Help me properly file for disability [SSI]
May 21, 2013 5:19 AM Subscribe
This is me three years ago. A lot has happened since I wrote that post. My brother got on disability, I had access to medical and psychiatric care for the first time in my life, and while I was still mostly homebound I had hope that our lives would eventually get better. Then my brother died quickly after a cancer diagnosis, I had a horrible, god-awful experience in a psychiatric hospital, stopped seeing my psychiatrist, rationalized not taking my medication because I would soon be without insurance anyway, and I pushed the only people willing and able to help me away. I've been trying and failing and giving up for almost a year.
This is me three years later trying again.
Yesterday I started the process of getting on disability. However, I started it on my own without fully understanding what I was doing on the SSA website. My reading comprehension is poor right now and my ability to express myself isn't much better. I've been so overwhelmed and anxious about what's going to happen to me after I'm cut off from my father's insurance two weeks from now. I'm scared I will no longer have access to psychiatric care at a time in my life when I need it the most.
What I've done so far: I filled out the Adult Disability Report* form online first, and then I proceeded with the Social Security Benefit Application. Then I barely slept and had anxiety attacks throughout the night because I was so sure I did something wrong.
I don't know what to expect now, and what my next step should be. Do I go to the SSA office and say "I filled out the Adult Disability Report and Benefit Application online, and I honestly have no idea what I'm doing. Please help."? Or do I wait for them to contact me first?
*The Adult Disability Report form I filled out looked like this, but there's also a more detailed looking form with a similar name. Is the Adult Function Report a form I'll fill out later on in the process?
Yesterday I started the process of getting on disability. However, I started it on my own without fully understanding what I was doing on the SSA website. My reading comprehension is poor right now and my ability to express myself isn't much better. I've been so overwhelmed and anxious about what's going to happen to me after I'm cut off from my father's insurance two weeks from now. I'm scared I will no longer have access to psychiatric care at a time in my life when I need it the most.
What I've done so far: I filled out the Adult Disability Report* form online first, and then I proceeded with the Social Security Benefit Application. Then I barely slept and had anxiety attacks throughout the night because I was so sure I did something wrong.
I don't know what to expect now, and what my next step should be. Do I go to the SSA office and say "I filled out the Adult Disability Report and Benefit Application online, and I honestly have no idea what I'm doing. Please help."? Or do I wait for them to contact me first?
*The Adult Disability Report form I filled out looked like this, but there's also a more detailed looking form with a similar name. Is the Adult Function Report a form I'll fill out later on in the process?
Best answer: If you're still in Florida, Florida DCFs is still my "where to start" answer.
Good for you for trying, for getting out there and trying to get the help you need.
I've never applied for SSI, I'm sorry I don't have more information. But I have gone to my local Social Security offices for different matters and always found the folks quite helpful. I'd be wary of paying for help, without more information about exactly what kind of "help" someone would be providing you couldn't get on your own.
posted by tilde at 5:46 AM on May 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Good for you for trying, for getting out there and trying to get the help you need.
I've never applied for SSI, I'm sorry I don't have more information. But I have gone to my local Social Security offices for different matters and always found the folks quite helpful. I'd be wary of paying for help, without more information about exactly what kind of "help" someone would be providing you couldn't get on your own.
posted by tilde at 5:46 AM on May 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Best answer: You're trying to file for disability?
Hire an attorney. Just do it. There are attorneys who do pretty much only SSDI work. They work on contingency--i.e., they do not get paid unless and until you do--and their fee is capped at $6,000 or 25% of your backpay benefits, whichever is less. Now they may charge you for things like court costs, etc., but (1) there are plenty out there that either won't, or will front these costs until you win, and (2) you shouldn't sign a fee agreement with them until you've seen a schedule for what they charge for these sorts of things.
The SSDI system is massively, horrendously broken. The word on the street is that if you want to get on SSDI and have anything like a qualifying disability, all you really need to do is apply/appeal three times. The administrative law judges who work these things are so overworked that it seems that anyone persistent enough to ask three times is just passed on, because it's easier for them to pay claims then deny them. Really. Paying a claim requires them to do almost nothing. Denying the claim requires them to, you know, read your file and come up with at least some reason why they're doing so.
