Too weird for OKCupid, not weird enough for Fetlife
September 28, 2011 7:42 PM   Subscribe

Need help with OKCupid. Difficulty: I'm creepy

In the spirit of Hogermite's question...
The basics: 25/Male/a little queer. Brooklyn. The profile in question. I've been using okc for about a year and a half with varying levels of success - I have the usual difficulties getting dates, but once I do things usually work out. I have some ongoing friend-with-benefits situations from this, but they live hours away. I'm not desperate; just frustrated.

I have two related problems. 1: I'm into stuff that's pretty out there but I'm not really into the whole BDSM or fetish scene. I'm aware of Fetlife's (and the mefite group's) existence, but I don't feel like I fit in there, and I don't really know how to use it effectively to find people like me; the kink community skews way more renfaire than hipster.
2: There are most definitely a lot of attractive people on okc that skew kinky but I have a hard time writing to them. As open as I am telling a crowd what I want to do in general, I have a lot of difficulty saying what I want to do to you.

So whom should I be pursuing? The least "lifestyle" people on fetlife, the handful of out kinksters on okc, or the general population and hope for the jackpot? And how do I go about that?
posted by modernserf to Human Relations (34 answers total) 14 users marked this as a favorite

What exactly are you looking for that you're not getting, in terms of love/romance/sex? What's your "jackpot"? You say you get dates, and have some FBW situations, and there's nothing in your profile to suggest you want more, so I'm a little confused.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:51 PM on September 28, 2011

Straight up there's a lot of things about your profile I'd change if you want to get more interest.

I'd include fewer goofy/weird pics. You look like you're trying to hard to be weird or distinctive in them, which reeks of insecurity. I'd definitely take out 2nd, 4th and 5th pics. Also get rid of the captions. Try to find some photos of yourself that other people have taken where your guard is more down and you're not striking some pose.

If you're trying to appeal to both genders, I'd get rid of the "homoerotic" reference in your profile because it will scare away the chicks, even if they're OK with you being bisexual. I know that doesn't seem to make sense but just trust me.

I'd get rid of this: "You should message me if you're a bi guy and you're interested in
doubling up on girls."

You don't need to wear your fetishes on your sleeve. This will freak out most women and possibly a lot of guys. Do you really want your kinkiness to be the main thing you're advertising about yourself? Instead, I'd bring it up once you've gotten to know somebody a little better.

I also think you're trying too hard in the text part of your profile to be funny and clever. Try to be more genuine. I don't learn much about you from your profile aside from the fact that you're a bit insecure and kinky.

When I'm not doing that, I'm mostly working on a project I expect to make me internet billions. (My Income level is thus "projected.")
I'd take this out. I know it's a joke, but it makes you sound a bit delusional and grandiose.
posted by timsneezed at 8:01 PM on September 28, 2011 [20 favorites]

*too hard
posted by timsneezed at 8:02 PM on September 28, 2011

If the "doubling up on girls" thing is what you're into, i think you're putting it out there in an appropriate way.

Also, as one data point, my okcupid profile doesn't mention sex at all, and yet i still get (moderately) frequent messages from people looking for something kinky. If it's interesting or intriguing, i'll message them with a "sounds intriguing but not my thing but what else?" or i'll ignore it, but i'm never really offended. I think you can probably tell from people's profile if they are very conservative or not, and if they aren't, just go ahead and message them. They'll check out your profile and if they are into the "doubling up" they'll message you back. If they aren't they won't.

So, yeah, in sum: general pop and hope to hit the jackpot.
posted by Kololo at 8:02 PM on September 28, 2011 [2 favorites]

A person can be a big carwheeling fan of the weirdest, craziest shit you can imagine, but that doesn't mean they want weird crazy shit all the time. Likewise another person can be quite comparatively conservative and prefer things simple, except, "well, I've never tried that, but..."

Unfortunately, if you let your "kinks" define you, and won't stray away from them even temporarily, you're going to be quite lonely, because if it does happen that you find somebody who shares your exact same set of predilections, chances are you won't have much else in common. Having a great sexy time together urinating into dishwashers or whatever can be fun while your bladder is still full, but what happens after that? So, uh, if you just want a freaky time, go with the fetish site because I'm sure many people there would be happy to ease up for a night or two, and hell, you might find something all whack-a-doodle (even whacking doodles) that you do thoroughly enjoy.
posted by tumid dahlia at 8:04 PM on September 28, 2011 [3 favorites]

Yes. The answer may depend a bit on your idea of "jackpot" - so please be a bit more specific.

