Help me assess this housing situation
September 16, 2013 3:11 PM Subscribe
Yesterday I moved into a room in an old Toronto house that has some character but a lot of issues. A couple friends are planning on joining me on the top two floors starting November 1st. A friend of one of them has lived on the mainfloor for seven years and is quite attached to the house. But the landlord appears to be absentee and what I learned yesterday gives me further misgivings about what we may be entering into.
I returned to Toronto last week after spending the summer away. Before I left I got rid of most of my stuff to travel lighter. I came back here hoping to quickly find some sort of modest furnished room/shared accommodation situation. But after spending a couple days looking I began bitching on Facebook about how everyone wants a "young professional/student/international student/female" for their prospective tenant. One of my Facebook friends then replied that she knew someone looking for a tenant.
I arranged to visit Saturday evening while the friend who tipped me off was visiting. I knocked a few times at the back door (where I was told to go) and when no one answered I looked around at the mess in the backyard and decided to move on. But an hour later her former boyfriend (whom I know a lot better and get along with well) sent a text asking where I was. I decided to go back, mostly to see the old friend, arriving after dark. For those who know Toronto, it's at Bloor/Sherbourne, close to the subway and central Toronto, but a challenged area. All around this place is scheduled for redevelopment, and there are some boarded old houses.
In the meantime they and three Mormon missionaries they had enlisted were cleaning. Seems that the former tenants left in a hurry, leaving a terrible mess. The kitchen was full of old food, furniture was left, we found several axes, a complete high end power drill set, an ox yoke, a MacIntosh computer, old television sets, oil lamps, a Wolverine costume, body-building supplements, amplifiers and a microphone with stand, and a teach yourself home electricity manual (someone was doing now unfinished renovations on the top floor). There are a couple rusting barbecues and garbage bicycles sinking into the dirt of the backyard, in addition to maybe twenty black garbage bags of old roof from when that was repaired. Probably lots else that was already bagged and carted out before I ever saw anything. Two floors plus a backyard of crap.
My guy friend showed me around. It was dark and not all the lights worked, but I saw a not disgusting mattress and a small desk. I had been staying for the past couple nights at a travel hostel in a dorm that smelled of wet towels, and knew I needed somewhere to escape that. And by now my two friends had decided they might come in and we could share the whole place. So as we talked it out I decided I'd take a room now while we worked on making the place habitable for when they can join me. I said it would be an adventure. But I made certain that I committed to nothing. I paid $300 for this last half of the month. I can leave without even giving notice. As we left the woman who lived there instructed us to all grab a garbage bag from the porch to take down to the street to leave on property set aside for the redevelopment plans. Because someone on the street had told her that "everyone does it", and the city will take it away. I muttered things like "this is nuts" and "get a guy with a truck" and "illegal dumping" but still I carried my two bags down.
My friends returned to do more cleaning yesterday. They moved a deckful of more garbage into the back yard. I proposed that since the place was clearly unfit to be rented in the state it had been in and probably still is, that my $300 plus what I am scheduled to pay next month should be regarded by the landlord as a bonus and dedicated to paying a guy with a truck to take all this garbage away, maybe with some left over to have the electricity upstairs inspected and some finishes done. But the lady who has been living there on the mainfloor thinks we can sneak it out little by little on garbage nights. She informed me that she is now paying rent on the whole house, because if she didn't they were going to make her leave too. This amazed me, and has become my most serious misgiving about the whole venture. How can a landlord charge rent for a space that is full of past tenants' garbage? How can he make new tenants responsible for disposing of it? What are we entering into if we take on all the responsibilities of making it fit for habitation? There are layers of grime we need to deal with here. There may be some mice and I've spotted a couple roaches, but the person downstairs says she's had little sign of either, so it might not be a major problem. With enough work (I don't yet understand where the money for paint and such will come from) they probably can make it an interesting place in a sort of bohemian way, and for now my little room is tolerable while I look for a job or somewhere better to live. It's alright being able to step out the door and walk a couple blocks and be in the busy section of the city. Like I said, I have zero commitment to anything here past the next two weeks. Although my friends might think I bailed on them if I did pull out. I'm just carrying a backpack and a laptop. They will be moving an apartment of furniture into here.
