Concrete plan to land a decent-paying job?
May 3, 2011 11:20 PM   Subscribe

Approaching mid-30s, loads of credit card debt (30k+ and in default), need a job to help me get on track financially. So far: Doing It Wrong. (Snowflake details inside)

I spent my 20s in and out of academia, with random work in between, and building up a lot of debt. I loosely planned to eventually get a decent job and get my shit together, but so far am failing. My degree is a MSc in physics. For the past 1.5 years I've been working as a contract, $15/hr, wearing-many-hats employee at a small startup (specialty wholesaler). There I can work as much as I want, but the place is dysfunctional and the work is tedious, so I often do the minimum 15-20hrs/wk - i.e. just enough to pay living expenses, but nothing else.

I have been 'looking for a job' for the past 2 years. Quotes because this has mainly been me staring at indeed.com or some company website for a few hours, then being overwhelmed at the number and content of job descriptions, none of which I seem to really have interest in or qualify for...and not really applying to anything. I saw a career counselor who had me take a Briggs-Myers tests and read related books (e.g. Do What you Are) all of which I found unhelpful and pretty dumb, frankly. The counselor said I was "overthinking it" and after a few meetings we mutually decided it wasn't working. My network is small, but I via people I did get a few interviews at Major Airline, and was in both cases told that I did well, but the jobs were "given to internal candidates." My motivation for airline positions in particular was mostly for potential travel benefits.

What am I looking for? It's all pretty nebulous to me, honestly. My latest best guess is to try the big defense contractors (Raytheon, etc) and maybe some oil industry companies, and look for some analyst type position there...but I hardly even know what to search for. Money-wise I think (hope) a $50-60k/yr position is realistic, but truthfully I don't know. Work in the financial markets would also be cool, but I don't have a PhD and also I think I may be too old to get into that field. Same goes for consulting (business? IT?)...although I haven't really liked my business experience thus far, and don't car much for excel...but I do like the project-based aspect of it. Location doesn't matter at this point.

I don't do online networking like linkedin to avoid debt collectors. I often think my debt situation makes me a shitty job candidate, and that I probably can't get a job in the financial sector or one that required a security clearance. Also, I have a few (tasteful) tattoos that can show a bit even with long sleeves...(can hide for interview, but not day-to-day) which I think may hurt me when trying for corporate-type jobs.

I have been stuck and seem to be staying stuck. I would like this to change. I also feel like I am getting dumber by the day, and have forgotten most of what I did in school. Common sense says that I need to make a real plan that I can actually make some progress on...but I have failed at that too so far. Anyway, been reading askmefi for a few years, I thought maybe some perspectives outside of my small friends/family group may be useful. Suggestions to convert this mess into actions to get a job/turn things around? Many thanks.
posted by no to Work & Money (10 answers total) 14 users marked this as a favorite
 
Make a plan when you have some options. It's time to act.

Start by bucking up and putting 40-50 hours in per week at work. As much as you can stand. It's the easiest and simplest thing you can do right now, so do it. Grin and bear it, as it's said. That'll get your cash flow moving in the right direction immediately (So you can start putting money up against your debt. Do something fun with a bit of it, too.) It'll get your inertia towards a career moving as well. Interviews are so much more fun when you can talk for days about working hard at the job you have now yet wanting more in a carer.

Superficial stuff like your tattoos won't matter when you can present the substantial accomplishment of putting in 40 hours of shit work to get yourself to the next level.
posted by carsonb at 11:35 PM on May 3, 2011 [2 favorites]


My personal advice--and this is from someone who has worked in a few job sectors--is to not be so picky about interviews.

Honestly, don't judge yourself OUT of a job before you're even into it. At this point, get an interview whereever you can. Wear long sleeves, but don't go to extreme lengths to cover tattoos. If it's a problem for them, let THEM decide and reject you AFTER they meet you. Don't reject them out of hand. Again, the debt situation: it exists, you have it, but don't use it as an excuse not to try for jobs. If it's a problem, they'll let you know.

Like I said, interview. Consider those interviews your chance to interview THEM as well as convince them you're a good employee. Ask them what their company's strategies are, what makes them different, yadda yadda yadda (although keep it general and try not to make it "what can you do for ME" type questions, this is your opportunity to see if you and their ideas, rhythms, and priorities match).

At some point, you'll get an offer, if you are taking every interview you can get, and treating them seriously. Treat an offer seriously too, and consider it. SERIOUSLY. And at some point: Take a job. Take the least shitty-sounding job you can. You got yourself into this hole slowly, so you won't be able to magick your way out of it, but take a job and work it and it doesn't need to be your forever job, but it can be a job where you learn a little more about what industry you may want to be in, or what type of office work you can or cannot do. And in two years, you might have networked your way into a better situation. Or at least wrangled your debt load down so that you aren't feeling so trapped.

