Is it okay to not take it seriously, or is it time to opt out?
May 9, 2015 7:55 AM Subscribe
I'm having a great time with a guy I have been dating for about a month. The thing is I like him and he seems mum in return. Finally I asked him what he was looking for and said no pressure, but he seems content to keep things casual and wants a sexual relationship. I am not sure I am okay with the arrangement as I know I become attached. Time to cut bait and move on?
I have been talking to/seeing this guy for about 2 months. The actual seeing each other part has been about a month. I really enjoy my time with him and we laugh a lot. I am attracted to him as well. He is 22 and I am about to be 23. I always end up posting on askmefi about anything relationship because I think you guys all know what's up. Lol
Well not to say I am in any rush to slap a title on things and kill the excitement, I didn't know exactly what he was looking for. We did meet on a dating site. We get along well and he eagerly set up a second date with me after our first. In between that time between first and second date he had asked me to randomly meet up to go to Waffle House, called me a few times resulting in an hour long convo, and also went to the midnight showing of a movie together. Then we went to the park like originally planned. The cincher is we slept together. I really enjoyed it. The thing is sex messes me up sometimes. I get attached.
So like most girls I was like oh no what does this mean?! What did I do? I just asked; hey you know I just have to ask, no pressure, but do you eventually want to end up with a relationship or are you wanting a more casual set up? He just said he was "open to whatever" then proceeded to ask to see me that evening. I wasn't satisfied with that very vague answer but saw him that night. We slept together several more times. We were like rabbits... of course we were protected.
He then asked to see me to get margaritas and introduced me as his friend because he knew the people working at the restaurant (he used to work there). I'm not saying he has to go ahead and make me his girlfriend but something feels off. He asks to see me 2 to 3 times per week and does contact me outside of "booty call" hours. When I finally told him I liked him he said well I am by no means looking for a serious relationship but I would like to continue spending time with you and seeing you. He told me he was not looking for or seeing anyone else. He also said he liked me beyond sex... but after having another discussion where I said well maybe for my comfort I think I should not spend the night nor sleep with you. To which eventually he said if you are going to say so bluntly what we can and can't do I will seek a relationship elsewhere though I would like to see you.
He wants to go with the flow. I see it as him saying "you'll do for now, I would like you to stick around till I find somebody better." I have tried to end the relationship as I feel him being very wishy washy will not make me feel very good and I know how these types of ambiguous relationships make me feel. However he keeps trying to convince me to stick around and has asked me to hang out this Monday. I just feel like my feelings are not wholly returned and don't want to be that silly girl who got attached who is waiting for the guy to come around. Frankly, I think it might be a waste of my time.
What do you guys think?
I have been talking to/seeing this guy for about 2 months. The actual seeing each other part has been about a month. I really enjoy my time with him and we laugh a lot. I am attracted to him as well. He is 22 and I am about to be 23. I always end up posting on askmefi about anything relationship because I think you guys all know what's up. Lol
Well not to say I am in any rush to slap a title on things and kill the excitement, I didn't know exactly what he was looking for. We did meet on a dating site. We get along well and he eagerly set up a second date with me after our first. In between that time between first and second date he had asked me to randomly meet up to go to Waffle House, called me a few times resulting in an hour long convo, and also went to the midnight showing of a movie together. Then we went to the park like originally planned. The cincher is we slept together. I really enjoyed it. The thing is sex messes me up sometimes. I get attached.
So like most girls I was like oh no what does this mean?! What did I do? I just asked; hey you know I just have to ask, no pressure, but do you eventually want to end up with a relationship or are you wanting a more casual set up? He just said he was "open to whatever" then proceeded to ask to see me that evening. I wasn't satisfied with that very vague answer but saw him that night. We slept together several more times. We were like rabbits... of course we were protected.
He then asked to see me to get margaritas and introduced me as his friend because he knew the people working at the restaurant (he used to work there). I'm not saying he has to go ahead and make me his girlfriend but something feels off. He asks to see me 2 to 3 times per week and does contact me outside of "booty call" hours. When I finally told him I liked him he said well I am by no means looking for a serious relationship but I would like to continue spending time with you and seeing you. He told me he was not looking for or seeing anyone else. He also said he liked me beyond sex... but after having another discussion where I said well maybe for my comfort I think I should not spend the night nor sleep with you. To which eventually he said if you are going to say so bluntly what we can and can't do I will seek a relationship elsewhere though I would like to see you.
He wants to go with the flow. I see it as him saying "you'll do for now, I would like you to stick around till I find somebody better." I have tried to end the relationship as I feel him being very wishy washy will not make me feel very good and I know how these types of ambiguous relationships make me feel. However he keeps trying to convince me to stick around and has asked me to hang out this Monday. I just feel like my feelings are not wholly returned and don't want to be that silly girl who got attached who is waiting for the guy to come around. Frankly, I think it might be a waste of my time.
What do you guys think?
i think you two want different things (you want to be his gf, he doesn't want a serious relationship) and it's probably best to find someone else that wants what you want. it's manipulative of him to say "i will seek a relationship elsewhere" when you say you don't want to have sex. a guy that respects you, understands you, and wants you not just for sex would have said something else. so yeah, it's time to opt out.
posted by cristinacristinacristina at 8:04 AM on May 9, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by cristinacristinacristina at 8:04 AM on May 9, 2015 [5 favorites]
Frankly, I think it might be a waste of my time.
