I need to end it. Please help me find the words.
June 10, 2013 6:38 AM Subscribe
The short version of how I got here – love my husband but fell in love with someone else. It’s not fair to him but I just don’t know how to say what I need to say. (Much) longer version inside.
My husband and I met in our early 20s, have been together over a decade, only married in the last few years, no kids. I’ve always been really proud of our relationship, which was really warm, supportive and happy. The only weak link was our sex life. I have only orgasmed with him a handful of times. I’m fine alone, but he couldn’t really get me there and wasn’t very open about talking about sex. I was young and we were both embarrassed. When he was finished it was finished. He’d ask sometimes (after a few years, when I’d brought up my dissatisfaction a lot) if he could do something for me? But I never felt he minded one way or the other – my cuming wasn’t an integral part of the sex, more like an add-on (that’s how it felt). So I got in a routine of sex with him for bonding, and because you have sex with your partner, and masturbating alone for orgasms (he was never into watching me and didn’t really like when I did it as part of sex as he read it as a criticism.) But everything else about the relationship was great, and he’s a great guy in a billion ways, so I just accepted it as a “can’t have everything” type of deal. I feel bad because I know I rejected him quite a lot, and on his side I know he wishes I made more of an effort – I’m not a “dress-up” kind of gal, so I’m not saying the blame is all on him or anything.
Then I met someone through work. There is no other way to describe it other than I fell in love with him really fast – before I really realised what I was feeling – and it took nearly a year before I told him. When I did, turned out he felt the same. There is absolutely no justification and I know it, but we started an affair. I literally had no idea sex could be like that. He is totally open and earthy, no inhibitions, he made it his business to learn how to make me cum, and I finally get the idea of the total connection sex creates between two people. He was married, but left his wife within a couple of months (I do not feel good about this but I admire that unlike me he couldn’t live a lie). He wants me to leave too and be with him. The connection is emotional and intellectual, not just physical, and I know I’d be so happy with him.
I know that whether I am with the other man or not I need to leave my husband because of what I've done. He deserves way, way more than this. He has never been anything but good to me. I can’t stand deceiving him and I hate the person I am now and how I’m living my life. But I just do not know what to say. I don’t want to say I’m leaving for someone else – I know there are two schools of thought on this and I’m in the “I don’t want to hurt him so badly just to clear my conscience” one so I’m not looking advice on that. I know that if I strip everything else away it comes down to the fact that the sexual element of our relationship doesn’t work, and never really did. I have been in therapy, me and my husband have recently been in couple’s therapy – as I have told him there are issues and we talked about the sex – and he has told me if I don’t see a future with him to stop wasting his time. I know this. I need to stop wasting it. But I really do love the person he is and I can’t imagine not being with him. I hate the thought of hurting him. I don’t know how I could say “It’s because I don’t want to have sex with you” because I could live my life with the rest of our relationship – although it isn’t as deep as with the other guy - but I can’t face a lifetime of feeling disappointed to the point of tears after sex (which has happened many times.) But that just doesn’t seem like a valid reason to end a long happy relationship, and I don’t want to leave him feeling inadequate.
I feel totally trapped by my cowardice, and I just can’t seem to get the words out of my mouth, or think how to structure the sentence, or find the right time. Any advice on figuring this nightmare out is appreciated. Please memail me if you'd prefer to answer privately, particularly if you've been in the same situation. Thank you.
My husband and I met in our early 20s, have been together over a decade, only married in the last few years, no kids. I’ve always been really proud of our relationship, which was really warm, supportive and happy. The only weak link was our sex life. I have only orgasmed with him a handful of times. I’m fine alone, but he couldn’t really get me there and wasn’t very open about talking about sex. I was young and we were both embarrassed. When he was finished it was finished. He’d ask sometimes (after a few years, when I’d brought up my dissatisfaction a lot) if he could do something for me? But I never felt he minded one way or the other – my cuming wasn’t an integral part of the sex, more like an add-on (that’s how it felt). So I got in a routine of sex with him for bonding, and because you have sex with your partner, and masturbating alone for orgasms (he was never into watching me and didn’t really like when I did it as part of sex as he read it as a criticism.) But everything else about the relationship was great, and he’s a great guy in a billion ways, so I just accepted it as a “can’t have everything” type of deal. I feel bad because I know I rejected him quite a lot, and on his side I know he wishes I made more of an effort – I’m not a “dress-up” kind of gal, so I’m not saying the blame is all on him or anything.
Then I met someone through work. There is no other way to describe it other than I fell in love with him really fast – before I really realised what I was feeling – and it took nearly a year before I told him. When I did, turned out he felt the same. There is absolutely no justification and I know it, but we started an affair. I literally had no idea sex could be like that. He is totally open and earthy, no inhibitions, he made it his business to learn how to make me cum, and I finally get the idea of the total connection sex creates between two people. He was married, but left his wife within a couple of months (I do not feel good about this but I admire that unlike me he couldn’t live a lie). He wants me to leave too and be with him. The connection is emotional and intellectual, not just physical, and I know I’d be so happy with him.
I know that whether I am with the other man or not I need to leave my husband because of what I've done. He deserves way, way more than this. He has never been anything but good to me. I can’t stand deceiving him and I hate the person I am now and how I’m living my life. But I just do not know what to say. I don’t want to say I’m leaving for someone else – I know there are two schools of thought on this and I’m in the “I don’t want to hurt him so badly just to clear my conscience” one so I’m not looking advice on that. I know that if I strip everything else away it comes down to the fact that the sexual element of our relationship doesn’t work, and never really did. I have been in therapy, me and my husband have recently been in couple’s therapy – as I have told him there are issues and we talked about the sex – and he has told me if I don’t see a future with him to stop wasting his time. I know this. I need to stop wasting it. But I really do love the person he is and I can’t imagine not being with him. I hate the thought of hurting him. I don’t know how I could say “It’s because I don’t want to have sex with you” because I could live my life with the rest of our relationship – although it isn’t as deep as with the other guy - but I can’t face a lifetime of feeling disappointed to the point of tears after sex (which has happened many times.) But that just doesn’t seem like a valid reason to end a long happy relationship, and I don’t want to leave him feeling inadequate.
I feel totally trapped by my cowardice, and I just can’t seem to get the words out of my mouth, or think how to structure the sentence, or find the right time. Any advice on figuring this nightmare out is appreciated. Please memail me if you'd prefer to answer privately, particularly if you've been in the same situation. Thank you.
You've written this question far more coherently than a huge majority of similar questions on this site. Have you tried writing him a letter? Even if you think it's not right to have him read the letter, it could help you figure out the right words to say to him. Then you could even read it out loud, to yourself first, for practice, and then to him.
posted by Mizu at 6:48 AM on June 10, 2013 [4 favorites]
posted by Mizu at 6:48 AM on June 10, 2013 [4 favorites]
Aw, man. This is rough. And it's gonna get rougher before it gets smoother, I can guarantee. But you're not bad or evil, and this isn't a cataclysmic event - it's so, so very common that there's even a NAME for it ("starter marriage"?... you're soaking in it!). You COULD waste time flailing around and self-flagellating and marinating in pain and guilt. But that is self-indulgent at best, destructive at worst. So since you asked - here's what you do:
- Know this, for now and for the future: you can break up with anyone, at any time, for any reason, and it doesn't make you a bad person. It's HOW you handle it that determines your character. You've already kinda mishandled this one with the affair... but there is still plenty of opportunity for you to behave nobly and kindly going forward.
- You do not now, do not EVER let your (eventual ex-) husband know you had an affair. I know I will catch flack for this, but I don't care. You know the aphorism "can't hurt, might help"? Telling him CANNOT POSSIBLY HELP, and will DEFINITELY hurt. So don't do it. Spare his feelings.
- No matter how well you think you know someone, when you initiate a divorce, you will start to become alien to one another. That's just how it works. So if you possibly can, sock away a little money for yourself beforehand.
- Every day you spend dragging this out is a day you are denying both yourself and your eventual-ex a shot at a better, more well-suited life. SO DON'T DO THAT. Don't rush into it, guns blazing, of course... but nor should you wait months.
- You may want to enlist the help of a therapist to figure out the least-traumatic way to break the news. Just a random thought.
posted by julthumbscrew at 6:49 AM on June 10, 2013 [21 favorites]
- Know this, for now and for the future: you can break up with anyone, at any time, for any reason, and it doesn't make you a bad person. It's HOW you handle it that determines your character. You've already kinda mishandled this one with the affair... but there is still plenty of opportunity for you to behave nobly and kindly going forward.
