Are lust and loneliness always bad counselors?

December 1, 2013 1:01 PM

I (30) am occasionally tutoring a girl (20) who seems to have some (undiagnosed) learning disability. Yesterday, she dropped me some hints that she might be attracted to me. I find her physically attractive too, but I realize that, on paper, we are not a good match. The differences in terms of education and prospects are considerable. She is a dropout trying to return to high school, she also assists her sister at a modest beauty parlor, I am a nerdy graduate student. As a long-time single, it is probably mainly lust and loneliness which is encouraging me to consider suggesting meeting outside tutoring time.

On the other hand I wonder whether after years of trying and being unable to click with anyone romantically within my context, this can be an unexpected chance life is offering us to get to know each other.
I don't think it's fair to reject people solely on the basis of their background and intelligence, is it? I am fairly certain that she would accept an invitation to hang out, and I think we could have a good time together. But is it a good idea considering our differences? If you found yourself in a similar situation (single for a long time, looking and not finding), would you pursue this? (gently and with consideration, of course)

posted by anonymous to Human Relations (33 answers total)

As the tutor, I think it would be unethical of you to exploit the student-tutor relationship for romance. Perhaps you both could explore a relationship at a later time when you are no longer her tutor, but right now you've signed on to a social contract of helping her get her schooling back on track, and that should be your singular goal.
posted by bluecore at 1:08 PM on December 1, 2013 [93 favorites]

The differences in background are not a problem. You being her tutor is.
posted by pantarei70 at 1:09 PM on December 1, 2013 [17 favorites]

I think it's only a bad idea because she's your client. Maybe when you're no longer paid to be with her, you could get together and get to know each other.
posted by kinetic at 1:09 PM on December 1, 2013 [1 favorite]

Don't do this. Do not do this. This thing? Don't do it.

Friend her on Facebook or whatever it is the 20-year-olds are using these days, and wait at least a month after the tutoring is complete, and if you're still into her at that point, then drop her a line and say, "Hey, I was wondering if you wanted to go get a coffee or something."

Don't do it while she might think you're using your position to untoward advantage.
posted by Etrigan at 1:10 PM on December 1, 2013 [8 favorites]

Hello, graduate student, you are doing what grad students are best at: over analyzing this. If you genuinely don't respect her--and there are undertone in your question that suggest that--then let it go. But if you like her, hang out with her. You are deciding to marry her, just get to know her. Some scholarly types have perfectly wonderful relationships with non-intellectuals who fulfill them in other ways. You could be one of them! Nothing ventured, nothing gained, etc. I am speaking to you as a fellow intellectual type who missed too many potential relationships by ruling people out before I had a chance to see if we clicked. And that was stupid of me. Your type might not be what you think your type is. This is how you find out.
posted by Pater Aletheias at 1:11 PM on December 1, 2013 [4 favorites]

The age is an issue. I think combined with the fact that you're her tutor, this would not be a good idea.

I dated someone quite a bit older than me when I was around 20, and I wasn't yet socially/emotionally mature enough to see the full implications. I knew all along that it wasn't going to last forever, but I didn't tell him that, and our break-up wasn't great.

I don't think it's fair to reject people solely on the basis of their background and intelligence, is it?

This is a somewhat self-serving way to formulate this problem. I don't think it would be fair to begin a relationship with someone who you don't seem to feel is an equal. (She's probably not, to say the least.)

Etrigan has probably the most pro-active response I could comfortably endorse.
posted by stoneandstar at 1:11 PM on December 1, 2013 [3 favorites]

I think you're focusing on the wrong reasons why this might be a bad idea. She's technically your client, and you are in a position of power in the sense that you are acting in a tutoring capacity. I think you have to ask yourself if pursuing a relationship with her would be ethical, regardless of your differing backgrounds/perceived levels of intelligence.
posted by catch as catch can at 1:11 PM on December 1, 2013 [4 favorites]

I agree with the above. If you even want to consider taking her on a date, quit the tutoring job first.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 1:11 PM on December 1, 2013

But, yes, what the others say: at least a few weeks after the tutoring has ended.
posted by Pater Aletheias at 1:12 PM on December 1, 2013 [2 favorites]

I don't think it's fair to reject people solely on the basis of their background and intelligence, is it?

Rule of thumb: don't sex people you don't respect.

It helps to stick to that when you find yourself caving a little bit. Makes your life much easier.
posted by discopolo at 1:13 PM on December 1, 2013 [25 favorites]

As a long-time single, it is probably mainly lust and loneliness which is encouraging me to consider suggesting meeting outside tutoring time.

Also, you're doing a disservice to yourself by simply going with low hanging fruit. Sure, she might sleep with you if that's all you are after, but you'll do better in putting in a wee bit of effort finding a suitable partner you respect.

