he really likes you, tubby!
November 2, 2011 12:16 AM Subscribe
Do I tell my partner his friend said something snarky? The brief: I have a fantastic bf who is everything I could ask for in a man. He's got a large circle which includes several female friends. One of them, he mentioned before I met her, is known for being funny, but generally inappropriate and uncouth (he gives pretty fair descriptions like this of everyone I've met, not singling her out). Met her a few times, and most recently she was very, very drunk. Can you guess where this is going?
While he socialized with the wider group, she tells me at length, repeatedly, that he's amazing (I know), I mustn't hurt him (hadn't planned on it), he likes me a lot and is always talking about how great I am (I had rather gathered he's fond of me), that despite what some people they mutually know think, she and he would NEVER be an item (he had mentioned he thought she was a bit baggage clad and wished anyone who takes her on well), he thinks I'm so great that, knowing she has issues with fat that he forbade her from even mentioning I'm fat (I'm a size 14 and he's plenty happy with my, uh, assets), and she wants us to be friends because if he thinks I'm amazing so does she (bom-ching!) On a loop, emphasis on how amazing he says I am and how she finds the idea anyone else might think they were dating craaaazy and icky.
So I have a hunch she's got feelings for him (understatement of the year). I'm not worried he returns them. Heck, I half suspect he is well aware of her feelings and his effusive praise of me could be his way of staving her off. So no worry he just can't see it. But do I mention the backhanded "compliments" and risk creating a rift or seeming jealous, or try to remain friendly and keep it to myself?
While he socialized with the wider group, she tells me at length, repeatedly, that he's amazing (I know), I mustn't hurt him (hadn't planned on it), he likes me a lot and is always talking about how great I am (I had rather gathered he's fond of me), that despite what some people they mutually know think, she and he would NEVER be an item (he had mentioned he thought she was a bit baggage clad and wished anyone who takes her on well), he thinks I'm so great that, knowing she has issues with fat that he forbade her from even mentioning I'm fat (I'm a size 14 and he's plenty happy with my, uh, assets), and she wants us to be friends because if he thinks I'm amazing so does she (bom-ching!) On a loop, emphasis on how amazing he says I am and how she finds the idea anyone else might think they were dating craaaazy and icky.
So I have a hunch she's got feelings for him (understatement of the year). I'm not worried he returns them. Heck, I half suspect he is well aware of her feelings and his effusive praise of me could be his way of staving her off. So no worry he just can't see it. But do I mention the backhanded "compliments" and risk creating a rift or seeming jealous, or try to remain friendly and keep it to myself?
Forget about it. What happens at a party stays at the party.
posted by joannemullen at 12:24 AM on November 2, 2011 [8 favorites]
posted by joannemullen at 12:24 AM on November 2, 2011 [8 favorites]
So I have a hunch she's got feelings for him (understatement of the year).
Wait, what?
I don't follow. Okay here's a thought experiment for you: Lets say you're an outgoing lady with a few good male friends. One of them starts dating a woman who can be insecure. You genuinely want to be her friend and you're very afraid of the repeat of an all-too-common scenario you're experienced in the past, where you lose the guy's friendship because his girlfriend is jealous. What might you do? Might you try to befriend the girlfriend, being a bit effusive about it, especially if you were drunk?
All I saw was her being well-meaning but a bit over-the-top about it. (Fits well with the description of a person who is funny but a bit blunt) Are you sure she doesn't just actually want you as a friend, and was afraid of you reacting in this exact way? Yeah, the "fat' comment was ungracious, (wtf?) and she was definitely a bit boundary-crossing. But it fits with what you know about her personality and she was drunk. I'm not seeing how this means she's attracted to him. Quite the opposite in fact.
Unless I'm missing something.
posted by Nixy at 12:29 AM on November 2, 2011 [22 favorites]
Wait, what?
I don't follow. Okay here's a thought experiment for you: Lets say you're an outgoing lady with a few good male friends. One of them starts dating a woman who can be insecure. You genuinely want to be her friend and you're very afraid of the repeat of an all-too-common scenario you're experienced in the past, where you lose the guy's friendship because his girlfriend is jealous. What might you do? Might you try to befriend the girlfriend, being a bit effusive about it, especially if you were drunk?
All I saw was her being well-meaning but a bit over-the-top about it. (Fits well with the description of a person who is funny but a bit blunt) Are you sure she doesn't just actually want you as a friend, and was afraid of you reacting in this exact way? Yeah, the "fat' comment was ungracious, (wtf?) and she was definitely a bit boundary-crossing. But it fits with what you know about her personality and she was drunk. I'm not seeing how this means she's attracted to him. Quite the opposite in fact.
Unless I'm missing something.
posted by Nixy at 12:29 AM on November 2, 2011 [22 favorites]
What would be your reason for telling him?
posted by Adventurer at 12:30 AM on November 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
posted by Adventurer at 12:30 AM on November 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
As a sometimes funny and often overly-blunt woman with male friends, I can only say what I would have meant if I had rambled on to you like this: I would have meant, hey, your new beaux is a friend of mine, and I really want to keep being friends with him, so I really don't want you to find my threatening, so I'm going to chat you up and be friends with you.
I would definitely keep this to yourself. If you share it with your boyfriend, he'll probably dismiss it as her drunken ramblings. And I can't see what possible good it could do to introduce the idea that she likes him (it sounds like he's already addressed this very issue with you).
My interpretation is that she's worried about losing her friend, your boyfriend. I'd give her another chance and definitely let this go.
posted by bluedaisy at 12:35 AM on November 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
I would definitely keep this to yourself. If you share it with your boyfriend, he'll probably dismiss it as her drunken ramblings. And I can't see what possible good it could do to introduce the idea that she likes him (it sounds like he's already addressed this very issue with you).
My interpretation is that she's worried about losing her friend, your boyfriend. I'd give her another chance and definitely let this go.
posted by bluedaisy at 12:35 AM on November 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
I don't see what good could come of saying something. Not everything needs to be shared or put to discussion in a relationship. Put this info in your back pocket and focus on other, more important and interesting stuff.
