How do we re-distribute rent to accommodate for a move-in girlfriend?
January 4, 2011 12:57 PM Subscribe
My roommate's girlfriend moved into our three bedroom apartment and we're about to re-sign the lease. I think we should take the new person into account and re-distribute the rent to accommodate for a fourth roommate, but what is the most fair way to do this?
The layout of the apartment is such that there are two normal bedrooms and one master with it's own bathroom and two large closets. The master, aside from having a private bathroom and closets, also has significantly more space and is also the quietest room in the apartment. It's a very large apartment with a big living room and kitchen which we all share and use. Utilities are included in the rent.
Currently we have the rent divided as $900, $900, $1150. The couple would like to keep paying $1150, but just splitting it between the two of them since they are sharing one room.
However, I think it is unfair for two people in the apartment to pay half as much rent while still getting the primo room.
I would like to have rent such that everyone would end up paying roughly an equivalent rate, as we had it when there were three people. For example, we did not charge the master at double the rate as the smaller rooms even though it is much larger and has significant amenities.
I get along with these roommates very well, and consider them to be good friends. Really, I just want help coming up with a solution so that everyone in the apartment is comfortable with the arrangement. Thanks!
The layout of the apartment is such that there are two normal bedrooms and one master with it's own bathroom and two large closets. The master, aside from having a private bathroom and closets, also has significantly more space and is also the quietest room in the apartment. It's a very large apartment with a big living room and kitchen which we all share and use. Utilities are included in the rent.
Currently we have the rent divided as $900, $900, $1150. The couple would like to keep paying $1150, but just splitting it between the two of them since they are sharing one room.
However, I think it is unfair for two people in the apartment to pay half as much rent while still getting the primo room.
I would like to have rent such that everyone would end up paying roughly an equivalent rate, as we had it when there were three people. For example, we did not charge the master at double the rate as the smaller rooms even though it is much larger and has significant amenities.
I get along with these roommates very well, and consider them to be good friends. Really, I just want help coming up with a solution so that everyone in the apartment is comfortable with the arrangement. Thanks!
How are you doing utilities? It may be an easier sell to split utilities four ways, which should reduce your costs significantly, than to readjust the rent. (That being said, I totally feel you on the rent. Having an extra person in the house is a burden on everyone.)
posted by restless_nomad at 1:02 PM on January 4, 2011
posted by restless_nomad at 1:02 PM on January 4, 2011
Looks like utilities are covered in rent. I'd suggest sitting down with your roommates and discussing this. If they are as laid back as you make them out to be, then it shouldn't be an issue.
posted by TheBones at 1:05 PM on January 4, 2011
posted by TheBones at 1:05 PM on January 4, 2011
Split the rent equally between the 4 people. I just can't see how any other method would be equally fair for everyone.
posted by malibustacey9999 at 1:05 PM on January 4, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by malibustacey9999 at 1:05 PM on January 4, 2011 [2 favorites]
Why not just divide the rent by 4? That's about $740 per person. If they state that they should pay less because they are sharing a room, point out that the living room and kitchen are still shared space, and then offer to make a concession where you and the other roommate pay 800+800, and they pay 675+675.
Ultimately, though, it only seems fair if you start off on the assumption that the rent should be split 4 ways.
posted by KokuRyu at 1:06 PM on January 4, 2011 [1 favorite]
Ultimately, though, it only seems fair if you start off on the assumption that the rent should be split 4 ways.
posted by KokuRyu at 1:06 PM on January 4, 2011 [1 favorite]
I think it was an error not to charge more for the private room in the first place, but what's done is done.
I do think the $900 renters deserve a discount for having to share the living room and kitchen with one other person. Coming up with a solution that seems fair to everyone is the point of negotiation! Offer $800 $800 $1350 (split two ways in $650 and $650 this is still a really good deal for them) or even $750 $750 $1450 (which is $725 each) and see where they go from there.
In the future, try to charge per square foot at the outset, taking in to account shared space.
posted by muddgirl at 1:06 PM on January 4, 2011 [4 favorites]
I do think the $900 renters deserve a discount for having to share the living room and kitchen with one other person. Coming up with a solution that seems fair to everyone is the point of negotiation! Offer $800 $800 $1350 (split two ways in $650 and $650 this is still a really good deal for them) or even $750 $750 $1450 (which is $725 each) and see where they go from there.
In the future, try to charge per square foot at the outset, taking in to account shared space.
posted by muddgirl at 1:06 PM on January 4, 2011 [4 favorites]
I think the problem here is with the way you are wording/framing this issue.
It sounds jealous or petty somehow, when the issue is really you are all sharing the space with one extra person.
The problem is the flip-flopping about the value of the master bedroom. Is everyone equal, or is the master worth a premium??
You're going to have a hard sell on this.
I would try for a small offset for the extra person - say $75 - making it $825, $825, and 1300. Otherwise, I can't see bringing this up being worth the bad feelings over the next year.
posted by jbenben at 1:06 PM on January 4, 2011 [4 favorites]
It sounds jealous or petty somehow, when the issue is really you are all sharing the space with one extra person.
The problem is the flip-flopping about the value of the master bedroom. Is everyone equal, or is the master worth a premium??
You're going to have a hard sell on this.