I think you're right. You have to believe what he is saying about himself right now, and not hope that he's going to want something more. He'll continue to use you and not feel bad about it because hey, he told you he didn't want anything, right?
You've already figured this all out at 22 and that is awesome. It took me alot longer. Save yourself the years of pain, trust your gut, and end this.
posted by fanta_orange at 8:04 AM on May 9, 2015 [5 favorites]
I think you're right. You have to believe what he is saying about himself right now, and not hope that he's going to want something more. He'll continue to use you and not feel bad about it because hey, he told you he didn't want anything, right?
You've already figured this all out at 22 and that is awesome. It took me alot longer. Save yourself the years of pain, trust your gut, and end this.
posted by fanta_orange at 8:04 AM on May 9, 2015 [5 favorites]
Please cut your losses to be with someone who wants what you want. Never compromise on that.
posted by bluespark25 at 8:05 AM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by bluespark25 at 8:05 AM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
It sounds like you know the answer here: you want something he doesn't. Even if theoretically he might become interested in a relationship after some time, you don't agree about what to do in the short term, either -- he wants a sexual relationship now, and you don't want that unless there's more clarity about feelings. You're just not compatible.
Good job knowing enough about yourself to recognize what you need. Move on.
posted by shattersock at 8:06 AM on May 9, 2015 [2 favorites]
Good job knowing enough about yourself to recognize what you need. Move on.
posted by shattersock at 8:06 AM on May 9, 2015 [2 favorites]
I would tell him that you don't feel like your feelings for him are reciprocated or that this relationship is going anywhere, and that for those reasons you need to end it. He will probably try to talk you into continuing with a casual relationship, but if you're not comfortable or happy with that, you need to stay strong and say no to future dates. If he comes back at some point and says that he wants a serious relationship with you, you will have to decide if you would like to give that a chance with him.
posted by amro at 8:06 AM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by amro at 8:06 AM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
I said well maybe for my comfort I think I should not spend the night nor sleep with you. To which eventually he said if you are going to say so bluntly what we can and can't do I will seek a relationship elsewhere though I would like to see you.
So you were honest and direct and said what you were willing to do in the relationship and he said he'd seek what he wanted in a relationship elsewhere.
First, good for you for being direct. Second, it doesn't sound like you two want the same things. I'd suggesting seeking a different relationship elsewhere as well.
Good luck.
posted by Beti at 8:08 AM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
So you were honest and direct and said what you were willing to do in the relationship and he said he'd seek what he wanted in a relationship elsewhere.
First, good for you for being direct. Second, it doesn't sound like you two want the same things. I'd suggesting seeking a different relationship elsewhere as well.
Good luck.
posted by Beti at 8:08 AM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
I think it's high time women started taking men who pull this bullshit to task, frankly.
Yes, some people of every gender want this kind of relationship, but often it seems guys will keep things deliberately ambiguous, rather than just saying what they want, because they know that if they did, women like you would leave.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:18 AM on May 9, 2015 [39 favorites]
Yes, some people of every gender want this kind of relationship, but often it seems guys will keep things deliberately ambiguous, rather than just saying what they want, because they know that if they did, women like you would leave.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:18 AM on May 9, 2015 [39 favorites]
There's a lot of pressure to be "chill" as a woman. This article says it best: "Chill is a garbage virtue that will destroy the species. Fuck Chill."
I spent lots of time when I was around your age pretending that it was ok when men treated me like crud, like someone who wasn't worth investing in. No thanks. You can't take back that time.
There is no reason to date guys like this. You don't want to, and that's reason enough not to. Resist the pressure to be "chill."
posted by sockermom at 8:44 AM on May 9, 2015 [35 favorites]
I spent lots of time when I was around your age pretending that it was ok when men treated me like crud, like someone who wasn't worth investing in. No thanks. You can't take back that time.
There is no reason to date guys like this. You don't want to, and that's reason enough not to. Resist the pressure to be "chill."
posted by sockermom at 8:44 AM on May 9, 2015 [35 favorites]
When I step back and take in your phrasing and your concerns, what jumps out at me the most is you project SO much insecurity and doubt and YOU SHOULDN'T.
My young friend, pretty much every answer you'll get here* is going to tell you:
1. People are entitled to want what they want.
2. People are entitled to express their wants to their partners/friends/family/others.
3. Others have the EXACT SAME entitlement to say they don't want the same things.
4. When you spend time attempting to interpret what people say and do, you're wasting your time. You can't get into anyone's headspace and you'll only drive yourself crazy.
He has told you that he's open to anything, but not a serious relationship.
Read that again.
HE HAS TOLD YOU THAT HE'S NOT INTERESTED IN A SERIOUS RELATIONSHIP. So you need to decide if this works for you or not. It would seem not. Cut your losses and move on.
* Also, please stop with the gender stereotypes: So like most girls I was like oh no what does this mean?!
