What can I do to solve this?
November 16, 2015 10:08 PM Subscribe
I live in a studio apartment with parquet flooring. The building is old for one in Toronto (~25 years), and the heating comes from pipes embedded in the ceiling of the room. The tenants right under my unit have their heat constantly turned on, which means my floor is constantly hot. Turning on my AC and two fans all the time doesn't solve the problem, and is borderline surreal as I embark on yet another Toronto winter.
I don't really want to leave my studio because I have grown used to it and its close to where I work. I have spoken to the building management countless times, and they always say that the tenants have full control of the system. I spoke to the tenants and they say that although they do turn on the head because it gets really cold (since they don't have anybody living under them who turns on the heat), the heating system is rigged to be on all the time. The constant heating is taking its toll on me health-wise (my blood pressure has gone up because even opening up the windows does very little to make it bearable) as well as financially (the AC and fans are on ALL the time even when it's sub-zero outside). What can I do to rectify this problem once and for all, especially since this is the second winter that I am going to have to soldier through with this ridiculous situation at hand?
I don't really want to leave my studio because I have grown used to it and its close to where I work. I have spoken to the building management countless times, and they always say that the tenants have full control of the system. I spoke to the tenants and they say that although they do turn on the head because it gets really cold (since they don't have anybody living under them who turns on the heat), the heating system is rigged to be on all the time. The constant heating is taking its toll on me health-wise (my blood pressure has gone up because even opening up the windows does very little to make it bearable) as well as financially (the AC and fans are on ALL the time even when it's sub-zero outside). What can I do to rectify this problem once and for all, especially since this is the second winter that I am going to have to soldier through with this ridiculous situation at hand?
This is normalish for an old building. Why are you running the AC though? It doesn't work properly in the winter, so you will spend lots of money on electricity without cooling properly, while potentially damaging your air conditioner. Open your windows and you will be much happier.
posted by mikek at 11:17 PM on November 16, 2015 [6 favorites]
posted by mikek at 11:17 PM on November 16, 2015 [6 favorites]
Well, that's a ridiculous system. Your AC isn't going to be effective or work at all when the temperature outside is cold, so don't bother with it. All you can try is more ventilation, e.g. box fans in the windows.
Unfortunately, the more you cool your place, the more heat will flow from the floor into your apartment (and consequently less into the apartment below) and so, assuming there is some sort of thermostatic control, there will be more and more heat supplied. If you really can't get your apartment down to room temperature with all the windows open in the winter, I'm not sure there is much you can reasonably do, aside from convincing your landlord to make changes to the heating system.
posted by ssg at 11:34 PM on November 16, 2015 [1 favorite]
Unfortunately, the more you cool your place, the more heat will flow from the floor into your apartment (and consequently less into the apartment below) and so, assuming there is some sort of thermostatic control, there will be more and more heat supplied. If you really can't get your apartment down to room temperature with all the windows open in the winter, I'm not sure there is much you can reasonably do, aside from convincing your landlord to make changes to the heating system.
posted by ssg at 11:34 PM on November 16, 2015 [1 favorite]
Maybe ceiling fans in the down stairs unit would help.
posted by Mr. Yuck at 12:44 AM on November 17, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by Mr. Yuck at 12:44 AM on November 17, 2015 [5 favorites]
I lived in a place like this. It SUCKED. I had a gigantic fan(something like this) i would run. One time it was actually blowing snow in on me. It was 85 degrees in my room, and snow was flying on to my face and TV. I felt like i was tripping balls. It was quite similar, in that there were pipes and parts of the wall/floor you literally couldn't touch they were so hot.
What ended up working was getting the strongest window mount fan i could find(it wasn't quite as strong as MegaFan, but it moved some serious air) and putting it in the kitchen window. Then i'd open all the other windows and have that kitchen fan blow out. It would pull cold air in all the other windows.
We would basically leave that fan on all winter. It ran non stop until it exploded, but it lasted several years. The only time i ever turned it off or down was in the spring when it wasn't hot enough to need a fan yet anyways but the heat was off.
It worked, though. I don't think i remember actually closing my windows more than a couple times in the winter however.