By now there must be queer-only bdsm sites? Right? Maybe someone can recommend a few to you?

You might have the most luck simply turning up to bdsm or gay events in NYC in terms of searching out your hipster jackpot. Good luck!
posted by jbenben at 8:04 PM on September 28, 2011

Also, um, i sort of disagree with a lot of what timsneezed said, i took the jokes as jokes. I thought the bleeding/blindfold photo was kind of gross but whatever. And i think its okay to wear your fetishes on your sleeve if what you're primarily interested in is satisfying them. (Also, i have a pretty high match percentage with you, so am maybe closer to the kind of girl you're trying to target.)
posted by Kololo at 8:08 PM on September 28, 2011

I think your profile rocks!! Sorry I missed that you are bi (or as I like to say, "omni-sexual"!)

Anywho. You are cute! Get out there clubbing and go to events! Go get your wiggle on!!
posted by jbenben at 8:08 PM on September 28, 2011 [2 favorites]

I think its okay to wear your fetishes on your sleeve if what you're primarily interested in is satisfying them.

That's true, but I assumed he was just into dating/relationship-hunting in general. Maybe I'm wrong. Is that your primary interest OP?
posted by timsneezed at 8:10 PM on September 28, 2011

Response by poster: I'd like to find a way to say that while group sex isn't all I'm interested in, I'm only interested in people who are open to that possibility. I don't have much difficulty finding people who aren't at all into that, but I've got 5, maybe 10 years left of the virility that sort of thing requires. The point is that I'm not really that kinky in the grand scheme of things -- there's a world of difference between threesomes and dishwasher-pissing -- and I don't want to invest myself into this as a lifestyle; I just want to have art school sex for a while before I settle down.
posted by modernserf at 8:20 PM on September 28, 2011

as an aside - the bdsm scene only seems more renfaire than hipster - and the scene events can also skew that way - but in the nuts and bolts (haha) of who is actually doing what to who - there's a lot of hipsters.
posted by nadawi at 8:21 PM on September 28, 2011 [3 favorites]

I also think your profile rocks! As a woman I think you come across as mostly into guys and maybe only into girls if it's with another guy. So if that's not what you're looking for I'd tone it down a bit.

I'd get rid of the second to last photo and the one before it and stick with the music, skiing and cute guniea pig one (that's a great photo btw).
posted by fshgrl at 8:21 PM on September 28, 2011 [1 favorite]

In my opinion, OKC is like the worst of Facebook and combined. Everyone trying too hard. There's not a lot of space for creativity and nuance.

You might do better in a format where you can just express yourself in a few paragraphs. I don't think Craigslist personals is much of anything anymore, but a few years ago I met a bunch of cool guys on there (including my BF of two years). Maybe try Or Adult Friend Finder if you're really looking for hookups as opposed to relationships.
posted by pourtant at 8:24 PM on September 28, 2011

also, i think your profile is just fine - but as a girl who has been with bisexual guys in group sex situations, i'd respond more to omni or polysexual than "banging two chicks." i don't mind crude - but i would want to know you're not a meat head.
posted by nadawi at 8:25 PM on September 28, 2011 [6 favorites]

When you think about writing someone, do you look at the questions people have answered? Their answers might lend at least some insight into compatibility when it comes to intimate interests.

I've seen more than a few people with profiles that are pretty tame when it comes to that stuff, but their answers to a number of questions cast a different light (and I can understand how some people would want to be relatively low-key about their kinks.)
posted by ambient2 at 8:31 PM on September 28, 2011

Best answer: It's all about the dog whistle. You don't send someone a message right off the bat saying "Here's what I want to do to you," because — even if they're into that shit too — it makes you sound like a drooling, tactless sex-crazed moron. What you want to convey is (a) that you're up for fun sexy adventures but (b) that you can be subtle, clever and discreet when the situation calls for it.