- You do not now, do not EVER let your (eventual ex-) husband know you had an affair. I know I will catch flack for this, but I don't care. You know the aphorism "can't hurt, might help"? Telling him CANNOT POSSIBLY HELP, and will DEFINITELY hurt. So don't do it. Spare his feelings.
- No matter how well you think you know someone, when you initiate a divorce, you will start to become alien to one another. That's just how it works. So if you possibly can, sock away a little money for yourself beforehand.
- Every day you spend dragging this out is a day you are denying both yourself and your eventual-ex a shot at a better, more well-suited life. SO DON'T DO THAT. Don't rush into it, guns blazing, of course... but nor should you wait months.
- You may want to enlist the help of a therapist to figure out the least-traumatic way to break the news. Just a random thought.
posted by julthumbscrew at 6:49 AM on June 10, 2013 [21 favorites]
He already told you he doesn't want you to waste his time. So let him know that you won't waste it anymore.
But make sure you're in a safe place. You haven't mentioned a temper, but some people who are uncommunicative about things that cause then shame can really lash out in anger. Please figure out how to protect yourself even if you think he wouldn't hurt a fly.
Consider not doing it in person and moving all your stuff out while he's at work.
posted by discopolo at 6:53 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
But make sure you're in a safe place. You haven't mentioned a temper, but some people who are uncommunicative about things that cause then shame can really lash out in anger. Please figure out how to protect yourself even if you think he wouldn't hurt a fly.
Consider not doing it in person and moving all your stuff out while he's at work.
posted by discopolo at 6:53 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
You don't need an excuse to leave your husband, and you're not required to leave because you are having this affair. You *want* to leave, and that is enough.
Your husband knows you want out - he asked you to stop wasting his time if you don't see a future with him. I think it would be truthful to say that you love so many things about him and your relationship but it's not working for you and you don't see a way to make it work, so you are leaving.
At some point you have to gather your courage and say the words, whatever words you find. You're not doing either one of you any favors by living in this limbo.
One caution - you don't know how happy you will be with the other guy. I'm not saying stay in your marriage if it's wrong for you, but I'm saying you don't know what a real relationship, out in the open with the same boredom and frustrations of daily life, will be until you get there.
posted by KAS at 6:55 AM on June 10, 2013 [8 favorites]
Your husband knows you want out - he asked you to stop wasting his time if you don't see a future with him. I think it would be truthful to say that you love so many things about him and your relationship but it's not working for you and you don't see a way to make it work, so you are leaving.
At some point you have to gather your courage and say the words, whatever words you find. You're not doing either one of you any favors by living in this limbo.
One caution - you don't know how happy you will be with the other guy. I'm not saying stay in your marriage if it's wrong for you, but I'm saying you don't know what a real relationship, out in the open with the same boredom and frustrations of daily life, will be until you get there.
posted by KAS at 6:55 AM on June 10, 2013 [8 favorites]
Are you still engaged in a sexual relationship with your husband? I hope you are using protection with both men, because nobody deserves to believe they're in a monogamous relationship when the other person is exposing them to third parties and all the risks that entails.
I hate the thought of hurting him.
Too late. Tell him. He deserves to know.
he has told me if I don’t see a future with him to stop wasting his time.
That's an invitation to be direct. Being indirect hasn't helped either of you or your relationship. So be direct.
posted by headnsouth at 6:56 AM on June 10, 2013 [7 favorites]
I hate the thought of hurting him.
Too late. Tell him. He deserves to know.
he has told me if I don’t see a future with him to stop wasting his time.
That's an invitation to be direct. Being indirect hasn't helped either of you or your relationship. So be direct.
posted by headnsouth at 6:56 AM on June 10, 2013 [7 favorites]
Telling him CANNOT POSSIBLY HELP, and will DEFINITELY hurt.
Things that would hurt worse: if he finds out in six months that he has a shiny new STD.
Please don't tell him you're leaving him because the sex is bad. You may not want to tell him that you were carrying on an affair for a while. You do need to tell him that you slept with someone else, especially if he's assuming that he is safe from the risks you've taken.
It sounds to me like your husband already knows something is up. So stop wasting his time. Tell him it isn't working. If you both want to do it this way, you can move out for a while and you guys can keep going to couples' counseling. If not, don't. There isn't an easy way to do this because it isn't (and shouldn't be) an easy thing to do.
posted by goodbyewaffles at 6:56 AM on June 10, 2013 [4 favorites]
Things that would hurt worse: if he finds out in six months that he has a shiny new STD.
Please don't tell him you're leaving him because the sex is bad. You may not want to tell him that you were carrying on an affair for a while. You do need to tell him that you slept with someone else, especially if he's assuming that he is safe from the risks you've taken.
It sounds to me like your husband already knows something is up. So stop wasting his time. Tell him it isn't working. If you both want to do it this way, you can move out for a while and you guys can keep going to couples' counseling. If not, don't. There isn't an easy way to do this because it isn't (and shouldn't be) an easy thing to do.
posted by goodbyewaffles at 6:56 AM on June 10, 2013 [4 favorites]
My single piece of advice in this is please don't try to tell your husband why you drew apart from him. You tried during your marriage and he couldn't hear it and it would be doubly painful for him if he were to hear something from you that could be interpreted as "this wouldn't be happening if only you..." or "you could salvage this even now if you were to..." Just end it.
Okay, one more thing: there are a lot of men who are really good at sex but not so good at the rest of the relationship. Take it slowly with new guy. I mean, definitely spend lots of time cavorting when you are free to do so but just realize that the rest of it has changed and don't jump into anything permanent or sticky.
posted by janey47 at 6:59 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Okay, one more thing: there are a lot of men who are really good at sex but not so good at the rest of the relationship. Take it slowly with new guy. I mean, definitely spend lots of time cavorting when you are free to do so but just realize that the rest of it has changed and don't jump into anything permanent or sticky.
posted by janey47 at 6:59 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
You know, your reasons are just a red herring. You cheated, you're in love and you want to be with the new guy. That's all that matters. It doesn't paint either you or your new partner in a very nice light.
Here's what I glean from this, that instead of working out your problems with your husband, instead of being honest with him and facing your marital problems, you chose to turn to someone else without giving your marriage a chance.
So. What's going to change in your new relationship? If something else is lacking, will you again turn to another person instead of working it out with your partner?
I think you should be honest with your husband and split because at this point there's nothing to salvage. You may want to get into couples therapy so that you can both work on as amicable split as is possible under the circumstances.
You need to be in separate therapy for yourself, because rather than rock the boat on the sex issue, you just fled your marriage. Before you enter another relationship, you need to understand why you let the situation drag on as long as it did, with you being unfulfilled and resentful.
Also, you and your new partner need to think about why it is that you are both so eager to get out of a marriage and with each other. There's a saying, "He'll/She'll do it with you, he'll/she'll do it to you." You are both people who are fundamentally dishonest with your partners. That is NO foundation to build a relationship on. So while doing couples thereapy with your husband, you might want to see if you can get a deal on couples therapy with your new man too.
Absolutely leave your husband, but don't jump into an all consuming relationship with the new guy. That way lies madness.
Be kind to your husband, don't lay the problems of your marriage at his feet. It's not because he didn't do X, Y or Z that you cheated. You cheated because you wanted to. You cheated because for whatever reasons, it was easier than confronting the issues in your marriage. You cheated and you get to bounce right into a new, fun relationship and your husband gets to move on knowing that you're happy and he's not.
There is no way this is going to be easy and frankly, why should it be?
Cheating hurts partners at a cellular level. It's an intimate betrayal. You had lots of options and you chose to cheat. I'm hoping you can learn from this and grow from it.
Good luck.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 7:07 AM on June 10, 2013 [79 favorites]
Here's what I glean from this, that instead of working out your problems with your husband, instead of being honest with him and facing your marital problems, you chose to turn to someone else without giving your marriage a chance.
So. What's going to change in your new relationship? If something else is lacking, will you again turn to another person instead of working it out with your partner?
I think you should be honest with your husband and split because at this point there's nothing to salvage. You may want to get into couples therapy so that you can both work on as amicable split as is possible under the circumstances.
You need to be in separate therapy for yourself, because rather than rock the boat on the sex issue, you just fled your marriage. Before you enter another relationship, you need to understand why you let the situation drag on as long as it did, with you being unfulfilled and resentful.
Also, you and your new partner need to think about why it is that you are both so eager to get out of a marriage and with each other. There's a saying, "He'll/She'll do it with you, he'll/she'll do it to you." You are both people who are fundamentally dishonest with your partners. That is NO foundation to build a relationship on. So while doing couples thereapy with your husband, you might want to see if you can get a deal on couples therapy with your new man too.
