How do I give and receive "vacuous" compliments graciously?
April 23, 2011 1:19 PM Subscribe
How to give and receive "vacuous" compliments graciously, particularly in relation to artistic work?
I often have trouble accepting compliments about my creative work. I think I have the most trouble with comments that lack specificity.
A claim like, "This is great. You're so talented," puts me on edge. My neck and shoulders tense up and I squeak out a "thank you" or some dismissal of the claim and try to change the subject.
If they narrow down their compliment even a little, like "I like the colours/rhythm/etc." I'm on much firmer ground. I can comment on what I was trying to achieve or if I think it was a happy accident, and then more naturally segue into discussion of technique or of whose work I admire for doing X better than me or whatever. (Or my favourite is if their compliment reveals a perspective of analysis that I could learn more about.)
Of course, I logically understand that not everyone responds how I do, but I am in the habit of only complimenting other people's work in precisely defined and concrete ways. Which would be fine if life were an art critique, but this recent askme illustrates how this might come across as stingy or excessively critical to friends and associates who are much freer with their praise.
How do I get more comfortable with giving this kind of praise without feeling like it's vacuous and superficial? And possibly hand-in-hand with that, how can I be more gracious in receiving it?
Maybe related, how do I "negotiate" as to who would appreciate this kind of praise?
I often have trouble accepting compliments about my creative work. I think I have the most trouble with comments that lack specificity.
A claim like, "This is great. You're so talented," puts me on edge. My neck and shoulders tense up and I squeak out a "thank you" or some dismissal of the claim and try to change the subject.
If they narrow down their compliment even a little, like "I like the colours/rhythm/etc." I'm on much firmer ground. I can comment on what I was trying to achieve or if I think it was a happy accident, and then more naturally segue into discussion of technique or of whose work I admire for doing X better than me or whatever. (Or my favourite is if their compliment reveals a perspective of analysis that I could learn more about.)
Of course, I logically understand that not everyone responds how I do, but I am in the habit of only complimenting other people's work in precisely defined and concrete ways. Which would be fine if life were an art critique, but this recent askme illustrates how this might come across as stingy or excessively critical to friends and associates who are much freer with their praise.
How do I get more comfortable with giving this kind of praise without feeling like it's vacuous and superficial? And possibly hand-in-hand with that, how can I be more gracious in receiving it?
Maybe related, how do I "negotiate" as to who would appreciate this kind of praise?
without feeling like it's vacuous and superficial
But it is. And it's supposed to be. Because no one is as serious about this as you are.
posted by elektrotechnicus at 1:29 PM on April 23, 2011 [13 favorites]
But it is. And it's supposed to be. Because no one is as serious about this as you are.
posted by elektrotechnicus at 1:29 PM on April 23, 2011 [13 favorites]
You'll constantly be sad and anxious when you act as if people have more to do with you than they actually do. The people who see your work, like it, and say that they like it, are not your professors or critics or anyone else who is paid to view your work finely and to express some sort of itemized list of things about it. They are just people looking at art.
It sounds like you want this sort of relatively fine-tuned analysis, and that you regard more general compliments as being "vacuous" and "superficial." This is putting an inordinate amount of effort onto other people in order for you to feel comfortable and to feel that they are being something other than vacuous or superficial.
Value compliments when you get them. Not everyone gets compliments. The polite, respectful response to a general compliment is "thank you." Thank them and move on with your life.
And if you're insecure about general compliments - fine, so some people might get polite compliments even when people aren't over the moon about their work. This happens to everyone else, so why not you? Appreciate it all the more when people do give you more detailed feedback, especially since you know that you can't always get that.
posted by Sticherbeast at 1:32 PM on April 23, 2011 [9 favorites]
It sounds like you want this sort of relatively fine-tuned analysis, and that you regard more general compliments as being "vacuous" and "superficial." This is putting an inordinate amount of effort onto other people in order for you to feel comfortable and to feel that they are being something other than vacuous or superficial.
Value compliments when you get them. Not everyone gets compliments. The polite, respectful response to a general compliment is "thank you." Thank them and move on with your life.
