How to control nighttime utterances?
December 20, 2005 11:17 PM Subscribe
After a several-month breakup, I'm trying to get back together with my long-term girlfriend. During the break, another girl who I've known for some time became one of my closest friends and we saw each other nearly every day. We ended up kissing once and once she slept over (but nothing else). I have no desire for Other Girl, but somewhat problematically have twice called Long-Term Girlfriend by her name.
Both instances have been when only half-awake in the middle of the night; once, "Other Girl, I'm so attracted to you," and a week later, "Kiss me, Other Girl." Needless to say, this is not only hurting our chances of reconciliation (one of the reasons we are not yet back together is that Long-Term Girlfriend doubts my commitment) but also causes Long-Term girlfriend a great deal of personal insult and pain and has served to ruin two otherwise wonderful evenings.
The situation is frustrating to me in that I have no control over it whatsoever -- it's not that I accidentally misspoke, but that I had no idea what I was saying. I am not seeing Other Girl on any sort of regular basis, and the women in question have not much in common except hair color (their names, especially, are light-years apart). I'm not on medication and hadn't been drinking, though I have been somewhat sleep-deprived of late. I have no secret desire for Other Girl, though she remains a good friend. I am in the habit of addressing friends/lovers by name frequently in conversation.
Is there any way to control these late-night utterances or otherwise banish Other Girl's name from the tip of my tongue? Or any good advice on dealing with the fallout?
Both instances have been when only half-awake in the middle of the night; once, "Other Girl, I'm so attracted to you," and a week later, "Kiss me, Other Girl." Needless to say, this is not only hurting our chances of reconciliation (one of the reasons we are not yet back together is that Long-Term Girlfriend doubts my commitment) but also causes Long-Term girlfriend a great deal of personal insult and pain and has served to ruin two otherwise wonderful evenings.
The situation is frustrating to me in that I have no control over it whatsoever -- it's not that I accidentally misspoke, but that I had no idea what I was saying. I am not seeing Other Girl on any sort of regular basis, and the women in question have not much in common except hair color (their names, especially, are light-years apart). I'm not on medication and hadn't been drinking, though I have been somewhat sleep-deprived of late. I have no secret desire for Other Girl, though she remains a good friend. I am in the habit of addressing friends/lovers by name frequently in conversation.
Is there any way to control these late-night utterances or otherwise banish Other Girl's name from the tip of my tongue? Or any good advice on dealing with the fallout?
I've done that. It's horribly embarrassing, especially knowing 100% that Other Girl is absolutely not on my mind or in my heart. Are their names similar? That's why it happened to me, their names were so similar that my mind tripped me up.
posted by evariste at 12:32 AM on December 21, 2005
posted by evariste at 12:32 AM on December 21, 2005
It's not a matter of being in love with Other Girl, danny the boy, it's just a form of mental stutter. People are complicated. I wouldn't recommend anonymous break up with the girl he loves just because of this. He obviously doesn't want to. He wants to control an involuntary action.
anonymous, just do your best not to do it again, and explain to her that it's a mental stutter and that you absolutely mean nothing by it. Try to be more aware and present. After I did this a couple of times, I sort of "installed a filter" in my mind of hyperawareness to make sure I was saying the right name. After a while it became automatic enough that I didn't need to consciously worry about it. Now it's not an issue at all.
Spending less time with Other Girl might be called-for. If being around her is activating whatever circuit is tripping you up, maybe you need time away from her until you sort this out.
posted by evariste at 12:36 AM on December 21, 2005
anonymous, just do your best not to do it again, and explain to her that it's a mental stutter and that you absolutely mean nothing by it. Try to be more aware and present. After I did this a couple of times, I sort of "installed a filter" in my mind of hyperawareness to make sure I was saying the right name. After a while it became automatic enough that I didn't need to consciously worry about it. Now it's not an issue at all.
