I hate baking
March 26, 2016 10:09 AM   Subscribe

Convince me to love it.

I cook. I don't bake. I'll spend hours over a stove with a long, complicated French recipe, but ask me to spend five minutes with flour? Forget it. It's just too messy.

(The one exception to this, for me, is making pizza dough. You need the right recipe, but I find pizza dough relatively simple and low-mess. And I love a great home baked pizza, have a killer recipe for the perfect thin crust, and am excited whenever I make it. If only all other baking was like this for me?)

Fact is, I don't want to have an aversion to baking. I love the idea of pulling an artisan bread out of the oven and knowing that I made that, or bulk baking steel cut oatmeal muffins to freeze for quick breakfasts, or making my own madeleines.

My partner likes to bake artisan bread when he can. He is not flour-averse in the least (will randomly make up a bunch of tortillas, naan, waffles, etc), but he works more overtime than I do so... it might be nice to return the baking favor to him once in a while.

What recipes would you recommend for a reluctant beginner baker? It does not necessarily have to be "no knead" or "no rise".

Likewise, what tools, tips and tricks do you recommend for keeping the "messy" part as minimal as possible? I always prefer to clean up as I go along, where possible, but this can get overwhelming when there are a lot of ingredients and certain steps are highly time sensitive or require having both hands available.

Some tools I currently have that do make baking easier:
- Flour sifter
- Digital food scale
- Stand mixer
- Silpat silicone baking mats

I'm probably most interested in savory breads, but am open to anything that qualifies as 'baking'. Not a picky eater/no allergies/special dietary restrictions.
posted by nightrecordings to Food & Drink (40 answers total) 26 users marked this as a favorite
The thing that made be think "holy shit baking is awesome" was when I made cheese gougeres. They don't involve getting tons of flour all over the place and they take very little time to make.

I used the recipe in Ratio by Michael Ruhlman, which is a great resource for understanding the basic logic behind baking (like "what is the actual difference between muffin batter and cake batter and pancake batter," etc).
posted by showbiz_liz at 10:12 AM on March 26, 2016 [8 favorites]

Make flourless baked goods? My favourite recipe at the moment is this:
posted by LoonyLovegood at 10:13 AM on March 26, 2016 [1 favorite]

I hate flour, too! It gets all over everything, and turns into paste when you try to clean up afterwards. I don't have any recipe suggestions, but do you have a bench scraper? It makes cleanup vastly easier if you just scrape all the flour up/away.
posted by Weeping_angel at 10:15 AM on March 26, 2016 [6 favorites]

One tip on the clean-up: Use cold water to clean spoons/beaters/bowls with dough on them. Using hot water just makes it more gluelike. Cold water is what helps it rinse clean.
posted by veggieboy at 10:29 AM on March 26, 2016 [15 favorites]

Things to ease baking:

stand mixer (goodbye endless kneading)
use recipes that have weights instead of measures
apron that wraps all the way around to avoid flour prints on the ass
giant bowl for mixing things (less slopping onto the counter)
a couple of good rubber/silicone spatulas
seconding Ratio by Michael Ruhlman (I can now make good, reliable, flaky pie crust)

Tricks for not having dough & flour sticking to you while making bread (pick one):
coat everything (including your hands) in olive oil or
coat everything in flour

I got into yeasted breads after having success with quick rise breads. They're mix, dump, stir kinds of recipes, so the mess if often relegated to two bowls. Cornbread has a high satisfaction factor for me (I like the buttermilk cornbread recipe from The Book of Bread by Judith and Evan Jones). Or try and herb and cheese variation of the Beyond Easy Beer Bread.

The Book of Bread is pretty much the book I use to bake bread from, though it's not one of the traditional, vaunted bread manuals.
posted by carrioncomfort at 10:30 AM on March 26, 2016 [1 favorite]

If you don't already store your flour in a nice wide canister (with an airtight seal,) do spring for one. It's SO much less messy than trying to scoop it out of a bag. Flour scooped out of a bag invariably makes a mess.
posted by fingersandtoes at 10:31 AM on March 26, 2016 [11 favorites]

French baguettes at home. No joke. So easy. I recommend watching the video.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 10:36 AM on March 26, 2016 [2 favorites]

King Arthur Flour has great books on baking, and sell lots of useful tools for making baking easy and fun.