And if you're insecure about general compliments - fine, so some people might get polite compliments even when people aren't over the moon about their work. This happens to everyone else, so why not you? Appreciate it all the more when people do give you more detailed feedback, especially since you know that you can't always get that.
posted by Sticherbeast at 1:32 PM on April 23, 2011 [9 favorites]
I have quite a few incredibly talented friends, who send me their work from time to time. I really, really love the work that they do, but I always worry that my praise comes off as hollow, because I'm pretty bad at doing analysis and coming up with the kind of specific things you're talking about; partially because I don't always have the necessary knowledge of the field to use the right vocabulary, and partially because it's just not how I approach art. It doesn't, in any way, devalue their work or undermine how much I actually like it. So do try to keep in mind that when people say "That's great!" or something equally insubstantial, it doesn't necessarily mean they're not genuine.
Also, there's an episode of 30 Rock that features lots of flashbacks of Jenna's various terrible creative endeavors, and Liz making up progressively more specific nice things to say so that she doesn't have to comment on the production as a whole.
posted by you're a kitty! at 1:32 PM on April 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
Also, there's an episode of 30 Rock that features lots of flashbacks of Jenna's various terrible creative endeavors, and Liz making up progressively more specific nice things to say so that she doesn't have to comment on the production as a whole.
posted by you're a kitty! at 1:32 PM on April 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
"Thank you so much! I'm so fortunate that the art I enjoy making also seems to strike a chord with other folks!"
"Thank you so much! I had a lot of fun with this one!"
"Thanks! It didn't turn out the way I expected, but I ended up liking where it decided to go!"
"Wow, thanks! I got to play with a new paint here and I really liked working with it!"
-- compliments are a gift; your job is to receive them graciously, so people can have a nice little feedback loop about telling you they like a thing you made, even though they're not conversant with the jargon. That takes guts - how do I compliment my brother about the custom race car he built out of an old station wagon? I have no frickin idea, what do I know about cars? So I say "you're so awesome to make something like this, it's fantastic!" and because he is gracious, and doesn't want me to feel dumb, he thanks me with enthusiasm as if my opinion were on par with [insert famous car customizing hotrod guy] and he gives me a few snippets in small words to make me feel included. It sounds patronizing; it's really not. No one can be an expert on everything, and it's grounding and balanced to have folks in your circle who come from diverse backgrounds and varied interests - let them enjoy your stuff and go ahead and enjoy theirs even if you don't have the specialist words. Don't let them be made uncomfortable by complimenting you - let them enjoy giving you that little gift!
tl;dr: pretend you're Mr Rogers, do it like he would.
honestly, that advice would steer you right in more situations than not, I think.
posted by Lou Stuells at 1:44 PM on April 23, 2011 [22 favorites]
"Thank you so much! I had a lot of fun with this one!"
"Thanks! It didn't turn out the way I expected, but I ended up liking where it decided to go!"
"Wow, thanks! I got to play with a new paint here and I really liked working with it!"
-- compliments are a gift; your job is to receive them graciously, so people can have a nice little feedback loop about telling you they like a thing you made, even though they're not conversant with the jargon. That takes guts - how do I compliment my brother about the custom race car he built out of an old station wagon? I have no frickin idea, what do I know about cars? So I say "you're so awesome to make something like this, it's fantastic!" and because he is gracious, and doesn't want me to feel dumb, he thanks me with enthusiasm as if my opinion were on par with [insert famous car customizing hotrod guy] and he gives me a few snippets in small words to make me feel included. It sounds patronizing; it's really not. No one can be an expert on everything, and it's grounding and balanced to have folks in your circle who come from diverse backgrounds and varied interests - let them enjoy your stuff and go ahead and enjoy theirs even if you don't have the specialist words. Don't let them be made uncomfortable by complimenting you - let them enjoy giving you that little gift!
tl;dr: pretend you're Mr Rogers, do it like he would.
honestly, that advice would steer you right in more situations than not, I think.
posted by Lou Stuells at 1:44 PM on April 23, 2011 [22 favorites]
Re: receiving compliments, one lesson I clearly remember learning in college - studying performing arts, but I think it applies to fine arts as well - is, "Always be gracious when someone compliments your work, because you don't know who they are." I heard this but it didn't really sink in until I had a shitty part in a play, and some guy said I did well afterwords, and I was like "Yeah, thanks, whatever." And then I found out he was the dean. Even if you do know who they are, you never know who they'll be or what might happen in the future. So just smile and say thank you.