Spending less time with Other Girl might be called-for. If being around her is activating whatever circuit is tripping you up, maybe you need time away from her until you sort this out.
posted by evariste at 12:36 AM on December 21, 2005
dude.. you're setting yourself up here to be the guy who cheats on your girlfriend. evariste is right with "meditate". do some long, hard soul searching here and make absolutely, positively sure Other Girl is just a friend. it's easy to fool yourself because you want it both ways - don't. just don't.
you ended up kissing and she slept over? and you're sure you don't like her? get real - these are things that happen with girls you like, not your buddies. there's no kissing with buddies. there's no sexual tension with buddies.
you're a sleep talker who's mumblings reflect your subconscious desires? even if they stay subconscious in that you don't act on them, LTG is going to get jealous if you keep saying her name or spend time with OG, and this will cause fights. before long you'll get in some fight or another with LTG, get drunk and OG will be there, at this moment comforting, understanding and seemingly everything LTG is not, and then, my friend, you are done for.
think about OG. are you self-conscious around her? do you flirt with her? do you try extra to be funny? do you try to impress? do you act around her differently than you do around your male friends? it is really, really easy to deny one's emotions, especially when they make you uncomfortable.
i'm not putting words into your mouth here. you are sending up lots of flags to me - it sounds a LOT like a situation i was in, and i ended up being That Guy because i had unresolved feelings for someone i thought was "just a friend." your willpower is not what you think it is. your self-awareness is not what you think it is. if you care about either of these girls, if you care about doing the right thing, if you feel even a hint of something like attraction to OG, you owe it to both of them and yourself to be absolutely honest about your feelings. there is no other way.
posted by sergeant sandwich at 1:16 AM on December 21, 2005
you ended up kissing and she slept over? and you're sure you don't like her? get real - these are things that happen with girls you like, not your buddies. there's no kissing with buddies. there's no sexual tension with buddies.
you're a sleep talker who's mumblings reflect your subconscious desires? even if they stay subconscious in that you don't act on them, LTG is going to get jealous if you keep saying her name or spend time with OG, and this will cause fights. before long you'll get in some fight or another with LTG, get drunk and OG will be there, at this moment comforting, understanding and seemingly everything LTG is not, and then, my friend, you are done for.
think about OG. are you self-conscious around her? do you flirt with her? do you try extra to be funny? do you try to impress? do you act around her differently than you do around your male friends? it is really, really easy to deny one's emotions, especially when they make you uncomfortable.
i'm not putting words into your mouth here. you are sending up lots of flags to me - it sounds a LOT like a situation i was in, and i ended up being That Guy because i had unresolved feelings for someone i thought was "just a friend." your willpower is not what you think it is. your self-awareness is not what you think it is. if you care about either of these girls, if you care about doing the right thing, if you feel even a hint of something like attraction to OG, you owe it to both of them and yourself to be absolutely honest about your feelings. there is no other way.
posted by sergeant sandwich at 1:16 AM on December 21, 2005
Meditation is a good, ernest and serious answer. However, you're so incredibly screwed it's not even funny.
Option A: Get back together with her, possibly even developing a strong, satisfying and lasting relationship - or not - and spend the rest of your life being badgered to death by a righteously indignant woman who casually dispenses terror and mayhem upon your trembling, quaking person and soul at any wild whim she fancies. As you die early - a harried and hen-pecked shell of a man - you spend your last breaths pondering what could have been.
Option B: Run like hell. The damage is done and you're damn lucky you still have all or most of your skin holding your moist bits inside. Have a beer and meditate upon the fact that approximately 50% of the population is female. Conduct research. And experiments.
Option C: As mentioned above, you're either unaware, unwilling or unable to inspect and face your motivations and desires. You get back together with LTG. You end up cheating on LTG. Everything goes to shit. Probably just after things started getting good. The universe is cruel like that and does indeed take deep pleasure from your misfortune and suffering - especially when it's self inflicted.
Option D: Get back together with her, you never slip up again and you have zero regrets. Not only does she forgive you, she genuinely forgets the whole incident and has to strain to vaguely remember it when you casually mention it as you lounge together sipping Mai Tais on a sprawling private balcony in an exclusive tropical resort as you both wistfully while away the gilded hours of your golden years and your 50th anniversary third honeymoon.
