Is it me?
February 19, 2012 12:31 AM Subscribe
Was I wrong?
This afternoon/evening was my friend's milestone birthday party. Her husband and I got her a gift together and he asked me to come over early so we could give it to her in advance of her party. I showed up as directed, gave the present and then was going to go back home, pick up Mr. M. and come back for the real party, which I thought was a couple of hours later. When I asked what time I should be back, I was informed that the party was starting shortly and I should just stay. I called Mr. M. to tell him that he should shower and come over because the party was starting earlier than I'd thought.
Mr. M. arrived a couple of hours later while the party was in full swing. These are not Mr. M.'s friends and he didn't want to stay that long. My car was blocked in, so when he was getting ready to leave, I suggested that I go with him and then we could pick up my car the next day. He said that I should stay. I said that I would stay and I'd be home in a few hours.
A few hours passed, the party started breaking up, my car became unblocked and I was getting ready to head home. Another very drunk guest cornered me and I ended up talking to her/counseling her for approximately 2 hours. During this time I made several attempts to cut the conversation off, but she was insistent on talking to me. When I finally got in my car to leave, I thought of calling Mr. M. to tell him that I was at long last on my way home, but I decided against it since I was only 15 or 20 minutes away and I didn't want to wake him up if he was sleeping.
Mr. M. wasn't sleeping and was, in fact, worried about where I was. During the time when I was cornered by the other guest, Mr. M. tried to call me on my cell phone. I did not receive his call. When I got home and he mentioned that he'd called, I looked at my phone and I didn't see a message or a missed call. We tried calling my cell from both his cell and our home phone number and in neither case did my cell ring or register a missed call or a message. I turned my phone off and back on and then his previous message appeared and my phone seemed to function normally again.
Mr. M. is royally pissed at me for not calling and he thinks I "did something" to my phone so that he couldn't get through. I really thought he'd be sleeping since on a previous occasion he slept right through when he was supposed to pick me up at the airport, which was why I didn't call when I was leaving. I didn't call during the 2 hours I was engaged with the other guest because I thought I'd be getting away at any moment.
It seems very unfair to me that Mr. M. is so pissed off at me, but more that he's unwilling to accept my apology and that he seems to think that I was not only doing something wrong, but that I was affirmatively blocking calls from him. I get that he was worried that I didn't come home when he was expecting. I apologized for not calling but he seems unwilling to accept my apology and instead is being rather rude to me. I think this is unreasonable and immature on his part. I mean, I'm 42 and he's 59. We're a little old for this idiocy. He is now saying that he wants nothing to do with my friend whose birthday party it was since she "acts like a child." (It doesn't really follow, I know, but that's what he said.)
What do I do? In my opinion, he's acting like kind of an idiot, but maybe I'm wrong here? I don't even know. I could really use some outside opinions on this. This seems like a dumb thing to post, but I'm really at a loss here.
This afternoon/evening was my friend's milestone birthday party. Her husband and I got her a gift together and he asked me to come over early so we could give it to her in advance of her party. I showed up as directed, gave the present and then was going to go back home, pick up Mr. M. and come back for the real party, which I thought was a couple of hours later. When I asked what time I should be back, I was informed that the party was starting shortly and I should just stay. I called Mr. M. to tell him that he should shower and come over because the party was starting earlier than I'd thought.
Mr. M. arrived a couple of hours later while the party was in full swing. These are not Mr. M.'s friends and he didn't want to stay that long. My car was blocked in, so when he was getting ready to leave, I suggested that I go with him and then we could pick up my car the next day. He said that I should stay. I said that I would stay and I'd be home in a few hours.
A few hours passed, the party started breaking up, my car became unblocked and I was getting ready to head home. Another very drunk guest cornered me and I ended up talking to her/counseling her for approximately 2 hours. During this time I made several attempts to cut the conversation off, but she was insistent on talking to me. When I finally got in my car to leave, I thought of calling Mr. M. to tell him that I was at long last on my way home, but I decided against it since I was only 15 or 20 minutes away and I didn't want to wake him up if he was sleeping.
Mr. M. wasn't sleeping and was, in fact, worried about where I was. During the time when I was cornered by the other guest, Mr. M. tried to call me on my cell phone. I did not receive his call. When I got home and he mentioned that he'd called, I looked at my phone and I didn't see a message or a missed call. We tried calling my cell from both his cell and our home phone number and in neither case did my cell ring or register a missed call or a message. I turned my phone off and back on and then his previous message appeared and my phone seemed to function normally again.
Mr. M. is royally pissed at me for not calling and he thinks I "did something" to my phone so that he couldn't get through. I really thought he'd be sleeping since on a previous occasion he slept right through when he was supposed to pick me up at the airport, which was why I didn't call when I was leaving. I didn't call during the 2 hours I was engaged with the other guest because I thought I'd be getting away at any moment.
It seems very unfair to me that Mr. M. is so pissed off at me, but more that he's unwilling to accept my apology and that he seems to think that I was not only doing something wrong, but that I was affirmatively blocking calls from him. I get that he was worried that I didn't come home when he was expecting. I apologized for not calling but he seems unwilling to accept my apology and instead is being rather rude to me. I think this is unreasonable and immature on his part. I mean, I'm 42 and he's 59. We're a little old for this idiocy. He is now saying that he wants nothing to do with my friend whose birthday party it was since she "acts like a child." (It doesn't really follow, I know, but that's what he said.)
What do I do? In my opinion, he's acting like kind of an idiot, but maybe I'm wrong here? I don't even know. I could really use some outside opinions on this. This seems like a dumb thing to post, but I'm really at a loss here.
Also, if he's 59, he's surely had to have tracked someone down without a cell phone before.
posted by june made him a gemini at 12:42 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
posted by june made him a gemini at 12:42 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
I don't think you're wrong. It is really weird that he's presuming malice on your part. Is it possible there's something else going on that he's frustrated/angry about, and it's just coming out here about this event?
posted by needs more cowbell at 12:42 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
posted by needs more cowbell at 12:42 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
Get some sleep. Sort this out when everyone is 100% rested and sober.
Going to bed angry has got to be the best piece of advice, ever. Staying up late sorting things out when no-one is capable of logic or reason only agravates things.
You're both grumpy and had to deal with a bunch of bullshit, when you shine the light of day on this tomorrow, I doubt anyone will be able to hold a grudge.
posted by JimmyJames at 12:42 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
Going to bed angry has got to be the best piece of advice, ever. Staying up late sorting things out when no-one is capable of logic or reason only agravates things.
You're both grumpy and had to deal with a bunch of bullshit, when you shine the light of day on this tomorrow, I doubt anyone will be able to hold a grudge.
posted by JimmyJames at 12:42 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
I agree that he should have just driven back over there if he was worried.
But that being said, when I was married, I absolutely hated it when my wife would stay gone significantly longer than she said she'd be gone, which you did. It's simple promise keeping. I think you should have prioritized getting home when you said you would, over "counseling" some drunk idiot after a party.
posted by jayder at 12:42 AM on February 19, 2012 [7 favorites]
But that being said, when I was married, I absolutely hated it when my wife would stay gone significantly longer than she said she'd be gone, which you did. It's simple promise keeping. I think you should have prioritized getting home when you said you would, over "counseling" some drunk idiot after a party.
posted by jayder at 12:42 AM on February 19, 2012 [7 favorites]
It seems like somewhat of a red flag that he does not believe you about your phone. Unless you have been deceitful in the past, this seems unreasonable. Does he have trust issues?
Also, I don't quite understand why he needed you to be home "in a few hours", if he would just be sleeping and it's your friend's party. Why shouldn't you be able to come home when you want to? Was there a specific reason he needed you to be home? Otherwise it sounds like a curfew.
No, from this reading you didn't do anything wrong, and moreover he comes of as a bit insecure and controlling.
posted by bearette at 12:43 AM on February 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
Also, I don't quite understand why he needed you to be home "in a few hours", if he would just be sleeping and it's your friend's party. Why shouldn't you be able to come home when you want to? Was there a specific reason he needed you to be home? Otherwise it sounds like a curfew.