Parchment paper is great for quick clean up and works great for keeping things from sticking to pans.

A good silicone spatula makes it easy to scrape down the sides of a bowl when mixing or to get every bit of batter/dough out of the bowl.

A good electric stand mixer (KitchenAid etc) is a huge help, but pricey. If you find yourself needing to mix things by hand, a dough whisk is very helpful.

This Pretzel Bite recipe is easy to make and wonderful to eat.

Get decent quality tools and ingredients. You don't need to spend a fortune on professional chief quality gear, but don't get super cheap stuff either. Good tools will work better, be easier to take care of, and will give you better results.
posted by nalyd at 10:37 AM on March 26, 2016 [2 favorites]

Flour is hard to contain, but that can be okay if you clear and wipe clean a large area of countertop before you start in with the ingredients. A dusting of stray flour across a counter is easy to clean up, but it becomes a chore if you have to dig it out of the crevices of the food processor and blender that you weren't even using. Give yourself some uncluttered elbow room.

When it's time to clean up, sweep up as much as possible while it's still dry, rather than going straight to a wet sponge that will make everything gooey. As mentioned above, use cold water and get a dough scraper.
posted by jon1270 at 10:49 AM on March 26, 2016 [2 favorites]

For me, it's the digital scale. Yes, measuring by weight is more exact, but being able to total out the scale and simply add from the storage container to the bowl makes way less flour mess and less tools to clean.
posted by atomicstone at 11:09 AM on March 26, 2016 [2 favorites]

Also, anything that involves batter as opposed to dough is way easier to clean up as it is normally fairly contained to the mixing bowl and recipes are normally straight forward. I count savoury muffins in this category. It's when you try to make things that need kneading, rolling out and all kinds of shaping that the clear large workspace and all that come into their own. Personally I just don't like getting stuck in with my hands too much!
posted by koahiatamadl at 11:13 AM on March 26, 2016 [5 favorites]

Pretend you're on a cooking show, where there is never a mess: measure out all dry ingredients in advance into small dishes (use small paper bowls if you want; if you bake only occasionally this isn't so wasteful.) Put the small bowl for the flour in the sink while you scoop it in. Then put everything away, wipe the counter and go do something else for a while. WHen it's time to actually bake, just dump in the ingredients from your little pre-measured bowls, like Giada or Ina.
posted by flourpot at 11:16 AM on March 26, 2016 [2 favorites]

Some super easy things are: oil cakes (no butter), cream scones (no butter), any sort of single bowl brownie, molten chocolate cakes, flourless chocolate cakes. Madeleines are also really easy.

The trick with flour is either to have it in something covered (a food processor with dough hook), or to cover the stand mixer with a towel when you start mixing (at slow speed). You can also start by mixing in the flour by hand until it's all slightly wet so when you use the stand mixer, there's no flour to fly everywhere. Since about 90% of my baking mess is flour (or cocoa) that flew somewhere while baking (the rest is accidental spills), you should pretty much have everything covered if you can keep the flour contained.
posted by jeather at 11:35 AM on March 26, 2016

Seconding the King Arthur baking books --- also cleaning your tools in cold water, and just soaking everything immediately: do not let dough harden on anything!

What specifically do you hate most about baking? Is it mostly the flour-y mess on counters and dough sticking to your hands? If so, it might be worth it to you to get an electric bread machine.

(Personally I adore getting elbow-deep in bread dough, but I know not everyone does. I'm lousy at delicate pastry like piecrust probably for the same reasons I'm great at bread: kneading, punching down, whacking it on the counter, it's a delicious way to get rid of frustrations, and cheaper than therapy....)
posted by easily confused at 11:47 AM on March 26, 2016

I had for a long time a marble kneading board which kept a lot of the flour contained and then you could scrape it off afterwards. And then there are recipes like this where the only flour aspect is "Pour it in with everything else" and they come out all nice and savory and good with cheese. Also agree about flour containers. I have some big glass jars that are wide enough to scoop out of, so flour mostly stays contained AND I can tell how much I have left. Another alternative is ziploc containers in the freezer if you have more room there or your place is prone to pantry moths.
posted by jessamyn at 11:59 AM on March 26, 2016

>have a killer recipe for the perfect thin crust

Much like asking cat questions on MetaFilter, I believe you are morally obligated to link to this pizza crust recipe. Thanks!
posted by 2soxy4mypuppet at 12:05 PM on March 26, 2016 [3 favorites]

Response by poster: What specifically do you hate most about baking? Is it mostly the flour-y mess on counters and dough sticking to your hands?