If that's otherwise difficult to do, then look into why *you're* so invested in this bit of potential drama.
posted by iamkimiam at 12:36 AM on November 2, 2011 [14 favorites]
If that's otherwise difficult to do, then look into why *you're* so invested in this bit of potential drama.
posted by iamkimiam at 12:36 AM on November 2, 2011 [14 favorites]
Sounds to me like your boyfriend set you up not to like her. Then she really rubbed you the wrong way, and you're looking for an opening to go after her, because you're feeling territorial about being couple-y.
Relax. Don't get threatened so easy. It's sad when women can't get along because of an associated man. Besides, your boyfriend is the one who should be watching his behavior and hers for appropriateness. Don't fall in this drama trap. Be gracious to her and assume the best of this drunken blathering - she might turn out to be a very good friend.
posted by griselda at 12:54 AM on November 2, 2011 [6 favorites]
Relax. Don't get threatened so easy. It's sad when women can't get along because of an associated man. Besides, your boyfriend is the one who should be watching his behavior and hers for appropriateness. Don't fall in this drama trap. Be gracious to her and assume the best of this drunken blathering - she might turn out to be a very good friend.
posted by griselda at 12:54 AM on November 2, 2011 [6 favorites]
Agree with Nixy and bluedaisy. What she said, apart from the weight comment, is meant to be flattering and kind. Don't repay kindness with evil.
posted by carolinaherrera at 12:55 AM on November 2, 2011
posted by carolinaherrera at 12:55 AM on November 2, 2011
She's not a threat, no need to put her down. You have nothing to gain by bringing this up, other than a chuckle. If you bring this up inelegantly, you will look bad (but unless you're particularly vicious, not all that bad).
Just leave her be.
posted by Garm at 1:44 AM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
Just leave her be.
posted by Garm at 1:44 AM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
He DID warn you she was mouthy. You are over-thinking this, making it a much bigger story than it is. She was drunk and said something a little creepy, and a little jerky. She's probably either a little embarrassed or has completely put it out of her mind.
If you want to continue the drama- and make everyone else uncomfortable along with you- go for it.
If you want to stop her repeating herself a zillion times- change the subject when she starts. "oh no not this AGAIN. Lady, tell me about YOUR lovelife."
But really, it'll fade with time. After she gets used to you and him as a couple she's going to stop worrying that you're going to ruin their friendship.
posted by Blisterlips at 2:25 AM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
If you want to continue the drama- and make everyone else uncomfortable along with you- go for it.
If you want to stop her repeating herself a zillion times- change the subject when she starts. "oh no not this AGAIN. Lady, tell me about YOUR lovelife."
But really, it'll fade with time. After she gets used to you and him as a couple she's going to stop worrying that you're going to ruin their friendship.
posted by Blisterlips at 2:25 AM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
Best answer: OompaLoompa, you do not come off as insecure or threatened. It's the other way around, imo.
Also, I'm finding it hard to believe that people are telling you to keep quiet about the fact that he had to ask her not to comment on your body and then she did it anyway, while neatly letting you know that they had a convo about your body behind your back. Under what circumstances is that funny or in any way friendly and reassuring? Wouldn't you want to know if one of your friends "let that slip" to someone you cared about?
If one of my bf's friends said those things to me-- the repeated unasked-for assurance that they could never date, the awful fat comment, etc-- I would consider telling my bf, and I would totally want to know if one of my guy friends cornered him that way. He may be well aware that she's tactless, but he may be unaware of exactly the kinds of things she's saying to his dates. Her drunkenness that night and her friendship with your bf do not give her the right to try to make you feel bad about your body or insinuate that other people think that she and he are a better match. Who knows if this woman has said the same or worse to his exes, which made them uncomfortable hanging out with his friends?
If you don't want to start a thing, then maybe just make him aware that her jealous barbs bothered you, as they obviously did. Sharing your feelings about this with your bf does not mean you feel threatened by this woman, it means you're worried that one of his friends may try to drive wedges between you as you grow closer. If she keeps doing this then he may need to redraw their friendship boundaries, which I would not hesitate to do if my SO was getting their feelings hurt.
posted by swingbraid at 2:34 AM on November 2, 2011 [32 favorites]
Also, I'm finding it hard to believe that people are telling you to keep quiet about the fact that he had to ask her not to comment on your body and then she did it anyway, while neatly letting you know that they had a convo about your body behind your back. Under what circumstances is that funny or in any way friendly and reassuring? Wouldn't you want to know if one of your friends "let that slip" to someone you cared about?
If one of my bf's friends said those things to me-- the repeated unasked-for assurance that they could never date, the awful fat comment, etc-- I would consider telling my bf, and I would totally want to know if one of my guy friends cornered him that way. He may be well aware that she's tactless, but he may be unaware of exactly the kinds of things she's saying to his dates. Her drunkenness that night and her friendship with your bf do not give her the right to try to make you feel bad about your body or insinuate that other people think that she and he are a better match. Who knows if this woman has said the same or worse to his exes, which made them uncomfortable hanging out with his friends?
If you don't want to start a thing, then maybe just make him aware that her jealous barbs bothered you, as they obviously did. Sharing your feelings about this with your bf does not mean you feel threatened by this woman, it means you're worried that one of his friends may try to drive wedges between you as you grow closer. If she keeps doing this then he may need to redraw their friendship boundaries, which I would not hesitate to do if my SO was getting their feelings hurt.
posted by swingbraid at 2:34 AM on November 2, 2011 [32 favorites]
Best answer: I wouldn't mention it, and I'll tell you why: I have an amazing husband who was my amazing boyfriend who was my new amazing boyfriend at one time, and I had a peck of odd conversations in the beginning... still do, sometimes, because everyone adores him and half the time the adorers are crushing. If I had mentioned every time slight weirdness came up over the many, many years we've been together it would not allow me to fully be heard when I need to say what I need to say: "Look, this person is problem for me, in X way, and I need you to do/not do Y."
