"I think its my brain, talking to me."
October 30, 2015 11:17 PM   Subscribe

My nine year old son recently told his teacher that he sometimes hears a voice talking to him. Now what?

So, yes, freaking out slightly. I want to note first and foremost that he already sees a pediatric developmental specialist and I have let her office know. She is on vacation this week, and since he doesn't have any "emergent" symptoms his office has advised to watch and wait until she gets back.

- He's nine.
- He's on the autism spectrum, and also takes methylphenidate to help him stay on-task at school.
- He says this has happened "as long as he can remember" so it doesn't seem to be a side effect of the meds, which only started last year.
- He says "It's not my voice, it sounds completely different and I can't quite understand it" (quoting the teacher's email to me.)
- He seems to accept it as a normal part of his life, and it only came up because I think he started to ask his teacher if she'd said something and then stopped, realizing she had not.
- In talking with him last night, he gave me some examples of when he hears "the noise" and in every example he gave me, he was in a crowded, loud place (the supermarket, the school gym).
- He is otherwise his normal, happy, loving self.

What now? Are there any explanations for this that don't seem terrible? What can we expect in terms of doctors and diagnostics and the process that we're facing?
posted by anonymous to Health & Fitness (19 answers total) 3 users marked this as a favorite
 
Are there any explanations for this that don't seem terrible?

Brains are really good at seeing patterns, and can often misinterpret random noise as meaningful signal (seeing faces in everything, for example.) Many (most?) people will sometimes mistakenly hear voices, ringing phones, crying babies, police sirens etc. in random noise and as long as they're able to recognize that the voice (or whatever it is) was just an artifact of their hearing and not an actual outside entity communicating with them, it's not necessarily a cause for concern. ("I think it's my brain talking to me" would actually a be pretty accurate and sophisticated interpretation of this effect.) It's entirely possible your son is just getting these normal auditory artifacts, and some combination of his autism-inflected affect and his nine-year-old naiveté about the stigma around "hearing voices" is making his description of his experience sound like something less ordinary than it is.

The fact that he experiences it as a "voice" but can't understand what it's saying makes me think this is likely what's going on: he hears some random sounds, the bits of of his brain that recognize and interpret speech light up erroneously and try to parse the sounds as speech but can't, he feels like somebody just said something but he couldn't make it out.

Not to say that there couldn't be a real problem here or that it's not worth following up with his doctor, but there's no reason to interpret this revelation as a certain omen of something terrible.
posted by contraption at 11:49 PM on October 30, 2015 [23 favorites]


Definitely follow up with the Doctor, and work to encourage your child to feel safe in telling you about it, especially if it gets worse or says more troubling things. You want him to be able to come to you as it changes and know you can help him with it instead of being afraid to admit to it.

That being said, here's two things to reassure you: 1. Schizophrenia symptoms develop in late teens/early adulthood usually, so don't automatically jump to that conclusion. 2. I had a niece with cerebral palsy that also gave her a seizure disorder. She knew she was having seizure activity in her brain before any physical symptoms emerged because she would see bunny rabbits that in reality didn't exist. That was our cue to address either her stress level or her meds before things got worse. So...if he is not neuro typical this just may be his brain's way of dealing with overloaded circuits. A med change may be necessary, or it may be a watch and see approach.
posted by MultiFaceted at 12:01 AM on October 31, 2015 [4 favorites]


One thing I'm thinking of is maybe some sort of auditory processing disorder?

I have APD related to my ADHD and possible Autism, and my brain has turned random sounds into voice-like sounds quite often. When I'm in a silent room and am talking to one or two people in there? I can hear perfectly. The more people involved and the more background noise involved, the harder it is for me to make out distinct sounds and understand what is being said. If there's too much, the auditory gets overwhelmed, and just loses the capacity to make out *anything* it seems. It's like this: 'Brain hears Sound A, there's also Background Noise also with Sound A, the Background Noise masks Sound A, so Brain gets tired, fills in the gaps, and decides it's Sound B instead'.

