I've got electrical tape and pliers and stuff, I'm ready for action!
December 12, 2010 1:29 AM Subscribe
Holiday lights. I have two long strands, they would (will) be too long to use what I want to use them for -- can I cut off the end of one strand? Or splice the two strands into one, can that be done, hack off the end of the first one, splice in the second one, cut the second one to length, then Hurray! one long(er) strand, it all works great, right? Right?
I mean, I won't burn down the house, right? And if I do this, the lights won't be brighter or dimmer than otherwise? I don't care if they're just a bit dimmer/brighter but not too much.
I'm not afraid to do things that "You're not supposed to do that!" but can be done without harm, yeah, I know I'm not *supposed* to do this, that, or the other but I don't care, in my experience you can mostly skate by with a lot of stuff. For example I remove the tags sewn onto mattresses that say it's against the law ( !! ) to do so -- gasp! Those annoying plugs that won't plug in but just one way, I take a tin snip to them - *snip* *snip* - now they'll plug into anything. I take tylonol that's out of date. More than once, I've driven over the speed limit. I'm just a scofflaw I guess, a bad seed.
Anyways, it'd just look hokey if I don't do something, the lights will all wrap around nicely but then have this long extraneous wad of lights on that last part of it, dangling. I suppose I could just hack a hole in the wall and jam them into the hole but even I don't think that's too very good an idea...
Oh, and on the box it says that up to three strands can be used end to end, I'm assuming this would have an impact on this question, or, rather, on the answer to this question.
In related news, I've another string that's only going to be one, not two put together, needs to have a couple feet hacked off of it so it'll fit right. Yes? No?
I mean, I won't burn down the house, right? And if I do this, the lights won't be brighter or dimmer than otherwise? I don't care if they're just a bit dimmer/brighter but not too much.
I'm not afraid to do things that "You're not supposed to do that!" but can be done without harm, yeah, I know I'm not *supposed* to do this, that, or the other but I don't care, in my experience you can mostly skate by with a lot of stuff. For example I remove the tags sewn onto mattresses that say it's against the law ( !! ) to do so -- gasp! Those annoying plugs that won't plug in but just one way, I take a tin snip to them - *snip* *snip* - now they'll plug into anything. I take tylonol that's out of date. More than once, I've driven over the speed limit. I'm just a scofflaw I guess, a bad seed.
Anyways, it'd just look hokey if I don't do something, the lights will all wrap around nicely but then have this long extraneous wad of lights on that last part of it, dangling. I suppose I could just hack a hole in the wall and jam them into the hole but even I don't think that's too very good an idea...
Oh, and on the box it says that up to three strands can be used end to end, I'm assuming this would have an impact on this question, or, rather, on the answer to this question.
In related news, I've another string that's only going to be one, not two put together, needs to have a couple feet hacked off of it so it'll fit right. Yes? No?
Response by poster: hattifattener: "I think it depends a lot on how the particular strands you have are wired; the ones I have are not all the same."
Good catch, should have thought to tell you this -- the two I'm thinking to splice together are identical, same brand, same box, same everything, brand new.
posted by dancestoblue at 2:03 AM on December 12, 2010
Good catch, should have thought to tell you this -- the two I'm thinking to splice together are identical, same brand, same box, same everything, brand new.
posted by dancestoblue at 2:03 AM on December 12, 2010
I mean, I won't burn down the house, right?
How many people do you think said that to themselves right before doing something that resulted in their house burning down. Don't be that guy. Being lucky is not the same as being right. (And heaven forbid if your house does burn down I really hope that your homeowners insurance doesn't choose to blame it on your 'modified' plugs and refuse to pay.)
Assuming that the lights you have are the kind that are wired in parallel, then you can simply remove all the bulbs past the point where you don't need any more lights without affecting the rest. Then you can just coil up the end and tuck it away where it won't be seen, or fold it back on itself and tie it down.
BTW, the warning on mattress tags is to retailers, not to end users. You're not breaking any laws cutting it off.
posted by Rhomboid at 2:07 AM on December 12, 2010 [2 favorites]
How many people do you think said that to themselves right before doing something that resulted in their house burning down. Don't be that guy. Being lucky is not the same as being right. (And heaven forbid if your house does burn down I really hope that your homeowners insurance doesn't choose to blame it on your 'modified' plugs and refuse to pay.)
Assuming that the lights you have are the kind that are wired in parallel, then you can simply remove all the bulbs past the point where you don't need any more lights without affecting the rest. Then you can just coil up the end and tuck it away where it won't be seen, or fold it back on itself and tie it down.