I would try for a small offset for the extra person - say $75 - making it $825, $825, and 1300. Otherwise, I can't see bringing this up being worth the bad feelings over the next year.
posted by jbenben at 1:06 PM on January 4, 2011 [4 favorites]
Best answer: Yeah, I agree $737.50 each is a lot fairer than $900 for you two and $575 each for them in an ensuite master bedroom. The other option is to suggest switching, they can each have their own bedroom at $900 each and you and the other room-mate are willing to share the master for $1150 together. According to them that would be fair, right?
posted by saucysault at 1:09 PM on January 4, 2011 [6 favorites]
posted by saucysault at 1:09 PM on January 4, 2011 [6 favorites]
Additionally, is the landlord going to increase the rent because there is an extra person on the lease?
If that comes up, the couple should absorb that extra cost as well.
posted by jbenben at 1:11 PM on January 4, 2011 [2 favorites]
If that comes up, the couple should absorb that extra cost as well.
posted by jbenben at 1:11 PM on January 4, 2011 [2 favorites]
either equal across all four, or divided up by sq. foot. another person in the house, especially creating a couple dynamic in the house changes everything and agreements should be reconsidered.
posted by nadawi at 1:13 PM on January 4, 2011
posted by nadawi at 1:13 PM on January 4, 2011
One way that I've thought was sensible in the past was to take not only the size of the bedrooms into consideration, but also the size of the public area.
posted by jangie at 1:14 PM on January 4, 2011
posted by jangie at 1:14 PM on January 4, 2011
They shouldn't get to pay that much less since the girlfriend's introduction into the apartment is going to also make less space in the common areas. 4 people is much harder than 3. Make them pay about 75-100 more each (which will still be significantly less than if they had rented one room, but makes up for the fact that you won't be getting 1/3 of a common space anymore).
posted by 200burritos at 1:14 PM on January 4, 2011
posted by 200burritos at 1:14 PM on January 4, 2011
The master...is also the quietest room in the apartment.
Not with a couple in it, it won't be! HONH HONH
Split the rent equally four ways. That way, your rent is lowered and the rent is still divvied out fairly. It would be unfair for you to take on an extra person without an accompanying reduction in your rent. It's still fair that each half of the couple pays what you pay, because moving in with your partner does involve a bit of sacrifice (loss of privacy), and the benefit of having a larger room dissipates when it's hosting more than one person.
Alternatively, you could adjust the rent slightly to reflect their private bathroom, so that you'd pay $700 $700 $775 $775. It's still a good deal for everyone, and there's no attempt to punitively charge anyone more.
posted by Sticherbeast at 1:15 PM on January 4, 2011 [1 favorite]
Not with a couple in it, it won't be! HONH HONH
Split the rent equally four ways. That way, your rent is lowered and the rent is still divvied out fairly. It would be unfair for you to take on an extra person without an accompanying reduction in your rent. It's still fair that each half of the couple pays what you pay, because moving in with your partner does involve a bit of sacrifice (loss of privacy), and the benefit of having a larger room dissipates when it's hosting more than one person.
Alternatively, you could adjust the rent slightly to reflect their private bathroom, so that you'd pay $700 $700 $775 $775. It's still a good deal for everyone, and there's no attempt to punitively charge anyone more.
posted by Sticherbeast at 1:15 PM on January 4, 2011 [1 favorite]
Fair is what the four among you agree is fair. (I second jbenben totally on the details.) Think about what other things you can negotiate apart from the rent: cleaning duties for instance, or utilities if there's a way of separating those.
Also, if you start charging per person rather than per room, what is the status of visitors people have? (for a few days? a week? two weeks?)
posted by squishles at 1:15 PM on January 4, 2011
Also, if you start charging per person rather than per room, what is the status of visitors people have? (for a few days? a week? two weeks?)
posted by squishles at 1:15 PM on January 4, 2011
First figure out which part of rent the utilities are. That needs to be split across 4 people without question.
Figure out what each room is worth, keeping in mind that not all square feet are equal. Bathrooms are a lot more valuable than hallways. Split each room between the people who will be sharing it. And don't let anyone weasel out of paying for the kitchen, if they eat they use the room.
Really though, changing the terms might be a tough sell. It's great for you and single roommate because you'll be paying less. But we don't know if girlfriend is moving in because the couple assumes they'll be splitting the rent that the boyfriend normally pays.
Not saying that it doesn't need to change, because at least on the level of you're sharing common space with another person it does need to change.
posted by theichibun at 1:16 PM on January 4, 2011
Figure out what each room is worth, keeping in mind that not all square feet are equal. Bathrooms are a lot more valuable than hallways. Split each room between the people who will be sharing it. And don't let anyone weasel out of paying for the kitchen, if they eat they use the room.
Really though, changing the terms might be a tough sell. It's great for you and single roommate because you'll be paying less. But we don't know if girlfriend is moving in because the couple assumes they'll be splitting the rent that the boyfriend normally pays.
Not saying that it doesn't need to change, because at least on the level of you're sharing common space with another person it does need to change.
posted by theichibun at 1:16 PM on January 4, 2011
I personally think in these situations, the couple should not be able to split the price of one bedroom between the two of them (especially since utilities are also covered). Nor do I think all the rent should be split equally (unless the master really is that much better).
Here's how I've seen it done:
1. Is there an easy way to figure out how much of the rent is utilities? That part should definitely be split evenly among all occupants (this is how it's done when utilities are not included in the rent).
