3rd grade bully...moving on up...
May 20, 2017 2:30 PM   Subscribe

There was this boy in my child's 3rd grade class this year. He used to be friends with my son, and when they parted ways about 2 months ago, he started bullying my son. Do I go to the school about this now and if so, how do I go about it? More snowflakes inside.

(I'll call the boy 'C') C and my son used to be good friends, both are 9. They were only school friends though, they have never been to each other's house nor have we ever met C's parents. They have been friends all school year until about 2 months ago. It all started when they had an argument on the playground during election season because my son said he was for Hilary and C said he was for Trump. Little arguments about the same would happen here and there but then C started making racial comments to a hispanic kid in their class. My son ended their friendship because he wouldn't stop. Since this has happened, C has started bullying my son. At first, it was just "your momma" jokes and such, then C started threatening to hit my son in the face. He would hold up one hand to represent my son's face and then use his other hand to make a fist and punch him, like this. This past week, he changed up the "fist hitting a face" gesture to "a gun shooting a face" gesture. He did this the last 2 days of school. Since last Tuesday was the last day of school, I figured I'd just let it go. Chances are they probably won't be in the same class next year anyway. Then my son tells me C lives down the street AND rides his bus. Also, the bus, not the playground, is where the "threatening to shoot him in the head" gesture was done to him. He has to ride the bus. Taking him to school and picking him up everyday is not an option for us.
I'm 44. I had my babies later in life so when I was growing up, this wouldn't have even been a question. It would have been laughed out of the office if a parent came in to complain about this. On one hand I feel silly about going to the school over it, but on the other hand, kids bring guns to school now. My son would never hit first, but if the other kid did throw a punch, I'd put my money on my kid. (He has 5 older brothers [total- and lives with 2] and is a "tough" kid.) That part, I'm not worried about. I am, however worried about the gun gesture. Am I being a helicopter parent? If it matters, we live in a small town in the gun totin' buckle of the bible belt and kids have killed other kids at school here. I'm trying to decide how to handle it. I want my son safe...but I don't want to be one of "those moms". What are your thoughts? What would you do? Thanks in advance. :)
posted by Amalie-Suzette to Human Relations (24 answers total) 2 users marked this as a favorite
 
Absolutely give the school a heads up. I mean, you don't have to go in guns blazing, but definitely express your concern and see what suggestions they might have.

You are not being a helicopter parent.

Let me repeat: not being a helicopter parent.
posted by Stewriffic at 2:45 PM on May 20, 2017 [22 favorites]


Not a parent, but I'd absolutely call the school and let them know of your concern. I'd keep it low level for now but not only have a phone call but document it with an email to them (you don't need to mention the email is for documentation, be pleasant in the email and then see what happens).
posted by arnicae at 2:47 PM on May 20, 2017 [1 favorite]


Ugh, your story makes me feel queasy. Sometimes a handful of low-level complaints can help establish a pattern for intervention. As others said, this is a totally valid thing to bring to the school's attention, as much for your son's benefit as, in the best of circumstances, the other kid's.
posted by vunder at 2:51 PM on May 20, 2017 [6 favorites]


Best answer: Teacher here. This definitely warrants a call to the AP or Dean of Students or similar admin. Schools tend to take threats, especially involving guns, *very* seriously.
posted by gnutron at 3:02 PM on May 20, 2017 [13 favorites]


I'd definitely say something. You're not a helicopter parent, because the gun thing crosses a line. It was out of anger and part of an ongoing thing; not a joke or a one-off. Adults know a line was crossed and should make sure that's communicated to this kid.

You'd be "that parent" if you came in making unreasonable demands over every little thing, but it sounds like you only want to express concern, which is warranted.

You might want to be clear in your own mind what you want to come of this conversation. Although I imagine most schools have an established procedure in place to deal with it and you may not get a say, so be prepared for that as well.