This has happened exactly twice in 20 years. Twice I've recognized that somebody could turn into an actual for-true problem for me in one way or another, and I've nipped it right in the bud both times. I could do it easily because I rarely make any comment or complaint about run-of-the-mill oddness like this... so if I say something is disturbing me, he takes it very seriously (and vice versa, for the same reasons). Mentioning every slight, snark or inappropriate comment could beget the Cassandra effect over time, and when you really need to communicate unease with a situation, it may be lost in the noise.
posted by taz at 3:11 AM on November 2, 2011 [29 favorites]
This has happened exactly twice in 20 years. Twice I've recognized that somebody could turn into an actual for-true problem for me in one way or another, and I've nipped it right in the bud both times. I could do it easily because I rarely make any comment or complaint about run-of-the-mill oddness like this... so if I say something is disturbing me, he takes it very seriously (and vice versa, for the same reasons). Mentioning every slight, snark or inappropriate comment could beget the Cassandra effect over time, and when you really need to communicate unease with a situation, it may be lost in the noise.
posted by taz at 3:11 AM on November 2, 2011 [29 favorites]
Listen to taz. Don't devalue the currency by flooding the market with complaints.
posted by twirlypen at 3:53 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by twirlypen at 3:53 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
Seems to me like your options are to either get over it or find a less generally-appealing guy.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 4:48 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 4:48 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
I wonder if the conversation about fat she alludes to isn't a figment of her drunk imagination. It might really be about her own obsession. Clearly it bothered you, though. Why?
posted by Obscure Reference at 4:56 AM on November 2, 2011
posted by Obscure Reference at 4:56 AM on November 2, 2011
Best answer: As a mouthy and uncouth female friend, I've been both options - the one with feelings for the guy and the one who genuinely just really really likes him as a friend.
Just because I'm mouthy and uncouth doesn't mean I would EVER, ever! do anything so underhanded and stupid as trying to go pursue someone who is already in a happy monogamous relationship while befriending their S.O, regardless of my own feelings.
If she has a thing for him, that's between the two of them and none of your business and also should not be a problem if he's true to his word and she's a worthwhile friend to him, which it sounds like to me, she is. People keep me around because I'm known to be incredibly, harshly honest - I do not mince words unless it's for fun and wordplay. She is likely in a similar position in her group of friends and is used to sharing all the sorts of things she did with you, with everyone in her group. She put them out there so that there's an even ground of basic clarity of intention and understanding to start from, not for you to read any extra stuff into.
If you want to continue befriending her, though, you might want to let her know what you are comfortable talking about, like the stuff with your weight and all. It's nice that your boyfriend sort of gave her some guidelines but it's up to you to work it out with her. Each of my friends have certain things I don't start in on with them, and I do try to respect them, once it's been made clear to me what those touchy areas are. But you shouldn't need your boyfriend to defend you from her, if you're going to try to be friends.
posted by Mizu at 5:22 AM on November 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
Just because I'm mouthy and uncouth doesn't mean I would EVER, ever! do anything so underhanded and stupid as trying to go pursue someone who is already in a happy monogamous relationship while befriending their S.O, regardless of my own feelings.
If she has a thing for him, that's between the two of them and none of your business and also should not be a problem if he's true to his word and she's a worthwhile friend to him, which it sounds like to me, she is. People keep me around because I'm known to be incredibly, harshly honest - I do not mince words unless it's for fun and wordplay. She is likely in a similar position in her group of friends and is used to sharing all the sorts of things she did with you, with everyone in her group. She put them out there so that there's an even ground of basic clarity of intention and understanding to start from, not for you to read any extra stuff into.
If you want to continue befriending her, though, you might want to let her know what you are comfortable talking about, like the stuff with your weight and all. It's nice that your boyfriend sort of gave her some guidelines but it's up to you to work it out with her. Each of my friends have certain things I don't start in on with them, and I do try to respect them, once it's been made clear to me what those touchy areas are. But you shouldn't need your boyfriend to defend you from her, if you're going to try to be friends.
posted by Mizu at 5:22 AM on November 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
If she was interested in him, and she is that outgoing, and they were friends, she'd already be dating him, because he wouldn't have had a choice otherwise.
posted by empath at 5:35 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by empath at 5:35 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
Dismiss the fat comment as a drunken lie. Even if some kind of conversation went down, it did not go down like THAT. Her retelling of it was wildly inappropriate and passive aggressively intended to wound. This is the kind of story you'll probably wind up recounting to your bf someday... After she's done something else, and he's already complaining about her. But for now I would just live and let live.
posted by hermitosis at 5:44 AM on November 2, 2011 [10 favorites]
posted by hermitosis at 5:44 AM on November 2, 2011 [10 favorites]
Yeah I imagine that went down like: "I should tell her to lose a little weight." and he said something like "Don't you dare."
posted by empath at 5:46 AM on November 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
posted by empath at 5:46 AM on November 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
Yeah, what taz said. Pick your battles. Do not presume malice here, being the better person means assuming this person's motivations were good, and the drunkenness overrode her manners (regardless of what the truth actually is). I will say, as a woman who has male friends, sometimes people cannot accept that women and men can be friends without anything else going on (a la When Harry Met Sally), so sometimes you feel the need to make it clear to people that you're actually NOT interested in your friend romantically, especially to their SO's, if the SO is newish. Being drunk can make that sound like protesting too much. Also, people who feel the need to "have issues" with other people's appearance are people who are likely insecure about some fundamental things about themselves, so I might view her fat comment with that in mind.
posted by biscotti at 5:50 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by biscotti at 5:50 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
OP, I don't think you're entirely incorrect. When I was young and dumb, this is the way I would act when I was interested in a guy, or even if we had mutual feelings. If I had been old enough to drink when I was young and dumb I'm sure I'd have said much of the same (except the size thing, wtf!).
