Did I sell myself short?
September 26, 2015 7:23 PM Subscribe
I'm currently in the very very early research stages of making a career change and I'm starting to think that I sold myself short in regards to my education. I have a Bachelor of Arts in History and, well, I've really been struggling to find "my place" in the career world for the last 5 years. I'm starting to think I sold myself short by not pursuing more math/science related careers. Is it too late for me to maybe find a career in STEM I would enjoy?
I feel so stereotypical for saying this, but I never felt that I was "good" at math when I was in elementary school. I started to get a better handle on math (and science courses) when I was in high school, but by that time all interest in those subjects was lost. I saw no future for myself in any STEM field because I was just too "dumb" (at least I thought that's what all my assignments said). I ended up never taking calculus or physics courses because I figured there was no point.
Years later, in my late 20s, I'm not really satisfied with the career path I chose. I'm working in education/libraries and I'm not really into it anymore, I've only just started and I plan on staying in the field for a couple more years (just to get some stability in other areas of my life). Now that I've begun to slowly research other fields, I'm feeling locked out of so many areas that sound interesting. Would it be worth it for me to try to take those high school physics/calculus courses as an adult? If I'm successful, I think they would open up so many more educational doors for me.
Did I really sell myself short when I was in high school/university? Part of me thinks that if I was just naturally good at math/science courses, I would have gravitated to them anyway and I wouldn't have been so discouraged when I was in school.
I feel so stereotypical for saying this, but I never felt that I was "good" at math when I was in elementary school. I started to get a better handle on math (and science courses) when I was in high school, but by that time all interest in those subjects was lost. I saw no future for myself in any STEM field because I was just too "dumb" (at least I thought that's what all my assignments said). I ended up never taking calculus or physics courses because I figured there was no point.
Years later, in my late 20s, I'm not really satisfied with the career path I chose. I'm working in education/libraries and I'm not really into it anymore, I've only just started and I plan on staying in the field for a couple more years (just to get some stability in other areas of my life). Now that I've begun to slowly research other fields, I'm feeling locked out of so many areas that sound interesting. Would it be worth it for me to try to take those high school physics/calculus courses as an adult? If I'm successful, I think they would open up so many more educational doors for me.
Did I really sell myself short when I was in high school/university? Part of me thinks that if I was just naturally good at math/science courses, I would have gravitated to them anyway and I wouldn't have been so discouraged when I was in school.
Response by poster: You're right, it does sound a little vague. I guess that's probably because I'm in the early research stage of my career change. If I'm successful at the courses I'm considering, I would probably apply to a 2 year diploma program in the field that sounds most interesting to me (right now I'm curious in a Civil Engineering Technology program). These programs sound really interesting to me, but because I've never took so many of those math and science programs I'm currently unable to apply because I don't have the credits.
posted by modesty.blaise at 7:40 PM on September 26, 2015
posted by modesty.blaise at 7:40 PM on September 26, 2015
There's no reason not to try. My only hesitation is the same as showbiz_liz, which is that if you end up finding STEM equally soul-numbing and aren't sure what you want, you don't want to end up feeling just as trapped. But I have no doubt that you could take/master that high school material and continue on if it turned out to be a fruitful path for you. Go for it!
Khan Academy has some good math training. You can definitely at some point pursue further education in order to find a STEM-related career, if it turns out to excite you.
posted by easter queen at 7:40 PM on September 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
Khan Academy has some good math training. You can definitely at some point pursue further education in order to find a STEM-related career, if it turns out to excite you.
posted by easter queen at 7:40 PM on September 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
Oh, just saw update-- yeah, take those classes! Civil engineering technology does sound very interesting, and I think once you get through the preliminary stuff and apply you'll start having a pretty good idea whether it's something you actually want to do. If you get in and pursue the program, I'd focus on finding a lot of practical experience/internships so you get an idea of whether you really want it as a career.
Also allow yourself to be naive for awhile. If you meet someone with experience, ask a LOT of questions, don't worry about feeling/sounding stupid. The benefits will accrue over time and you'll become more learned/wise about the field.
posted by easter queen at 7:43 PM on September 26, 2015
Also allow yourself to be naive for awhile. If you meet someone with experience, ask a LOT of questions, don't worry about feeling/sounding stupid. The benefits will accrue over time and you'll become more learned/wise about the field.
posted by easter queen at 7:43 PM on September 26, 2015
Yes, you majored in the wrong thing for the career you want. That's OK, most people have regrets. Few people know what they want to do when they're 18.