Absolutely leave your husband, but don't jump into an all consuming relationship with the new guy. That way lies madness.
Be kind to your husband, don't lay the problems of your marriage at his feet. It's not because he didn't do X, Y or Z that you cheated. You cheated because you wanted to. You cheated because for whatever reasons, it was easier than confronting the issues in your marriage. You cheated and you get to bounce right into a new, fun relationship and your husband gets to move on knowing that you're happy and he's not.
There is no way this is going to be easy and frankly, why should it be?
Cheating hurts partners at a cellular level. It's an intimate betrayal. You had lots of options and you chose to cheat. I'm hoping you can learn from this and grow from it.
Good luck.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 7:07 AM on June 10, 2013 [79 favorites]
You can't break up with someone without both of you feeling bad. There are miserable divorces and horrible divorces. Mine was reasonably miserable. I think all the things I did to try to make it less miserable, made it more miserable. A clean, decisive break would have been better.
You can't reject someone without their feeling rejected. But you can leave him free to find someone he'll have a better dynamic with, and not waste his time, like he asked.
Only you can know how your husband will react to your having an affair. If he's at all sensitive, he probably suspects. If he asks "is there someone else," are you going to lie to him? Why bring a lie into a divorce? In some ways, it's easier to take a relative rejection -- "I don't feel for you what I feel for him" -- than an absolute rejection -- "I'd rather be single than with you."
posted by musofire at 7:08 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
You can't reject someone without their feeling rejected. But you can leave him free to find someone he'll have a better dynamic with, and not waste his time, like he asked.
Only you can know how your husband will react to your having an affair. If he's at all sensitive, he probably suspects. If he asks "is there someone else," are you going to lie to him? Why bring a lie into a divorce? In some ways, it's easier to take a relative rejection -- "I don't feel for you what I feel for him" -- than an absolute rejection -- "I'd rather be single than with you."
posted by musofire at 7:08 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Can I suggest counselling with the goal of breaking up more peaceably? With a counselor as mediator you may be able to say what you need to say. And he may be able to say what he needs to say.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 7:16 AM on June 10, 2013
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 7:16 AM on June 10, 2013
he has told me if I don’t see a future with him to stop wasting his time.
So tell him: "I'm sorry. I love you and I wish the best for you. Despite all we have, there's not enough for me here and I don't see a future with you."
posted by DarlingBri at 7:19 AM on June 10, 2013 [5 favorites]
So tell him: "I'm sorry. I love you and I wish the best for you. Despite all we have, there's not enough for me here and I don't see a future with you."
posted by DarlingBri at 7:19 AM on June 10, 2013 [5 favorites]
Your husband has told how he wants it ended. You want to end it.
Do the right thing and oblige him. You're dragging this out for pretty selfish reasons.
posted by PsuDab93 at 7:28 AM on June 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
Do the right thing and oblige him. You're dragging this out for pretty selfish reasons.
posted by PsuDab93 at 7:28 AM on June 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
Oh, and do yourself a favor and re-read what Ruthless Bunny wrote.
That person dropped science on you.
posted by PsuDab93 at 7:34 AM on June 10, 2013 [8 favorites]
That person dropped science on you.
posted by PsuDab93 at 7:34 AM on June 10, 2013 [8 favorites]
I think people who are saying that you chose not to work on your marriage are missing where you said you've been in couples counseling and that you've had these ongoing problems of his selfishness/lack of consideration in your sex life for the entire relationship.
Yeah, having an affair is wrong. You're clearly beating yourself up pretty sufficiently over it, though - and that's something you're going to have to deal with eventually; sure, you need to feel bad, but it's more important to learn from this than to scourge yourself and wear the hair shirt forever.
To tell him - I'd make a list. Where are you going to live? Because you ended it, you can expect to have to move out of where ever you're living. What about money? As someone mentioned above, things change when a relationship ends; it can get ugly, and you shouldn't count on being able to easily negotiate financial matters. So can you support yourself alone? Are you afraid of his response? Do you need to take your physical safety into account? You know him best -- do you think presenting it to him as a done deal "I've seen a lawyer" kind of thing is best, or would it be better to just sit him down and tell him that it's over and you want the two of you to figure out how to handle the split together? You might want to consider talking to your couples counselor alone and get their perspective. And good luck.
posted by lemniskate at 7:46 AM on June 10, 2013 [25 favorites]
Yeah, having an affair is wrong. You're clearly beating yourself up pretty sufficiently over it, though - and that's something you're going to have to deal with eventually; sure, you need to feel bad, but it's more important to learn from this than to scourge yourself and wear the hair shirt forever.
To tell him - I'd make a list. Where are you going to live? Because you ended it, you can expect to have to move out of where ever you're living. What about money? As someone mentioned above, things change when a relationship ends; it can get ugly, and you shouldn't count on being able to easily negotiate financial matters. So can you support yourself alone? Are you afraid of his response? Do you need to take your physical safety into account? You know him best -- do you think presenting it to him as a done deal "I've seen a lawyer" kind of thing is best, or would it be better to just sit him down and tell him that it's over and you want the two of you to figure out how to handle the split together? You might want to consider talking to your couples counselor alone and get their perspective. And good luck.
posted by lemniskate at 7:46 AM on June 10, 2013 [25 favorites]
but I can’t face a lifetime of feeling disappointed to the point of tears after sex (which has happened many times.) But that just doesn't seem like a valid reason to end a long happy relationship
No that's a super valid reason.
I’ve always been really proud of our relationship, which was really warm, supportive and happy. The only weak link was our sex life.
This is a broken link, not a weak one. Unfortunately if you look around AskMe this is a mistake a lot of young women (but not only of course) seem to make, entering into sexually unfulfilled relationships at a relatively young age and then just hanging out there forever. If someone won't make the effort to do me right, they are not right for me.
As Ruthless Bunny points out you chose to let this situation linger for a very long time. This was a critical flaw in your relationship that you left largely un-addressed because you got some shitty push back from your insecure partner. Things are going to be wrong in a relationship there are going to be flaws; flaws become 'problems' when they are not proactively addressed.
I'd go for honesty. 'Our marriage was deeply troubled and unfulfilling, instead of leaving I've found someone new and now I have to stop lying to both of us'
posted by French Fry at 7:50 AM on June 10, 2013 [16 favorites]
No that's a super valid reason.
I’ve always been really proud of our relationship, which was really warm, supportive and happy. The only weak link was our sex life.
This is a broken link, not a weak one. Unfortunately if you look around AskMe this is a mistake a lot of young women (but not only of course) seem to make, entering into sexually unfulfilled relationships at a relatively young age and then just hanging out there forever. If someone won't make the effort to do me right, they are not right for me.
As Ruthless Bunny points out you chose to let this situation linger for a very long time. This was a critical flaw in your relationship that you left largely un-addressed because you got some shitty push back from your insecure partner. Things are going to be wrong in a relationship there are going to be flaws; flaws become 'problems' when they are not proactively addressed.
I'd go for honesty. 'Our marriage was deeply troubled and unfulfilling, instead of leaving I've found someone new and now I have to stop lying to both of us'
posted by French Fry at 7:50 AM on June 10, 2013 [16 favorites]
I'm not sure what to tell you to say when you tell him it's over. But I can tell you the part I wish people understood about being the one who gets left when the marriage ends. And maybe that will help you choose your words.
Maybe your husband will have trouble accepting it's over. Maybe it will hurt him to let you go. But the thing that is most soul-crushing about being the one who gets left isn't losing the other person. It's had to get to that point without seeing the writing on the wall. The hardest part is losing your entire idea of what the rest of your life would be and you don't feel like you got any say.
I don't know that there is a solution to that. But having been in similar shoes as he is about to step into, it's what I wish my ex had understood.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:05 AM on June 10, 2013 [7 favorites]
Maybe your husband will have trouble accepting it's over. Maybe it will hurt him to let you go. But the thing that is most soul-crushing about being the one who gets left isn't losing the other person. It's had to get to that point without seeing the writing on the wall. The hardest part is losing your entire idea of what the rest of your life would be and you don't feel like you got any say.
I don't know that there is a solution to that. But having been in similar shoes as he is about to step into, it's what I wish my ex had understood.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:05 AM on June 10, 2013 [7 favorites]
I'll cut against the grain here, and say that there are things in a marriage relationship that are way more important than sex. Your post appears to indicate that your marriage has all of those things. Your marriage may not yet be beyond saving, but it requires a decision by you to examine and potentially rearrange your priorities.
However, you also appear to have made your decision to leave. Ruthless_Bunny's advice is solid. Tell the truth as to why you are leaving: Because you wanted better sex. There's no point in lying about it or attempting to sugar-coat it or spin it in some way that makes it easier for your husband or paints you in a better light.