On the flip, there was some weird behavior when my husband and I started dating. One chick said "Oh, me and (pht) should go on a date!" sort of like, attempting to be joking but serious at the same time. My husband referred to these incidents as "girls behaving badly".
posted by kpht at 6:01 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
On the flip, there was some weird behavior when my husband and I started dating. One chick said "Oh, me and (pht) should go on a date!" sort of like, attempting to be joking but serious at the same time. My husband referred to these incidents as "girls behaving badly".
posted by kpht at 6:01 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
Best answer: I'm kind of in between on this, and that's how I would handle it. The gal sounds a little - more than a little, maybe - unable to control her own boundaries. She was drunkenly gushing, and I think there's a seed of "I genuinely want to be friends" in there, but she revealed some of her own psychological issues - she seems to have (had?) feelings for your boyfriend, and she seems to body image issues, either about herself, or as a tool for cutting other women down, or both.
So on the other hand, this doesn't mean you need to do anything. I'd take the taz road here and just evaluate it for what it is - a dramatic and somewhat boundary-lacking friend of your boyfriend's. Which he already knows, and warned you about. This is that "baggage" he was referring to. Time will tell where this goes for you, but chances are very good that because your boyfriend pretty much has her number, and because she's so obviously all over the place, she's not a serious threat.
However, the issue of whether your boyfriend would be tempted to cheat with her (sooo doubtful) and whether you and she can form an independent friendship are separate. I'll speak to the second issue now: how do you conduct yourself socially around this person? I would be circumspect around her for some time to come, until I had more understanding of her character. I would be friendly and stay open to the idea of a friendship developing, but she's taken a confused approach here, pairing offers of friendship with distinctly and knowingly backhanded compliments. Do your best to feel and exude only total personal confidence around her. Don't share a lot of private thoughts with her, ask her opinion, or pump her for information about your guy's past. Those are ways a manipulative person loves to get in the mix and feel as though they have some power over others in the situation.
All in all, she gave you a lot of information about herself in this episode, and you can just sock it away as you build your understanding of what's going in with her and in your boyfriend's larger social world. It's not really actionable and there's not really any reason to bring it up or make an issue of it with your boyfriend. Certainly "going after her," as in the "let's gang up and pick on your friends to help shore up my relationship with you, until you can see it's us against the world" thing, is not a relationship strategy that goes in a super good direction. Be confident. Your assessment of her is not necessarily wrong, but you don't need to do anything about it. The world is full of people like this.
posted by Miko at 6:26 AM on November 2, 2011 [11 favorites]
So on the other hand, this doesn't mean you need to do anything. I'd take the taz road here and just evaluate it for what it is - a dramatic and somewhat boundary-lacking friend of your boyfriend's. Which he already knows, and warned you about. This is that "baggage" he was referring to. Time will tell where this goes for you, but chances are very good that because your boyfriend pretty much has her number, and because she's so obviously all over the place, she's not a serious threat.
However, the issue of whether your boyfriend would be tempted to cheat with her (sooo doubtful) and whether you and she can form an independent friendship are separate. I'll speak to the second issue now: how do you conduct yourself socially around this person? I would be circumspect around her for some time to come, until I had more understanding of her character. I would be friendly and stay open to the idea of a friendship developing, but she's taken a confused approach here, pairing offers of friendship with distinctly and knowingly backhanded compliments. Do your best to feel and exude only total personal confidence around her. Don't share a lot of private thoughts with her, ask her opinion, or pump her for information about your guy's past. Those are ways a manipulative person loves to get in the mix and feel as though they have some power over others in the situation.
All in all, she gave you a lot of information about herself in this episode, and you can just sock it away as you build your understanding of what's going in with her and in your boyfriend's larger social world. It's not really actionable and there's not really any reason to bring it up or make an issue of it with your boyfriend. Certainly "going after her," as in the "let's gang up and pick on your friends to help shore up my relationship with you, until you can see it's us against the world" thing, is not a relationship strategy that goes in a super good direction. Be confident. Your assessment of her is not necessarily wrong, but you don't need to do anything about it. The world is full of people like this.
posted by Miko at 6:26 AM on November 2, 2011 [11 favorites]
Everyone seems to want you to take the high road. Sometimes, if you are clever, you can take both the high road and the low road. Wait until she comes up in the conversation (or the party, or his group of friends) then, giggle, touch him on the shoulder to get his attention and say, "I'm not really sure if I should say this, because you probably already know, but anything you say to friend seems to fall right back out of her mouth. She passed on an unflattering conversation blip about me that you and she had. Don't worry, she was the insulting one, not you, and she was drunk so I'm not worried about it. I just wanted to let mention it in case you didn't know that she is a tell all." Then quickly, smoothly change the subject, leaving him to figure out if she is a good friend or not. And then forget about it.
posted by myselfasme at 6:27 AM on November 2, 2011
posted by myselfasme at 6:27 AM on November 2, 2011
Response by poster: I don't want to start drama, which is why I've so far kept it to myself. And I feel a little bad for her; there are things she has said and done that I haven't mentioned here that do indicate that she's scared of losing her friend at least. At the very least (this includes sudden attempts at dating others, which until she started unsolicited rambling about how I shouldn't worry about them I took for boredom now that he spends a bunch of time with me). Thing is? The first time I met her, we got along fine, as I have with all his friends. He has a ton of them, as do I, so generally, I can navigate these things fine, thanks.
What shocked me was that it was completely out of the blue, because, at least on my end, I haven't felt threatened, and have made no attempt to limit their interaction. In fact, their interaction is pretty context-specific and to my knowledge,aside from weekend hanging out, they spend as much time together as theyve always done. I haven't asked about them or her intentions or even hinted. Hell, i thought we were cool at the first meeting and was really glad to finally meet her. I was talking to lots of people though, so maybe I missed something.
I brought this here rather than to him to get a second read on it, and some advice on how to proceed. Because I don't think she's malicious, and I still want to get to know her better, and I'm trying to figure out how to let him know his friend seems to feel threatened by me, without him just deciding he should keep us apart. Suppose I could just say I'd like o get to know her better.
