Credit card fraud - how to act?
March 15, 2012 8:56 AM Subscribe
My SO was victim of credit card fraud - what now?
Last month, when my SO opened her statement, she noticed several withdrawals and expenses in poker websites that weren't hers. She immediately complained, then they said they would cancel the transactions and investigate.
Then then send a letter that, for whatever reason, she never saw. The letter stated that she was supposed to confirm that complaint in writing up to a certain date.
This month, the fraudulent expenses were back in her credit card. She called again, they mentioned the letter, she found it.
Does she have any recourse? It seems unfair that she would have to pay (it's something like $ 2000) just because she didn't see a letter. Also, they never mentioned a letter in the first place.
Last month, when my SO opened her statement, she noticed several withdrawals and expenses in poker websites that weren't hers. She immediately complained, then they said they would cancel the transactions and investigate.
Then then send a letter that, for whatever reason, she never saw. The letter stated that she was supposed to confirm that complaint in writing up to a certain date.
This month, the fraudulent expenses were back in her credit card. She called again, they mentioned the letter, she found it.
Does she have any recourse? It seems unfair that she would have to pay (it's something like $ 2000) just because she didn't see a letter. Also, they never mentioned a letter in the first place.
When this has happened to me, the process took several months but did include me having to certify in writing that the charges were not mine. I am unclear about a few things from your question
- Did she see the charges get removed from her account and then re-added?
- Did she get this letter but she's just one of those "I don't open my mail" people or did something else happen?
- Did she follow up at any point in time between the initial phone call and getting the statement in the next month?
The credit card company should have a fraud department and they should be able to talk her through this. It would be a fairly shady company that would not handle this for her. I'd just stick to the broken record approach "I need these charges removed. They are fraudulent. I am aware that a letter was sent. I did not see it nor was I notified that it was coming. Please let me know how we can work to resolve this issue. Thank you"
If people are stonewalling, just keep at it. Unless there is something significantly sketchier than you have outlined here, this should resolve itself but it may take a lot of annoying phone calls and, at some point, a piece of paper certifying the fraud so make sure she's checking her mail.
posted by jessamyn at 9:11 AM on March 15, 2012
- Did she see the charges get removed from her account and then re-added?
- Did she get this letter but she's just one of those "I don't open my mail" people or did something else happen?
- Did she follow up at any point in time between the initial phone call and getting the statement in the next month?
The credit card company should have a fraud department and they should be able to talk her through this. It would be a fairly shady company that would not handle this for her. I'd just stick to the broken record approach "I need these charges removed. They are fraudulent. I am aware that a letter was sent. I did not see it nor was I notified that it was coming. Please let me know how we can work to resolve this issue. Thank you"
If people are stonewalling, just keep at it. Unless there is something significantly sketchier than you have outlined here, this should resolve itself but it may take a lot of annoying phone calls and, at some point, a piece of paper certifying the fraud so make sure she's checking her mail.
posted by jessamyn at 9:11 AM on March 15, 2012
Response by poster: It's Visa. They said that since she didn't reply to the letter, they "restored" the expenses. The card was cancelled immediately. The issue with the "restored" expenses is that she didn't reply to the letter.
Oh, we're in Canada.
posted by TheGoodBlood at 9:12 AM on March 15, 2012
Oh, we're in Canada.
posted by TheGoodBlood at 9:12 AM on March 15, 2012
Response by poster: Did she see the charges get removed from her account and then re-added?
Yes.
Did she get this letter but she's just one of those "I don't open my mail" people or did something else happen?
Yes.
Did she follow up at any point in time between the initial phone call and getting the statement in the next month?
No.
They are at the moment saying that they can't do anything. What should she do?
posted by TheGoodBlood at 9:15 AM on March 15, 2012
Yes.
Did she get this letter but she's just one of those "I don't open my mail" people or did something else happen?
Yes.
Did she follow up at any point in time between the initial phone call and getting the statement in the next month?
No.
They are at the moment saying that they can't do anything. What should she do?
posted by TheGoodBlood at 9:15 AM on March 15, 2012
You can be polite and keep pushing back. However, on the back of my all my CC statements are words to the effect that any disputed charge must be put in writing before next billing cycle.