And, what you're a kitty! says is very true. Not everyone knows the right words for these kinds of things, sometimes "That was good!" is the only way they have of expressing it. And there's nothing wrong with that. Personally as long as they don't say "That sucked," I'm happy enough!
posted by DestinationUnknown at 1:56 PM on April 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
And, what you're a kitty! says is very true. Not everyone knows the right words for these kinds of things, sometimes "That was good!" is the only way they have of expressing it. And there's nothing wrong with that. Personally as long as they don't say "That sucked," I'm happy enough!
posted by DestinationUnknown at 1:56 PM on April 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
Hard to answer. But as someone who goes through art galleries, it always makes me feel awkward when the artist is standing right by their artwork, visibly vibrating with your excitement at showing your work. I feel like I HAVE to say something, no matter how I feel about the artwork. If the artist responds to my vague but friendly compliment with a long treatise on the treatment of color in modern art, or waxes philosophically about the nature of life, I feel uncomfortable and a little annoyed.
Our social contract was broken. I am a guest in the gallery, observing artwork, and you are the artist. As the guest, I feel contractually like I must thank you for allowing me to experience your artwork, but not necessarily that I want to be in a long conversation. Also, if you hang around the artwork, people will feel obligated to engage with you. If you don't want empty compliments, hang out away from the artwork but leave an artist's bio up with your picture. People will be able to ID you from that and seek you out if they have a specific compliment or want to have a conversation.
I'd say:
Vague compliment: Vague response with a sincere, open smile "Thanks! I'm so glad you were able to make it to the show." Hand them your Moo card or a flier for your next show, and if they want to talk some more, they'll take it from there.
Compliment: Friendly two-liner response with a friendly, open smile "I know, I love cows, too! Thanks for coming out." Hand them your card/flier, let them take it from there.
Specific compliment: Specific and longer response "With this piece, I really wanted to evoke a sense of melancholy with my use of color on the cow's spots . . . "
Specific compliment and question: Conversation This person might want to have a more lengthy conversation and is certainly interested in a response to their question.
posted by arnicae at 2:10 PM on April 23, 2011 [4 favorites]
Our social contract was broken. I am a guest in the gallery, observing artwork, and you are the artist. As the guest, I feel contractually like I must thank you for allowing me to experience your artwork, but not necessarily that I want to be in a long conversation. Also, if you hang around the artwork, people will feel obligated to engage with you. If you don't want empty compliments, hang out away from the artwork but leave an artist's bio up with your picture. People will be able to ID you from that and seek you out if they have a specific compliment or want to have a conversation.
I'd say:
Vague compliment: Vague response with a sincere, open smile "Thanks! I'm so glad you were able to make it to the show." Hand them your Moo card or a flier for your next show, and if they want to talk some more, they'll take it from there.
Compliment: Friendly two-liner response with a friendly, open smile "I know, I love cows, too! Thanks for coming out." Hand them your card/flier, let them take it from there.
Specific compliment: Specific and longer response "With this piece, I really wanted to evoke a sense of melancholy with my use of color on the cow's spots . . . "
Specific compliment and question: Conversation This person might want to have a more lengthy conversation and is certainly interested in a response to their question.
posted by arnicae at 2:10 PM on April 23, 2011 [4 favorites]
Compliments, vague or specific, are part of the social exchange. We use them to let other people know that we value something they've done. Lack of specific detail in a compliment doesn't necessarily make it less genuine; sometimes people who aren't as conversant with the subject as you are will not know how to craft a more specific compliment, but they still want to tell you they liked your work.
So...you pretty much can't go wrong with "Thank you" as a response to any genuine compliment. It takes practice, but it really does make things nicer for everyone--including you, the recipient, because when you get accustomed to responding that way, you'll stop stressing out so much about WHAT DID THEY MEAN BY THAT or I WISH THEY'D BE MORE SPECIFIC. Thank the person for the compliment; if you feel like it you can add more detail as Lou Stuells suggests; then move on.
How do I get more comfortable with giving this kind of praise without feeling like it's vacuous and superficial?
Well, you say you're more comfortable giving praise in specific, concrete ways. So do that. If you don't like the work, or can't find something specific to praise, you don't have to lie about it, but you might want to say something kind that acknowledges the person's effort.