So get a lawyer and be done with it. No reason in the world not to.
posted by valkyryn at 5:51 AM on May 21, 2013 [6 favorites]
Hire an attorney. Just do it. There are attorneys who do pretty much only SSDI work. They work on contingency--i.e., they do not get paid unless and until you do--and their fee is capped at $6,000 or 25% of your backpay benefits, whichever is less. Now they may charge you for things like court costs, etc., but (1) there are plenty out there that either won't, or will front these costs until you win, and (2) you shouldn't sign a fee agreement with them until you've seen a schedule for what they charge for these sorts of things.
The SSDI system is massively, horrendously broken. The word on the street is that if you want to get on SSDI and have anything like a qualifying disability, all you really need to do is apply/appeal three times. The administrative law judges who work these things are so overworked that it seems that anyone persistent enough to ask three times is just passed on, because it's easier for them to pay claims then deny them. Really. Paying a claim requires them to do almost nothing. Denying the claim requires them to, you know, read your file and come up with at least some reason why they're doing so.
So get a lawyer and be done with it. No reason in the world not to.
posted by valkyryn at 5:51 AM on May 21, 2013 [6 favorites]
Seconding please tell us where you are so that we can help you find a community organization that will help you to fill out these forms. I'm a reference librarian and I'm good at finding information. Fell free to memail if you'd rather not share your location publicly.
posted by mareli at 6:01 AM on May 21, 2013
posted by mareli at 6:01 AM on May 21, 2013
Northeast Florida Community Action Agency . Disability Rights Florida. ILRC of Northeast Florida.
These all look like some good options for you.
posted by mareli at 6:24 AM on May 21, 2013 [4 favorites]
These all look like some good options for you.
posted by mareli at 6:24 AM on May 21, 2013 [4 favorites]
Best answer: Maybe someone here could help you locate an SSI attorney who works on contingency in Jacksonville. I am nthing not doing this without assistance. It is my understanding that the process is basically apply, be rejected, appeal, be accepted.
posted by DarlingBri at 6:25 AM on May 21, 2013
posted by DarlingBri at 6:25 AM on May 21, 2013
Best answer: I'd start by contacting general social service organizations, like the ones mareli mentioned or Catholic Charities (you don't have to be Catholic).
First, some will have programs to help you apply for DI/SSI. If they don't, they may be able to refer you to a reputable lawyer. There are a lot of good disability lawyers; there are also many bad ones.
Second, they may be able to assist you in other ways, either directly or by making other appropriate referals.
But yes, you absolutely need help one way or the other. Congratulations on being able to reach out for the help you need.
posted by Mr.Know-it-some at 6:34 AM on May 21, 2013
First, some will have programs to help you apply for DI/SSI. If they don't, they may be able to refer you to a reputable lawyer. There are a lot of good disability lawyers; there are also many bad ones.
Second, they may be able to assist you in other ways, either directly or by making other appropriate referals.
But yes, you absolutely need help one way or the other. Congratulations on being able to reach out for the help you need.
posted by Mr.Know-it-some at 6:34 AM on May 21, 2013
Best answer: But in the meantime while you work on getting SSDI you should check into other options. For instance, you may be able to get subsidized housing, food stamps, medicaid, and SSI.
Here's another organization that might be able to help: Community Connections.
posted by mareli at 6:39 AM on May 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Here's another organization that might be able to help: Community Connections.
posted by mareli at 6:39 AM on May 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: I'm sorry if my question was vaguely worded. When I said my brother got on "disability", I meant that he got on SSI. This is embarrassing to admit, but again, because I have no idea what I'm doing, and because I'm so overwhelmed with other things going on in my life right now I didn't see there was a difference between filing for SSDI and SSI.
On their website it says:
To apply for SSI benefits, you can:
Complete the Adult Disability Report or the Child Disability Report online, and schedule an appointment to complete the SSI application; or
Schedule an appointment with your local office to complete the application process. Only the Disability Reports can be completed online. You must complete the application process at your local office.
So it looks like my next step is scheduling an appointment. Is that right?
posted by Cdr Sara Bellum at 7:19 AM on May 21, 2013
On their website it says:
To apply for SSI benefits, you can:
Complete the Adult Disability Report or the Child Disability Report online, and schedule an appointment to complete the SSI application; or
Schedule an appointment with your local office to complete the application process. Only the Disability Reports can be completed online. You must complete the application process at your local office.
