What have I done to my neighbors and how can I fix it?
July 4, 2016 7:56 AM   Subscribe

I accidentally created an uncomfortable living space for people I care about. I don't know how to mitigate this like a grown up; I suspect I've been using junior high level tactics.

I live on a lovely little walking court, with 5 units tucked in together. Or, to put it less real estately, my neighbors and I are jammed in tight. We can see and hear into each other's homes in the summer when the windows are open. The custom we have is ignoring open windows (because creepy) and, if someone's door is open, tapping lightly to get eye contact before speaking. There are exceptions. We all go in and out of each other's empty homes for pet care and OHMYGODTHEIRONISSTILLON help requests. If someone has people over, you don't usually knock at their door. Just to give you a quick sketch of the community.

Of course, when we get a bad apple in one of the units, it makes life tough for everyone. I just put a bad apple in our midst. I use her professional services, and she has always been completely lovely to me. I had no hesitation recommending her to the landlord.

But she's moved in loud, and in takeover mode. Lots of people, loud drunken cheer, blaring teevee. For days, she cleaned and set up the inside of her house, while leaving boxes and crates strewn around the outdoor common areas. She took down one neighbor (A)'s hammock to make room for her own stuff, without speaking to A about it. The hammock's big metal frame then fell onto another neighbor (B) and her little dog while they were walking by it. Neighbor B had words with her over it, and our bad apple was pretty defensive and rude. She told me later she was "really high" and didn't recognize who neighbor B was. Our landlord got emails that night from me complaining (and apologizing for the recommendation) and neighbors A & B complaining.

The next day, the four of us had a quick meeting where A & B offered her space in their storage units. (Mine is full.) I thought things were looking up after a rough, stressful start.

Then.

The bad apple has a girlfriend I had not previously met. Apparently they do not live together, but the gf has been around quite a bit. In the afternoon that same day, the gf called through neighbor B's window to her, "Hey pretty lady!" B said hi back, despite being annoyed, and then the gf said "See? It's not so hard to be nice, is it?" For real.

Everyone is assuring me they don't blame me, but also sort of ignoring me if I'm talking to bad apple. I so want her to settle down and in. I realize that is entirely on her. I just can't help but try to make her feel more comfortable and less defensive, to facilitate that. But I DO NOT want to alienate A & B who are dear to me.

My husband thinks I should stop interacting with the bad apple until she makes amends. That is appealing, but unlikely to happen.

Any thoughts on how to fix, patch this or extract myself without hurting anyone?
posted by The Noble Goofy Elk to Human Relations (22 answers total) 3 users marked this as a favorite
 
Wait, have you talked to her about the spoken & unspoken rules of your little community? No excuse for not recognizing you, right? If not, do that immediately. One on one. Not confrontational, as four on one certainly is. Jeez, no wonder she's defensive. She's a bit of a boor, maybe, but how would she know any of this going in?
posted by supercres at 8:03 AM on July 4, 2016 [16 favorites]


This may be your circus, but she is not your monkey.

You cannot fix this new person. You cannot expect this new person to make amends. You can only stop choosing to interact with this person.

That doesn't mean you can't acknowledge a hello as you walk by, but you don't need to go out of your way to try to be friendly to her, or to try to fix her, or to try to get her to understand the way of things in your formerly tranquil home.
posted by jacquilynne at 8:04 AM on July 4, 2016 [8 favorites]


Response by poster: Oh, sorry, supercres , very bad omission. Yes, I have. We spoke about what it was like to live here and the norms for things like windows, etc several times before she decided to rent the place. She was very interested in what the community was like.
posted by The Noble Goofy Elk at 8:17 AM on July 4, 2016 [1 favorite]


My husband and I live in a row house in a major city. There is an unspoken rule to be nice to your neighbors, especially given our close quarters.

With that said, you cannot control your neighbors and their lifestyle. If they are doing all this on their property, that's one thing, but if they are removing hammocks that are on another person's property, that's not ok.