Of these four choices, one of them in particular is terribly unlikely. The other three are not necassarily exclusive of each other.
posted by loquacious at 3:09 AM on December 21, 2005
Option A: Get back together with her, possibly even developing a strong, satisfying and lasting relationship - or not - and spend the rest of your life being badgered to death by a righteously indignant woman who casually dispenses terror and mayhem upon your trembling, quaking person and soul at any wild whim she fancies. As you die early - a harried and hen-pecked shell of a man - you spend your last breaths pondering what could have been.
Option B: Run like hell. The damage is done and you're damn lucky you still have all or most of your skin holding your moist bits inside. Have a beer and meditate upon the fact that approximately 50% of the population is female. Conduct research. And experiments.
Option C: As mentioned above, you're either unaware, unwilling or unable to inspect and face your motivations and desires. You get back together with LTG. You end up cheating on LTG. Everything goes to shit. Probably just after things started getting good. The universe is cruel like that and does indeed take deep pleasure from your misfortune and suffering - especially when it's self inflicted.
Option D: Get back together with her, you never slip up again and you have zero regrets. Not only does she forgive you, she genuinely forgets the whole incident and has to strain to vaguely remember it when you casually mention it as you lounge together sipping Mai Tais on a sprawling private balcony in an exclusive tropical resort as you both wistfully while away the gilded hours of your golden years and your 50th anniversary third honeymoon.
Of these four choices, one of them in particular is terribly unlikely. The other three are not necassarily exclusive of each other.
posted by loquacious at 3:09 AM on December 21, 2005
done this too. it will pass. no idea what the solution is, though, apart from time. in the longer term, you might try using a diminutive rather than a real name. "you've never called me snugglebun before!" is better than "that's not my name"...
posted by andrew cooke at 4:11 AM on December 21, 2005
posted by andrew cooke at 4:11 AM on December 21, 2005
oh, maybe that's not a diminutive? long words for short words confuse me...
posted by andrew cooke at 4:13 AM on December 21, 2005
posted by andrew cooke at 4:13 AM on December 21, 2005
So, why'd you guys break up in the first place?
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:08 AM on December 21, 2005
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:08 AM on December 21, 2005
After a good knock to the head some folks are left with a condition called dysnomia, including myself. It is a marked difficulty in remembering names or words. Example: last week my finance was greatly confused/amused by my wondering around the house trying to find my "muffins". I was actually looking for my mittens. Generally these incidents are with words that are similar: they share the first couple of letters (m), purpose (objects), and/or have a similar pronunciation or structure (double letters near the middle). The rest of the incidents occur because I've stalled in remembering a word and my brain goes with the next one in that 'category'...
Awkward example: People who I have unconditional love for. There's two and, when the problem is worse, I sometimes flip their names. It happens. Very embarrassing, though at least they both know I have this problem so we can have a laugh. We're talking once every couple of months often, for this specific substitution, but at times like the holidays it happens more because their both on my mind more often (what would they like for a present? etc.).
It tends to happen when I'm exhausted or not very focused on what I'm saying. I.e. when it happens to you. And I'm not saying you have dysnomia, but just trying to show how the brain works. If you had dysnomia you'd know it because you'd be doing this so often it is annoying (multiple times per evening, depending on how I slept), which I do.
Anyway, point is: you've got both of these women in the same category, wether it be "People I'm comfortable around", "People I'm attracted to", "People I trust", etc. Your going to have to figure out which category it is (Hint: they probably address one of your major character 'flaws' or something weighing heavily on your mind), and specifically work to differentiate those people so your brain understands the difference.
Having said all that, evariste's answer is right on, and hopefully this explains why. The implications of finding that category are far better explained by the others in this thread than I, but your question just can't be answered without knowing what the category is. Good luck.
posted by jwells at 5:48 AM on December 21, 2005
Awkward example: People who I have unconditional love for. There's two and, when the problem is worse, I sometimes flip their names. It happens. Very embarrassing, though at least they both know I have this problem so we can have a laugh. We're talking once every couple of months often, for this specific substitution, but at times like the holidays it happens more because their both on my mind more often (what would they like for a present? etc.).