It could be nothing or it could be a sign of something very serious; you have no way of knowing, so don't keep it to yourself.
posted by kapers at 3:22 PM on May 20, 2017 [2 favorites]


As someone who got bullied in elementary school, I wish you would do anything you possibly can to fight this battle for your kid.

That said, I'd expect to get results along the lines of "next to nothing," though. I get the feeling it's too damned inconvenient for adults to want to try to separate a bully and victim, somehow. But if you live in a place with tons of guns and kids getting murdered, maybe you might have better odds if you bring that up in conversation. "What happens if little Jimmy brings a gun to school and goes after my kid" might get you results?

Do you have any ability to talk to the bus driver about this? I don't know how much a bus driver can do while driving while the kids are punching each other in the back, mind you, but if the bus is a hot spot for bullying, that might be where I'd start inquiries.
posted by jenfullmoon at 3:26 PM on May 20, 2017


Call the school, and possibly the parents, if this child lives down the street and you may run into him this summer.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:41 PM on May 20, 2017


Former school board member who did student discipline; definitely have a conversation with the school about it. Threats of violence should at least be mentioned: indeed, the concern is if there's a pattern with this child. It may also (in combination with other things teachers see from him) give them a heads up that he's having problems at home and one of the ways he's acting out is through threats, because he doesn't have the power/knowledge/ability to stand up for himself at home or to ask for intervention from an adult.

In my experience, most of the time, it's just a phase some kids go through, where they're experimenting with violent language (that they may hear at home, on TV, in video games, etc.) and with way to "get their own way" and impose their will on the world. Most will figure out after a while that threatening violence doesn't usually get you what you want, but does often get you in trouble and lose you friends, and it fades away as a strategy. Some smaller number of children will continue threatening people as a rhetorical strategy because they don't find other strategies that work better; some VERY much smaller number will begin following through on threats and getting in fights.

I don't think you need to worry too much about actual violence; it's very unlikely to escalate to serious violence (beyond age-appropriate shoving/wrestling sorts of things, I mean). But I do think the school should be aware of this behavior, both to protect your son from bullying, and to ensure that C is on the radar ... either because he may have behavior problems that need intervention, or because he may be a child in distress.

You can just go in like, "I just want to make you aware that this is happening, I'm sure it'll settle down over the summer and I don't need any action on this now, but in case this has been a problem before, or it becomes an ongoing problem, I just want to make you aware."
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 4:15 PM on May 20, 2017 [16 favorites]


Best answer: I consider myself on the "free range" end of the parenting spectrum, but what you describe would make me pretty angry and I wouldn't even hesitate before telling both the school and his parents about it. Say what you will about the mores of the past, this HAS NEVER BEEN and WILL NEVER BE acceptable behavior.
posted by treehorn+bunny at 6:52 PM on May 20, 2017 [11 favorites]


Yeah, I'm of the mind that if your child is being threatened with being shot, you definitely need to talk to the highest person at the school first-thing Monday morning, and then the school needs to come down HARD--like a friggin' cartoon safe--with the child's parents being brought in and told
"There needs to be an apology right now,
and let me make this clear:
NOTHING. LIKE. THIS.
EVER. HAPPENS. AGAIN.
"
posted by blueberry at 7:39 PM on May 20, 2017 [3 favorites]


Institutional inertia and lack of observation leads to accusations of bullying being routinely minimised, dismissed, and denied by school administrations - this is a fact with research backing it up. Given this culture, any efforts you undertake to call out bullying, wherever it happens, is commendable.

The school may well try to fob you off, please escalate until resolution for your son's sake, and for the sake of all the other kids getting bullied at this school and especially on their buses (a ripe target due to lack of supervision and school reluctance to manage).

We routinely accept harrassment and bullying behaviours from children that would be grossly unacceptable - even criminal - in adults. Children should not matter less. The admin would no doubt act very differently if a kid mimed shooting a teacher - as a parent and adult with power I truly believe it's your responsibility to address this gap so your kid - and other kids - get as much respect and protection (ideally more) than an adult in the same situation.