The best you can do is be honest, make no excuses for your behavior and own your choices.
posted by DWRoelands at 8:07 AM on June 10, 2013 [4 favorites]
However, you also appear to have made your decision to leave. Ruthless_Bunny's advice is solid. Tell the truth as to why you are leaving: Because you wanted better sex. There's no point in lying about it or attempting to sugar-coat it or spin it in some way that makes it easier for your husband or paints you in a better light.
The best you can do is be honest, make no excuses for your behavior and own your choices.
posted by DWRoelands at 8:07 AM on June 10, 2013 [4 favorites]
I normally agree with Ruthless Bunny but:
a) It sounds to me like you did try to save your marriage, with couples therapy and some frank conversation about failing sex;
b) I see no value in the "no holds barred, total honesty" approach that basically results in you leaving your husband and telling him it's because he sucks in bed. Splits are devastating enough; there's no need to destroy his ego and uttterly sap his ego when there may be someone out there with whom he's simply more sexually compatible.
posted by DarlingBri at 8:11 AM on June 10, 2013 [16 favorites]
a) It sounds to me like you did try to save your marriage, with couples therapy and some frank conversation about failing sex;
b) I see no value in the "no holds barred, total honesty" approach that basically results in you leaving your husband and telling him it's because he sucks in bed. Splits are devastating enough; there's no need to destroy his ego and uttterly sap his ego when there may be someone out there with whom he's simply more sexually compatible.
posted by DarlingBri at 8:11 AM on June 10, 2013 [16 favorites]
It doesn't matter if you hate the thought of hurting him. When you began this affair, you made the choice to hurt him and you can't go back and undo that. It's apparent you don't want to go back and unmake that choice. It's time to minimize the damage, be a grown-up, and leave. You absolutely cannot hold onto both of these men, and trying to do so is selfish and cruel. Exactly how you frame the break-up is probably a lot less important than the fact that you need to do it. Period.
posted by moxie_milquetoast at 8:28 AM on June 10, 2013 [4 favorites]
posted by moxie_milquetoast at 8:28 AM on June 10, 2013 [4 favorites]
This sentence of the OP is a non sequitur to me:
me and my husband have recently been in couple’s therapy – as I have told him there are issues and we talked about the sex – and he has told me if I don’t see a future with him to stop wasting his time.
Did your husband talk about your not seeing a future and not wasting his time as a direct result of couples therapy? Did he say this because you sought couples therapy, or because of what you discussed during therapy? What did he say during couples therapy? What did he do afterwards? I would have been more clear on your own feelings and relationship if you had instead written (or would now clarify):
me and my husband have recently been in couple’s therapy – as I have told him there are issues and we talked about the sex – but even in therapy, he refused to discuss our sexual issues, and instead of cooperating during therapy, he has told me if I don’t see a future with him to stop wasting his time.
You are asking how to explain to your husband why you need a divorce, without describing yourself as someone who ruined a decade-long relationship for mere sexual pleasure from another man. If my rewrite of your question has any truth, you can tell your husband his refusal to address the sexual issues in your marriage, even during counseling, showed you that he didn't think the marriage was worth saving. You're not divorcing him because he's a selfish lover who cares only about his orgasms to the exclusion of yours. You're divorcing him because he's selfish husband who refuses to work on problems affecting you, even though a solution to this marital crisis fits, literally, in the palm of his hand.
He may not feel his refusal to address your sexual fulfillment merited your affair or divorce. But one spouse doesn't get to decide what the dealbreakers are for another spouse. DirtyOldTown says the most tragic part of divorce for the abandoned spouse is "losing your entire idea of what the rest of your life would be and you don't feel like you got any say." Again, if my assumptions about your counseling are correct, if my re-write of your question is accurate, your husband had a say in whether he got to spend the rest of his life with you. When you invoked couples counseling, he had agency on whether he got to remain your husband. It seemed he passed on that chance.
posted by hhc5 at 8:36 AM on June 10, 2013 [18 favorites]
me and my husband have recently been in couple’s therapy – as I have told him there are issues and we talked about the sex – and he has told me if I don’t see a future with him to stop wasting his time.
Did your husband talk about your not seeing a future and not wasting his time as a direct result of couples therapy? Did he say this because you sought couples therapy, or because of what you discussed during therapy? What did he say during couples therapy? What did he do afterwards? I would have been more clear on your own feelings and relationship if you had instead written (or would now clarify):
me and my husband have recently been in couple’s therapy – as I have told him there are issues and we talked about the sex – but even in therapy, he refused to discuss our sexual issues, and instead of cooperating during therapy, he has told me if I don’t see a future with him to stop wasting his time.
You are asking how to explain to your husband why you need a divorce, without describing yourself as someone who ruined a decade-long relationship for mere sexual pleasure from another man. If my rewrite of your question has any truth, you can tell your husband his refusal to address the sexual issues in your marriage, even during counseling, showed you that he didn't think the marriage was worth saving. You're not divorcing him because he's a selfish lover who cares only about his orgasms to the exclusion of yours. You're divorcing him because he's selfish husband who refuses to work on problems affecting you, even though a solution to this marital crisis fits, literally, in the palm of his hand.
He may not feel his refusal to address your sexual fulfillment merited your affair or divorce. But one spouse doesn't get to decide what the dealbreakers are for another spouse. DirtyOldTown says the most tragic part of divorce for the abandoned spouse is "losing your entire idea of what the rest of your life would be and you don't feel like you got any say." Again, if my assumptions about your counseling are correct, if my re-write of your question is accurate, your husband had a say in whether he got to spend the rest of his life with you. When you invoked couples counseling, he had agency on whether he got to remain your husband. It seemed he passed on that chance.
posted by hhc5 at 8:36 AM on June 10, 2013 [18 favorites]
I'm on the side of not revealing the affair but that's because that's what I'd want if someone cheated on me. I'd rather find out much later, after I'd had some time to work through just the basics of the loss. Do I need to feel rejected, inadequate and deceived during that process too? But some people want the truth. Has your husband ever indicated what he would want either directly or covertly, say while watching a tv show or discussing other people's relationships?
Yes, there are things in marriage that are more important than sex, but having a sex life that leaves you on the verge of tears every time you go there with your partner? I can't see a marriage like that surviving.
posted by amycup at 8:43 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Yes, there are things in marriage that are more important than sex, but having a sex life that leaves you on the verge of tears every time you go there with your partner? I can't see a marriage like that surviving.
posted by amycup at 8:43 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
I actually think that if you were to be honest and direct and say, “Husband, I’m leaving you because our sex life is unfulfilling and I need a partner who cares about my needs” –- that could possibly help him learn to be successful in future relationships. It’s not about technique or ability, it’s his lack of consideration for you in the bedroom. Bad sex is a very legitimate dealbreaker.
That said, I agree with Ruthless Bunny that it would be a good idea to take a lot of time to yourself to think about why you let this relationship drag on as unsatisfying as it was, and why you were only able to end it when you found someone else. It sounds like these issues were there from the beginning, before you got married, but you still decided to make a promise to this guy to love and be faithful to him for the rest of your life.
posted by Asparagus at 8:46 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
That said, I agree with Ruthless Bunny that it would be a good idea to take a lot of time to yourself to think about why you let this relationship drag on as unsatisfying as it was, and why you were only able to end it when you found someone else. It sounds like these issues were there from the beginning, before you got married, but you still decided to make a promise to this guy to love and be faithful to him for the rest of your life.
posted by Asparagus at 8:46 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
When you invoked couples counseling, he had agency on whether he got to remain your husband.
We can't know what he was thinking, but perhaps the fact that an active affair was happening during the couples counseling dimmed the husband's view of the enterprise somewhat.
posted by ftm at 8:54 AM on June 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
We can't know what he was thinking, but perhaps the fact that an active affair was happening during the couples counseling dimmed the husband's view of the enterprise somewhat.
posted by ftm at 8:54 AM on June 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
Is this accurate? You have a pretty good marriage that could be salvaged if your husband ngot better at sex. You had an affair and learned about great sex.
A therapist trained in sex therapy could help your husband learn to be a lot better at sex.
But I think you're really done with your marriage, but haven't fully realized it. Talk to a therapist who can help you sort out your feelings and be certain that you're done with the marriage. Then end it.
posted by theora55 at 9:02 AM on June 10, 2013
A therapist trained in sex therapy could help your husband learn to be a lot better at sex.