Other than that, you can't just expect her to fall in line with what everyone else is doing. How would you feel if you were the "bad apple" and didn't fit in?

I would be cordial but not go out of your way. She may not think there is "fixing" to do, and that's ok.

Last night our rear neighbors had a giant BRO-PARTY complete with shitty music and beer pong and keg stands for hours while wearing patriotic bro-tank tops which upset our dogs. We just waved hello, offered them our spare recycle bin and took the dogs for a walk outside instead of letting them in the yard. It's a trade off and compromise in close living situations is King, always. I'm sure we will eventually do something that's obnoxious too, and even though our other neighbors are generally similar to us in lifestyle doesn't give any of us the right of being judgy at their choices in their own home and yard. Just be nice.
posted by floweredfish at 8:18 AM on July 4, 2016 [2 favorites]


Other adult's actions are not your responsibility. You had no reason to believe this person would act like this. This person's actions are not your responsibility.

It may be helpful, however, to give her a quick rundown of neighborhood etiquette, in a "I know things may be a bit different here, given how tightly we're all squeezed together, so here's what I wish someone had told me..." way. But that's because it may make life easier for you.

This person is not your responsibility.
posted by lazuli at 8:19 AM on July 4, 2016 [2 favorites]


Good grief. Personally, I would not offer any of my storage space to this person: as you say, she's already taken over the shared courtyard; offering her storage space means losing it ALL to her. Also, from now on I'd make sure all my doors and windows were locked and my curtains closed, because yes, strangers yelling in comments like "pretty lady" is BEYOND creepy.

Other than that, yeah try having a one-on-one talk with her: about how boxes shouldn't be left for day out in the courtyard, about her obnoxious GF, and about noise in general. After that, get the landlord to handle all complaints.
posted by easily confused at 8:24 AM on July 4, 2016 [18 favorites]


> Ok, good. Yes. Because I just kept thinking how incensed I would be if I didn't get a complete rundown of social norms in a new tight-knit community before moving in and then the one person I knew -- the one person who could/should have given me a heads up -- started to ignore me because of it. (I'd probably be in the opposite situation, seeming inappropriately stand-offish.)

Still, I think she deserves at least one more one-on-one before taking punitive action, this time focusing on specifics. Even if you don't feel especially apologetic towards her, start with an apology.* Honestly, it's hard to know what a place is going to be like, and what you're going to be like in a place, before moving in. What do you have to lose?

* Her actions against the community aren't your fault, but her expectations about the community might have been your responsibility. It sounds like you discharged your responsibility fully, but clearly there was some part of the picture that she didn't get.

Moving is hard. Integrating into a new tight-knit community is super hard. Give her another chance.

(Partially I'm saying this because I would probably be on your husband's side, so objectively speaking, I would want someone to give me this advice.)
posted by supercres at 8:39 AM on July 4, 2016 [3 favorites]


I agree with easily confused. Take her out to lunch and try to find out how she thinks things are going. Don't present her with a laundry list of grievances but express concern. If you freeze her out as your husband suggests, you have no hope of improving the situation. You want to keep communication open. If A and B have a problem with your still taking to her-- well, that seems silly of them. She's probably not a good fit and that's probably not going to change fundamentally; all you can do is make a good faith effort.

And then stop feeling bad about your part in it. Anyone could move in and have an obnoxious friend or partner or whatever. If there are specific things you all don't want going on, they should be in written rules. (Interfering with other people's property like she did with the hammock, and leaving a bunch of stuff in common areas, is probably violating a rule on some level, right?)
posted by BibiRose at 8:51 AM on July 4, 2016 [6 favorites]


You did not create this situation. Your new neighbor did this. You made a good-faith recommendation based on what you knew at the time, and even discussed community norms with this neighbor ahead of her moving in. You acted in good faith and did your due diligence, and this neighbor still managed to fuck up.