2. You also have to account for how much common area there is and how that is shared. How much is the common area alone "worth"? That should be split evenly among all housemates.
3. Finally, with what's left, you can go by square-footage, while taking into account things like privacy and other amenities. Then, each individual room has a price. The couple living in the master should pay for what the room is worth, because the extra person was already taken into account in the calculating for utilities and common area.
There's no "correct" way to do this, and you'll have to compromise, but I feel this way is one of the more fairer and systematic ways to calculate.
posted by lacedcoffee at 1:17 PM on January 4, 2011
Here's how I've seen it done:
1. Is there an easy way to figure out how much of the rent is utilities? That part should definitely be split evenly among all occupants (this is how it's done when utilities are not included in the rent).
2. You also have to account for how much common area there is and how that is shared. How much is the common area alone "worth"? That should be split evenly among all housemates.
3. Finally, with what's left, you can go by square-footage, while taking into account things like privacy and other amenities. Then, each individual room has a price. The couple living in the master should pay for what the room is worth, because the extra person was already taken into account in the calculating for utilities and common area.
There's no "correct" way to do this, and you'll have to compromise, but I feel this way is one of the more fairer and systematic ways to calculate.
posted by lacedcoffee at 1:17 PM on January 4, 2011
I would say split half the cost four ways and half the cost three ways, since the two people using one bedroom are still two people using the bathrooms and living room and kitchen.
So all four of you would be splitting $1475 four ways (which comes out to $369 rent for common areas each) and then you'd split $1475 three ways (which comes out to $492 rent for each bedroom, which those of you in singletons could pay and which the couple can then split between themselves).
So you and your roommates would be paying $861 and they'd each be paying $705, less the rounding I did to do this in my head because I am too lazy to get a calculator out of my desk drawer.
posted by Sidhedevil at 1:17 PM on January 4, 2011 [2 favorites]
So all four of you would be splitting $1475 four ways (which comes out to $369 rent for common areas each) and then you'd split $1475 three ways (which comes out to $492 rent for each bedroom, which those of you in singletons could pay and which the couple can then split between themselves).
So you and your roommates would be paying $861 and they'd each be paying $705, less the rounding I did to do this in my head because I am too lazy to get a calculator out of my desk drawer.
posted by Sidhedevil at 1:17 PM on January 4, 2011 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Split it four ways and everyone wins.
Your current arrangement: $900 / $900 / $1150 = $2950
$2950 / 4 = $737.50
Everyone's rent goes down (including the roomie with the new squeeze).
Everyone is paying the exact same amount of money.
Win win win.
posted by DWRoelands at 1:25 PM on January 4, 2011 [7 favorites]
Your current arrangement: $900 / $900 / $1150 = $2950
$2950 / 4 = $737.50
Everyone's rent goes down (including the roomie with the new squeeze).
Everyone is paying the exact same amount of money.
Win win win.
posted by DWRoelands at 1:25 PM on January 4, 2011 [7 favorites]
The rent for that room stays at $1150 only if the girlfriend stays in there and never uses any other room of the house.
2950/4 = $737 for four people split evenly.
2950/3 = ~$983, so the people who were in a less spacious bedroom situation before got a discount of $83 or 8.4% of the rate in a straight split. Applying the same metric to the new four person arrangement would yield $675 each for the couple, $800 for those with rooms to themselves. That would seem reasonable to me, though as a member of a couple I've always gone for the straight split.
posted by contraption at 1:25 PM on January 4, 2011
2950/4 = $737 for four people split evenly.
2950/3 = ~$983, so the people who were in a less spacious bedroom situation before got a discount of $83 or 8.4% of the rate in a straight split. Applying the same metric to the new four person arrangement would yield $675 each for the couple, $800 for those with rooms to themselves. That would seem reasonable to me, though as a member of a couple I've always gone for the straight split.
posted by contraption at 1:25 PM on January 4, 2011
What I'd do is split the divide the total rent into two funds - "General Apartment" and "Bedrooms". Split the first $1475 four ways, so each person pays $368.75, split the second half in thirds - $491.66. So, the two people in the small bedrooms pay $860.41 (1/4 of the 'general apartment' fund, and 1/3 of the 'room fund'), and the two people in the big room pay $614.58, (368.75 + half of $491.66 for their shared bedroom). The couple pays a bit less singularly, but a bit more collectively. The other two get a small break, and the whole thing is done on the up and up.
posted by dirtdirt at 1:31 PM on January 4, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by dirtdirt at 1:31 PM on January 4, 2011 [1 favorite]
Sidhedevil's solution seems like the most fair, but I didn't understand it the first time I read it so it might be a harder sell. I've been in this -ahem -situation myself, as the girlfriend. And it was at my insistence that we split the rent and utilities four-ways. As much as I hate the living situation (come on June 1!), expecting to pay less rent is silly when I'm the one who is basically encroaching on someone else's space.
If they insist on getting a discount because they're sharing a room, that argument is basically bullshit. They have a larger room, a private bathroom, and are sharing it as a couple. If the guy was originally paying $1150 -because- of the larger room, then it's already been agreed they should have to pay a premier price for that space.
posted by katybird at 1:31 PM on January 4, 2011
If they insist on getting a discount because they're sharing a room, that argument is basically bullshit. They have a larger room, a private bathroom, and are sharing it as a couple. If the guy was originally paying $1150 -because- of the larger room, then it's already been agreed they should have to pay a premier price for that space.
posted by katybird at 1:31 PM on January 4, 2011
Splitting it 4 ways isn't fair as two of them are sharing a bedroom (albeit a bigger one than yours).
