The Waiting Phase?
October 1, 2015 10:40 PM Subscribe
Can my virginity be scaring my love interest away?
I am currently seeing someone that I really like but I also happen to be really insecure - I'm also slightly scared that me being a virgin is scaring him away. He says he wants to take it slow but is that code for him wanting to fade me out? Any advice/relevant anecdotes for getting through it?
I've been following this site for some time now but this is my first post. Sorry if this is long but I need some advice and other perspectives on my situation.
So me (25) and this guy (30) are studying to become therapists. We had a class together in the spring but we only exchanged a few words. In the summer, we started to get to know each other by hanging out at a cafe with a mutual friend. He revealed to me that he felt isolated (he's from the east coast, we are in CA) and so we exchanged numbers. Since then, we had texted just about everyday and hung out from time to time.
After a month of talking and hanging out, I came over to his place for the first time. That night we started kissing and getting physical. I was freaking out because I had to tell him I was a virgin (not saving it for marriage btw) and I thought he would lose interest in me. He didn't. He has been really understanding. He's always saying things like "take your time, we'll go as far as you want to go, whatever you're comfortable with, etc." We told each other that we liked each other but he also said "he didn't know how he felt about being in a relationship" at the moment - which to me says - I don't want to commit. And I told him that was fair. A week later, I slept over a second night, we didn't go all the way but we had a good time. The next morning we went to a baseball game and enjoyed ourselves.
About a week after that, I wanted to try and go all the way but it hurt so we stopped. We did other things - he was satisfied if you catch my drift. However, after that I felt slightly disconnected from him. We weren't texting and flirting as much but he's an introvert and I'm an extrovert so i figured we needed some space from each other (and I didn't want to appear needy or clingy). He would still initiate conversation and hang out with me so I figured I was being irrational anyway. He eventually revealed to me that he was struggling with depression and then I reasoned that must be partly why I sensed a disconnect.
Recently, he went to the east coast for 3 weeks. And I had to help my brother move to the south for a week - so we were apart for a month. We still texted each other while we were away. Of course not very frequently but we would both ask each other specific questions about our trips. When I got back, we hung out and we had a good talk. At first he said: "I didn't know how you felt about me being first (in regards to my virginity) when I wasn't sure how i felt about being in a relationship." he also said, "I like you, i like hanging out with you, i think our humor is compatible but I want to take it slow." He explained that he's jumped into relationships too soon in the past and he learned things about people 6 months into a relationship he wish he knew earlier. It didn't seem like he wanted to be just friends even though the topic came up. I said "If you were to tell me right now that you wanted to be just friends, I wouldn't be heart broken. I would be disappointed but not heartbroken. But, if this does go any further then I am going to get invested." And he said "okay"- like he understood where i was coming from - not an okay like "this should be over." He could have said in that moment "well it's probably better that we just stay friends" but he didn't. So I felt good about our talk. We fooled around and then we went out to play billiards and that was enjoyable then too.
A few days later (a week ago) we had class together and it was awkward. Very awkward. He even avoided me a bit. I didn't know if this was just normal awkwardness that comes from having seen each other naked. But I spoke to him casually after class ("hey how was that game last night?") and things seemed fine. He basically walked me to my car. And a few days later, a Friday night to be exact, he texted me asking me how the rest of my classes were. And just this week I asked him out for coffee before class and he agreed. And I also think that went fine. We don't sit together in class but I think he prefers it that way given the nature of our classes (we have to reveal some personal information to our partners at times - which would go against taking it slow).
*************
But that's the whole story. Now I'm scared that he brought up the "taking it slow" because he actually wants to fade me out, I'm also wondering if me being a virgin has scared him. Obviously he did not go into this wanting to commit to a relationship and I'm sure me being a virgin has changed some things. I'm thinking that now he's had a chance to think about it and he might be reconsidering dating me.
I'm also really insecure and I keep going back and forth wondering if this guy likes me or not. I feel like he's being genuine. I don't think he's trying to play with me but I am a little scared that he's losing interest. I just don't really know how to proceed. I want to text him but i don't know how often. I had no problems initiating in the past but I sense that things are different. He obviously doesn't text me as frequently but there are so many factors : he's introvert, depressed, taking it slow, scared, maybe disinterested as well. I don't want to be too much which could be why he wanted to take it slow. But I also want to be able to check up on him and his depression.
So should I just take his word for it that he actually likes me and just wait this out? How long? I just don't know if I'm strong enough to do so.
I've been following this site for some time now but this is my first post. Sorry if this is long but I need some advice and other perspectives on my situation.