BTW, the warning on mattress tags is to retailers, not to end users. You're not breaking any laws cutting it off.
posted by Rhomboid at 2:07 AM on December 12, 2010 [2 favorites]
It might be able to be done safely, but that depends on a number of factors. How are you going to splice it together? Using a soldering iron and heat-shrink tubing would be one good way; can you do that? Most (all?) modern lights have a fused plug; will you be drawing enough current to blow the fuse? Will they be outside, where moisture may short out the splice if it is not adequately waterproofed? Will they be on greenery or other flammable decorations where a spark might start a fire? Think about all these safety related issues and others when you plan something like this.
Assuming that the lights you have are the kind that are wired in parallel, then you can simply remove all the bulbs past the point where you don't need any more lights without affecting the rest.
That doesn't work for most inexpensive lights (the only kind I am familiar with); the parallel wiring is in the base of the bulb itself and the string goes dark if a bulb is removed. Replacing the bulbs on the end with burned-out bulbs would work, though.
A simpler solution might be to adjust your plans (put the lights a little closer together or further apart) so that the lights fit better, or buy lights in the length you need; I was shopping for lights recently and noticed that if you look in enough places you can get lights in about 1 foot increments, which should be close enough for most projects.
Finally, ignore my advice if you are working with LED lights; I have some (and am gradually switching over to all LED Xmas lights) but am not familiar enough with them to know how you might screw them up if you start cutting and splicing.
posted by TedW at 2:42 AM on December 12, 2010
Assuming that the lights you have are the kind that are wired in parallel, then you can simply remove all the bulbs past the point where you don't need any more lights without affecting the rest.
That doesn't work for most inexpensive lights (the only kind I am familiar with); the parallel wiring is in the base of the bulb itself and the string goes dark if a bulb is removed. Replacing the bulbs on the end with burned-out bulbs would work, though.
A simpler solution might be to adjust your plans (put the lights a little closer together or further apart) so that the lights fit better, or buy lights in the length you need; I was shopping for lights recently and noticed that if you look in enough places you can get lights in about 1 foot increments, which should be close enough for most projects.
Finally, ignore my advice if you are working with LED lights; I have some (and am gradually switching over to all LED Xmas lights) but am not familiar enough with them to know how you might screw them up if you start cutting and splicing.
posted by TedW at 2:42 AM on December 12, 2010
The following only applies to incandescent lights that don't have any crazy blinky functions. A simple steady blink that is controlled by a bulb is OK, but nothing more complex than that. And if you want to use LEDs, you get into adding current limiting resistors as well as all the circuit calculations I mention below. Plus, different color LEDs draw different amounts of current and it's all a pain in the ass.
You likely won't burn your house down. But this doesn't work as simply as you're presuming, either. The Christmas lights that I am familiar with are wired in series, rather than parallel. Each bulb is a 2.5 volt bulb, and a string of 50 of them are on one series circuit. That series of 50 may be run in parallel with other series of 50 to make a string with more bulbs. Your lights might have different values. Don't take these numbers as gospel. If you decide to do this (and I think you shouldn't) read the paperwork that came in the box with your lights or the box from the lights themselves to get the correct figures!
Rather than try and put into words what I understand as images/physical objects, I'm going to link you to this page from HowStuffWorks.
Basically, you can do a handful of math-y circuit calculations, and a bunch of pain in the ass splicing, or you can just buy strands that are the right length. It's possible, but it's going to be a huge headache.
posted by mollymayhem at 4:02 AM on December 12, 2010 [2 favorites]
You likely won't burn your house down. But this doesn't work as simply as you're presuming, either. The Christmas lights that I am familiar with are wired in series, rather than parallel. Each bulb is a 2.5 volt bulb, and a string of 50 of them are on one series circuit. That series of 50 may be run in parallel with other series of 50 to make a string with more bulbs. Your lights might have different values. Don't take these numbers as gospel. If you decide to do this (and I think you shouldn't) read the paperwork that came in the box with your lights or the box from the lights themselves to get the correct figures!
Rather than try and put into words what I understand as images/physical objects, I'm going to link you to this page from HowStuffWorks.
Basically, you can do a handful of math-y circuit calculations, and a bunch of pain in the ass splicing, or you can just buy strands that are the right length. It's possible, but it's going to be a huge headache.
posted by mollymayhem at 4:02 AM on December 12, 2010 [2 favorites]
Before attempting something like this you would need some knowledge about basic electrical circuits. Questions that need to be answered: Are the lights wired in parallel or in a series? How many watts does each bulb have, and what's the total wattage of the whole strand? How many amps does it draw, and is that less than what your wires and the fuse will tolerate?
Unless you know Ohm's law and Kirchhoff's laws and can apply them to your problem, don't try this. If your bulbs burn brighter, that means that they are going to burn out very quickly - unless the wires get too hot and your house burns down first.
posted by amf at 4:02 AM on December 12, 2010
Unless you know Ohm's law and Kirchhoff's laws and can apply them to your problem, don't try this. If your bulbs burn brighter, that means that they are going to burn out very quickly - unless the wires get too hot and your house burns down first.
posted by amf at 4:02 AM on December 12, 2010
I am very tired, so I left some stuff out. If you rewire these so that the voltage the strand is looking for is lower than 120, your bulbs will get really bright and then burn out. Or just burn out as soon as you plug them in, with a lovely flash and popping noise. If you rewire them so that they're looking for a voltage higher than 120, they will be very dim.