I've never been in a living arrangement with friends before. I'm hopeful about that aspect. I get isolated living alone. I've never put any investment into any place I've lived besides hanging a couple pictures on the wall. So maybe I just don't know what people are willing to do to make a place for themselves. Maybe I'm not as strong as they are. I'm raising the concerns but maybe to them I'm just being whiny. Help me get my perspective on a place where someone is being made to continue paying full rent on a place vacated by others and left full of trash while the landlord and his property management company absolve themselves of all responsibility, even when there may be a couple truckloads of trash here to dispose.
I returned to Toronto last week after spending the summer away. Before I left I got rid of most of my stuff to travel lighter. I came back here hoping to quickly find some sort of modest furnished room/shared accommodation situation. But after spending a couple days looking I began bitching on Facebook about how everyone wants a "young professional/student/international student/female" for their prospective tenant. One of my Facebook friends then replied that she knew someone looking for a tenant.
I arranged to visit Saturday evening while the friend who tipped me off was visiting. I knocked a few times at the back door (where I was told to go) and when no one answered I looked around at the mess in the backyard and decided to move on. But an hour later her former boyfriend (whom I know a lot better and get along with well) sent a text asking where I was. I decided to go back, mostly to see the old friend, arriving after dark. For those who know Toronto, it's at Bloor/Sherbourne, close to the subway and central Toronto, but a challenged area. All around this place is scheduled for redevelopment, and there are some boarded old houses.
In the meantime they and three Mormon missionaries they had enlisted were cleaning. Seems that the former tenants left in a hurry, leaving a terrible mess. The kitchen was full of old food, furniture was left, we found several axes, a complete high end power drill set, an ox yoke, a MacIntosh computer, old television sets, oil lamps, a Wolverine costume, body-building supplements, amplifiers and a microphone with stand, and a teach yourself home electricity manual (someone was doing now unfinished renovations on the top floor). There are a couple rusting barbecues and garbage bicycles sinking into the dirt of the backyard, in addition to maybe twenty black garbage bags of old roof from when that was repaired. Probably lots else that was already bagged and carted out before I ever saw anything. Two floors plus a backyard of crap.
My guy friend showed me around. It was dark and not all the lights worked, but I saw a not disgusting mattress and a small desk. I had been staying for the past couple nights at a travel hostel in a dorm that smelled of wet towels, and knew I needed somewhere to escape that. And by now my two friends had decided they might come in and we could share the whole place. So as we talked it out I decided I'd take a room now while we worked on making the place habitable for when they can join me. I said it would be an adventure. But I made certain that I committed to nothing. I paid $300 for this last half of the month. I can leave without even giving notice. As we left the woman who lived there instructed us to all grab a garbage bag from the porch to take down to the street to leave on property set aside for the redevelopment plans. Because someone on the street had told her that "everyone does it", and the city will take it away. I muttered things like "this is nuts" and "get a guy with a truck" and "illegal dumping" but still I carried my two bags down.
My friends returned to do more cleaning yesterday. They moved a deckful of more garbage into the back yard. I proposed that since the place was clearly unfit to be rented in the state it had been in and probably still is, that my $300 plus what I am scheduled to pay next month should be regarded by the landlord as a bonus and dedicated to paying a guy with a truck to take all this garbage away, maybe with some left over to have the electricity upstairs inspected and some finishes done. But the lady who has been living there on the mainfloor thinks we can sneak it out little by little on garbage nights. She informed me that she is now paying rent on the whole house, because if she didn't they were going to make her leave too. This amazed me, and has become my most serious misgiving about the whole venture. How can a landlord charge rent for a space that is full of past tenants' garbage? How can he make new tenants responsible for disposing of it? What are we entering into if we take on all the responsibilities of making it fit for habitation? There are layers of grime we need to deal with here. There may be some mice and I've spotted a couple roaches, but the person downstairs says she's had little sign of either, so it might not be a major problem. With enough work (I don't yet understand where the money for paint and such will come from) they probably can make it an interesting place in a sort of bohemian way, and for now my little room is tolerable while I look for a job or somewhere better to live. It's alright being able to step out the door and walk a couple blocks and be in the busy section of the city. Like I said, I have zero commitment to anything here past the next two weeks. Although my friends might think I bailed on them if I did pull out. I'm just carrying a backpack and a laptop. They will be moving an apartment of furniture into here.