For the people who say they'd say something similar, why? Especially unprovoked?
posted by OompaLoompa at 6:49 AM on November 2, 2011
What shocked me was that it was completely out of the blue, because, at least on my end, I haven't felt threatened, and have made no attempt to limit their interaction. In fact, their interaction is pretty context-specific and to my knowledge,aside from weekend hanging out, they spend as much time together as theyve always done. I haven't asked about them or her intentions or even hinted. Hell, i thought we were cool at the first meeting and was really glad to finally meet her. I was talking to lots of people though, so maybe I missed something.
I brought this here rather than to him to get a second read on it, and some advice on how to proceed. Because I don't think she's malicious, and I still want to get to know her better, and I'm trying to figure out how to let him know his friend seems to feel threatened by me, without him just deciding he should keep us apart. Suppose I could just say I'd like o get to know her better.
For the people who say they'd say something similar, why? Especially unprovoked?
posted by OompaLoompa at 6:49 AM on November 2, 2011
Yeah, some people are just like that.
It sounds like your BF has been open and upfront with you the whole time and that's what's important.
posted by mazola at 6:57 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
It sounds like your BF has been open and upfront with you the whole time and that's what's important.
posted by mazola at 6:57 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
For the people who say they'd say something similar, why? Especially unprovoked?
Because you're trying to be friendly, but you're socially awkward and drunk and sometimes put your foot in your mouth.
As a socially awkward person, I've recognized that a lot of what I'd previously attributed to malice in other people is just a manifestation of their own anxieties. Yeah, the fat comment was a little weird, but everything else you've mentioned, from "don't you hurt him" to "people sometimes think we're together but EW EW GAK" are things I could easily imagine saying when wrecked, when I can be a bit inappropriately honest.
"I'm not really sure if I should say this, because you probably already know, but anything you say to friend seems to fall right back out of her mouth. She passed on an unflattering conversation blip about me that you and she had. Don't worry, she was the insulting one, not you, and she was drunk so I'm not worried about it. I just wanted to let mention it in case you didn't know that she is a tell all."
Man, you know, I would probably tell my husband in this situation, because we're both big gossips that share everything, but that seems like a kind of shitty thing to say to someone about their friend, who might be having a hard time with their new dating situation. The woman already is no threat to you. There's no need to drive a wedge in their relationship like that.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 6:57 AM on November 2, 2011 [7 favorites]
Because you're trying to be friendly, but you're socially awkward and drunk and sometimes put your foot in your mouth.
As a socially awkward person, I've recognized that a lot of what I'd previously attributed to malice in other people is just a manifestation of their own anxieties. Yeah, the fat comment was a little weird, but everything else you've mentioned, from "don't you hurt him" to "people sometimes think we're together but EW EW GAK" are things I could easily imagine saying when wrecked, when I can be a bit inappropriately honest.
"I'm not really sure if I should say this, because you probably already know, but anything you say to friend seems to fall right back out of her mouth. She passed on an unflattering conversation blip about me that you and she had. Don't worry, she was the insulting one, not you, and she was drunk so I'm not worried about it. I just wanted to let mention it in case you didn't know that she is a tell all."
Man, you know, I would probably tell my husband in this situation, because we're both big gossips that share everything, but that seems like a kind of shitty thing to say to someone about their friend, who might be having a hard time with their new dating situation. The woman already is no threat to you. There's no need to drive a wedge in their relationship like that.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 6:57 AM on November 2, 2011 [7 favorites]
So I have been the uncouth friend in a similar situation (although the subject of said-uncouthness is a bit different), and the absolute worst thing that happened was that my friend came up to me and was like, "My girlfriend felt excluded yesterday because you said X" because it felt like I couldn't make amends or explain myself to the girlfriend without making the entire situation more awkward, and it felt like the girlfriend was scared of talking to me directly even though I thought we were pretty good acquaintances at that point.
So if I were in your shoes I would either drop it (or at most, tell it to my boyfriend in the lighthearted, "OMG your friend is so socially awkward/drunk" kind of way, because my spouse and I are big ol' gossips), or I would confront the friend directly. If she feels threatened by you, there's nothing your boyfriend can do about that except make things worse. If she doesn't feel threatened by you, there's nothing your boyfriend can do except make things worse.
posted by muddgirl at 7:05 AM on November 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
So if I were in your shoes I would either drop it (or at most, tell it to my boyfriend in the lighthearted, "OMG your friend is so socially awkward/drunk" kind of way, because my spouse and I are big ol' gossips), or I would confront the friend directly. If she feels threatened by you, there's nothing your boyfriend can do about that except make things worse. If she doesn't feel threatened by you, there's nothing your boyfriend can do except make things worse.
posted by muddgirl at 7:05 AM on November 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
Need clarification here: He specifically told her not to mention your size. He's the one who put this topic in her head. If you previously didn't have problems outside of her usually loudmouthyness I'd guess that she was drunk and thinking "don't mention weight, don't mention weight, don't mention weight" and so of course that popped out.
Let it go. That's not taking the high road, that just being reasonable.
posted by Lesser Shrew at 7:29 AM on November 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
Let it go. That's not taking the high road, that just being reasonable.
posted by Lesser Shrew at 7:29 AM on November 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: She has serious body image issues. I'll just drop it for now. She's goofed enough without additional humiliation. If anything, I should have said, right then, "ha! Look at us! I have a hard time keeping things out of my mouth, and you have a hard time keeping them in!"
posted by OompaLoompa at 7:53 AM on November 2, 2011 [5 favorites]
posted by OompaLoompa at 7:53 AM on November 2, 2011 [5 favorites]
When women make comments about another woman's weight, directly or otherwise, they know EXACTLY what they're doing.
posted by hermitosis at 8:12 AM on November 2, 2011 [17 favorites]
posted by hermitosis at 8:12 AM on November 2, 2011 [17 favorites]
I'm surprised at all the "keep it to yourself" answers. If it's bothering you, I would bring it up and communicate about it. Do it with kindness, of course, and give them both the benefit of the doubt, use your "I" statements, but I would let him know how it made you feel. Otherwise, it will fester and you'll start to resent her.
posted by Lieber Frau at 8:28 AM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by Lieber Frau at 8:28 AM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
I would let this go. It's been made clear that the fat comment is really about her issues, not you.