Would you want to be in a dating relationship with someone who considered you less than an equal just so she could soothe her loneliness?
posted by discopolo at 1:17 PM on December 1, 2013 [2 favorites]

This girl is swimming against the tide already. Difficulties in learning, no diploma, little money. It's normal that she'd be attracted to you...you're older, you're very smart, you've achieved things that she can't. Also, she doesn't really know you -- so her attraction is very superficial. She came to you hoping you'd be able to help her become more independent; getting sexually involved with her could very well set her back in that regard.

I don't think it's fair to reject people solely on the basis of their background and intelligence, is it?

I think your wishful thinking is leading you away from the relevant points. Of course it's fine to date someone younger or who's financially and educationally less advantaged -- that's not the problem here.

If you can find ways to get to know women gradually, in a context that's interesting to you, you may improve your chances to find love. Joining a group would give you a chance to do something you like and also let the women you meet see you at your best outside of an awkward dating situation.
posted by wryly at 1:19 PM on December 1, 2013 [25 favorites]

Maybe she is bored during the sessions and is trying to liven things up for herself with some flirting.
posted by Jason and Laszlo at 1:19 PM on December 1, 2013 [5 favorites]

first, i second what everyone else says about waiting till she's no longer your client before you consider pursuing anything romantic.

2ndly, you have a point when you say this may just be lust and loneliness. in the past i've found that desire can wane pretty quickly once you've gone out a few times and you realize that in reality you are not compatible.

but getting to know someone does not mean you must marry them. after your professional obligations end, ask her if she'd like to go out sometime. after a few dates you'll know whether your suspicions are confirmed.
posted by camdan at 1:21 PM on December 1, 2013 [1 favorite]

People who are in a position of needing remedial help for things are in a vulnerable position with regard to those who are remediating them. This young woman needs your help so that she can stand on her own two feet. Please don't undermine her stability by taking advantage of your position of power. This is just an hour or two a week for you but it's a lifetime of potential change for her. Be a true friend to her and show her by example how to keep your eyes on the prize.
posted by headnsouth at 1:36 PM on December 1, 2013 [22 favorites]

Less educated does not equal less intelligent. But as others have said: While you are her tutor, this is a big fat NO.

Age difference: It matters when it matters. I have had relationships where it mattered and had ones where it did not. Education difference: Some people get educated in the school of hard knocks. Your degree does not necessarily make you inherrently a superior thinker, though it makes it likely that you have had the good fortune of being exposed to some better tools than she has. Still, I have known people with PHDs who could not put a cogent argument together (and expected you to kiss their ass because of said PHD) and high school dropouts who could correct the mistakes of folks with degrees.

Anyway, NO for now. If you care about her as a human being, she needs help getting her life together more than she needs sexing. And if you don't care about her getting her life together, you really, really should never touch her. Realllllly.
posted by Michele in California at 1:42 PM on December 1, 2013 [3 favorites]

Someone older and wiser than I pointed out to me that sometimes you can be attracted to someone else's attraction to you. As you suggest, it may be that your loneliness is causing you to gloss over compatibility issues that you would otherwise consider important.

For her part, she probably does not get a lot of attention from nice, successful men. This situation can also cause people to consider partners who are perhaps not so suitable.

I'm also wondering about the terms of your tutoring arrangement. She has almost certainly not sought you out independently. Either her parents or some other agency is arranging the tutoring sessions. Ask yourself - if this went terribly bad, if things break off and she is angry and sees you as someone she wants to hurt - how badly would your career be damaged if she or her parents reported to your employer that you seduced a client?
posted by bunderful at 1:43 PM on December 1, 2013 [4 favorites]

A problem while you're tutoring here. Not a problem once you are no longer tutoring her. So the solution seems obvious!
posted by Justinian at 1:49 PM on December 1, 2013

There's a power imbalance between student and teacher. As others have pointed out, you cannot do this.

Also, at the risk of being overly cynical: consider the possibility that being flirty is her default way of being nice to you as a male authority figure. The signals you are getting may very well be spurious.
posted by Dr Dracator at 1:54 PM on December 1, 2013 [16 favorites]

I will add that it is possible she feels attracted because you are helping her get her life together. Refusing to tutor her in order to sleep with her may put out the fire. This may be a no win situation for you personally.
posted by Michele in California at 2:25 PM on December 1, 2013 [11 favorites]

Who set up the tutoring arrangement? If it was trough a service organization of any type there is a pretty solid chance what you are thinking of pursuing is against their code of conduct (for good reason) and you may well end up being black listed because of it.
posted by edgeways at 2:37 PM on December 1, 2013 [1 favorite]

Lust and loneliness may be part of how you are feeling, but consider that there is something else too: you may have developed an intimate and caring relationship with her. It is intimate because she trusts you, and you trust her. It is caring because you are helping her, and she appreciates the help. These are good things for you to feel.