In the meantime, carsonb is right: work as much as you can right now, no matter how dysfunctional it is. (My strategy when I've been in that situation: treat it as if you are gathering material for your Great American Novel.) Suck it up, put in the time, and keep track of interview worthy stories ("Name a time you had to deal with XYZ shitty situation....") and work on making your handling of those situations worthy of an interview answer.

And apply, apply, apply, for anything you might REMOTELY qualify for.

My creds for this: late 30s and starting a new career. Literally: I just got a paid internship for the summer and I'm over the moon about it.
posted by e to the pi i at 12:06 AM on May 4, 2011 [4 favorites]


Seconding e to to pi i, plus I'd add: you've not applied for jobs for ages, so just pick something that looks interesting and apply anyway. Consider it practice for the next application. And the same with the next one & so on :)

If your debt is holding you back & you have a job that you can work the hours to get the debt paid down, then just do it. Look into Snowballing your debts: psychologically it's much more effective because you see results early, which helps you stay positive.
posted by pharm at 1:49 AM on May 4, 2011


$30k of credit card debt? Declare bankruptcy. Like, yesterday. There's no way in hell you're going to dig yourself out from under that. Minimum payments will take you about twenty years and cost you over two-hundred thousand dollars in interest.

I mean, yeah, you need a job, but getting a job will not fix this problem. You need to make that debt go away. Sure, bankruptcy will nuke your credit for the next seven years, but it isn't like anyone was going to lend you money anyway, especially given that you're already in default. Get that debt off your shoulders and your current gig will be a lot more viable.

Get yourself a phone book and look for bankruptcy attorneys. Call one. They'll set up an appointment with you, probably this week. Get that ball rolling.
posted by valkyryn at 5:13 AM on May 4, 2011 [4 favorites]


I think applying for other jobs is wasted time until you take your current job seriously. With your qualifications and experience, there's not something magically different about a $50-60k/year job vs. a $15/hour job -- it's just that the higher-paid folks have proven they're capable of putting up with the tedious side of work and have references who will say that. Unpleasant as it may be, you can prove yourself as your current company, build up your network, and move on to better opportunities. You're also in a good position because you know how much you need to make to survive, so you can dedicate every extra dollar to debt reduction. 20 additional hours a week at $10 net per ends up being $10k at the end of the year, and that kind of effort will likely get you a job next year (either with your current company or another one) that will help take care of the rest.

I work in a very corporate environment, where essentially everyone makes six figures, and the successful people have all been forged by digging themselves out of these kinds of holes. Most of these folks would have lept at a $15/hour job back then; it's a better option than the barista tips or enlisted-Navy salary that a couple of guys I know used to support their families.

(Also: visible tattoos are not an issue in most industries these days.)
posted by backupjesus at 5:38 AM on May 4, 2011


When I wrote here my main concern is that you don’t know what you are looking for in terms of a job, so even if you get an interview – you may not present yourself in the best manner (CV-wise, interview), along with exuding “I need 50 K/don’t want to do the tedium of my other job.” There is nothing wrong with any of those ideas (50K and/or finding a more challenging job), but you may need to sell them on why they should hire you and match the job on some other criteria, too. As in, are you excited about their industry and can you exhibit whatever aptitude is needed for that job?

If I were you, I would first come up with a list of 1 or 2 job titles or industries that at least interest you. I had great luck with a little book called “Alternative Careers in Science,” mainly because it described a day in the life of each alternative career so I could quickly read and say “never,” “no,” to “sounds great.” For example, some of the jobs described being on the phone half the day (no), whereas another described reading new science studies daily (sounded good). Another place to look and evaluate possible careers is the WRK4Us archived discussions (see links on right hand side of page). For each type of job, they interview a few people and they tell what they need to do to transition into the job, salary, worklife, etc. Wrk4Us was made for people in the humanities with PhDs who wanted to leave academia, but it is still a useful resource.

After you define what you want, do info interviews. I did them and the purpose and the reason was not to get hired by any of those people, but learn a) how to present yourself (hot industry words or CV format), alternate job titles to find on indeed.com, and if you find people who transitioned into the field – ask him or her what steps they took. To find these people, you could ask for lists with former students and their jobs now through your alma mater, googling, linkedin, whatever. I've posted about info interviews ten thousand times on metafilter, so rather than retype it you can just go reread.

