Is it normal that I'm so private with my mother?
June 14, 2015 3:12 PM Subscribe
This Onion article reflects pretty well my relationship with my mother. I love her very much, but I can rarely bring myself to share much with her about my life, and when I do, I usually regret it. Is this common for men?
I think it probably hurts my mother's feelings that I am so sparing in what I tell her about my life. It's been this way since I first left home. When I do reveal some small detail, maybe something as simple as that I'm going to a party later in the evening, she latches onto it in a way that makes me uncomfortable, asking follow-up questions that aren't necessarily invasive, but which I can't answer without revealing more about my life which, rationally or not, I'm not comfortable doing.
And it reverberates for weeks. She'll bring up the party in later conversations, as if it were a milestone moment in my life. It deflates me that she sees my life as so uneventful (but how can she not, given that I'm so private?) and so I fall back to a pattern of tight-lipped small talk.
What is the mother-son story like for other men in my demographic? I'm 30 or so, single with a traditional lifestyle. Is this normal, and can I stop feeling guilty? My mother has a much closer relationship with my sister, and so that's the standard I'm compared against. Are her expectations wrong or am I a bad son? I imagine this will clear up naturally once I'm in a serious longterm relationship, but that may not happen for years.
One last note. This dynamic began after I broke up with my high school girlfriend when I left for college. My mother continued to be friendly toward her, which is good, but there was an incident where my mother hired her to take care of the family pets while my mother was on vacation, giving my ex-girlfriend access to our whole house, including my room (which I felt to be private). I felt betrayed and I was angry about it for years. This was well over a decade ago and I doubt my mother remembers it even happened.
I think it probably hurts my mother's feelings that I am so sparing in what I tell her about my life. It's been this way since I first left home. When I do reveal some small detail, maybe something as simple as that I'm going to a party later in the evening, she latches onto it in a way that makes me uncomfortable, asking follow-up questions that aren't necessarily invasive, but which I can't answer without revealing more about my life which, rationally or not, I'm not comfortable doing.
And it reverberates for weeks. She'll bring up the party in later conversations, as if it were a milestone moment in my life. It deflates me that she sees my life as so uneventful (but how can she not, given that I'm so private?) and so I fall back to a pattern of tight-lipped small talk.
What is the mother-son story like for other men in my demographic? I'm 30 or so, single with a traditional lifestyle. Is this normal, and can I stop feeling guilty? My mother has a much closer relationship with my sister, and so that's the standard I'm compared against. Are her expectations wrong or am I a bad son? I imagine this will clear up naturally once I'm in a serious longterm relationship, but that may not happen for years.
One last note. This dynamic began after I broke up with my high school girlfriend when I left for college. My mother continued to be friendly toward her, which is good, but there was an incident where my mother hired her to take care of the family pets while my mother was on vacation, giving my ex-girlfriend access to our whole house, including my room (which I felt to be private). I felt betrayed and I was angry about it for years. This was well over a decade ago and I doubt my mother remembers it even happened.
Well, there are different kinds of "normal" for all different relationships, so we can't really answer that part of your question adequately. For example, this wouldn't feel normal for me and my mom, but it would probably feel very close to normal for my mom and her mother. You know?
If you don't want to share a lot of private stuff with your mother, you certainly don't need to. There's nothing wrong at all with being reserved, even with a close family member. That said, if you do feel comfortable sharing a bit more, I think you'd see some improvement (specifically, the "reverberation" you mention would be a much smaller problem).
Finally, about your story about your high school girlfriend. I can totally see why you felt like this was a bit of an invasion, though I am almost 100% certain that your mother didn't mean anything by it. Being "angry about it for years," though, that's not healthy at all. It sounds like you would benefit from therapy.
posted by schroedingersgirl at 3:25 PM on June 14, 2015 [6 favorites]
If you don't want to share a lot of private stuff with your mother, you certainly don't need to. There's nothing wrong at all with being reserved, even with a close family member. That said, if you do feel comfortable sharing a bit more, I think you'd see some improvement (specifically, the "reverberation" you mention would be a much smaller problem).
Finally, about your story about your high school girlfriend. I can totally see why you felt like this was a bit of an invasion, though I am almost 100% certain that your mother didn't mean anything by it. Being "angry about it for years," though, that's not healthy at all. It sounds like you would benefit from therapy.
posted by schroedingersgirl at 3:25 PM on June 14, 2015 [6 favorites]
I have this exact relationship with my mother down to the latching on to some fleeting detail about my private life and feeling like this wouldn't happen if I were in a long term relationship. Whenever I do open up to her I regret it as she goes into fix it mode, especially when it relates to a relationship thing, or fraught anxiety about my being "all alone." It's all very stressful so I just prefer to be tight lipped. I'd like to be closer with her but our relationship just does not work that way.
I'm a woman and my brother is much closer to my mother so it's not necessarily a gender thing.
posted by sweetkid at 3:28 PM on June 14, 2015 [16 favorites]
I'm a woman and my brother is much closer to my mother so it's not necessarily a gender thing.
posted by sweetkid at 3:28 PM on June 14, 2015 [16 favorites]
Well, based on that high school story, you can't trust her to be thoughtful about your privacy. But it doesn't sound like it was malicious, just thoughtless and it could just be that she doesn't value privacy in the same way you do. You could mention it to her casually one day if you think you could do it calmly and felt like having a more intimate conversation. Like, "Mom, one reason I don't share much is because of that time out of high school ... I would probably share more ..." But I would only do this if you thought something would actually change for the better. My brother and I don't share much with my parents because everything is so dramatic with them all the time and is always the cause of so much speculation and spinning.
posted by gt2 at 3:43 PM on June 14, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by gt2 at 3:43 PM on June 14, 2015 [2 favorites]
I'm 45, but this sounds a lot like my relationship with my mother as well.
At this point I don't want any closer relationship than I have. Half of it is that I've had the same experience that you have -- offer something, have it weirdly seized upon and face what feels like interrogation. It doesn't help that I'm an academic so any talk about my work ends up feeling like having to justify why I might care about these things.