I've never been in a living arrangement with friends before. I'm hopeful about that aspect. I get isolated living alone. I've never put any investment into any place I've lived besides hanging a couple pictures on the wall. So maybe I just don't know what people are willing to do to make a place for themselves. Maybe I'm not as strong as they are. I'm raising the concerns but maybe to them I'm just being whiny. Help me get my perspective on a place where someone is being made to continue paying full rent on a place vacated by others and left full of trash while the landlord and his property management company absolve themselves of all responsibility, even when there may be a couple truckloads of trash here to dispose.
"... what I learned yesterday gives me further misgivings about what we may be entering into."
Full stop. Do not pass go. Do not get $200. Walk away.
I often find with things like living quarters and things that revolve around security and safety that you should listen to you GUT.
posted by absquatulate at 3:24 PM on September 16, 2013
Full stop. Do not pass go. Do not get $200. Walk away.
I often find with things like living quarters and things that revolve around security and safety that you should listen to you GUT.
posted by absquatulate at 3:24 PM on September 16, 2013
Response by poster: Oh, they've seen it. They've been the ones cleaning out all the crap. They have animals (two dogs, a cat and a rabbit), so maybe for them it's even harder to find a place to rent than being an older shy guy who has a difficult time finding a stable job.
posted by TimTypeZed at 3:26 PM on September 16, 2013
posted by TimTypeZed at 3:26 PM on September 16, 2013
The actual work sounds kind of cool. Landlord sounds hella sketch. I would not rent from a landlord who was screwing over the lady on the first floor and keeping the place in such bad repair.
Can you all go in together on another place?
Down at heel is one thing; if the place were just shabby and in need of a good cleaning but was affordable, I'd say to go for it. But full of garbage? That the landlord expects you to dispose of illegally? If he wants it disposed of illegally, let him come and do it and risk whatever penalties exist.
posted by Frowner at 3:26 PM on September 16, 2013 [4 favorites]
Can you all go in together on another place?
Down at heel is one thing; if the place were just shabby and in need of a good cleaning but was affordable, I'd say to go for it. But full of garbage? That the landlord expects you to dispose of illegally? If he wants it disposed of illegally, let him come and do it and risk whatever penalties exist.
posted by Frowner at 3:26 PM on September 16, 2013 [4 favorites]
This is bizarre and raises a load of red flags e.g. have the previous axe-owning tenants still got a key to the place, or might want their stuff back. A couple of important things.
1. Say "no" to this illegal dumping of trash, because it's illegal and you'll be the one in trouble if caught. Why on earth are you taking all the risk?
2. Pay no-one any more money connected with this place. Use the time you have there to look for something better.
3. If you don't feel safe, for either yourself or your laptop, then move.
posted by Wordshore at 3:28 PM on September 16, 2013 [2 favorites]
1. Say "no" to this illegal dumping of trash, because it's illegal and you'll be the one in trouble if caught. Why on earth are you taking all the risk?
2. Pay no-one any more money connected with this place. Use the time you have there to look for something better.
3. If you don't feel safe, for either yourself or your laptop, then move.
posted by Wordshore at 3:28 PM on September 16, 2013 [2 favorites]
To continue: the landlord is a slumlord. He's expecting his tenants to be so desperate and so socially vulnerable that they will put up with his antics. That means he will be perpetually trying to screw you over.
Now, if the place is cheap enough and you're desperate enough and you're committed to some hard work, that might be tolerable. Just roll with what he throws at you, pay for an electrician yourselves and be prepared to be out on your ear in a couple of years. If the rent is low enough, that might be worth it. Around here, for instance, $300/month is about where I'd start considering something like this because I'd be saving enough on rent to make the inconveniences tolerable.
If you do this, deal with the roaches right away and get a cat if the existing cats do not mouse.
posted by Frowner at 3:28 PM on September 16, 2013 [5 favorites]
Now, if the place is cheap enough and you're desperate enough and you're committed to some hard work, that might be tolerable. Just roll with what he throws at you, pay for an electrician yourselves and be prepared to be out on your ear in a couple of years. If the rent is low enough, that might be worth it. Around here, for instance, $300/month is about where I'd start considering something like this because I'd be saving enough on rent to make the inconveniences tolerable.
If you do this, deal with the roaches right away and get a cat if the existing cats do not mouse.
posted by Frowner at 3:28 PM on September 16, 2013 [5 favorites]
Leave this place as soon as you can.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 3:37 PM on September 16, 2013
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 3:37 PM on September 16, 2013
Maybe I'm chicken, but I refuse to live someplace where they've been doing amateur electrical work --- and the fact that not all the lights work proves just HOW bad at it they are. Ditto those chunks of old roofing you were all hauling out: if a pro had done the roof work, they'd have removed the debris.