Perhaps you feel like praise loses its value if it is given out too generously. I agree with that--in an academic or professional context. But in a social context? It's OK to just be nice.
posted by hurdy gurdy girl at 2:20 PM on April 23, 2011
So...you pretty much can't go wrong with "Thank you" as a response to any genuine compliment. It takes practice, but it really does make things nicer for everyone--including you, the recipient, because when you get accustomed to responding that way, you'll stop stressing out so much about WHAT DID THEY MEAN BY THAT or I WISH THEY'D BE MORE SPECIFIC. Thank the person for the compliment; if you feel like it you can add more detail as Lou Stuells suggests; then move on.
How do I get more comfortable with giving this kind of praise without feeling like it's vacuous and superficial?
Well, you say you're more comfortable giving praise in specific, concrete ways. So do that. If you don't like the work, or can't find something specific to praise, you don't have to lie about it, but you might want to say something kind that acknowledges the person's effort.
Perhaps you feel like praise loses its value if it is given out too generously. I agree with that--in an academic or professional context. But in a social context? It's OK to just be nice.
posted by hurdy gurdy girl at 2:20 PM on April 23, 2011
You say "thank you," and if this is a problem then you practice getting better at being gracious. Your "firmer ground" upon hearing more specific critiques sounds to me like you're requiring people to validate your work the way that you want in order for you to take their words seriously, and that simply is not a random fan's duty. They're just trying to be supportive.
In order to get better at giving simple praise, maybe you could ingratiate yourself to people whose work you only sort of like, or like one aspect. If you want to use complimenting others as an avenue to getting better at receiving compliments, don't include the "one aspect" in your compliment. Give them simple praise and see how they take it. I bet more often than not they say...wait for it..."thank you." If they go into more detail, then you can see where that goes, if anywhere.
More pointedly, requiring an articulated reason to like something is a hallmark of snobbery.
posted by rhizome at 2:36 PM on April 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
In order to get better at giving simple praise, maybe you could ingratiate yourself to people whose work you only sort of like, or like one aspect. If you want to use complimenting others as an avenue to getting better at receiving compliments, don't include the "one aspect" in your compliment. Give them simple praise and see how they take it. I bet more often than not they say...wait for it..."thank you." If they go into more detail, then you can see where that goes, if anywhere.
More pointedly, requiring an articulated reason to like something is a hallmark of snobbery.
posted by rhizome at 2:36 PM on April 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
This might sound trite, but people can like things (even marvel at them) without being at all able to describe why they do so -- and this certainly need not imply that they're being superficial. Quite frankly, art wouldn't exist without this instinctual and emotional foundation. Intellectual reactions might be great and all, but don't expect everyone to be able to reduce art to art theory: allow them to appreciate art for its own sake.
posted by matlock expressway at 2:42 PM on April 23, 2011 [7 favorites]
posted by matlock expressway at 2:42 PM on April 23, 2011 [7 favorites]
I would love it if I vaguely complimented some awesome artwork - vague because I'm intimidated and don't want to say something silly, or because I really don't know off the top of my head exactly why I like it, or because I don't want to take up too much of the artist's time - and the artist engaged me by saying thanks and asking what specifically was drawing my attention.
posted by pluot at 2:51 PM on April 23, 2011
posted by pluot at 2:51 PM on April 23, 2011
I am trying really, really hard not to be snarky here. But as someone who has spent plenty of time in galleries, and who often does not usually feel ready to give a detailed compliment to an artist about their work but prefers to simply say, "thanks, I enjoyed this", I think you should really try to swallow your own awkwardness and simply reply with a gracious "thank you for coming" or "I'm glad you liked it." Honestly, as others have mentioned, not everybody feels comfortable getting into a detailed discourse on art, especially with an artist, so you should really try to accept that and, uh, get over yourself a bit.
posted by ladybird at 2:53 PM on April 23, 2011 [3 favorites]
posted by ladybird at 2:53 PM on April 23, 2011 [3 favorites]
Giving
A good way to give a non-specific compliment is to smile at someone.
Receiving
Treat the non-specific compliment as a verbal smile. Smile back. Non-verbally is okay.
Alternatively, ask a question in response. "Really? What do you like about it?" People love being asked about their point of view...if they have one. Alternatively, they don't have one, and they drift away.
Dogs bark. Infants babble. Adults engage in social niceties.
Not all dogs bark. Not all infants babble. Not all adults engage in social niceties.
Dogs that don't bark don't begrudge those that do. Ditto for infants. What's wrong here?
posted by perspicio at 2:59 PM on April 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
A good way to give a non-specific compliment is to smile at someone.
Receiving
Treat the non-specific compliment as a verbal smile. Smile back. Non-verbally is okay.