The fact that your new neighbor is an inconsiderate boor is not your fault—everything you knew at the time indicated otherwise, and there's no way you could have known that she would be like this. Her behavior is 100% on her. It's not up to you to fix it, it's up to her. If she can't or won't fix it, then she's not a good fit for the neighborhood. Treat this as you would any other unpleasant-neighbor situation: by talking to her about the problems her behavior is causing, complaining to the landlord if she doesn't fix her behavior, and treating her with a cool minimum of polite civility when your paths cross.

She's an adult, she's responsible for her own behavior. You don't have to actively shun her, but you also don't need to do her any favors or defend her to the rest of your little neighborhood. If she can't get her act together, feel free to wash your hands of her and treat her like any other unpleasant neighbor. Just because you recommended her doesn't make her your responsibility—she is responsible for herself.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 10:23 AM on July 4, 2016 [12 favorites]


I would probably do my best to ignore her and distance myself from her, and maybe try to be extra-nice to the other neighbors who are having to deal with her shit. She sounds like a giant asshole (moving someone's hammock without asking? Wtf). You can't control her actions, but you CAN preserve your own reputation by not associating with her anymore. You will not gain anything by trying to maintain your friendship with her.
posted by a strong female character at 10:32 AM on July 4, 2016 [2 favorites]


I'd tell her straight up: I wouldn't have recommended you if I'd known you would be so publicly intoxicated you couldn't function and started fights in the street. This is what you need to do to straighten up and fly right or we'll be trying to get you out and don't expect me to help you. I'd also tell her that I'd not be recommending her professional services again, knowing what you do now.

Btw, it sounds like she has a drinking/ drugs problem and so does the gf. Those are not the actions of sober people. Since you knew her professionally you would have only met sober her and therefore could not have predicted this. If you focus on that it might help you mentally reframe this.
posted by fshgrl at 11:37 AM on July 4, 2016 [4 favorites]


I don't think there's an objectively correct course of direct action here, because there's too much that's unknown. Maybe the new neighbor is really mostly fine but just had a bumpy start. Maybe they have some serious problems that will go on causing disruption and discontent. Maybe they will tone it down and things will smooth out. Maybe they won't tone it down that much but might become the fun, quirky neighbor that people mostly enjoy after some time passes. Maybe they will just not fit into the miniculture ever, and will move on, or, worst case, they won't fit in, but won't move, and will be someone everyone sort of needs to route around.

However it works out, I'd say that the losing move for you is to become the go-between. I'd take a neutral position if I were you, and not get drawn into relaying information between neighbors (ie, find yourself responsible for delivering messages of frustration or requests between other neighbors and new neighbor, that sort of thing), and just generally try to stay out of gossip or complaint fests with any of the parties. I think it's not very uncommon for people to be a bit on edge when their comfortable routine is threatened by an unknown quantity, and it's not uncommon for people to be nervous and maybe too aggressive or awkward when entering a new space where everyone else is established. Time often smooths over the initially sharp edges between people of good will, so maybe that will happen here. But you aren't on the hook for singlehandedly making that happen!

You didn't do anything wrong, and it's really not your responsibility in the way that you feel it is. Your intentions were good, new neighbor seemed like someone who would fit the vibe there, and they still may become that. But if not, you aren't to blame. Be pleasant all around, don't ignore your new neighbor, and don't get drawn into intrigues or microwars on either side. If someone says something, express optimism, and turn the discussion to other things. "Oh, New Neighbor may not realize that the flower pot is in the way there, you should mention it, or maybe the landlord can work it out. I'm sure it won't be a big deal. Now, here's that adobo seasoning I told you about; give it a try and tell me what you think!"

If new neighbor turns out to really be beyond the pale, then you may decide to cut off communication and the landlord will probably be kicking them out, but meanwhile hope for the best, see how it goes, and don't fall into the trap of becoming the intermediary, which is how you end up being blamed for whatever goes badly or becoming the scapegoat for people's hurt feelings or frustrations.