We're women, not girls, and saying "most" just reinforces very unfortunate and inaccurate gender stereotypes.
posted by kinetic at 8:45 AM on May 9, 2015 [25 favorites]
My young friend, pretty much every answer you'll get here* is going to tell you:
1. People are entitled to want what they want.
2. People are entitled to express their wants to their partners/friends/family/others.
3. Others have the EXACT SAME entitlement to say they don't want the same things.
4. When you spend time attempting to interpret what people say and do, you're wasting your time. You can't get into anyone's headspace and you'll only drive yourself crazy.
He has told you that he's open to anything, but not a serious relationship.
Read that again.
HE HAS TOLD YOU THAT HE'S NOT INTERESTED IN A SERIOUS RELATIONSHIP. So you need to decide if this works for you or not. It would seem not. Cut your losses and move on.
* Also, please stop with the gender stereotypes: So like most girls I was like oh no what does this mean?!
We're women, not girls, and saying "most" just reinforces very unfortunate and inaccurate gender stereotypes.
posted by kinetic at 8:45 AM on May 9, 2015 [25 favorites]
However he keeps trying to convince me to stick around and has asked me to hang out this Monday.
Come on, he's not holding a gun to your head. You already know what your pattern tends to be in situations like this and that it's not good for you. He's not the only one being wishy-washy here (and from what you've said, it actually seems like he's been pretty clear: he doesn't want a Relationship right now). Tell him you're done and then act like it.
posted by rtha at 9:05 AM on May 9, 2015 [4 favorites]
Come on, he's not holding a gun to your head. You already know what your pattern tends to be in situations like this and that it's not good for you. He's not the only one being wishy-washy here (and from what you've said, it actually seems like he's been pretty clear: he doesn't want a Relationship right now). Tell him you're done and then act like it.
posted by rtha at 9:05 AM on May 9, 2015 [4 favorites]
You're completely in the right.
People who want vague, meandering, wafty relationships are undoubtedly fine human beings, who should stick to dating other people who also want vague, meandering, wafty relationships.
You are not a person who wants vague waftiness in your relationships. According to him, he is, and you are quite right to take him at his word.
Feel free to drop him like he's hot. Sorry this has turned out so disappointing for you, but it would only be worse if you went with his flow.
posted by tel3path at 9:06 AM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
People who want vague, meandering, wafty relationships are undoubtedly fine human beings, who should stick to dating other people who also want vague, meandering, wafty relationships.
You are not a person who wants vague waftiness in your relationships. According to him, he is, and you are quite right to take him at his word.
Feel free to drop him like he's hot. Sorry this has turned out so disappointing for you, but it would only be worse if you went with his flow.
posted by tel3path at 9:06 AM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
If you walk away right now, you'll look back in 5 years (maybe even sooner) and it'll be crystal clear that you were right to do so, and that you did it with your dignity intact.
I wish I had more memories like that to cherish! To look back and be able to say "you go girl!"
To revel in the power you have right now, to say NO to a situation that will, yes, be a waste of your time and, yes, will put you in a very difficult position emotionally and erode your self-respect.
To be able to say "Oh that's too bad! I really enjoyed the time we spent together, but this type of arrangement just doesn't work for me. Have a nice life!" and get on with your life. Find someone more fitting. Good luck!
posted by ipsative at 9:35 AM on May 9, 2015 [4 favorites]
I wish I had more memories like that to cherish! To look back and be able to say "you go girl!"
To revel in the power you have right now, to say NO to a situation that will, yes, be a waste of your time and, yes, will put you in a very difficult position emotionally and erode your self-respect.
To be able to say "Oh that's too bad! I really enjoyed the time we spent together, but this type of arrangement just doesn't work for me. Have a nice life!" and get on with your life. Find someone more fitting. Good luck!
posted by ipsative at 9:35 AM on May 9, 2015 [4 favorites]
You should be VERY turned off that he's trying to convince you to let him use you after discussions have revealed you both want different types of relationships.
You absolutely should not talk to this boundary pushing asshole further, or explain yourself again.
Delete. Block. Move forward with confidence.
PS. Yep. That "chill" shit is garbage. Own that you deserve a great relationship and excellent treatment. Go find someone who thinks treating someone great is what they want, too!
PPS. I don't know if I made it clear, but for this guy to be a great guy worth your friendship and not the asshole he's acted like, he should have backed off when it became clear in discussions that he wants things casual and you're not looking for that. Instead, this guy heard your crystal clear boundaries, and he's trying to get you to break them for his sole benefit. Breaking those boundaries means your feelings will get hurt, he's still pushing you to hang out! He doesn't care about your feelings!
Learn to see this type of person, recognize them despite their charm. If he was really connecting with you, your emotional wellbeing would matter to him. Your emotional wellbeing does not matter to him.
Block. Delete. Move on with confidence.
posted by jbenben at 9:36 AM on May 9, 2015 [12 favorites]
You absolutely should not talk to this boundary pushing asshole further, or explain yourself again.
Delete. Block. Move forward with confidence.
PS. Yep. That "chill" shit is garbage. Own that you deserve a great relationship and excellent treatment. Go find someone who thinks treating someone great is what they want, too!
PPS. I don't know if I made it clear, but for this guy to be a great guy worth your friendship and not the asshole he's acted like, he should have backed off when it became clear in discussions that he wants things casual and you're not looking for that. Instead, this guy heard your crystal clear boundaries, and he's trying to get you to break them for his sole benefit. Breaking those boundaries means your feelings will get hurt, he's still pushing you to hang out! He doesn't care about your feelings!