Anyway, you've taken a step in her direction and she's offered you negative reinforcement. Why repeat behavior that doesn't work for you? If she actually wants a closer relationship with you, she can take a step towards you instead of just continuing to assume that what works with your sister will work with you.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 4:00 PM on June 14, 2015 [4 favorites]
At this point I don't want any closer relationship than I have. Half of it is that I've had the same experience that you have -- offer something, have it weirdly seized upon and face what feels like interrogation. It doesn't help that I'm an academic so any talk about my work ends up feeling like having to justify why I might care about these things.
Anyway, you've taken a step in her direction and she's offered you negative reinforcement. Why repeat behavior that doesn't work for you? If she actually wants a closer relationship with you, she can take a step towards you instead of just continuing to assume that what works with your sister will work with you.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 4:00 PM on June 14, 2015 [4 favorites]
I don't think this is a mother-son thing. I have trouble opening up with my mom, and I'm female.
Not sure what to tell you about the guilt. You could try to find an arena that you can bond over that isn't too private for you. Some people use celebrity or family gossip for this - sharing other people's secrets instead of their own. I tend to tell my mom a lot about my more boring hobbies.
posted by bunderful at 4:00 PM on June 14, 2015
Not sure what to tell you about the guilt. You could try to find an arena that you can bond over that isn't too private for you. Some people use celebrity or family gossip for this - sharing other people's secrets instead of their own. I tend to tell my mom a lot about my more boring hobbies.
posted by bunderful at 4:00 PM on June 14, 2015
It's been a journey with both of my kids one older daughter and a son who is 10 years younger.
What I do is talk to them about things we have in common. With my daughter it is kids and working and life in general, as we have those things in common.
With my son, it is more like food, because we have food and cooking in common. So I won't ask him about his life, but I will say, "hey, I am cooking pulled pork!" And he will talk to me and we will go back and forth about his car or his job, and I have learned to not give advice but say, "man, that sucks! What are you going to do?"
I think it's that mothers worry about their kids so much, and they were there for them for what, 18-20 years? Could you give up a friend of 20 years and then have no word from them and not latch onto something like that? I couldn't. And I couldn't. I went through many nights, crying and crying because my kids didn't want to be my friend anymore. It was so hurtful. So much pain, after holding them and hugging them, to let them go.
But I did it. I let them go. And now they both have come back to me, as my friends, as adults. They take the time to talk to me, to include me in their lives as much as they want, and I don't ask about the finite details, because I really don't want to know. I just want to know that they are healthy and happy.
I did all of my crying in silence. And then I started to build my own life without children, which is hard. It's so hard, to be away from your children. Maybe your Mom never got to that point, but I did, even tho' it tore my heart apart. I healed it on my own. So just an insight as to why she hones in on something, because a lot of women's value in life is about raising children, and being suddenly cut off from your children when they become adults is jarring, and quite painful. It's a huge transition, which you will maybe experience later on when you have grown children.
Now I know for sure that my son loves me, and we can have talks about anything, even if it's weeks apart, we are close. The same with my daughter. I think it's knowing they are safe and doing well, and have a good head on their shoulders, but they still love me and take the time to communicate with me. I have value, even after all these years. I am still a person of value and they appreciate me and still want to be my friend.
posted by Marie Mon Dieu at 4:20 PM on June 14, 2015 [60 favorites]
What I do is talk to them about things we have in common. With my daughter it is kids and working and life in general, as we have those things in common.
With my son, it is more like food, because we have food and cooking in common. So I won't ask him about his life, but I will say, "hey, I am cooking pulled pork!" And he will talk to me and we will go back and forth about his car or his job, and I have learned to not give advice but say, "man, that sucks! What are you going to do?"
I think it's that mothers worry about their kids so much, and they were there for them for what, 18-20 years? Could you give up a friend of 20 years and then have no word from them and not latch onto something like that? I couldn't. And I couldn't. I went through many nights, crying and crying because my kids didn't want to be my friend anymore. It was so hurtful. So much pain, after holding them and hugging them, to let them go.
But I did it. I let them go. And now they both have come back to me, as my friends, as adults. They take the time to talk to me, to include me in their lives as much as they want, and I don't ask about the finite details, because I really don't want to know. I just want to know that they are healthy and happy.
I did all of my crying in silence. And then I started to build my own life without children, which is hard. It's so hard, to be away from your children. Maybe your Mom never got to that point, but I did, even tho' it tore my heart apart. I healed it on my own. So just an insight as to why she hones in on something, because a lot of women's value in life is about raising children, and being suddenly cut off from your children when they become adults is jarring, and quite painful. It's a huge transition, which you will maybe experience later on when you have grown children.
Now I know for sure that my son loves me, and we can have talks about anything, even if it's weeks apart, we are close. The same with my daughter. I think it's knowing they are safe and doing well, and have a good head on their shoulders, but they still love me and take the time to communicate with me. I have value, even after all these years. I am still a person of value and they appreciate me and still want to be my friend.
posted by Marie Mon Dieu at 4:20 PM on June 14, 2015 [60 favorites]
As others have said, there are different normals. My wife and her mother hardly speak and they're both totally OK with that (Me, too). My mother would happily live in my hall closet and dote on me as if I had my own little goddamn house elf, but that's my vision of hell on earth.
She's dumb and racist and generally has zero filter. I have to treat her as if she were a stinging insect -- keep your distance, no sudden moves, etc.
What I've learned works best for both me and my mom is picking a model of interaction and staying consistent with it. I told her point blank that I hate chatting on the phone. So I don't call except for holidays and events. I answer emails, but never right away -- I wait until I get home from work. I don't ask questions -- I don't need to because she just talks and talks. But that's it. I don't, like, get a bug in my ear and change the pattern. I would never do this Onion article thing and "gift" her with something just for the hell of it. That's not the pattern.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 4:41 PM on June 14, 2015 [5 favorites]
She's dumb and racist and generally has zero filter. I have to treat her as if she were a stinging insect -- keep your distance, no sudden moves, etc.