Good luck, I hope it all turns out okay in the end!
posted by taz at 12:16 PM on July 4, 2016 [2 favorites]


You've talked to the new neighbor, but has anyone talked to the girlfriend? Or asked the new neighbor if they've talked to the girlfriend about expected etiquette?
posted by CathyG at 1:47 PM on July 4, 2016 [1 favorite]


Response by poster: Thank you all for your helpful advice and framing.

I feel like the problem is quickly resolving itself, in that over the course of last night she got ahold of A's cigarettes from their shared back stoop (after A went to sleep) and smoked them. All. This is definitely heading in a direction that I couldn't control even if I had the desire. It's 3 PM and she's made no mention of it, much less replaced them or apologized.

She's on her own.
posted by The Noble Goofy Elk at 3:10 PM on July 4, 2016 [10 favorites]


over the course of last night she got ahold of A's cigarettes from their shared back stoop (after A went to sleep) and smoked them. All.

Holy cow, what a weirdo. Disengage with great prejudice. I mean, I know you're going to do this, but for anyone else who happens upon this thread: disengage.

Sidenote:

Last night our rear neighbors had a giant BRO-PARTY complete with shitty music and beer pong and keg stands for hours while wearing patriotic bro-tank tops which upset our dogs.
This makes it sound like the patriotic tank tops upset your dogs, which is completely awesome.

posted by chainsofreedom at 3:38 PM on July 4, 2016 [26 favorites]


Response by poster: I read the patriotic bro-tanks as the final straw for the dogs too, and it is awesome!
posted by The Noble Goofy Elk at 4:32 PM on July 4, 2016 [13 favorites]


Yeah, cut her loose. This was never your baby to begin with. Now she's definitely crossed the line. You're doing the only thing you can do in this situation.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 6:47 PM on July 4, 2016


So, can the landlord kick her out for petit theft?
posted by blueberry at 10:08 PM on July 4, 2016 [1 favorite]


I'd like to reiterate my comment about keeping your doors and windows locked: I said it the first time because of the high chances of this boundary-crosser and her GF just walking into other peoples' homes without warning or something obnoxious and annoying like that; I reiterate it because of the possibilities for theft --- excuse me, for "borrowing", as I'm sure she'd term it.
posted by easily confused at 5:04 AM on July 5, 2016 [1 favorite]


As you know, OP, there is no fixing this. Try, try, try not to feel guilty because you had no way of knowing what this person would be like as a neighbor. I once recommended a former colleague to an acquaintance who had a job opening. That guy got hired. Several weeks later the acquaintance called to say the guy I'd recommended had done a bunch of inappropriate, crazy-ass stuff. She asked if I had known the guy was capable of such things. And I was all, Of course not, he was completely responsible and professional when we worked together. And he had been. So I spoke the truth as I knew it. Really, that's all any of us can do. I'm just sorry you have to live near this person awhile longer because she and her gf sound like total drags.
posted by Bella Donna at 2:14 PM on July 5, 2016 [2 favorites]


Yes, new neighbor sounds boorish, but make sure that you're giving her the same benefit of the doubt that you give each other when it comes to the shared spaces.

I hate that I'm about to say this, but if your new neighbor can't leave her boxes outside while moving in and setting up shop, A should also not be leaving stuff outside, like cigarettes. (Smoking them was 100% wrong.) I'm also assuming that since A and new neighbor share a stoop, that they are next-door neighbors. So perhaps the giant hammock was in the way of new neighbor moving in? Or taking up some of the room she had planned for her own stuff?
posted by kimberussell at 5:18 PM on July 5, 2016


Response by poster: So, can the landlord kick her out for petit theft?

If A would tell him, he would take note and keep a closer eye out. I doubt you can break a lease over that, but he might warn her. I really want to stay out of the middle though.

Also, as far as equivalence between leaving a pack of cigarettes on your (half of a) stoop and covering the common areas with boxes and crates...um, seriously? No.
posted by The Noble Goofy Elk at 7:43 PM on July 5, 2016 [1 favorite]


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