Honestly, after reading everyone's (awesome!) suggestions so far, I'm realizing that I not only dislike baking because of how messy my countertops get due to flour, but how messy the other dry ingredients like sugar, baking soda, baking powder, salt etc are when you don't keep them in special containers for scooping. We buy flour in bulk (20lbs) at Costco and have been trying to find the right container for all 20lbs; but it's confusing to figure out what the right size container would be since most are measured in gallons or cups. So... any additional suggestions for a gigantic bulk flour container, as well as standard size containers for all the other dry ingredients, are welcome.

You guys are great, thank you times a million and please keep the suggestions coming! I have a feeling I'll be - dare I say happily? - wearing a flour-crusted apron by the time this day is over.
posted by nightrecordings at 12:09 PM on March 26, 2016

a killer recipe for the perfect thin crust,
So, you're going to share this, right? Pizza crust is on my list of things to figure out.

I don't love baking because I don't cook with great precision, and a lot of baking requires precision. But I really want to have healthy muffins to grab on my way out the door, so I make my personalized version of these from Mark Bittman. I add some combination of bran, applesauce, pumpkin, molasses, apricots, banana, walnuts; you get the idea.
posted by theora55 at 12:11 PM on March 26, 2016 [1 favorite]

Do you have a dishwasher? Make your dough on the counter that's directly over it. Then when you're done, just open the dishwasher and sponge the flour etc. off the counter edge onto the dishwasher door.
posted by daisyace at 12:12 PM on March 26, 2016

Response by poster: By request (and then I'll quit thread-sitting): this is the best thin crust pizza dough recipe. That I've found, anyway. It's crispy and even and light and even folks I know who are anti-thin crust have told me they dig it.

Note: after learning from Cook's Illustrated that a pizza steel > pizza stone (I used pizza stones for years and definitely see and taste the difference), I encourage you to seek one out.
posted by nightrecordings at 12:19 PM on March 26, 2016 [4 favorites]

If you have room, you want containers like this for flour and sugar; if not, something smaller like this. Things you use less of (oatmeal, cocoa, brown sugar) can go in similar but smaller containers. These are easy to scoop out of, easy to clean, and lock tight to prevent flour moths.

Things like baking powder and baking soda and corn starch are used in such small amounts that they don't need their own reusable containers -- b powder & corn starch come in just fine round plastic containers, and b soda I use in the cardboard box for a while until I decide it's too old and move it into the fridge for odour containment.

If you bake by volume -- which I do; I find baking by weight a pain and unnecessarily precise -- treat yourself to the off-sized measuring cups (2/3, 3/4), which are really nice to use.
posted by jeather at 12:29 PM on March 26, 2016

I buy 5lb. bags of flour, so I don't have specific container suggestions, but extrapolating from this answer, 20 lbs. of all-purpose flour is approximately 4.2 gallons or 16.9 quarts by volume, so a container rated for at least that much should be able to handle your 20 lb. bag of flour.

You might find it easier to divvy up the bag into two smaller containers though. I don't think I'd like baking much either if I had to drag out a 20 lb. container of flour every time I baked.

Also, best recipes for the hesitant baker: cookies! They almost always use the single bowl, come together great in a stand mixer, and if you get parchment paper and use it to line the baking sheets, cleanup is dead simple. Actually, parchment paper can help with a lot of the mess for baking; I use it to line just about any pan that uses a batter or unkneaded dough. My favorite recipe is this peanut butter chocolate chip cookie recipe.
posted by Aleyn at 12:34 PM on March 26, 2016