If she'd done something deliberately cruel--gossiping about you when she knew full well you were in earshot, thrown a drink in your face, been snarky about how you hosted a party or planned a group outing, told a nasty story about bf-- I would let him know about that.
posted by brujita at 8:36 AM on November 2, 2011
If she'd done something deliberately cruel--gossiping about you when she knew full well you were in earshot, thrown a drink in your face, been snarky about how you hosted a party or planned a group outing, told a nasty story about bf-- I would let him know about that.
posted by brujita at 8:36 AM on November 2, 2011
I don't like that your boyfriend set you up to possibly have issues with this person because he "warned" you about her in advance. I wonder what he has said to her about you? I wonder if her weirdness isn't about something he said or did that you don't know about?
At first I thought this was innocent, but when I read Miko's answer that you favorited, a different story jumped out at me.
I think they've been FWB and don't want you (anyone?) to know about it. I think your BF is pretty smooth, and she's the one who isn't. Your BF expected her to totally crack or at least strongly hint at the truth, so he disparaged her character and called her credibility into question preemptively.
I could be totally wrong.
And it could be true that she has all the issues you've attributed to her and your BF is/was in some kind of deeper relationship with her that's screwing with her head even further.
I dunno. I feel like there is some crucial missing element to explain this weird weird conversation she had with you. I doubt she'd go where she went out of thin air.
If your BF had not trashed his friend to you, which he did, I would not be suggesting you take a look to rule on this possibility. It's something I've seen cheaters do. I missed it until Miko tightened up your narrative a bit.
posted by jbenben at 9:10 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
At first I thought this was innocent, but when I read Miko's answer that you favorited, a different story jumped out at me.
I think they've been FWB and don't want you (anyone?) to know about it. I think your BF is pretty smooth, and she's the one who isn't. Your BF expected her to totally crack or at least strongly hint at the truth, so he disparaged her character and called her credibility into question preemptively.
I could be totally wrong.
And it could be true that she has all the issues you've attributed to her and your BF is/was in some kind of deeper relationship with her that's screwing with her head even further.
I dunno. I feel like there is some crucial missing element to explain this weird weird conversation she had with you. I doubt she'd go where she went out of thin air.
If your BF had not trashed his friend to you, which he did, I would not be suggesting you take a look to rule on this possibility. It's something I've seen cheaters do. I missed it until Miko tightened up your narrative a bit.
posted by jbenben at 9:10 AM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
Everything Miko said is dead-on. Also, the next time she engages you in this fashion, listen patiently, then (when there's an opening) pat her on the back and dismiss her with a quick "you're so funny!" and walk away. Really, there's no need to dignify her behavior, or engage with it. Just let her ramble, then scoot.
posted by davejay at 10:15 AM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by davejay at 10:15 AM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
Oh, yeah, and:
Also, I'm finding it hard to believe that people are telling you to keep quiet about the fact that he had to ask her not to comment on your body and then she did it anyway, while neatly letting you know that they had a convo about your body behind your back.
Seconded. You have a choice to make on that specific comment: are you going to allow yourself to be her confidant, or are you going to communicate openly with your boyfriend? Whether she realized it or not, she set you up with "your boyfriend told me not to do something insulting, and I'm doing it anyway. What are you going to do about it?" and so you might want to consider bringing it up from a "you told her to do something, and she blatantly went out of her way to disrespect you, so I figured you should know; after all, I'm your girlfriend, not her confidant" perspective.
posted by davejay at 10:22 AM on November 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
Also, I'm finding it hard to believe that people are telling you to keep quiet about the fact that he had to ask her not to comment on your body and then she did it anyway, while neatly letting you know that they had a convo about your body behind your back.
Seconded. You have a choice to make on that specific comment: are you going to allow yourself to be her confidant, or are you going to communicate openly with your boyfriend? Whether she realized it or not, she set you up with "your boyfriend told me not to do something insulting, and I'm doing it anyway. What are you going to do about it?" and so you might want to consider bringing it up from a "you told her to do something, and she blatantly went out of her way to disrespect you, so I figured you should know; after all, I'm your girlfriend, not her confidant" perspective.
posted by davejay at 10:22 AM on November 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
which of course implies that he'd better be your boyfriend and not her confidant, as far as your body issues are concerned, without you actually having to say that.
posted by davejay at 10:23 AM on November 2, 2011
posted by davejay at 10:23 AM on November 2, 2011
Response by poster: jbenben, you make good points, and it wouldn't surprise me if they had tried more at some point. That actually wouldn't bother me. People have histories. Nothing about his behavior has indicated he's anything but over-the-moon about me, so I'm not worried he's going to step out. Really. It would surprise me that he'd hide something like that, though, considering I've told him up front about my FWB-turned pal, though they haven't yet met. But I hear you on that, and it could be a reasonable explanation for her outburst if she's got lingering sentiment.
He didn't trash her so much as give a fair assessment. One of the reasons I pointed out that he does this with all of his friends as I meet them is because I didn't want anyone to get the idea that he's singled her out for badmouthing and therefore is trying to hide something. He's just frank about people's foibles. Ex: "My friend Jack is great, but man, sometimes he says the most ignorant things. My friend Jill is lots of fun, but she has a temper and it tends to come out at the worst times, so I can't take her certain places. My friend Mouthy is hilarious, but she's got some issues and no filter." I get this, because I also have a tremendous group of friends and sometimes have to...curate groups and situations, and it is as important to me as it is to him to have a partner who can navigate a variety of personalities. I see these disclosures as more helpful than anything.