No, from this reading you didn't do anything wrong, and moreover he comes of as a bit insecure and controlling.
posted by bearette at 12:43 AM on February 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
Both of you need to go to bed, and figure this out in the morning.
posted by spunweb at 12:44 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by spunweb at 12:44 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
He really worried and mad when he couldn't get through to you, and now that he knows it wasn't your fault he is too wound up in his emotions to act rationally. He has, like, object-in-angry-emotion-stays-in-angry-emotion inertia. You did nothing wrong. Here's hoping Mr. M will wake up in the morning with a fresh outlook and an apology.
posted by feets at 12:45 AM on February 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by feets at 12:45 AM on February 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: As god is my witness, we are both sober. We are also night owls, so we would be up for a couple more hours even without this argument.
posted by Maisie at 12:48 AM on February 19, 2012
posted by Maisie at 12:48 AM on February 19, 2012
Response by poster: Oh, and no, I have not ever been deceitful in our relationship, although he has. I will stop babysitting the thread now.
posted by Maisie at 12:51 AM on February 19, 2012
posted by Maisie at 12:51 AM on February 19, 2012
he seems to think that I was not only doing something wrong, but that I was affirmatively blocking calls from him
That's ridiculous.
posted by fshgrl at 12:52 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
That's ridiculous.
posted by fshgrl at 12:52 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
He can Memail me.
Recently, a few folks have called my iphone and/or left actual voice mails I have NOT at all received. I keep meaning to call AT&T about it. I keep wondering about the friends and clients who think I've blown them off.
Thanks for reminding me to follow up on this. I pay good money each month to avoid miscommunications.
posted by jbenben at 12:55 AM on February 19, 2012
Recently, a few folks have called my iphone and/or left actual voice mails I have NOT at all received. I keep meaning to call AT&T about it. I keep wondering about the friends and clients who think I've blown them off.
Thanks for reminding me to follow up on this. I pay good money each month to avoid miscommunications.
posted by jbenben at 12:55 AM on February 19, 2012
i think you were in the wrong - doesn't matter that you were blameless for your phone not ringing, because you should have called him yourself - if you were battling a forest fire i can see not calling for a few hours, but if you're just having a conversation, how tough is it? - but it's completely a trivial violation and he should be a gentleman and forgive you. the blocking calls paranoia on his part is nuts, of course.
posted by facetious at 12:58 AM on February 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
posted by facetious at 12:58 AM on February 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
I did not realize this had just happened--I thought he was holding a grudge about this for 24 hours or more, which is a different story. Yeah, go to sleep, or at least set this aside for the night. Even if you're night owls and you're both sober, it's the end of what's been a long and frustrating day for both of you (being cornered by a drunk person for 2 hours? Ugh.) Neither of you is at your finest.
posted by needs more cowbell at 12:59 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by needs more cowbell at 12:59 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
Oh, and no, I have not ever been deceitful in our relationship, although he has.
I was hesitant to write this before you posted that. I don't know the nature of his deceit but he could be accuseing you of using the same deceitful tactics he used in the past.
This could just be his guilt or resentment over that past deceit coming to the surface.
posted by munchingzombie at 1:06 AM on February 19, 2012 [21 favorites]
I was hesitant to write this before you posted that. I don't know the nature of his deceit but he could be accuseing you of using the same deceitful tactics he used in the past.
This could just be his guilt or resentment over that past deceit coming to the surface.
posted by munchingzombie at 1:06 AM on February 19, 2012 [21 favorites]
My 'stranger on the internet' opinion is: Your husband is starting to feel his age. He's worried that he's not 'keeping up'. He's worried he's going to lose you to some young buck of 45. He's concerned that you have a life and friends outside of him. He's jealous and feeling insecure.
Call him on it. In the morning. Tell him that you:
1) love him - he is your man and that you are an honest person who is not deceitful.
2) are an individual and have a right to your own life, even if that means not arriving home at the exact appointed hour.
3) that phones are fallible.
I hope he apologises in the morning, because he's at fault for making such a drama, not you.
posted by Kerasia at 1:10 AM on February 19, 2012 [13 favorites]
Call him on it. In the morning. Tell him that you:
1) love him - he is your man and that you are an honest person who is not deceitful.
2) are an individual and have a right to your own life, even if that means not arriving home at the exact appointed hour.
3) that phones are fallible.
I hope he apologises in the morning, because he's at fault for making such a drama, not you.
posted by Kerasia at 1:10 AM on February 19, 2012 [13 favorites]
Hey, he was worried, and it sounds like maybe you could learn to break drunks off a little bit sooner. They aren't going to remember.
posted by rhizome at 1:24 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by rhizome at 1:24 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
Yes it would have been nice if you were able to call or text him, but he's your husband not your keeper, you don't have a curfew. Its just one of those things, sometimes things don't go to plan and you're not able to call.
He is massively overreacting, you didn't nothing "wrong" and you've already apologised for not calling. The phone thing is not your fault (I've had it happen too).
You've apologised for the only thing you need to apologise for, he's being paranoid and childish. You could just give him the apology he wants for a quiet life but IMO the lack of trust is a bigger issue that deserves to be addressed rather than dismissed for the sake of peace.
posted by missmagenta at 1:30 AM on February 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
He is massively overreacting, you didn't nothing "wrong" and you've already apologised for not calling. The phone thing is not your fault (I've had it happen too).
You've apologised for the only thing you need to apologise for, he's being paranoid and childish. You could just give him the apology he wants for a quiet life but IMO the lack of trust is a bigger issue that deserves to be addressed rather than dismissed for the sake of peace.
posted by missmagenta at 1:30 AM on February 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
This is something of a sensitive topic for and I have to admit to often acting and feeling like your husband. I certainly don't think what you did was wrong, but perhaps I can offer a bit of insight into his thought process.
(on preview, I see that his past deceit has come into the discussion. I am going to ignore that in my answer - but it might be pertinent in your case)
For me, I quite quickly get stressed when I can't get in contact with my partner when her plans change unexpectedly. I entirely trust my partner, and don't think she is out out deceive me. Nor do I want to keep tabs on what she is doing. It is just that I can sleep easy if I know that, if we need to, get in contact with each other; because I tend to always assume the worst when something like this happens: ie. car crash, riot, whatever.
Of course, that is my own issue to deal with, and I am trying to get better at it. But I think my anxiety stems from my childhood. Growing up with a family member with unpredictable behaviour (caused by severe mental illness), there were times when I had to quickly get in contact with someone. If I couldn't reach them, there was a real chance that something dreadful might have happened.
Has there been a situation in your husband's past that might act like a similar trigger?
The arguments I have had with my partner when situations similar to yours have come up have not been about me not trusting her, but when she hasn't understood why it is that I have been so worried and upset about her. The stress your husband has felt has probably manifested itself in him saying some silly things to you this evening and causing the argument to go on longer than it needed to.
Hopefully he will apologise in the morning for what he said, but maybe next time be aware that this sort of thing is a hot-button issue for some people and a quick 60 second phone call will mean a lot more to those who care about you than you might realise.
Good luck!
posted by TheOtherGuy at 1:32 AM on February 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
(on preview, I see that his past deceit has come into the discussion. I am going to ignore that in my answer - but it might be pertinent in your case)
For me, I quite quickly get stressed when I can't get in contact with my partner when her plans change unexpectedly. I entirely trust my partner, and don't think she is out out deceive me. Nor do I want to keep tabs on what she is doing. It is just that I can sleep easy if I know that, if we need to, get in contact with each other; because I tend to always assume the worst when something like this happens: ie. car crash, riot, whatever.
Of course, that is my own issue to deal with, and I am trying to get better at it. But I think my anxiety stems from my childhood. Growing up with a family member with unpredictable behaviour (caused by severe mental illness), there were times when I had to quickly get in contact with someone. If I couldn't reach them, there was a real chance that something dreadful might have happened.
Has there been a situation in your husband's past that might act like a similar trigger?
The arguments I have had with my partner when situations similar to yours have come up have not been about me not trusting her, but when she hasn't understood why it is that I have been so worried and upset about her. The stress your husband has felt has probably manifested itself in him saying some silly things to you this evening and causing the argument to go on longer than it needed to.
Hopefully he will apologise in the morning for what he said, but maybe next time be aware that this sort of thing is a hot-button issue for some people and a quick 60 second phone call will mean a lot more to those who care about you than you might realise.
Good luck!
posted by TheOtherGuy at 1:32 AM on February 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
I think that, while he was waiting, he thought of a million things that could have gone wrong. The worst case scenario was the "dead in a ditch" scenario that people have when they can't get in touch with you, then everything else, on a sliding scale.
When you showed up, you obviously weren't dead, weren't injured, weren't kidnapped, weren't struck with amnesia, etc., so he went to the next "worst case" option, because he was tired and scared, and that's what one does when one is terrified...the easiest emotion to jump to after fear is anger. It's misdirected anger, for sure, but it almost always comes after a great fright.