The couple splitting the existing rent of the master bedroom isn't fair as there will be four people using the communal areas and utilities instead of three.
Somewhere in the middle is the way to go.
posted by finding.perdita at 1:32 PM on January 4, 2011 [4 favorites]
The couple splitting the existing rent of the master bedroom isn't fair as there will be four people using the communal areas and utilities instead of three.
Somewhere in the middle is the way to go.
posted by finding.perdita at 1:32 PM on January 4, 2011 [4 favorites]
Do not fall for this. The gf is using space and other things throughout the apartment.
Yeah, I agree $737.50 each is a lot fairer than $900 for you two and $575 each for them in an ensuite master bedroom. The other option is to suggest switching, they can each have their own bedroom at $900 each and you and the other room-mate are willing to share the master for $1150 together. According to them that would be fair, right?
This is brilliantly illuminating.
Don't sign anything until it is all worked out, but splitting it evenly isn't fair to you. What about utilities? What about the loss of the common areas? Plus you have an alliance to deal with now.
posted by Ironmouth at 1:32 PM on January 4, 2011 [3 favorites]
Yeah, I agree $737.50 each is a lot fairer than $900 for you two and $575 each for them in an ensuite master bedroom. The other option is to suggest switching, they can each have their own bedroom at $900 each and you and the other room-mate are willing to share the master for $1150 together. According to them that would be fair, right?
This is brilliantly illuminating.
Don't sign anything until it is all worked out, but splitting it evenly isn't fair to you. What about utilities? What about the loss of the common areas? Plus you have an alliance to deal with now.
posted by Ironmouth at 1:32 PM on January 4, 2011 [3 favorites]
It doesn't seem fair to split it 25% each - they each have to share a room, and you get your own room. But they're not renting just the bedroom - rent includes access to the kitchen and whatever shared living space. Could the other two of you have partners move in too without affecting everyone's quality of life? Of course not!
The master bedroom complicates it some, but not that much.
800-800-675-675 leaves you paying 27% and the couple paying 23% each. I don't think making them pay more than that is really fair - unless the master bedroom is as big as both other bedrooms and all the other shared space put together!
FWIW, I live in a 3br. When one roommate's girlfriend moved in, we changed from splitting rent evenly three ways to 30-30-20-20. We don't have a master bedroom with its own bathroom is why I'm suggesting a different split for you.
posted by aubilenon at 1:36 PM on January 4, 2011
The master bedroom complicates it some, but not that much.
800-800-675-675 leaves you paying 27% and the couple paying 23% each. I don't think making them pay more than that is really fair - unless the master bedroom is as big as both other bedrooms and all the other shared space put together!
FWIW, I live in a 3br. When one roommate's girlfriend moved in, we changed from splitting rent evenly three ways to 30-30-20-20. We don't have a master bedroom with its own bathroom is why I'm suggesting a different split for you.
posted by aubilenon at 1:36 PM on January 4, 2011
Oh goodie! I've been so hoping that someone else would ask this question, so I could refine my previous answer.
To summarize, I advocated calculating the total floor space of the apartment in square inches and dividing the rent proportionately, with an adjustment for expected minute by minute usage of the common areas. Your new twist allows us to also add in utility consumption to the equation. I'm thinking each occupant should be penalized for excessive utility usage, particularly those who take long showers. Don't forget to provide a discount should the couple shower together, unless said shower takes more time than two standard individual showers.
Failing that, I actually think contraption's proposal is quite fair, although clearly less accurate than my patent-pending formula.
posted by Lame_username at 1:36 PM on January 4, 2011
To summarize, I advocated calculating the total floor space of the apartment in square inches and dividing the rent proportionately, with an adjustment for expected minute by minute usage of the common areas. Your new twist allows us to also add in utility consumption to the equation. I'm thinking each occupant should be penalized for excessive utility usage, particularly those who take long showers. Don't forget to provide a discount should the couple shower together, unless said shower takes more time than two standard individual showers.
Failing that, I actually think contraption's proposal is quite fair, although clearly less accurate than my patent-pending formula.
posted by Lame_username at 1:36 PM on January 4, 2011
The couple should collectively pay more than $1150, but less than half the total rent of all rooms. To be fair, their rent has to go up when a fourth person is brought in, for reasons others have already explained. Presumably she'll be keeping her food, dishes, glasses, etc. in the kitchen, leaving the rest of you with what will in effect be a smaller kitchen. One more person also means more wear and tear (at best).
Living with a couple is itself a burden on you if they ever have loud arguments. I wouldn't necessarily bring this up with them. But face it, most couples do get into fights sometimes. At least keep that in the back of your mind while negotiating.
But again, it wouldn't make sense to split the rent equally 4 ways: they're still sharing a room. They're being more economical in their use of space than the other two of you. (If you were to have a friend sleep in a sleeping bag in your room for one night, I doubt you'd feel the need to prorate that one day as if your friend had their own fourth room.)
I wouldn't try to jack up the price dramatically on the ground that you suddenly realized how much better the master bedroom itself is than the other rooms. You should have figured that into the rents from the beginning. It would appear disingenuous to start harping on that now.