So me (25) and this guy (30) are studying to become therapists. We had a class together in the spring but we only exchanged a few words. In the summer, we started to get to know each other by hanging out at a cafe with a mutual friend. He revealed to me that he felt isolated (he's from the east coast, we are in CA) and so we exchanged numbers. Since then, we had texted just about everyday and hung out from time to time.
After a month of talking and hanging out, I came over to his place for the first time. That night we started kissing and getting physical. I was freaking out because I had to tell him I was a virgin (not saving it for marriage btw) and I thought he would lose interest in me. He didn't. He has been really understanding. He's always saying things like "take your time, we'll go as far as you want to go, whatever you're comfortable with, etc." We told each other that we liked each other but he also said "he didn't know how he felt about being in a relationship" at the moment - which to me says - I don't want to commit. And I told him that was fair. A week later, I slept over a second night, we didn't go all the way but we had a good time. The next morning we went to a baseball game and enjoyed ourselves.
About a week after that, I wanted to try and go all the way but it hurt so we stopped. We did other things - he was satisfied if you catch my drift. However, after that I felt slightly disconnected from him. We weren't texting and flirting as much but he's an introvert and I'm an extrovert so i figured we needed some space from each other (and I didn't want to appear needy or clingy). He would still initiate conversation and hang out with me so I figured I was being irrational anyway. He eventually revealed to me that he was struggling with depression and then I reasoned that must be partly why I sensed a disconnect.
Recently, he went to the east coast for 3 weeks. And I had to help my brother move to the south for a week - so we were apart for a month. We still texted each other while we were away. Of course not very frequently but we would both ask each other specific questions about our trips. When I got back, we hung out and we had a good talk. At first he said: "I didn't know how you felt about me being first (in regards to my virginity) when I wasn't sure how i felt about being in a relationship." he also said, "I like you, i like hanging out with you, i think our humor is compatible but I want to take it slow." He explained that he's jumped into relationships too soon in the past and he learned things about people 6 months into a relationship he wish he knew earlier. It didn't seem like he wanted to be just friends even though the topic came up. I said "If you were to tell me right now that you wanted to be just friends, I wouldn't be heart broken. I would be disappointed but not heartbroken. But, if this does go any further then I am going to get invested." And he said "okay"- like he understood where i was coming from - not an okay like "this should be over." He could have said in that moment "well it's probably better that we just stay friends" but he didn't. So I felt good about our talk. We fooled around and then we went out to play billiards and that was enjoyable then too.
A few days later (a week ago) we had class together and it was awkward. Very awkward. He even avoided me a bit. I didn't know if this was just normal awkwardness that comes from having seen each other naked. But I spoke to him casually after class ("hey how was that game last night?") and things seemed fine. He basically walked me to my car. And a few days later, a Friday night to be exact, he texted me asking me how the rest of my classes were. And just this week I asked him out for coffee before class and he agreed. And I also think that went fine. We don't sit together in class but I think he prefers it that way given the nature of our classes (we have to reveal some personal information to our partners at times - which would go against taking it slow).
*************
But that's the whole story. Now I'm scared that he brought up the "taking it slow" because he actually wants to fade me out, I'm also wondering if me being a virgin has scared him. Obviously he did not go into this wanting to commit to a relationship and I'm sure me being a virgin has changed some things. I'm thinking that now he's had a chance to think about it and he might be reconsidering dating me.
I'm also really insecure and I keep going back and forth wondering if this guy likes me or not. I feel like he's being genuine. I don't think he's trying to play with me but I am a little scared that he's losing interest. I just don't really know how to proceed. I want to text him but i don't know how often. I had no problems initiating in the past but I sense that things are different. He obviously doesn't text me as frequently but there are so many factors : he's introvert, depressed, taking it slow, scared, maybe disinterested as well. I don't want to be too much which could be why he wanted to take it slow. But I also want to be able to check up on him and his depression.
So should I just take his word for it that he actually likes me and just wait this out? How long? I just don't know if I'm strong enough to do so.
Ok, first impressions on reading your story, regardless of the virginity part, this sounds like a dating/budding relationship situation that is already way too much laden with anxieties and worries, and I personally think based on experience that those worries you feel have nothing whatsoever to do with your virginity as if it was something you were to be embarrassed about, or some sort of hindrance justifying the behaviour of the guy in question - this could happen to you at 40 after an accumulated lifetime of sex partners, you could still run into this kind of situation where the guy is telling you the typical "oh I like you but I’m not sure I want to be in a relationship", as a kind of warning, so it’s all on your shoulders and he cannot feel blame later if you two carry on and then he just changes his mind and pulls back and loses interest and leaves you hanging there after having spent more time together.