If you just have fans trying to push air in, you're probably not doing much. You want a fan drawing the hot air out, and pulling cold air in. I'd maybe even look in to buying something like an attic/whole house fan. This one will do almost 4000 CFM, and 170 watts is a hell of a lot less than even 1/3rd of an AC. I bet it'll make way more of a difference than an AC would.
On preview, i saw you're in a studio. If you have more than one window(especially if they're on more than one face of the building) that thing will make your apartment whatever temperature it is outside.
Lets say your studio is 650 square feet with 8 foot ceilings. With a that fan, you're getting 100% fresh air in less than two minutes. If you're not freezing your ass off in 10 minutes i'd be shocked. With my old window fan on "super"(which we almost never switched it to) you COULD make it ~60 degrees in there from the 90 it would get. The noise was almost unbearable, but you could run it down to that temp then set it to medium and it would stay between 68-75 unless you closed too many windows.
posted by emptythought at 12:48 AM on November 17, 2015 [9 favorites]
What ended up working was getting the strongest window mount fan i could find(it wasn't quite as strong as MegaFan, but it moved some serious air) and putting it in the kitchen window. Then i'd open all the other windows and have that kitchen fan blow out. It would pull cold air in all the other windows.
We would basically leave that fan on all winter. It ran non stop until it exploded, but it lasted several years. The only time i ever turned it off or down was in the spring when it wasn't hot enough to need a fan yet anyways but the heat was off.
It worked, though. I don't think i remember actually closing my windows more than a couple times in the winter however.
If you just have fans trying to push air in, you're probably not doing much. You want a fan drawing the hot air out, and pulling cold air in. I'd maybe even look in to buying something like an attic/whole house fan. This one will do almost 4000 CFM, and 170 watts is a hell of a lot less than even 1/3rd of an AC. I bet it'll make way more of a difference than an AC would.
On preview, i saw you're in a studio. If you have more than one window(especially if they're on more than one face of the building) that thing will make your apartment whatever temperature it is outside.
Lets say your studio is 650 square feet with 8 foot ceilings. With a that fan, you're getting 100% fresh air in less than two minutes. If you're not freezing your ass off in 10 minutes i'd be shocked. With my old window fan on "super"(which we almost never switched it to) you COULD make it ~60 degrees in there from the 90 it would get. The noise was almost unbearable, but you could run it down to that temp then set it to medium and it would stay between 68-75 unless you closed too many windows.
posted by emptythought at 12:48 AM on November 17, 2015 [9 favorites]
You can't. You can't. You've done all you can do. You've gone to management. You've gone to the downstairs tenants. No one is willing to do anything.
It's bad luck. You're going to have to either keep the AC and the fans on all the time and that's the new normal, or you're going to have to look for another place.
I, too, lived in a situation like yours. I was right over the boiler. It was 80 degrees in my bedroom in the middle of winter. Lucky for me, my husband and I moved in together. But it was hot in there. Hot.
posted by Piedmont_Americana at 4:48 AM on November 17, 2015 [1 favorite]
It's bad luck. You're going to have to either keep the AC and the fans on all the time and that's the new normal, or you're going to have to look for another place.
I, too, lived in a situation like yours. I was right over the boiler. It was 80 degrees in my bedroom in the middle of winter. Lucky for me, my husband and I moved in together. But it was hot in there. Hot.
posted by Piedmont_Americana at 4:48 AM on November 17, 2015 [1 favorite]
I lived on the top floor of a house with radiant heat when I first moved to ottawa. We kept the windows open all winter long.
posted by betsybetsy at 5:30 AM on November 17, 2015
posted by betsybetsy at 5:30 AM on November 17, 2015
Depending on budget, you might put down carpeting. If you want to go really all-out, put down a radiant barrier underneath the carpet. Reflect and insulate. (I have not actually faced such a problem).
posted by jon1270 at 6:04 AM on November 17, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by jon1270 at 6:04 AM on November 17, 2015 [1 favorite]
- Get emergency blankets and put them down under area rugs to reflect heat back down.
- Yep. Downstairs needs ceiling fans to force hot air off of the ceiling.
- You need to keep the windows open and blow air as emptythought describes.