Alternatively, ask a question in response. "Really? What do you like about it?" People love being asked about their point of view...if they have one. Alternatively, they don't have one, and they drift away.
Dogs bark. Infants babble. Adults engage in social niceties.
Not all dogs bark. Not all infants babble. Not all adults engage in social niceties.
Dogs that don't bark don't begrudge those that do. Ditto for infants. What's wrong here?
posted by perspicio at 2:59 PM on April 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
How do I get more comfortable with giving this kind of praise without feeling like it's vacuous and superficial?
I might feel differently about this kind of stuff since I review professionally, but I have no problem heaping on the copious praise when I mean it--but only when I really mean it. I'm not into giving out this praise casually, because I feel it degrades the worth of genuine praise when I give it. And, er, I'm not into "just be nice rhetoric" whether in social or professional contexts. I'm generally a nice person, but I don't have to kiss someone's butt about how talented they are in order to qualify as "nice."
So, curmudgeon that I am, I say, keep on keeping on. But then, I think my life is better without worrying about high-maintenance friends who require creative validation in casual contexts.
And possibly hand-in-hand with that, how can I be more gracious in receiving it?
In the immortal words of Garth Algar, just say thank you.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 3:00 PM on April 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
I might feel differently about this kind of stuff since I review professionally, but I have no problem heaping on the copious praise when I mean it--but only when I really mean it. I'm not into giving out this praise casually, because I feel it degrades the worth of genuine praise when I give it. And, er, I'm not into "just be nice rhetoric" whether in social or professional contexts. I'm generally a nice person, but I don't have to kiss someone's butt about how talented they are in order to qualify as "nice."
So, curmudgeon that I am, I say, keep on keeping on. But then, I think my life is better without worrying about high-maintenance friends who require creative validation in casual contexts.
And possibly hand-in-hand with that, how can I be more gracious in receiving it?
In the immortal words of Garth Algar, just say thank you.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 3:00 PM on April 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
A lot of them are just conversational strokes. General compliments often mean "I recognize that you've done this, congratulations, it's good, now let's talk about something else." That's okay, they can like it without it being their thing.
"That's great" can also mean "wow, I really love this, and I can't think of anything specific to say because it's all great." Sometimes people give more specific compliments when they don't like something but feel obligated to give some sort of sincere praise.
Consider, also, that some people get tired of talking about their work, especially in casual contexts, and maybe people are trying to be polite by keeping it brief and giving you an out. I do this. Imagine being well-known for a specific piece, or a specific characteristic in your work, and everyone you meet wants to talk about that. It'd probably get awfully old, especially if you're trying to branch out creatively, or if you're just trying to hang out and have a conversation that isn't about you.
Additionally, most laypeople don't really know the intricacies of various arts. If they got as specific as you'd like, you'd probably get annoyed fast, because they'll get things wrong. Someone will mistake your etchings for drawings, or assume that because you're a graphic novelist you've seen every superhero movie this decade.
posted by Metroid Baby at 3:14 PM on April 23, 2011
"That's great" can also mean "wow, I really love this, and I can't think of anything specific to say because it's all great." Sometimes people give more specific compliments when they don't like something but feel obligated to give some sort of sincere praise.
Consider, also, that some people get tired of talking about their work, especially in casual contexts, and maybe people are trying to be polite by keeping it brief and giving you an out. I do this. Imagine being well-known for a specific piece, or a specific characteristic in your work, and everyone you meet wants to talk about that. It'd probably get awfully old, especially if you're trying to branch out creatively, or if you're just trying to hang out and have a conversation that isn't about you.
Additionally, most laypeople don't really know the intricacies of various arts. If they got as specific as you'd like, you'd probably get annoyed fast, because they'll get things wrong. Someone will mistake your etchings for drawings, or assume that because you're a graphic novelist you've seen every superhero movie this decade.
posted by Metroid Baby at 3:14 PM on April 23, 2011
In the immortal words of Garth Algar, just say thank you.
When I was a kid at sleep-away camp, I had a counselor who had some sort of advice-of-the-day calendar or something she'd read to us as we were lining up to go to breakfast. I only remember one: Just say thank you.
She made us do it all day, too, whenever anyone gave us compliment.
I tend to do the apology thank you: Oh, thank you, but....
JUST SAY THANK YOU.
