OTC anti-anxiety remedies?
November 27, 2013 8:08 AM Subscribe
Are there any studies or medical evidence to support the effectiveness of homeopathic remedies for anxiety, such as Hyland's Calms, Hyland's Nerve Tonic, or Rescue Remedy?
I suspect not, but there are often a fair number of positive reviews on Amazon/Drugstore.com/etc. Placebo effect? Advertising shills? Or could the ingredients actually have mild (compared to prescribed medication) anti-anxiety effectiveness?
I suspect not, but there are often a fair number of positive reviews on Amazon/Drugstore.com/etc. Placebo effect? Advertising shills? Or could the ingredients actually have mild (compared to prescribed medication) anti-anxiety effectiveness?
Absolutely no chance at all. This cartoon is a nice summary of homeopathy, as is this video with James Randi.
posted by kmennie at 8:20 AM on November 27, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by kmennie at 8:20 AM on November 27, 2013 [3 favorites]
Rescue remedy contains alcohol, which is a sedative. If you're following the recommended dose, you're not getting a lot of booze, but you're not getting zero either. Probably simpler to have a brandy though.
posted by caek at 8:25 AM on November 27, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by caek at 8:25 AM on November 27, 2013 [1 favorite]
Looking at the label for Hyland Calms, I don't see anything homeopathic about it, except that it claims to be "homeopathically prepared" (whatever that means). It contains Avena Sativa (oats), Chamomilla (which some people find relaxing), Humulus Lupulus (hops), and Passiflora (Passion flower). As they don't give the strengths, it's impossible to judge whether this is a mild tea or just water with the inert ingredients (Lactose, Corn Starch, Tapioca, and Vegetable Magnesium Stearate) added.
posted by ubiquity at 8:29 AM on November 27, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by ubiquity at 8:29 AM on November 27, 2013 [1 favorite]
Also, the Hyland's stuff is straight-up dilution homeopathy which, again, is bunk.
Rescue Remedy is based on Bach's Flower Remedies; here's a meta-analysis concluding that "the most reliable clinical trials do not show any differences between flower remedies and placebos."
posted by griphus at 8:29 AM on November 27, 2013 [3 favorites]
Rescue Remedy is based on Bach's Flower Remedies; here's a meta-analysis concluding that "the most reliable clinical trials do not show any differences between flower remedies and placebos."
posted by griphus at 8:29 AM on November 27, 2013 [3 favorites]
Are you using homeopathic in the strict sense, or also thinking generally of non-FDA approved, often 'herbal' based treatments?
posted by Salamandrous at 8:30 AM on November 27, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by Salamandrous at 8:30 AM on November 27, 2013 [3 favorites]
If you want something non-prescription, try nutritional support. As long as you're not mega-dosing (maybe visit your doctor for baseline levels first), the worst that can happen is that you're getting more vitamins and minerals in your system.
There's plenty of "anec-data" and cure-all woo with the above approach too, but homeopathy is straight up woo, with no beneficial side effects of throwing your money at it beyond the placebo effect.
posted by blue suede stockings at 8:32 AM on November 27, 2013
There's plenty of "anec-data" and cure-all woo with the above approach too, but homeopathy is straight up woo, with no beneficial side effects of throwing your money at it beyond the placebo effect.
posted by blue suede stockings at 8:32 AM on November 27, 2013
The pet and children formulas of Rescue Remedy don't have alcohol. I use it for my cats when traveling or other stressful situations. It works.
They are very intelligent cats but lack much abstract thought - so placebo effect seems remote for them...
posted by cat_link at 8:34 AM on November 27, 2013 [3 favorites]
They are very intelligent cats but lack much abstract thought - so placebo effect seems remote for them...
posted by cat_link at 8:34 AM on November 27, 2013 [3 favorites]
A lot of the Hyland's products are not homeopathic at all, in spite of the labeling. Many of the ingredients are at "1X" strength, which means that they each constitute 10% of the total product. Homeopathic remedies are far more dilute than that.
posted by Ery at 8:35 AM on November 27, 2013
posted by Ery at 8:35 AM on November 27, 2013
I use it for my cats when traveling or other stressful situations. It works. ...
