What do I do with this relationship?

February 22, 2016 2:51 AM

I met this guy several years ago. We had a fantastic friendship, which was temporarily torpedoed by a failed attempt to make it romantic. We are now friends again, on a long distance basis, but I am worried that his attitude is shifting and he may want to give the couple option another try. Should I say or do something?

Back then: I developed a crush, I thought it was reciprocated, he made it clear that it wasn't and then changed his mind. We had a long and painful set of conversations in which he ultimately told me that he wasn't used to my body type but loved my personality and could we try a relationship on that basis. I said no, that was called friendship, and that's where we left it.

We are now fairly close friends again (albeit long-distance). However, he has recently started making comments about how great we would be together, and hinting at romantic interest again. I'm pretty sure that a relationship with a guy who dislikes my body but thinks he could get over that remains a bad idea. But I want to stay friends. I also still have feelings for him and that complicates my reactions when we are actually talking.

Am I fooling myself to think continued no-further-drama friendship is an option here? Should I say something, preemptively, about how disastrous I felt our last conversation about getting together was and how, no, we definitely wouldn't be great together? Or would that be jumping the gun and creating unnecessary awkwardness? Is the only option to pull back from the friendship itself? I really don't want to have another conversation about how to get over the obstacle of my fat body. (I've lost a small amount of weight since our initial friendship began, but my body looks basically the same as it did then and I can't imagine how awful it would be to be in a relationship that was wholly contingent on my losing weight and keeping it off.)

posted by anonymous to Human Relations (17 answers total)

I see this in a few different ways.

A) One of the questions you should be asking, all other circumstances aside, is if you want to engage in a LDR. Those are not easy.

B) Part is what it seems like is happening here is that he is having a "grass is greener" moment, in that he's connecting with you long-distance that wouldn't be possible if you were physically near each other. I say this because of his previous comments of your looks. He's attracted to your personality, and for whatever reason he can put the looks hangup aside when you guys don't actually have to see each other. (By the way, I certainly wouldn't date anyone who told me I was not physically attractive.)

C) You still seem very hurt by those comments, and I think it would be good to clear the air with regards to them. Next time he says "how great we would be together", you say "I'm pretty sure that a relationship with a guy who dislikes my body remains a bad idea." Then see how he responds. It's possibe he's matured a bit and has realized what's most important to him.
posted by Brittanie at 3:10 AM on February 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

As Captains Kirk or Picard would say, "Shields UP!"
You are correct in this assumption, and I agree with Brittanie that he's having a grass is greener moment, combined with a bit of selective amnesia.

But I want to stay friends. This IS possible, but you need to have a Come To Jesus with him before this goes any further. Be Perry Mason and pull out the evidence to convict him of being a jerk last time. Allow him to testify on his own behalf. Listen.

I also still have feelings for him... Might these feelings be love, but in a platonic sense? You can still care for him, but you don't have to get mixed up in a very bad long distance relationship with him.

This whole situation is bothering you a great deal, but you gotta put on your Big Girl Britches* and have a very frank talk about how this ended last time, and how it is going to go a lot differently from here on out. You need to be prepared for any number of reactions from him when you have this sanity-saving talk with him.

He may get angry. He may lash out. He may apologize. He may feel ashamed. He may go silent running. He may leave your life forever.

Are you prepared for these things? They are a possibility. Judge him by his actions, and not his words.

I think you're smart to be very cautious, and I it sounds like you're getting healthier (working out, eating better, losing weight) and frankly, you don't need to be thrown back into this mess again.

If he truly wants to be a friend, then make him earn it. He didn't last time.

*I assume M/F relationship here, I apologize if that's not the case.
posted by Major Matt Mason Dixon at 3:26 AM on February 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

There's always the chance that he's come around and thought, "I'm an idiot. This person is hot inside and out. I fucked it up."

But, well, he fucked it up, in a way that can't be unfucked. Even if you mutually decided you were in love and wanted to make it work, you will never get those comments out of your head. You will always doubt his attraction to you. Please remember that this is not your fault or your body's fault, but a result of his own foot in his mouth.

You won't be happy in a relationship where you suspect your partner finds you unattractive. You won't be happy in a friendship with attraction getting in the way. I don't think there's any sort of conversation you can have that will resolve either the hurt feelings or the romantic ones. Yet if you continue being friends with this guy, you'll keep marinating in both.