The question is, what do you do about it now? Invest several more years of your life in a different path that you may or may not like? That doesn't make sense to me. You should find a way in to the field now, and invest in more education when you're sure you need it and you know you like the field.
Can you get a relatively cheap and easy project management certificate, and then an entry level project management job at a civil engineering firm? Or maybe the education angle can work to your advantage and you could work in education services at a vendor in the industry. Or, maybe apply for government jobs -- something in community involvement at a department of transportation might work. My point is that you should validate your career change and establish background knowledge first, before investing a significant chunk of your life in something that might not pan out.
posted by miyabo at 8:48 PM on September 26, 2015 [6 favorites]
The question is, what do you do about it now? Invest several more years of your life in a different path that you may or may not like? That doesn't make sense to me. You should find a way in to the field now, and invest in more education when you're sure you need it and you know you like the field.
Can you get a relatively cheap and easy project management certificate, and then an entry level project management job at a civil engineering firm? Or maybe the education angle can work to your advantage and you could work in education services at a vendor in the industry. Or, maybe apply for government jobs -- something in community involvement at a department of transportation might work. My point is that you should validate your career change and establish background knowledge first, before investing a significant chunk of your life in something that might not pan out.
posted by miyabo at 8:48 PM on September 26, 2015 [6 favorites]
A classic pattern is that the girl who gets a B in math thinks, "Wow, that is my worst grade. I must be bad at math," while the boy who gets a B in math thinks, "Wow, that is my best grade. I must be good at math."
posted by yarntheory at 8:49 PM on September 26, 2015 [8 favorites]
posted by yarntheory at 8:49 PM on September 26, 2015 [8 favorites]
Engineer here. Yes do it. Civil engineering has one of the lighter math requirements as compared to other engineering departments. I can't say the same for a diploma but an engineering degree opens doors even if you don't actually work as an engineer.
As for "not naturally good at it" - bah humbug. I once explained 2nd year engineering concepts to my "arty" friend (she was studying at a prestigious arts university, not mathy at all). She took to it very well and said she never thought of herself as good at science since she came from a family of "artsy" people, but I could tell she would have done fine. It was something special to see the confidence and change of self-image that came out of that short tutorial.
Also as we said in university - "D is for degree!" All but a few careers require textbook perfect knowledge once you graduate and computers will do all the sims for you, so in the end the math is not the issue, understanding the base concepts is. Even if math isn't your best subject, you just need to be fluent enough to understand the physical concepts being described. And again, the math in civil engineering is totally doable.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 8:50 PM on September 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
As for "not naturally good at it" - bah humbug. I once explained 2nd year engineering concepts to my "arty" friend (she was studying at a prestigious arts university, not mathy at all). She took to it very well and said she never thought of herself as good at science since she came from a family of "artsy" people, but I could tell she would have done fine. It was something special to see the confidence and change of self-image that came out of that short tutorial.
Also as we said in university - "D is for degree!" All but a few careers require textbook perfect knowledge once you graduate and computers will do all the sims for you, so in the end the math is not the issue, understanding the base concepts is. Even if math isn't your best subject, you just need to be fluent enough to understand the physical concepts being described. And again, the math in civil engineering is totally doable.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 8:50 PM on September 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
I don't think you sold yourself short in high school. I also think that there are things that are at least as important than being "good" at math when considering to pursue a STEM career. You know what got me interested in space? I had snow mittens when I was toddler that had an astronaut on a EVA on them. Do you know why I majored in aerospace engineering? I liked Star Trek. Snow mittens and Star Trek were at least as important to me as math aptitude in deciding to pursue a STEM career.
My point is that if you had wanted to pursue a STEM field of study when you were younger you would have, AND you would have known that you wanted to pursue a STEM field of study. Apparently you pursued what you were interested in at the time when in high school/college, and that's OK. Now you're finding your chosen field of study unsatisfying, and it's OK to find your field of study unsatisfying once you work in your field for a couple of years.
I think what you need to do now is to decide what it is you want to do for a career, and then pursue the relevant education. Don't pursue a STEM career just to answer some kind of "what if" or "if only" type of question, you'll be disappointed at work on a nearly daily basis.
posted by Rob Rockets at 8:56 PM on September 26, 2015 [4 favorites]
My point is that if you had wanted to pursue a STEM field of study when you were younger you would have, AND you would have known that you wanted to pursue a STEM field of study. Apparently you pursued what you were interested in at the time when in high school/college, and that's OK. Now you're finding your chosen field of study unsatisfying, and it's OK to find your field of study unsatisfying once you work in your field for a couple of years.