And that illegal dumping? What it says to me is that they have no boundaries: they're gonna do whatever they want..... and if what they want involves your personal property, too bad for you.
So: a possible electrical-fire in the making under a probably-gonna-leak roof, living with sketchy people. Might I suggest you keep looking?!?
posted by easily confused at 4:20 PM on September 16, 2013 [3 favorites]
And that illegal dumping? What it says to me is that they have no boundaries: they're gonna do whatever they want..... and if what they want involves your personal property, too bad for you.
So: a possible electrical-fire in the making under a probably-gonna-leak roof, living with sketchy people. Might I suggest you keep looking?!?
posted by easily confused at 4:20 PM on September 16, 2013 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: Yeah, I was leaning toward using my time to look for another place for the first of the month. Although most shared furnished places you find as a single tenant not wanting to pay too much money have some dodgy aspects. If I can't find any place here I can live healthy, guess it's time to leave Toronto. I just thought that this woman on the main floor has been there alone seven years with the ax-men above her, and wants to stay, so there must be some way it is doable. There are families living in the houses next door, and the houses will stay if the surrounding condos are built. And hardy people must deal with this kind of thing when they take residence in warehouses and lofts and other unusual living arrangements. But the garbage issue seems totally nuts to me. And the rent isn't any great deal. I just needed clarification.
posted by TimTypeZed at 4:23 PM on September 16, 2013
posted by TimTypeZed at 4:23 PM on September 16, 2013
Speaking as a landlord, I would strongly recommend AVOID AVOID AVOID.
posted by thomas j wise at 5:02 PM on September 16, 2013
posted by thomas j wise at 5:02 PM on September 16, 2013
Best answer: NO NO NO NO NO
sorry to get all capsy there, but this entire thing right down to the garbage and the mice HAS HAPPENED TO ME BEFORE. NO.
I seriously did the whole table-flip thing with my laptop and like, security guard from metal gear solid popped up a big explanation point above my head with a corny sound effect.
What are we entering into if we take on all the responsibilities of making it fit for habitation?
I doubt anything legally you should be afraid of(and don't they have pretty aggressively tenant focused rental laws up there? i know they're more robust than my state in the US), you're just getting fucked over for free labor. You're providing value to the landlord and not getting compensated for it. If they want you to do that for them they should either be paying you, or offering you a cut on the rent. You're getting hosed here.
The money for paint and such will be expected to come from you. The landlord is happily hoping you guys will just fix the place up to live in it and then leave them with no work to do. Completely expect the kind of slumlord garbage like being expected to replace fridges and such on your own dime(or maybe they'll chip in "part of the cost") despite the fact that's mostly illegal in the US, and as far as i know canada as well.
I walked in to a situation like this, and it got worse than i could POSSIBLY imagine. I had some stupid funny drunken times there, but everything about the actual living situation is one of my worst regrets. Any time you need anything form these landlords they will either try and turn it around and make the problem somehow your fault and on you to solve, or just outright ignore you.
You will end up in a leaky shithole full of mice/rats/roaches while garbage water leaks on your bed when you're out of the house. The electrical shit is scary(and ha, that was part of my place too!) and will constantly cause weird problems or short out and fuck up things you own or possibly even start a fire.
And hardy people must deal with this kind of thing when they take residence in warehouses and lofts and other unusual living arrangements.
That's because they get something tangible out of that work. Then you live, often for quite cheap, in a place with lots of square footage that you can have shows in, band practice, do major art projects, weld, store your burning man camper, whatever you want and construct the internal space however you please. You're getting a lego set instead of a happy meal toy that most rentals are. You are getting none of that here, just essentially a broken toy and being sold a bill of goods.
Oh, and as a closing note i'll also say i ended up in the shithole i did because my roommate had a dog(that i loved!) and it was one of the only places we could find that would allow us to keep him with us. Never. Again. Let the pet people go off and find a shithole that allows their pets. It's one thing if they're yours, but don't be drug into that mess of everyone denying you because of the pets if it isn't even your pets. That's not your battle to fight and not your consequences to accept.