With all this in mind, reach an agreement everyone's happy with. Whatever you decide will be what is "fair."
posted by John Cohen at 1:37 PM on January 4, 2011
Living with a couple is itself a burden on you if they ever have loud arguments. I wouldn't necessarily bring this up with them. But face it, most couples do get into fights sometimes. At least keep that in the back of your mind while negotiating.
But again, it wouldn't make sense to split the rent equally 4 ways: they're still sharing a room. They're being more economical in their use of space than the other two of you. (If you were to have a friend sleep in a sleeping bag in your room for one night, I doubt you'd feel the need to prorate that one day as if your friend had their own fourth room.)
I wouldn't try to jack up the price dramatically on the ground that you suddenly realized how much better the master bedroom itself is than the other rooms. You should have figured that into the rents from the beginning. It would appear disingenuous to start harping on that now.
With all this in mind, reach an agreement everyone's happy with. Whatever you decide will be what is "fair."
posted by John Cohen at 1:37 PM on January 4, 2011
Best answer: I've faced this situation in the past. A rough rule we used that seemed pretty reasonable was to assume that when everybody was living one-to-a-bedroom, half of each person's rent was designed to cover their bedroom, and half was designed to cover common space. You can use those figures to decide how to add a new person fairly: Common space rent is shared equally among everybody who lives in the apartment. Bedroom rent is shared among the people who lives in them. [You have the slight wrinkle of the master bedroom, but that can be taken into account too. See below]
How does that work out for you? Here's the allocation of rent before you add a fourth person:
Single 1: $900 = $450 for common space, $450 for bedroom
Single 2: $900= $450 for common space, $450 for bedroom
Member of Couple 1: $1150= $450 for common space, $700 for bedroom
That means your total common space rent is $1350, and your total bedroom rent is $1600.
Common space rent should be shared equally among all four tenants.
Single 1: $337.5
Single 2: $337.5
Member of Couple 1: $337.5
Member of Couple 2: $337.5
Bedroom rent should be allocated to those who sleep in them.
Single 1: $450
Single 2: $450
Member of Couple 1: $350
Member of Couple 2: $350
That means the individual shares should be:
Single 1: $337.5 + $450 = $787.5
Single 2: $337.5 + $450 = $787.5
Member of Couple 1: $337.5 + $350 = $687.5
Member of Couple 2: $337.5 + $350 = $687.5
In other words, the two single tenants now pay about $110 less in rent ($787.5 each) and the couple now together pays about $225 more ($1375 total). This seems pretty fair to me-- it reflects the increased burden that a new person puts on the shared common space, but also reflects that that person isn't sharing bedroom space.
[You can do a more advanced version of this whole equation taking into account square footage, bathrooms, etc., but that seems like it's probably more trouble than its worth for you.]
posted by willbaude at 1:38 PM on January 4, 2011 [27 favorites]
How does that work out for you? Here's the allocation of rent before you add a fourth person:
Single 1: $900 = $450 for common space, $450 for bedroom
Single 2: $900= $450 for common space, $450 for bedroom
Member of Couple 1: $1150= $450 for common space, $700 for bedroom
That means your total common space rent is $1350, and your total bedroom rent is $1600.
Common space rent should be shared equally among all four tenants.
Single 1: $337.5
Single 2: $337.5
Member of Couple 1: $337.5
Member of Couple 2: $337.5
Bedroom rent should be allocated to those who sleep in them.
Single 1: $450
Single 2: $450
Member of Couple 1: $350
Member of Couple 2: $350
That means the individual shares should be:
Single 1: $337.5 + $450 = $787.5
Single 2: $337.5 + $450 = $787.5
Member of Couple 1: $337.5 + $350 = $687.5
Member of Couple 2: $337.5 + $350 = $687.5
In other words, the two single tenants now pay about $110 less in rent ($787.5 each) and the couple now together pays about $225 more ($1375 total). This seems pretty fair to me-- it reflects the increased burden that a new person puts on the shared common space, but also reflects that that person isn't sharing bedroom space.
[You can do a more advanced version of this whole equation taking into account square footage, bathrooms, etc., but that seems like it's probably more trouble than its worth for you.]
posted by willbaude at 1:38 PM on January 4, 2011 [27 favorites]
The nice thing about this situation is that there is no one right way to distribute the rent, and every sane answer features a discount for everyone.
So, your homework now is to find the fair scheme with the lowest rent for you, while also compiling the rationales for other fair schemes that might be more advantageous for the couple. Begin by negotiating for the fair scheme with the best deal for you, and see if it sticks. If they balk, move on to the next fair scheme with the second-best deal for you, and so on.
posted by Sticherbeast at 1:44 PM on January 4, 2011
So, your homework now is to find the fair scheme with the lowest rent for you, while also compiling the rationales for other fair schemes that might be more advantageous for the couple. Begin by negotiating for the fair scheme with the best deal for you, and see if it sticks. If they balk, move on to the next fair scheme with the second-best deal for you, and so on.
posted by Sticherbeast at 1:44 PM on January 4, 2011
There's no perfect way to do this, but I agree with earlier posters that neither the status quo or 1/4s is the right answer. You need to acknowledge that the common space is being split up among more people, as are the utilities.
