Why does my dog seem okay?
July 6, 2013 12:00 AM Subscribe
How long can a dog really stay in a parked car?
I am new to dog ownership and thoughtless. Today I left my black lab in a parked car for 90 minutes in the sun and 80 degree temperatures with a bowl of water and the windows partly down. Again, no idea what I was thinking. I now understand even fifteen minutes of that was pretty much a death sentence and feel terrible -- except that he seems fine. Is he actually fine? If not, what should I do for him? If so, how did he survive? I won't do it again either way, but I want to know if I should treat him for heat damage and/or better understand what happened.
Take it easy with him for the next day or so, make sure he has plenty of enticing options to help him rehydrate (does he like ice cubes in his water?), keep an eye on him for signs of distress (not eating/drinking enough, lethargy, etc.) but it sounds like he'll be fine.
And, pics please!
posted by arnicae at 12:04 AM on July 6, 2013 [1 favorite]
And, pics please!
posted by arnicae at 12:04 AM on July 6, 2013 [1 favorite]
I don't know the official rule of thumb but anywhere over 20 deg. (roughly 70 fahrenheit) and I will go out of my way to park in the shade and not leave him for longer than half an hour. 30 or higher and I simply won't do it, I'll go out of my way to take him home or if I really have to I'll get him out and tie him up somewhere in the shade.
But yeah for now I think it sounds like your guy is fine, don't worry about it.
posted by mannequito at 12:09 AM on July 6, 2013
But yeah for now I think it sounds like your guy is fine, don't worry about it.
posted by mannequito at 12:09 AM on July 6, 2013
I disagree with the "don't worry about it" comments. You made a huge error and you are lucky that he is ok. Watch him closely for the next few days.... When you know better, you do better and it sounds like you know that you messed up so going forward, don't do that again. And maybe check with his vet to be sure he doesn't need a check up.
posted by pearlybob at 12:14 AM on July 6, 2013 [20 favorites]
posted by pearlybob at 12:14 AM on July 6, 2013 [20 favorites]
Not to make you feel worse, but it's a bad idea to leave the windows even partly down when your dog is in the car, because outside events can trigger him to jump out, placing him in greater danger. Warning: In this recent video, a Rotweiler is fatally shot by a police officer, after jumping out of an open car window to follow its owner as the owner confronts the police officer. A big dog like a Lab, on the loose, is seen by many as an immediate threat, and even what you might see as a curious approach on the part of the dog, will be perceived by others as a "dog attack," putting your dog in great danger. So that's a second reason to keep in mind and avoid doing it, whenever you're tempted to leave your dog in the car, even for a minute.
posted by paulsc at 12:20 AM on July 6, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by paulsc at 12:20 AM on July 6, 2013 [2 favorites]
This Weather.com article tells about signs of heat stroke in a dog. I would suggest taking him to the vet anyway even if he doesn't show signs. They can take his temperature there and make sure he is okay.
Even with the windows down, it can quickly get 20+ degrees hotter in as little as a few minutes. It can much much higher than that, especially after 90 minutes.
This chart shows how the temperature can rise in your vehicle even with the windows down. It looks like there will be at least a 45 degree increase after only 60 minutes, with the windows cracked. That could be as much as 125 degrees or more.
Take your dog to the vet. He may not be okay but it can be hard to tell. Don't do it again.
Summary of conclusion for quick reference for anyone interested:
CONCLUSIONS
When temperatures exceed 80 F (26.7C) potentially lethal temperatures of 105 F (40.6C) plus can be reached in less than 20 minutes and when they exceed 88 F (31.1C) lethal readings can be reached in 10 minutes or less. Only minor mitigation achieved by “cracking” the windows or having a vehicle of larger size or a lighter color.
posted by Crystalinne at 12:47 AM on July 6, 2013 [10 favorites]
Even with the windows down, it can quickly get 20+ degrees hotter in as little as a few minutes. It can much much higher than that, especially after 90 minutes.
This chart shows how the temperature can rise in your vehicle even with the windows down. It looks like there will be at least a 45 degree increase after only 60 minutes, with the windows cracked. That could be as much as 125 degrees or more.
Take your dog to the vet. He may not be okay but it can be hard to tell. Don't do it again.
Summary of conclusion for quick reference for anyone interested:
CONCLUSIONS
When temperatures exceed 80 F (26.7C) potentially lethal temperatures of 105 F (40.6C) plus can be reached in less than 20 minutes and when they exceed 88 F (31.1C) lethal readings can be reached in 10 minutes or less. Only minor mitigation achieved by “cracking” the windows or having a vehicle of larger size or a lighter color.
posted by Crystalinne at 12:47 AM on July 6, 2013 [10 favorites]
Mod note: Comment deleted. OP has already clearly stated he won't do it again; please don't comment just to scold.
posted by taz (staff) at 1:26 AM on July 6, 2013 [9 favorites]
posted by taz (staff) at 1:26 AM on July 6, 2013 [9 favorites]
Dogs often seem okay when they aren't. Especially as a new owner, you probably aren't as aware of your dog's way of expressing discomfort/pain. I've had my dog for years and sometimes, I still can't really tell if she's having an upset-stomach-day or if she's just tired.