The main question is not whether he likes your or not, or what kind of issues he may have with your virginity - and those would be his problem, not yours - the main question you need to ask yourself is more like: do you want to be in a non-relationship relationship with a guy who acts contradictory and pulls back already at the start and gives you all these worries and awkward moments? Do you want to keep dating someone when you're already worrying he may be "reconsidering" dating you and gives the impression of being disinterested?
The very fact you’re getting these feelings from him is a sign your own needs are not being met here.
So, maybe try and stop worrying about how he feels and what he really really means, and try and figure out better what bothers you and what you want and don’t want from someone, what kind of relationship you’d be comfortable and happier with - it doesn’t sound like you’re very comfortable or happy here - and put yourself and your needs first, because no one else will do it for you. You deserve better, be it "a first" or not.
posted by bitteschoen at 11:37 PM on October 1, 2015 [10 favorites]
The main question is not whether he likes your or not, or what kind of issues he may have with your virginity - and those would be his problem, not yours - the main question you need to ask yourself is more like: do you want to be in a non-relationship relationship with a guy who acts contradictory and pulls back already at the start and gives you all these worries and awkward moments? Do you want to keep dating someone when you're already worrying he may be "reconsidering" dating you and gives the impression of being disinterested?
The very fact you’re getting these feelings from him is a sign your own needs are not being met here.
So, maybe try and stop worrying about how he feels and what he really really means, and try and figure out better what bothers you and what you want and don’t want from someone, what kind of relationship you’d be comfortable and happier with - it doesn’t sound like you’re very comfortable or happy here - and put yourself and your needs first, because no one else will do it for you. You deserve better, be it "a first" or not.
posted by bitteschoen at 11:37 PM on October 1, 2015 [10 favorites]
I don't think this has anything to do with your virginity necessarily, you've just unfortunately met a guy who is iffy about being in a relationship with you but is probably not going to man up and say as much. I think its time to fall back and look into dating other people. Sorry :(
posted by skjønn at 11:43 PM on October 1, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by skjønn at 11:43 PM on October 1, 2015 [4 favorites]
Best dating advice I ever heard: anytime someone says the words "right now" cross those words out in your head and replace them with "with you."
"I'm not looking to get into a relationship right now"="I'm not looking to get into a relationship with you."
posted by skjønn at 11:45 PM on October 1, 2015 [36 favorites]
"I'm not looking to get into a relationship right now"="I'm not looking to get into a relationship with you."
posted by skjønn at 11:45 PM on October 1, 2015 [36 favorites]
Also, this - "I just don't really know how to proceed. I want to text him but i don't know how often…He obviously doesn't text me as frequently" - whenever I’ve been in this situation or heard this from friends (and heard this a lot), it didn’t turn out to be a good sign, it rarely proceeded to better communication from there... when you meet someone whose interest in you is clear and strong, as clear and strong as yours in him, you will feel no such confusion or insecurity, or, it will fade quickly, because he will not give you so many contradictory signals and the impression of disinterest as you’re getting here. And I don’t think those impressions are all stemming from your being insecure as a person. Someone really into you as much as you’re into him will text you with the exact same spontaneous frequency you’ll both feel comfortable with, it will all happen more naturally and without all these worries, even if he’s depressed and you’re insecure. When you both feel interest for each other and are a good enough match as personalities, it won’t be this difficult and make you worry so much, regardless of respective hangups.
posted by bitteschoen at 11:46 PM on October 1, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by bitteschoen at 11:46 PM on October 1, 2015 [5 favorites]
Yep. Toss this one back.
By the way... This guy is giving you info about being depressed, and you just kinda bounced over that. Either he's making up an excuse not to get close, or he really is depressed. The result is the same: This guy is not dating material.
He told you what was going on, but you did not hear him.
Please please don't try to "fix" him, OK? The message was that he is not available to date, not that he would be available to date "if only...." There is no "if only" here. He is not able to date you.
PS - You did great! Next time, worry more about having your needs met, less about appearing "clingy" since that is just some bullshit popularized to get you to sublimate your needs for someone else's. It should be mutual, or not at all.
Good luck!
posted by jbenben at 12:13 AM on October 2, 2015 [15 favorites]
By the way... This guy is giving you info about being depressed, and you just kinda bounced over that. Either he's making up an excuse not to get close, or he really is depressed. The result is the same: This guy is not dating material.
He told you what was going on, but you did not hear him.
Please please don't try to "fix" him, OK? The message was that he is not available to date, not that he would be available to date "if only...." There is no "if only" here. He is not able to date you.