Give him some time to calm down. Get some sleep, the both of you, and realize that you were both wrong (I don't care how "cornered" you were, you really should be able to get a message to someone at home, and he could have called anyone else at the party or just driven back there) and it's okay for your minds to go to dark places, so long as they don't stay there.
posted by xingcat at 1:48 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
When you showed up, you obviously weren't dead, weren't injured, weren't kidnapped, weren't struck with amnesia, etc., so he went to the next "worst case" option, because he was tired and scared, and that's what one does when one is terrified...the easiest emotion to jump to after fear is anger. It's misdirected anger, for sure, but it almost always comes after a great fright.
Give him some time to calm down. Get some sleep, the both of you, and realize that you were both wrong (I don't care how "cornered" you were, you really should be able to get a message to someone at home, and he could have called anyone else at the party or just driven back there) and it's okay for your minds to go to dark places, so long as they don't stay there.
posted by xingcat at 1:48 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
He can memail me too -- i have had phones act this way as well, and it is bloody annoying to be waiting for a call and have your phone not ring at the appointed hour and to have the message not turn up until hours later. When I confronted my carrier about this, they blithely insisted I must have been out of the coverage area when I had been in the core of one if the biggest cities on the country, a half block from their head office.
Anyway, yes,it sounds to me like he is displacing resentment about something else to this.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 3:00 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
Anyway, yes,it sounds to me like he is displacing resentment about something else to this.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 3:00 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
Yeah, I have to say that you were at least in the wrong because you should have called him, at the very least. People worry when their loved ones aren't back at the time they expect, and that isn't something we grow out of, so I'm afraid age doesn't excuse it. We should be considerate about that concern for our loved one, no? Instead of taking care of that you took care of a pushy drunk stranger for two hours when you were really under no obligation to do so, and could have simply said "I'm sorry, I really have to go now" at any point. Your husband has, unfortunately, become a bit paranoid about the incident, but he has every right to be annoyed.
posted by Decani at 3:22 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
posted by Decani at 3:22 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
He's your husband, not your parole officer. You shouldn't have to account to him for your every move. He knew you were at a party, and surely at his age he knows that sometimes it is hard to get away from a party when you think you're going to. Also, it really sounds like he didn't want to go to the party anyway, and he started out grumpy about it.
The cellphone thing was completely ridiculous. Why would he leap to a conclusion like that?
I don't think you're wrong at all. I'd just let it blow over. If your husband is a reasonable person, he'll see he over-reacted in the morning, and perhaps the next time there's a social event for people he doesn't want to attend he'll be a little more adult about processing his feelings about you having a different set of friends than he does.
posted by winna at 4:54 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
The cellphone thing was completely ridiculous. Why would he leap to a conclusion like that?
I don't think you're wrong at all. I'd just let it blow over. If your husband is a reasonable person, he'll see he over-reacted in the morning, and perhaps the next time there's a social event for people he doesn't want to attend he'll be a little more adult about processing his feelings about you having a different set of friends than he does.
posted by winna at 4:54 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
I vote that you are both guilty of odd behaviour. Him for being pissed about the cell phone thing. These are not the most reliable devices, weird shit happens. You, because you are a grownup that was unable to get out of a conversation with a person for two hours. Sleep, and head out for a nice brunch tomorrow (or bring one in, hang out in the livingroom and spread the newspaper all over, and cuddle), and try to forgive each other.
posted by kellyblah at 5:28 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
posted by kellyblah at 5:28 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
I would be annoyed that you could not shake off the woman on your way out, it makes you seem very weak willed and like a very flimsy frivolous reason for being very late. Also seems like some stupid drunk person is more important to you than not making your spouse worry.
I agree some with this. You're gonna blow off your husband to "counsel" a drunk? Here's the thing about drunks- they're drunk! They don't need hours of counsel they won't remember the next day, they need a glass of water, an aspirin, and a safe way to get home. Why would you allow yourself to be commandeered by someone in that state? Try to examine your motivations so you can better handle these situations next time.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 6:03 AM on February 19, 2012 [8 favorites]
I agree some with this. You're gonna blow off your husband to "counsel" a drunk? Here's the thing about drunks- they're drunk! They don't need hours of counsel they won't remember the next day, they need a glass of water, an aspirin, and a safe way to get home. Why would you allow yourself to be commandeered by someone in that state? Try to examine your motivations so you can better handle these situations next time.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 6:03 AM on February 19, 2012 [8 favorites]
I work tech support for a cell phone company, and this TOTALLY happens from time to time. If you don't regularly (as in every couple of days) turn your phone off for a minute or so, then your phone can lose it's connection to the network and have difficulty receiving the message from the cell phone network that you have a call trying to come through. Same thing for a notification that you have a voicemail waiting. Sometimes the network hiccups which can cause the same thing. If your call list shows no call from him during the time that he called then you didn't get the call to your handset, simple as that.
posted by ottergrrl at 6:04 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by ottergrrl at 6:04 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
nthing phones being fallible. Sometimes, across networks, it's taken hours for messages and calls o get through. Once got into a particularly grim argument about missing a call, and about two hours in, my phone beeped with the "missed call" signal from the caller while I was being yelled at.
posted by scruss at 6:56 AM on February 19, 2012
posted by scruss at 6:56 AM on February 19, 2012
Yeah, I think the phone thing is a red herring. You should not have stayed to counsel someone who was drunk.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:35 AM on February 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:35 AM on February 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
This has happened to me on my cell phone many, many times. Once I was waiting on pins and needles for life-changing call for a full week and couldn't understand why the person hadn't called, then riding in the car I heard the voicemail ding on my cell phone, and it was a VM they had left a full week earlier finally coming through. But it's utterly common for phone calls not to come through and the VMs to show up hours later.
posted by HotToddy at 7:48 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by HotToddy at 7:48 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
I think that the reality is that people don't like it when their partner says they've going to be home at such-and-such time and end up coming home many hours later with no notice. It seems possible that he expected you home in no more than two hours and you ended up getting home three hours after he expected you home.
I've been on both sides of this coin myself. There were a few times I went down to a favorite watering hole for "just a drink and a quick visit" and ended up engaged in conversation until rather late. Mrs. slkinsey was pissed off when this happened, whereas I thought it was no big deal (after all, it's not like we had any plans to do anything that night and she knew I was spending time with friends, amiright?). Some time later Mrs. slkinsey was meeting friends for early drinks and dinner and ended up moving on to some other place with one friend until late in the night. I was pissed off when this happened, and then a little lightbulb went off for me.
I couldn't say why exactly, for either of us, except that it's just basic consideration. But the basic lessons I learned are to (a) come home reasonably near when I say I'm coming home; (b) be more deliberately open-ended about when I might be coming home if I have reason to believe it could go considerably longer (e.g., "I hope to be back by 9:00, but you know how these things go... it could be midnight, so let's just say I'll be out for the evening?), and (c) to absolutely call in if things change in unpredictable ways.
If you expect your partner home at 8 and he or she comes rolling in at midnight instead with no notice (and especially if you tried calling at 10 and 11 but there was no answer) I think it's normal to be annoyed. And vice-versa. I think it's likely that if the roles were reversed and you had reason to believe Mr. M was coming home to spend the rest of the evening with you at such-and-such time, but ended up coming home many hours later during which time he was at some wild party yukking it up with his friends, and also without calling in, you might be pissed off.
Looking at what you wrote, I wonder if you might quantify just how much longer you stayed at the party after Mr. M left? And what you think hit assumptions might have been as to how long you would be staying? It's hard to read from your post, but it seems likely that you might have arrived home as many as four or more hours after Mr. M might reasonably have been expecting you, and without the courtesy of a phone call. I'm also not sure why you would have expected him to be asleep if you're both "night owls" for whom it would be ordinary to be up for a few more hours after you got home. And as someone who spends a lot of time around people in various stages or inebriation, I don't think I've ever found myself "trapped" in a conversation with someone when I wanted to leave and was trying to get out the door. And finally, given your 17 year age difference, I imagine there may be some amount of age-related jealousy involved. Issues relating to your difference in age will only magnify as he enters his 60s while you are still in your early 40s, so you have to decide whether you want to be extra-understanding and accommodating about it, or if you want to be tough-love about it. Being a much-younger woman in the relationship puts a large balance of sexual power on your side of the equation, and given what we have all observed throughout history it's not unpredictable that the much-older man will sometimes wonder what his much-younger wife is up to when she's away much later than predicted at a party where young people are whooping it up and getting drunk.
