Normal Two-Year Old Behavior Occurring, Why Does Anyone Do This To Themselves?

June 9, 2012 9:22 PM

My two year old likes to scream in my two month old's face. Please help me deal.

Not only is he screaming right in the baby's face, he hits, yanks on her arms, and squeezes her little appendages (in the least PC term ever: he tries to give her an Indian Burn- please tell me there is a better name for that these days?). He has been doing this since week 1, and I know that it is normal two year old activity, likely due to feeling ousted as the baby and unable to deal with his emotions, but it is totally infuriating. I am a gentle person by nature and definitely not into hitting in any way, but this behavior makes me want to spank and scream and use time outs (I don't think he would connect the dots there). I've been gathering the baby up and leaving the area without a word, hoping if he doesn't get any attention for it, he'll quit. No dice.

He gets lots of 1 on 1 attention during the day, but will seek the baby out to torture her even when he and I are doing something fun together- which, of course, brings the fun activity to an abrupt halt. I make sure to invite him onto my lap for snuggles and a book when the baby nurses.

I dont know what else to do. I am at my wits end- I know there is a more positive way of dealing with this than letting it build up until I explode. I need some tips for dealing with my own emotions and/or some btdt anecdotes, or maybe you know some bit of magic that will work on my aggravating two year old. Thanks

posted by LyndsayMW to Human Relations (16 answers total)

if he doesn't get any attention for it, he'll quit.

I know there are whole parenting books about this kind of approach, but I really think this is a problem. Time outs can work wonders, as can other types of consequence-based conditioning.

Good luck.
posted by hamandcheese at 9:32 PM on June 9, 2012 [2 favorites]

Why do you think he can't handle time-outs? I think 2 is a perfect age to start with that kind of thing, especially for this kind of behavior. My daughter at 18 months understands a heck of a lot more than she can communicate. I'd give that a try. "We do not scream at each other and we do not scream at the baby. We are gentle with the baby. If you cannot be gentle, you will need to sit by yourself for a while." It will take repetition for sure.

My daughter went though a hitting phase. It comes and goes, really. I would grab her hand and say, "gentle with mama" and the let her stroke my face. If she did it again, I'd put her down and say, "we don't hit." Lots of repetition and it seems to have helped. At the least she knows what hitting is and she knows I don't like it. I also say, "we hug, we don't hit." And then we hug. I've noticed recently that hitting is a sign she is way overtired. A couple times she's even gone person to person to dole out hits. And so I remove her and do nap routine and bam, she's out.

So, random, but is he overtired? Maybe your day is a little crazy with the new baby and he's not getting enough sleep. Mine is down to one nap a day but she really needs two. Around 4, she gets quiet time with a bottle, some soft music and a couple books in bed. It really seems to help.
posted by amanda at 9:44 PM on June 9, 2012 [4 favorites]

If it makes you feel any better about it, a friend of mine is a psychologist that works with abused children in care. She tells her son to sit in the thinking chair/spot. So he can have a think about what's happened. The whole idea of a thinking spot might be lost on a two year old now, but very soon he'll get it.
posted by taff at 10:29 PM on June 9, 2012

My son is just 14 months old and just started walking on his own. He's turned into a menace within the space of a week and a half. I've been wondering about similar things because I feel like he's too young to understand right from wrong... and yet, they need to learn this, don't they.

Someone suggested 1-2-3 Magic to me, and I know it is popular here on the green.

I'm going to try it. Hope it works for you, too.
posted by jbenben at 10:30 PM on June 9, 2012

Response by poster: I guess I don't understand how time outs help him to modify his behavior- and how is it different from moving ourselves away from him (if a time out is moving him away from us)? I feel like, from his perspective, "If I do X, Y bad thing happens... But I don't know how *not* to do X or why I shouldn't." Enter frustration and more acting out (and why the ignoring it thing is not working). I am probably over thinking this. You can't reason with 2.