It's hard, because frequently we're trained by the world around us to minimize our awesomeness, so it becomes awkward when someone points it out. But you don't make that better by making the compliment giver feel bad-which is what all those responses that are not JUST THANK YOU do.
You have to practice. I find repeating that phrase in my head as the compliment is coming in can be helpful. And I fail at it plenty. But, really, that's all you have to do. Just say "thank you".
posted by atomicstone at 3:18 PM on April 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
When I was a kid at sleep-away camp, I had a counselor who had some sort of advice-of-the-day calendar or something she'd read to us as we were lining up to go to breakfast. I only remember one: Just say thank you.
She made us do it all day, too, whenever anyone gave us compliment.
I tend to do the apology thank you: Oh, thank you, but....
JUST SAY THANK YOU.
It's hard, because frequently we're trained by the world around us to minimize our awesomeness, so it becomes awkward when someone points it out. But you don't make that better by making the compliment giver feel bad-which is what all those responses that are not JUST THANK YOU do.
You have to practice. I find repeating that phrase in my head as the compliment is coming in can be helpful. And I fail at it plenty. But, really, that's all you have to do. Just say "thank you".
posted by atomicstone at 3:18 PM on April 23, 2011 [2 favorites]
When receiving a vacuous compliment, supply your own specifics.
Person X: "This is great. You're so talented."
RobotHero: "Thanks, I did a lot of work on the [colors / rhythm / shading / whatever] and I'm pleased with how it came out."
I don't know why, but this always makes me feel better when I receive a compliment that seems rote.
posted by Orinda at 3:29 PM on April 23, 2011
Person X: "This is great. You're so talented."
RobotHero: "Thanks, I did a lot of work on the [colors / rhythm / shading / whatever] and I'm pleased with how it came out."
I don't know why, but this always makes me feel better when I receive a compliment that seems rote.
posted by Orinda at 3:29 PM on April 23, 2011
I'm that person, and I'm probably saying that because I have no clue about art. Don't get me wrong: I'm neither dumb nor vacuous, as you'd discover if you asked my opinion about your policy analysis or research methodology. But I float through art shows like a three-year-old: "prettttty" "ooh, ugly!" "what's that?" "I want to touch it!" If I hate it, I'll try to leave immediately, but if I find you to say I like it, I like it. At that point, I'm in awe and scared, almost like you were this wizard who caused something beautiful to appear out of almost nothing, using dirt and sticks and goo. I'm not complimenting your shading because I don't know you shaded it. So take pity on us mere mortals and don't be too judgmental of our inarticulate babbling.
posted by salvia at 3:58 PM on April 23, 2011 [9 favorites]
posted by salvia at 3:58 PM on April 23, 2011 [9 favorites]
This is a great question and I'm glad that you're getting some varied responses.
1. Keep your deep conversations with your peers, confidants and those who show genuine interest.
2. Everyone else is pedestrian. (As mentioned above, treat them with courtesy, because you don't know who they are or might be.)
As to making shallow or vapid comments yourself, why would you if you so dislike it?
Or...
You see promise in the work and you're just being supportive. You KNOW you can't give a proper critique...face to face...to a total stranger.
More pointedly, requiring an articulated reason to like something is a hallmark of snobbery. This made me laugh because it is so true, but there's nothing wrong with a little snobbery, it just goes with the territory...that is to say, as an artist, sometimes I feel like I'm speaking a completely different language than the folks around me.
One last note; I've seen really brilliant artists resort to making gimmicky touristy crap to get by and it's incredibly sad. So as a case in point, you may find that what you're doing is being the best seller of your goods.
Best of luck to you!
posted by snsranch at 3:59 PM on April 23, 2011
1. Keep your deep conversations with your peers, confidants and those who show genuine interest.
2. Everyone else is pedestrian. (As mentioned above, treat them with courtesy, because you don't know who they are or might be.)
As to making shallow or vapid comments yourself, why would you if you so dislike it?
Or...
You see promise in the work and you're just being supportive. You KNOW you can't give a proper critique...face to face...to a total stranger.
More pointedly, requiring an articulated reason to like something is a hallmark of snobbery. This made me laugh because it is so true, but there's nothing wrong with a little snobbery, it just goes with the territory...that is to say, as an artist, sometimes I feel like I'm speaking a completely different language than the folks around me.
One last note; I've seen really brilliant artists resort to making gimmicky touristy crap to get by and it's incredibly sad. So as a case in point, you may find that what you're doing is being the best seller of your goods.