Learn to see this type of person, recognize them despite their charm. If he was really connecting with you, your emotional wellbeing would matter to him. Your emotional wellbeing does not matter to him.
Block. Delete. Move on with confidence.
posted by jbenben at 9:36 AM on May 9, 2015 [12 favorites]
Tl;dr
He's actively demonstrating that your emotional wellbeing doesn't matter to him. Stop talking to this person, and def don't hang out or sleep with him again.
posted by jbenben at 9:38 AM on May 9, 2015 [5 favorites]
He's actively demonstrating that your emotional wellbeing doesn't matter to him. Stop talking to this person, and def don't hang out or sleep with him again.
posted by jbenben at 9:38 AM on May 9, 2015 [5 favorites]
Being introduced as a "friend" when you're having rabbit sex with someone is kind of like a slap in the face.
I mean, you're 23. If you don't want to get married yet, it might be in your interests to have non-super serious relationships.
But I think that should be more along the lines of, either an honest one night stand, or honest exclusive girlfriend/boyfriend for like 3-6 months and then it fizzles. No one has to meet anyone's family but there should be some acknowledgement that hey, we are exclusively sleeping together.
This dude sounds like a dude who wants a fantasy life of pulling ladies and therefore wants to always be open to pulling new ladies so he wants to "see where this goes" (IE, see how long it takes him to pull another lady) and "not put labels on things" (IE, be able to deny you exist when he does pull next said lady), yet doesn't realize he's not capable of pulling ladies in longer than 3-6 month period. Leaving plenty of time in which he doesn't want to give up the already accessible sex for him to just cave and call you a girlfriend already. Which is all kind of tragically hilarious. He's a cliche and young chump, laugh at his pretentions.
posted by quincunx at 9:42 AM on May 9, 2015 [14 favorites]
I mean, you're 23. If you don't want to get married yet, it might be in your interests to have non-super serious relationships.
But I think that should be more along the lines of, either an honest one night stand, or honest exclusive girlfriend/boyfriend for like 3-6 months and then it fizzles. No one has to meet anyone's family but there should be some acknowledgement that hey, we are exclusively sleeping together.
This dude sounds like a dude who wants a fantasy life of pulling ladies and therefore wants to always be open to pulling new ladies so he wants to "see where this goes" (IE, see how long it takes him to pull another lady) and "not put labels on things" (IE, be able to deny you exist when he does pull next said lady), yet doesn't realize he's not capable of pulling ladies in longer than 3-6 month period. Leaving plenty of time in which he doesn't want to give up the already accessible sex for him to just cave and call you a girlfriend already. Which is all kind of tragically hilarious. He's a cliche and young chump, laugh at his pretentions.
posted by quincunx at 9:42 AM on May 9, 2015 [14 favorites]
I am astounded at your ability to see this clearly in your very early twenties, wow. I think you have just come to us for validation so here is me lobbing a massively edited version of your own question back at you.
I am not okay with the arrangement as I know I become attached. Time to cut bait and move on.
You go girl.
posted by BoscosMom at 10:02 AM on May 9, 2015 [8 favorites]
I am not okay with the arrangement as I know I become attached. Time to cut bait and move on.
You go girl.
posted by BoscosMom at 10:02 AM on May 9, 2015 [8 favorites]
The thing is sex messes me up sometimes. I get attached.
There's nothing wrong with this at all. It's not messing up and is in fact very normal. I wish I had known this when I was younger. That said, if your feelings aren't reciprocated (and it's looking like they aren't), it's a waste of your time if you're looking for something more serious.
posted by mynameisluka at 10:20 AM on May 9, 2015 [9 favorites]
There's nothing wrong with this at all. It's not messing up and is in fact very normal. I wish I had known this when I was younger. That said, if your feelings aren't reciprocated (and it's looking like they aren't), it's a waste of your time if you're looking for something more serious.
posted by mynameisluka at 10:20 AM on May 9, 2015 [9 favorites]
I agree with everyone's thoughts in general, but I feel like I'm reading a different question! You talked to him for a month online (that's not dating) and have been actually seeing each other for only a month. To me (just me, apparently!), a single month of dating would feel a bit soon for a serious commitment - waiting a bit to learn more about each other seems kind of reasonable, I don't know. (From my current POV, I don't really get the thing of people in their early twenties locking themselves into pseudo-marriages ten minutes after they meet, though, seems to cause more heartache than not, but that's again probably just me :/)
Anyway, he hasn't cut off the possibility of a relationship, unless I'm reading your question wrong. He said he's open to seeing how things go. And actually, his behaviour is leaning toward commitment, whatever he told his friends at the restaurant (which may well be just him being cautious, or not wanting to be presumptuous - it's only been a month!) - he's not seeing anyone else, and isn't interested in seeing anyone else. He wants to see you often, in a number of settings, and consistently and enthusiastically initiates plans to do that. And I can kind of understand his response to a unilateral decision about sex (at the same time that I of course appreciate why you wanted to make it and support your self-assertion).