He does have some impulse control- I've never known him to hit or scream at any other kids. He is actually an introvert. And, for whatever it's worth, the screams are happy playful ones- not something I wish to train out of him necessarily, particularly with his sister (screaming yes, happy playful no).
posted by LyndsayMW at 10:59 PM on June 9, 2012

I think explanation of why he's there (repeatedly!) should explain to him why he shouldn't be hitting/screaming at/etc. the baby. Offering other alternatives ("we are gentle with the baby" [or "you can hit a pillow, you cannot hit your sister" even?]) explains how not to do it. Even if he doesn't *really* understand, a. explaining isn't going to hurt anything that I can think of, and b. it should modify his behavior anyway. Maybe positive reinforcement too? "See how BabySister smiles when we play nicely?"

A time out is different from you leaving because he can't follow and is not free to move, in addition to an explanation being provided. You are free to move when you move away from him.
posted by jorlyfish at 11:11 PM on June 9, 2012 [2 favorites]

Have you tried redirecting the energy at all? I honestly don't know how I would be able to calmly handle it if my child was doing that to my other child, but when my child does that to our cats, I say something like "We do not xxxx the cats. It seems like you want to (pull, hit, bang, etc). You may (bang the drum, pull this toy, etc).And she usually happy switches to the new activity. (In your case, maybe "Oh, you are singing to the baby! How nice! That is little too loud for her. Can you stand over here and sing?) I have also redirected her by having her do something helpful - put food in the cats bowl, brush the cats.
She is acting more from enjoying the reaction from the cats than any animus she may feel, so not sure if it will work for you. Also am not suggesting that cats = babies.

I have found some waldorf parenting books very helpful for situations like this. I don't really agree with their reasons for doing things a certain way, but often really agree with the conclusions & suggestions. One I have found helpful is "You Are Your Child's First Teacher." good luck!
posted by munichmaiden at 11:12 PM on June 9, 2012

This is the exact time when time outs become productive. You yourself mentioned that you can't reason with 2, and that is correct. Time outs work because you aren't reasoning with them, you are clearly showing them that if they do X (scream in sisters face), there will be a punishment (time out in room for 2 minutes). There is no wiggle room there, so it is an easy concept for them to grasp. The reason he keeps doing it now is because he wants to get a reaction from you (and his little sister), and his current punishment isn't really a punishment, so he has no incentive to stop.

I strongly recommend this book, it is helping my family a lot going through the terrible 2's, and I know several other people who swear by it.

123 magic
posted by markblasco at 11:22 PM on June 9, 2012 [2 favorites]

One thing about 123 magic that I really like is that you use the same method of warnings for anything the kids do wrong (counting to 3 in a very specific way), so once you start implementing the system, you can use it for any and all behavior problems. They know as soon as you start counting them that whatever it is they are doing is wrong, and they need to stop or they get a time out. Most kids are smart enough to figure this out well before they hit 2 years old.
posted by markblasco at 11:26 PM on June 9, 2012 [1 favorite]

An alternate data point: in my house there's no spanking, with the specific exception of punishment for hitting. (Everything else is gentle reprimand or time out, and two year olds are absolutely old enough to understand time outs.) This might not work for you, but I can say that we only had to do it once or twice and we haven't had a hitting incident in years.

I don't think hitting a newborn is normal at all, by the way. Anger, yes. Hitting you, maybe yes. Hitting a newborn... I think demands a stronger response from you than what you've described.
posted by fingersandtoes at 11:47 PM on June 9, 2012 [7 favorites]

Google up some forums on Positive Parenting, that is the perfect place to ask this question.
posted by vignettist at 11:47 PM on June 9, 2012

Best answer: We just went through a nasty hitting (and kicking) phase! My son will be 3 in September. We also tried time out and yelling (we do use counting but for things that you would take the time to count for like "we are going to leave in 1 minute... ok 5 sec ... 4... 3... ok let's go").

What worked for us, this time, was having a conversation (EVERYDAY for a while) about "What type of touches do we do with the baby? Only gentle touches. Show me a gentle touch." Then any gentle touch that was done was praised to the moon! And "When you want to get someone's attention, what do you say? That is right say 'Excuse me, I want...' " And then we also talk about consequences before the behavior: "If you hit someone, you will need to take a break from ____ activity." Or "If you hit the baby, then I will have to stop playing with you and take care of the baby and I want to play one on one with you right now." These conversations worked best if the adult was looking at my son in the eye (even though he did not like it). And then we would follow through with consequences but before that do reminders like if he was going toward a child we would call out "gentle touches".