When I was an eligible young bachelor bondage nerd on OkCupid, the standard move was to list something like "The Secretary" under your favorite movies, and then people could message each other all "Hey, you like The Secretary? Me too! What an amazing coincidence! Let's get coffee." Which, I mean, that comes about as close as you can get to "I want to tie you up or perhaps vice versa" without actually coming out and saying it — but it's still ever so slightly subtle, and subtlety matters.

So okay, that's not your kink and it's an outdated cultural reference at this point anyway. But you can figure out what the equivalent dog whistle is for "into ironically homoerotic hipster threesomes."

As nadawi says, "doubling up on girls" is a pretty meathead-sounding thing to say. Actually, "I want to have art school sex for a while before I settle down" might be the line to use. It leaves something to the imagination (though it still makes it pretty clear to the reader what sort of something they're supposed to be imagining) and it's vaguely witty and doesn't reek of frat party bathroom. Could be worse.
posted by nebulawindphone at 8:34 PM on September 28, 2011 [14 favorites]

Response by poster: (sorry for threadsit) I'm really liking the "dog whistle" idea. A lot of this dilemma was about how to express myself eloquently. Any specific ideas on what says "threesome" without saying "dane cook?"
posted by modernserf at 8:43 PM on September 28, 2011

Best answer: I think the biggest hurdle is your "message me if" section. Preemptively referring to what you want as "creepy" says "insecure about what I want" to me. "Doubling up on girls" is also not an awesome choice of phrase, as nadawi points out. nebulawindphone's suggestion on the rephrase sounds like a substantial improvement to me.
posted by EvaDestruction at 8:44 PM on September 28, 2011 [2 favorites]

I just came in to say that you aren't creepy in the least. Your kinks are totally fine; you shouldn't ever be self conscious! Your profile looks good, too, but I agree with almost all of the proposed changes made above. Good luck with all the art school sex!
posted by two lights above the sea at 8:54 PM on September 28, 2011

I think the writing in your profile is splendid, so mark that down as a thumbs up from me. Were I unwed and quite a bit more gay I would take you in the ironically kinky way you crave.
posted by Sebmojo at 9:05 PM on September 28, 2011 [1 favorite]

Oh! Art School Sex! Something shy of "swinging" - OK.

This website is probs totally cheesy and infiltrated with pay-for-play , but it is a start. Look for similar but better options on the internets.

This person has ongoing monthly fetish parties in NYC. This is one event I know of, but it can not be the only one.

At events like this, you are FREE to flirt with people and engage in conversations. It's OK to tell anyone and everyone about your "Jackpot" scenario. You don't have to hook up, it is just about getting your wiggle on, enjoying yourself, and openly being yourself.


In my experience, you will probably have more success in your quest by getting out there and going to specific events rather than using websites, but don't block any avenues.

Go forth and have fun!
posted by jbenben at 9:54 PM on September 28, 2011 [1 favorite]

There's a skittery quality in your writing that reminds me of Robert Quine. If it is attracting the right -kind- of people without the right kinks I would say it needs nothing more than a bit of orientation.
posted by jet_silver at 10:12 PM on September 28, 2011

When I was on OKCupid, if I saw anything that stuck out to me as obviously fake or lying, I'd immediately move on, no matter how attractive the profile was otherwise. (I mean, everyone misrepresents themselves on these things, but usually it's not an out and out lie.)

Even though your profile is generally great, I'd have moved on as soon as I saw what you put as your income level--especially since I saw it before I saw your explanation. Were I you, I'd just cut that whole joke.
posted by ocherdraco at 10:49 PM on September 28, 2011 [1 favorite]

I'm actually disappointed that I missed out on the version of the profile that includes a list of kinks, as I was curious about why you thought you were creepy.

The current version is tame, says little to nothing about sex, and I giggled in much nerdiness reading that the guinnea pig's name is totoro :)

That said, I removed most references to kink from my OKC profile after spending an hour one night trying to get some random guy to understand that when I talked about having a puppy I was referencing an actual canine, not a human who likes to act like a dog... Oi! Talk about creeps coming out of the woodwork!

If you want to leave more subtle clues, as someone above said listing movies like The Secretary, or even saying something less subtle like "mildly kinky and sex positive" it wouldn't go amiss.