So it looks like my next step is scheduling an appointment. Is that right?
posted by Cdr Sara Bellum at 7:19 AM on May 21, 2013
Mod note: Added an "[SSI]" clarification in the title at OP's request; carry on.
posted by taz (staff) at 7:31 AM on May 21, 2013
posted by taz (staff) at 7:31 AM on May 21, 2013
Yes, do it, it's easier to get SSI than SDI, as far as I know.
posted by mareli at 8:36 AM on May 21, 2013
posted by mareli at 8:36 AM on May 21, 2013
Best answer: The same disability rules apply to both programs: If you're judged to be disabled for one, you are disabled enough for the others. The difference is how benefits are calculated. In general, people who worked regularly get DI, which usually provides a larger payment than SSI.
Really, get some help with this from a lawyer or other person with experience. It's not just a matter of filling out the right form. Especially with psychiatric disabilities, which can be more difficult to evaluate (which is not to imply less serious), a sucessful application requires appropriately detailed medical history and related documentation.
posted by Mr.Know-it-some at 10:20 AM on May 21, 2013 [2 favorites]
Really, get some help with this from a lawyer or other person with experience. It's not just a matter of filling out the right form. Especially with psychiatric disabilities, which can be more difficult to evaluate (which is not to imply less serious), a sucessful application requires appropriately detailed medical history and related documentation.
posted by Mr.Know-it-some at 10:20 AM on May 21, 2013 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Yes, fill out the more detailed form honestly. It can't hurt. You can supplement your file at any point in the process. You can request and bring in your own medical records. You can go to the Social Security office and ask for a copy of your file to see what they are still waiting for. The more information you give Social Security about why you qualify, the sooner they will be able to approve you.
Valkyryn is right that if you are denied it is very much worth appealing, but even if you get in front of the nicest administrative law judge in the world you won't get SSI or SSDI just because you applied and appealed three times. Plenty of people get denied at ALJ hearings.
A good lawyer will do a lot of work to improve your case. They will know hundreds of pages of regulations. They will get and read and understand and summarize all of your medical records (something Social Security often does not do a very good job of) and write briefs in support of your case. They will send carefully worded questionnaires to your doctors which often turn out to be key pieces of evidence. At the hearing, they will help you concisely and persuasively explain to the ALJ why you qualify and they will cross-examine the Social Security medical expert and vocational expert.
Be cautious about hiring a law firm that spends a lot of time talking about its high volume of cases or a firm that spends a lot of money on TV ads and billboards. They don't generally provide the highest quality service. Start by contacting the nonprofit organizations that have been recommended in this thread.
posted by steinwald at 11:30 AM on May 21, 2013
Valkyryn is right that if you are denied it is very much worth appealing, but even if you get in front of the nicest administrative law judge in the world you won't get SSI or SSDI just because you applied and appealed three times. Plenty of people get denied at ALJ hearings.
A good lawyer will do a lot of work to improve your case. They will know hundreds of pages of regulations. They will get and read and understand and summarize all of your medical records (something Social Security often does not do a very good job of) and write briefs in support of your case. They will send carefully worded questionnaires to your doctors which often turn out to be key pieces of evidence. At the hearing, they will help you concisely and persuasively explain to the ALJ why you qualify and they will cross-examine the Social Security medical expert and vocational expert.
Be cautious about hiring a law firm that spends a lot of time talking about its high volume of cases or a firm that spends a lot of money on TV ads and billboards. They don't generally provide the highest quality service. Start by contacting the nonprofit organizations that have been recommended in this thread.
posted by steinwald at 11:30 AM on May 21, 2013
Best answer: "Do I go to the SSA office and say "I filled out the Adult Disability Report and Benefit Application online, and I honestly have no idea what I'm doing. Please help.""
Yes. Or you call the local office and say that, if you prefer to do it on the phone.
Or you say "I filled out the Adult Disability Report and Benefit Application online. I've also filled out the Adult Function Report. I'd like to schedule an appointment to bring this in and complete my application."
If you can't go in to the office for medical reasons, say so.
If you have copies of any of your medical records, bring them with you.
posted by steinwald at 11:44 AM on May 21, 2013
Yes. Or you call the local office and say that, if you prefer to do it on the phone.
Or you say "I filled out the Adult Disability Report and Benefit Application online. I've also filled out the Adult Function Report. I'd like to schedule an appointment to bring this in and complete my application."
If you can't go in to the office for medical reasons, say so.