When I find myself that frustrated with my son, it usually means that I am taking his behavior personally or as a personal reflection of myself. So, I have to take a step back and realize we are in this together and I am going to guide him ("I will not let you hurt me or anyone else") but he is going to figure it out from there. And when was the last time you had an hour to yourself? To recharge in the bath or talk with friends? To laugh about your monsters and realize you are more than shepherd?

Hang in there Mama.
posted by mutt.cyberspace at 12:32 AM on June 10, 2012 [20 favorites]

Best answer: What worked for us, this time, was having a conversation (EVERYDAY for a while) about "What type of touches do we do with the baby? Only gentle touches. Show me a gentle touch."

Absolutely this. I was a preschool teacher and a nanny before I had my own son and I came in to say that positive reinforcement works a thousand times better than time outs. It may take a while to see results, but if you model what you do want your son to do - rather than simply telling him what not to do - he has a better understanding of the expectations. From his perspective, you tell him not to hit and... he doesn't know what else to do. He doesn't get what the alternatives are. "So, I don't hit, so then what? I have no idea." And this kind of frustration is difficult for a kid to express, making him more likely to keep hitting.

Model gentle touches and praise him when he uses them on his own. Pretty much praise any positive behavior - especially towards the baby. If he ever brings baby a blanket or anything - "Yay!!! How wonderful you helped baby!!!" Etc.

Of course, sometimes you will absolutely need to remove him from the situation. In these moments, I've found that a sort of modified time-out works best. The problem with time-out as traditionally done is that it teaches the kid "I can do this until mom says I get time out." What I've found works best is the same sort of end result - removing the child from the action - but phrased differently. I usually use "take a break." "You're not playing nicely right now, you need to take a break." I do this with my own son when he throws tantrums and scratches me - he takes a break (in his crib, so he's safe - you, of course, know your son best and know where he'll be safest and most likely to calm down, probably in his room) on his own until he's calm and then he gets to come back and play when he's chilled out. I've worked extensively with two year olds and found that this really, really does help - especially when kiddo is overtired. Older kids can understand explanations of their behavior, younger toddlers just need a chance to regroup.

(And seriously, sometimes he gets to "take a break" just because I will go bonkers if I let him scratch me all day long. You gotta watch out for yourself as well.)

Once he's chilled out, don't try to have a conversation about his behavior - just start over. If you do feel like he'd benefit from a discussion just say something like "I'm glad you're calmed down now, it made me very sad to see you so angry" or something of the sort. The point is to emphasize not that he's being punished, but that he needs to calm down and regroup when he gets upset/angry rather than acting out.

Good luck to you! I hope that this thread has helped you and that things start going smoother for your kiddos!
posted by sonika at 3:33 AM on June 10, 2012 [8 favorites]

Is he closer to a 24 month old or is he closer to being three?

The thing is, I found I had to use vastly different techniques with my son when he had just turned two vs nearly a year later when he was two turning three. And so where he is in being two is worth paying attention to with your consequences.

Not only that, but two is a prime age for a hitting phase regardless of a little baby. I went through a serious hitting phase with my son where, honestly, it was sometimes like living with an abuser. It took a lot of work and passing him off to my husband a lot, but in part he outgrew it and in part he learned better ways of dealing with his emotions.
posted by zizzle at 5:40 AM on June 10, 2012

Time-outs don't work for every kid. But this is how I did a time out: Time-out is NOT a punishment. Time-out is a time to leave the problem situation and sit and think quietly and cool off (definitely for the kid, and sometimes the adult!) I brought the child over to a neutral chair/spot, told them to sit, and told them why they were in that chair/spot. Often I would tell them what I'd like them to think about, in this case, think about some kind ways to treat the baby. When the time out was over, I would ask the child if he knew why were sitting there, and generally he would say something like "I was being mean to my sister", and I would ask them if there was a nicer way to treat his sister, and maybe even demonstrate a soft touch. Repeat as many times as necessary. Eventually some of what you are trying to tell them sinks in. Hopefully.
posted by molasses at 9:31 AM on June 10, 2012 [2 favorites]

Best answer: He's old enough to be read Hands are Not for Hitting, which would go well with the ideas mutt.cyberspace had about practicing being gentle with the baby.
posted by The corpse in the library at 10:08 AM on June 10, 2012 [1 favorite]