What I've learned works best for both me and my mom is picking a model of interaction and staying consistent with it. I told her point blank that I hate chatting on the phone. So I don't call except for holidays and events. I answer emails, but never right away -- I wait until I get home from work. I don't ask questions -- I don't need to because she just talks and talks. But that's it. I don't, like, get a bug in my ear and change the pattern. I would never do this Onion article thing and "gift" her with something just for the hell of it. That's not the pattern.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 4:41 PM on June 14, 2015 [5 favorites]
I am a lady, and I had a couple incidents with my mother doing things I found violating, which led me to being pretty tight lipped around her. But it occurred to me that I am an unusually private person, so she deserved an explanation or a laying out of boundaries or something, so I did that. I told her the things she did that I thought were uncool. I just explained to her that I wasn't comfortable having her interfere with my life, or with her talking about me in gossipy ways. (She would sometimes misinterpret and get things mixed up and present a kind of baroque version of my life to others.) I talked to her pretty gently about it and cast is as more me being unusually private than her being unusually intrusive, and she made a real effort. She'd slip every now and again, but she really did try. And I tried to keep in mind that she is my mom, and she devoted a good chunk of her life raising me and my siblings. She wasn't a perfect parent, but she was pretty good, and she deserved to have a relationship with us, even if it was a little bit of a PITA every now and again.
It also helped that I have a kid myself, so I could see it a little bit from her perspective. My son is a tetch younger than you, but he has no compunctions about telling me all kinds of detail about his life. He's just a much more open, extroverted person than I am, and I'm glad he's comfortable talking to me. We're sort of becoming more buddies now that he's an adult, and it's pretty great. I devoted a huge chunk of my life to him, and to have him just fade out of it as an adult would be pretty painful, I imagine.
Do you feel like you could just sort of talk to her? Maybe take her out for a nice meal and confess that you're a little uncomfortable with sharing things with her just because it seems to snowball, and maybe come to a bit of a compromise where you tell her more little mundane things, and she tries not to launch interrogations about them? If it became a bit more regular, she'd probably get a little less excited about the little disclosures.
(BTW, as silly as this probably sounds, my son semi-regularly takes me out to lunch, and I walk on clouds for days. Every time.)
posted by ernielundquist at 5:10 PM on June 14, 2015 [8 favorites]
It also helped that I have a kid myself, so I could see it a little bit from her perspective. My son is a tetch younger than you, but he has no compunctions about telling me all kinds of detail about his life. He's just a much more open, extroverted person than I am, and I'm glad he's comfortable talking to me. We're sort of becoming more buddies now that he's an adult, and it's pretty great. I devoted a huge chunk of my life to him, and to have him just fade out of it as an adult would be pretty painful, I imagine.
Do you feel like you could just sort of talk to her? Maybe take her out for a nice meal and confess that you're a little uncomfortable with sharing things with her just because it seems to snowball, and maybe come to a bit of a compromise where you tell her more little mundane things, and she tries not to launch interrogations about them? If it became a bit more regular, she'd probably get a little less excited about the little disclosures.
(BTW, as silly as this probably sounds, my son semi-regularly takes me out to lunch, and I walk on clouds for days. Every time.)
posted by ernielundquist at 5:10 PM on June 14, 2015 [8 favorites]
I think you might be inaccurately generalizing from how she acts when she gets one personal detail: "oh no, if she latches on this hard to that one thing I said about a party two months ago, imagine how much worse it would be if I actually described how things are going!" But maybe if you were more open, she wouldn't be latching onto these tiny, random bits of hope that you'll talk to her about your life and tracking them to their bloody, awkward ends.
She might be a completely reasonable person to talk to at a certain level of closeness and just not be great at dealing with the amount of distance you want to maintain. Is there something you COULD talk to her about on a regular basis when she asks--a new hobby you've started, a particular project at work, your trouble sleeping, etc.? Even talking about a book you've been reading and what you're enjoying about it might satisfy both your desire for privacy and your mom's for connection, and follow-up questions won't be weird.
posted by cogitron at 5:39 PM on June 14, 2015 [7 favorites]
She might be a completely reasonable person to talk to at a certain level of closeness and just not be great at dealing with the amount of distance you want to maintain. Is there something you COULD talk to her about on a regular basis when she asks--a new hobby you've started, a particular project at work, your trouble sleeping, etc.? Even talking about a book you've been reading and what you're enjoying about it might satisfy both your desire for privacy and your mom's for connection, and follow-up questions won't be weird.
posted by cogitron at 5:39 PM on June 14, 2015 [7 favorites]
The latching onto details could well be a side effect of having so few details in the first place. It's hard to latch onto anything when there is a nice steady stream of new information coming in. Having said that I'd pay cash money for my mother to remember details from our phone conversations, she will regale me with things strangers said to her from 2 years ago in minute detail but forgets stuff I told her earlier in the phone call. Sometimes it's better to have someone that cares, than someone that just wants a sounding board to hear themselves speak.
Side note, before my brothers drug addiction kicked into high gear, she talked to him almost everyday & knew most of what was going on (well not the drug bits) in his life. So it's not necessarily on gender lines.
It's OK to not tell your mother details about your life if you don't want to. Assuming your mother for the most part has been a caring part of your life, it might be time to let something that happened when you were a teenager 10 years ago go, if only for your own mental health.
The urge to keep your life private from your parents is part of the teenage growth from childhood, separating your identity from theirs. Assuming you've done that & would like to feel closer, you can always start opening up a little about "low value" details and see how that goes. When you feel closer to someone you want to share, the downside is to feel close to people you have to share and least some parts of your life.
posted by wwax at 6:00 PM on June 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
Side note, before my brothers drug addiction kicked into high gear, she talked to him almost everyday & knew most of what was going on (well not the drug bits) in his life. So it's not necessarily on gender lines.
It's OK to not tell your mother details about your life if you don't want to. Assuming your mother for the most part has been a caring part of your life, it might be time to let something that happened when you were a teenager 10 years ago go, if only for your own mental health.