I think what you need to do now is to decide what it is you want to do for a career, and then pursue the relevant education. Don't pursue a STEM career just to answer some kind of "what if" or "if only" type of question, you'll be disappointed at work on a nearly daily basis.
posted by Rob Rockets at 8:56 PM on September 26, 2015 [4 favorites]
Dunno about that Rob Rockets. I was a fey little elf during high school and did extremely well in history and English and languages, so I took a degree in classics at university. Messed around working for the government for a while and then got a bee in my bonnet much as modesty.blaise has here and reenrolled at university to study biochemistry. That worked out awesome. But I don't entirely disagree - "affinity" for whatever field is important, there does need to be something drawing you in.
What I would advise is to not fuss so much about subject matter but rather, identify the style of work that you most enjoy. This hankering for some STEM might indicate that you need more analytical or statistical thinking in your work - which STEM fields can give you buckets of, but so can say, law. Or maybe it's that you feel like you need to be working with your hands - again, lots of opportunity for that in STEM, but also in cooking, trades, etcetera. It may well be that STEM is the answer, but cast your net widely!
posted by nicolas léonard sadi carnot at 9:54 PM on September 26, 2015 [6 favorites]
What I would advise is to not fuss so much about subject matter but rather, identify the style of work that you most enjoy. This hankering for some STEM might indicate that you need more analytical or statistical thinking in your work - which STEM fields can give you buckets of, but so can say, law. Or maybe it's that you feel like you need to be working with your hands - again, lots of opportunity for that in STEM, but also in cooking, trades, etcetera. It may well be that STEM is the answer, but cast your net widely!
posted by nicolas léonard sadi carnot at 9:54 PM on September 26, 2015 [6 favorites]
I don't think taking an intro precalc or calc class at a CC or something while you're researching job possibilities is a bad idea.
I wouldn't worried about being naturally good or bad at anything; regardless of your natural talents, if you put in a little work you will be fine in intro physics and calculus. You really don't need to be a STEM genius to do well in those, take it from a person who took them and is very naturally bad at that sort of thing. I would mainly focus on what exactly about Civil Engineering or whatever you fancy right now is attractive to you and what it has over your current career path.
posted by hejrat at 11:07 PM on September 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
I wouldn't worried about being naturally good or bad at anything; regardless of your natural talents, if you put in a little work you will be fine in intro physics and calculus. You really don't need to be a STEM genius to do well in those, take it from a person who took them and is very naturally bad at that sort of thing. I would mainly focus on what exactly about Civil Engineering or whatever you fancy right now is attractive to you and what it has over your current career path.
posted by hejrat at 11:07 PM on September 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
Mostly, I think that it doesn't matter if you could have taken more math and science. What's done is done.
Lots of people who bobbled through undergraduate maths and science somehow make it to STEM careers - me included. Absolutely take some of the classes you think you missed. You probably won't use those classes exactly in your career, but you also won't be wondering if everyone else learned something crucial that you missed.
You have a few more decades in the workforce. You can absolutely make the transition.
posted by 26.2 at 11:50 PM on September 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
Lots of people who bobbled through undergraduate maths and science somehow make it to STEM careers - me included. Absolutely take some of the classes you think you missed. You probably won't use those classes exactly in your career, but you also won't be wondering if everyone else learned something crucial that you missed.
You have a few more decades in the workforce. You can absolutely make the transition.
posted by 26.2 at 11:50 PM on September 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
I do agree that you don't need to go into STEM just because STEM is considered "better" or to prove it to yourself or anything. By all means look into it but I don't get the sense that you really have a good grip on what you want (but obviously I could be wrong) which is fine.
Looking at your past question you are only a few months into your present career right? You also said in that question that you weren't interested in doing more school. For a lot of careers you just need a degree so I'd really dig deep into a ton of different fields and not just STEM for the sake of it. Your focus on natural ability etc. in this question kind of makes it seem that way, but I could be reading it wrong. In any case, I am certain you have the capability to do the amount of math/science to go into engineering or something, just make sure you have a good reason for doing so.