But duly noted. I have dated someone in the past who had a friend with a serious crush, who behaved inappropriately towards me, and I initially tried to ignore the barbs. These were not even small barbs--the friend went so far as to joke to me that they wanted to marry my ex, hoped we'd break up soon, etc. After it had happened a few times, I brought it up, and found my then-partner to be dismissive, evasive, and protective of the friend. Needless to say, that (and some other issues) killed my trust for him and makes me reluctant to deal with that dynamic again. This, so far, has felt very different, at least as far as my bf's behavior goes. But who knows? Only time and the benefit of the doubt will tell.
posted by OompaLoompa at 10:28 AM on November 2, 2011
He didn't trash her so much as give a fair assessment. One of the reasons I pointed out that he does this with all of his friends as I meet them is because I didn't want anyone to get the idea that he's singled her out for badmouthing and therefore is trying to hide something. He's just frank about people's foibles. Ex: "My friend Jack is great, but man, sometimes he says the most ignorant things. My friend Jill is lots of fun, but she has a temper and it tends to come out at the worst times, so I can't take her certain places. My friend Mouthy is hilarious, but she's got some issues and no filter." I get this, because I also have a tremendous group of friends and sometimes have to...curate groups and situations, and it is as important to me as it is to him to have a partner who can navigate a variety of personalities. I see these disclosures as more helpful than anything.
But duly noted. I have dated someone in the past who had a friend with a serious crush, who behaved inappropriately towards me, and I initially tried to ignore the barbs. These were not even small barbs--the friend went so far as to joke to me that they wanted to marry my ex, hoped we'd break up soon, etc. After it had happened a few times, I brought it up, and found my then-partner to be dismissive, evasive, and protective of the friend. Needless to say, that (and some other issues) killed my trust for him and makes me reluctant to deal with that dynamic again. This, so far, has felt very different, at least as far as my bf's behavior goes. But who knows? Only time and the benefit of the doubt will tell.
posted by OompaLoompa at 10:28 AM on November 2, 2011
After it had happened a few times, I brought it up, and found my then-partner to be dismissive, evasive, and protective of the friend. Needless to say, that (and some other issues) killed my trust for him and makes me reluctant to deal with that dynamic again.
To me, the important issue is: What do you want your partner to do with the information you are providing him in this situation? Clearly, your previous boyfriend being dismissive of your concerns is not a beneficial outcome, but what IS a positive outcome? You talk a lot about what HAS happened but not about what you WANT to happen in the future. The vague impression that I get is that you're worried that his friend will compromise your relationship in some way, but it takes two people to make that happen, and you don't really seem that concerned that your boyfriend would do such a thing, so what problem needs to be solved here?
posted by muddgirl at 11:09 AM on November 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
To me, the important issue is: What do you want your partner to do with the information you are providing him in this situation? Clearly, your previous boyfriend being dismissive of your concerns is not a beneficial outcome, but what IS a positive outcome? You talk a lot about what HAS happened but not about what you WANT to happen in the future. The vague impression that I get is that you're worried that his friend will compromise your relationship in some way, but it takes two people to make that happen, and you don't really seem that concerned that your boyfriend would do such a thing, so what problem needs to be solved here?
posted by muddgirl at 11:09 AM on November 2, 2011 [4 favorites]
so what problem needs to be solved here?
I have plenty of things I discuss with my husband that don't involve solving a problem -- in fact, often I specifically don't want him to solve anything but just to listen if I want to talk about something that is bothering me. Because it is his friend who bothered you, I do think you want to be sensitive and respect that he cares about her. I'm not saying you necessarily should talk to him in this case (letting it go is maybe the best course of action for now), just pointing out that you should feel you can discuss things with your partner without needing him to solve anything.
posted by JenMarie at 1:25 PM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
I have plenty of things I discuss with my husband that don't involve solving a problem -- in fact, often I specifically don't want him to solve anything but just to listen if I want to talk about something that is bothering me. Because it is his friend who bothered you, I do think you want to be sensitive and respect that he cares about her. I'm not saying you necessarily should talk to him in this case (letting it go is maybe the best course of action for now), just pointing out that you should feel you can discuss things with your partner without needing him to solve anything.
posted by JenMarie at 1:25 PM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: muddgirl, JenMarie and davejay both sort of have it. in fact, all of the conflicting opinions here are pretty much what swirled in my own head and why I sought some outside input. Because of my past relationship, transparency is of tremendous importance to me, and I don't want to fall into the pattern I had last time, where I ignored something that shouldn't have been ignored, tried to be the nice one, and by the time I was bothered enough by it to bring it up, it was A Situation.
Because I don't think this is the same issue with my current partner, I don't want him to get the idea I don't trust him. On the other hand, I value openness, and it's very difficult keeping something from your chief confidant that seems off to you because it's something you think might hurt one of their other relationships.
And thus the wedge could begin. I bring it up, I'm venting for myself but maybe hurting her relationship with him. I leave it alone, and she's neatly done exactly what she claims she doesn't want--planted herself uncomfortably in our relationship. Admittedly, it does get on my tits a little that she gets to say dodgy things (which she had been warned to keep to herself, which is another issue of betrayal of his trust) and i just have to deal for the sake of keeping the peace, but that's often what happens with people like this. She likes drama, I hate it, and it will be up to me to kill it, I guess.
So for now, I'll leave it alone. I'm sensitive because of the previous situation, and that person was actively manipulative. This woman is, as far as I know, just completely lacking in tact. I'll give her the benefit of the doubt for another meeting or two.
posted by OompaLoompa at 1:50 PM on November 2, 2011
Because I don't think this is the same issue with my current partner, I don't want him to get the idea I don't trust him. On the other hand, I value openness, and it's very difficult keeping something from your chief confidant that seems off to you because it's something you think might hurt one of their other relationships.