PS - You did great! Next time, worry more about having your needs met, less about appearing "clingy" since that is just some bullshit popularized to get you to sublimate your needs for someone else's. It should be mutual, or not at all.
Good luck!
posted by jbenben at 12:13 AM on October 2, 2015 [15 favorites]
I don't have enough information to say if it's definitely about your virginity. It's possible, of course, that it's a factor, but without him being completely candid, who knows?
What is more important is that, regardless of why he's doing it, he's not really invested in any kind of relationship with you at this point other than casual. Unless you're willing to invest time in him deciding (and that may very well still end up in a "I don't want to be with you" answer), then you really should move on as kindly as you can.
I think the true killer of your connection was the 3 weeks he was away. Such a trip so early is deadly to so many budding relationships.
I wish you all the best.
posted by inturnaround at 12:18 AM on October 2, 2015
What is more important is that, regardless of why he's doing it, he's not really invested in any kind of relationship with you at this point other than casual. Unless you're willing to invest time in him deciding (and that may very well still end up in a "I don't want to be with you" answer), then you really should move on as kindly as you can.
I think the true killer of your connection was the 3 weeks he was away. Such a trip so early is deadly to so many budding relationships.
I wish you all the best.
posted by inturnaround at 12:18 AM on October 2, 2015
Just to address one small point, I can think of a lot of reasons for the in-class awkwardness, but the facts about how far/not far the two of you have gone wouldn't rate in the top ten. The top three might be wanting to keep things kind of professional/formal in a group of future colleagues, wanting it to not come up in connection with the exercises you mention, and, uh, wanting to be viewed as single in a room with other people he could go out with. It's not a red flag, but it looks kind of orange maybe, because all three reasons would involve wanting to keep you at some distance. Maybe something will work out, but I think you should probably prioritize other things and other people.
posted by Monsieur Caution at 12:26 AM on October 2, 2015
posted by Monsieur Caution at 12:26 AM on October 2, 2015
Skjonn has it.
Look for enthusiasm from a partner. Dating shouldn't be an anxiety filled chore.
posted by French Fry at 6:08 AM on October 2, 2015 [4 favorites]
Look for enthusiasm from a partner. Dating shouldn't be an anxiety filled chore.
posted by French Fry at 6:08 AM on October 2, 2015 [4 favorites]
I am a little older than this dude and I am in the early stages of dating with a virgin who is a little older than you and I can tell that it's going to get more serious pretty quickly. I am relatively inexperienced sexually for my age and I've had excellent experiences since the end of my marriage with women who were sex positive and understanding of what they wanted in bed. Especially coming from a marriage where the sex was not very good for a long time, my feelings about dating a virgin are that it's an extra layer of worry that I am nervous about. I don't want my sexual experiences to feel momentous or boundary breaking; I see sexual activity as a basic human need and source of pleasure and I want it to feel casual and low-stress and it hasn't felt that way so far with my new person. She and I really like each other and are really attracted to each other, so I'm willing to work harder on the sex part to get us both into a comfortable, mutually satisfying place. But if I didn't feel that mutual like and attraction, I would move on to someone else-it's definitely more work to put into sex than I want to put in unless everything else is lining up correctly.
I'm not sure how much of that applies to your situation, but that's one man's perspective on dating a virgin. Well, here's a way it might apply: "After a month of talking and hanging out, I came over to his place for the first time. That night we started kissing and getting physical."
For the woman that I'm dating, a month of slow build would be a typical pattern. But for us, it happened after the second date-not because I was pushing for it (I'm not a pushy man in any way), but because we were so attracted to each other that we were having a hard time being in public and needed to go start figuring it out alone together. If I'm going to be dating a virgin, that kind of attraction is the place I want to be coming from. So if I was this guy, I probably would have cut you loose by now, since the attraction isn't where I would need it to be.
posted by Kwine at 7:29 AM on October 2, 2015 [1 favorite]
I'm not sure how much of that applies to your situation, but that's one man's perspective on dating a virgin. Well, here's a way it might apply: "After a month of talking and hanging out, I came over to his place for the first time. That night we started kissing and getting physical."
For the woman that I'm dating, a month of slow build would be a typical pattern. But for us, it happened after the second date-not because I was pushing for it (I'm not a pushy man in any way), but because we were so attracted to each other that we were having a hard time being in public and needed to go start figuring it out alone together. If I'm going to be dating a virgin, that kind of attraction is the place I want to be coming from. So if I was this guy, I probably would have cut you loose by now, since the attraction isn't where I would need it to be.
posted by Kwine at 7:29 AM on October 2, 2015 [1 favorite]
Yeah, lots of men do this all the time. (Probably women do too, but I don't have experience with that, so)
For whatever reason there are guys out there who would rather have their teeth pulled than straight up admit to a woman they aren't really interested. This means you eventually learn to take the fudging as a stronger "no" than it really seems. Anything less than an enthusiastic yes can be slotted to "no" territory. Mixed signals? Not mixed at all, that's a "no" as well. Actions saying no but words saying yes? Gotta trust the actions, every time. That's a "no."