There are people who will be good friends without the drama. There are people who will love all of you without qualification. I don't think you can get either from this guy. I think you have to fade.
posted by Metroid Baby at 3:45 AM on February 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

it sounds like you're getting healthier (working out, eating better, losing weight)

At no point does the OP mention that she was unhealthy before or that she wants or needs to lose weight.
posted by Metroid Baby at 3:53 AM on February 22, 2016 [44 favorites]

This guy is not your friend or an idiot, nor does he have a faulty memory. In actual fact he's just your garden variety asshole. He remembers your conversation perfectly. He remembers telling you he'd be ok with dating you, if only you lost a bit of weight. What he's trying to do now is remind you of this and dangle the promise of a relationship in front of you, remind you of how well you get along and hoping that you'll get the hint and you know, LOSE THE WEIGHT. His preference for dating skinny chicks haven't changed overnight. The question is, have you developed a preference for men who make you feel like shit?
posted by Jubey at 6:02 AM on February 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

Honestly, he is the worst type of asshole, because he's the confused maybe-I-have-good-intentions asshole, who will just fuck with your head and make his own indecision your problem. It will be your problem that he wants to be attracted to you but can't be. It will be your problem that he's lonely. It will be your problem that he's tactless. It will be your problem that he can't have everything he wants and always be totally blunt about his boring preferences and get to be the Good Guy too. He will convince you to feel sorry for him for having you as a girlfriend, and will have no idea what a complete and utter jerk and moron he's being.

Give me an honest jerk any day over that nightmare.

Stay far away from this train wreck in the making.
posted by quincunx at 7:07 AM on February 22, 2016 [20 favorites]

Some commenters may be reading him as more of a jerk than he actually is... I see how he could be based on your post, but can also see how he may not be, and am going to assume the latter based on the fact that you like him. (But decide first whether he's worth your time!)

In your situation, I would tell him that you would like to be in a romantic relationship with him, but you can't be with someone who doesn't love your body. If he ever realizes that he does actually love your body, he should let you know, but until then, you love and value your friendship and hope to maintain it.

(I do think it's possible that at some point he might decide he loves your body. I think many of us go through periods in our lives when, subconsciously, a large part of our attraction is based on what we know other people find attractive... some of the things we find turn-offs are in part turn-offs because some part of us thinks about how we'd be embarrassed by the "low status indicator" of dating someone with a particular look. Thankfully, many of us outgrow this. But he needs to do that BEFORE you date him!)
posted by metasarah at 7:23 AM on February 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

I've been this fellow. I think we all have at a certain point/age. But he should have the maturity to realize that if it didn't work then it won't work now. Just ignore him and let him get over it.
posted by Young Kullervo at 7:24 AM on February 22, 2016

I think there's every chance that "I'm not used to your body type" meant "I am attracted to you but fear judgment about it." I don't say that to suggest that you should date this guy, because you shouldn't, but to suggest that you should avoid dating him specifically because of his emotional immaturity. He's been trying to slide sideways into a relationship with you while simultaneously avoiding admitting his attraction, and that's gross and you deserve better. Wait for someone who will shout about how hot you are. They're out there and not that rare.

As for whether you should say something, yes, you should. It might torpedo the friendship, but if it does, you've killed two birds with one stone: you've said your piece, and you've discovered that his offer of friendship was insincere. A valuable friendship, one that's worth putting this tsuris behind you, is one that doesn't fall apart when you tell him he's hurt your feelings.

Kudos to you for not taking his meager offerings last time, by the way. It takes guts to give up something you want because it's not being offered in good faith.
posted by babelfish at 7:35 AM on February 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

When I have been in this situation, with the other person doing that ridiculous hinting thing with plausible deniability, is to corner him: "are you trying to hint at something? Why do you keep saying these things? If there's something you want from me, say so plainly. Otherwise this is boundary-pushing bullshit and you need to stop."


See what happens. Be prepared for him to slink away never to be heard from again, but every once in a while a conversation like this gives someone the impetus to stand up and be a grownup and if that did happen it could make for a valuable friendship to have in your life. But never date him, that ship has sailed and you will be a) settling b) reinforcing his notion that this is how it's supposed to work.
posted by Lyn Never at 8:09 AM on February 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Men who are truly interested will often go to great lengths – or distances – to make it happen. You sound like you're both interested, but also a bit reticent. If that's the case, can you be straight up with him?

"We tried this before, remember? If you're really interested and want to go give it another go, you know where I am, and you know what I like. If you want to be friends, we can be friends. If you want more than that, by all means please woo me."

In terms of the friendship, it doesn't sound like a stable friendship (to me), rather it sounds like one of those meandering attraction-based relationships, where both people are in orbit around each other – close enough, but not too close, staying in touch as life naturally unfolds. It also sounds that each of you still wonders "what if".

If that's the case, next time he brings it up, give him a good, lighthearted encouragement as mentioned above and see where it goes. You'll know quite quickly I imagine.
posted by nickrussell at 9:18 AM on February 22, 2016

I think you should fade out on this person. He's pressing where he shouldn't be pressing, IMO.