The urge to keep your life private from your parents is part of the teenage growth from childhood, separating your identity from theirs. Assuming you've done that & would like to feel closer, you can always start opening up a little about "low value" details and see how that goes. When you feel closer to someone you want to share, the downside is to feel close to people you have to share and least some parts of your life.
posted by wwax at 6:00 PM on June 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
I'm a mom with adult children who has a similar history with my own mother because we have so few shared interests or values. It seemed that if she wasn't virtually ignoring what I said, she was being critical or dismissive. Although we still aren't particularly close, things improved immensely when I started responding to her comments, rather than just silently stewing. For me, this was a side-effect of marriage counseling. (The marriage tanked, but those communication skills were worth every penny.)
You seem to be doing a lot of stewing and not much communicating. You share some small detail and she asks "follow-up questions that aren't necessarily invasive", which is essentially how conversation works, "but which I can't answer without revealing more about my life which, rationally or not, I'm not comfortable doing." So, redirect the conversation, side-step the question, and/or politely say you don't want to talk about it - which is also how conversation works.
Why assume that bringing up a minor event weeks after the fact means she thinks your life is "uneventful"? It sounds as though she's aware of the fact that you don't tell her much. However, she can only talk about the things you do tell her.
Re hiring your ex-girlfriend to house sit: I understand why a high school boy would be upset at the thought that his ex-girlfriend might be going through his room. I bet this possibility never occurred to your mom because she wouldn't have hired someone she didn't trust. I'm not saying your ex deserved her trust - just asking you to consider that once people age out of that kind of relationship nonsense, they stop expecting these behaviors. Had you spoken to your mom at the time, she could have made other arrangements or, if after the fact, apologized to you. That this is still an issue is really all on you.
Look, you don't have to be close to your mom, but it's not doing you any good to be so angry with her, either. I'm also thinking that her hurt feelings aren't so much due to your reluctance to share the details of your life with her, but rather with the way you behave toward her.
posted by she's not there at 6:03 PM on June 14, 2015 [5 favorites]
You seem to be doing a lot of stewing and not much communicating. You share some small detail and she asks "follow-up questions that aren't necessarily invasive", which is essentially how conversation works, "but which I can't answer without revealing more about my life which, rationally or not, I'm not comfortable doing." So, redirect the conversation, side-step the question, and/or politely say you don't want to talk about it - which is also how conversation works.
Why assume that bringing up a minor event weeks after the fact means she thinks your life is "uneventful"? It sounds as though she's aware of the fact that you don't tell her much. However, she can only talk about the things you do tell her.
Re hiring your ex-girlfriend to house sit: I understand why a high school boy would be upset at the thought that his ex-girlfriend might be going through his room. I bet this possibility never occurred to your mom because she wouldn't have hired someone she didn't trust. I'm not saying your ex deserved her trust - just asking you to consider that once people age out of that kind of relationship nonsense, they stop expecting these behaviors. Had you spoken to your mom at the time, she could have made other arrangements or, if after the fact, apologized to you. That this is still an issue is really all on you.
Look, you don't have to be close to your mom, but it's not doing you any good to be so angry with her, either. I'm also thinking that her hurt feelings aren't so much due to your reluctance to share the details of your life with her, but rather with the way you behave toward her.
posted by she's not there at 6:03 PM on June 14, 2015 [5 favorites]
I have a similar relationship with my mother. Part of it is... I don't know if I would go as far as to classify it as emotional abuse, but during high school I learned that anything I told her could be used as a weapon later. So I stay very vague and I never discuss anything that might actually be important to me.
I do also come from a larger family that just doesn't talk about their feelings, so it's probably partly that. I don't think it's terribly uncommon.
posted by backseatpilot at 6:47 PM on June 14, 2015 [4 favorites]
I do also come from a larger family that just doesn't talk about their feelings, so it's probably partly that. I don't think it's terribly uncommon.
posted by backseatpilot at 6:47 PM on June 14, 2015 [4 favorites]
she latches onto it in a way that makes me uncomfortable, asking follow-up questions that aren't necessarily invasive, but which I can't answer without revealing more about my life which, rationally or not, I'm not comfortable doing.
Ha ha ha. That is me and my mom at times. For sure. And then she gets really nosy or strident as soon as she thinks I'm being evasive. (I'm in my 30's, female BTW.)
Things that have helped me with this dynamic:
- Asking her about her life and what she's been up to. Asking follow-up questions about those things.
- As others have said, have a few "safe" topics that you actually like talking about - hobbies, movies, other family members, etc. My mom has a favorite pro sports team she never tires of discussing and making predictions about.
- Taking mental notes to check in with her about the things going on in her life over email. Email in addition to phone calls really helps because I control the information I include over an email.
- Sending her pictures of stuff I've been up to over email.
- Being as gracious with her about miscommunications as I would with a co-worker. Sometimes it isn't easy to separate an off-hand, insensitive remark from the context of our relationship and getting into co-worker mode can help me clear up those feelings quickly.
- Using humor when I feel she's being controlling. "Don't worry mom, if the party gets out of hand you'll be my one call from jail."
- Reminding myself that when she gets on these jags of interrogating me for information or calling me more often than I would like, it's because she needs the contact. Read: lonely or missing her kids. We all have lonely times and the rejection of indifference stings. We put so much energy into our kids and it can hurt to be isolated from them. I'm not saying that as a guilt trip, believe me, just as perspective.
posted by Pearl928 at 7:14 PM on June 14, 2015 [4 favorites]
Ha ha ha. That is me and my mom at times. For sure. And then she gets really nosy or strident as soon as she thinks I'm being evasive. (I'm in my 30's, female BTW.)
Things that have helped me with this dynamic:
- Asking her about her life and what she's been up to. Asking follow-up questions about those things.
- As others have said, have a few "safe" topics that you actually like talking about - hobbies, movies, other family members, etc. My mom has a favorite pro sports team she never tires of discussing and making predictions about.