All of which is to say that #1 it's entirely predictable to be angry/annoyed when one's partner comes home hours later than expected with no phone call, and especially when unresponsive to your phone calls whatever the reason, #2 it's probably something that won't stay a big deal for very long, and #3 it's always helpful to establish some mutually agreed upon ground rules (and stick to them!) for these sorts of situations.
posted by slkinsey at 7:53 AM on February 19, 2012 [5 favorites]
I've been on both sides of this coin myself. There were a few times I went down to a favorite watering hole for "just a drink and a quick visit" and ended up engaged in conversation until rather late. Mrs. slkinsey was pissed off when this happened, whereas I thought it was no big deal (after all, it's not like we had any plans to do anything that night and she knew I was spending time with friends, amiright?). Some time later Mrs. slkinsey was meeting friends for early drinks and dinner and ended up moving on to some other place with one friend until late in the night. I was pissed off when this happened, and then a little lightbulb went off for me.
I couldn't say why exactly, for either of us, except that it's just basic consideration. But the basic lessons I learned are to (a) come home reasonably near when I say I'm coming home; (b) be more deliberately open-ended about when I might be coming home if I have reason to believe it could go considerably longer (e.g., "I hope to be back by 9:00, but you know how these things go... it could be midnight, so let's just say I'll be out for the evening?), and (c) to absolutely call in if things change in unpredictable ways.
If you expect your partner home at 8 and he or she comes rolling in at midnight instead with no notice (and especially if you tried calling at 10 and 11 but there was no answer) I think it's normal to be annoyed. And vice-versa. I think it's likely that if the roles were reversed and you had reason to believe Mr. M was coming home to spend the rest of the evening with you at such-and-such time, but ended up coming home many hours later during which time he was at some wild party yukking it up with his friends, and also without calling in, you might be pissed off.
Looking at what you wrote, I wonder if you might quantify just how much longer you stayed at the party after Mr. M left? And what you think hit assumptions might have been as to how long you would be staying? It's hard to read from your post, but it seems likely that you might have arrived home as many as four or more hours after Mr. M might reasonably have been expecting you, and without the courtesy of a phone call. I'm also not sure why you would have expected him to be asleep if you're both "night owls" for whom it would be ordinary to be up for a few more hours after you got home. And as someone who spends a lot of time around people in various stages or inebriation, I don't think I've ever found myself "trapped" in a conversation with someone when I wanted to leave and was trying to get out the door. And finally, given your 17 year age difference, I imagine there may be some amount of age-related jealousy involved. Issues relating to your difference in age will only magnify as he enters his 60s while you are still in your early 40s, so you have to decide whether you want to be extra-understanding and accommodating about it, or if you want to be tough-love about it. Being a much-younger woman in the relationship puts a large balance of sexual power on your side of the equation, and given what we have all observed throughout history it's not unpredictable that the much-older man will sometimes wonder what his much-younger wife is up to when she's away much later than predicted at a party where young people are whooping it up and getting drunk.
All of which is to say that #1 it's entirely predictable to be angry/annoyed when one's partner comes home hours later than expected with no phone call, and especially when unresponsive to your phone calls whatever the reason, #2 it's probably something that won't stay a big deal for very long, and #3 it's always helpful to establish some mutually agreed upon ground rules (and stick to them!) for these sorts of situations.
posted by slkinsey at 7:53 AM on February 19, 2012 [5 favorites]
How about, you're both wrong and you both apologize? You can't make him apologize, but you can decide what you do, and maybe if you act like a grown-up, he will, too.
You should have called. You were hours later than expected and he had a right to be nervous.
He should not accuse you of tampering with your phone. That's just insane. Especially since, as far as I know, there's no way to make a phone not register that it's being called -- and he actually saw it have that problem. I don't know enough about your relationship to know whether this is indicative of trust issues on his end, or whether he was just nervous and angry and said the first moronic thing that popped into his brain.
posted by J. Wilson at 8:25 AM on February 19, 2012 [7 favorites]
You should have called. You were hours later than expected and he had a right to be nervous.
He should not accuse you of tampering with your phone. That's just insane. Especially since, as far as I know, there's no way to make a phone not register that it's being called -- and he actually saw it have that problem. I don't know enough about your relationship to know whether this is indicative of trust issues on his end, or whether he was just nervous and angry and said the first moronic thing that popped into his brain.
posted by J. Wilson at 8:25 AM on February 19, 2012 [7 favorites]
You should have called him to tell him you would be so late; I would have been very worried if my girlfriend stayed out several hours later than planned (the worry would not be unfaithfulness, it would be a car accident or something along those lines).
That said, once you got home and explained and apologized, he should have forgiven you, not turned it into a bigger fight.
posted by insectosaurus at 8:29 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
That said, once you got home and explained and apologized, he should have forgiven you, not turned it into a bigger fight.
posted by insectosaurus at 8:29 AM on February 19, 2012 [6 favorites]
I'm also not sure why you would have expected him to be asleep if you're both "night owls" for whom it would be ordinary to be up for a few more hours after you got home.
Yeah, what's up with that?
Usually it's my husband who's out with friends, and I'm at home, and a two-hour delay would merit a text. You're out late, people are drinking, you're driving. But to think you are blocking his calls or something is pretty serious; I would want to get to the bottom of whether he really thinks you would do that. It is very strange to think that... except if you were my partner I have to say I would be annoyed and maybe made somewhat suspicious by the lengthy circumstantial excuse-making, if you talked to him the way you did in this post. You make it sound like you have no agency in whether you get home on time. He might be less pissed if you said, Sorry, I totally messed up, won't happen again.
posted by BibiRose at 8:32 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
Yeah, what's up with that?
Usually it's my husband who's out with friends, and I'm at home, and a two-hour delay would merit a text. You're out late, people are drinking, you're driving. But to think you are blocking his calls or something is pretty serious; I would want to get to the bottom of whether he really thinks you would do that. It is very strange to think that... except if you were my partner I have to say I would be annoyed and maybe made somewhat suspicious by the lengthy circumstantial excuse-making, if you talked to him the way you did in this post. You make it sound like you have no agency in whether you get home on time. He might be less pissed if you said, Sorry, I totally messed up, won't happen again.
posted by BibiRose at 8:32 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
I think you're both wrong. You should have called him, or tried harder to leave when you were planning to. But accusing you of some kind of phone magic to give yourself cover to stay at the party is pretty extreme. If this fight is still happening, it can't possibly be about the party. This is a time to say "what are we really fighting about here?" and see what he says.
posted by Ragged Richard at 8:42 AM on February 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
posted by Ragged Richard at 8:42 AM on February 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
...lengthy circumstantial excuse-making...
Yes, the sense of dissimulation in the telling was a bit of a red flag to me as well. Also the fact that some of the timeframes seemed vague (as in, how much longer did he expect you to stay at the party versus how much time you actually stayed at the party -- there are plenty of different understandings of "a few") makes me wonder what really happened. Not to mention that being "trapped" into a two hour (!) conversation with some drunk doesn't seem credible for someone who is really trying to leave the party.
I am less bothered about what some are assuming are accusations of sophisticated cell-phone tampering unless we know what "did something to my phone so that he couldn't get through" means. It could simply mean turning off or silencing the phone, or any number of other things. Or, more likely, it could just be frustration or disbelief that the calls wouldn't have gone through -- perhaps borne out of a lack of sophisticated understanding of cell phone quirks. I know that I have been known to get quite annoyed when unable to reach Mrs. slkinsey on her cell phone, usually because she has it silenced in her bag. And likewise Mrs. slkinsey has been quite annoyed with me if she has tried to reach me someplace noisy and I didn't hear my phone ringing.
What I think this really boils down to is that it can be hurtful to someone to imagine that they are being left at home by a partner who would rather spend time with someone else. Of course, we all have times when we prefer to spend time with someone other than our partner, but it still doesn't feel nice. It especially doesn't feel nice if the partner isn't thinking of you enough to show some basic consideration as to turning up at home within the expected timeframe, and even moreso if the partner isn't updating you as to their status and whereabouts if/when the timeframe changes, and even more moreso if the partner isn't picking up the phone when you call after having expected them home earlier. And, let's be honest here, most anyone is going to have some level of suspicion when the partner is 17 years younger, has spent the evening at a boozy party with other young people, and spins a tale full of circumstantial excuse-making upon eventual late arrival home.