Also, part of life as you grow older is being locked out of interesting things and learning to deal with that (by having other things that you love). That shouldn't be a factor in changing what you are doing, unless you have a burning desire to do one of those things that is separate from the fact that you are locked out from it.
posted by hejrat at 12:03 AM on September 27, 2015
Looking at your past question you are only a few months into your present career right? You also said in that question that you weren't interested in doing more school. For a lot of careers you just need a degree so I'd really dig deep into a ton of different fields and not just STEM for the sake of it. Your focus on natural ability etc. in this question kind of makes it seem that way, but I could be reading it wrong. In any case, I am certain you have the capability to do the amount of math/science to go into engineering or something, just make sure you have a good reason for doing so.
Also, part of life as you grow older is being locked out of interesting things and learning to deal with that (by having other things that you love). That shouldn't be a factor in changing what you are doing, unless you have a burning desire to do one of those things that is separate from the fact that you are locked out from it.
posted by hejrat at 12:03 AM on September 27, 2015
Would it be worth it for me to try to take those high school physics/calculus courses as an adult?
Totally! You shouldn't feel like anything has been foreclosed on because you didn't demonstrate some kind of intrinsic affinity or aptitude for math in high school. It's also completely normal to re-evaluate what subjects most interest you with the benefit of time and experience -- I mean, I had never taken a single statistics class before graduate school, and yet statistics is now a major part of what I do for a living. As far as timing goes, it is absolutely, certainly not too late. Five years out of college is nothing; people go back to school (and retool in less formal ways, of course) way later than that. The author of this book has a doctorate in engineering and is currently a professor despite having an early history with math and science that sounds a lot like yours.
(The above advice applies regardless of your gender, but also, if you are a woman, consider that there may have been some cultural baggage weighing on you that may have influenced how you saw yourself in relation to math/science before. Women are often not supported or encouraged to persevere through difficulties in STEM fields as much as men are.)
posted by en forme de poire at 12:05 AM on September 27, 2015 [3 favorites]
Totally! You shouldn't feel like anything has been foreclosed on because you didn't demonstrate some kind of intrinsic affinity or aptitude for math in high school. It's also completely normal to re-evaluate what subjects most interest you with the benefit of time and experience -- I mean, I had never taken a single statistics class before graduate school, and yet statistics is now a major part of what I do for a living. As far as timing goes, it is absolutely, certainly not too late. Five years out of college is nothing; people go back to school (and retool in less formal ways, of course) way later than that. The author of this book has a doctorate in engineering and is currently a professor despite having an early history with math and science that sounds a lot like yours.
(The above advice applies regardless of your gender, but also, if you are a woman, consider that there may have been some cultural baggage weighing on you that may have influenced how you saw yourself in relation to math/science before. Women are often not supported or encouraged to persevere through difficulties in STEM fields as much as men are.)
posted by en forme de poire at 12:05 AM on September 27, 2015 [3 favorites]
(BTW, I encountered that book in this excellent post by Dr. Prescod-Weinstein, which is aimed at STEM students who are underrepresented minorities.)
posted by en forme de poire at 12:31 AM on September 27, 2015
posted by en forme de poire at 12:31 AM on September 27, 2015
FWIW, most of the web developers that I know have liberal arts degrees.
posted by COD at 5:51 AM on September 27, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by COD at 5:51 AM on September 27, 2015 [1 favorite]
I majored in East Asian Studies. I now work in electronics manufacturing and am doing school part time for Computer Engineering. It's totally doable.
Also re: math, I really sucked at it in high school, but I'm realized I retained a lot more than I thought. Also I found that as a grown up, math really isn't nearly as daunting.
posted by KernalM at 5:59 AM on September 27, 2015
Also re: math, I really sucked at it in high school, but I'm realized I retained a lot more than I thought. Also I found that as a grown up, math really isn't nearly as daunting.
posted by KernalM at 5:59 AM on September 27, 2015
It sounds like you're considering a pretty major life change. I don't think it's too late at all, but you should have a concrete career path in mind before making any big changes like going back to school. I'd recommend taking some free online STEM courses at Coursera or MIT EdX in the field(s) you're considering to see if you enjoy them and have any aptitude for them. If you do, then you'll be a step ahead when you start your program.
posted by chickenmagazine at 6:25 AM on September 27, 2015
posted by chickenmagazine at 6:25 AM on September 27, 2015
Part of me thinks that if I was just naturally good at math/science courses, I would have gravitated to them anyway and I wouldn't have been so discouraged when I was in school.