- Taking mental notes to check in with her about the things going on in her life over email. Email in addition to phone calls really helps because I control the information I include over an email.
- Sending her pictures of stuff I've been up to over email.
- Being as gracious with her about miscommunications as I would with a co-worker. Sometimes it isn't easy to separate an off-hand, insensitive remark from the context of our relationship and getting into co-worker mode can help me clear up those feelings quickly.
- Using humor when I feel she's being controlling. "Don't worry mom, if the party gets out of hand you'll be my one call from jail."
- Reminding myself that when she gets on these jags of interrogating me for information or calling me more often than I would like, it's because she needs the contact. Read: lonely or missing her kids. We all have lonely times and the rejection of indifference stings. We put so much energy into our kids and it can hurt to be isolated from them. I'm not saying that as a guilt trip, believe me, just as perspective.
posted by Pearl928 at 7:14 PM on June 14, 2015 [4 favorites]
I fell into the same pattern when I was a teenager and wanted nothing to do with my parents, and to some degree it's carried over into my adult life. I don't know WHAT my problem is; while she's sometimes annoying as all people are, I know she always has my back, and my aversion to telling her much about my personal life and ANYTHING about my internal/ emotional life makes no sense. I'm a 39-year-old woman. So there's a data point. As others have suggested, I try to find topics that I am willing to talk to her about because I do care about her and know she wants to hear about me and my life.
posted by metasarah at 7:24 PM on June 14, 2015
posted by metasarah at 7:24 PM on June 14, 2015
I can't speak to what's typical for most people, but I can speak to my own experience. I'm about your age, and also single. My relationship with my mother has changed from being fairly closed-off and superficial to talking more seriously about my life as things have changed in my life and about our relationship.
We had a fairly strained relationship most of the time when I was in high school and college, and it took me a long time to get over it. There were a bunch of things I was pissed off at her for and it wasn't until I grew up enough to realize that she had clearly forgiven me for the various (minor but still very irksome) ways I had been a shit when I was younger, and so I probably should forgive her for the various ways she was not perfect and let go of the simmering resentments I still carried from living with her. (I still don't think I'd want to live with her again, of course.)
It also took until I had been successful enough in building a life that I had stuff I wanted to talk to her about. A lot of which is fairly mundane, but why should I keep the book club I joined or the person I just met a secret? I'd tell friends this stuff if they seemed interested, why not my mother?
I think what really shook it up, though, was when I went through some tough stuff and leaned on her a little for emotional support. I didn't have an SO to lean on, and I realized I was really pushing the limits of what my friends could really be expected to tolerate, and of course I tried not to be too much of a burden on my folks either, but it helped to have their (and mostly my mom's) support. After that there was no reason to go back to shutting her out.
I think you're probably right about her reasons for bringing up minor events again and again (and also, she's probably just trying to make more conversation with you, and asking people about themselves is a pretty basic and normal conversational gambit. If you gave her more to work with, she might not harp on those details as much.)
If you're asking, it suggests you might be open to having a closer relationship with her. She'd probably appreciate it. Wouldn't hurt you to try.
posted by mister pointy at 7:35 PM on June 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
We had a fairly strained relationship most of the time when I was in high school and college, and it took me a long time to get over it. There were a bunch of things I was pissed off at her for and it wasn't until I grew up enough to realize that she had clearly forgiven me for the various (minor but still very irksome) ways I had been a shit when I was younger, and so I probably should forgive her for the various ways she was not perfect and let go of the simmering resentments I still carried from living with her. (I still don't think I'd want to live with her again, of course.)
It also took until I had been successful enough in building a life that I had stuff I wanted to talk to her about. A lot of which is fairly mundane, but why should I keep the book club I joined or the person I just met a secret? I'd tell friends this stuff if they seemed interested, why not my mother?
I think what really shook it up, though, was when I went through some tough stuff and leaned on her a little for emotional support. I didn't have an SO to lean on, and I realized I was really pushing the limits of what my friends could really be expected to tolerate, and of course I tried not to be too much of a burden on my folks either, but it helped to have their (and mostly my mom's) support. After that there was no reason to go back to shutting her out.
I think you're probably right about her reasons for bringing up minor events again and again (and also, she's probably just trying to make more conversation with you, and asking people about themselves is a pretty basic and normal conversational gambit. If you gave her more to work with, she might not harp on those details as much.)
If you're asking, it suggests you might be open to having a closer relationship with her. She'd probably appreciate it. Wouldn't hurt you to try.
posted by mister pointy at 7:35 PM on June 14, 2015 [1 favorite]
I think this is a common parent-child thing. I recommend two things: figure out what thing you can share that you would be comfortable with her picking apart - is there a sports team you like? A coffee shop you go to? A shirt you are looking for? Anything at all?? The second recommendation is re-orienting the conversation to her - "Oh me, not much going on here - all this terrible rain...what are you up to? Seen any movies lately? Go anywhere interesting"
posted by Toddles at 8:02 PM on June 14, 2015
posted by Toddles at 8:02 PM on June 14, 2015
But maybe if you were more open, she wouldn't be latching onto these tiny, random bits of hope that you'll talk to her about your life and tracking them to their bloody, awkward ends.
She's behaving this way for reasons that are internal to herself. It's not the poster's fault that she does this, nor his responsibility to fix her.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:28 PM on June 14, 2015 [5 favorites]
She's behaving this way for reasons that are internal to herself. It's not the poster's fault that she does this, nor his responsibility to fix her.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:28 PM on June 14, 2015 [5 favorites]
Just to chime in here; I am a woman in my 30s and this is exactly my experience with my mother. I did an experiment and shared some level of detail with her once 2 years ago; she grabbed on to it so tight! She cried about me "opening up to her" and wanted to fly across the country to come try to solve my problem for me (ugh boundaries much?) and then told me for weeks later that she was still thinking about me and the problem, and praying for me, long after I'd gotten over it. Wowsa.