A "yes" will look like enthusiastic words and actions aligned. Anything less is a "no."
posted by quincunx at 7:47 AM on October 2, 2015 [6 favorites]
For whatever reason there are guys out there who would rather have their teeth pulled than straight up admit to a woman they aren't really interested. This means you eventually learn to take the fudging as a stronger "no" than it really seems. Anything less than an enthusiastic yes can be slotted to "no" territory. Mixed signals? Not mixed at all, that's a "no" as well. Actions saying no but words saying yes? Gotta trust the actions, every time. That's a "no."
A "yes" will look like enthusiastic words and actions aligned. Anything less is a "no."
posted by quincunx at 7:47 AM on October 2, 2015 [6 favorites]
It's really, really, really hard to accurately interpret the behavior and language of a partner early on in a relationship.
But it's much easier to know what you like, prefer, need in a relationship; to know what makes you feel attractive, wanted, respected, cared for in a relationship.
I suggest you spend some time reflecting on your needs and wants and then communicating them to this guy. He can either meet them right now, which is great. He can have difficulty meeting them right now, but be totally willing to work on meeting them in the near future, which is also great. Or he cannot meet them now or in a reasonable time frame, which doesn't make him a bad person, just not right for you. Bottom line is a relationship should meet your needs and make you feel good, not anxious and worried all the time.
It is hard to communicate needs. It puts you in a position of vulnerability; you risk rejection of your needs. But it's also the way to achieve a stronger emotional connection with this person. You have to find a way to have these critical conversations if you really want a relationship to flourish.
It's also important to note that your guy also has things he needs to feel wanted, cared for, respected in a relationship and you have to make time and space to listen and understand those and decide if you can meet his needs.
If you can't meet each others needs because of compatibility, timing, depression, other commitments, whatever, then you should let each other go to find partners who can.
posted by brookeb at 8:01 AM on October 2, 2015 [1 favorite]
But it's much easier to know what you like, prefer, need in a relationship; to know what makes you feel attractive, wanted, respected, cared for in a relationship.
I suggest you spend some time reflecting on your needs and wants and then communicating them to this guy. He can either meet them right now, which is great. He can have difficulty meeting them right now, but be totally willing to work on meeting them in the near future, which is also great. Or he cannot meet them now or in a reasonable time frame, which doesn't make him a bad person, just not right for you. Bottom line is a relationship should meet your needs and make you feel good, not anxious and worried all the time.
It is hard to communicate needs. It puts you in a position of vulnerability; you risk rejection of your needs. But it's also the way to achieve a stronger emotional connection with this person. You have to find a way to have these critical conversations if you really want a relationship to flourish.
It's also important to note that your guy also has things he needs to feel wanted, cared for, respected in a relationship and you have to make time and space to listen and understand those and decide if you can meet his needs.
If you can't meet each others needs because of compatibility, timing, depression, other commitments, whatever, then you should let each other go to find partners who can.
posted by brookeb at 8:01 AM on October 2, 2015 [1 favorite]
I would say that virginity is only relevant in that he feels that it puts weight onto the relationship; if he's "the guy you lose your virginity to" then that puts things into a very boyfriend/relationship kind of space, as distinct from more casual sex. If you were not a virgin, and/or if things had gone well when you tried, then you'd be in the "having fun while we see if this goes anyplace" region, which is someplace in the middle, but as things stand, it is basically not possible to have casual sex at this point (because of the weight of the virginity question). As others have said, this is headed into "none of the above".
So. It's not going to be a meaningful love affair relationship. But he'll always mean something to you; in your mental book of milestones, he's "first guy I had almost-sex with" even if it wasn't actual sex. Think about how you want things to go - you can't opt for a relationship with this guy, but if you wanted to push ahead with a less-meaningful physical exploration, that might be an option. This could make your future relationship landscape with other guys easier (not to deal with this first-sex question again) or harder (if your feelings are hurt or this guy negatively affects your feelings about sex). I say this not to encourage you to go off and have sex for the heck of it, but because other posters are focusing on this relationship as its own thing (is he the guy for you to date or not) so I thought I'd bring up the bigger picture, which is also interesting.