The bottom line is really how you feel about it all, of course - you should listen to what your gut is telling you. Do you feel used, played, disrespected, insecure? Ditch. Do you feel his attention and intention is squarely on you? Maybe give it a second thought, and just a bit of time (e.g. maybe another couple of weeks, say), and tell him goodbye if he's still uncertain at that point. He may not have articulated what commitment means, even to himself. (And if you know for certain that you want someone who's able to do that instantly, it's fair enough to ditch for that reason, too.) But he is behaving like someone who's going in that direction, imo. The early days of getting to know someone always involve a little bit of the unknown (because you're just getting to know each other). So I don't know, if it were me, I might wait and see (just for a bit).
posted by cotton dress sock at 10:26 AM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
Anyway, he hasn't cut off the possibility of a relationship, unless I'm reading your question wrong. He said he's open to seeing how things go. And actually, his behaviour is leaning toward commitment, whatever he told his friends at the restaurant (which may well be just him being cautious, or not wanting to be presumptuous - it's only been a month!) - he's not seeing anyone else, and isn't interested in seeing anyone else. He wants to see you often, in a number of settings, and consistently and enthusiastically initiates plans to do that. And I can kind of understand his response to a unilateral decision about sex (at the same time that I of course appreciate why you wanted to make it and support your self-assertion).
The bottom line is really how you feel about it all, of course - you should listen to what your gut is telling you. Do you feel used, played, disrespected, insecure? Ditch. Do you feel his attention and intention is squarely on you? Maybe give it a second thought, and just a bit of time (e.g. maybe another couple of weeks, say), and tell him goodbye if he's still uncertain at that point. He may not have articulated what commitment means, even to himself. (And if you know for certain that you want someone who's able to do that instantly, it's fair enough to ditch for that reason, too.) But he is behaving like someone who's going in that direction, imo. The early days of getting to know someone always involve a little bit of the unknown (because you're just getting to know each other). So I don't know, if it were me, I might wait and see (just for a bit).
posted by cotton dress sock at 10:26 AM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
He has said the words "I am in no way looking for a serious relationship." No matter what time of day he calls you, he has been clear on this.
If you are looking for a boyfriend, this is not the guy. Neither of you messed up, it's just a mismatch that you discovered while getting to know each other.
posted by heatherann at 10:53 AM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
If you are looking for a boyfriend, this is not the guy. Neither of you messed up, it's just a mismatch that you discovered while getting to know each other.
posted by heatherann at 10:53 AM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
I just feel like my feelings are not wholly returned and don't want to be that silly girl who got attached who is waiting for the guy to come around.
Then break up with him and stick to it. You're an adult, you can say "goodbye" and not say "hello" again. If you keep going back to something that isn't giving you what you want, then maybe you need to ask yourself why.
He's been clear with you, which is the very least you can expect from someone you're in a romantic entanglement. It's time for you to be clear with you. If anyone is messing anyone about, it's you. Go find someone who you thrill to be with and who will give you what you want. Don't keep settling for something that looks kinda like what you want when it's actually something you don't want. Use your agency.
posted by Solomon at 11:05 AM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
Then break up with him and stick to it. You're an adult, you can say "goodbye" and not say "hello" again. If you keep going back to something that isn't giving you what you want, then maybe you need to ask yourself why.
He's been clear with you, which is the very least you can expect from someone you're in a romantic entanglement. It's time for you to be clear with you. If anyone is messing anyone about, it's you. Go find someone who you thrill to be with and who will give you what you want. Don't keep settling for something that looks kinda like what you want when it's actually something you don't want. Use your agency.
posted by Solomon at 11:05 AM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
Oh jeez, sorry, yes, missed it! Retracted!
posted by cotton dress sock at 11:06 AM on May 9, 2015
posted by cotton dress sock at 11:06 AM on May 9, 2015
Response by poster: My confusion lies in the fact that he does in fact show some signs of being in some sort of relationship with me. The thing is I will forever be a friend. I flip-flap because I like him and have sexual urges but then my feelings say noooooo don't do it, you are in for pain and heartbreak. He says how do you know it will end that way? I just said that is how these things end up. He wants me to settle for somewhat of a monogamous non-relationship. I need to stop being indecisive, stick to my personal feelings, and be done when I say I am done. I know this. I also know I have been made to feel from guys that I should just be as you call it "chill." I am an emotional person who naturally does not do chill in sexual situations that are casual because I do not find sexual relations of any sort casual. So I agree, I need to stop being insecure and listen to myself, and look for somebody else. I am actually supposed to meet up with a guy tonight for a chat and some coffee. He is some years older, 28, but seems to have his head in the right place. We shall see.
posted by Chelsaroo650 at 11:15 AM on May 9, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by Chelsaroo650 at 11:15 AM on May 9, 2015 [2 favorites]
He wants me to settle for somewhat of a monogamous non-relationship.