Or, you might need to move. Good luck.
posted by jbenben at 6:12 AM on November 17, 2015 [2 favorites]
- Yep. Downstairs needs ceiling fans to force hot air off of the ceiling.
- You need to keep the windows open and blow air as emptythought describes.
Or, you might need to move. Good luck.
posted by jbenben at 6:12 AM on November 17, 2015 [2 favorites]
Thick insulating rugs with underlay.
Don't use air conditioning it's a waste in winter, you need to ventilate the rooms by opening windows, with a fan to pull air in, and another one open for a cross breeze.
posted by wwax at 7:16 AM on November 17, 2015
Don't use air conditioning it's a waste in winter, you need to ventilate the rooms by opening windows, with a fan to pull air in, and another one open for a cross breeze.
posted by wwax at 7:16 AM on November 17, 2015
Can you get the building to turn on the heat in the unit below your downstairs neighbors?
posted by rmless at 8:41 AM on November 17, 2015
posted by rmless at 8:41 AM on November 17, 2015
Switching units is a great idea. So is getting management to turn on the heat under them, if possible.
There is a nuclear option, if moving isn't something you'll do: in Ontario, it's possible to file for someone else in the building to be evicted if they are interfering with your reasonable enjoyment of the unit. More generally, going to the Landlord & Tenant Board might provide you with a big enough stick to threaten both management and downstairs tenants into doing something about this stupid situation.
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 9:35 AM on November 17, 2015 [2 favorites]
There is a nuclear option, if moving isn't something you'll do: in Ontario, it's possible to file for someone else in the building to be evicted if they are interfering with your reasonable enjoyment of the unit. More generally, going to the Landlord & Tenant Board might provide you with a big enough stick to threaten both management and downstairs tenants into doing something about this stupid situation.
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 9:35 AM on November 17, 2015 [2 favorites]
I think this is just a function of older buildings that rely on pipes/radiators for heat. I lived in a place in Winnipeg like this. Our solution was to keep windows open and not wear a lot of clothes during the winter.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 9:55 AM on November 17, 2015
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 9:55 AM on November 17, 2015
I haven't lived in a big building, so haven't dealt with this personally. But here are some links:
Landlord responsibilities (written for landlords but good info in there, in particular [citing a legal case] - "In this case a number of tenants filed an application against the landlord for general poor level of maintenance throughout the complex. Despite the claims of the landlord who argued that the tenants where responsible for the poor conditions, the judge still found that the landlord is responsible for keeping the apartment unit or complex in a good state of repair and fit for habituation. In this case the tenants were awarded an abatement of rent."
and "If the tenant(s) feels there is a breach of the landlord’s responsibility for maintenance, the tenant may file a T6 application ($45.00) at the Landlord and Tenant Board. The landlord may appear before the Board and may be consequenced through a fine, abatement of rent, termination of tenancy or any other order that the Board considers appropriate"
Maybe find out if other tenants have the same issue?
FAQ from the city on what to do about property standards not being met
Info on that T6 application (here too, pdf).
(Probably, it'd be quicker and easier to switch apartments or find another one in the area.)
posted by cotton dress sock at 10:26 AM on November 17, 2015
Landlord responsibilities (written for landlords but good info in there, in particular [citing a legal case] - "In this case a number of tenants filed an application against the landlord for general poor level of maintenance throughout the complex. Despite the claims of the landlord who argued that the tenants where responsible for the poor conditions, the judge still found that the landlord is responsible for keeping the apartment unit or complex in a good state of repair and fit for habituation. In this case the tenants were awarded an abatement of rent."
and "If the tenant(s) feels there is a breach of the landlord’s responsibility for maintenance, the tenant may file a T6 application ($45.00) at the Landlord and Tenant Board. The landlord may appear before the Board and may be consequenced through a fine, abatement of rent, termination of tenancy or any other order that the Board considers appropriate"
Maybe find out if other tenants have the same issue?
FAQ from the city on what to do about property standards not being met
Info on that T6 application (here too, pdf).
(Probably, it'd be quicker and easier to switch apartments or find another one in the area.)
posted by cotton dress sock at 10:26 AM on November 17, 2015
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by gt2 at 10:27 PM on November 16, 2015 [6 favorites]