favorites]

My wife and I who were in a similar situation 2 years in. (6 figures, credit card debt from wedding and honeymoon and housing expenses). We totally failed at budgeting.

Here is how it was resolved: We put away the credit cards. We didn't use them for gas, to get points, for emergencies, to buy things online, for anything. Your credit card balance is why you think you don't have money, let me assure you. This is your absolute top priority.

I automatically deducted enough money every month to pay off our cards in 12 months and put it directly toward credit cards. I also automatically deducted all other bills.

If we didn't have cash for something, we didn't buy it.

It's pretty easy to budget that way. You just spend your money until you don't have any more cash, and then you stop buying stuff. You'll learn pretty quick to set aside grocery and gas money the first time you're eating ramen for dinner. You guys aren't broke, you're just behind because you charged so much in the past.

Once you cards are paid off, you can start charging again (for convenience or emergencies), but if you ever end up with a balance at the end of the month, you have to play the same game -- credit cards away until you have a zero balance.

You'd be amazed at how much money you discover that you have when you aren't still paying for stuff you bought last year.
posted by empath at 1:23 PM on August 3, 2017 [4 favorites]

I feel like I should be a little bit more clear.

How you spend your money isn't nearly as important as how much money you spend

It's really easy to get lost in the weeds of figuring out how much you spend on groceries and restaurants and for netflix, etc. But all of that won't help if you're spending more every month than you're taking in. Figure out how much you need to pay off your debt, and put that money out of reach.
posted by empath at 1:33 PM on August 3, 2017 [3 favorites]

@empath, the only critique I'd offer is that you cannot tell a child that they're not going to eat or not going to have shoes or not going to go on a field trip because you overspent. Well, I suppose you could, but that is something most people would rather go into debt than do. That's why fluid budgeting has to happen and goals cannot be set in stone. YNAB is great for showing you how the compromises you will have to make will affect your goals, which is what you need to be able to deal with the unpredictability of kids and finances.
posted by Pacrand at 1:58 PM on August 3, 2017

Do you have all of your accounts linked through Mint? If not, do that first, and import all of the data you can. Then you should have a number of tools that should help you get started on this. It's a pretty powerful compilation of data.

First go through the transactions and make sure that everything is accurately categorized. Setup rules if you need to re-categorize particular payees or types of transactions. For example, if everything on the Bank of America card is for Husband's business expenses that are separate from your household cash flow, you may want to either not link that card at all, or tell mint to ignore or re-categorize those transactions.

Now spend some time on the "Trends" tab. Net income over the past 12 months gives you a good idea of how your income matches up with your spending. Spending over time is the next thing to get a sense of, and then spending by category over various time periods. Particularly when you look at spending by category, does anything surprise you? Are you spending way more on, say, alcohol or another non-essential than you might have realized?

Next, set a goal. Seems like the #1 goal would be to gather up enough cash to pay down the "More" card. Plug in the amount and how fast you want to pay it off.

Now spend some time on the budget tab. Fill in the reoccurring expenses that you can't do much about without major lifestyle changes, like mortgage and rent, car insurance, utilities. Spend some time looking at other reoccurring expenses before you plug them in. What does cable cost every month? Can you live without it? Can you get away with a cheaper smartphone plan? Do you use your gym membership? If left unchecked, those reoccurring costs can be killers.

Then look at other things that aren't fixed but are regular expenses. Gas, groceries, eating out, child-related expenses. Start first by plugging in what you've spent, on average, over the past 12 months. Then look at what you can cut without feeling too much pain, and trim the budget accordingly. Things like ditching the morning Starbucks run and packing a lunch can go a long way. But don't go crazy just yet.

After doing all of that, take a look at how much you have left over that you can put towards paying off that credit card bill.

And I would suggest living like this for a few months, and paying very close attention to where you're spending your money and how much you're spending, on a daily or at least a weekly basis. Getting a very good sense of where the money is going goes a long way in informing decisions about where you can make cuts.
posted by craven_morhead at 2:53 PM on August 3, 2017 [1 favorite]

Going against the grain, “All Your Worth: The Ultimate Lifetime Money Plan,” by Amelia Warren Tyagi and Elizabeth Warren (yes, that Elizabeth Warren) has super-simple parameters for managing your money. They divide it into “Must-Haves,” “Wants,” and “Savings,” and give you case examples of when you feel broke because you’re spending too much on “Must-Haves,” or too much on “Wants,” while also coaching you on what to cut so you can get to a 20% savings rate, a 50% must-have rate, and a 30% wants rate.