Good on you: Bring it up, push it if they try to ignore, you are doing the right thing. Bullying can wreck people for life.
posted by smoke at 7:43 PM on May 20, 2017 [9 favorites]


I really hate the term helicopter parent, because I'm convinced that for every actual helicopter parent there are 99 parents who aren't involved enough, and I actually believe the term exists largely as something to discourage parents from paying enough attention.
posted by randomkeystrike at 8:02 PM on May 20, 2017 [3 favorites]


It might be helpful to know where you live. Different jurisdictions handle bullying differently.

In our town the school system has a very visible anti-bullying program, and specifically request that they be told when kids are harassing other kids. We would definitely talk to the school if anything like what you're describing happened to one of our kids.
posted by Winnie the Proust at 8:23 PM on May 20, 2017


I would have gone to the teacher when the threats of hitting began. Physical fighting and threats are never acceptable in school (just like in an office) and better that kids should learn acceptable social boundaries at this age than later.

Since the school year has ended you can't go to the teacher anymore but you must go to the administration. This behavior is wholly unacceptable and the administration needs to be aware of it so that if it happens again next year they can take action. ASK THEM what they will do if it happens again. We went through an issue with a kid this year and admin kept saying that they were "working on it" while no one knew what the deliverables were and parents kept getting more and more frustrated while their kids were being victimized (I'm not using that term lightly, it was a serious issue but I won't derail with the details). In the end a dozen kids had brought complaints and nothing happened for nine months. We actually lost enrollment, both during the school year and in families that will finish the school year but will not return next year because no one knew what was going on. So now we've learned that you have to ask at the very beginning what the protocols are and what you can expect.

Our school is fortunate to have a culture and a staff that fosters social and emotional learning so there would be circle talks and other activities to drive home why this is not okay and options that the kids can use to nip it in the bud when it starts at the teasing phase. I would hope that your school has a counselor or someone who can walk C through some talks like this to get him to understand that people have opposing viewpoints but it doesn't mean we devolve into threats or violence.

You are not being a helicopter parent. You are teaching your son how to advocate for himself, and you are teaching him that you will always advocate for him.
posted by vignettist at 8:52 PM on May 20, 2017 [3 favorites]


Since it's in between school years, can they make sure that the boys are separated next year as much as possible? (Different classes, different lunch periods, lockers far away from one another, and/or whatever else applies in fourth grade.)
posted by salvia at 9:04 PM on May 20, 2017 [2 favorites]


You just reminded me of something I have forgotten about for ~23 years. When I was about your son's age, I was getting bullied on the school bus. My father went with me one morning, talked to the bus driver, and then my father *boarded the bus and confronted my bully and told them to quit it.* Oh you better believe they never bullied me again.

Not sure if this would be possible nowadays, and it may only work if you have an intimidating look (my father sure did!) but if you can do this--do it!
posted by shalom at 11:52 PM on May 20, 2017 [4 favorites]


C likely has people in his life, maybe his parents, who are modelling the behaviour he's demonstrating. I wouldn't count on them to spontaneously address this, neither the kids (either of them). The administration *needs* to take active steps here.

Not being American - and this may reflect bias of my own, apologies for that - I can't even guess how school administrators in a small conservative US town might respond to the originating disagreement between the kids. Hopefully they'd act with impartial professionalism. I have had experience of attending a politicized school, though, and in that instance, unfortunately it did seem that broader issues seemed to influence lower-level actions by the admin. Might be a slightly paranoid suggestion but I might not mention the specific content of that dispute unless it were really necessary, just in case your son's/presumably your support of Clinton works against him somehow.