I don't think this automatically true, especially growing up female. Another thing that can happen (it happened for me at least), is that if you have a natural aptitude for the humanities, it can make you more inclined to say, "Oh, well, clearly I'm good at humanities and suck at STEM because I'm not automatically acing those classes."
But here's the thing. With a lot of humanities classes, if you've got good critical reading skills and can translate your thoughts into writing, well, that's really all you need. I was a terrible procrastinator, didn't study, read all my books/wrote all my papers the night before they were do, but I aced all those classes.
That just doesn't really happen in math/science courses, not once you get into high school/college level courses. (Okay, unless you're like an absolute math prodigy or something.) Even if you have some natural aptitude, you really have to put in the work.
Okay, time for a personal anecdote: I gave up on STEM stuff after I got a C+ in my college Gen Chem class freshman year of college. I took some non-lab science courses after that, but I gave up on any dream of pursuing a STEM career, because I had decided I was just bad at science.
Except that I'm not, and I'm not even really sure there's such a thing as being "bad at science." You just have to put in the work, and you have to learn how to study in a way that works for you.
I say that because, a few years after graduating from college, I decided to give it another shot. I took Gen Chem again, and I aced it. It wasn't easy. I worked hard, studied hard, studied smarter. But I got an A both semesters, and now I actually TA for a lab science course.
I'm not saying you should definitely do this. I think taking a free online course or a cheap community college course is a good start. Heck, you can go buy a used calc text off of Amazon and start working through the problems on your own. I would approach this as a sort of exploratory, low pressure thing. Sort of like how you might decide to try a foreign language for fun.
It's good for our brain to learn new things, so as long as you don't sink a lot of money into this or make any huge life altering decisions on a whim, I would say dip your toes in the water, and see how it feels.
posted by litera scripta manet at 10:39 AM on September 27, 2015 [1 favorite]
I don't think this automatically true, especially growing up female. Another thing that can happen (it happened for me at least), is that if you have a natural aptitude for the humanities, it can make you more inclined to say, "Oh, well, clearly I'm good at humanities and suck at STEM because I'm not automatically acing those classes."
But here's the thing. With a lot of humanities classes, if you've got good critical reading skills and can translate your thoughts into writing, well, that's really all you need. I was a terrible procrastinator, didn't study, read all my books/wrote all my papers the night before they were do, but I aced all those classes.
That just doesn't really happen in math/science courses, not once you get into high school/college level courses. (Okay, unless you're like an absolute math prodigy or something.) Even if you have some natural aptitude, you really have to put in the work.
Okay, time for a personal anecdote: I gave up on STEM stuff after I got a C+ in my college Gen Chem class freshman year of college. I took some non-lab science courses after that, but I gave up on any dream of pursuing a STEM career, because I had decided I was just bad at science.
Except that I'm not, and I'm not even really sure there's such a thing as being "bad at science." You just have to put in the work, and you have to learn how to study in a way that works for you.
I say that because, a few years after graduating from college, I decided to give it another shot. I took Gen Chem again, and I aced it. It wasn't easy. I worked hard, studied hard, studied smarter. But I got an A both semesters, and now I actually TA for a lab science course.
I'm not saying you should definitely do this. I think taking a free online course or a cheap community college course is a good start. Heck, you can go buy a used calc text off of Amazon and start working through the problems on your own. I would approach this as a sort of exploratory, low pressure thing. Sort of like how you might decide to try a foreign language for fun.
It's good for our brain to learn new things, so as long as you don't sink a lot of money into this or make any huge life altering decisions on a whim, I would say dip your toes in the water, and see how it feels.
posted by litera scripta manet at 10:39 AM on September 27, 2015 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thanks everyone for the advice, I think that I'll just take the math and physics courses over the next year and see how I like them. The initial post was pretty vague because, well, I'm not sure what I want to do. I'm just entering an exploratory phase right now and I'm interested in discovering skill areas I might've missed the first time around. Don't worry, I'm not making any irrational decisions.
posted by modesty.blaise at 1:42 PM on September 27, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by modesty.blaise at 1:42 PM on September 27, 2015 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
It might be worth doing a little math study and, while you do it, thinking about what you do and don't like about it (like, lots of people love geometry and hate statistics, etc). Then you could go from there and think about what you could do with that specific area of math.
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:29 PM on September 26, 2015