The only way this would be remotely acceptable is if it was in a very cool location and very cheap, and you were fully willing to accept how shitty it was to get that. Even then it would have serious problems, but i'd at least understand(The shithole place i put up wi- i mean lived in was INSANELY cheap, like "no fucking way!" cheap and right on the edge of a great area people payed out the ass to live in. I beat myself with that justification every time something bad happened and eventually it just wasn't worth it). This has nothing going for it on that front.
Keep looking, even in expensive areas there's usually some kind of place or deal you can work to get a reasonable spot. Somehow my friends manage to find them even in expensive as shit places like the bay area or brooklyn(or the expensive parts of seattle, tbh). Toronto shouldn't be impossible.
Oh, and do not stay too long here as a stepping stone or you will encounter major turbulence with these people when you try and move on. Hit that wall more than once too. You might have to punch some friendships in the balls to get out of this and wait for them to heal. Be ready to do that if you spend more than a couple weeks or a month there, since you'll become defacto part of the situation in their minds.
posted by emptythought at 5:23 PM on September 16, 2013 [6 favorites]
sorry to get all capsy there, but this entire thing right down to the garbage and the mice HAS HAPPENED TO ME BEFORE. NO.
I seriously did the whole table-flip thing with my laptop and like, security guard from metal gear solid popped up a big explanation point above my head with a corny sound effect.
What are we entering into if we take on all the responsibilities of making it fit for habitation?
I doubt anything legally you should be afraid of(and don't they have pretty aggressively tenant focused rental laws up there? i know they're more robust than my state in the US), you're just getting fucked over for free labor. You're providing value to the landlord and not getting compensated for it. If they want you to do that for them they should either be paying you, or offering you a cut on the rent. You're getting hosed here.
The money for paint and such will be expected to come from you. The landlord is happily hoping you guys will just fix the place up to live in it and then leave them with no work to do. Completely expect the kind of slumlord garbage like being expected to replace fridges and such on your own dime(or maybe they'll chip in "part of the cost") despite the fact that's mostly illegal in the US, and as far as i know canada as well.
I walked in to a situation like this, and it got worse than i could POSSIBLY imagine. I had some stupid funny drunken times there, but everything about the actual living situation is one of my worst regrets. Any time you need anything form these landlords they will either try and turn it around and make the problem somehow your fault and on you to solve, or just outright ignore you.
You will end up in a leaky shithole full of mice/rats/roaches while garbage water leaks on your bed when you're out of the house. The electrical shit is scary(and ha, that was part of my place too!) and will constantly cause weird problems or short out and fuck up things you own or possibly even start a fire.
And hardy people must deal with this kind of thing when they take residence in warehouses and lofts and other unusual living arrangements.
That's because they get something tangible out of that work. Then you live, often for quite cheap, in a place with lots of square footage that you can have shows in, band practice, do major art projects, weld, store your burning man camper, whatever you want and construct the internal space however you please. You're getting a lego set instead of a happy meal toy that most rentals are. You are getting none of that here, just essentially a broken toy and being sold a bill of goods.
Oh, and as a closing note i'll also say i ended up in the shithole i did because my roommate had a dog(that i loved!) and it was one of the only places we could find that would allow us to keep him with us. Never. Again. Let the pet people go off and find a shithole that allows their pets. It's one thing if they're yours, but don't be drug into that mess of everyone denying you because of the pets if it isn't even your pets. That's not your battle to fight and not your consequences to accept.
The only way this would be remotely acceptable is if it was in a very cool location and very cheap, and you were fully willing to accept how shitty it was to get that. Even then it would have serious problems, but i'd at least understand(The shithole place i put up wi- i mean lived in was INSANELY cheap, like "no fucking way!" cheap and right on the edge of a great area people payed out the ass to live in. I beat myself with that justification every time something bad happened and eventually it just wasn't worth it). This has nothing going for it on that front.
Keep looking, even in expensive areas there's usually some kind of place or deal you can work to get a reasonable spot. Somehow my friends manage to find them even in expensive as shit places like the bay area or brooklyn(or the expensive parts of seattle, tbh). Toronto shouldn't be impossible.