Oh, another thing I've found that helps lessen the baking mess, at least for me, is to put down a large silpat on the counter where I'm mixing and/or working with ingredients. Most of the mess will end up on the silpat which you can then rinse/wash off in the sink after you're done, and if you give the countertop a slightly damp surface with a washcloth when you lay the silpat down, it'll almost guarantee it stays in one place for all but the most sticky doughs.
posted by Aleyn at 12:52 PM on March 26, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm not seeing a ton of enthusiasm about sweets here, but the thing that always gets me back into baking is making up a ton of cookie dough, baking maybe 6-12 cookies, and then portioning the rest out into a stash of "emergency cookies" - ready to go frozen cookie dough balls that I can pop out of the freezer and bake two of them in the toaster oven on a whim after a rough day.
posted by deludingmyself at 1:07 PM on March 26, 2016 [2 favorites]

These oatmeal scones are oaty, quick, and can go sweet (with jam for breakfast) or savoury (with cheese and apples for lunch) depending on how much sugar and salt you use. The best thing about these is they are largely oats, so you don't have so much flour flying everywhere, and use melted butter, so there's no cutting-in-butter tedium. I can make them start to finish in a little over 20 minutes, tossing everything into a full soapy sink as I go, washing up as they bake, and then eat them warm out of the oven, BAM. I'm not much a baker on account of the faff but I make these all. the. time.
posted by Erasmouse at 1:13 PM on March 26, 2016 [1 favorite]

Hmmm. Part of dealing with the mess is practice at not making so much mess. I also wonder if you are diving right into difficult recipes without practicing the simple ones.
posted by SemiSalt at 1:37 PM on March 26, 2016 [1 favorite]

You might find it easier to divvy up the bag into two smaller containers though. I don't think I'd like baking much either if I had to drag out a 20 lb. container of flour every time I baked.

Yeah, this! Buy in bulk and store in bulk, but keep a smaller jar on the counter along with your jars for sugar, etc. Then just restock from the larger stored container when needed.
posted by showbiz_liz at 1:42 PM on March 26, 2016 [1 favorite]

My baking life has vastly improved with a purchase of a countertop pastry board! Since it's portable, when I'm done baking I just lift it up and scrape off any remaining flour/dough into the compost, rather than scrubbing the counter down.
posted by thirdletter at 2:33 PM on March 26, 2016

I still botch things all the time, but I love baking now. The two things that have helped me the most are:
• Read the recipe the whole way through before you start (nothing is more frustrating than dumping all the dry ingredients into a bowl and mixing them together only to read "reserve 1/4 cup of the flour" in the next line of the recipe.)
• Pre-measure everything and do a quick counter clean before you start combining. And I find recipes with ingredients listed in grams to be so much easier than measure/scrape/sift/etc., (obviously you need a scale.)

I used to find bread really intimidating, now I love making it but I'm nowhere near an expert. The Brown-Eyed Baker has a pretty good list of top 10 yeast breads to make that aren't particularly hard. I've been making the chocolate babka for xmas gifts for neighbours for the last 3 years.
I'm currently trying to master Rose Levy Beranbaum's The Bread Bible, which is an awesome book but she's super picky about everything, particularly things like "ONLY USE X-BRAND FLOUR" and we usually don't have the things she uses here in Canada so that frustrates me a bit.

I know you said savoury, but I bought Kate Lebo's Pie School for like $9 at a cheap book store a few months ago and I've already made 3 or 4 pies from it. Worth it for her easy crust techniques alone, which have come out perfect for me, without fail. The cheddar crust I made a few weeks ago for an apple pie was so good. Plus she's cool and favourited my Instagram pic of a Maple Bourbon Pecan Pie I made.

St. Peepsburg, I'll have to try that baguette recipe. This one from saveur.com has always worked great for me.
posted by chococat at 2:55 PM on March 26, 2016

oh, you didn't mention pan cleanup, but I will say I almost never use an unlined pan anymore because I don't want to deal with scrubbing big pans. Cookie sheets get a silpat or a piece of parchment paper. Brownies get a sling of two sheets of parchment paper; or sometimes greased foil.

Pyrex dishes for quickbreads are ok, because they are small enough to go in the dishwasher without taking up too much room.
posted by fingersandtoes at 3:01 PM on March 26, 2016

Like Semisalt, I am also wondering how you are managing to make such a mess. Sponge cake is a one-bowl operation. So are muffins, brownies, cupcakes, etc. Tarts, flans, biscuits and bread use one bowl and a small bit of worktop for rolling out. Are you trying to make those intricate Great British Bake Off multi-tiered monstrosities? Rainbow cakes, stuff like that? Don't! A decent lemon drizzle or chocolate loaf cake is much easier and tastes a lot nicer.