Not sure if that rises to terms/conditions or card agreement (or what differences there may be in Canadian law), but if SO didn't follow through and ignored the letter, may be SOL. So, keep being polite and pushing back, but ...
posted by k5.user at 9:20 AM on March 15, 2012 [1 favorite]
Not sure if that rises to terms/conditions or card agreement (or what differences there may be in Canadian law), but if SO didn't follow through and ignored the letter, may be SOL. So, keep being polite and pushing back, but ...
posted by k5.user at 9:20 AM on March 15, 2012 [1 favorite]
The credit card company should have a fraud department and they should be able to talk her through this.
It sounds like the fraud department has already gone through the whole process, including the requirement that the cardholder sign a written statement that she didn't make the charges, and have rejected the fraud claim.
It varies from company to company but I've heard that it's very difficult to get charges reversed once a fraud claim is rejected like her's apparently was. The only thing I can think of is to call the credit card company and ask them to re-open the fraud claim, which you've already done without success obviously. The only leverage you have is that they will lose a customer and possibly you could threaten to open a small claims court case against them. But in all likelihood they will probably just keep telling you that the fraud claim was rejected and that you're stuck paying for it.
posted by burnmp3s at 9:21 AM on March 15, 2012
It sounds like the fraud department has already gone through the whole process, including the requirement that the cardholder sign a written statement that she didn't make the charges, and have rejected the fraud claim.
It varies from company to company but I've heard that it's very difficult to get charges reversed once a fraud claim is rejected like her's apparently was. The only thing I can think of is to call the credit card company and ask them to re-open the fraud claim, which you've already done without success obviously. The only leverage you have is that they will lose a customer and possibly you could threaten to open a small claims court case against them. But in all likelihood they will probably just keep telling you that the fraud claim was rejected and that you're stuck paying for it.
posted by burnmp3s at 9:21 AM on March 15, 2012
Response by poster: Oh, some new information here.
Her card was actually cancelled in December. There were two letters that she never saw.
So it took a while for them to re-add the expenses.
posted by TheGoodBlood at 9:23 AM on March 15, 2012
Her card was actually cancelled in December. There were two letters that she never saw.
So it took a while for them to re-add the expenses.
posted by TheGoodBlood at 9:23 AM on March 15, 2012
Her card was actually cancelled in December
When you say canceled do you mean you closed the account or just that they gave you a new card/card number that you still have and can use?
posted by burnmp3s at 9:31 AM on March 15, 2012
When you say canceled do you mean you closed the account or just that they gave you a new card/card number that you still have and can use?
posted by burnmp3s at 9:31 AM on March 15, 2012
Response by poster: When you say canceled do you mean you closed the account or just that they gave you a new card/card number that you still have and can use?
New card/number.
posted by TheGoodBlood at 9:33 AM on March 15, 2012
New card/number.
posted by TheGoodBlood at 9:33 AM on March 15, 2012
This is confusing. When you say she never saw the letters, does that mean that they never arrived, or that she just didn't notice/take care of them? Because those are two very different situations. In the former case, she has a legitimate excuse, but if she just didn't notice or care about the letters, it's hard to see how this will end well. But even then, it's worthwhile to keep politely pushing back to see how much they'll be willing to discharge.
posted by clockzero at 9:55 AM on March 15, 2012
posted by clockzero at 9:55 AM on March 15, 2012
Response by poster: When you say she never saw the letters, does that mean that they never arrived, or that she just didn't notice/take care of them?
As I said before in reply to jessamyn and others, the letters arrived and she never opened them.
posted by TheGoodBlood at 9:58 AM on March 15, 2012 [1 favorite]
As I said before in reply to jessamyn and others, the letters arrived and she never opened them.
posted by TheGoodBlood at 9:58 AM on March 15, 2012 [1 favorite]
Is there a Canadian version of the Better Business Bureau? She could send the letter requesting the reversal of the charges, indicating that she called, and the card was cancelled. Copy the BBB and a lawyer friend on it. when companies see that, they usually react. Also, she should talk to a supervisor, not the first-rung phone op she gets on the phone.
posted by rich at 9:59 AM on March 15, 2012
posted by rich at 9:59 AM on March 15, 2012
Response by poster: By the way, one of the items was in Gibraltar, for what's worth. Very blatant fraud.
posted by TheGoodBlood at 10:05 AM on March 15, 2012
posted by TheGoodBlood at 10:05 AM on March 15, 2012
"Also, they never mentioned a letter in the first place."