I have a friend who has struggled with her weight and had a similar "friend" who would be into her if she only lost the weight. She lost the weight, they got married, she gained it all back. She then had to go to Mexico to get bariatric surgery to get it all back off :(
posted by getawaysticks at 9:46 AM on February 22, 2016

I think the big clarification would be to figure out whether he actually has trouble finding your body attractive... or if this just isn't what he's used to thinking of as "hot" and he's got to re-wire expectations a bit. I think that really can be done. Sometimes the social aspect is a problem. I dated a guy when I was young who... I didn't really find HIM that attractive, but I was lonely, at the time. He made some comments about my weight that were very unhelpful since I was in recovery from an ED at the time, as far as my not being his type. He didn't really want to hang out with me and his friends at the same time. But he was clearly into the idea of sleeping with me. I think in a situation where instead of casual dating you've got a pre-existing emotional connection? And where you're not both, like, in college, ideally, but a little more mature? It could happen. You pretty much have to have some in-depth conversations about it, and that kind of sucks, but... if you phrased it accurately, look at how you put that. If he thinks HE could get over it, it's a lot different than thinking YOU could get over it.

There are a lot of non-visual things that go into intimacy. They don't usually make up for a total lack of attraction. But I do think they can close the distance if one or both parties might otherwise be on the fence. If you're close enough to know anything about his other tastes and whether they match well, that would be very encouraging. Don't put your theoretical weight loss on the table as part of the deal.

My SO, for a lot of reasons (if not weight, but including the fact that we tried this once before and already split up once) is not the person I would have necessarily expected to wind up with? But what we have in common fits really well. And after the first try, we both failed pretty miserably at moving on. We wound up talking again and at some point it was like: I have feelings, and you have feelings, and we're spending tons of time together. It's not always a matter of starting a relationship so much as acknowledging that one exists and figuring out what has to happen to make it functional. You just need to see if there's enough foundation there to build on. If his bright idea is "helping" you diet... no.
posted by Sequence at 10:05 AM on February 22, 2016

It sounds like you've already decided this person is not a good person to date, so I'm going to focus on the questions you asked at the end of your post.

Am I fooling myself to think continued no-further-drama friendship is an option here?

Any friendship has the option of not being dramatic. However, that requires two people who are committed to supporting each other, who voice their boundaries and respect those stated, who think of the other person's feelings and do their best not to do things they know will hurt them. Do you honestly think this person is capable of that with you? Are you capable of that with them?

Should I say something, preemptively, about how disastrous I felt our last conversation about getting together was and how, no, we definitely wouldn't be great together?

If you haven't openly stated that the last conversation was an unmitigated disaster that totally ruined their chances forever, feel free. I wouldn't say it's pre-emptive because... you already had the conversation. If they're not getting that saying such a hurtful and fatphobic thing put them firmly in the "fuck never" box, feel free to remind them.

Or would that be jumping the gun and creating unnecessary awkwardness?

It's already unnecessarily awkward or you wouldn't be asking this question. Calling someone out for continuing to make you feel weird is not creating unnecessary awkwardness, it's reaffirming your right to exist and be respected. Next time they push your boundaries or mention how you should totally date, give them your pre-emptive speech.

Is the only option to pull back from the friendship itself?

I would but that's because I wouldn't want to be friends with someone who makes me feel this way. You deserve good friendships without feeling like the person is only hanging around because they're attracted to you and they're hoping you'll lower your standards enough to date someone who says hurtful things about your body. Only you can decide whether you want to remain friends with this person and what that friendship will look like. If you two flirt a lot as part of your friendship dynamic, that probably feels different now, and you might want to revisit that part of your interactions to see if you're still OK with it.
posted by buteo at 11:23 AM on February 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

A benevolent reading of his behavior is that long distance is masking his issue. Long distance, he is connecting to the things he's attracted to in you, but not dealing with your physical body. If he's still not attracted to you physically, then there's not a lot you can do about it.

Next time he hints, it's fair to say "No, I don't want to be with someone who's not attracted to me. I enjoy our friendship, but a romance is off the table."

If he fades after that, then good riddance.
posted by 26.2 at 12:54 PM on February 22, 2016

Britanie is correct with point B. Having been in many LDR, unless you're skyping daily (and even then) when you're apart from someone, your brain tends to forget their actual physicality and fill in the blanks with roses and sunshine. Like, even having lived with my fiance for ages, when we were forced apart for a year, there was little things I'd forgotten when I saw him again. Like height or broadness. I had been imagining him slightly taller subconsciously. I don't think everyone does this, and it wasn't a big deal, but it is a thing that happens and it may be contributing to your guys escalated affections, especially if it's mostly text-based conversations and not video chatting.