If you make the assumption that you're paying about 1/3 of your rent for shared space and utilities, and then factor in the square footage numbers, because they're already in the bigger room, I get numbers similar to the 800-800-675-675 suggested above. (or more precisely 835-835-640-640, but that seems a tad overprecise)
posted by mercredi at 1:48 PM on January 4, 2011
If you make the assumption that you're paying about 1/3 of your rent for shared space and utilities, and then factor in the square footage numbers, because they're already in the bigger room, I get numbers similar to the 800-800-675-675 suggested above. (or more precisely 835-835-640-640, but that seems a tad overprecise)
posted by mercredi at 1:48 PM on January 4, 2011
I've been party to willbaude's method and it's gone over very well. Highly recommended.
posted by JohnFredra at 2:46 PM on January 4, 2011
posted by JohnFredra at 2:46 PM on January 4, 2011
I lived in a few different houses with roommates. We used something similar to willbaude's solution at one place, and it was the most reasonable.
In another place, two of my roommates were libertarian economics majors and auctioned off the desirable rooms. Basically, all the rooms started out at the same price, say $300 for each of 4 rooms. If someone offered $390 for the master, the cost of the other rooms was reduced accordingly so the total equaled the monthly rent, so the split was $390/$270/$270/$270. That worked out too, as we had one roommate who really wanted the master and could afford to outbid everyone else. I think the split ended up being $500/$300/$200/$200, which was great for me, since I didn't care about how big my room was. It also avoided the "we're a couple/i have a girlfriend so I neeeeed the bigger room" argument.
posted by electroboy at 2:52 PM on January 4, 2011 [2 favorites]
In another place, two of my roommates were libertarian economics majors and auctioned off the desirable rooms. Basically, all the rooms started out at the same price, say $300 for each of 4 rooms. If someone offered $390 for the master, the cost of the other rooms was reduced accordingly so the total equaled the monthly rent, so the split was $390/$270/$270/$270. That worked out too, as we had one roommate who really wanted the master and could afford to outbid everyone else. I think the split ended up being $500/$300/$200/$200, which was great for me, since I didn't care about how big my room was. It also avoided the "we're a couple/i have a girlfriend so I neeeeed the bigger room" argument.
posted by electroboy at 2:52 PM on January 4, 2011 [2 favorites]
stay calm people, you don't solve this with mathematics, or maybe you could, but that really depends on your flatmates. Many people will be at best confused and at worst offended and hurt if OP presented them these calculations. If the couple would like to keep the rent as it was then OP has to be very delicate in changing that idea.
"Fair" isn't just something you do some mathematics to find; fair is something you sit down and talk about, and accommodate their concerns and yours. "Fair" is saying, hey, is there a chance we could adjust the rates to match another person coming in? and them replying, well, we didn't think of that, maybe we should have, how about we throw in an extra 100$? and then you saying, well, yeah, that's cool, but could you make it 150$ and then we pay 825, 825, 1300?
If they don't budge at all, maybe they don't think they can afford it, or maybe the goodness of your relationship with them doesn't stretch to this kind of give-and-take. (Maybe you need to go into this with a good plan B) "Fair" isn't about counting the glasses in the kitchen, or necessarily about OMG my living space is invaded by another person (because she didn't visit before?), fair is about coming to a decision together.
posted by squishles at 3:57 PM on January 4, 2011
"Fair" isn't just something you do some mathematics to find; fair is something you sit down and talk about, and accommodate their concerns and yours. "Fair" is saying, hey, is there a chance we could adjust the rates to match another person coming in? and them replying, well, we didn't think of that, maybe we should have, how about we throw in an extra 100$? and then you saying, well, yeah, that's cool, but could you make it 150$ and then we pay 825, 825, 1300?
If they don't budge at all, maybe they don't think they can afford it, or maybe the goodness of your relationship with them doesn't stretch to this kind of give-and-take. (Maybe you need to go into this with a good plan B) "Fair" isn't about counting the glasses in the kitchen, or necessarily about OMG my living space is invaded by another person (because she didn't visit before?), fair is about coming to a decision together.
posted by squishles at 3:57 PM on January 4, 2011
Do the math!
Right now, $900+$900+$1150 is $2950. Say $200 cover utilities, that gets split four ways, so $50 each. You're down to $2750. Hypothetically, the square feet measures of your apartment are as follows (you'll have to fill in your own numbers):
Bedroom 1 (to be shared, incl closets and bathroom): 200 sq feet
Bedroom 2: 120 sq feet
Bedroom 3: 110 sq feet
Common area to share with everyone: 400 sq feet
Bathroom to share with BR2 and BR3 people: 50 sq feet
(This total is 880 sq feet)
Partner 1 in BR1 gets 100 sq feet from the bedroom and 100 sq feet from the common area - 200 sq feet total
Partner 2 in BR1 gets 100 sq feet from the bedroom and 100 sq feet from the common area - 200 sq feet total
Person in BR2 gets 120 sq feet from the bedroom and 100 sq feet from the common area and 25 sq feet from the shared bath - 245 sq feet total
Person in BR3 gets 110 sq feet from the bedroom and 100 sq feet from the common area and 25 sq feet from the shared bath - 235 sq feet total
(200+200+245+235=880, here's your doublecheck)
Partner 1 in BR1 pays 200/880*$2750 - $625 per month plus $50 worth of utilities
Partner 2 in BR1 pays 200/880*$2750 - $625 per month plus $50 worth of utilities
Person in BR2 pays 245/880*$2705 - $765.625 per month plus $50 worth of utilities
Person in BR3 pays 235/880*$2705 - $734.375 per month plus $50 worth of utilities
Which means the couple pays a combined total of $1350 while the person in BR2 pays $815.625 and the person in BR3 pays $784.375. (These numbers total $2950, here's your second doublecheck.)