What that taught me is that she doesn't behave in a way that makes me feel like I can trust her. And so I felt less guilty about not sharing with her. She doesn't know how to engender my trust. I don't owe her any details about my life just because she's my mom. I try to get along with her the best I can, given the limits of our two personalities. But I don't share details because I don't feel safe to, and that's my prerogative. (She doesn't understand her role in it; I'm sure the entire family thinks I'm some kind of mystery hermit but oh well.)
Observing my friends, your dynamic is not the majority, but neither is it uncommon. My fiance has a great relationship with his mom (and dad); they talk weekly. I had another friend who adored his mother and spent a lot of time with her and was devastated when she passed. That being said, I don't think either of these men shared details with their mom in the same way women share details. These guys spend quality time with their mom taking them places and doing things together but didn't get into day-to-day detail about their lives either. So it could be a man/woman thing. Your mom shouldn't expect you to be her best girlfriend, since.... well... you're not a best girlfriend.
Sometimes we're just born into families where the personalities are either too similar, or too different, to get along in a deep & harmonious way. And maybe this generation expects a level of being understood by our parents that our parents did not get themselves, nor do they know how to provide. So it can be hard to accept that a close relationship is just not possible given who you are, and to work with the hand that is dealt.
Reading what you wrote, my guess is that the ex-girlfriend thing is not the only situation; you probably felt misunderstood or put-off by how your mother responded to you for a lot longer than that. Otherwise you would have felt comfortable to tell her right away that you were upset that she let the gf pet sit; you would have had that level of intimacy and comfort already. The gf incident may be the biggest item that you remember, but my guess is she has a long pattern of not getting you. (Compare this to a friend of mine & her young son, who tells her right away if he's upset about something. She's developed that kind of relationship with him where he feels safe to do so.)
It sounds like a part of you wants to share with your mom (otherwise you wouldn't ask the question here) but the response you get from her is so weird that it's hard to be close. For that I'd say, learn to accept her for who she is, and allow yourself the feelings you have in response to her, try to let go of the resentment and/or disappointment that you didn't get a mom who responds more naturally and comfortably for you, and then carry on as you are. You could try building on common interests (movies? pets? travel?) and talk about low-risk stuff that you both find interesting, that might take the pressure off both of you. Hugs & good luck :)
posted by serenity soonish at 7:16 AM on June 15, 2015 [5 favorites]
What that taught me is that she doesn't behave in a way that makes me feel like I can trust her. And so I felt less guilty about not sharing with her. She doesn't know how to engender my trust. I don't owe her any details about my life just because she's my mom. I try to get along with her the best I can, given the limits of our two personalities. But I don't share details because I don't feel safe to, and that's my prerogative. (She doesn't understand her role in it; I'm sure the entire family thinks I'm some kind of mystery hermit but oh well.)
Observing my friends, your dynamic is not the majority, but neither is it uncommon. My fiance has a great relationship with his mom (and dad); they talk weekly. I had another friend who adored his mother and spent a lot of time with her and was devastated when she passed. That being said, I don't think either of these men shared details with their mom in the same way women share details. These guys spend quality time with their mom taking them places and doing things together but didn't get into day-to-day detail about their lives either. So it could be a man/woman thing. Your mom shouldn't expect you to be her best girlfriend, since.... well... you're not a best girlfriend.
Sometimes we're just born into families where the personalities are either too similar, or too different, to get along in a deep & harmonious way. And maybe this generation expects a level of being understood by our parents that our parents did not get themselves, nor do they know how to provide. So it can be hard to accept that a close relationship is just not possible given who you are, and to work with the hand that is dealt.
Reading what you wrote, my guess is that the ex-girlfriend thing is not the only situation; you probably felt misunderstood or put-off by how your mother responded to you for a lot longer than that. Otherwise you would have felt comfortable to tell her right away that you were upset that she let the gf pet sit; you would have had that level of intimacy and comfort already. The gf incident may be the biggest item that you remember, but my guess is she has a long pattern of not getting you. (Compare this to a friend of mine & her young son, who tells her right away if he's upset about something. She's developed that kind of relationship with him where he feels safe to do so.)
It sounds like a part of you wants to share with your mom (otherwise you wouldn't ask the question here) but the response you get from her is so weird that it's hard to be close. For that I'd say, learn to accept her for who she is, and allow yourself the feelings you have in response to her, try to let go of the resentment and/or disappointment that you didn't get a mom who responds more naturally and comfortably for you, and then carry on as you are. You could try building on common interests (movies? pets? travel?) and talk about low-risk stuff that you both find interesting, that might take the pressure off both of you. Hugs & good luck :)
posted by serenity soonish at 7:16 AM on June 15, 2015 [5 favorites]
P.S. the shortcut word for this is "neediness." Your mom is acting needy. Being needy turns people off and makes them pull away. The sad effect is that neediness usually leaves the person more isolated and lonely, creating a cycle of neediness. At some point you might try interjecting a few phrases with your mom to curb her behavior, or at least give her feedback about how she comes across to you. "geez ma can't a guy share some detail without his mom getting needy about it?" or "ok relax with the anxiousness, that party was weeks ago!"
(Of course you know your mom's personality best. If she will break down in tears with small comments like this then... well... like I said, you likely didn't develop this relationship with her out of nowhere! She may have changed over the years, as you have, so it's worth a shot to see how she responds. I recently called my mother out on her anxious harping and to my absolute shock and surprise, she owned it & apologized... and then ran away and hid from me for over a month. Sigh.)
And as others have pointed out, you've learned to cope with her behavior by pulling away and distancing. That is one coping method out of many. You could read & research other ways to respond to her that might push the relationship in a direction you like better.
P.P.S. "I imagine this will clear up naturally once I'm in a serious longterm relationship"
I think typically guys share less with their moms once they have a gf/wife/partner since they tend to share those details with the partner instead of their mom. That being said, my experience has been that having a partner has helped my family relationships since I have someone who understands me, sees how crazy the family acts and helps me find a balanced response to their insanity.
posted by serenity soonish at 7:39 AM on June 15, 2015
(Of course you know your mom's personality best. If she will break down in tears with small comments like this then... well... like I said, you likely didn't develop this relationship with her out of nowhere! She may have changed over the years, as you have, so it's worth a shot to see how she responds. I recently called my mother out on her anxious harping and to my absolute shock and surprise, she owned it & apologized... and then ran away and hid from me for over a month. Sigh.)