Oh, and do not stay too long here as a stepping stone or you will encounter major turbulence with these people when you try and move on. Hit that wall more than once too. You might have to punch some friendships in the balls to get out of this and wait for them to heal. Be ready to do that if you spend more than a couple weeks or a month there, since you'll become defacto part of the situation in their minds.
posted by emptythought at 5:23 PM on September 16, 2013 [6 favorites]
Oh and as a bonus thing, when i left a place like this the landlord tried to bill us for the damage to the place that existed(or was covered up with one coat of paint, or some expanding foam, etc) when we showed up or resulted from things like pests or the roof leaking that we had reported. She sent us to collections for a whole shitload of money and ate the deposit of anyone who had put any in. It was a fucking nightmare and an epilogue to what had been a shitty place.
Oh, and they quit paying our garbage bill when they got extra bills for extra bags... Didn't even try and pass them off to us which had also been shitty, but just ignored them and let them go delinquent. This of course happened from picking up all the leftover garbage exactly like your place. So we had basically no garbage pickup and ended up with even more bags of garbage and especially recycling that the city/county/etc wouldn't come collect. We eventually paid to have it disposed of at the transfer station in a borrowed truck, which i'm sure was exactly the landlords plan.("They won't just live in and surounded by garbage, and then it won't be our problem!")
This is future you stepping out of the delorean.(seriously, i'm almost FREAKED OUT how similar this story is, holy fuck). This is a mistake.
I wish any of the other people who lived there with me posted on here so i could get them to come in and regale you with how bad of an idea this is. But yea.
posted by emptythought at 5:29 PM on September 16, 2013
Oh, and they quit paying our garbage bill when they got extra bills for extra bags... Didn't even try and pass them off to us which had also been shitty, but just ignored them and let them go delinquent. This of course happened from picking up all the leftover garbage exactly like your place. So we had basically no garbage pickup and ended up with even more bags of garbage and especially recycling that the city/county/etc wouldn't come collect. We eventually paid to have it disposed of at the transfer station in a borrowed truck, which i'm sure was exactly the landlords plan.("They won't just live in and surounded by garbage, and then it won't be our problem!")
This is future you stepping out of the delorean.(seriously, i'm almost FREAKED OUT how similar this story is, holy fuck). This is a mistake.
I wish any of the other people who lived there with me posted on here so i could get them to come in and regale you with how bad of an idea this is. But yea.
posted by emptythought at 5:29 PM on September 16, 2013
You know what I think would happen if you stayed? You guys would put in the work and maybe a bunch of money, get the place looking nice and habitable, and then the landlord would realise he can now charge a bunch more rent for it. So your rent will get raised, or he will kick you out and find those young professionals once the place is within the realms of what young professionals will put up with.
Unless the place is RIGHT NOW in a state that you are happy to live in for the amount of rent you are paying, move as soon as you can. If you decide to stay, get good renters' insurance, and don't put a penny more of your own money into the place than you are willing to pay for SHORT TERM increased comfort. I.e. if you need to spend $20 to buy some paint for your bedroom, and you decide that this would bring you more pleasure this week than going to the movies or ordering pizza or whatever else costs $20, fine. If you have an electrician's bill for $800, consider whether you would pay $800 for a month's worth of improved lighting, because that's maybe all the enjoyment you will get out of it if you are on a month-to-month contract and the landlord kicks you out.
posted by lollusc at 7:03 PM on September 16, 2013
Unless the place is RIGHT NOW in a state that you are happy to live in for the amount of rent you are paying, move as soon as you can. If you decide to stay, get good renters' insurance, and don't put a penny more of your own money into the place than you are willing to pay for SHORT TERM increased comfort. I.e. if you need to spend $20 to buy some paint for your bedroom, and you decide that this would bring you more pleasure this week than going to the movies or ordering pizza or whatever else costs $20, fine. If you have an electrician's bill for $800, consider whether you would pay $800 for a month's worth of improved lighting, because that's maybe all the enjoyment you will get out of it if you are on a month-to-month contract and the landlord kicks you out.
posted by lollusc at 7:03 PM on September 16, 2013
Another thing i didn't mention, is that at least in the US, which means i may be sphincter typing here, but i just wanted to set an example... it's quite possible that any improvements not approved by the landlord(and usually in writing, check the lease!) are against the terms of the lease/rental agreement.
Which is to say, they could be aware you're cleaning up the place and fixing things... and then kick you out after you've paid your own money to fix things that they're possibly legally obligated to fix themselves anyways... because you fixed them. They kick you out, throw on some finishing touches, and rent it for whatever the market rate is for the now nicer place it is.
which is to say, lollusc is bringing up very good points here that they could turn on you as soon as you cleaned up their mess for them. Above and beyond my points that they'll simply be useless and the place will be a perpetual problem.