Best of luck to you!
posted by snsranch at 3:59 PM on April 23, 2011
I'm not sure if you attended art or design school, but in my experiences there (design school) we had class and individual critique sessions, in which we gave very specific feedback to each other. The more specific, the easier it was to understand and learn from, and usually vague or noncommittal critiques meant that the one critiquing the work didn't like it.
This does not translate to non-designers and non-artists. People who aren't trained in the arts don't have the knowledge or the visual literacy to give that kind of response, most of the time. I've found that when people give that vague feedback they're sincere, and the best/easiest response has been a sincere "Thank you! I appreciate hearing when people like my work."
And that's that. Any more detailed response (or visible anxiety at the comment) and you can end up looking like arrogant or insecure.
posted by lockstitch at 5:03 PM on April 23, 2011
This does not translate to non-designers and non-artists. People who aren't trained in the arts don't have the knowledge or the visual literacy to give that kind of response, most of the time. I've found that when people give that vague feedback they're sincere, and the best/easiest response has been a sincere "Thank you! I appreciate hearing when people like my work."
And that's that. Any more detailed response (or visible anxiety at the comment) and you can end up looking like arrogant or insecure.
posted by lockstitch at 5:03 PM on April 23, 2011
Vacuous and superficial praise can mean the person didn't really like it and is just being polite. If you want the truth out of them, well, you might not like the truth so just say thanks and don't push it. Getting technical tips from fellow practitioners is a different kettle of fish as they might not like what you've done but could still suggest ways of doing it better. If getting praise makes you feel uncomfortable then don't solicit it, your art is no good if it doesn't speak for itself anyway.
posted by joannemullen at 5:19 PM on April 23, 2011
posted by joannemullen at 5:19 PM on April 23, 2011
I remember when I gave my First Serious Screenplay (Like, For Reals) to be critiqued. He spent the better part of the day reading it and, when finished, looked up at me and said "it's good".
"And?" I demanded.
"And nothing," he said "It's just really good."
I just about flew out of my skin. I had spent all this time weaving a complex, epic story with strong characters and lovingly crafted lines and "good" is the best you can do?!?
What about my allusions to ancient mythology? The dualistic nature of the hero and the villain? The satisfying ending that leaves just enough room for a sequel? You MUST have an opinion on those things! It's what I spent the most time on!
Later on, I saw the folly in my own selfishness. The truth is, most people don't read scripts or novels (or watch movies or TV shows) like that. When "normal" people watch The Matrix they see Kung-Fu, guns and robots instead of the deep undercurrent of gnostic philosophy/questioning reality that the Watchowski bros. tried to cram in there. People "feel" a work of art first and MAYBE, possibly, think about it later. This is actually normal human behavior. Us artistic types are actually the freaks who can't appreciate a creative work without seeing it's roots in 19th century German Romanticism or whatever.
A big part of being a successful artist is the act of getting over yourself. The act of realizing that 99.9% of all the human beings who have ever lived would probably see your art, scratch their heads and go "huh" -- and that this is okay.
Nowadays, when my friend reads my stuff and says "it's good", I'm pleased because I know that he means it. I say "thanks" and invite him out for a drink. That's how it works, I guess.
posted by Avenger at 7:50 PM on April 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
"And?" I demanded.
"And nothing," he said "It's just really good."
I just about flew out of my skin. I had spent all this time weaving a complex, epic story with strong characters and lovingly crafted lines and "good" is the best you can do?!?
What about my allusions to ancient mythology? The dualistic nature of the hero and the villain? The satisfying ending that leaves just enough room for a sequel? You MUST have an opinion on those things! It's what I spent the most time on!
Later on, I saw the folly in my own selfishness. The truth is, most people don't read scripts or novels (or watch movies or TV shows) like that. When "normal" people watch The Matrix they see Kung-Fu, guns and robots instead of the deep undercurrent of gnostic philosophy/questioning reality that the Watchowski bros. tried to cram in there. People "feel" a work of art first and MAYBE, possibly, think about it later. This is actually normal human behavior. Us artistic types are actually the freaks who can't appreciate a creative work without seeing it's roots in 19th century German Romanticism or whatever.
A big part of being a successful artist is the act of getting over yourself. The act of realizing that 99.9% of all the human beings who have ever lived would probably see your art, scratch their heads and go "huh" -- and that this is okay.