This is your best angle. If they *admit* not advising of the letter, than you have a chance. Reason: their fraud processing procedures are weakened by this critical omission. Request an audio of the conversation to prove it, as long as you are sure you were not advised.
posted by Kruger5 at 10:44 AM on March 15, 2012
This is your best angle. If they *admit* not advising of the letter, than you have a chance. Reason: their fraud processing procedures are weakened by this critical omission. Request an audio of the conversation to prove it, as long as you are sure you were not advised.
posted by Kruger5 at 10:44 AM on March 15, 2012
So perhaps lay off the attitude.
In the original question it also said "She called again, they mentioned the letter, she found it" which implies that she had the letter and didn't find it until they mentioned it on the phone.
They don't really want to stick their customers with fraudulent charges
But more importantly they don't want to get stuck with the charges themselves. Normally for online fraud charges, it's the merchant that eats the chargeback because they didn't do their job to verify that it was actually the card holder making the purchase. However, generally merchants have a time window after which chargebacks cannot be made, so depending on the agreement between the merchant and Visa it may be impossible for the credit card company to get the merchant to pay. If so the company has a big monetary incentive to deny the fraud claim now that they did not have when the fraud actually happened.
posted by burnmp3s at 10:58 AM on March 15, 2012
In the original question it also said "She called again, they mentioned the letter, she found it" which implies that she had the letter and didn't find it until they mentioned it on the phone.
They don't really want to stick their customers with fraudulent charges
But more importantly they don't want to get stuck with the charges themselves. Normally for online fraud charges, it's the merchant that eats the chargeback because they didn't do their job to verify that it was actually the card holder making the purchase. However, generally merchants have a time window after which chargebacks cannot be made, so depending on the agreement between the merchant and Visa it may be impossible for the credit card company to get the merchant to pay. If so the company has a big monetary incentive to deny the fraud claim now that they did not have when the fraud actually happened.
posted by burnmp3s at 10:58 AM on March 15, 2012
Both my wife and I (Canadians as well) have had fraudulent charges on our cards in the last two years. In both cases, the process was as you described.
- Call and complain
- Cancel the card and have new card issued
- Fill out the letter and submit it
They will not launch a fraud investigation for anything under a certain value, $2,000 if I recall. It doesn't sound like you are dealing with the fraud department at all, just Tier 1/2 customer service processing a chargeback, the process of which was halted when the letter was not submitted.
posted by WinnipegDragon at 11:47 AM on March 15, 2012
- Call and complain
- Cancel the card and have new card issued
- Fill out the letter and submit it
They will not launch a fraud investigation for anything under a certain value, $2,000 if I recall. It doesn't sound like you are dealing with the fraud department at all, just Tier 1/2 customer service processing a chargeback, the process of which was halted when the letter was not submitted.
posted by WinnipegDragon at 11:47 AM on March 15, 2012
My Visa card gets hit with poker-based CCF so often that I'm on conversational terms with the fraud team at the bank. Basically, you (or they) flag bad transactions, then the card issuer sends out a letter itemizing the fraudelent entries which you have to sign and return within a couple of weeks. They also issue you with a new card.
If you don't return it, they assume you're okay with the charges, and they go back on the card. It's part of the cardholder agreement. If you've let fraudulent charges go to long, by not responding, you've basically accepted responsibility.
posted by scruss at 2:39 PM on March 15, 2012
If you don't return it, they assume you're okay with the charges, and they go back on the card. It's part of the cardholder agreement. If you've let fraudulent charges go to long, by not responding, you've basically accepted responsibility.
posted by scruss at 2:39 PM on March 15, 2012
Response by poster: Thanks for all the answers! I'll her the link to this page.
posted by TheGoodBlood at 3:59 PM on March 17, 2012
posted by TheGoodBlood at 3:59 PM on March 17, 2012
This thread is closed to new comments.
Make another call, make sure they cancel the card, and send a followup letter contesting the charges. Note dates of calls made in the letter and state that she won't be paying for the fraudulent charges. Provide as much detail to the card company regarding interactions.
posted by rich at 9:03 AM on March 15, 2012 [2 favorites]