This isn't some wildly likely scenario, but even uncovering your ass in such a way that it's possible is far in to shitty and "why bother" territory in my mind.
posted by emptythought at 3:08 AM on September 17, 2013
Which is to say, they could be aware you're cleaning up the place and fixing things... and then kick you out after you've paid your own money to fix things that they're possibly legally obligated to fix themselves anyways... because you fixed them. They kick you out, throw on some finishing touches, and rent it for whatever the market rate is for the now nicer place it is.
which is to say, lollusc is bringing up very good points here that they could turn on you as soon as you cleaned up their mess for them. Above and beyond my points that they'll simply be useless and the place will be a perpetual problem.
This isn't some wildly likely scenario, but even uncovering your ass in such a way that it's possible is far in to shitty and "why bother" territory in my mind.
posted by emptythought at 3:08 AM on September 17, 2013
Response by poster: The more I think about it the more I see that the landlord could get them from six different directions. They could improve things and then have that held against them. Maybe it's not even so much the landlords that are the agents of disaster here. Maybe they lost on the last tenants, have seen the state of things and would just prefer the lady downstairs move out so they can go in a different direction. She's kind of quirky, and maybe she's drawing people into a bad scene in a wrong-headed effort to hold onto her place. (Still, the landlords are probably slumlords.)
For me, I've slept a little better the last couple nights than I did for my three nights sharing a room with three other guys in a hostel, and it's cheaper here than thirty something bucks a night there, so I'll get through the next couple weeks okay. Continuing to scan craigslist and send the odd inquiry. If I close the door and look around my room here it's not much different than other cheap places I've lived in older houses. Probably better than some. Now I'm wondering how to inform my friends without getting grief from the person downstairs while I'm here. I thought my friends would have until the end of this month before they'd need give notice on the place they're living now, but when I wrote to them about learning that the women downstairs was now paying for the whole house, I mentioned that I could go along little by little see how it goes, but they'd be all in once they give notice. The reply I received was something like "lol, realized I was late on giving notice, yeah we're all in now".
posted by TimTypeZed at 5:48 AM on September 17, 2013
For me, I've slept a little better the last couple nights than I did for my three nights sharing a room with three other guys in a hostel, and it's cheaper here than thirty something bucks a night there, so I'll get through the next couple weeks okay. Continuing to scan craigslist and send the odd inquiry. If I close the door and look around my room here it's not much different than other cheap places I've lived in older houses. Probably better than some. Now I'm wondering how to inform my friends without getting grief from the person downstairs while I'm here. I thought my friends would have until the end of this month before they'd need give notice on the place they're living now, but when I wrote to them about learning that the women downstairs was now paying for the whole house, I mentioned that I could go along little by little see how it goes, but they'd be all in once they give notice. The reply I received was something like "lol, realized I was late on giving notice, yeah we're all in now".
posted by TimTypeZed at 5:48 AM on September 17, 2013
Can you see if this dump could pass a city inspection and/or is considered habitable?
Call your local code enforcement agency and see IF there's a Certificate of Occupancy, then see if it's for a multi tenant structure.
I suspect that this building will have neither of those things and will have hundreds of code violations in the bargain.
Keep looking. There's no good place this can go.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 6:06 AM on September 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
Call your local code enforcement agency and see IF there's a Certificate of Occupancy, then see if it's for a multi tenant structure.
I suspect that this building will have neither of those things and will have hundreds of code violations in the bargain.
Keep looking. There's no good place this can go.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 6:06 AM on September 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Well, I fled that situation. Downstairs lady hadn't yet accepted my interac payment for $300, and after more nonsense (front door left wide open two days in a row because she usually used the side and didn't know how to properly lock the front - after seven years!) I cancelled the payment and left. Bouncing around hostels again (took a private room tonight since nothing else was available and I saved on the last two nights) and everywhere seems booked for tomorrow, but at least I escaped that black hole. Hoping one landlord who replied back tonight will proceed further soon. Thanks for the advice.
posted by TimTypeZed at 8:13 PM on September 17, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by TimTypeZed at 8:13 PM on September 17, 2013 [3 favorites]
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You should definitely make sure that the friends moving in come by to see the place before they move their furniture - they might be more annoyed at you for not warning them away than for moving out yourself!
posted by jacalata at 3:21 PM on September 16, 2013