It's hard to say how or why this escalated into a big fight, but sometimes tempers flare about these kinds of things. It seems likely to me that his annoyance over the situation was ramping up towards anger with every hour you didn't arrive and as his calls went unanswered/unreturned, and if you were defensive or may have appeared disingenuous or dismissive upon your eventual arrival (all of which would be natural outcomes for someone in your position, at least if my own historical reactions in similar situations are any indication) then, voilà: fight.
posted by slkinsey at 9:20 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
Yes, the sense of dissimulation in the telling was a bit of a red flag to me as well. Also the fact that some of the timeframes seemed vague (as in, how much longer did he expect you to stay at the party versus how much time you actually stayed at the party -- there are plenty of different understandings of "a few") makes me wonder what really happened. Not to mention that being "trapped" into a two hour (!) conversation with some drunk doesn't seem credible for someone who is really trying to leave the party.
I am less bothered about what some are assuming are accusations of sophisticated cell-phone tampering unless we know what "did something to my phone so that he couldn't get through" means. It could simply mean turning off or silencing the phone, or any number of other things. Or, more likely, it could just be frustration or disbelief that the calls wouldn't have gone through -- perhaps borne out of a lack of sophisticated understanding of cell phone quirks. I know that I have been known to get quite annoyed when unable to reach Mrs. slkinsey on her cell phone, usually because she has it silenced in her bag. And likewise Mrs. slkinsey has been quite annoyed with me if she has tried to reach me someplace noisy and I didn't hear my phone ringing.
What I think this really boils down to is that it can be hurtful to someone to imagine that they are being left at home by a partner who would rather spend time with someone else. Of course, we all have times when we prefer to spend time with someone other than our partner, but it still doesn't feel nice. It especially doesn't feel nice if the partner isn't thinking of you enough to show some basic consideration as to turning up at home within the expected timeframe, and even moreso if the partner isn't updating you as to their status and whereabouts if/when the timeframe changes, and even more moreso if the partner isn't picking up the phone when you call after having expected them home earlier. And, let's be honest here, most anyone is going to have some level of suspicion when the partner is 17 years younger, has spent the evening at a boozy party with other young people, and spins a tale full of circumstantial excuse-making upon eventual late arrival home.
It's hard to say how or why this escalated into a big fight, but sometimes tempers flare about these kinds of things. It seems likely to me that his annoyance over the situation was ramping up towards anger with every hour you didn't arrive and as his calls went unanswered/unreturned, and if you were defensive or may have appeared disingenuous or dismissive upon your eventual arrival (all of which would be natural outcomes for someone in your position, at least if my own historical reactions in similar situations are any indication) then, voilà: fight.
posted by slkinsey at 9:20 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
I have found with my cell phone that it occasionally needs to be turned off and back on, to get it to function right.
posted by annsunny at 10:27 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by annsunny at 10:27 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
I can sympathize with both sides of your story having been both the worrier and the worry-ee at different times. I agree with the many posters above that this will likely seem like much less of a problem tomorrow once you have both had a chance to relax at home.
Here's the solution to this that my boyfriend and I have developed after one too many of these disagreements: The person who is home agrees to turn their phone on silent if they go to sleep. That way the person who is out can feel free to call without worrying about waking or disturbing them. And then the person who is out must keep up this end of the bargain by keeping in contact when plans change. And a message must be left. Because even if my phone is on silent, I don't want to wake up at 4am with no boyfriend and 2 missed calls but no messages.
I hope you've worked it out. The important thing going forward is not who is right but how to prevent the situation in the future. You can then chalk up your argument as resolved which will be satisfying for both of you.
posted by tinamonster at 11:06 AM on February 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
Here's the solution to this that my boyfriend and I have developed after one too many of these disagreements: The person who is home agrees to turn their phone on silent if they go to sleep. That way the person who is out can feel free to call without worrying about waking or disturbing them. And then the person who is out must keep up this end of the bargain by keeping in contact when plans change. And a message must be left. Because even if my phone is on silent, I don't want to wake up at 4am with no boyfriend and 2 missed calls but no messages.
I hope you've worked it out. The important thing going forward is not who is right but how to prevent the situation in the future. You can then chalk up your argument as resolved which will be satisfying for both of you.
posted by tinamonster at 11:06 AM on February 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
tinamonster beat me to what I was going to suggest! Although I would suggest just turning the "text" function to silent, and then the person wouldn't be woken by a text of "I'm talking to Jane; she's drunk and upset; I could be a while" if they were sleeping, but would be woken by a call of "HOLY FUCK THE ENGINE IS ON FIRE!" if need be.
posted by Sidhedevil at 11:24 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by Sidhedevil at 11:24 AM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
Anyway, you should have called or texted. Coming home 3 hours after the arranged time, with no explanation, is rude and disrespectful.
But he shouldn't be turning this into a giant melodrama, with the "You're purposefully blocking me on your phone!" and the "Your friend acts like a child!" nonsense.
posted by Sidhedevil at 11:26 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
But he shouldn't be turning this into a giant melodrama, with the "You're purposefully blocking me on your phone!" and the "Your friend acts like a child!" nonsense.
posted by Sidhedevil at 11:26 AM on February 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
When we got one of my wife's phones, we were told by the salesperson that in order to ensure the phone would work properly she should turn the phone of and restart it EVERY DAY. She said this was true of all phones on all carriers, but since 99% of the time the phones will work anyway if you leave them on for extended periods, they don't advertise it and usually only recommend it if you get to a certain stage of tech support.
posted by Yorrick at 11:37 AM on February 19, 2012
posted by Yorrick at 11:37 AM on February 19, 2012
Her husband and I got her a gift together and he asked me to come over early so we could give it to her in advance of her party. I showed up as directed, gave the present and then was going to go back home, pick up Mr. M. and come back for the real party, which I thought was a couple of hours later. When I asked what time I should be back, I was informed that the party was starting shortly and I should just stay. I called Mr. M. to tell him that he should shower and come over because the party was starting earlier than I'd thought...Mr. M. is royally pissed at me for not calling and he thinks I "did something" to my phone so that he couldn't get through.
Sounds like he's afraid you turned your phone off to fool around with Mr. Gift-in-Kind.
posted by Snarl Furillo at 11:38 AM on February 19, 2012
Sounds like he's afraid you turned your phone off to fool around with Mr. Gift-in-Kind.
posted by Snarl Furillo at 11:38 AM on February 19, 2012
Do you think he might be uncomfortable with your friendship with your friend's husband?
I know this is a shot in the dark but your question, the way you related it, just raised a big red flag for me, starting right with the first sentence:
Her husband and I got her a gift together and he asked me to come over early so we could give it to her in advance of her party.
This is actually a pretty intimate thing to do, I think - to conspire with somebody's husband to get her a (presumably big, expensive, special) gift for her "milestone birthday" - and to go over there on your own, without your husband, to give the gift in tandem with her husband. It suggests a backstory in which you and her husband had lengthy conversations about this gift - what it should be, how and when to give it to her. And I wonder if your husband isn't comfortable with this...and as a result, felt particularly unhappy about you staying at the friend's house so late, without answering his call.
Talk to him. Find out what his unhappiness is really about. If it were really just about his feeling that you should have called, you're right, he would have accepted your apology already.
posted by artemisia at 11:44 AM on February 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
I know this is a shot in the dark but your question, the way you related it, just raised a big red flag for me, starting right with the first sentence:
Her husband and I got her a gift together and he asked me to come over early so we could give it to her in advance of her party.
This is actually a pretty intimate thing to do, I think - to conspire with somebody's husband to get her a (presumably big, expensive, special) gift for her "milestone birthday" - and to go over there on your own, without your husband, to give the gift in tandem with her husband. It suggests a backstory in which you and her husband had lengthy conversations about this gift - what it should be, how and when to give it to her. And I wonder if your husband isn't comfortable with this...and as a result, felt particularly unhappy about you staying at the friend's house so late, without answering his call.