If you have copies of any of your medical records, bring them with you.
posted by steinwald at 11:44 AM on May 21, 2013
Best answer: As someone on SSDI/SSI, I can tell you that it really helps to get someone else to fill out the forms. And if you are trying for it on psychiatric criteria, as I did, expect to have to go all the way to a hearing. I didn't get an attorney until after my appeals were denied, but I was shepherded through the process a bit by DSHS (Welfare). If you are already on Assistance, they will probably help you (gets you off their rolls and onto SS), if you aren't and need to go on, expect to have to apply for Disability if you are eligible. It looks like that might be the best first step, if you are already unable to work and are about to be uninsured. Even if someone else is supporting you, as long as you have no assets of your own it is the right way to start. It worked for me. I had no insurance and we couldn't afford the doctor visits and medication and I obviously couldn't work. Being on Welfare probably helped my case.
Filling out the forms, don't sugarcoat but don't exaggerate, be brutally honest and have whoever you get to fill out the third party forms (observations on your functionality) to be the same. It is painful and embarassing, but necessary. The whole process took about 2 years, start to finish, and this was back before budget cuts at Social Security made the process even slower for these kind of claims.
After you get all of the paperwork filled out and submitted they will request whatever else they need. They don't want you to give them your records, they want them from the sources. Expect to be called in to be interviewed by their psych people. I've also heard that they may not be inclined to grant status to people who are non-compliant with treatment. You must be seen to be trying to get better, but not actually able to function well enough to work.
Also, keep copies of everything you send them, if possible, and KEEP EVERYTHING THEY SEND YOU. They expect you to have done so, even if they don't ask for it.
posted by monopas at 12:42 PM on May 21, 2013
Filling out the forms, don't sugarcoat but don't exaggerate, be brutally honest and have whoever you get to fill out the third party forms (observations on your functionality) to be the same. It is painful and embarassing, but necessary. The whole process took about 2 years, start to finish, and this was back before budget cuts at Social Security made the process even slower for these kind of claims.
After you get all of the paperwork filled out and submitted they will request whatever else they need. They don't want you to give them your records, they want them from the sources. Expect to be called in to be interviewed by their psych people. I've also heard that they may not be inclined to grant status to people who are non-compliant with treatment. You must be seen to be trying to get better, but not actually able to function well enough to work.
Also, keep copies of everything you send them, if possible, and KEEP EVERYTHING THEY SEND YOU. They expect you to have done so, even if they don't ask for it.
posted by monopas at 12:42 PM on May 21, 2013
Best answer: I am an attorney who has done some SSI related work. The nonprofit legal organizations I am familiar with (here in Los Angeles) do not help with the first level of SSI applications. However, if someone recieves a denial, they are often able to provide help with an appeal, for free.
I found this Jacksonville Area Legal Aid organization online - it's not clear to me whether they do SSI work, and if they do whether they would help with the initial application or just an appeal. I bet that if they can't help you, they can refer you to someone who can. I can't vouch for them, of course.
I agree that it's very important to get a folder and keep copies of everything you submit and everything they send you! This will be very helpful if an attorney assists you later on (if you haven't kept copies so far, don't worry about it - just start keeping copies now).
posted by insectosaurus at 1:16 PM on May 21, 2013
I found this Jacksonville Area Legal Aid organization online - it's not clear to me whether they do SSI work, and if they do whether they would help with the initial application or just an appeal. I bet that if they can't help you, they can refer you to someone who can. I can't vouch for them, of course.
I agree that it's very important to get a folder and keep copies of everything you submit and everything they send you! This will be very helpful if an attorney assists you later on (if you haven't kept copies so far, don't worry about it - just start keeping copies now).
posted by insectosaurus at 1:16 PM on May 21, 2013
Response by poster: My previous experience with DCF and a local organization makes me weary and doubtful they'll be able or willing to help me.
I e-mailed the organizations mareli linked. The only response I got was that unfortunately they don't have any resources for someone in my situation and that I should apply for Medicaid, which was discouraging based on some memories I have three years ago.