Each person is paying the amount of rent proportional to the amount of square feet they have and an equal share of the utilities. If you think certain spaces (e.g., the 40 square feet along the southern wall because it's got a nice bay window) are premium places, you can easily adjust the math to assign these places a premium price. Kinda like paying more for a house in a nice part of town. You can also adjust the proportions of the utilities as well.
posted by Brian Puccio at 5:31 PM on January 4, 2011
Right now, $900+$900+$1150 is $2950. Say $200 cover utilities, that gets split four ways, so $50 each. You're down to $2750. Hypothetically, the square feet measures of your apartment are as follows (you'll have to fill in your own numbers):
Bedroom 1 (to be shared, incl closets and bathroom): 200 sq feet
Bedroom 2: 120 sq feet
Bedroom 3: 110 sq feet
Common area to share with everyone: 400 sq feet
Bathroom to share with BR2 and BR3 people: 50 sq feet
(This total is 880 sq feet)
Partner 1 in BR1 gets 100 sq feet from the bedroom and 100 sq feet from the common area - 200 sq feet total
Partner 2 in BR1 gets 100 sq feet from the bedroom and 100 sq feet from the common area - 200 sq feet total
Person in BR2 gets 120 sq feet from the bedroom and 100 sq feet from the common area and 25 sq feet from the shared bath - 245 sq feet total
Person in BR3 gets 110 sq feet from the bedroom and 100 sq feet from the common area and 25 sq feet from the shared bath - 235 sq feet total
(200+200+245+235=880, here's your doublecheck)
Partner 1 in BR1 pays 200/880*$2750 - $625 per month plus $50 worth of utilities
Partner 2 in BR1 pays 200/880*$2750 - $625 per month plus $50 worth of utilities
Person in BR2 pays 245/880*$2705 - $765.625 per month plus $50 worth of utilities
Person in BR3 pays 235/880*$2705 - $734.375 per month plus $50 worth of utilities
Which means the couple pays a combined total of $1350 while the person in BR2 pays $815.625 and the person in BR3 pays $784.375. (These numbers total $2950, here's your second doublecheck.)
Each person is paying the amount of rent proportional to the amount of square feet they have and an equal share of the utilities. If you think certain spaces (e.g., the 40 square feet along the southern wall because it's got a nice bay window) are premium places, you can easily adjust the math to assign these places a premium price. Kinda like paying more for a house in a nice part of town. You can also adjust the proportions of the utilities as well.
posted by Brian Puccio at 5:31 PM on January 4, 2011
There's not a "right" or "fair" mathematical answer here. She's living there now and some kind of adjustment sounds reasonable to me, but yeah, you need to talk it out and see how everyone else feels.
Do you and the third roommate have girlfriends? What if your GF starts spending, say, 10 nights a week there? Is she going to pitch in at a 1/3 share of your rent with a complicated new calculation?
It sounds like part of what's going on is that you're upset about not charging the master at a higher rate from the start, which is BS, because you should have negotiated a different deal if it were actually worth more than 1150 to any of you.
posted by J. Wilson at 5:46 PM on January 4, 2011 [1 favorite]
Do you and the third roommate have girlfriends? What if your GF starts spending, say, 10 nights a week there? Is she going to pitch in at a 1/3 share of your rent with a complicated new calculation?
It sounds like part of what's going on is that you're upset about not charging the master at a higher rate from the start, which is BS, because you should have negotiated a different deal if it were actually worth more than 1150 to any of you.
posted by J. Wilson at 5:46 PM on January 4, 2011 [1 favorite]
I wish I knew someone who could spend 10 nights a week somewhere. Sorry, I couldn't resist that.
One thing that you've not mentioned is how stable the relationship is. What would happen if the couple broke up? Instantly back to the situation you have now? Still adjusted but different?
I know it's not something that he'll want to discuss, but I've seen plenty of roommate situations go bad when someone in a shared room moves out. Suddenly one person paying double and the others not being prepared to pay more leads to a lot of fighting, whether it's a romantic relationship that ruined things or not.
posted by theichibun at 6:37 PM on January 4, 2011 [1 favorite]
One thing that you've not mentioned is how stable the relationship is. What would happen if the couple broke up? Instantly back to the situation you have now? Still adjusted but different?
I know it's not something that he'll want to discuss, but I've seen plenty of roommate situations go bad when someone in a shared room moves out. Suddenly one person paying double and the others not being prepared to pay more leads to a lot of fighting, whether it's a romantic relationship that ruined things or not.
posted by theichibun at 6:37 PM on January 4, 2011 [1 favorite]
How long has she been living there? I think the appropriate thing would have been to discuss the rent before she moved in.
If she was under the impression that she would be splitting the rent with your roommate and no one told her otherwise, I think it would be unfair to suddenly tell her she would be paying $400 or more per month than planned.
Maybe she wouldn't be able to afford to pay separate rent even though she is sharing a bedroom.