posted by aimedwander at 8:03 AM on October 2, 2015 [4 favorites]
So. It's not going to be a meaningful love affair relationship. But he'll always mean something to you; in your mental book of milestones, he's "first guy I had almost-sex with" even if it wasn't actual sex. Think about how you want things to go - you can't opt for a relationship with this guy, but if you wanted to push ahead with a less-meaningful physical exploration, that might be an option. This could make your future relationship landscape with other guys easier (not to deal with this first-sex question again) or harder (if your feelings are hurt or this guy negatively affects your feelings about sex). I say this not to encourage you to go off and have sex for the heck of it, but because other posters are focusing on this relationship as its own thing (is he the guy for you to date or not) so I thought I'd bring up the bigger picture, which is also interesting.
posted by aimedwander at 8:03 AM on October 2, 2015 [4 favorites]
Best answer: He obviously doesn't text me as frequently but there are so many factors : he's introvert, depressed, taking it slow, scared, maybe disinterested as well. I don't want to be too much which could be why he wanted to take it slow.
I think it is a little bit of all of these things, based on what you told me. I wouldn't chalk it up to a thing about virginity/relative experience/lack of experience.
So should I just take his word for it that he actually likes me and just wait this out? How long? I just don't know if I'm strong enough to do so.
I think it makes a lot of people uncomfortable if they are fielding a lot of "do you really like me?" type questions early on in a relationship. I would back off from trying to confirm his emotions a little, but what I would recommend doing more of is communicating your own feelings rather than trying to push him to define his feelings. Basically, it is totally up to you to decide whether (in a relationship, in general) you want to take things slow, wait things out, get emotionally intimate early on or not and what that means to you. But it's up to him too and that's a major determiner in your compatibility.
In other words, do that whole "I-statement" thing. After the awkwardness in class, "I felt like things were awkward between us in class. I'd like us to continue talking and collaborating in class. Is that OK with you?" would probably be a more comfortable discussion than "I felt like you were avoiding me in class. Are you disconnecting? Do you still like me? Is this about us having sex?" etc. because the goal is to feel out your respective comfort levels, rather than to try to strictly define all the emotions involved. (I'm exaggerating a little here but I hope it's making sense.) You'll need to accept his answers though, and not assume that he is hiding his true feelings: relationships need to start on a foundation of trusting each other and respecting each other's decisions. If you feel that you cannot trust someone or cannot respect their decisions, do not date them.
You could also say, "I would like to move our relationship to the next level and to me that means I'd like [more unstructured hang out time/more deep emotional discussion/to talk about our future/whatever]. Are you comfortable with that, and if not, could you let me know what your comfort level is right now?" But just be aware that if you define what you want/need and it's not what he wants/needs then this may not be the right relationship for you, and that's not about how you should have been more thoughtful or anything, it's just the way it goes sometimes. And do you see why that might be a better discussion starter than something like this: "I think you're pulling away. Do you want to take it slow because of your anxieties, because of my virginity, or because you don't actually like me that much?"
posted by capricorn at 8:43 AM on October 2, 2015 [1 favorite]
I think it is a little bit of all of these things, based on what you told me. I wouldn't chalk it up to a thing about virginity/relative experience/lack of experience.
So should I just take his word for it that he actually likes me and just wait this out? How long? I just don't know if I'm strong enough to do so.
I think it makes a lot of people uncomfortable if they are fielding a lot of "do you really like me?" type questions early on in a relationship. I would back off from trying to confirm his emotions a little, but what I would recommend doing more of is communicating your own feelings rather than trying to push him to define his feelings. Basically, it is totally up to you to decide whether (in a relationship, in general) you want to take things slow, wait things out, get emotionally intimate early on or not and what that means to you. But it's up to him too and that's a major determiner in your compatibility.
In other words, do that whole "I-statement" thing. After the awkwardness in class, "I felt like things were awkward between us in class. I'd like us to continue talking and collaborating in class. Is that OK with you?" would probably be a more comfortable discussion than "I felt like you were avoiding me in class. Are you disconnecting? Do you still like me? Is this about us having sex?" etc. because the goal is to feel out your respective comfort levels, rather than to try to strictly define all the emotions involved. (I'm exaggerating a little here but I hope it's making sense.) You'll need to accept his answers though, and not assume that he is hiding his true feelings: relationships need to start on a foundation of trusting each other and respecting each other's decisions. If you feel that you cannot trust someone or cannot respect their decisions, do not date them.