And as others have pointed out, you've learned to cope with her behavior by pulling away and distancing. That is one coping method out of many. You could read & research other ways to respond to her that might push the relationship in a direction you like better.
P.P.S. "I imagine this will clear up naturally once I'm in a serious longterm relationship"
I think typically guys share less with their moms once they have a gf/wife/partner since they tend to share those details with the partner instead of their mom. That being said, my experience has been that having a partner has helped my family relationships since I have someone who understands me, sees how crazy the family acts and helps me find a balanced response to their insanity.
posted by serenity soonish at 7:39 AM on June 15, 2015
> I think this is a common parent-child thing.
Yes, it is. I loved my mom a lot, but once I left home for college I didn't share a whole lot with her (and, like you, was taken aback by her "needy" reaction when I did share something). Now that I'm married to a woman with a grown son I see the other side of the equation—how important he is to her and how much it means to her to know what's going on with him—and I wish I'd been closer to my mom before she died. (Similarly, seeing how my older grandson treats his younger brother, I realize what a shit I must have been to my own younger brothers.) Obviously don't do anything that makes you feel awful, but maybe try telling her more on a more regular basis and see if she eases off on the needy reaction? You might be glad of it later.
posted by languagehat at 8:49 AM on June 15, 2015 [4 favorites]
Yes, it is. I loved my mom a lot, but once I left home for college I didn't share a whole lot with her (and, like you, was taken aback by her "needy" reaction when I did share something). Now that I'm married to a woman with a grown son I see the other side of the equation—how important he is to her and how much it means to her to know what's going on with him—and I wish I'd been closer to my mom before she died. (Similarly, seeing how my older grandson treats his younger brother, I realize what a shit I must have been to my own younger brothers.) Obviously don't do anything that makes you feel awful, but maybe try telling her more on a more regular basis and see if she eases off on the needy reaction? You might be glad of it later.
posted by languagehat at 8:49 AM on June 15, 2015 [4 favorites]
I have a similar relationship with my mom. I'm about your age and single. I too don't like sharing details. You're not doing anything wrong, so there's nothing to feel guilty about. You're an adult and you get to decide for and by yourself what your boundaries are. Other people get to suck it up.
Part of being an adult is deciding what you're OK with and then making that thing happen. You can't change your mother's behaviour - she's likely to keep asking you questions - but you have 100% control over what you share with her. It's completely OK to say "I don't want to discuss that" and then not discuss it. You're not a bad son for not being the person that she wants you to be. Part of being a parent is dealing with the fact that your kids will likely turn out quite differently to what you expect/want.
Part of the reason I don't share with my mom is because I can't trust her to keep things between us. I've lost count of the amount of times I've been monologued at with a story about a friend of my aunt's meeting her and her sister while they were out shopping, and how said friend's husband has gone into hospital to have a boil removed. I'm not comfortable with that level of detail about another person's life, especially when I can't be sure whether the husband in question actually wants me to know about the boil removal. What I do know is that she will be telling said friend all about whatever things I've shared with her about my personal life, none of which are that friend's business. I've had to become very selective about what I share, because any question that I do answer will be met with another. I can't just say I was working in [place] today, because it will lead to another question about what I was doing there. It's a never ending spiral of nosiness.
Your story about the ex girlfriend reminded me of something that happened to me. I had a friends-with-benefits type thing going on with someone, and we ended up drifting apart. My mom mentioned that I hadn't mentioned Friend in a while, and I said that I hadn't heard from them for a while. So she decided to send Friend a christmas card and involve herself in the situation that way. Completely inappropriate.
You're not a bad son. You're a grown adult, which means it's time to set some boundaries in place. One thing that does strike me is that you're ascribing motivations and thought processes to her that might not be accurate. You can't know what your mom is thinking unless you're a mind reader. Maybe open a dialogue with her about boundaries and intrusive questions so you can get to know her motivations a little better. If you can figure out the actual reason why she's behaving like this, you're on the way to figuring out the best way to handle it. If you're not comfortable with sharing, then don't do it. You get to decide your comfort level by yourself. What other people think of it is their own business.
posted by Solomon at 8:54 AM on June 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
Part of being an adult is deciding what you're OK with and then making that thing happen. You can't change your mother's behaviour - she's likely to keep asking you questions - but you have 100% control over what you share with her. It's completely OK to say "I don't want to discuss that" and then not discuss it. You're not a bad son for not being the person that she wants you to be. Part of being a parent is dealing with the fact that your kids will likely turn out quite differently to what you expect/want.
Part of the reason I don't share with my mom is because I can't trust her to keep things between us. I've lost count of the amount of times I've been monologued at with a story about a friend of my aunt's meeting her and her sister while they were out shopping, and how said friend's husband has gone into hospital to have a boil removed. I'm not comfortable with that level of detail about another person's life, especially when I can't be sure whether the husband in question actually wants me to know about the boil removal. What I do know is that she will be telling said friend all about whatever things I've shared with her about my personal life, none of which are that friend's business. I've had to become very selective about what I share, because any question that I do answer will be met with another. I can't just say I was working in [place] today, because it will lead to another question about what I was doing there. It's a never ending spiral of nosiness.
Your story about the ex girlfriend reminded me of something that happened to me. I had a friends-with-benefits type thing going on with someone, and we ended up drifting apart. My mom mentioned that I hadn't mentioned Friend in a while, and I said that I hadn't heard from them for a while. So she decided to send Friend a christmas card and involve herself in the situation that way. Completely inappropriate.