Animals react very, very differently to certain substances than people. Valerian root, for instance, may or may not have anxiolytic effects in people -- most studies point to 'useless but harmless' and you can get it OTC if you want to give it a shot -- but it makes cats go apeshit in roughly the same way catnip does.
posted by griphus at 8:40 AM on November 27, 2013 [1 favorite]
Animals react very, very differently to certain substances than people. Valerian root, for instance, may or may not have anxiolytic effects in people -- most studies point to 'useless but harmless' and you can get it OTC if you want to give it a shot -- but it makes cats go apeshit in roughly the same way catnip does.
posted by griphus at 8:40 AM on November 27, 2013 [1 favorite]
Some of these preparations contain natural anxiolytics that seem to be present for the sole purpose of selling the efficacy of homeopathic remedies.
If you're looking to achieve the effects of, say, Hyland's Nerve Tonic (omg we're still saying "nerve tonic") without overspending and without contributing to a market that the entire scientific community is dismissive of, drink a cup or two of chamomile tea. This is what *actually causes any axiolytic effect in Hyland's product*, and it's cheap and widely available and delicious.
I just read your last question on the subject. I'm sorry I missed it, because I has what you has and I has answers. MeMail me sometime if you wanna trade remedies.
posted by tapesonthefloor at 9:16 AM on November 27, 2013 [2 favorites]
If you're looking to achieve the effects of, say, Hyland's Nerve Tonic (omg we're still saying "nerve tonic") without overspending and without contributing to a market that the entire scientific community is dismissive of, drink a cup or two of chamomile tea. This is what *actually causes any axiolytic effect in Hyland's product*, and it's cheap and widely available and delicious.
I just read your last question on the subject. I'm sorry I missed it, because I has what you has and I has answers. MeMail me sometime if you wanna trade remedies.
posted by tapesonthefloor at 9:16 AM on November 27, 2013 [2 favorites]
I'm often curious as to why folks would eschew that which has been rigorously tested, and is produced in a sterile environment, with strict quality controls, for things that are absolutely not.
Because to go for what's been rigorously tested, you have to be able to get a doctor's appointment, if you're lucky maybe even with a steady doctor who actually knows you and to whom you can return, but in reality probably not, afford to take time off work to go to the doctor for a prescription (and maybe to go back and back and back again if what you try the first time doesn't work out), have to be able to afford to pay the doctor's bill (and/or the health insurance premiums), have to be able to afford to pay the prescribed drug (and maybe comparison shop for the best deal because every pharmacy seems to be different), and hope that it actually works out for you without side effects or else be prepared to do the whole thing again.
I'm happy for you that you can't relate from personal experience to being in a position where all of that (or any of that) feels like quite a high barrier and finding something on Amazon that has good reviews and will be in your hands in three days seems like a relatively better bet. And happy to hopefully help assuage your curiosity about our 'weirdness'.
posted by Salamandrous at 9:43 AM on November 27, 2013 [4 favorites]
Because to go for what's been rigorously tested, you have to be able to get a doctor's appointment, if you're lucky maybe even with a steady doctor who actually knows you and to whom you can return, but in reality probably not, afford to take time off work to go to the doctor for a prescription (and maybe to go back and back and back again if what you try the first time doesn't work out), have to be able to afford to pay the doctor's bill (and/or the health insurance premiums), have to be able to afford to pay the prescribed drug (and maybe comparison shop for the best deal because every pharmacy seems to be different), and hope that it actually works out for you without side effects or else be prepared to do the whole thing again.
I'm happy for you that you can't relate from personal experience to being in a position where all of that (or any of that) feels like quite a high barrier and finding something on Amazon that has good reviews and will be in your hands in three days seems like a relatively better bet. And happy to hopefully help assuage your curiosity about our 'weirdness'.
posted by Salamandrous at 9:43 AM on November 27, 2013 [4 favorites]
finding something on Amazon that has good reviews and will be in your hands in three days seems like a relatively better bet
But these products have universally poor 'reviews' from the entirety of mainstream science.
posted by kmennie at 9:49 AM on November 27, 2013
But these products have universally poor 'reviews' from the entirety of mainstream science.