Also so far as fetlife goes, there are plenty of folks into milder levels of kink, just make sure to read profiles before you contact people. Although to be honest the better ways to meet people through that site are to join local based groups, go out to local events and such, and look up the various groups that might be dedicated to your particular fetishes.

I've found as far as various sites and such, meh. Chat with people as people, be straightforward about what you're looking for, see where it goes from there. If your kinks are beyond the norm for your average vanilla it might be best to focus your searches on sites where its less "strange".
posted by myShanon at 11:40 PM on September 28, 2011

I agree completely with timsneezed.

Be subtle, and don't try so hard. And use euphemisms that show that you have the social skills to be discreet. (I love the "art school sex" thing.)

Also, the internet billionaire stuff is funny to people in that milieu, but people outside of it will take you seriously and think that you are a douche. Especially cool, hipster-ish people, who work in a different field or come from another part of the world. In other words, not everyone (including awesome people you would want to meet) will get it.

And, like timsneezed said, leave off "homoerotic". It's drilled into (no pun intended) girls' heads that "bi-sexual" is code for "gay". Putting this in your profile will make people think you are gay, posing as bi. It may not make sense, but it will work better if you take this off.

One final thing... I can't get any sense of you as a person from your profile. You make post-ironic jokes about everything, but... what do you care about? What do you love? What are you doing? The best part for me was about the "people you wished were your cool uncle". Why those people? Who are you? Etc.
posted by 3491again at 11:53 PM on September 28, 2011 [5 favorites]

Best answer: One final thing... I can't get any sense of you as a person from your profile. You make post-ironic jokes about everything, but... what do you care about? What do you love? What are you doing? The best part for me was about the "people you wished were your cool uncle". Why those people? Who are you? Etc.

Seconding this. The only thing that made me smile a bit is the omelet thing.

Generally, I think less would be more here. There's some charm but it's buried under a lot of posturing and cliche. I'd also try to get rid of anything that seems to be judging other people on there, since these are people you could be fucking. This is a guy I would message:
My self-summary
At some point in time, I stopped trying to write the Great American Novel and settled for the Great American Men's Magazine. I'm full of two-fisted tales, a couple drink recipes, and some startlingly homoerotic fashion spreads.

I have an apartment and a bedroom that I can furnish with whatever I please but I still make forts out of my pillows and blankets.

I'm really indoorsy. I like walking around but not in nature. NYC is a good fit for me.

I reflexively hit Command-Z in real life.

I claim to like Phil Collins ironically, but there's really nothing ironic about it.

What I’m doing with my life
I'm making a "private social network" for "thought leaders" in the "crowdsourcing community." Think Dunder Mifflin Infinity. When I'm not doing that, I'm mostly working on a project I expect to make me internet billions. [Maybe. This is still kinda cringey]

Every once in a while I work on one of those self-indulgent thinly-veiled memoir about early adulthood and shitty retail jobs that every wordy guy has.

I’m really good at
Elaborate hangover breakfasts.
Synthesizer programming.

The first things people usually notice about me
I'm thinking its the cartoon character voice, charitably described as John Darnielle-esque.

I have a tattoo on my forearm. I get two questions:
1) is that real?
2) what does it mean?

I have wonderfully floppy hair.
Favorite books, movies, shows, music, and food
Recently - Books
The Mythical Man-Month, Infinite Jest, Snow Crash, Middlesex
Louie, Party Down, Hoarders, No Reservations
- Music
St. Vincent, Glen Campbell, David Axelrod, Joni Mitchell, REM
- Food
Pork shoulder, fivespice. OMELETTES.
- Other
almost every 5by5 podcast

The six things I could never do without
This is a silly question. I could be typical and say "my iPhone lol ;-)" or literal and say "air" but both of those are cop-outs. I prefer:

The six people I wish were my cool uncle
Alton Brown
Anthony Bourdain
Merlin Mann
Joel Hodgson
Matt Paxton
Paul F. Tompkins

I spend a lot of time thinking about
Lately I've been very much on a "practical biological anthropology" kick and trying to analyze my social interactions like I'm watching a band of bonobos. Next time I ask for a raise I'm definitely baring my canines.