I suggest keeping lots of water out for him and being very mindful of his behaviour over the next few days. If he seems to be extra lethargic or slow to grab his favourite foods, I would take him to the vet straightaway. If you want to be really safe, take him to the vet right now.
posted by cyml at 1:32 AM on July 6, 2013
I suggest keeping lots of water out for him and being very mindful of his behaviour over the next few days. If he seems to be extra lethargic or slow to grab his favourite foods, I would take him to the vet straightaway. If you want to be really safe, take him to the vet right now.
posted by cyml at 1:32 AM on July 6, 2013
I think the danger of being left in a car increases inversely to size. That's why you or I might be okay, but a baby would not be. A small dog would get heated all the way through much more quickly than a large one, so a full-grown lab probably has a bit of an advantage there. Also if he was able to move around and get down into a shady bit in a footwell or something, he probably wouldn't have heated up so quickly. (In the sun he would be in extra trouble because of the black fur, though.)
I still think you got very lucky, but those are some reasons why you maybe got lucky this time.
posted by lollusc at 1:33 AM on July 6, 2013
I still think you got very lucky, but those are some reasons why you maybe got lucky this time.
posted by lollusc at 1:33 AM on July 6, 2013
Just an anecdotal note: My lab (about 80 pounds) LOVES to ride in the car, even when it is hot. I usually take her with me and leave the windows down for her and she is totally fine. I don't take her when it is over 80 F, but she's never been bothered by it. That said, she's an outdoor dog who lives in the South, where it is routinely over 100 degrees on any given day between May and September.
This is not an explicit endorsement to ride around with your dog in the car when it is hot, but just saying that dogs are probably all different and if your dog seems fine, then keep an eye on her and let it go.
posted by mrfuga0 at 2:25 AM on July 6, 2013 [2 favorites]
This is not an explicit endorsement to ride around with your dog in the car when it is hot, but just saying that dogs are probably all different and if your dog seems fine, then keep an eye on her and let it go.
posted by mrfuga0 at 2:25 AM on July 6, 2013 [2 favorites]
You left the windows down and I would think you got lucky and due to your parking location and the kind of car you have it wasn't much hotter in the car than outside. Some cars get hotter than others, particularly if the dog could get out of the sun (ie was not stuck in the back of a hatchback or in a pickup with a huge window facing the sun and no backseat to retreat to).
I now understand even fifteen minutes of that was pretty much a death sentence
All the charts and PSAa and such that people are linking to that say your dog could die in minutes talk about a car with closed or merely "cracked" windows, which imho means an inch or less or opening and basically no air circulation.
The point about the dog jumping out is a good one although, realistically, I think a dog is about one million times more likely to be run over or lost than shot by a passing police officer if it were to jump out of a parked car.
posted by fshgrl at 3:22 AM on July 6, 2013 [1 favorite]
I now understand even fifteen minutes of that was pretty much a death sentence
All the charts and PSAa and such that people are linking to that say your dog could die in minutes talk about a car with closed or merely "cracked" windows, which imho means an inch or less or opening and basically no air circulation.
The point about the dog jumping out is a good one although, realistically, I think a dog is about one million times more likely to be run over or lost than shot by a passing police officer if it were to jump out of a parked car.
posted by fshgrl at 3:22 AM on July 6, 2013 [1 favorite]
My dog, Spawn of Satan, (my wife insists on calling her Tippy) has lineage straight from the pit of Hell, which explains her heat tolerance.
I tie her out where she has access to shade and asphalt, gravel, grass and water. She insists on baking on the asphalt. It's impossible to tell if it affects her negatively, as she is at heart, an enormous collection of mostly negative things. If she died, l would also have trouble telling, especially if I used smell as the criteria, since she smells like death kinda anyway.
Point is... even when they can self-regulate, they apparently have a lot more tolerance for heat than humans. Still, I would never think of leaving her in a car for more than a few minutes, though, summer or winter. She's just too tiny and precious to risk and since I hate her so much, I'd never find another dog who fills that need and I have to be rather conservative. Did I mention how much I dislike her. She can't even do simple algebra. Useless.
Still, no car on a hot day. Nothing smells worse than cooked dog unless it's my dog. Phew.
posted by FauxScot at 3:37 AM on July 6, 2013 [41 favorites]
I tie her out where she has access to shade and asphalt, gravel, grass and water. She insists on baking on the asphalt. It's impossible to tell if it affects her negatively, as she is at heart, an enormous collection of mostly negative things. If she died, l would also have trouble telling, especially if I used smell as the criteria, since she smells like death kinda anyway.