Of course he does, honey. He doesn't want you sleeping around, but he wants to be able to cut bait if someone else catches his eye. A man who doesn't want to be your boyfriend can still get awfully traditional and not-chill about not wanting to "share" you with any male competition.
posted by blue suede stockings at 11:32 AM on May 9, 2015 [12 favorites]
Of course he does, honey. He doesn't want you sleeping around, but he wants to be able to cut bait if someone else catches his eye. A man who doesn't want to be your boyfriend can still get awfully traditional and not-chill about not wanting to "share" you with any male competition.
posted by blue suede stockings at 11:32 AM on May 9, 2015 [12 favorites]
I had the same initial reaction as cotton dress sock in that I was thinking "What is so odd about not declaring yourself as a committed couple after a month of dating?" But, I think there's a difference between "seeing where things go" and taking things slowly in early dating where you both view things getting more serious as a real and desirable possibility, and this situation where this guy is telling you, "I don't want a girlfriend anytime in the forseeable future."
I also this kind of casual attitude is an odd pairing with the expectation of exclusivity, so I think it's good you're still dating other guys. If he's never going to be your boyfriend, and you would like to have a boyfriend at some point, why would you stop looking around? It'd be like taking down your resume because you found a three month temp job.
posted by Asparagus at 12:00 PM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
I also this kind of casual attitude is an odd pairing with the expectation of exclusivity, so I think it's good you're still dating other guys. If he's never going to be your boyfriend, and you would like to have a boyfriend at some point, why would you stop looking around? It'd be like taking down your resume because you found a three month temp job.
posted by Asparagus at 12:00 PM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: He has not asked me to stop seeing others but seems to think I should be okay with him saying he is not looking for or seeing others, or that it should make me feel better. Though idk what would happen if my schedule wasn't so wide open for him anymore. He seems to think we will spend the summer doing fun things together. I don't get it in a way.
posted by Chelsaroo650 at 12:06 PM on May 9, 2015
posted by Chelsaroo650 at 12:06 PM on May 9, 2015
What I hear is that you guys are not communicating well, and things should not be this hard at one month. I mean, sheesh, now is the time to have fun and get to know one another, not to have so much angst. You haven't even had enuf time to have actual problems yet, what happens when you do?
This strikes me as too much trouble. Too much thinking. You're young, move on pleasantly, no bridges burned, and find someone who makes you feel valued, someone you can communicate with more easily. Where you both enjoy each other's company at the same level.
It should not be this hard, is what I'm saying. Good luck.
posted by alwayson_slightlyoff at 12:17 PM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
This strikes me as too much trouble. Too much thinking. You're young, move on pleasantly, no bridges burned, and find someone who makes you feel valued, someone you can communicate with more easily. Where you both enjoy each other's company at the same level.
It should not be this hard, is what I'm saying. Good luck.
posted by alwayson_slightlyoff at 12:17 PM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: You are correct. It shouldn't be, but for some reason I had to pry any sort of conversation out of him. Lol he does not want these conversations happening but either way they needed to. I think I knew from what I didn't hear how it truly was.
posted by Chelsaroo650 at 12:32 PM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by Chelsaroo650 at 12:32 PM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
He has not asked me to stop seeing others but seems to think I should be okay with him saying he is not looking for or seeing others, or that it should make me feel better.
I 10000% bet that if he found out you were seeing and especially sleeping with someone else he would passive aggressively flip shit.
Friends of mine complain at length about guys like this. And that's always what flipswitches them from being "chill" in to getting weird as if you were in a relationship. I, like several others, originally came here to defend not wanting to commit to where things were going a month in, but this guy sounds like he just wants a cake-and-eat-it-too scenario. He's good at playing the game and seeming on board just enough that you wont leave, but wants to be able to say "woah, we weren't dating or anything!" any time it conflicts with anything else(or whoever else) he wants to do.
This shit is lame, and i'm really sad that it fucked it up for people who... yea, just don't know whether they have interest in committing or not within the first couple months.
posted by emptythought at 1:10 PM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
I 10000% bet that if he found out you were seeing and especially sleeping with someone else he would passive aggressively flip shit.
Friends of mine complain at length about guys like this. And that's always what flipswitches them from being "chill" in to getting weird as if you were in a relationship. I, like several others, originally came here to defend not wanting to commit to where things were going a month in, but this guy sounds like he just wants a cake-and-eat-it-too scenario. He's good at playing the game and seeming on board just enough that you wont leave, but wants to be able to say "woah, we weren't dating or anything!" any time it conflicts with anything else(or whoever else) he wants to do.
This shit is lame, and i'm really sad that it fucked it up for people who... yea, just don't know whether they have interest in committing or not within the first couple months.
posted by emptythought at 1:10 PM on May 9, 2015 [1 favorite]
Hm. Parroting a few others in saying that this is simply a case of you and this guy wanting completely different things. Time to move on.
That said, I can't help but play a little bit of devil's advocate here, because it sounds like the relationship started off as a casual friendship (with benefits) -- with no expectations there'd be a blossoming romance or partnership to follow. There doesn't seem to have been any kind of conversation prior to your meeting where you discussed relationship expectations at all, until after sex (whereupon you admit you developed the more-than-casual-feels).
You mentioned having the 1st relationship conversation in a 'no-pressure' context with this guy, but 'no-pressure' doesn't seem to be what you really meant. IMHO, it seemed like you were really hoping he'd give you the answer you wanted -- that he was specifically open to (or in pursuit of) a romantic relationship. This discord seems even more evident after he introduced you as a 'friend' (and not a girlfriend/partner/etc.) and you were upset by it. So you decided to have another 'no-pressure' relationship talk --- the 2nd one within just a month of actually seeing this guy.