It tends to happen when I'm exhausted or not very focused on what I'm saying. I.e. when it happens to you. And I'm not saying you have dysnomia, but just trying to show how the brain works. If you had dysnomia you'd know it because you'd be doing this so often it is annoying (multiple times per evening, depending on how I slept), which I do.
Anyway, point is: you've got both of these women in the same category, wether it be "People I'm comfortable around", "People I'm attracted to", "People I trust", etc. Your going to have to figure out which category it is (Hint: they probably address one of your major character 'flaws' or something weighing heavily on your mind), and specifically work to differentiate those people so your brain understands the difference.
Having said all that, evariste's answer is right on, and hopefully this explains why. The implications of finding that category are far better explained by the others in this thread than I, but your question just can't be answered without knowing what the category is. Good luck.
posted by jwells at 5:48 AM on December 21, 2005
there's no kissing with buddies. there's no sexual tension with buddies.
Not true at all.
People talk and say stupid things in their sleep. Most of such talk is complete nonsense. Sometimes it represents a verbalization of thoughts that were previously formulated but never verbalized. Mostly it's nonsense. Sleep talking (somniloquy) is a harmless condition, usually brought on by stress. I encourage you and your ex to sit down and do some research into this condition if it's affecting your quality of life. Once you both have a better grip on what's going on you can ignore all the silly "subconscious" (which is not a scientific or meaningful concept, IMO) talk.
I suspect what's really going on here is that your ex needs you to prove your commitment. She may want you to (temporarily? permanently?) cut Other Girl out of your life. A lot of the time people need more than words and more than actions before they'll really accept something from a loved one. Only unreasonable sacrifice can/does convince them of the depth of their loved one's feelings. This would be a choice you have to make--don't ask your ex. But do tell Other Girl if you decide to stop seeing Other Girl for the sake of your relationship--don't just drop off the map.
posted by nixerman at 6:19 AM on December 21, 2005
Not true at all.
People talk and say stupid things in their sleep. Most of such talk is complete nonsense. Sometimes it represents a verbalization of thoughts that were previously formulated but never verbalized. Mostly it's nonsense. Sleep talking (somniloquy) is a harmless condition, usually brought on by stress. I encourage you and your ex to sit down and do some research into this condition if it's affecting your quality of life. Once you both have a better grip on what's going on you can ignore all the silly "subconscious" (which is not a scientific or meaningful concept, IMO) talk.
I suspect what's really going on here is that your ex needs you to prove your commitment. She may want you to (temporarily? permanently?) cut Other Girl out of your life. A lot of the time people need more than words and more than actions before they'll really accept something from a loved one. Only unreasonable sacrifice can/does convince them of the depth of their loved one's feelings. This would be a choice you have to make--don't ask your ex. But do tell Other Girl if you decide to stop seeing Other Girl for the sake of your relationship--don't just drop off the map.
posted by nixerman at 6:19 AM on December 21, 2005
I have no secret desire for Other Girl, though she remains a good friend.
I would like to add a word for Other Girl -- she may have fallen for you, anon, and it would be best for everyone involved if you stopped trying to be "just friends" with her.
posted by footnote at 6:59 AM on December 21, 2005
I would like to add a word for Other Girl -- she may have fallen for you, anon, and it would be best for everyone involved if you stopped trying to be "just friends" with her.
posted by footnote at 6:59 AM on December 21, 2005
I would encourage you to accept that you're broken up for a reason, and that you're calling out this other girl's name for a reason. It just seems so... obvious, whether or not you're willing to see it.