Am I fooling myself to think continued no-further-drama friendship is an option here?

Yes. That way lies much drama. Maybe in time you can be friends, but not while you still have feelings for him. Because as long as you have feelings for him in any capacity, the romantic hints he drops will do nothing but hold you back and keep you stuck.

I was where you stood, once. Ours was a strange one-sided long-distance friendship, probably more a crush on my end, but for what it's worth, I did love this person, very much at the time. It began to escalate and I knew it was getting complicated. But I also knew that my physicality was not what he was usually attracted to. We discussed it a lot, and he eventually said that he loved who I was as a person, and he wasn't closed off to the idea of me, or us, and we could see how it went. He didn't outright say I wasn't his physical type, in fact, he often claimed he was attracted to me, but I always had to pull compliments out of him and when I did talk about things like my body, or the limitations of being chubby in today's society, I wasn't very reassured. Understandable, I guess, but instead I was often told how great my personality was. Still, we made a promise to try it out, together. I was happy with that, and so we began plodding towards the path of a potential relationship, with much insecurity and hand-wringing on my end.

On the eve of this, though, he browsed CL to trawl for 'new friends' one night and met up with someone soon after-- basically the physical antithesis of me-- and 'fell in love' within two weeks. We'd been friends two years by that point. What happened after is enough for a novel, suffice to say, it was pretty much drama city.

In hindsight, I'm not sure why I wasted time with somebody who 'loved' me but wasn't crazy about me or my body and couldn't show it. Partly, I was conditioned to think this was normal and 'that is what guys want' and it was all I deserved-- the strength of my personality was my only real asset, and most men would just have to overlook the chub and put up with it anyway, and I would be lucky if I could find anyone to do so.

I had no idea just how freaking wrong I was. Almost immediately after this, I met a series of younger (some were conventionally hot) men who seemed to be quite taken by my personality AND my body and it was a real eye-opener for me. In a way I'm glad he shoved me away rather cruelly, because it allowed me to become 'unstuck' from him and my mindset. It expanded my experiences, and made me realize that me and my body weren't the issue at all. Moreover, it made me open my heart to someone else that loves my body and my personality, and makes me feel beautiful and sexy every single day, regardless of if I gain weight or lose it.

I'm not saying that attraction isn't sometimes malleable for some people, and that they can expand what they find 'sexy' and perhaps this is the case with this guy, but the fact he waffled on his attraction to you when you confessed your crush, then took it back and such... and the fact he pulls you towards him when you're long distance now... it reminds me a lot of my situation. In my case, I feel like he was keeping me around because he loved my personality and it was an ego boost for him for me to like him.

A guy shouldn't have to 'convince' himself to want to be with you or learn to love your body. Your body is not something you need to excuse in any capacity. It's hot and there are guys out there that will love it, and you, just as you are. You deserve much better than 'maybe I could learn to like it, because I like your personality' -- You deserve to desire and be desired in return. You are correct in realizing that a relationship based on you maintaining a reduced weight will absolutely end in tears. The way he push-pulls, acts reciprocal, then steps wildly back when you escalate, then hums and haws and acts reciprocal again? This is a GIANT red flag. It will not get better. Perhaps he's not intentionally leading you on, but he is doing so, and the more you play the game the worse it'll feel in the long run. I have a feeling that even if you pre-emptively told him 'hey no we wouldn't be great together, because of conversation' he would deny that he was making romantic notions at all, since this seems to be his MO any time you broach the topic.

Again, as long as you still have feelings for him, I don't think it's wise to chat to him at all any more. It clouds judgment to be in contact with one's affection. Long-distance makes it even more dangerous, because it feels so 'safe' because of the distance, and is easy to slip into. But It will leave you emotionally stuck, while he dangles his affections like a carrot. I can't say it enough times. You deserve better than that. I did too. Please learn from my mistakes.

Good luck
posted by Dimes at 1:02 PM on February 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

However, he has recently started making comments about how great we would be together, and hinting at romantic interest again.

I don't think you need a big confrontation or conversation if you don't want to have one. You've already had the big conversation with him, and it seems painful and awkward to go there again given that you aren't interested in trying again with him (seems like the right call to this internet stranger). I think you may be able to signal your disinterest by acting oblivious and/or laughing off his comments. "Oh, haha, come one, we both know it doesn't really work out between us. So, tell me about...." If he has the grace to follow your lead and drop the subject, you can still be friends with relatively little drama. If not, then you've got a problem and you either have to talk through all of this, again, or drop him (either suddenly or with a gradual fade out).
posted by Area Man at 2:09 PM on February 22, 2016