But I think you're really done with your marriage, but haven't fully realized it. Talk to a therapist who can help you sort out your feelings and be certain that you're done with the marriage. Then end it.
posted by theora55 at 9:02 AM on June 10, 2013
Oh man, I try to avoid these, but absolutely:
You were stuck in a loveless marriage. You guys were great friends and roommates who had sex, but not lovers. Period.
There's all kinds of situations where someone gets married, and then the sex gets less hot, and then they cheat for sex. Those people suck. This is not you.
You have, according to your post, never had a sexual connection. You have been together for a decade and have only orgasmed with him a handful of times?
This is not the 1950s. You don't have to stay in an unhappy marriage forever. You are right to leave him.
posted by corb at 9:04 AM on June 10, 2013 [17 favorites]
You were stuck in a loveless marriage. You guys were great friends and roommates who had sex, but not lovers. Period.
There's all kinds of situations where someone gets married, and then the sex gets less hot, and then they cheat for sex. Those people suck. This is not you.
You have, according to your post, never had a sexual connection. You have been together for a decade and have only orgasmed with him a handful of times?
This is not the 1950s. You don't have to stay in an unhappy marriage forever. You are right to leave him.
posted by corb at 9:04 AM on June 10, 2013 [17 favorites]
Also:
People are telling you not to tell him about the affair. But you don't have kids. Is there a potential you might be ordered to pay alimony? If not, do you want to be friends with him later?
If you ever want to be friends with him later, come clean with him now, and be honest from now on. It will make a world of difference.
posted by corb at 9:06 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
People are telling you not to tell him about the affair. But you don't have kids. Is there a potential you might be ordered to pay alimony? If not, do you want to be friends with him later?
If you ever want to be friends with him later, come clean with him now, and be honest from now on. It will make a world of difference.
posted by corb at 9:06 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
I would reveal the affair for one reason: cheating puts the unknowing partner's sexual health at risk and that's not fair to them. They have the right to know who they have been sleeping with by proxy.
The connection is emotional and intellectual, not just physical, and I know I’d be so happy with him.
Be cautious of your feelings for the new guy. You have been looking at that situation through the tint of your failing marriage, so it's going to seem like the perfect thing you were looking for all along. Once things aren't quite so clandestine, this is likely to change.
You and your new partner have both been cheating on your spouses, so neither one of you should be surprised if the other cheats in this relationship. For this reason, I think all hands need to be in therapy if you're to make it work this time around.
posted by futureisunwritten at 9:08 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
The connection is emotional and intellectual, not just physical, and I know I’d be so happy with him.
Be cautious of your feelings for the new guy. You have been looking at that situation through the tint of your failing marriage, so it's going to seem like the perfect thing you were looking for all along. Once things aren't quite so clandestine, this is likely to change.
You and your new partner have both been cheating on your spouses, so neither one of you should be surprised if the other cheats in this relationship. For this reason, I think all hands need to be in therapy if you're to make it work this time around.
posted by futureisunwritten at 9:08 AM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thank you for all your answers. I appreciate that everyone has been considered and not hateful in a situation where judgement is easy.
Just to respond to hhc5 - he was not keen to go to therapy but he went, which I took as a sign of wanting to work on things. He was very uncomfortable talking about the sex as we had a female therapist. He expressed issues he has also had - I could do with losing some weight (he did not say this in a mean way) and he would prefer it if I wore lingerie, for example (this came up as I talked of a time I'd called him into the bathroom when I was in the bath to try to be alluring - ha - and I said he didn't even look at me. He said that was because that particular scenario didn't do it for him). I'm just mentioning this as an indicator that I don't think we're sexually attracted to each other, rather than "he's bad at it". That is the part we have talked about as I've asked him if maybe we've moved into some kind of platonic place, and I think that happened long before I met the other person. He didn't disagree, but he hasn't done anything differently in bed since, and neither have I to be fair. It feels like its too late and too awkward now. I don't know if that clarifies anything tbh. At any point if he had had the attitude of the other guy - lets figure this out together - I think I might have felt differently.
Just to add, I have told the om that if I do leave I want at least 6 months before we would begin a 'real' relationship, as I know that it might turn out that he was a catalyst to realising something was fundamentally wrong rather than the answer. Too late, I know, but maybe better late than never.
posted by outoftime at 9:12 AM on June 10, 2013
Just to respond to hhc5 - he was not keen to go to therapy but he went, which I took as a sign of wanting to work on things. He was very uncomfortable talking about the sex as we had a female therapist. He expressed issues he has also had - I could do with losing some weight (he did not say this in a mean way) and he would prefer it if I wore lingerie, for example (this came up as I talked of a time I'd called him into the bathroom when I was in the bath to try to be alluring - ha - and I said he didn't even look at me. He said that was because that particular scenario didn't do it for him). I'm just mentioning this as an indicator that I don't think we're sexually attracted to each other, rather than "he's bad at it". That is the part we have talked about as I've asked him if maybe we've moved into some kind of platonic place, and I think that happened long before I met the other person. He didn't disagree, but he hasn't done anything differently in bed since, and neither have I to be fair. It feels like its too late and too awkward now. I don't know if that clarifies anything tbh. At any point if he had had the attitude of the other guy - lets figure this out together - I think I might have felt differently.
Just to add, I have told the om that if I do leave I want at least 6 months before we would begin a 'real' relationship, as I know that it might turn out that he was a catalyst to realising something was fundamentally wrong rather than the answer. Too late, I know, but maybe better late than never.
posted by outoftime at 9:12 AM on June 10, 2013
"I don’t want to say I’m leaving for someone else...
Sorry, but after a relationship of ten years, he's entitled to a reason. Not to give him a reason, and leave him wondering makes this situation even more painful and maddening.
By all means, leave if that's what you want to do. But you don't get to go without saying why. It only has to be a simple "I've met someone else." You don't need to say anything more than that (and certainly not the sex stuff).
How he deals with that information is his concern, not yours. You don't get to decide that for him. But after ten years, if you care and respect him as much as you say you do, you have to at least tell him why. He deserves that much. It doesn't even have to be face-to-face. Even a Dear John letter will do. But not nothing. It's way past that.
Good luck to you both.
posted by Capt. Renault at 9:14 AM on June 10, 2013
Sorry, but after a relationship of ten years, he's entitled to a reason. Not to give him a reason, and leave him wondering makes this situation even more painful and maddening.
By all means, leave if that's what you want to do. But you don't get to go without saying why. It only has to be a simple "I've met someone else." You don't need to say anything more than that (and certainly not the sex stuff).
How he deals with that information is his concern, not yours. You don't get to decide that for him. But after ten years, if you care and respect him as much as you say you do, you have to at least tell him why. He deserves that much. It doesn't even have to be face-to-face. Even a Dear John letter will do. But not nothing. It's way past that.
Good luck to you both.
posted by Capt. Renault at 9:14 AM on June 10, 2013
"We've been to counseling and it hasn't helped. I think we should end our marriage. I love you, but we're both not getting what we need or deserve. I'm sorry."
Don't ever ever ever mention the affair. Process that away from your ex and the break up of your marriage.
I think you should talk to a lawyer first to get coaching on breaking the news and protecting your interests, because I strongly suspect a man who tells you in couples therapy that his failure is your problem will undoubtedly turn into an asshole once you call it quits with him. I mean, isn't this kinda how things got to this point in the first place??
Lawyer. Break up. Move on.
Good luck.
posted by jbenben at 9:22 AM on June 10, 2013 [8 favorites]
Don't ever ever ever mention the affair. Process that away from your ex and the break up of your marriage.
I think you should talk to a lawyer first to get coaching on breaking the news and protecting your interests, because I strongly suspect a man who tells you in couples therapy that his failure is your problem will undoubtedly turn into an asshole once you call it quits with him. I mean, isn't this kinda how things got to this point in the first place??
Lawyer. Break up. Move on.
Good luck.
posted by jbenben at 9:22 AM on June 10, 2013 [8 favorites]
Whoops! I don't want anyone to think I'm blaming the OP's affair on her husband with my comments above.
Rather, I think the OP has painted a rosier picture of her marriage and her husband's demeanor than exists in reality. Any man that thinks it's OK for you to cry after sex, or thinks he doesn't have to work on his own issues in couples counseling - that type of man probably isn't going to be easy to deal with during a divorce.
OP, resist the urge to vilify your (ex) husband, but do start seeing him for the man he is, not who you wanted him to be.
posted by jbenben at 9:35 AM on June 10, 2013 [13 favorites]
Rather, I think the OP has painted a rosier picture of her marriage and her husband's demeanor than exists in reality. Any man that thinks it's OK for you to cry after sex, or thinks he doesn't have to work on his own issues in couples counseling - that type of man probably isn't going to be easy to deal with during a divorce.