You're not a bad son. You're a grown adult, which means it's time to set some boundaries in place. One thing that does strike me is that you're ascribing motivations and thought processes to her that might not be accurate. You can't know what your mom is thinking unless you're a mind reader. Maybe open a dialogue with her about boundaries and intrusive questions so you can get to know her motivations a little better. If you can figure out the actual reason why she's behaving like this, you're on the way to figuring out the best way to handle it. If you're not comfortable with sharing, then don't do it. You get to decide your comfort level by yourself. What other people think of it is their own business.
posted by Solomon at 8:54 AM on June 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
On the one hand, of course, you get to determine your own boundaries with your mother. Here is my method for dealing with phone conversations with people who can be hard to talk to: prepare for conversations by coming up with talking points. My mom liked gardening, so if I read an article about gardening, I would plan to mention it to her when we talked. Think of it like making FPP posts for an individual. If you are telling your mom about some weird story about a zoo in her home state, then she feels like you love her enough to think about her outside of those phone calls, but she also is not asking you about the minutiae of your life in a way that makes you feel uncomfortable.
On the other hand, this struck me as disordered thinking on your part: there was an incident where my mother hired her to take care of the family pets while my mother was on vacation, giving my ex-girlfriend access to our whole house, including my room (which I felt to be private). I felt betrayed and I was angry about it for years.
This, to me, sounds like your mom liked this girl who she had known for years, and you were out of town yourself (right? otherwise you would have been petsitting?), and so your mom asked this person who she trusted to do a pretty normal job. (Maybe even as a favor to your ex, as a way of giving her money.)
Did you have a particularly acrimonious breakup? Did you have some reason to think that your ex was using petsitting as an excuse to violate boundaries by going through your room for no reason? Did you ever indicate to your mother that you wanted her to have less contact with your ex?
I can understand being a little irritated by this situation while being college aged, or being very upset if your ex was a terrible person who was known for disregarding your boundaries. But absent either of those conditions, it really seems like this was a turning point where you nursed this resentment against your mother to the point that it is hurting your ability to trust her, even now. What was it about this arrangement that upset you so much? I think you could find some real healing by figuring out what it was that threw you so off-kilter in a situation that seems pretty innocuous and boring from the outside. You indicate that it is good that your mom remained friends with your ex, which means that your mom likely had no idea that you would resent her for years over asking the ex to watch the dogs/cats/boa constrictors for a few days.
posted by a fiendish thingy at 10:44 AM on June 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
On the other hand, this struck me as disordered thinking on your part: there was an incident where my mother hired her to take care of the family pets while my mother was on vacation, giving my ex-girlfriend access to our whole house, including my room (which I felt to be private). I felt betrayed and I was angry about it for years.
This, to me, sounds like your mom liked this girl who she had known for years, and you were out of town yourself (right? otherwise you would have been petsitting?), and so your mom asked this person who she trusted to do a pretty normal job. (Maybe even as a favor to your ex, as a way of giving her money.)
Did you have a particularly acrimonious breakup? Did you have some reason to think that your ex was using petsitting as an excuse to violate boundaries by going through your room for no reason? Did you ever indicate to your mother that you wanted her to have less contact with your ex?
I can understand being a little irritated by this situation while being college aged, or being very upset if your ex was a terrible person who was known for disregarding your boundaries. But absent either of those conditions, it really seems like this was a turning point where you nursed this resentment against your mother to the point that it is hurting your ability to trust her, even now. What was it about this arrangement that upset you so much? I think you could find some real healing by figuring out what it was that threw you so off-kilter in a situation that seems pretty innocuous and boring from the outside. You indicate that it is good that your mom remained friends with your ex, which means that your mom likely had no idea that you would resent her for years over asking the ex to watch the dogs/cats/boa constrictors for a few days.
posted by a fiendish thingy at 10:44 AM on June 15, 2015 [1 favorite]
As others have noted, there's a huge range of normal. You sound uncomfortable with your current conversations, though, so you may want to change how you do it.
Therapy helped me to have better boundaries with a lot of people. It sounds like your mom is a lot like my mom, in that she asks questions because she wants to be closer, but there are a lot of topics where I'd rather have a lot of privacy.
I learned through therapy to divulge details that I'm Happy to talk about more. A recent meal or food I cooked (as mentioned above, lots of people have interest in food), something interesting from work (but not at all interpersonal), music (if it's music she'd like), gardens and plants (even if it's just "I saw roses in bloom here and that made me think of how you like your garden, what's in bloom in your garden?"). I also learned to listen a little better, and as folks have mentioned above, to start thinking of her as another human instead of just the role of mother.
posted by ldthomps at 12:21 PM on June 15, 2015
Therapy helped me to have better boundaries with a lot of people. It sounds like your mom is a lot like my mom, in that she asks questions because she wants to be closer, but there are a lot of topics where I'd rather have a lot of privacy.
I learned through therapy to divulge details that I'm Happy to talk about more. A recent meal or food I cooked (as mentioned above, lots of people have interest in food), something interesting from work (but not at all interpersonal), music (if it's music she'd like), gardens and plants (even if it's just "I saw roses in bloom here and that made me think of how you like your garden, what's in bloom in your garden?"). I also learned to listen a little better, and as folks have mentioned above, to start thinking of her as another human instead of just the role of mother.
posted by ldthomps at 12:21 PM on June 15, 2015
Not unique to men. My mother is very high maintenance, and she also gets obsessed tiny details of my life (typically this results in her forwarding an entirely disproportionate article about this tiny thing if it were The Only Thing in my life, months after I stopped thinking about it at all). In our case she has poor boundaries while I have very strong ones, and she always thinks I'm cold and prickly, while I think she's a black hole of need. All you can do is try to come up with a balance of giving her some crumbs while keeping the distance you need to function in life; you can't make that be a perfect deal for everybody...
posted by acm at 12:44 PM on June 15, 2015
posted by acm at 12:44 PM on June 15, 2015
Response by poster: Thank you for all the responses.
posted by pot suppeck at 8:27 PM on June 15, 2015
posted by pot suppeck at 8:27 PM on June 15, 2015
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by i_am_a_fiesta at 3:19 PM on June 14, 2015 [1 favorite]