Point is... even when they can self-regulate, they apparently have a lot more tolerance for heat than humans. Still, I would never think of leaving her in a car for more than a few minutes, though, summer or winter. She's just too tiny and precious to risk and since I hate her so much, I'd never find another dog who fills that need and I have to be rather conservative. Did I mention how much I dislike her. She can't even do simple algebra. Useless.
Still, no car on a hot day. Nothing smells worse than cooked dog unless it's my dog. Phew.
posted by FauxScot at 3:37 AM on July 6, 2013 [41 favorites]
I now understand even fifteen minutes of that was pretty much a death sentence
Obviously not. Maybe it could have been in some worst-case scenario, but it wasn't. Maybe your car is white or silver or beige, so that it doesn't absorb as much energy as the dark blue test vehicles in the study Crystalinne linked to. Maybe the interior started out fairly cool, because the car had been parked in a shady garage earlier or because you had been driving around with the AC on for a while. Maybe a big cargo van parked next to your car, shading it while you were gone. We don't have enough detail about the situation to guess how hot it might've gotten in your particular car on that particular day, but the physics are a little more complex than (car+sun)*15 minutes=dead dog. The point of all the hooplah around this topic is that the temperature in a closed or mostly-closed vehicle can sometimes rise to hazardous levels faster than most people would guess. You might get away with it. but it's easy to misjudge so you shouldn't make it a habit or be cavalier about it. Anyhow, even temperatures that don't kill an animal can be very unpleasant; you could probably survive for quite a while in 120F if you had some ventilation and a supply of water, but you wouldn't like it.
posted by jon1270 at 4:05 AM on July 6, 2013 [3 favorites]
Obviously not. Maybe it could have been in some worst-case scenario, but it wasn't. Maybe your car is white or silver or beige, so that it doesn't absorb as much energy as the dark blue test vehicles in the study Crystalinne linked to. Maybe the interior started out fairly cool, because the car had been parked in a shady garage earlier or because you had been driving around with the AC on for a while. Maybe a big cargo van parked next to your car, shading it while you were gone. We don't have enough detail about the situation to guess how hot it might've gotten in your particular car on that particular day, but the physics are a little more complex than (car+sun)*15 minutes=dead dog. The point of all the hooplah around this topic is that the temperature in a closed or mostly-closed vehicle can sometimes rise to hazardous levels faster than most people would guess. You might get away with it. but it's easy to misjudge so you shouldn't make it a habit or be cavalier about it. Anyhow, even temperatures that don't kill an animal can be very unpleasant; you could probably survive for quite a while in 120F if you had some ventilation and a supply of water, but you wouldn't like it.
posted by jon1270 at 4:05 AM on July 6, 2013 [3 favorites]
I also live in the south and have a big Lab that loves to ride. I use the 80 degree cut-off point, too. Anything 80 or over and Remi stays home, no matter how much she gives me "the look". But 90 minutes is a long time to stay in the car, even at a cool temp. None of us can say how close your doggie came to getting too hot, but 90 minutes in the sun with temps in 80's sounds like you were pretty lucky to get out of it with a healthy dog.
posted by raisingsand at 7:08 AM on July 6, 2013
posted by raisingsand at 7:08 AM on July 6, 2013
According to the ASPCA, leaving a dog alone in a parked car is illegal in some states.
Dog are more susceptible to heat stroke than people, because they cannot sweat. Also, large breeds are *more* susceptible to heat stroke than smaller breeds. Anecdata, but my coworker took her mastiff with her to march in a parade on Memorial Day in moderate heat and sun, and he died a few hours later from heat stroke; it was simply too hot for him to be marching a parade route.
Obviously, you were not marching around with your dog or otherwise exerting him, but my point is that a temperature that seems uncomfortably hot to a person may be downright dangerous for a dog.
I might take him in just to have him checked out; like others have said, he may be showing signs of distress in ways you don't recognize. But from what I've personally witnessed, heat stroke is pretty obvious--frantic panting, drooling, acting confused. And yes, I've seen more than one dog get heat stroke--dogs with careful owners who were not doing anything wrong other than letting their dog run around on a really hot day.
Leaving the dog in the car was a mistake, but I'm so glad to hear that you recognize that. I don't think a lot of people take this seriously, judging by the number of dogs baking in parked cars that I encounter each summer. :(
posted by whistle pig at 7:15 AM on July 6, 2013 [5 favorites]
Dog are more susceptible to heat stroke than people, because they cannot sweat. Also, large breeds are *more* susceptible to heat stroke than smaller breeds. Anecdata, but my coworker took her mastiff with her to march in a parade on Memorial Day in moderate heat and sun, and he died a few hours later from heat stroke; it was simply too hot for him to be marching a parade route.