And thus the wedge could begin. I bring it up, I'm venting for myself but maybe hurting her relationship with him. I leave it alone, and she's neatly done exactly what she claims she doesn't want--planted herself uncomfortably in our relationship. Admittedly, it does get on my tits a little that she gets to say dodgy things (which she had been warned to keep to herself, which is another issue of betrayal of his trust) and i just have to deal for the sake of keeping the peace, but that's often what happens with people like this. She likes drama, I hate it, and it will be up to me to kill it, I guess.
So for now, I'll leave it alone. I'm sensitive because of the previous situation, and that person was actively manipulative. This woman is, as far as I know, just completely lacking in tact. I'll give her the benefit of the doubt for another meeting or two.
posted by OompaLoompa at 1:50 PM on November 2, 2011
She likes drama, I hate it, and it will be up to me to kill it, I guess.
This is a hard lesson to learn, but it definitely gets easier with practice. In the South we might deflect attempts at stirring up drama with a well-place, "Well, aren't YOU a darling."
posted by muddgirl at 2:35 PM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
This is a hard lesson to learn, but it definitely gets easier with practice. In the South we might deflect attempts at stirring up drama with a well-place, "Well, aren't YOU a darling."
posted by muddgirl at 2:35 PM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
leave it alone, and she's neatly done exactly what she claims she doesn't want--planted herself uncomfortably in our relationship. Admittedly, it does get on my tits a little that she gets to say dodgy things (which she had been warned to keep to herself, which is another issue of betrayal of his trust)
I don't quite see how she has the power to plant herself in your relationship, unless your boyfriend goes off with her.
Rather than think of it as "she gets to say dodgy things" (and was it really her betraying his trust, and not him betraying yours, and why do you need to police the former when he specifically warned you that the problem with her is that she opens her big mouth all the time), how about you think of it as "maybe she drinks too much"?
posted by Adventurer at 3:01 PM on November 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
I don't quite see how she has the power to plant herself in your relationship, unless your boyfriend goes off with her.
Rather than think of it as "she gets to say dodgy things" (and was it really her betraying his trust, and not him betraying yours, and why do you need to police the former when he specifically warned you that the problem with her is that she opens her big mouth all the time), how about you think of it as "maybe she drinks too much"?
posted by Adventurer at 3:01 PM on November 2, 2011 [3 favorites]
Sorry that I'm late to the commenting party, but I was working all day and HAD to answer because my vote is underrepresented! I, personally, as a young-ish female in the best relationship of my life, would TOTALLY say something to your boyfriend. Drunk or not, this girl knew what she was saying. I agree with your read that she has feelings for him. Maybe she didn't even KNOW she had them until she met you, but I think they're there. But I'm also of the camp that men and women can't really be friends unless they're related or something, so take that with a grain of salt. You don't need to be confrontational, rude, or judgmental, but a "Wow, Friend said the weirdest, rude thing to me--what the hell?!" would be okay, I think. My boyfriend has more than one friend who sounds similar to this, and it took a lot of corrective action early in the relationship to draw boundaries where I thought there should be some. For instance, one ex in particular, upon meeting me for the first time, told my boyfriend, "Come sit in my lap!". I didn't say anything at the party, but afterwards I mentioned that was totally inappropriate and from then on, we haven't had any trouble with her.
I know the AskMefites tend to be less insecure/jealous than I am, but if you're comfortable saying how you feel I don't think it could hurt. Your boyfriend already knows Friend has potential to do things of this nature, and I think he'd like to know how your encounter went. If I were him, I would want to know if a friend was being rude to a girl I liked, especially about her body, which I am attracted to. A size 14 isn't fat in my book, but anything to change the fat=gross mentality, especially to other women, would be appreciated by the fatosphere! And hell, it would have been awesome to drive home the point to her that your boyfriend isn't dating her, not because of her body (about which you said she was insecure), but because of some other flaw she has! Ha!
posted by masquesoporfavor at 4:21 PM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
I know the AskMefites tend to be less insecure/jealous than I am, but if you're comfortable saying how you feel I don't think it could hurt. Your boyfriend already knows Friend has potential to do things of this nature, and I think he'd like to know how your encounter went. If I were him, I would want to know if a friend was being rude to a girl I liked, especially about her body, which I am attracted to. A size 14 isn't fat in my book, but anything to change the fat=gross mentality, especially to other women, would be appreciated by the fatosphere! And hell, it would have been awesome to drive home the point to her that your boyfriend isn't dating her, not because of her body (about which you said she was insecure), but because of some other flaw she has! Ha!
posted by masquesoporfavor at 4:21 PM on November 2, 2011 [1 favorite]
When women make comments about another woman's weight, directly or otherwise, they know EXACTLY what they're doing.
So true, and unfortunately, the "tell" in this situation. She is not just over-the-top and a mouthy drunk but harmless. She is mean. It's both rude and somewhat threatening (she wants your man and she wants you to know it) to have mentioned your weight (and I wish he hadn't discussed it with her, honestly!)
I would say nothing to him, and go slow and careful and be a little suspicious of her.
posted by thinkpiece at 4:34 PM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
So true, and unfortunately, the "tell" in this situation. She is not just over-the-top and a mouthy drunk but harmless. She is mean. It's both rude and somewhat threatening (she wants your man and she wants you to know it) to have mentioned your weight (and I wish he hadn't discussed it with her, honestly!)
I would say nothing to him, and go slow and careful and be a little suspicious of her.
posted by thinkpiece at 4:34 PM on November 2, 2011 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Eh, and just like that, I'm over it. I do hope she knows I'm not trying to take her friend away. Not sure how to make that any clearer, though.
Thanks for the advice, MeFites. Always nice to get a round of opinions from the green.
posted by OompaLoompa at 8:39 AM on November 3, 2011
Thanks for the advice, MeFites. Always nice to get a round of opinions from the green.
posted by OompaLoompa at 8:39 AM on November 3, 2011
« Older Help me remember this disturbing horror novel | Is that a bump on your shoulder or are just happy... Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by ian1977 at 12:22 AM on November 2, 2011 [3 favorites]