OP, resist the urge to vilify your (ex) husband, but do start seeing him for the man he is, not who you wanted him to be.
posted by jbenben at 9:35 AM on June 10, 2013 [13 favorites]
I agree that you need to not lay your divorce on your husband's feet, but you do need to tell him that you slept with someone else and risked his safety.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:50 AM on June 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:50 AM on June 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
Thanks for that update.......
You should also consider that, from what you have told us, that you are not meeting his needs either.
Break up and move on ASAP. I don't even see what you're trying to salvage at this point.
posted by PsuDab93 at 10:12 AM on June 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
You should also consider that, from what you have told us, that you are not meeting his needs either.
Break up and move on ASAP. I don't even see what you're trying to salvage at this point.
posted by PsuDab93 at 10:12 AM on June 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
Mod note: A couple comments removed. If you want to complain about moderation, do it via the contact form or Metatalk, but don't include it in a followup answer in-thread.
posted by cortex (staff) at 10:19 AM on June 10, 2013
posted by cortex (staff) at 10:19 AM on June 10, 2013
You and your husband are not sexually compatible - and your husband is being extremely selfish about sex. Many women need to manually stimulate themselves during vaginal intercourse to come - something like 75% of women do not orgasm from vaginal sex alone. Your husband should be encouraging you to masturbate during sex (or whatever brings you pleasure), not discouraging you. And, now that you have had a considerate lover, you have realized this too.
I mentioned your question to my SO, and they said DTMFA. There was no question about it.
posted by jb at 11:02 AM on June 10, 2013 [5 favorites]
I mentioned your question to my SO, and they said DTMFA. There was no question about it.
posted by jb at 11:02 AM on June 10, 2013 [5 favorites]
Stop trying to justify your desire to leave. You don't want him anymore, and you are breaking up with him to be with someone who does it for you in the sack. That's fine, if that's what you want, and you don't need to beat yourself up over it to make it acceptable; neither you nor your husband needs to be the villain in order for it to be ok that you want to leave him. Make a choice and stand by it- whether or not other people approve is ultimately their problem, not yours. I get the impression that you feel guilty about your choices. That's fine too; you did something unethical. But that feeling of guilt won't change the past or your plans for the future, so let go of it when you do tell your husband "I'm leaving you for someone else. I cheated on you". He has a right to know those things. But this sounds ultimately like incompatibility and bad choices on both your parts.
posted by windykites at 11:37 AM on June 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by windykites at 11:37 AM on June 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
why don't you meet with your marriage counselor individually and tell them you want to leave your spouse, that the reason is the lack of sexual satisfaction and that you are having an affair. ask the therapist what is the best way to deliver the news to your husband. doing it in a therapy session might be a good plan but i really don't know. your therapist will. just do it asap. you've already hurt your husband and marriage by cheating and lying. it isn't like telling him is the beginning of you hurting him. this is just admitting to it and dealing with the fallout. telling him asap is to his benefit so he can start moving on with his life. call the marriage counselor today and make an appointment.
posted by wildflower at 1:50 PM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by wildflower at 1:50 PM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Most answers here are coming down on the side of not telling your husband about your affair. I'm going to come down on the other side. We had friends who split several years ago. The husband was the one doing the leaving. Said he just didn't love her any more. Swore up and down there was no one else. Told his children there was no one else. It was heartbreaking for the wife to just think it was her fault, wonder if there was something she could do to make him love her again, and that if they just tried harder they could make it work.
Of course, there was someone else. The deception made the entire thing far worse than it would have been if he had been honest from the beginning. I suppose if there were an absolute guaranty that you could keep your affair a secret then that might be a reason to keep it from your husband. But I think you are being much too optimistic about that. The fact that you work together is at the very least going to create suspicion.
Getting divorced is going to hurt no matter what you do. I think you honor your husband and your marriage more by being honest with him.
posted by Bresciabouvier at 2:01 PM on June 10, 2013 [4 favorites]
Of course, there was someone else. The deception made the entire thing far worse than it would have been if he had been honest from the beginning. I suppose if there were an absolute guaranty that you could keep your affair a secret then that might be a reason to keep it from your husband. But I think you are being much too optimistic about that. The fact that you work together is at the very least going to create suspicion.
Getting divorced is going to hurt no matter what you do. I think you honor your husband and your marriage more by being honest with him.
posted by Bresciabouvier at 2:01 PM on June 10, 2013 [4 favorites]
The only person who should ultimately advise the OP about whether she should disclose the affair is her lawyer.
(OP, you are seeking an attorney, right?)
posted by jbenben at 3:03 PM on June 10, 2013
(OP, you are seeking an attorney, right?)
posted by jbenben at 3:03 PM on June 10, 2013
Sorry for your situation OP. I don't have any particular words of wisdom in this area, except to say I think the idea that the affair can be hidden or covered up for good is highly unlikely. It always comes out, and I would not be surprised at all if your husband is already hip to it -- just on a gut level or because he has some other evidence.
Good luck.
posted by loveyallaround at 3:08 PM on June 10, 2013
Good luck.
posted by loveyallaround at 3:08 PM on June 10, 2013
Favoriting hhc5 and corb so hard. The sex issue is not fundamentally about sexuality or orgasms. It's about intimacy, it's about connection, it's about caring. As someone who has been there, I know exactly how soul-crushing it is to be literally crying in bed due to lack of love and kindness and to get a cold response. I am so sorry this has happened to you too.
People are getting on your case about the affair, which is to be expected. But I want to suggest you pick up Mira Kirschenbaum's book When Good People Have Affairs. I think it will really help you clarify your thinking.
More generally, about sexuality and how it manifests in love relationships, also please check out David Schnarch's Intimacy and Desire. I think there will be a lot of clues in there as to what when wrong in your marriage--and should be a thought provoking read about how to make sure it doesn't happen the same way in your next relationship.
Good luck.
posted by Sublimity at 4:19 PM on June 10, 2013 [5 favorites]
People are getting on your case about the affair, which is to be expected. But I want to suggest you pick up Mira Kirschenbaum's book When Good People Have Affairs. I think it will really help you clarify your thinking.
More generally, about sexuality and how it manifests in love relationships, also please check out David Schnarch's Intimacy and Desire. I think there will be a lot of clues in there as to what when wrong in your marriage--and should be a thought provoking read about how to make sure it doesn't happen the same way in your next relationship.
Good luck.
posted by Sublimity at 4:19 PM on June 10, 2013 [5 favorites]
I can’t face a lifetime of feeling disappointed to the point of tears after sex (which has happened many times.) But that just doesn’t seem like a valid reason to end a long happy relationship
It seems like this is a sticking point for you. That might be something to discuss with a therapist.
Some things to think about on this: If you knew that you could choose to get into a relationship that would be a happy one in most ways, but that you would be disappointed to the point of tears after sex, would you do that? What would you tell a friend to do if she was considering the same situation?
posted by yohko at 5:22 PM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
It seems like this is a sticking point for you. That might be something to discuss with a therapist.
Some things to think about on this: If you knew that you could choose to get into a relationship that would be a happy one in most ways, but that you would be disappointed to the point of tears after sex, would you do that? What would you tell a friend to do if she was considering the same situation?
posted by yohko at 5:22 PM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
I'm almost always an advocate for kindness above all. However, in this case, I would advise that you consider being honest about the affair. No details are needed, but especially if you plan on pursuing a relationship with the new person, don't insult your husband's intelligence by not disclosing what he probably already suspects and will surely figure out soon.
Anecdotally: I'm approaching the finalization of a separation/divorce, and my ex has steadfastly insisted he never cheated. However, immediately after we separated, he moved in with his (married) "spiritual buddy," they supposedly fell in love immediately, and are now expecting a baby. It's ridiculous, really, and is obvious this has been going on a long time. Dealing with the deception and denial has made my own healing process a lot more difficult than it needed to be. Your husband's mileage may vary, of course, but that's been my experience. I do wish you well!
posted by justonegirl at 6:05 PM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Anecdotally: I'm approaching the finalization of a separation/divorce, and my ex has steadfastly insisted he never cheated. However, immediately after we separated, he moved in with his (married) "spiritual buddy," they supposedly fell in love immediately, and are now expecting a baby. It's ridiculous, really, and is obvious this has been going on a long time. Dealing with the deception and denial has made my own healing process a lot more difficult than it needed to be. Your husband's mileage may vary, of course, but that's been my experience. I do wish you well!
posted by justonegirl at 6:05 PM on June 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
I agree with the above posts recommending NOT mentioning the affair. You can be honest without being explicit. You can cite the things you want but aren't getting without mentioning that you are, indeed, already getting them from someone else.