As an example: Once, I was on a crowded city bus, and it sounded like everyone was speaking in oddly inflected Swedish. However, the bus and I? We were in Seattle. No actual Swedish was being spoken.
posted by spinifex23 at 12:13 AM on October 31, 2015 [10 favorites]


There's such a stigma about "hearing voices" but there seems to be slowly more and more evidence accumulating that a lot of people with psychologically healthy and functioning lives also hear voices, and that it might not necessarily be a negative symptom. (one of the first links, a general overview with a TED talk).

The biggest red flag is if the voices are cruel, negative or persecuting him. If they're gibberish or friendly, it seems mostly benign, but this is all something his doctor will have to explore with him. Schizophrenia is rare in a young child and usually has more associated (negative) symptoms though, not just a single benign voice.

I have brain things going on sporadically due to medical weirdness, and have experienced temporary sensory effects - the Alice in Wonderland syndrome recently was hilarious because I knew it was likely to be temporary, but I've also got the memory of being about your son's age and having what in hindsight were likely neurological symptoms from migraines. Some of those are awful because they were linked to surviving an abusive childhood and nightmarish, but some of those memories are my favourite childhood memories remaining because they were almost literally like experiencing magic. The voices or sensory weirdness or whatever wasn't upsetting but simply - what it was. If your son is loved and loving and happy, and his doctors can rule it out as a symptom of something emerging to worry about, it's neutral. It's just his brain being a little quirky in another new way.

It's really really wonderful that he talks to you about this and understands himself so well already - you're ahead of the curve and doing awesome parenting already for him to be comfortable with his brain.

You will want to test the waters carefully with his doctors and teachers to find out if they are going to back you and him up with this or if he will need to learn to Not Talk About This Stuff at school or with other people to navigate it. That's going to depend heavily on what this turns out to be and how your local community and family feel about neuro-atypical kids.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 12:44 AM on October 31, 2015 [12 favorites]


- He says this has happened "as long as he can remember" so it doesn't seem to be a side effect of the meds, which only started last year.

This may or may not be entirely accurate. He may have just gotten used to this effect after some event (the medication? maybe it's an auditory discrimination problem that emerged after something non-neural, like an ear infection?) and forgotten what things were like before.
posted by cotton dress sock at 12:47 AM on October 31, 2015 [1 favorite]


Imaginary friends are a pretty normal experience of childhood, and sometimes last well into elementary school... Maybe in the past they just were never really investigated and diagnosed beyond the stories told about them.
posted by mdn at 1:24 AM on October 31, 2015 [2 favorites]


Up late and saw this and had to respond. There is actually some fascinating research being carried out by various researchers, from neurologists to classical psychiatrists to audiologists. More on that in a minute. First, IANYD and this is only discussion for educational purposes.

It's been said in many ways by many neurologists, but it goes something like this:

Q: How much have we really learned about the brain in the past couple of decades?

A: The more we have learned about the brain, the clearer it is that we understand it less.


This above is absolutely true. There has been so much data collected using new technology, new methods of research, collaboration, global mining of neurology research, so much data. What do we do with it? The more it's looked at the more it contradicts everything we thought we knew about the brain.

The philosophy/science divide on this issue has lessened though. Many neurologists now accept that the brain is not necessarily the same as the "mind." It's been said a big-city coroner once said, "I've performed a lot of autopsies and I've never once laid eyes on a mind." This is important because we are using "the brain" in this discussion as another term for what your nine year-old son is actually experiencing - hearing voices in his conscious mind. It's all a part of the "hard problem of consciousness."

The chances of this being a symptom of a serious mental disorder is fairly small. Especially with children. "Hearing voices," many times translates into something very different under closer questioning and examination. It's believed by many that young people, under worry and stress, experience "white noise," in order to deal with their emotions. This often comes through to the child's mind as "voices," but they cannot tell you what they are saying (as in the case with your son).

I would check with your PDS first and possibly seek referrals to an audiologist and a neurologist. Tests can be run that will help determine if this is a medical disorder, an auditory anomaly, a mental issue, or -- a simple coping mechanism that needs no diagnosis.