Maybe try a workshop to polish your technique? I went to a Christmas baking day run by my local cake shop, and in addition to coming home with a load of amazing cakes and biscuits, I also picked up lots of great tips on handling pastry and dough (like this skewer tip for perfectly even thickness, and rolling out on a polypocket or baking parchment instead of flouring my worktop).
posted by tinkletown at 5:09 PM on March 26, 2016

We use gallon bags and put the small bags of ingredients inside sealed gallon bags to avoid mess. Also seconding wax paper - it's a life changer.
posted by corb at 7:54 PM on March 26, 2016

You need two bench scrapers: one made of metal (my favorite is by OXO) and one made of plastic. Providing you are working on a smooth surface, you can run the flat edge of the scraper along the surface and push any spilled dry ingredients or dried batter into the trash. The metal one is also extremely useful for cutting butter and dough, while the plastic one is great for scraping batters out of bowls. I think they'll really help you minimize the messiness of baking. Hope you get to enjoy baking more with these tips!
posted by constellations at 8:05 PM on March 26, 2016

I am also a Costco flour buyer. If you have the space for it, my system works well for me: a five-gallon airtight food safe bucket in the pantry (or garage or extra closet or whatever space you have) plus a largeish (one and a half gallon?) container in the kitchen that I refill it from occasionally.
posted by charmedimsure at 11:07 PM on March 26, 2016

This question is baffling to me -- not because you don't like baking, but because the reasons you don't like it should be worse for cooking.

The reasons I don't like cooking as much as baking are because it's messier and more time sensitive. Hot oil flying around. Meat smoking. Having to stir something constantly. Can't walk away or my meat will burn. Can't walk away or my sauce will disappear. Removing skins or seeds or stems or ends from plants. Removing fat or bones from meat. Cutting, chopping, dicing. So much preparation. So many different ingredients. Pots and pans to clean with caked on grease. Raw meat bacteria juice I have to sanitize. Seemingly no down time... unless you put something in the oven.

What are you baking that is highly time sensitive and that has no down time for you to clean as you go along? Maybe a better question is what part of the process do you find messy? Making pizza dough isn't that much unlike any other bread dough.

When I make yeast breads, I put all the ingredients in a bucket (or bowl, either way make sure it is quite a bit bigger than the ingredients) and mix with a spoon or dough whisk or scraper or my hand (start slow so you don't throw everything around). Maybe there are some stray ingredients on the bench now but it's very little. Then I knead it right on the bench. That is if it needs kneading -- many recipes are no knead or call for folding the dough right in the bucket. If kneading, you should have little to no flour on the bench. If the dough sticks, use your dough scraper to scrape it up. Use it for loose bits of dough stuck on the counter too. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXV8mayG3W0

When the dough is ready for bulk fermentation, you have at least an hour and maybe even 12 or 24 hours before you have to do anything again. This is the perfect time to clean. This counts as cleaning as you go along because the recipe isn't done yet.

When it's time to shape the dough, you might put flour on your bench, but again not too much. While the dough is proofing, you again have something like an hour before you have to do anything again. Cleaning opportunity.

If you didn't proof your dough in the baking vessel, you again might have to put flour on your bench. After you transfer the dough to the baking vessel, you have something like 15 to 45 minutes before you have to pull the dough out of the oven. Cleaning opportunity. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtoMhY0vS9E

By the time the recipe is done, you will have everything clean. I'm pretty much never able to be completely done with cleaning before a recipe is done unless I'm baking. And it's mostly just the countertop that you have to clean.

Depending on how your kitchen is set up, the best way to clean it is with either a plastic scraper or a metal scraper or ideally both. Just scrape the flour and dough from your counter straight to the sink or garbage. Then wipe with a rag or sponge. Keep your work area small even if you have a huge countertop so there is less mess. You can use a silpat or a pastry board, but I find it just adds another thing to clean.

For pies or pastries, same thing. The messiest part is rolling out the dough onto a floured work surface. After you've moved the dough to the baking vessel and put it into the oven, you have an hour to scrape the flour into the sink.

For cookies or quick breads, you usually end up throwing everything into the stand mixer, so I'm not sure where the messiness is here. For muffins, everything ends up in a single bowl also.