I can see the sense in being brutally honest if you feel like that may promote a friendly relationship down the road, but I would certainly put the focus on and lead with any and all reasons for leaving the relationship that are NOT, "I have met someone else."
I hope it goes as well as is possible!
posted by all-caps relapse at 12:26 AM on June 11, 2013
I can see the sense in being brutally honest if you feel like that may promote a friendly relationship down the road, but I would certainly put the focus on and lead with any and all reasons for leaving the relationship that are NOT, "I have met someone else."
I hope it goes as well as is possible!
posted by all-caps relapse at 12:26 AM on June 11, 2013
People of Metafilter, I love you, but sometimes you have no idea what you're talking about.
I'm about two weeks into the process of leaving my husband for almost exactly the same reasons. I am not and was not in love with anyone else, but I did have a catalytic infatuation with someone which showed me in no uncertain terms that I couldn't live my life crying after sex because it was so unsatisfying and alienating. I wonder whether the people getting on your case about this have any idea what this is like. Silent tears rolling down your face because you don't want to hurt your partner, but it hurts you so very much that you're just not getting what you need. Sexual satisfaction is not just an amenity in an intimate relationship. We are, or are supposed to be, past the era of arranged marriages (at least in the culture to which I belong, and I assume the OP does too), or marriages for property, or marriages because women are not allowed to support themselves financially. Sex is *important*. Bad relationships can last longer by far than they should because the sex is good. (I know this from experience too.) Seemingly good relationships can be secretly excruciating because the sex is bad. Perhaps some people are happy with a good-roommate relationship as a marriage. Neither I nor the OP are. We are animals, we are mammals. We are pair-bonding mammals. And if the intimate aspects of bonding are absent, some of us simply cannot be bonded enough.
I advise not telling your husband about the affair. You love him, though you're not in love with him anymore, so you don't want to hurt him. Get tested for STD's, and if you don't have any, don't worry about that part. It won't do any good. You can tell him, since it's already been brought up, that your sexual dissatisfaction is a lot of why you can't stay. If he's as good a person as you think he is, he'll understand that that is indeed important. In fact, he's clearly already registered the increasing distance between you. That is the part you need to worry about. That may be hurting him more than your leaving will. That's the case in my situation. Now my soon-to-be-ex-husband can move on with his life. He can distance too.
This part will hurt you more than you think it will now, when the separation is only a thing in your head that you know that you want. I'm aching over it even though it was me who initiated it. I can hardly imagine how he felt about me doing it when we still planned to be together for the rest of our lives.
I've known I wanted to leave for a year and a half. It's been getting increasingly difficult in the last six months. But I, too, didn't know how to bring it up. Last Wednesday my husband complained about our lack of physical intimacy. I told him this wasn't a conversation he wanted to have at midnight when he had to work the next day. But he pushed it, and we did. And there was a lot of crying, on both sides, but we both know it's for the best. He's a wonderful person, but this is still hard. That's part of why it's hard. But I can't stay through the distance and lack of physical connection any more than you can. I can't speak to the Other Man thing. I know as soon as I am released there will be a bit of a firestorm as regards such things-- looks like what they say about women in their early thirties and sexual peak and suchlike holds true for me. But I am, as I said, not in love with anybody. I need to be alone for a while. (Though perhaps not *entirely* alone, ahem.) I can't comment on that part of your situation, since you already know you need to ensure that the other gentleman is more than just a catalyst.
But I disagree relentlessly with the "there are more important things than" people. People who like to preach that have never been where we are. Technically, maybe there are. But air and water and food are also more important things than shelter, and what kind of crazy person argues that you should keep a house that has no roof because the plumbing still works?
Myself, I need to look for something more than a good friendship with combined finances. It sounds like you do too. There are other people in the same place, and still more who have been and have moved on. You're not alone. MeMail me if you would like, as I am only a short bit chronologically from where you may end up. I am not having the best time of my life right now, but I don't regret it at all. It's also not the worst time of my life. It would be much worse if I reached 85 and only let myself realize this then. A staggeringly wonderful person may still not be the right person for you.
Be strong, be brave, take a scalpel and a magnifying glass to yourself and figure out what you are really doing. But if you know you're right, do what you know you need to do. Just don't hurt him. The words are, paraphrased: "You're a wonderful person, and I love you. But you deserve someone who can really appreciate you, and that person is not me. We want different things. And I'm very much afraid there's no fixing this. It's not you, it's not me. It's us. We thought we were right for each other, but now I see that we are not. And so do you."
I support you. I'm there too. Good luck doing what is right for you. It's hard. But I think it will be worth it, in the end.
posted by Because at 2:59 AM on June 11, 2013 [20 favorites]
I'm about two weeks into the process of leaving my husband for almost exactly the same reasons. I am not and was not in love with anyone else, but I did have a catalytic infatuation with someone which showed me in no uncertain terms that I couldn't live my life crying after sex because it was so unsatisfying and alienating. I wonder whether the people getting on your case about this have any idea what this is like. Silent tears rolling down your face because you don't want to hurt your partner, but it hurts you so very much that you're just not getting what you need. Sexual satisfaction is not just an amenity in an intimate relationship. We are, or are supposed to be, past the era of arranged marriages (at least in the culture to which I belong, and I assume the OP does too), or marriages for property, or marriages because women are not allowed to support themselves financially. Sex is *important*. Bad relationships can last longer by far than they should because the sex is good. (I know this from experience too.) Seemingly good relationships can be secretly excruciating because the sex is bad. Perhaps some people are happy with a good-roommate relationship as a marriage. Neither I nor the OP are. We are animals, we are mammals. We are pair-bonding mammals. And if the intimate aspects of bonding are absent, some of us simply cannot be bonded enough.
I advise not telling your husband about the affair. You love him, though you're not in love with him anymore, so you don't want to hurt him. Get tested for STD's, and if you don't have any, don't worry about that part. It won't do any good. You can tell him, since it's already been brought up, that your sexual dissatisfaction is a lot of why you can't stay. If he's as good a person as you think he is, he'll understand that that is indeed important. In fact, he's clearly already registered the increasing distance between you. That is the part you need to worry about. That may be hurting him more than your leaving will. That's the case in my situation. Now my soon-to-be-ex-husband can move on with his life. He can distance too.
This part will hurt you more than you think it will now, when the separation is only a thing in your head that you know that you want. I'm aching over it even though it was me who initiated it. I can hardly imagine how he felt about me doing it when we still planned to be together for the rest of our lives.
I've known I wanted to leave for a year and a half. It's been getting increasingly difficult in the last six months. But I, too, didn't know how to bring it up. Last Wednesday my husband complained about our lack of physical intimacy. I told him this wasn't a conversation he wanted to have at midnight when he had to work the next day. But he pushed it, and we did. And there was a lot of crying, on both sides, but we both know it's for the best. He's a wonderful person, but this is still hard. That's part of why it's hard. But I can't stay through the distance and lack of physical connection any more than you can. I can't speak to the Other Man thing. I know as soon as I am released there will be a bit of a firestorm as regards such things-- looks like what they say about women in their early thirties and sexual peak and suchlike holds true for me. But I am, as I said, not in love with anybody. I need to be alone for a while. (Though perhaps not *entirely* alone, ahem.) I can't comment on that part of your situation, since you already know you need to ensure that the other gentleman is more than just a catalyst.
But I disagree relentlessly with the "there are more important things than" people. People who like to preach that have never been where we are. Technically, maybe there are. But air and water and food are also more important things than shelter, and what kind of crazy person argues that you should keep a house that has no roof because the plumbing still works?
Myself, I need to look for something more than a good friendship with combined finances. It sounds like you do too. There are other people in the same place, and still more who have been and have moved on. You're not alone. MeMail me if you would like, as I am only a short bit chronologically from where you may end up. I am not having the best time of my life right now, but I don't regret it at all. It's also not the worst time of my life. It would be much worse if I reached 85 and only let myself realize this then. A staggeringly wonderful person may still not be the right person for you.
Be strong, be brave, take a scalpel and a magnifying glass to yourself and figure out what you are really doing. But if you know you're right, do what you know you need to do. Just don't hurt him. The words are, paraphrased: "You're a wonderful person, and I love you. But you deserve someone who can really appreciate you, and that person is not me. We want different things. And I'm very much afraid there's no fixing this. It's not you, it's not me. It's us. We thought we were right for each other, but now I see that we are not. And so do you."