As much as the brain is fascinating, the mind is what we experience the world with. Whatever we "wake-up" to, that allows us to make sense of the world, is clearly the biggest scientific mystery in all of science. So, finding THE answer for your son may be extremely difficult unless it is a clear medical issue found through examination and imaging.

Some resources that will lead you to a lot of interesting discussion of research on this topic:
Intervoice
Hearing Voices Network of Wales
The Hearing Voices Network

A good article from popular media that might give you some comfort.

Best of luck to you and your son.
posted by Gerard Sorme at 1:24 AM on October 31, 2015 [13 favorites]


The most clinically relevant piece of diagnostic information in your story is this: He is otherwise his normal, happy, loving self.

You have described a symptom, and like all symptoms they need to be put in context. It takes more than a hallucination in and of itself to make a diagnosis, and that is where context comes in. Serious psychiatric diagnoses do not tend to stick to people that are acting normally and happily.
posted by chiquitita at 1:44 AM on October 31, 2015 [1 favorite]


I've worked with kids on the spectrum for a long time and this has happened with four boys in my career. Their parents were terrified.

First have his ears checked. There may be fluid buildup or they're waxy in the canals and his hearing is off. If his ears are fine, then it's off to an audiologist, ideally one who works with spectrumy kids, who can determine if there's an auditory processing disorder.

All of the four boys who heard voices that I worked with were also on the spectrum, and of them, one just had an ear infection and the other three ended up having APD. Now that I think about it, all four kids were in the second grade when they reported hearing voices, so they were between 8 and 9.

There is a noted correlation between autism and APD, this from the Autism Research Institute:

"Eric Courchesne, Ph.D., of the Neurosciences Department, University of California at San Diego, has found significant impairments in auditory processing in autistic individuals using P300 brain wave technology...

We do not know the underlying reason for auditory processing problems in autism, but we have an idea; autopsy research by Drs. Bauman and Kemper have shown that an area in the limbic system, the hippocampus, is neurologically immature in autistic individuals (Bauman & Kemper, 1994). The hippocampus is responsible for sensory input as well as learning and memory.

In simple terms, information is transferred from the senses to the hippocampus, where it is processed and then transferred to areas of the cerebral cortex for long-term storage. Since auditory information is processed in the hippocampus, in people with autism the information may not be properly transferred to long-term memory.


And by the examples that he hears things when he's in LOUD places with lots of voices where his brain is struggling to make sense of things, I'd bet it's very likely this is auditory processing. His hippocampus is possibly less developed, he's only 9, and his ability to filter and process sensory information is working overtime. I would think that loud places really confuse his brain. (As a side question, does he get exhausted or cranky in these situations or need a nap afterwards? I bet so, right? Now you know why.)

The good news is there is a lot of awesome Auditory Integration Training which will help your son's brain learn to discriminate sounds.
posted by kinetic at 3:40 AM on October 31, 2015 [15 favorites]


If he says he can't quite understand it, it could be something like tinnitus that he is misinterpreting as a voice. I get tinnitus and sometimes I briefly think it is someone speaking in a muffled way nearby before I realise that no, the sound is coming from inside my head.
posted by lollusc at 4:20 AM on October 31, 2015 [2 favorites]


IANYD (and not a psychiatrist). This is a fairly common thing in kids and definitely doesn't necessarily mean anything scary or bad. Some phrases to search on would be "self talk" or "inner speech" - a lot of times, from what I understand, kids hearing voices turns out to be "self talk" rather than a manifestation of psychosis. This article might help reassure you.

"In children, hallucinations are not always a sign of psychosis
Although hallucinations frequently are considered synonymous with psychotic disorders, in children this is rare. Neurobiologic studies (fMRI) of adults show activation of Broca’s area (left inferior frontal gyrus) seconds before patients perceive auditory verbal hallucinations, which suggests that auditory hallucinations may be misidentified self-talk.a,b ...