The thing to consider though is that the intimacy and care in your relationship is predicated on the fact that you are her tutor. To try and go beyond that now could actually be a betrayal of that trust. This isn't to say that you can't navigate these issues, but to do so will require a clear head, consideration and some time, and you shouldn't do anything until you are no longer her tutor.
posted by Good Brain at 2:48 PM on December 1, 2013 [1 favorite]

Eh, I don't see age or you being a tutor as such a big deal. You're not really in a position of authority like an actual teacher (although for some reason TA-college student relationships seem to be socially acceptable), you just help her with her math problems.

I would say "do something about it" and have a fling (this does not seem like long-term relationship material), but the thing is your student's goal of finally getting that high school diploma will go to the backburner. Which ain't great, but she is an adult and can make her own choices.

You certainly have to consider how good she is at making choices, though.
posted by KokuRyu at 2:50 PM on December 1, 2013

Don't go out with her. Explore on-line dating and look for someone that is a good fit, not just an easy option.

This is definitely a campfire rule scenario. Given her circumstances, it is difficult to imagine this relationship being something empowering, life-sustaining, or fruitful for either of you, but particularly her.
posted by arnicae at 3:25 PM on December 1, 2013 [2 favorites]

There's a ten year age difference (which is a pretty big deal when those ages are 20 and 30, as you've had about six times as much time to experience life as a legal adult as she has), you obviously don't actually think much of her as a person, and you are the teacher in a teacher-student relationship with her. What the hell? No! Do not pursue any kind of romantic or sexual relationship with this person.
posted by Scientist at 4:00 PM on December 1, 2013 [12 favorites]

There is nothing - nothing - not a single phrase - in your entire post that makes this sound like a good idea, even by itself.

Try this exercise: masturbate, then think about the possibilities. No guarantees that this will auger the best path, but at least your horniness will be at a manageably low tide then, and the endorphins will help you see past the loneliness better for a short while.

This is a terrible idea.
posted by IAmBroom at 4:09 PM on December 1, 2013 [1 favorite]

It is not a great idea for you to start sleeping with someone you're tutoring. Especially if, as you admit up front, this isn't a situation where it's an obvious love connection and you want to Be Together for real, but just someone you want to fool around with.

So many ways that could come back to bite you in the ass. So many. I mean, it might be worth the risk for True Love soulmates/The One type stuff. But just because you're attracted to her and haven't gotten laid in a while? Bad idea with zero redeeming aspects.
posted by Sara C. at 4:27 PM on December 1, 2013 [1 favorite]

Tutor = bad idea. Age = bad idea. Your sneaking suspicion that you're not compatible and this is just an itch-scratching for you = bad idea, given the other two bad ideas.

You know what the answer is. You're on the right track, because you're on the track to talking yourself out of it.
posted by Linda_Holmes at 4:31 PM on December 1, 2013 [7 favorites]

I think the answers in this AskMe are very relevant to your current question.

Your students, especially those who are significantly younger than you and vulnerable due to socioeconomic disadvantages, are NOT a potential dating pool. What are you doing to meet women who are on your level, age-wise and intellectually? Focus more on that and less on whether it's a good idea to date your students (it's a terrible idea).
posted by keep it under cover at 4:37 PM on December 1, 2013 [12 favorites]

(although for some reason TA-college student relationships seem to be socially acceptable)

That's really, really, really no longer the case in the US.
posted by jaguar at 5:20 PM on December 1, 2013 [8 favorites]

Dr Dracator: "There's a power imbalance between student and teacher. As others have pointed out, you cannot do this.

Also, at the risk of being overly cynical: consider the possibility that being flirty is her default way of being nice to you as a male authority figure. The signals you are getting may very well be spurious."

This. I am always surprised at the way some men (mostly) misinterpret very obvious attempts to be polite/personable/deferent to authority as flirtation. It was mostly customer service at that point, but also these kinds of learning interactions. Hell, just being in a good mood and friendly sufficed!

And, when you're poor and female, you work out very young that there's a lot of shit against you and life's a little easier (in some ways) if you smile and look pretty and let men think less of you. They will anyway (you're poor, you're stupid, you're young) so you may as well get some mileage out of it. I could never do it (not pretty enough) but friends of mine knew the ropes so I'd watch it all unfold. And via my parents I would hear the gossip about my friends and that the men genuinely thought they were attracting these young girls when it really wasn't the case.

But seriously? Stop trying to fuck your students. Just stop. It's really poor form, it's creepy, and it reflects badly on you as a teacher.
posted by geek anachronism at 6:00 PM on December 1, 2013 [20 favorites]

I sympathize with your loneliness, but this isn't smart. All of the likely scenarios here end badly. If you don't end up getting hurt yourself (which I think is fairly likely) you'll probably give this girl a kick in the teeth. Don't do that.

Look for someone who is on more equal footing with you, not necessarily in every way, but at least in some ways. It's more likely to work well, and if it goes badly, it won't be something you have to feel ashamed of for a long time after.
posted by mattu at 6:17 PM on December 1, 2013

You might look over the responses to this earlier question -- might be helpful.
posted by vitabellosi at 11:10 AM on December 2, 2013 [1 favorite]