Oh yeah and your linkedin problem – can’t you change the spelling of your name just a little? There are tons of discussion groups there with people in various fields.

You ask about what steps to take and if I were you I would break it down into 1) a few weeks max to define the job you want, 2) a few info interviews in the next few weeks, and 3) get your CV out there through every possible way (monster, indeed, linkedin, recruiters if they are used in your new industry, etc.).

I would follow the timeline. If you don’t do it, then there is another problem; in that case, approach temp companies (and try out new jobs) or as others suggest, increase your hours.

Although I didn’t have the debt that you have, I also changed careers at close to the same age as you, so you are NOT too old. At the start, I had no idea what career I wanted. No idea whatsoever. I transitioned into a new career within a few months following the timeline and steps above. Ask metafilter was great resource, too,once I identified an industry and job that I wanted (people gave industry appropriate suggestions on a few occasions). Good luck.

posted by Wolfster at 6:58 AM on May 4, 2011 [3 favorites]


I'm also in my mid 30s. I'm also heavily tattooed. I run an accounting department at a prestigious institution. 5 years ago, I was heavily in debt and making $12 an hour doing glorified data entry. Apply to everything you think you are remotely qualified for. Don't convince yourself that it won't happen- I didn't get calls back on things that seemed like gimmes, but I did on several of my huge stretch calls. You have education, you just need to push to make it happen.

Bankruptcy might absolutely be the right choice so you aren't feeling crushed under that debt. Sit down and get a really good picture of your debt, and see if it could be paid off with consistent work. You are doing yourself a huge disservice avoiding networking out of fear of debt.

Also, as some who has hunted for financial sector jobs with horrible credit, I've had much better luck being honest about my financial situation to potential employers. It might not solve everything, but people can be surprisingly understanding about such things.

You can do this.
posted by Zophi at 7:28 AM on May 4, 2011 [1 favorite]


Response by poster: Thank you all for the replies so far - I am trying to just take everything in for now, but I wanted to add a few clarifications/details.

Why I am not pouring everything I have into my current job: It has been one long lesson in how not to start/run a business. It is a sinking ship (the best person just left), and despite his, my, and a few others efforts, the owner seems hell-bent on running it into the ground. The finances are tenuous, and without drastic changes may not last 6 months. This is partly fueling my urgency.

Re: Bankruptcy. This is not off the table, my thinking up to now is that since my debts are in collections, if I am making a decent salary I can start building small lump sums (2k here, 3k there) to settle the various debts. At the end of the day I could settle for ~50% of my total debt, I figure. I guess it is also ego or guilt, that I should pay rather than bankruptcy.

Between Airline/Defense/Oil/Financial/Consulting - is it ok to just apply to stuff in all these areas? Narrowing it down is the step I keep getting stuck on.
posted by no at 9:18 AM on May 4, 2011


my thinking up to now is that since my debts are in collections, if I am making a decent salary I can start building small lump sums (2k here, 3k there) to settle the various debts.

Not likely. If you have enough income to save up $2-3k from time to time, you have enough for creditors to garnish your wages. That means you'll never really be able to get ahead.

I say again: bankruptcy. You are, in fact, bankrupt, in that you are unable to generate sufficient liquidity to meet your credit obligations (and getting a better job isn't really going to fix that) so any shame that is associated with bankruptcy you should be feeling already. Initiating bankruptcy proceedings is basically just getting past the denial part and dealing with it.

Suck it up and call a lawyer.
posted by valkyryn at 9:41 AM on May 4, 2011 [4 favorites]


I've been in a similar situation a few years ago but younger than you, with a somewhat smaller debt and a full time, albeit low-paying job. I did settle some parts of debt for around 50-60%, restructured and paid off the rest of it. It was hard and in retrospect bankruptcy might have been a better idea.

I want to comment on the other things. It sounds like you should have a perspective on relativeness of the issues you listed. On a scale 1 to 100, I would say the tattoo is 2/100, 'debt situation makes me a bad prospect' is 5/100, but this: being overwhelmed at the number and content of job descriptions, none of which I seem to really have interest in or qualify for...and not really applying to anything is like 88/100 or so.

Looking for work is the most annoying, energy-draining and hopeless-feeling occupations. You need to see this clearly and have a strategy for doing it despite its suckiness. It's a goal-oriented task (find a job) and yet you're 99.99% sure that any particular post will be a waste of time and effort. You know, rationally, they you have to do it and I'm sure you've tried to reason with yourself many times. You need to invent some kind of stupid trick to reframe it from being goal-oriented to simply routine. Anything that will work for a few months.
posted by rainy at 10:41 AM on May 4, 2011


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