Imaginary friends or companions are common among all children. Children who have imaginary friends are more likely to report hearing “voices.”f Imaginary friends:
appear, function, and disappear at the wish of the child
pose no threat and often are a source of comfort
often can be described in detail
are not ego-dystonic.g
Also, children with imaginary friends will not show evidence of a thought disorder."
posted by treehorn+bunny at 6:39 AM on October 31, 2015 [2 favorites]


And in terms of what to expect, I would expect his psychiatrist to ask him a variety of questions to find out more about the voices (whose voices, what they say, positive or negative, etc). Depending on the answers to those questions, no further diagnostics may be necessary.
posted by treehorn+bunny at 6:41 AM on October 31, 2015


I occasionally experience background noise as voices, like a radio in the next room, with the volume too low to hear the words.
posted by Bruce H. at 7:15 AM on October 31, 2015 [1 favorite]


Plural of anecdotes isn't data, but I had occasional but persistent auditory hallucinations as a kid (different from what your son is describing - usually when I was alone), and a lot of people I've discussed them with had some personal experience with sensory hallucinations in childhood as well - so in my admittedly limited experience, they aren't a harbinger of terrible things in kids per se. I grew out of the (kind of creepy) hallucinations but kept the mild tinnitus.
posted by deludingmyself at 7:34 AM on October 31, 2015 [1 favorite]


Here's a prior metafilter question, wherein the answers are "auditory hallucinations are more common than you'd think" and "talk with your doctor, of course, but as long as they're not menacing, it's not an emergency." This does not sound like a big deal, and while I'm sure your pede will want to investigate it, I'm equally sure the results will be reassuring.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 10:25 AM on October 31, 2015


I am very much not a doctor, but I wanted to mention something related to treehorn+bunny's point that may or may not be helpful. Hope this isn't too far afield from the question. I have ASD and all my life I've heard my thoughts as inner speech. How auditory it is comes and goes, but I don't ever confuse it with real voices, and it reflects my actual thoughts, nothing foreign. It's kind of a "hollow" voice if that makes sense, lacking the depth and pitch of a real one.

I don't know if this is normal or not, whatever that means, but when I started a job where I worked often with people who were homeless and had schizophrenia or symptoms of psychosis, I got a little freaked out because the upset stressed-out running thoughts they would voice resembled my own inner monologue when I'm deeply depressed, haranguing me and calling me names. At first I was like, "oh no! I have undiagnosed mental illnesses!" but ultimately I figured out that it wasn't that I am somehow more ill than I first imagined, but that the schizophrenic folks were not as different from me as I had thought. They may vocalize more of what other people keep in their heads, but the content is not necessarily that different, and the pain of depression is what's scary, not the thought disorder.

What your son experiences sounds more like an auditory processing thing than what I am talking about, but my point is that while it's important to pay attention to brain weirdness like this and you are right to be investigating it, also remember that your son is loved and supported and has good teachers and parent(s), and however goofy and out-of-the-norm his brain might act, that's what's really important.
posted by thetortoise at 1:28 PM on October 31, 2015 [1 favorite]


I have Auditory Processing Disorder from multiple childhood ear infections and the resultant nerve damage. I've misheard random noises as voices saying random words for as long as I can remember. Definitely, investigate further and follow up, but I wouldn't panic just yet.
posted by culfinglin at 2:00 PM on October 31, 2015 [1 favorite]


Here is another MetaFilter question I posted a few years ago about hearing actual, distinct "not-me" voices. There are some fascinating examples of perfectly healthy people having these experiences. On the other hand, the person I posted about, who had voices or "entities" in their head since middle school went on to develop problems with these voices to point that they now needs to medicate them away or they will develop into a problem. So, don't ignore it but there are lots of reasons not to panic.
posted by metahawk at 3:07 PM on October 31, 2015


Just stopped by to offer supportful noises and am happy to see that others have delivered the same, sane message: it's not as rare or as alarming as once thought. Be of good cheer and continue monitoring.
posted by cleroy at 3:30 PM on November 1, 2015 [1 favorite]


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