Everyone above is right that this is just putting your money in different buckets, but for me tracking what I needed to pay versus what I wanted to pay, and deciding what percent I wanted to save, have made a real difference.
posted by tooloudinhere at 3:30 PM on August 3, 2017 [3 favorites]

I like Gail Vaz Oxlade's books and website. She advocates going through 6 months to a year's worth of spending, then make a budget from there. Google her! Personally, I have trouble with any daily tracking app. My bank (RBC in Canada) offers some basic tracking, but mostly we use credit cards for absolutely everything, pay it off each month, and sit and analyze the statement a lot.
posted by Valancy Rachel at 4:11 PM on August 3, 2017 [1 favorite]

When we were having to budget tighter, I found Mint to work really well (though with some frustrations) for solving the connected problems of 'where is the money going' and 'how do we handle the upcoming expenses?'

I never used it for budgeting per se, just the tracking and prediction; for the budgeting I think that YNAB offers stronger features but also requires more investment of time. It's maybe a question of what is really your underlying issue -- money tracking, or financial planning and coordination?
posted by Dip Flash at 5:24 PM on August 3, 2017

Do you know what the disconnect is between reviewing mint and changing your spending behaviors? The fact that that you say we, except when you are reviewing mint, it sounds like it might be about getting equal commitment to greater financial stability. That might be reading too closely between the lines, but my point is that a successful budget is about understanding your weaknesses to minimize their financial impact on your life.

I can't do any disciplined YNAB type budgeting. It gets disordered and self-destructive real fast. It makes me obsessive: throwing money after ineffective savings ideas, blowing any real savings on 'rewards', or finally getting overloaded, shutting down and not log in to pay the bills on time.

Instead I've set it up to automate the things I'm not good at, and only check in regularly at times when I'm less stressed and less likely to make rash decisions. That doesn't mean no stress. But if I'm spinning out, I try to leave it. When I made less money, that meant occasionally hitting zero and having my debit card declined. The acute stress and embarrassment of those moments was more manageable than the constant obsession for me, though as Pacrand notes, that isn't universally true.
posted by politikitty at 6:26 PM on August 3, 2017

YNAB. There is a learning curve (with lots of tutorials and good quality tech support to help). You also have to actually USE it for it to work. But it's great.
posted by latkes at 7:41 PM on August 3, 2017

We started YNAB a few months ago and we have definitely saved more in that time through more reflective spending than the cost of the software. We used an excel spreadsheet and multiple savings accounts for bills before to keep track of things, but YNAB just helps to manage things on a much more granular level.

I think dismissing it out of hand based on the cost might be "Penny wise, pound foolish" and definitely worth reconsidering.
posted by chiquitita at 9:09 PM on August 3, 2017 [1 favorite]

I've never been good at budgeting, as something unexpected would come up and I'd feel like I'd failed. I was also terrible at keeping up with the tracking. But I think I could handle it now, and I actually did one yesterday in about 5 minutes using this website. (It's Australian, but I'm guessing it would work).

However, even without budgeting, I've been saving like crazy since January in order to pay off a loan from my parents. This is how I did it:

- I did a No Spend month in January. I didn't eat out, barely bought anything extra, and cut my socialising significantly (not to nothing, but much lower than it was). I ate up all the weird old food in my kitchen, only bought the minimum in groceries, and stopped eating as much meat. It was weird, but it wasn't that hard.
- I then reviewed my spending for the month. This was really easy, because I hadn't got many transactions. This showed me what my fixed expenses were, and just how much money I had been pissing away on non-necessities.

Since then, now that I know how much I can save (assuming I never buy socks or anything new) my spending has slowed right down. With two people, this might be trickier, but when it's just me, I just have to negotiate with myself, and my default position is now, "Don't need it, don't buy it".

This is how I manage my money now:

As soon as I get paid:

1. I shift any extra money left in my transaction account into savings. I love doing this. It's like winning at life. I know what I want it to be from my no spend month, and actually often hit it (I've reduced some of my expenses since January). I do have a float in my transaction account just in case I don't get paid, but it's a round number, so the maths is easy. In your case, any extra money would go to one of your debts.