Talk to him. Find out what his unhappiness is really about. If it were really just about his feeling that you should have called, you're right, he would have accepted your apology already.
posted by artemisia at 11:44 AM on February 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
so - your evening was supposed to be, "drop something off, go home, a few hours later go to the party with your husband, stay for a bit, and leave." instead your evening was, "go to drop something off, end up staying, call your husband, he shows up hours later, stays for a bit, leaves without you, and you stay for somewhere between 4-6 more hours, and then come home to find out he had been actively trying to contact you." add to this the fact that these weren't his friends and he doesn't seem to like them.
i wouldn't accuse you of tampering with your phone, but i'd be pretty miffed at the end of a day like that if i were your husband.
i also agree "i didn't call him when i was hours late because he once fell asleep instead of picking me up from the airport" is just as flimsy and shitty as an argument as "you tampered with your phone to not receive my call."
posted by nadawi at 11:51 AM on February 19, 2012 [5 favorites]
i wouldn't accuse you of tampering with your phone, but i'd be pretty miffed at the end of a day like that if i were your husband.
i also agree "i didn't call him when i was hours late because he once fell asleep instead of picking me up from the airport" is just as flimsy and shitty as an argument as "you tampered with your phone to not receive my call."
posted by nadawi at 11:51 AM on February 19, 2012 [5 favorites]
I think the cell phone is a red herring, and I would be upset if I were your husband.
I'm an introvert who makes a conscious effort to go out and socialize at parties and events, often because they are important to my partner. I like people, and enjoy socializing, don't get me wrong, but for me it is also draining. I'm a night owl, too; it isn't the late hours that make me want to leave in the end but the effort of feeling like I am "on". I just want to wind down and have some quiet down time at home with just my family. Like you, my husband is an extrovert, who if anything is fueled by interaction with others. He ALWAYS wants to stay longer than I do; we are almost always among the first to arrive, and he still wants to stay until the last group leaves.
To me, it would be unthinkable to stay out several hours. To my spouse it might not be. He should know me well enough to acceptthat two, three hours is usually my limit at these things. I know him well enough that if he were attending one and I wasn't, or I had left early, I would have a pretty accurate expectation of when to expect him home.
I would be very upset if he didn't show up until hours later than that, without so much as a phone call to let me know he was running late. That's just churlish behavior. I trust my spouse, so I wouldn't worry about infidelity, but I would worry he was in a car accident or something bad had happened. And even being a night owl, there's a limit to how late I might want to stay up waiting for him, and a call to say, "Hey, I'm going to be a while," is just common courtesy.
It's not about right and wrong in a marriage--and I think you must know this, which is why I said the cell phone issue was a red herring--it's about showing consideration for each other. Part of doing that is recognizing you are different people, and respecting those differences, so you can give your partner what he needs while having your needs met, too.
Your husband was making an effort to "Let you be you" when he basically said, go ahead and stay a while and have fun, though he'd already had enough. You were doing the same when you offered to go with him. You then both agreed on a compromise that incorporated both your needs--he would leave, and you'd stay for just a couple hours more and then come home. So far, so good.
But you didn't keep to your half of the bargain. You were at this party at least a couple hours before your husband. He stayed, I'm sure, for a little while--say another hour and a half. The party broke up, you say, two hours after that. Then you supposedly get cornered by this drunk who won't let you phone (that's a stretch for me, honestly. You can't just pull your phone out of your pocket and start dialling because you're more worried about offending some drunk acquaintance than your spouse who is home worrying?!). So we add another TWO HOURS(?!) for drunk person. I've counselled family members on serious issues, and vice versa, and two hours seems excessive to me, but whatever.
So now you have been at friend's house for a total of, what, at least SEVEN AND A HALF HOURS! And most of that time, your spouse has been alone, waiting for you. He's adding that up in his head, and it must seem like an eternity, because he's an introvert like me. To you, it's only a couple extra hours (though you did realize he'd be worried, because you say you thought about calling). But to him it's not just the extra 2; he's seeing ALL THOSE HOURS and in his place, it's unfathomable you spent them all with all these other people instead of him. So something's drastically wrong in his world, and his mind's going to the crazy place now.
This is not about how your cell phone worked or didn't work. This is about spending all afternoon and into the night away from your spouse, and then not understanding why he was upset and lashing out unreasonably (by saying your friend is childish or accusing you of fooling around or messing with your phone).
Apologize for putting him through all that worry, and forget about the cell phone. It's not the cause of this dispute, it's just a convenient scapegoat. If you had wanted to call him, you would have found a way.
Obviously, your spouse feels seriously neglected. Why is it easier for a stranger on the internet to get that than it is for you, his wife?
posted by misha at 12:33 PM on February 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
I'm an introvert who makes a conscious effort to go out and socialize at parties and events, often because they are important to my partner. I like people, and enjoy socializing, don't get me wrong, but for me it is also draining. I'm a night owl, too; it isn't the late hours that make me want to leave in the end but the effort of feeling like I am "on". I just want to wind down and have some quiet down time at home with just my family. Like you, my husband is an extrovert, who if anything is fueled by interaction with others. He ALWAYS wants to stay longer than I do; we are almost always among the first to arrive, and he still wants to stay until the last group leaves.
To me, it would be unthinkable to stay out several hours. To my spouse it might not be. He should know me well enough to acceptthat two, three hours is usually my limit at these things. I know him well enough that if he were attending one and I wasn't, or I had left early, I would have a pretty accurate expectation of when to expect him home.
I would be very upset if he didn't show up until hours later than that, without so much as a phone call to let me know he was running late. That's just churlish behavior. I trust my spouse, so I wouldn't worry about infidelity, but I would worry he was in a car accident or something bad had happened. And even being a night owl, there's a limit to how late I might want to stay up waiting for him, and a call to say, "Hey, I'm going to be a while," is just common courtesy.
It's not about right and wrong in a marriage--and I think you must know this, which is why I said the cell phone issue was a red herring--it's about showing consideration for each other. Part of doing that is recognizing you are different people, and respecting those differences, so you can give your partner what he needs while having your needs met, too.
Your husband was making an effort to "Let you be you" when he basically said, go ahead and stay a while and have fun, though he'd already had enough. You were doing the same when you offered to go with him. You then both agreed on a compromise that incorporated both your needs--he would leave, and you'd stay for just a couple hours more and then come home. So far, so good.
But you didn't keep to your half of the bargain. You were at this party at least a couple hours before your husband. He stayed, I'm sure, for a little while--say another hour and a half. The party broke up, you say, two hours after that. Then you supposedly get cornered by this drunk who won't let you phone (that's a stretch for me, honestly. You can't just pull your phone out of your pocket and start dialling because you're more worried about offending some drunk acquaintance than your spouse who is home worrying?!). So we add another TWO HOURS(?!) for drunk person. I've counselled family members on serious issues, and vice versa, and two hours seems excessive to me, but whatever.
So now you have been at friend's house for a total of, what, at least SEVEN AND A HALF HOURS! And most of that time, your spouse has been alone, waiting for you. He's adding that up in his head, and it must seem like an eternity, because he's an introvert like me. To you, it's only a couple extra hours (though you did realize he'd be worried, because you say you thought about calling). But to him it's not just the extra 2; he's seeing ALL THOSE HOURS and in his place, it's unfathomable you spent them all with all these other people instead of him. So something's drastically wrong in his world, and his mind's going to the crazy place now.
This is not about how your cell phone worked or didn't work. This is about spending all afternoon and into the night away from your spouse, and then not understanding why he was upset and lashing out unreasonably (by saying your friend is childish or accusing you of fooling around or messing with your phone).
Apologize for putting him through all that worry, and forget about the cell phone. It's not the cause of this dispute, it's just a convenient scapegoat. If you had wanted to call him, you would have found a way.
Obviously, your spouse feels seriously neglected. Why is it easier for a stranger on the internet to get that than it is for you, his wife?
posted by misha at 12:33 PM on February 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
This is actually a pretty intimate thing to do, I think - to conspire with somebody's husband to get her a (presumably big, expensive, special) gift for her "milestone birthday" - and to go over there on your own, without your husband, to give the gift in tandem with her husband. It suggests a backstory in which you and her husband had lengthy conversations about this gift - what it should be, how and when to give it to her.
I think it reflects a high level of intimacy with the friend, not with the friend's husband.
If Mr. Maisie can twist that into "she must be fooling around with her friend's husband" when he has actually been to the party and seen that the friend is there and that other guests are there...well, Mr. Maisie needs help.
Seriously, being paranoid about someone making a plan to give a big gift to their best friend in conjunction with that best friend's husband is off. Agree that Mr. Maisie should have been invited to be part of the presentation, but it sounds like Mr. Maisie isn't so high on Maisie's best friend in the first place. Which must suck for Maisie.
posted by Sidhedevil at 2:33 PM on February 19, 2012
I think it reflects a high level of intimacy with the friend, not with the friend's husband.