Personally, i've been in the situation before - living with couples. In two places, we all split the rent evenly. In another place, a girlfriend moved in and neither I nor the other roommate cared that they would be splitting the original rent for the third person.
I never really cared nor paid attention to room sizes.
I also never used the common areas besides the refrigerator or the bathroom. So maybe she won't take over too much space.
So, I guess, if you really want to suddenly tell her that she needs to be paying her own rent even though she already moved in, you probably should ask if she could afford it. or how much she can afford.
posted by KogeLiz at 9:10 PM on January 4, 2011
If she was under the impression that she would be splitting the rent with your roommate and no one told her otherwise, I think it would be unfair to suddenly tell her she would be paying $400 or more per month than planned.
Maybe she wouldn't be able to afford to pay separate rent even though she is sharing a bedroom.
Personally, i've been in the situation before - living with couples. In two places, we all split the rent evenly. In another place, a girlfriend moved in and neither I nor the other roommate cared that they would be splitting the original rent for the third person.
I never really cared nor paid attention to room sizes.
I also never used the common areas besides the refrigerator or the bathroom. So maybe she won't take over too much space.
So, I guess, if you really want to suddenly tell her that she needs to be paying her own rent even though she already moved in, you probably should ask if she could afford it. or how much she can afford.
posted by KogeLiz at 9:10 PM on January 4, 2011
Just a note to say that, if they have a private bathroom, you should build in their use of the main bathroom, along with use by their own guests. I remembered being irked at having to pay for supplies and do the cleaning for the main bath when my roommate's friends would use the bathroom my other roommate and I shared, since the en suite was through the bedroom.
posted by acoutu at 9:57 PM on January 4, 2011
posted by acoutu at 9:57 PM on January 4, 2011
I say 4 way split. I understand the idea that the private rooms are an asset - and I agree that they are - IF the pair in the master were not a couple. While not impossible, how likely would it be that they would get a 2 bedroom apartment on their own and not share bedrooms? This isn't a game of heads or tails where they lost. This is how they'd likely be using rooms in an apartment without roommates, and the room they have sounds significantly better than the other 2.
Bringing another person into an apartment is a big deal. It changes the whole dynamic, even more so here since the new addition is a lover of one of the occupants. You could do that crazy math with the common areas verses bedroom areas verses north or south or cold or hot but I think the differences in price are negligible. It seems a little insane to me to get that granular but hey - if they insist, that works too.
What doesn't work is paying the same amount that your current roomie pays now. Helllll no!
posted by amycup at 11:16 PM on January 4, 2011
Bringing another person into an apartment is a big deal. It changes the whole dynamic, even more so here since the new addition is a lover of one of the occupants. You could do that crazy math with the common areas verses bedroom areas verses north or south or cold or hot but I think the differences in price are negligible. It seems a little insane to me to get that granular but hey - if they insist, that works too.
What doesn't work is paying the same amount that your current roomie pays now. Helllll no!
posted by amycup at 11:16 PM on January 4, 2011
Ooooh I gotta flip it! I just noticed that you said she already moved in. If she's been there a while (more than a couple of weeks) and didn't sort of move in silently in a jerky way, I'd say it's kind of sucky to renegotiate the situation now. This should have been discussed head on before she committed to living there since it may have impacted her decision to move in.
It also sounds like her presence isn't causing any ill effects, which indicates that changes to the living arrangement have been minimal, even positive. This doesn't leave you a lot of room to suggest this without making waves. You were fine with the current arrangement and the couple gave you no grounds to feel like your life has been negatively affected by her tenancy, so you kind of painted yourself into a corner.
posted by amycup at 11:29 PM on January 4, 2011
It also sounds like her presence isn't causing any ill effects, which indicates that changes to the living arrangement have been minimal, even positive. This doesn't leave you a lot of room to suggest this without making waves. You were fine with the current arrangement and the couple gave you no grounds to feel like your life has been negatively affected by her tenancy, so you kind of painted yourself into a corner.
posted by amycup at 11:29 PM on January 4, 2011
Yeah, no.
She needs to pull her weight as well and I find it rather audacious of the couple to think they can just split the cost of the master room. Nice try, but just...no.
There have been several good suggestions on how to split the rent four ways. Unless the couple are going to spend 24/7 in the bedroom and never come out, they need to suck it up and pay what is fair.
posted by Windigo at 8:31 AM on January 5, 2011
She needs to pull her weight as well and I find it rather audacious of the couple to think they can just split the cost of the master room. Nice try, but just...no.
There have been several good suggestions on how to split the rent four ways. Unless the couple are going to spend 24/7 in the bedroom and never come out, they need to suck it up and pay what is fair.
posted by Windigo at 8:31 AM on January 5, 2011
The nice part of willbaude's method is that it matches the current rents for pre-girlfriend situation.
posted by smackfu at 12:15 PM on January 5, 2011
posted by smackfu at 12:15 PM on January 5, 2011
Best answer: This is the best solution I have come across so far as it does a very fair job of accounting for not only how many people are sharing a room, but variations in the quality of rooms.
Thumbs up!
http://www.splittherent.org/p/rent-calculator.html
posted by forkisbetter at 11:57 AM on February 21, 2011 [1 favorite]
Thumbs up!
http://www.splittherent.org/p/rent-calculator.html
posted by forkisbetter at 11:57 AM on February 21, 2011 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by ghharr at 1:02 PM on January 4, 2011 [4 favorites]