2. I pay my bills. In the two or three days after I get paid, I have direct deposits for my rent and a bit to savings. I pay off my credit card. I shift money for any bills that I'll be paying on my credit card that pay period into an attached savings account. I could do this with periodic bills too, but I haven't gotten round to shifting the direct debits yet.

3. I review my spending for the last pay period. I use an excel spreadsheet and pivot tables, but I think that Mint is meant to do this for you. I have a number that I try to keep my total spending below (a bit above my No Spend month), and dance a small dance if I manage it.

I then spend carefully and minimally, watching my transaction account like a hawk.

This would absolutely be more tricky with two people and kids, especially if you're paid monthly (I'm fortnightly). I suggest shifting more line items out into an attached savings account and then transferring them back in increments. For example, you could transfer out a sensible amount of petrol money, and then pay for petrol on your credit card. Transfer a bit more if you know you're planning a roadtrip that month. You could transfer an amount for groceries out, and then bring it back in weekly, or however often you shop. You could get a small cash withdrawal out each to spend on frivolities.

TLDR: try a No Spend month, and then review your spending. It will help you understand where you money is going.

Also, look into Dave Ramsey. He's very religious and dogmatic, but the general idea is good, and the stories that come out of his programmes are inspiring. He's got about 2.5 hours of podcasts available every weekday.
posted by kjs4 at 9:37 PM on August 3, 2017

Going against the grain, “All Your Worth: The Ultimate Lifetime Money Plan,” by Amelia Warren Tyagi and Elizabeth Warren (yes, that Elizabeth Warren) has super-simple parameters for managing your money. They divide it into “Must-Haves,” “Wants,” and “Savings,” and give you case examples of when you feel broke because you’re spending too much on “Must-Haves,” or too much on “Wants,” while also coaching you on what to cut so you can get to a 20% savings rate, a 50% must-have rate, and a 30% wants rate.

I came in here to second this too. I use this exact method: Must Haves, Wants and Savings/ Debt, with a ratio of 50:30:20. It's very simple and practical.

My partner and I share all our expenses. We track our expenses using an app called Toshl. We have one Toshl account, so we both can input our expenses into our phones as they arise. We can also check Toshl on a webpage online. Very useful when inputting a lot of expenses.

Toshl comes default populated with a lot of categories, but we have deleted all our categories and only use two: Must Haves, Wants. It's easy, simple, practical and lets both of us input our expenses whenever -- no need for a computer or internet connection. No need to spend 10 minutes trying to figure out what Category to label a particular expense. You can set up budgets on the app too, but I have never used this because just checking each month how much I spend for Must Haves and Wants is enough for me.
posted by moiraine at 12:57 AM on August 4, 2017 [1 favorite]

OK, YNAB free trial! I signed up last night. It's terribly confusing but I am going to give it a shot.

Thanks, friends.
posted by waterisfinite at 5:20 AM on August 4, 2017 [3 favorites]

@empath, the only critique I'd offer is that you cannot tell a child that they're not going to eat or not going to have shoes or not going to go on a field trip because you overspent.

I expect if they are realistically looking at their bank balance and don't have credit as an option, then they will find ways to not get into that situation.

Their problem isn't that they need to budget. Their problem is that they are using a credit card as a source of additional income and just flushing money down the toilet every month for interest payments.

If they don't stop using the card, no budget is going to help them.
posted by empath at 6:12 AM on August 4, 2017 [1 favorite]

The YNAB online webinars are great for getting started and free.

(There's also a forum, where people are great with advice and helping you figure out what weirdness you just did to your budget, and also someone's probably already asked about many early situations if you find search and read works better for you.)
posted by modernhypatia at 7:08 AM on August 4, 2017

FYI, there's also a very active Facebook group for asking questions and discussing issues.
posted by rabbitrabbit at 12:44 PM on August 4, 2017

Definitely do the YNAB online tutorials!
posted by medusa at 6:34 PM on August 4, 2017

« Older Sorry, the grill has been cleaned and isn't...   |   Y Gwyll in Cymraeg?/Hinterland in Welsh? Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.