I give the fellow kudos for being honest with you -- he's specifically told you he doesn't want a serious relationship but that he likes you, enjoys your company, and enjoys the 'benefits' part of the arrangement you guys have in your friendship. What I'm curious about is why, rather than ending the friendship there (aware of the incompatibilities), you decided to specifically tell him you were cutting off intimacy. No offense, but it seems vaguely manipulative -- as though you were hoping, by cutting off intimacy, he'd reconsider his 'no serious relationship' boundary for you. His answer demonstrates his honesty here -- he is not looking for a serious relationship. He is only looking for a casual relationship (for whatever reason) -- and is unwilling to budge on that -- even if it means finding someone other than you (ie: someone who wants the same thing he does). The alternative to his honesty would have been dishonesty -- where he'd agree to a relationship, despite not wanting one, simply to placate you. That happens a lot and usually tends to end in heartbreak.
So, I'd definitely move on. You've gotten (understandably) attached and are waiting around for this guy to come around. That's certainly not fair to yourself -- you clearly want a romantic relationship/partnership and you shouldn't be wasting your time on guys who explicitly don't want one. And it's also not fair to him -- he's been honest about what he wants -- to continue to engage with this guy tells me you're still hoping to change his mind. He's not forcing you to go out or answer his calls, or respond to him in any way -- it's all your decision to continue doing so. And to continue doing so, is indeed wasting your time.
posted by stubbehtail at 1:13 PM on May 9, 2015 [4 favorites]
That said, I can't help but play a little bit of devil's advocate here, because it sounds like the relationship started off as a casual friendship (with benefits) -- with no expectations there'd be a blossoming romance or partnership to follow. There doesn't seem to have been any kind of conversation prior to your meeting where you discussed relationship expectations at all, until after sex (whereupon you admit you developed the more-than-casual-feels).
You mentioned having the 1st relationship conversation in a 'no-pressure' context with this guy, but 'no-pressure' doesn't seem to be what you really meant. IMHO, it seemed like you were really hoping he'd give you the answer you wanted -- that he was specifically open to (or in pursuit of) a romantic relationship. This discord seems even more evident after he introduced you as a 'friend' (and not a girlfriend/partner/etc.) and you were upset by it. So you decided to have another 'no-pressure' relationship talk --- the 2nd one within just a month of actually seeing this guy.
I give the fellow kudos for being honest with you -- he's specifically told you he doesn't want a serious relationship but that he likes you, enjoys your company, and enjoys the 'benefits' part of the arrangement you guys have in your friendship. What I'm curious about is why, rather than ending the friendship there (aware of the incompatibilities), you decided to specifically tell him you were cutting off intimacy. No offense, but it seems vaguely manipulative -- as though you were hoping, by cutting off intimacy, he'd reconsider his 'no serious relationship' boundary for you. His answer demonstrates his honesty here -- he is not looking for a serious relationship. He is only looking for a casual relationship (for whatever reason) -- and is unwilling to budge on that -- even if it means finding someone other than you (ie: someone who wants the same thing he does). The alternative to his honesty would have been dishonesty -- where he'd agree to a relationship, despite not wanting one, simply to placate you. That happens a lot and usually tends to end in heartbreak.
So, I'd definitely move on. You've gotten (understandably) attached and are waiting around for this guy to come around. That's certainly not fair to yourself -- you clearly want a romantic relationship/partnership and you shouldn't be wasting your time on guys who explicitly don't want one. And it's also not fair to him -- he's been honest about what he wants -- to continue to engage with this guy tells me you're still hoping to change his mind. He's not forcing you to go out or answer his calls, or respond to him in any way -- it's all your decision to continue doing so. And to continue doing so, is indeed wasting your time.
posted by stubbehtail at 1:13 PM on May 9, 2015 [4 favorites]
You basically never need permission to say "this isn't working for me."
posted by PMdixon at 1:27 PM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by PMdixon at 1:27 PM on May 9, 2015 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: Guys, dating sucks. I wasnt trying to manipulate him but you know I can't help but be a bit upset in the end. Neither of us was upfront about what we wanted. Both of us are trying to get what we want out of the other. Lol it isn't gong to work... yet again. He just keeps trying. I need to say no. I wish I could find an attractive man who treats me well and wants to be with me and only me. I know it's only been a month but you still should have some sort of dialogue I think.
posted by Chelsaroo650 at 1:33 PM on May 9, 2015
posted by Chelsaroo650 at 1:33 PM on May 9, 2015
Granted, I am an internet stranger and can only speak from what you write, but I don't understand why you'd ask this very long and detailed question about monogamy and how to work out a monogamous relationship with someone while you yourself are planning on dating someone else the very day you post the question.
Just drop this first guy. Don't immediately sleep with this other guy if you think you over-attach.
(and Chelsaroo650, before a mod pops in, it's an AskMe convention to post your question and let people respond as they will. You can supply answers if people ask you clarifying questions, but otherwise we don't engage in back and forth.)
posted by kinetic at 1:39 PM on May 9, 2015 [2 favorites]
Just drop this first guy. Don't immediately sleep with this other guy if you think you over-attach.