If Mr. Maisie can twist that into "she must be fooling around with her friend's husband" when he has actually been to the party and seen that the friend is there and that other guests are there...well, Mr. Maisie needs help.
Seriously, being paranoid about someone making a plan to give a big gift to their best friend in conjunction with that best friend's husband is off. Agree that Mr. Maisie should have been invited to be part of the presentation, but it sounds like Mr. Maisie isn't so high on Maisie's best friend in the first place. Which must suck for Maisie.
posted by Sidhedevil at 2:33 PM on February 19, 2012
Sooo... what happened?
posted by desjardins at 3:42 PM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by desjardins at 3:42 PM on February 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
Agree that Mr. Maisie should have been invited to be part of the presentation, but it sounds like Mr. Maisie isn't so high on Maisie's best friend in the first place. Which must suck for Maisie.
Given the large age difference between Maisie and her husband, it's not surprising that he might not be as close to her friends as she is. I mean, my husband and I are the same age and we're not necessarily joined completely at the hip as far as our social life is concerned, even though we're very close. Mr. Maisie was planning to show up later for the party, after all. Maybe he had something else to do that afternoon.
I think you're all way overthinking this, especially anyone who's imagining some sort of intrigue between Maisie and her friend's husband (good grief!). Maisie's only real error was in being too polite to cut off conversation with the drunk (who probably wouldn't have remembered most of it anyways). Mr. Maisie's error is that he's being a grumpy old man. She should apologize ("Look, I'm sorry I didn't think to call; I didn't realize you'd be so worried. Next time I think I'm going to be later than I originally said, I'll let you know, OK? I promise." Hopefully he will follow suit and promise not to overreact next time. End of squabble. No need for major probing into deep, entirely imaginary marital and personal flaws.
posted by tully_monster at 3:47 PM on February 19, 2012
Given the large age difference between Maisie and her husband, it's not surprising that he might not be as close to her friends as she is. I mean, my husband and I are the same age and we're not necessarily joined completely at the hip as far as our social life is concerned, even though we're very close. Mr. Maisie was planning to show up later for the party, after all. Maybe he had something else to do that afternoon.
I think you're all way overthinking this, especially anyone who's imagining some sort of intrigue between Maisie and her friend's husband (good grief!). Maisie's only real error was in being too polite to cut off conversation with the drunk (who probably wouldn't have remembered most of it anyways). Mr. Maisie's error is that he's being a grumpy old man. She should apologize ("Look, I'm sorry I didn't think to call; I didn't realize you'd be so worried. Next time I think I'm going to be later than I originally said, I'll let you know, OK? I promise." Hopefully he will follow suit and promise not to overreact next time. End of squabble. No need for major probing into deep, entirely imaginary marital and personal flaws.
posted by tully_monster at 3:47 PM on February 19, 2012
This is actually a pretty intimate thing to do, I think - to conspire with somebody's husband to get her a (presumably big, expensive, special) gift for her "milestone birthday" - and to go over there on your own, without your husband, to give the gift in tandem with her husband. It suggests a backstory in which you and her husband had lengthy conversations about this gift - what it should be, how and when to give it to her.I think it reflects a high level of intimacy with the friend, not with the friend's husband.
I don't agree. If I am not particularly close with a friend's spouse, I'm not likely to plan some big, expensive, special present and presentation with that friend's spouse.
If Mr. Maisie can twist that into "she must be fooling around with her friend's husband" when he has actually been to the party and seen that the friend is there and that other guests are there...well, Mr. Maisie needs help.
I think it's worth of note that Maisie isn't saying that this was the case. Rather, this is conjecture on the part of other posters in this thread. Since a large numbers of respondents have said that they would wonder if something inappropriate were going on given an analogous situation in their own lives, it doesn't exactly seem like "Mr. Maisie needs help" for (potentially!) having similar reaction.
I think nadawi nails it. From his perspective: He was expecting Maisie to drop something off, then return home, then go to the party a few hours later with him, stay for a while and then go home together. What he got was Maisie going to drop something off, staying there for 2+ hours until he drives himself to the party which is "in full swing" and full of people he doesn't particularly know upon his arrival, then instead of leaving together he goes home by himself expecting her to arrive home a bit later later (I note that Maisie says she told him she would be home a "few hours later," not that he suggested she stay several more hours), and instead it's more like five hours later during which time she not only doesn't call in but his calls to her go unanswered. So now a 2-hour trip to a party has turned into a seven hour outing, most of which was not spent with Mr. Maisie. And on top of this, we don't know what their interactions were like at the party. I certainly have had times in my life where I've been at a party full of my friends who were not particularly my partner's friends, and ended up having too good a time with my friends to make sure my partner wasn't stranded (this is something I consciously try to do better nowadays, because it's such an easy mistake to make). Yanno... most people I know would be at least a little pissed off about this.
posted by slkinsey at 3:47 PM on February 19, 2012
You shoulda' called. Who cares about drunk people?
posted by Area Control at 7:09 AM on February 20, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by Area Control at 7:09 AM on February 20, 2012 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: I'm also not sure why you would have expected him to be asleep if you're both "night owls" for whom it would be ordinary to be up for a few more hours after you got home.
Yeah, what's up with that?
In case anyone's still reading, I can see why this doesn't make sense without more details. About 1/2 the time Mr. M. will go to sleep sometime between 10 and midnight and sleep for 2-3 hours, wake up and then be up until 6 or 7 am. The other half of the time, he will skip the late nap and then stay up until sometime between 4 and 6 am. I thought he might be napping and didn't want to disturb him.
posted by Maisie at 8:14 AM on February 20, 2012
Yeah, what's up with that?
In case anyone's still reading, I can see why this doesn't make sense without more details. About 1/2 the time Mr. M. will go to sleep sometime between 10 and midnight and sleep for 2-3 hours, wake up and then be up until 6 or 7 am. The other half of the time, he will skip the late nap and then stay up until sometime between 4 and 6 am. I thought he might be napping and didn't want to disturb him.
posted by Maisie at 8:14 AM on February 20, 2012
Response by poster: About the gift business, I asked Mr. M. if he wanted to come over for the gift presentation and he declined. I would have loved for him to come with me for that. There's absolutely nothing untoward about my relationship with my friend's husband. We both knew how much she wanted this particular thing, it was expensive, I could get a discount through a family member, so we decided to go in together to get this for her.
To clear up the timeframes, I got home approximately 5 hours after he did. When he left, I was in no condition to drive, so I said I thought I'd be home in a few hours -- in other words, once I'd had a chance to sober up (I was more tipsy than drunk when he left, but better safe than sorry; I was completely sober by the time I left) and my car was no longer blocked. Mr. M. frequently complains about what we New Englanders (he's from the midwest) mean when we say "a couple" or "a few." He gets very annoyed at what he thinks is "the New England 'couple,'" as he says, which he thinks people in New England say to mean anything between 2 and 8. I actually avoid using the phrase "a couple" (which is why I specifically said "a few hours") around him because it always results in the same tiresome diatribe about how New Englanders don't know how to communicate.
The reason I wasn't more forceful with the drunk girl was because she was talking about something she's having a very hard time with now that I can relate to that probably no one else in her life can. We were raised in the same crazy fundamentalist religion that we both left as adults. Both of our families are still practicing this religion and we both have difficult relationships with them as a result. I have a lot of compassion for what she's going through and I guess I have a little bit of a complex about helping people who are having this particular set of difficulties.
Oh, and he was still mad as of last night.
In any event, you've all given me a lot to think about.
posted by Maisie at 8:44 AM on February 20, 2012
To clear up the timeframes, I got home approximately 5 hours after he did. When he left, I was in no condition to drive, so I said I thought I'd be home in a few hours -- in other words, once I'd had a chance to sober up (I was more tipsy than drunk when he left, but better safe than sorry; I was completely sober by the time I left) and my car was no longer blocked. Mr. M. frequently complains about what we New Englanders (he's from the midwest) mean when we say "a couple" or "a few." He gets very annoyed at what he thinks is "the New England 'couple,'" as he says, which he thinks people in New England say to mean anything between 2 and 8. I actually avoid using the phrase "a couple" (which is why I specifically said "a few hours") around him because it always results in the same tiresome diatribe about how New Englanders don't know how to communicate.
The reason I wasn't more forceful with the drunk girl was because she was talking about something she's having a very hard time with now that I can relate to that probably no one else in her life can. We were raised in the same crazy fundamentalist religion that we both left as adults. Both of our families are still practicing this religion and we both have difficult relationships with them as a result. I have a lot of compassion for what she's going through and I guess I have a little bit of a complex about helping people who are having this particular set of difficulties.