Somehow I'm going to reconcile this with contemporary feminism.

On a typical Friday night I am
Honestly Friday isn't that great for going out, since that's when everybody else is doing the same thing. I'm a philosopher-style drunk and it would be a shame if one of my pearls of wisdom were swallowed up by the din of a bar crowd.

The Rebecca Black lyrics that used to be here did not age well.

The most private thing I’m willing to admit
I recently had a dream that I was a web server.
I’m looking for
Guys and girls who like bi guys
Ages 21-40
Near me
For short-term dating, activity partners

You should message me if
The other night I heard a relationship described as "a Bedford Ave.
kind of romance - we'd fuck and have brunch but it wasn't a big
deal." That's what I'm good for, right now.
I'm not outrageously kinky, but I'd like to have some art school sex before I'm too old and detumescent to handle that sort of thing anymore.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 12:04 AM on September 29, 2011 [14 favorites]

If I'm ever single again, i'd want PhoBWanKenobi editing my profile.

Of course, ironic, if anyone ever googled a unique phrase, they'd probably find this thread.

Yeah, dial it back a notch. You've got a great, uh, base to build from, but I'd really re-think that work section. To me (admittedly, older and more jaded than your target audience), it screams either entitled douche or underemployed slacker programmer douche. Especially those scare-quotes, even though I think you meant it all as a big joke, it trips over its own two feet and falls flat, flat, flat.
posted by canine epigram at 5:59 AM on September 29, 2011 [2 favorites]

Best answer: Any specific ideas on what says "threesome" without saying "dane cook?"

In the vein of nebulawindphone's Secretary reference, you could say that your favorite movie is Y Tu Mamá También.
posted by quiet coyote at 6:24 AM on September 29, 2011 [1 favorite]

Hmm. If you really are sincere about your age range going up to 40, then I think you might want to tailor your ad a bit to appeal to people who have perhaps grown out of their love of irony & quirkiness, but might still be down for some art school sex. Your okc ad might have appealed to 22 year old me ... but mid 30s me, not so much. I think you might want to consider two ads, one more targeted to finding sex, and one targeted to longer term relationships with (presumably) girls your own age.
posted by mrs. sock at 10:52 AM on September 29, 2011

As per the kinky stuff, there's totally nothing wrong with being kinky and using OkC to look for that, it's a very kinky dating site. However, I find that instead of making that a focus of your profile, you can maybe put a hint of it in, but make sure that you fill out a bunch of the kinkier sexual questions.

When I'm on there I read the profile to make sure that the person is a human being I can relate to, and then head over to his or her questions to see if we match up on a bunch of issues, which include sex and kink. There, you can be explicit about what you like and are looking for, but it's not right up there on your front page.
posted by robot-hugs at 11:26 AM on September 29, 2011

Honestly, I'd be more put off by the "contemporary feminism" comment than the homoerotic or bisexual comments. but thats just my experience with men who claim to be feminist because they think it makes them seem more sensitive... even though I'm decidedly *not* a feminist, and enjoy my men a tiny bit mysoginistic (aka, selfish, arrogant, masculine and unapologetic about asserting themselves in a relationship).
posted by myShanon at 2:52 AM on September 30, 2011

I'd like to find a way to say that while group sex isn't all I'm interested in, I'm only interested in people who are open to that possibility.

Why don't you just say, "group sex isn't all I'm interested in, but I'm only interested in people who are open to that possibility"? If that's really what you mean, then what are the possible consequences of saying it?

(You might, possibly, turn off people who are open to the possibility, but are concerned that you're going to put the pressure on inappropriately. But. . . if you ask for what you want, you also run the risk of getting what you want.)

And, while I fully admit that you probably have access to information about your virility that I don't, but, in the absence of additional information, I think you are happily underestimating the virility of men past 40. Not that I think you should just "sit tight" instead of going after what you want, but, don't feel so panicky about running out of time.
posted by endless_forms at 2:08 PM on September 30, 2011

Response by poster: The hanky code for "I like group sex" is putting "shortbus" in your movies list.
posted by modernserf at 9:10 PM on October 8, 2011

(Ooh. Good call.)
posted by nebulawindphone at 7:39 PM on October 9, 2011

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