Three years ago I went to the ER with my brother to get help, the psychiatric team at the hospital got DCF involved, and DCF eventually referred us to a local non-profit organization willing to provide counseling and other services, that is, until they lost their funding from Congress a few months later. We were told by someone during our Financial Evaluation that we weren't eligible for Medicaid or a Shands card because of how much my father made, and I don't remember our social workers ever disputing this. I do, however, remember our social workers freaking out about the funding, and pressuring my parents to put my brother and me in a homeless shelter so they could continue providing their services to us (or something! I don't remember why!). Not long after they told us to go to a homeless shelter, my brother got on SSI for his arm, they were able to offer their services to him again because he was on Medicaid, and they didn't bother with me again because I was finally covered by my father's health insurance as I was still old enough at the time to be covered. These memories left me with the impression I'm not eligible for Medicaid as long as I live with my parents. Whether that's true or not, I don't know.
posted by Cdr Sara Bellum at 4:42 AM on May 23, 2013
I e-mailed the organizations mareli linked. The only response I got was that unfortunately they don't have any resources for someone in my situation and that I should apply for Medicaid, which was discouraging based on some memories I have three years ago.
Three years ago I went to the ER with my brother to get help, the psychiatric team at the hospital got DCF involved, and DCF eventually referred us to a local non-profit organization willing to provide counseling and other services, that is, until they lost their funding from Congress a few months later. We were told by someone during our Financial Evaluation that we weren't eligible for Medicaid or a Shands card because of how much my father made, and I don't remember our social workers ever disputing this. I do, however, remember our social workers freaking out about the funding, and pressuring my parents to put my brother and me in a homeless shelter so they could continue providing their services to us (or something! I don't remember why!). Not long after they told us to go to a homeless shelter, my brother got on SSI for his arm, they were able to offer their services to him again because he was on Medicaid, and they didn't bother with me again because I was finally covered by my father's health insurance as I was still old enough at the time to be covered. These memories left me with the impression I'm not eligible for Medicaid as long as I live with my parents. Whether that's true or not, I don't know.
posted by Cdr Sara Bellum at 4:42 AM on May 23, 2013
Response by poster: Thanks, everyone, for all the great advice and for giving me a general idea of what to expect. I'm a lot less anxious now that I know I didn't do anything "wrong". I scheduled the appointment. I have little expectations at this point as far as actually getting on SSI, but it is my hope that by taking this step, someone out there in the world will help me figure out what my other options are.
The reason I tried applying for SSI on my own was because I didn't want to burden my relatives and I didn't want my mother to discourage me from trying to get help again. I wish I didn't have to make a fool of myself to get the help I need. But it seems I had to embarrass myself and do this on my own to send a message to my family that I'm tired of having my needs put on the back-burner because they, too, find all of this confusing and overwhelming. The good news is my mother sees how much effort I put in and she, albeit begrudgingly, seems willing to provide transportation to any appointments I make and she seems open to seeing an attorney when/if we have to appeal. Also, I have since reached out to a formerly estranged relative, who has connections with the right people and may be able to help me with all of this.
I'm going to try to keep this thread up to date so someone else as confused and desperate as I am has the information and encouragement they need to improve their quality of life.
posted by Cdr Sara Bellum at 5:01 AM on May 23, 2013
The reason I tried applying for SSI on my own was because I didn't want to burden my relatives and I didn't want my mother to discourage me from trying to get help again. I wish I didn't have to make a fool of myself to get the help I need. But it seems I had to embarrass myself and do this on my own to send a message to my family that I'm tired of having my needs put on the back-burner because they, too, find all of this confusing and overwhelming. The good news is my mother sees how much effort I put in and she, albeit begrudgingly, seems willing to provide transportation to any appointments I make and she seems open to seeing an attorney when/if we have to appeal. Also, I have since reached out to a formerly estranged relative, who has connections with the right people and may be able to help me with all of this.
I'm going to try to keep this thread up to date so someone else as confused and desperate as I am has the information and encouragement they need to improve their quality of life.
posted by Cdr Sara Bellum at 5:01 AM on May 23, 2013
Best answer: Here are the sites of two attorneys in your area who spoke at a recent Social Security Disability law conference:
http://www.ewbergerlaw.com/www/Index.php
http://tracytysonmiller.com/
Remember, initial consultations with lawyers are free and don't force you to do anything. A call to them before applying couldn't hurt.
posted by Mr.Know-it-some at 8:26 AM on May 23, 2013
http://www.ewbergerlaw.com/www/Index.php
http://tracytysonmiller.com/
Remember, initial consultations with lawyers are free and don't force you to do anything. A call to them before applying couldn't hurt.
posted by Mr.Know-it-some at 8:26 AM on May 23, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by hoyland at 5:29 AM on May 21, 2013 [2 favorites]