My other thought is that if your kid's like a few other terrorized kids I've known, he might benefit from taking classes​ in martial arts. Not to position him for a street fight, but to help him recover self-esteem and a sense of control.

posted by cotton dress sock at 4:02 AM on May 21, 2017


I'm a teacher and I would absolutely want to know about this situation. If a parent came to me with this concern, I would have several options, including peer mediation, we could try.
posted by usedsongs at 4:44 AM on May 21, 2017 [5 favorites]


I'm a former teacher. I would talk to the school, and ask them what concrete steps will be taken not just to ensure that your son is safe, but that he feels safe. I'd also look up their anti-bullying policy beforehand and make sure whoever you are talking to is familiar with it and willing to enforce it.

And seriously, holy shit, I hope you are being attentive to how your son is perceiving these threats, conveying to him that it is not okay for people to act like this to him, and assuring him that you are going to keep him safe!
posted by alphanerd at 7:42 AM on May 21, 2017 [4 favorites]


Best answer: Another teacher here. Don't put ANY of this in email because emails with student names become part of their record and can be subpoenaed. This means the school will not respond to an email that mentions kids by name.

Instead, call the school and make an appointment to speak with the administration. You're absolutely not overreacting. Kids do bring guns to school. At the very least, this kid needs to be told very clearly that pretend shooting is not okay to do. Just so you know, for confidentiality reasons, the admins will not tell you if this kid has done this before, nor will they tell you any actions they'll take.

The exception to this is all actions they'll take for your son, which should be separate classes, lockers far away, etc.

And don't ever worry about being a helicopter parent. Having been a teacher for a long time, I promise you that in a million years, those parents would NEVER define themselves as such and would most definitely never ask if they're going overboard.
posted by yes I said yes I will Yes at 11:17 AM on May 21, 2017 [2 favorites]


I'm a school administrator. When any threat is made between our students that involves a weapon, there is a whole, long process of assessing the risk (we're required to do it, don't know about other locations) - stuff like how often was this threat made? What was it specifically? Who else heard? Does the child actually have access to a weapon? While threats are often just that, one huge benefit I've seen is that going through this process makes it very clear to both student and parents that this is a BIG DEAL.

I'm not sure how the fact that the school year is over changes things, but the first step, like others have said, is talking to admin about potential next steps that ensure everyone sees that this is an issue that needs to be stopped.
posted by violetish at 10:52 PM on May 21, 2017 [2 favorites]


As a teacher, (though not in the USA) I want to second the above- yes you should go to the school- so many times we get the "why the hell didn't you do something" and we just- didn't know.

Things to not do:
don't get overly emotional.
don't demand unreasonable punishments (no "should be suspended for six weeks", no "expelled" to quote some recent examples) - or specific punishments at all!


Do:
be calm, rational, state the facts.
if the school is large enough, ask if it's possible that C and your son be placed in separate classes next year.
Bring this up again at the beginning of next year- just for reference- teachers forget things over the summer and sometimes don't always reference notes from the end of the year.
But yes, bring it up now, you want this on record, now, when it's fresh.

I'm sorry you're dealing with this.
posted by freethefeet at 2:34 AM on May 22, 2017


Don't put ANY of this in email because emails with student names become part of their record and can be subpoenaed.

Ugh. If they're so concerned about this, though, maybe put the conclusions of the meeting in an email that includes the children's names, so that they follow through on what they said they'd do.
posted by salvia at 7:59 AM on May 23, 2017 [1 favorite]


Response by poster: Confronting his parents is an option I guess...but who knows what kind of people they are and I'm not looking for a fight or an on-going feud with the neighbors. (even though I'd like nothing more than to go grab the little shit by the collar and shake the fuck out of him and tell him I'll hurt him if he ever talks to my son like that again...) I was bullied in school too and no one EVER stood up for me or even listened to me. I know I have to let him fight his own battles, but at least I'm behind the scenes, giving all of the support I can give, this just crosses a line to me. I called the school yesterday and administration will not be back in office until July 31st. They wouldn't let me make an appointment but told me to call back then and I could make one. School doesn't start back until August 7th, so that should give them plenty of time to make sure they are separated. Thank you so much for everyone's helpful advice. Every one of you helped me. 🤗
posted by Amalie-Suzette at 1:17 PM on May 23, 2017


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