Obviously, you were not marching around with your dog or otherwise exerting him, but my point is that a temperature that seems uncomfortably hot to a person may be downright dangerous for a dog.
I might take him in just to have him checked out; like others have said, he may be showing signs of distress in ways you don't recognize. But from what I've personally witnessed, heat stroke is pretty obvious--frantic panting, drooling, acting confused. And yes, I've seen more than one dog get heat stroke--dogs with careful owners who were not doing anything wrong other than letting their dog run around on a really hot day.
Leaving the dog in the car was a mistake, but I'm so glad to hear that you recognize that. I don't think a lot of people take this seriously, judging by the number of dogs baking in parked cars that I encounter each summer. :(
posted by whistle pig at 7:15 AM on July 6, 2013 [5 favorites]
if it's been a few days your dog is probably fine. there are many factors that go into how hot your car gets and what your dog can tolerate. you were just lucky this time. the real danger, i think, isn't that a dog can never survive in a car for some period of time, but that if often you can take longer than you originally think.
posted by cupcake1337 at 7:49 AM on July 6, 2013
posted by cupcake1337 at 7:49 AM on July 6, 2013
Response by poster: Thanks to everyone so far. I really do feel lucky; the thought of what I could have come back to is a sad and troubling one. And I really appreciate the data and experiences shared even though it's difficult to talk about "the line" for something that shouldn't and won't happen again.
For posterity, these are the additional mitigators I noticed after reading these answers:
I didn't plan any of those factors except the AC; it could have turned out much worse. He's been getting all the water he wants and his usual active self. My wife is checking his capillary refill time. If we see anything unusual, we'll take him in.
posted by michaelh at 8:21 AM on July 6, 2013
For posterity, these are the additional mitigators I noticed after reading these answers:
- Light colored car
- Large dog, but inactive during
- Large car (van) full of air-conditioned air and shady spots between the seats
- large SUV on the sun side provided partial shade
- Windows were open further than they should have been
- Wasn't delayed in any unexpected way (i.e. it could have easily been even longer)
I didn't plan any of those factors except the AC; it could have turned out much worse. He's been getting all the water he wants and his usual active self. My wife is checking his capillary refill time. If we see anything unusual, we'll take him in.
posted by michaelh at 8:21 AM on July 6, 2013
Starting off with A/C is a big help, as are the other factors. He survived because of these and the fairly open windows, and he's fine. When you got in the car and cranked up the A/C, he was able to cool down promptly. I've had to leave my dog in the car for unexpected reasons on sunny, hot days, and have covered the windows with the blankets that live in the car and with newspapers, which helps control the heat. Welcome to dog ownership.
posted by theora55 at 9:06 AM on July 6, 2013
posted by theora55 at 9:06 AM on July 6, 2013
You might find this recent video of a vet who closed himself in a hot car for 30 minutes enlightening.
posted by AnOrigamiLife at 4:10 PM on July 6, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by AnOrigamiLife at 4:10 PM on July 6, 2013 [1 favorite]
Yeah, death sentence is way too harsh -- I mean, obviously some people feel that way, and I would not have done this now, but before people were really aware of this I can tell you it happened all the time.* We took our family dog to Florida several times, among other trips, and I'm sure that meant many mealtimes and what not stuck in the car in the sun (I mean, we would choose the shade that was available, but...). She basically would crawl down into the deepest part of the foot wells and rest quietly.
So yes, in many cases this is easily survivable, just not very comfortable.
Don't beat yourself up, just arm yourself with the gift of knowledge going forward. It's a problem for us with our family dog today, as like many dogs she simply loves a car ride, but unless we have absolutely no stops planned we have to refuse her.
* I mean, jeez, we were even one of the many people who would (occasionally) loop the dog's leash around the trailer hitch. Vacation performed a public service by putting that habit in the past for many people, I'm sure. But the point is people decided to stop writing these things off as freak accidents and thinking about the chain of decisions that could impact the life or health of their pet.
posted by dhartung at 6:35 PM on July 6, 2013
So yes, in many cases this is easily survivable, just not very comfortable.
Don't beat yourself up, just arm yourself with the gift of knowledge going forward. It's a problem for us with our family dog today, as like many dogs she simply loves a car ride, but unless we have absolutely no stops planned we have to refuse her.
* I mean, jeez, we were even one of the many people who would (occasionally) loop the dog's leash around the trailer hitch. Vacation performed a public service by putting that habit in the past for many people, I'm sure. But the point is people decided to stop writing these things off as freak accidents and thinking about the chain of decisions that could impact the life or health of their pet.
posted by dhartung at 6:35 PM on July 6, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by TonyRobots at 12:02 AM on July 6, 2013 [4 favorites]