You could also say, "I would like to move our relationship to the next level and to me that means I'd like [more unstructured hang out time/more deep emotional discussion/to talk about our future/whatever]. Are you comfortable with that, and if not, could you let me know what your comfort level is right now?" But just be aware that if you define what you want/need and it's not what he wants/needs then this may not be the right relationship for you, and that's not about how you should have been more thoughtful or anything, it's just the way it goes sometimes. And do you see why that might be a better discussion starter than something like this: "I think you're pulling away. Do you want to take it slow because of your anxieties, because of my virginity, or because you don't actually like me that much?"
posted by capricorn at 8:43 AM on October 2, 2015 [1 favorite]
It sounds like this guy wants you, but doesn't want to be an asshole - which is usually what we think, societally, of men who take women's virginity and then fade without a relationship. You're not saving it for marriage, but you sound like you were saving for someone special maybe? This guy seems worried about being that guy.
posted by corb at 12:44 PM on October 2, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by corb at 12:44 PM on October 2, 2015 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Thanks to everyone for all your honesty and perspectives. I really appreciate it! I essentially agree with what everyone has posted on here. A few of these things have crossed my own mind but given how anxious I was being it was hard for me to really think clearly. But hearing this from all of you was the reality check that I needed.
From what you all wrote, I basically realized that when it comes to dating I was totally focusing on the wrong thing: which should have been myself. I was so busy trying to figure this guy out and what moves to make that I totally lost myself in all this.
Overall, the main consensus seemed to be: take a big fat chill pill, take care of myself, and think about what I want in a relationship (which I agree with - you are all right). That might include him or not.
It also seemed like I at least had some options, which is nice, I could talk to him about how I felt and/or move on. I haven't decided which yet. Although, after hearing everyone's advice, it has been easier for me to consider just moving on. I might wait a week or 2 before completely giving up on this guy. But in the end, like most of you have said, if he really wanted to be with me - he would have made that clear and I wouldn't be so anxious (nor would I have to wonder).
I think that's been the hard part for me because I think he really did like me at one point (siiiiiiiiiigh)
posted by Trusted Sidekick at 1:52 PM on October 2, 2015 [2 favorites]
From what you all wrote, I basically realized that when it comes to dating I was totally focusing on the wrong thing: which should have been myself. I was so busy trying to figure this guy out and what moves to make that I totally lost myself in all this.
Overall, the main consensus seemed to be: take a big fat chill pill, take care of myself, and think about what I want in a relationship (which I agree with - you are all right). That might include him or not.
It also seemed like I at least had some options, which is nice, I could talk to him about how I felt and/or move on. I haven't decided which yet. Although, after hearing everyone's advice, it has been easier for me to consider just moving on. I might wait a week or 2 before completely giving up on this guy. But in the end, like most of you have said, if he really wanted to be with me - he would have made that clear and I wouldn't be so anxious (nor would I have to wonder).
I think that's been the hard part for me because I think he really did like me at one point (siiiiiiiiiigh)
posted by Trusted Sidekick at 1:52 PM on October 2, 2015 [2 favorites]
I just wanted to chime in. There's a lot in your original post about him telling you what he wants and how he feels about things, and you didn't say much about how you feel and what you want (i.e. casual relationship, serious relationship, dating, sex, all or none of the above). I just wanted to make sure you're making your own wants and needs a priority. Do you know what those are and have you told him?
Here is what I am hearing him saying: "I am enjoying spending time with you; I am attracted to you; I don't want or plan to be in a relationship with you; many people feel very attached to or want a relationship with the person they lose their virginity to; would I be getting myself into a complicated situation or feel some emotionally complex feelings (e.g. guilt) if I had sex with you but don't want a relationship with you? What if you got attached after we slept together?" Is this a conversation you've had with him? Have you worked it out for yourself?
But anyway, what he is thinking and feeling matters less than what you are thinking and feeling. Do you want to be in a relationship? Are you looking for casual sex? Are you eager to have sex and see what it's like and do you foresee yourself not wanting to be attached to this person? Figure out what you want and once you know, have a direct conversation with him if it feels appropriate (or, alternately, slow fade -- or fast fade -- on him). Basically, if your feeling is, I want to lose my virginity and I want to be in a relationship with that person, that's completely fine and a civil, and respectable reason to break it off. And you have lots of opportunities if this doesn't end up being your guy.
A possible reason for the awkwardness may be because he is perceiving that his wants/priorities are being placed first and you're planning around him; if he doesn't know what you want or whether you are okay with the situation or not, there's definitely a potential for future weirdness and I imagine he perceives that. You seem to be giving him the power in this situation and he might feel weird about it.
posted by mermily at 5:23 PM on October 2, 2015 [1 favorite]
Here is what I am hearing him saying: "I am enjoying spending time with you; I am attracted to you; I don't want or plan to be in a relationship with you; many people feel very attached to or want a relationship with the person they lose their virginity to; would I be getting myself into a complicated situation or feel some emotionally complex feelings (e.g. guilt) if I had sex with you but don't want a relationship with you? What if you got attached after we slept together?" Is this a conversation you've had with him? Have you worked it out for yourself?