Oh, and he was still mad as of last night.
In any event, you've all given me a lot to think about.
posted by Maisie at 8:44 AM on February 20, 2012
Oh, and he was still mad as of last night.
Well, then it's his problem and there's nothing much you can do. Let him be mad and go do your own thing. If he's still mad in like, a week, there is something else going on and you might think about couples counseling.
As a midwesterner, I have the same problem with "a couple" and "a few." A couple means two. That's the definition of the word. "Few" is open to more interpretation, but in my world (and apparently his), it means less than 5. In the future, "I'll be home by 2 am" might work better.
posted by desjardins at 9:20 AM on February 20, 2012
Well, then it's his problem and there's nothing much you can do. Let him be mad and go do your own thing. If he's still mad in like, a week, there is something else going on and you might think about couples counseling.
As a midwesterner, I have the same problem with "a couple" and "a few." A couple means two. That's the definition of the word. "Few" is open to more interpretation, but in my world (and apparently his), it means less than 5. In the future, "I'll be home by 2 am" might work better.
posted by desjardins at 9:20 AM on February 20, 2012
Response by poster: A couple means two. That's the definition of the word.
Oh believe me, desjardins, you're not telling me anything that hasn't been made extremely clear to me in great detail, complete with insults about how not a single person from New England (of which I am one) knows how to communicate. I avoid using the word even if it's perfectly clear that I mean 2 because he apparently cannot hear "couple" out of my mouth without having a Pavlovian response.
Anyway, reading everything above, I am making it sound like I don't even like him. I do; I like him and love him, which is why I have chosen to be with him. We don't have children so there's not anything external forcing us to stay together whether we want to or not. Other than when we fight (which isn't even that often), he's a wonderful, loving, supportive partner. He's also extremely smart, wickedly funny and excruciatingly attractive.
What I don't like is that he seems to feel like my not calling him is proof that I don't care about him or his feelings and that I treat him like he's not even a real person worthy of any consideration whatsoever. He said all this. I don't appreciate his once again turning what should be a minor fight into threats of leaving me. I dislike that he is again telling me what I think and feel and disregarding what I tell him I actually think and feel. I don't like that he clearly projects his issues and past behavior onto me.
I understand that this is probably the result of insecurity on his part and an overdeveloped (and unrealistic) fear of being abandoned. I probably should have just said that I was sorry and that I love him, but frankly, I'm a little tired of this dance. We've been together for 12 years through his health problems, his misbehavior with another woman, tragedies and triumphs with our families, our mental health problems -- in short, everything.
Writing this all out has been very helpful for me to be able to understand some of the underlying issues and I appreciate having this venue to work through this problem. I guess what I was really looking for is reassurance that I wasn't being a complete asshole who deserved the response he gave, which I think most of the answers have supported. I've also gotten some insight into what he might have been thinking, which has helped me think about this in a different way. So thank you, everyone.
Also, wow, I should get my own blog, FFS.
posted by Maisie at 10:46 AM on February 20, 2012
Oh believe me, desjardins, you're not telling me anything that hasn't been made extremely clear to me in great detail, complete with insults about how not a single person from New England (of which I am one) knows how to communicate. I avoid using the word even if it's perfectly clear that I mean 2 because he apparently cannot hear "couple" out of my mouth without having a Pavlovian response.
Anyway, reading everything above, I am making it sound like I don't even like him. I do; I like him and love him, which is why I have chosen to be with him. We don't have children so there's not anything external forcing us to stay together whether we want to or not. Other than when we fight (which isn't even that often), he's a wonderful, loving, supportive partner. He's also extremely smart, wickedly funny and excruciatingly attractive.
What I don't like is that he seems to feel like my not calling him is proof that I don't care about him or his feelings and that I treat him like he's not even a real person worthy of any consideration whatsoever. He said all this. I don't appreciate his once again turning what should be a minor fight into threats of leaving me. I dislike that he is again telling me what I think and feel and disregarding what I tell him I actually think and feel. I don't like that he clearly projects his issues and past behavior onto me.
I understand that this is probably the result of insecurity on his part and an overdeveloped (and unrealistic) fear of being abandoned. I probably should have just said that I was sorry and that I love him, but frankly, I'm a little tired of this dance. We've been together for 12 years through his health problems, his misbehavior with another woman, tragedies and triumphs with our families, our mental health problems -- in short, everything.
Writing this all out has been very helpful for me to be able to understand some of the underlying issues and I appreciate having this venue to work through this problem. I guess what I was really looking for is reassurance that I wasn't being a complete asshole who deserved the response he gave, which I think most of the answers have supported. I've also gotten some insight into what he might have been thinking, which has helped me think about this in a different way. So thank you, everyone.
Also, wow, I should get my own blog, FFS.
posted by Maisie at 10:46 AM on February 20, 2012
I don't appreciate his once again turning what should be a minor fight into threats of leaving me.
Well this was an extremely important detail to leave out and probably would have changed most people's answers, as it's now clear this has nothing to do with how cell phones work. Couples counseling is definitely a must. You cannot cure his fear of abandonment on your own, and if you're tired of trying, then you need a 3rd party. I'm not saying he's some kind of monster; I believe you that he has many good qualities. But really, this is poisonous to your relationship and it's too much for you to handle alone. He's clearly not willing to tackle it himself if he hasn't apologized to you by now.
posted by desjardins at 11:51 AM on February 20, 2012 [1 favorite]
Well this was an extremely important detail to leave out and probably would have changed most people's answers, as it's now clear this has nothing to do with how cell phones work. Couples counseling is definitely a must. You cannot cure his fear of abandonment on your own, and if you're tired of trying, then you need a 3rd party. I'm not saying he's some kind of monster; I believe you that he has many good qualities. But really, this is poisonous to your relationship and it's too much for you to handle alone. He's clearly not willing to tackle it himself if he hasn't apologized to you by now.
posted by desjardins at 11:51 AM on February 20, 2012 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Well this was an extremely important detail to leave out and probably would have changed most people's answers, as it's now clear this has nothing to do with how cell phones work. Couples counseling is definitely a must. You cannot cure his fear of abandonment on your own, and if you're tired of trying, then you need a 3rd party. I'm not saying he's some kind of monster; I believe you that he has many good qualities. But really, this is poisonous to your relationship and it's too much for you to handle alone. He's clearly not willing to tackle it himself if he hasn't apologized to you by now.
Agreed, yes, I could have done a better job on writing this question. I was trying to get some perspective on the merits of the argument rather than hold a referendum on our entire relationship. I agree that there are issues for us to work out beyond this disagreement. I see a therapist and I invited him to discuss this either with my therapist and me or with a couple's counselor. He refused.
I know you didn't directly ask this stuff about the phone, but I'd like to respond. The reason I included the cell phone stuff was to illustrate his apparent point of view -- that he thinks I might have been dissembling. That was the same reason I mentioned how he slept through picking me up at the airport -- I was trying to show that my thinking that he might be asleep isn't a post hoc rationalization.
In any case, thanks for sticking with this thread, desjardins, and thanks to everyone else who read and answered.
posted by Maisie at 1:51 PM on February 20, 2012
Agreed, yes, I could have done a better job on writing this question. I was trying to get some perspective on the merits of the argument rather than hold a referendum on our entire relationship. I agree that there are issues for us to work out beyond this disagreement. I see a therapist and I invited him to discuss this either with my therapist and me or with a couple's counselor. He refused.
I know you didn't directly ask this stuff about the phone, but I'd like to respond. The reason I included the cell phone stuff was to illustrate his apparent point of view -- that he thinks I might have been dissembling. That was the same reason I mentioned how he slept through picking me up at the airport -- I was trying to show that my thinking that he might be asleep isn't a post hoc rationalization.
In any case, thanks for sticking with this thread, desjardins, and thanks to everyone else who read and answered.
posted by Maisie at 1:51 PM on February 20, 2012
I'll go back and read the other responses, but this "and he thinks I "did something" to my phone so that he couldn't get through" is a screaming red flag.
posted by Pax at 11:21 AM on February 21, 2012
posted by Pax at 11:21 AM on February 21, 2012
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You offered to go home with him and pick up the car the next morning. He told you to stay. If he was worried, and it was only 15-20 minutes away, he should have driven back over.
posted by june made him a gemini at 12:37 AM on February 19, 2012 [16 favorites]