posted by kmennie at 9:49 AM on November 27, 2013
I looked on Pubmed for studies about Rescue Remedy and found this one: Anxiolytic effect of rescue remedy for psychiatric patients: a double-blind, placebo-controlled, randomized trial. Unfortunately, there's no abstract and I don't have access to the full text. However, this page summarizes that study thusly:
"Review of Efficacy One small trial has evaluated the anxiolytic effect of Rescue Remedy, although the trial included participants with diagnoses other than anxiety disorders, such as depression or schizoaffective disorder.[19] In total, 98 patients were randomized to Rescue Remedy or placebo (water and alcohol drops) for 3 days and instructed to self-medicate at the onset of anxiety. There was no difference in effect on anxiety between the Rescue Remedy and placebo."
I can't speak to Hyland's, but based on what I know of homeopathy, I can't imagine well-done scientific studies showing any better results for that.
posted by needs more cowbell at 9:55 AM on November 27, 2013 [1 favorite]
"Review of Efficacy One small trial has evaluated the anxiolytic effect of Rescue Remedy, although the trial included participants with diagnoses other than anxiety disorders, such as depression or schizoaffective disorder.[19] In total, 98 patients were randomized to Rescue Remedy or placebo (water and alcohol drops) for 3 days and instructed to self-medicate at the onset of anxiety. There was no difference in effect on anxiety between the Rescue Remedy and placebo."
I can't speak to Hyland's, but based on what I know of homeopathy, I can't imagine well-done scientific studies showing any better results for that.
posted by needs more cowbell at 9:55 AM on November 27, 2013 [1 favorite]
Not every drug that isn't FDA-regulated has "universally poor 'reviews' from the entirety of mainstream science."
For example, SAMe is sold over the counter as a nutritional supplement in North America, but is a prescription anti-depressant in multiple places in Europe. It is more expensive over the counter than many generic anti-depressants, but much cheaper than psychiatrist visits plus prescriptions (especially name brand prescriptions).
The FDA is not the be all and end all of science. It does not have the resources to be that even if it had the will.
For the poster, in case you are interested in all over the counter options and not just homeopathic ones, a therapist I respect has observed that many of his patients struggling with OCD and anxiety disorders have found inositol to be helpful.
Of course, this was not a clinical study, and the placebo effect is powerful.
At least for myself, I have decided to embrace the placebo effect!
I do think that for going over the counter, it is important to do your own research and also to be aware that unregulated substances may not even contain what they claim to contain, regardless of whether or not they would even 'work' if they were what they said they were.
posted by Salamandrous at 10:03 AM on November 27, 2013
For example, SAMe is sold over the counter as a nutritional supplement in North America, but is a prescription anti-depressant in multiple places in Europe. It is more expensive over the counter than many generic anti-depressants, but much cheaper than psychiatrist visits plus prescriptions (especially name brand prescriptions).
The FDA is not the be all and end all of science. It does not have the resources to be that even if it had the will.
For the poster, in case you are interested in all over the counter options and not just homeopathic ones, a therapist I respect has observed that many of his patients struggling with OCD and anxiety disorders have found inositol to be helpful.
Of course, this was not a clinical study, and the placebo effect is powerful.
At least for myself, I have decided to embrace the placebo effect!
I do think that for going over the counter, it is important to do your own research and also to be aware that unregulated substances may not even contain what they claim to contain, regardless of whether or not they would even 'work' if they were what they said they were.
posted by Salamandrous at 10:03 AM on November 27, 2013
("These products" = homeopathic products, the ones exclusively referenced and discussed in the question.)
posted by kmennie at 10:15 AM on November 27, 2013
posted by kmennie at 10:15 AM on November 27, 2013
Mod note: Folks, please don't let this wander into chatty territory.
posted by cortex (staff) at 10:27 AM on November 27, 2013
posted by cortex (staff) at 10:27 AM on November 27, 2013
Specific to the Hylands, there is no way to know that the product even contains what it claims it contains, or at the same strength. Hylands has been dinged for this before.
posted by KathrynT at 1:47 PM on November 27, 2013
posted by KathrynT at 1:47 PM on November 27, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by griphus at 8:11 AM on November 27, 2013 [12 favorites]