I buy 25 pounds of flour at a time and I keep it in a 22 qt container. Cambro is a popular brand. They have other sizes. http://www.webstaurantstore.com/cambro-rfs22148-22-qt-round-white-food-storage-container/214RFS22.html http://www.amazon.com/Cambro-RFS6PPSW2190-6-Quart-Food-Storage-Container/dp/B002PMV77G

You can move the big container around when you bake or estimate and put into a smaller container or weigh right where your big container is.

For the non-flour ingredients you mentioned, baking soda comes in a box and a baking powdered comes in a can that are easy to scoop out of. How are they messy? Are you buying them in huge quantities? You probably won't be able to use it all before it goes bad. Either buy the standard size or put in a jar or small Cambro or something.

For salt, don't you use salt when cooking? Avoid grinding salt when baking because it's such a pain. Buy kosher salt or fine sea salt. The retail containers are generally fine (open the kosher salt box even if it has a spout) or put in a jar if not.

Retail sugar can be left in the bag. I put that bag in a ziploc bag so any spills are caught. If you buy it in bulk, get a Cambro for your sugar too.

As for recipes, pick a somewhat simple recipe (like the fougasse video above) that you really enjoy. I can't believe there is that much variation in baking for the recipe to matter. You could pick 10 ingredients and be able to bake yeast breads, quick breads, cookies, muffins, cakes, biscuits, pastries, and pies. You want to pick a recipe that you can do and will feel good about after you're done.

There is something about flour you don't like. You must learn to love the flour. The smell. The sight. The little white specs, like snow on a winter morning. It's not a sign of messiness. It's a sign of a beautiful, calm day. It's food for the yeast, our wonderfully fragrant friends. Smell the yeast. Feel the dough in your bare hands, not in some soulless Captain Hook bowl. The dough is alive. Not just the yeast. Feel the dough come alive. From a incoherent mess to a tangled web of long luxurious gluten strands. Maybe the solution is not to be less messy. Maybe the solution is to redefine messy. Become one with the flour.
posted by aloysius on the mixing boards at 12:37 AM on March 27, 2016 [3 favorites]

The thing that made be think "holy shit baking is awesome" was when I made cheese gougeres.

I had never heard of gougeres until I read this comment, and I have never baked anything savoury before. Made them last night and they are AMAZING. A+ highly recommended
posted by drunkonthemoon at 6:11 AM on March 27, 2016 [3 favorites]

Another thought: when you have clean a mixing bowl or countertop or pastry board that has dried dough or flour/water mixture on it, the tool you need is a Dobie. They have enough bite to clean, but won't scratch anything. They can get covered with pasty stuff, but wash clean pretty easily.
posted by SemiSalt at 11:47 AM on March 27, 2016

I used to be you. I loved cooking, but baking... I just wouldn't go there. Part of it was the mess (to this day, recipes that call for cocoa powder make me frown), but that wasn't the crux of the issue for me, which I mention because I feel it might be the case with you as well, only you haven't completely realised it yet.

For me, it was the combination between down time (what, nothing to stir?! I'm going to sit here and drum my fingers on the countertop... OMG, baking is so fucking BORING) and not being able to check on doneness while whatever it is is in the oven (is it done yet? It's a bit brown... Is it done yet? How do I know it is done??). Like you, I was already way into making pizza - which takes little time in the oven, and you can pretty much see when it is done.
So, at the end of the day, it took getting armed with a few easy, fool proof recipes (I really recommend joyofbaking.com's recipes, I love everything Jennifer has taught me to make), and just doing it, forcing myself to go do something else while I wait for exactly the amount of time stated on the recipe. It worked. Of course, muffins as positive reinforcement, that's just brilliant.

And yes, get a plastic dough scraper, a large plastic bowl (or several) for kneading, and containers (I like OXO Pop) and little shovels that you store in each one. Always wash and clean with cold water.
posted by neblina_matinal at 1:16 PM on March 27, 2016 [1 favorite]

I buy grains and legumes in bulk, too, and store them in clean 5 or 10 gallon buckets with a lid with a rubber gasket or a gamma seal lid if you wanna get fancy. I then transfer them into large lock & lock containers for scoop-ability & pantry storage.
posted by carrioncomfort at 2:58 PM on March 29, 2016

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