But anyway, what he is thinking and feeling matters less than what you are thinking and feeling. Do you want to be in a relationship? Are you looking for casual sex? Are you eager to have sex and see what it's like and do you foresee yourself not wanting to be attached to this person? Figure out what you want and once you know, have a direct conversation with him if it feels appropriate (or, alternately, slow fade -- or fast fade -- on him). Basically, if your feeling is, I want to lose my virginity and I want to be in a relationship with that person, that's completely fine and a civil, and respectable reason to break it off. And you have lots of opportunities if this doesn't end up being your guy.
A possible reason for the awkwardness may be because he is perceiving that his wants/priorities are being placed first and you're planning around him; if he doesn't know what you want or whether you are okay with the situation or not, there's definitely a potential for future weirdness and I imagine he perceives that. You seem to be giving him the power in this situation and he might feel weird about it.
posted by mermily at 5:23 PM on October 2, 2015 [1 favorite]
I didn't see this mentioned in the thread thus far: you say "he was satisfied" but it doesn't sound like you were. Maybe this is the reason you felt disconnected from him afterwards? I'd think the focus should have been even more on you than him, since it was your first time and then since it hurt, but it sounds like it was all about him. This is something a lot of young women tolerate, sadly. I hope you choose not to.
posted by mysterious_stranger at 3:00 AM on October 3, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by mysterious_stranger at 3:00 AM on October 3, 2015 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: I did not go into full details about that because I guess I felt like it was already a long post - but don't get me wrong, I was satisfied (other than the fact that we did not go all the way). I'm pretty sure I was in my head A LOT. Again, he never pressured me. He always kept saying "take it slow, we'll go as far as you want, etc." But I was the one who wanted to give it a try. That night, before I even made it to his place, I had already made up my mind that I wanted to lose it. And I suppose, after it did not work out, I got worried that I pushed for too much too fast. Basically I do not think I was relaxed and I think I put a lot of pressure on myself for that moment to happen and be really great or something.
But my almost-first time (and the previous times before that) were actually really great. He always put a lot of time and effort into the foreplay and never made it seem like a chore. He always asked me what I liked or did not like, etc. Also just to mention it again, he never expected me to reciprocate. I just sort of felt like I wanted to make him feel as good as he made me feel - and that was the only other way I felt that I could achieve that in that moment.
I know I may not have painted the best picture of him or our budding relationship in my original post but I do think that he is a good guy. It just so happens that we might not be good for each other.
posted by Trusted Sidekick at 12:08 PM on October 3, 2015
But my almost-first time (and the previous times before that) were actually really great. He always put a lot of time and effort into the foreplay and never made it seem like a chore. He always asked me what I liked or did not like, etc. Also just to mention it again, he never expected me to reciprocate. I just sort of felt like I wanted to make him feel as good as he made me feel - and that was the only other way I felt that I could achieve that in that moment.
I know I may not have painted the best picture of him or our budding relationship in my original post but I do think that he is a good guy. It just so happens that we might not be good for each other.
posted by Trusted Sidekick at 12:08 PM on October 3, 2015
This thread is closed to new comments.
For what it's worth, I don't read anything particularly troubling in your description of his behavior. I mean, yes, he might fade out on you in time, but that's not what he said he wanted to do and it doesn't seem to be what he's doing at this point. You've gotten some of the emotional attachment stuff out on the table. That's good.
HOWEVER, you seem pretty anxious and over thinking this,and it's possible you're putting more effort and energy into this than he is at this point. So, I would encourage you to relax for a bit, worry less about maintaining and pushing forward, don't worry about checking up on him and his mental health for awhile. It's good to be a concerned friend but he's an adult and it's not your responsibility.
Don't distance yourself exactly, but pull it back a little. Focus on doing some things you like, hanging out with other friends, nourishing other parts of your life, etc. You don't need to play hard to get, but let him do some of the work to move things forward if that's what he wants to do.
If he does move things forward, great! If not, then at least other parts of your emotional life will feel more secure, and you can evaluate from a place of security. How he behaves will tell you how much energy he's willing to put forth.
I'm a big fan of taking people at their word AND at their actions. So far his words seem straightforward. Nuture yourself rather than the relationship for a few days or weeks, and give him some room to act.
posted by Knicke at 11:30 PM on October 1, 2015 [4 favorites]