I support you. I'm there too. Good luck doing what is right for you. It's hard. But I think it will be worth it, in the end.
posted by Because at 2:59 AM on June 11, 2013 [20 favorites]
I think you should be very honest so he knows what kind of person he has been living with and you should be strong enough to face your actions.
posted by tarvuz at 6:05 AM on June 11, 2013
posted by tarvuz at 6:05 AM on June 11, 2013
get tested for STDs and if you don't have any, don't worry about that part
I just want to point out that some STIs- such as HIV- can remain undetectable for months, and that in my opinion, it is incredibly unfair to take away someone else's knowledge of a potential risk to their health just because it makes you uncomfortable to tell them.
posted by windykites at 9:38 AM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
I just want to point out that some STIs- such as HIV- can remain undetectable for months, and that in my opinion, it is incredibly unfair to take away someone else's knowledge of a potential risk to their health just because it makes you uncomfortable to tell them.
posted by windykites at 9:38 AM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
I just want to point out that some STIs- such as HIV- can remain undetectable for months, and that in my opinion, it is incredibly unfair to take away someone else's knowledge of a potential risk to their health just because it makes you uncomfortable to tell them.
THIS SO MUCH. Look, I know it sucks to have to fess up when you do an unkind thing, but that's a choice you made. If you didn't want to have this conversation, you should have ended things before you started sleeping with someone else. If your husband believes that he is in a monogamous relationship, you need to tell him that he isn't. Again, I'd opt for the less-devastating route of just saying you slept with someone else, and leave out that you've been carrying on affair for months and months, but you really do need to tell him that his health is at risk. As an ethical person, you'd have to do that even with a rando you had a one-night stand with - this guy is your husband, and someone you care about. You owe it to him to be honest about the risks you took with his health. Send him a letter if you have to.
posted by goodbyewaffles at 1:03 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
THIS SO MUCH. Look, I know it sucks to have to fess up when you do an unkind thing, but that's a choice you made. If you didn't want to have this conversation, you should have ended things before you started sleeping with someone else. If your husband believes that he is in a monogamous relationship, you need to tell him that he isn't. Again, I'd opt for the less-devastating route of just saying you slept with someone else, and leave out that you've been carrying on affair for months and months, but you really do need to tell him that his health is at risk. As an ethical person, you'd have to do that even with a rando you had a one-night stand with - this guy is your husband, and someone you care about. You owe it to him to be honest about the risks you took with his health. Send him a letter if you have to.
posted by goodbyewaffles at 1:03 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
People who behave like this --who feel they are perfectly entitled to not acknowledge their spouse's sexual being and need for fulfillment-- don't understand how they are inadvertently demanding that their spouse silence or deaden their sexual self. I think this equally applies to men and women both. And a person can only bear this self-silencing for so long -- including the self-soothing of the sexual soul via solo masturbation, and the silent crying/mourning of this inner death -- before life brings them a wake-up call to realize that this deadened life is not enough. In your case (as it has been for many others), this wake-up call came in the form of an affair.
I know that whether I am with the other man or not I need to leave my husband because of what I've done.
It almost sounds like you needed this affair to generate some tangible evidence justifying your need to leave a sexually miserable and unfulfilling relationship, especially since your husband hasn't done anything to directly demonstrate his dissatisfaction with you. FWIW I strongly suspect he doesn't want to do anything that would result in him being labelled the 'bad guy'; I strongly suspect he wants you to own all of it. All the pressure is on you to provide the nasty evidence of incompatibility, so that it'll be clear who will get assigned the blame for the relationship's failure (just my opinion).
It also sounds to me like without the new guy, you still don't understand that your sexual fulfillment alone is worth honoring. This new guy is symbolizing that truth for you, and he will continue to until you find your way to own it yourself. You don't need a sexy fun man to validate your sexual needs (although he has clearly helped you on this path of realization); you just need YOU to be on your own side! And if this new guy is worth it, he'll be capable of honoring that too (that you are not 100% dependent on him for accepting and appreciating the entirety of your sexual self).
He deserves way, way more than this.
So do you. You both do, and deep down, you both already know it. Roll with that.
I feel totally trapped by my cowardice, and I just can’t seem to get the words out of my mouth, or think how to structure the sentence, or find the right time.
I'd like to build on Because's script, "It's not you, it's not me. It's us. During our time together we've both grown a lot, and as time's go on it's becoming clearer and clearer that the people we were already becoming are just not compatible. We thought we were right for each other, but now I see that we are not. And so do you."
posted by human ecologist at 1:21 PM on June 11, 2013 [5 favorites]
I know that whether I am with the other man or not I need to leave my husband because of what I've done.
It almost sounds like you needed this affair to generate some tangible evidence justifying your need to leave a sexually miserable and unfulfilling relationship, especially since your husband hasn't done anything to directly demonstrate his dissatisfaction with you. FWIW I strongly suspect he doesn't want to do anything that would result in him being labelled the 'bad guy'; I strongly suspect he wants you to own all of it. All the pressure is on you to provide the nasty evidence of incompatibility, so that it'll be clear who will get assigned the blame for the relationship's failure (just my opinion).
It also sounds to me like without the new guy, you still don't understand that your sexual fulfillment alone is worth honoring. This new guy is symbolizing that truth for you, and he will continue to until you find your way to own it yourself. You don't need a sexy fun man to validate your sexual needs (although he has clearly helped you on this path of realization); you just need YOU to be on your own side! And if this new guy is worth it, he'll be capable of honoring that too (that you are not 100% dependent on him for accepting and appreciating the entirety of your sexual self).
He deserves way, way more than this.
So do you. You both do, and deep down, you both already know it. Roll with that.
I feel totally trapped by my cowardice, and I just can’t seem to get the words out of my mouth, or think how to structure the sentence, or find the right time.
I'd like to build on Because's script, "It's not you, it's not me. It's us. During our time together we've both grown a lot, and as time's go on it's becoming clearer and clearer that the people we were already becoming are just not compatible. We thought we were right for each other, but now I see that we are not. And so do you."
posted by human ecologist at 1:21 PM on June 11, 2013 [5 favorites]
outoftime: " I can’t face a lifetime of feeling disappointed to the point of tears after sex (which has happened many times.) But that just doesn’t seem like a valid reason to end a long happy relationship"
Not being sexually satisfied is a good reason not to start a long happy relationship. I don't have much advice to you in your situation beyond what others have said, but perhaps you can comfort yourself that hopefully people see this question and learn that sexual compatibility is an integral and crucial part of a healthy, long term relationship and avoid the mistake you did.
Cheating is always wrong, but his attitude towards your sexual happiness was really not helpful. You come across as not being at all assertive about your needs. I worry that you will encounter this in future relationships. Just because someone else provides you with a lot of other things that are nice does not mean that needs magically become nice-to-haves.
outoftime: " I feel bad because I know I rejected him quite a lot, and on his side I know he wishes I made more of an effort – I’m not a “dress-up” kind of gal, so I’m not saying the blame is all on him or anything."
The only thing you should feel bad about is cheating. He knew about the way you dressed before you married him, and it is at a partner's discretion whether they are open to having sex at a particular moment. In fact, if there were times that you told him you didn't want to have sex, that would have been an excellent opportunity for him to have started a conversation about why you didn't want to have sex, which might have led to a frank discussion about your sexual needs.
Finally, I kind of feel like it is insane for someone in this day and age not to care about their partner's orgasms. I mean, really?
posted by Deathalicious at 4:37 AM on June 12, 2013 [3 favorites]
Not being sexually satisfied is a good reason not to start a long happy relationship. I don't have much advice to you in your situation beyond what others have said, but perhaps you can comfort yourself that hopefully people see this question and learn that sexual compatibility is an integral and crucial part of a healthy, long term relationship and avoid the mistake you did.
Cheating is always wrong, but his attitude towards your sexual happiness was really not helpful. You come across as not being at all assertive about your needs. I worry that you will encounter this in future relationships. Just because someone else provides you with a lot of other things that are nice does not mean that needs magically become nice-to-haves.
outoftime: " I feel bad because I know I rejected him quite a lot, and on his side I know he wishes I made more of an effort – I’m not a “dress-up” kind of gal, so I’m not saying the blame is all on him or anything."
The only thing you should feel bad about is cheating. He knew about the way you dressed before you married him, and it is at a partner's discretion whether they are open to having sex at a particular moment. In fact, if there were times that you told him you didn't want to have sex, that would have been an excellent opportunity for him to have started a conversation about why you didn't want to have sex, which might have led to a frank discussion about your sexual needs.
Finally, I kind of feel like it is insane for someone in this day and age not to care about their partner's orgasms. I mean, really?
posted by Deathalicious at 4:37 AM on June 12, 2013 [3 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
That's what you are doing, though, right?
posted by thelonius at 6:45 AM on June 10, 2013 [7 favorites]