There is no way you could possibly know that. Name replacement dosn't mean anything. I've called my sister the name of a girl I hung out with a lot, didn't mean I wanted to replace my sister with that chick. Please.
posted by delmoi at 7:03 AM on December 21, 2005
There is no way you could possibly know that. Name replacement dosn't mean anything. I've called my sister the name of a girl I hung out with a lot, didn't mean I wanted to replace my sister with that chick. Please.
posted by delmoi at 7:03 AM on December 21, 2005
Jwells nails it, although I don't think you have dysnomia. But in your mind "girls name" has come to mean "person that I'm hanging out with all the time" or simply "the other person in the room". You may have never been 'in love' with her, it sounds like you were just hanging out with her to pass the time to begin with.
What bugs your girlfriend isn't that you say the name, but that it's still stuck in your head. The fact that her name is still burned in your head makes her feel like Other Girl still takes a big part of your heart. (I suppose)
My advice is to work saying her (your new girlfriend's name) as often as you can. Whenever you see her, think her name to yourself in your head. Do that even more. The idea is to train yourself to say her name reflexively.
In my experience, this thing goes away after a month or so.
posted by delmoi at 7:11 AM on December 21, 2005
What bugs your girlfriend isn't that you say the name, but that it's still stuck in your head. The fact that her name is still burned in your head makes her feel like Other Girl still takes a big part of your heart. (I suppose)
My advice is to work saying her (your new girlfriend's name) as often as you can. Whenever you see her, think her name to yourself in your head. Do that even more. The idea is to train yourself to say her name reflexively.
In my experience, this thing goes away after a month or so.
posted by delmoi at 7:11 AM on December 21, 2005
I have also had this same experience. The name of the person I was saying to my girlfriend of the time was my best friend. My girlfriend had been acting jealous and I had created a rift between me and BF for this reason. So of course, I was extremely guilty and upset. What I remember mostly about this time in my life and in this relationship was a lot of tears and angst.
The reason I'm posting this, is that I was also saying these things in a dream-like state. Sometimes I would say them when I was a awake-- but even then, reality seemed a little hazy. Like nixerman said, sleep-talking is usually brought on by stress and, in my case, the stress was brought on by the relationship. So the ultimate cause of this problem was just that the relationship was so very exigent. It was just another clue that I should find a way of de-stressing the relationship or get out.
posted by fireflies to stars at 7:56 AM on December 21, 2005
The reason I'm posting this, is that I was also saying these things in a dream-like state. Sometimes I would say them when I was a awake-- but even then, reality seemed a little hazy. Like nixerman said, sleep-talking is usually brought on by stress and, in my case, the stress was brought on by the relationship. So the ultimate cause of this problem was just that the relationship was so very exigent. It was just another clue that I should find a way of de-stressing the relationship or get out.
posted by fireflies to stars at 7:56 AM on December 21, 2005
There is no way you could possibly know that. Name replacement dosn't mean anything. I've called my sister the name of a girl I hung out with a lot, didn't mean I wanted to replace my sister with that chick. Please.
Did you also accidentally say to the girl you hung out with a lot, "Sister, I'm so attracted to you," and "Kiss me, Sister" ?
It's like I'm taking crazy pills...
posted by danny the boy at 8:44 AM on December 21, 2005
Did you also accidentally say to the girl you hung out with a lot, "Sister, I'm so attracted to you," and "Kiss me, Sister" ?
It's like I'm taking crazy pills...
posted by danny the boy at 8:44 AM on December 21, 2005
Well, at least in my mind, it's pretty easy to mess up names. Especially when half alseep. So far I've managed to avoid calling my girlfriend by an ex-girlfriends name, but it's been damn close on a couple of occasions, like catching the glass while falling close. That being said, I have called her by my best friend's name before. Who's a boy. I assure you, I have no urge to sleep with him, or any secret desires for him. I'm just terrible with names.
Terrible.
posted by KirTakat at 9:53 AM on December 21, 2005
Terrible.
posted by KirTakat at 9:53 AM on December 21, 2005
Meditate.