Nowadays, when my friend reads my stuff and says "it's good", I'm pleased because I know that he means it. I say "thanks" and invite him out for a drink. That's how it works, I guess.
posted by Avenger at 7:50 PM on April 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
I own a couple art supply stores and get invited to openings and people bring stuff in to show me and all of my employees paint and I really have nothing left to say that sounds sincere after 13 years of this constant barrage of images. If I really like something, I might say "I wish I still had some wallspace."
The two people who have worked in my stores and made it in the art world never cared what anyone said and they sold art to people who were trying to match color schemes in their houses. They have more discriminating customers now.
I've a guy working here now who I think is going to rule the art world. He is self promotional in a very low key way and gets people to his shows and expects nothing.
posted by Mr. Yuck at 8:28 PM on April 23, 2011
The two people who have worked in my stores and made it in the art world never cared what anyone said and they sold art to people who were trying to match color schemes in their houses. They have more discriminating customers now.
I've a guy working here now who I think is going to rule the art world. He is self promotional in a very low key way and gets people to his shows and expects nothing.
posted by Mr. Yuck at 8:28 PM on April 23, 2011
Avenger's got it. It's kinda unrealistic to expect your audience to be able deconstruct their feelings about your art right there in front of you. If they like it, you win. Say "Thanks" to show your genuine appreciation for their compliment.
posted by Aquaman at 9:20 PM on April 23, 2011
posted by Aquaman at 9:20 PM on April 23, 2011
Response by poster: Hahaa. Yeah, maybe I just need to lighten up about it.
Today, I ate a pie, and I said to the person who made it, "This is a really great pie!" And they said thanks. And it didn't occur to me until after, that it's the same basic interaction, only without the part where I over-think everything.
posted by RobotHero at 10:55 PM on April 23, 2011 [7 favorites]
Today, I ate a pie, and I said to the person who made it, "This is a really great pie!" And they said thanks. And it didn't occur to me until after, that it's the same basic interaction, only without the part where I over-think everything.
posted by RobotHero at 10:55 PM on April 23, 2011 [7 favorites]
That pie thing is an excellent comparison. You weren't like, "great job -- these cherries were sliced so evenly that they cooked quite consistently" or whatever. :)
posted by salvia at 11:09 PM on April 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by salvia at 11:09 PM on April 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
On giving: I try not to make judgement calls or pronouncements. I try to share my reaction. Rather than say something is good, I say "Wow, I really enjoyed that song a lot!"
posted by cccorlew at 10:15 AM on April 24, 2011
posted by cccorlew at 10:15 AM on April 24, 2011
I think sometimes this comes up when you're really excited to talk about work and hear how someone else sees it. I try to have some questions ready for people. Something that can be helpful to me without alienating the viewer. Like, "This is the newest one in the series and I wonder if it's too different from the others; do you think it fits in?" Or, "People have been saying this one feels scary; do you get that from it too?"
posted by xo at 10:30 AM on April 24, 2011
posted by xo at 10:30 AM on April 24, 2011
I just heard someone on the radio quote CS Lewis saying "we long to praise that which we enjoy. Praise completes the experience of enjoyment." Maybe you could view the praise to you as being for the viewer's own pleasure and receive it as such, like "I'm so glad you enjoyed it," or "well I'm very happy you were here. Thank you for coming."
posted by salvia at 11:01 AM on April 24, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by salvia at 11:01 AM on April 24, 2011 [2 favorites]
Following salvia's comment, this seems apposite.
Last year, when shopping, I saw a well-known older comedian being approached by someone who recognised him. The comedian had just popped into the local store to buy a newspaper and as he was leaving the store the fan went up to him in order to say hello and make a comment about the comedian's work. I didn't hear the man's specific comment, but what I did hear was the comedian's reply, which was a simple, warmly delivered, 'Thank you. You are very kind.'
posted by davemack at 2:25 PM on April 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
Last year, when shopping, I saw a well-known older comedian being approached by someone who recognised him. The comedian had just popped into the local store to buy a newspaper and as he was leaving the store the fan went up to him in order to say hello and make a comment about the comedian's work. I didn't hear the man's specific comment, but what I did hear was the comedian's reply, which was a simple, warmly delivered, 'Thank you. You are very kind.'
posted by davemack at 2:25 PM on April 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by knilstad at 1:26 PM on April 23, 2011