(and Chelsaroo650, before a mod pops in, it's an AskMe convention to post your question and let people respond as they will. You can supply answers if people ask you clarifying questions, but otherwise we don't engage in back and forth.)
posted by kinetic at 1:39 PM on May 9, 2015 [2 favorites]
Mod note: And a mod is popping in for good measure just to reiterate that. Totally fine to elaborate once or twice if something significant got omitted in the original question, but please don't use this as a general chat/vent space.
posted by cortex (staff) at 1:49 PM on May 9, 2015
posted by cortex (staff) at 1:49 PM on May 9, 2015
You want different things, so break up. But also: if you want monogamy you need to offer it in return. Finally: at 22 you're both doing relatively well being able to work out that you want different things inside of a month, and the few obvious screw ups in communication and behaviour are not worth reading deep patterns into. Sure he's looking for casual things and isn't being a fully consistent or considerate casual dater. You aren't acting fully consistent with your needs either, but that's OK, because you're 22! A time of great confusion and inconsistency and mistakes!
But yeah, break up.
posted by ead at 2:56 PM on May 9, 2015
But yeah, break up.
posted by ead at 2:56 PM on May 9, 2015
I remember your other question about the abusive guy and the good decision you made to end it with him, and you seem to have a lot of common sense. I'm twice your age and I know wereof I speak. So I think you should end things with Mr. Ambivalent, and seek out someone who's more on your level. Have you considered dating guys who are 5 years older than you or thereabouts? They might be more comfortable with a committed relationship. Your gut feelings are telling you that this guy is too casual for you.
posted by Beethoven's Sith at 4:52 PM on May 9, 2015
posted by Beethoven's Sith at 4:52 PM on May 9, 2015
Guys not uncommonly want a relationship that provides them with a sexual outlet but they proclaim that they "aren't looking for a relationship," "just want to be friends [who fuck]," etc. By having a girl as a sexual outlet and a hangout partner, but not calling her a girlfriend, they are escaping much of the heavy lifting that comes with being in a relationship.
For example: the girl's family. If the guy is not her "boyfriend," then he's excused from hanging out with her family. And these days, in the US at least, things are in such flux culturally that there's really not much fun to be had if you're a millennial or whatever having to go get earfucked by a girl's baby boomer parents. All of that unfun shit that cramps a kewl guy's style--relationship stuff--is totally optional when you are "keeping things casual." You don't have to get to know her friends, family, go to weddings, etc.
It's basically having a girlfriend but on terms that allow a guy to get out of any stuff he doesn't want to do. It's deliberate.
Seems to me that you are being used for sex and you're not really okay with it. Move on ...
posted by jayder at 6:02 PM on May 9, 2015 [6 favorites]
For example: the girl's family. If the guy is not her "boyfriend," then he's excused from hanging out with her family. And these days, in the US at least, things are in such flux culturally that there's really not much fun to be had if you're a millennial or whatever having to go get earfucked by a girl's baby boomer parents. All of that unfun shit that cramps a kewl guy's style--relationship stuff--is totally optional when you are "keeping things casual." You don't have to get to know her friends, family, go to weddings, etc.
It's basically having a girlfriend but on terms that allow a guy to get out of any stuff he doesn't want to do. It's deliberate.
Seems to me that you are being used for sex and you're not really okay with it. Move on ...
posted by jayder at 6:02 PM on May 9, 2015 [6 favorites]
"To which eventually he said if you are going to say so bluntly what we can and can't do I will seek a relationship elsewhere though I would like to see you."
The way he said this bugs me. Like he's got a problem with you being "blunt" and speaking your mind instead of doing whatever he wants. Yeah, no. Fuck that noise. Be blunt! DTMFA, and good for you for arranging that coffee meet up with a new guy the other night. Keep doing that.
"I am an emotional person who naturally does not do chill in sexual situations that are casual because I do not find sexual relations of any sort casual."
Yeah, we're not all Samantha characters from Sex and the City, and that's cool. This is a really great insight to know about yourself. Go you! Sounds like it might make sense for you to wait until the next guy actually calls you "girlfriend" in front of his friends/family, and until things are feeling more official and exclusive to you before having sex.
posted by hush at 5:00 PM on May 12, 2015 [1 favorite]
The way he said this bugs me. Like he's got a problem with you being "blunt" and speaking your mind instead of doing whatever he wants. Yeah, no. Fuck that noise. Be blunt! DTMFA, and good for you for arranging that coffee meet up with a new guy the other night. Keep doing that.
"I am an emotional person who naturally does not do chill in sexual situations that are casual because I do not find sexual relations of any sort casual."
Yeah, we're not all Samantha characters from Sex and the City, and that's cool. This is a really great insight to know about yourself. Go you! Sounds like it might make sense for you to wait until the next guy actually calls you "girlfriend" in front of his friends/family, and until things are feeling more official and exclusive to you before having sex.
posted by hush at 5:00 PM on May 12, 2015 [1 favorite]
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There is no right or wrong here -- you're not right, he's not wrong -- but all that matters is that this is not the type of relationship you want. You want a committed relationship with a boyfriend. He doesn't want a committed relationship with a girlfriend. So he's not the match for you. Stop seeing him. It is -- as you already surmised -- a waste of your time.
posted by BlahLaLa at 8:03 AM on May 9, 2015 [12 favorites]