Yeah. This is kind of like hiccups. You can't force it to stop, consciously. Meditate ON the real name of your girlfriend. Just say it to yourself over and over. Visualize her. Spend a couple minutes a day doing this. I'd say do NOT spend a bunch of time kicking yourself over the mistake. That will make you nervous about it and could even cause it to happen more. Even awake!
Good luck with all of that.
posted by scarabic at 12:37 PM on December 21, 2005
Yeah. This is kind of like hiccups. You can't force it to stop, consciously. Meditate ON the real name of your girlfriend. Just say it to yourself over and over. Visualize her. Spend a couple minutes a day doing this. I'd say do NOT spend a bunch of time kicking yourself over the mistake. That will make you nervous about it and could even cause it to happen more. Even awake!
Good luck with all of that.
posted by scarabic at 12:37 PM on December 21, 2005
Sleeptalking is kind of funny.
I once came half awake and said "Good morning, jelly" to my girlfriend. She said "WHAT?!?!" so I said, "You do not have any bones in you so I call you jelly."
Then I came awake and thought "WTF."
Later, I discovered she thought I called her "Jenny." Much hilarity ensued.
I do not know how to avoid these types of brain glitches.
posted by ikkyu2 at 9:33 PM on December 21, 2005
I once came half awake and said "Good morning, jelly" to my girlfriend. She said "WHAT?!?!" so I said, "You do not have any bones in you so I call you jelly."
Then I came awake and thought "WTF."
Later, I discovered she thought I called her "Jenny." Much hilarity ensued.
I do not know how to avoid these types of brain glitches.
posted by ikkyu2 at 9:33 PM on December 21, 2005
I second the suggestion that you use behavior modification, rather than attempting to will or meditate it away. Make sure you say her name out loud, to her, a couple of times a day. (This even though the pet name psst. andrew. is the favored Lothario solution since time immemorial.) You want to get used to saying it, again. It will also reinforce to your girlfriend what you feel, since people like hearing their own name. Try to make some of these moments romantic ones, too, to reinforce the habit of associating romantic feelings with your girlfriend's name.
You can add to this cognitive feedback methods, such as the simple trick of wearing a rubber band, and every time you make the mistake -- even if it's just in your mind -- snapping the rubber band enough to say ouch. This will help you learn to "catch" yourself unconsciously.
Anyway, this sort of thing is common. My parents raised us yelling "Gregor! I mean Dan! I mean Tracks (the dog)!" and now with my nieces I think my record is barely 60% saying the right girl's name when I need to raise my voice. (They're both very indignant when it happens, but that doesn't seem to be enough for cognitive feedback to set in ...)
But loquacious has a very good point. Do you really want to spend the rest of your life with someone who makes a big deal out of something like this? If it isn't this, it's likely to be something else equally ... innocent ... that's going to be the trigger, once you've expunged the name issue.
posted by dhartung at 12:50 AM on December 22, 2005
You can add to this cognitive feedback methods, such as the simple trick of wearing a rubber band, and every time you make the mistake -- even if it's just in your mind -- snapping the rubber band enough to say ouch. This will help you learn to "catch" yourself unconsciously.
Anyway, this sort of thing is common. My parents raised us yelling "Gregor! I mean Dan! I mean Tracks (the dog)!" and now with my nieces I think my record is barely 60% saying the right girl's name when I need to raise my voice. (They're both very indignant when it happens, but that doesn't seem to be enough for cognitive feedback to set in ...)
But loquacious has a very good point. Do you really want to spend the rest of your life with someone who makes a big deal out of something like this? If it isn't this, it's likely to be something else equally ... innocent ... that's going to be the trigger, once you've expunged the name issue.
posted by dhartung at 12:50 AM on December 22, 2005
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but,
"I have no secret desire for Other Girl".
Erm... yes...
I would encourage you to accept that you're broken up for a reason, and that you're calling out this other girl's name for a reason. It just seems so... obvious, whether or not you're willing to see it. I doubt your ex will ever be able to fully trust you again. Would you ever be able to have a relationship with a girl whom you know is in love with someone else?
Leave it & her alone.
posted by danny the boy at 12:19 AM on December 21, 2005