The fact that you can plug three strands end to end has very little to do with what you're contemplating. What that limit is about is the total wattage the strands are pulling, combined, is. Every wire that is designed for electrical power usage has a wattage rating. That's the watts that wire can safely carry. Above that wattage, and you risk fire, melting insulation, electrical shock and other bad things.
For further reading on the subject, Ohm's law is a good place to start your research.
Those annoying plugs that won't plug in but just one way, I take a tin snip to them - *snip* *snip* - now they'll plug into anything.
Those are polarized plugs. They're designed to keep you from hurting yourself. See here.
I work as a theatrical electrician. I've seen friends and coworkers injured and property destroyed by people who thought that the NEC was just a suggestion. I hate to be a spoilsport, but if you don't know what you're doing, please don't fuck around with electricity.
posted by mollymayhem at 4:19 AM on December 12, 2010 [3 favorites]
The fact that you can plug three strands end to end has very little to do with what you're contemplating. What that limit is about is the total wattage the strands are pulling, combined, is. Every wire that is designed for electrical power usage has a wattage rating. That's the watts that wire can safely carry. Above that wattage, and you risk fire, melting insulation, electrical shock and other bad things.
For further reading on the subject, Ohm's law is a good place to start your research.
Those annoying plugs that won't plug in but just one way, I take a tin snip to them - *snip* *snip* - now they'll plug into anything.
Those are polarized plugs. They're designed to keep you from hurting yourself. See here.
I work as a theatrical electrician. I've seen friends and coworkers injured and property destroyed by people who thought that the NEC was just a suggestion. I hate to be a spoilsport, but if you don't know what you're doing, please don't fuck around with electricity.
posted by mollymayhem at 4:19 AM on December 12, 2010 [3 favorites]
Don't do it. The danger is not worth it. Go out and buy a strand the size you want. Also, these light strands can plug into each other. Why not just do that, and arrange them so the plug does not show? Electricity is not for amateurs, especially those who "do things they should not." Christmas lights are cheap enough, no need to resort to this kind of thing if there is any danger at all of burning down the house, which there certainly could be. Or giving yourself or someone else who comes in contact with the lights a nasty shock.
posted by mermayd at 4:23 AM on December 12, 2010
posted by mermayd at 4:23 AM on December 12, 2010
In your ignorance you are conflating vastly different safety risks into a single category, which you have unfortunately labeled "safe." Of everything you say, the scariest is
Those annoying plugs that won't plug in but just one way, I take a tin snip to them - *snip* *snip* - now they'll plug into anything.
... which is a remarkably bad idea. Those plugs weren't made that way to annoy you! They force the neutral and hot connections to be made to specific conductors, which changes how they internally insulate the device. It's the difference between a broken wire being no big deal and a broken wire electrocuting you when you touch your (cold, off) toaster.
I'm really not trying to be mean here, but not grasping these sorts of distinctions (eg, putting this in the same "I'm a rebel" category as snipping a mattress tag) pretty much automatically disqualifies you from even attempting the project you propose.
posted by range at 6:26 AM on December 12, 2010 [3 favorites]
Those annoying plugs that won't plug in but just one way, I take a tin snip to them - *snip* *snip* - now they'll plug into anything.
... which is a remarkably bad idea. Those plugs weren't made that way to annoy you! They force the neutral and hot connections to be made to specific conductors, which changes how they internally insulate the device. It's the difference between a broken wire being no big deal and a broken wire electrocuting you when you touch your (cold, off) toaster.
I'm really not trying to be mean here, but not grasping these sorts of distinctions (eg, putting this in the same "I'm a rebel" category as snipping a mattress tag) pretty much automatically disqualifies you from even attempting the project you propose.
posted by range at 6:26 AM on December 12, 2010 [3 favorites]
I am an electrician. You have two things to consider.
First, will you over-load the circuit. This is not a safety concern, because if you do over-load the circuit, you will trip a circuit breaker. But, just keep in mind, you can only put so many lights on one circuit. The basic plugs around your house are either 15amp or 20amp circuits. You can put about 2100watts of lighting on a 20amp circuit.
Second, and your only safety concern, can you make a good splice. You need to cut the wire, strip back the insulation to reveal the two copper wire inside, then make your splices. You should use a wire-nut to make the splice. It will safer. Then, after the wire-nut is attached, wrap it in phase tape (electrical tape). The only danger you face is, if you make a bad splice, and wire comes loose will being energized. So, use a wire-nut, and then tape to hold it tight and act as a second insulator.
Also just to note, when you strip the wire, there will be two wires inside. A nuetral and hot. You might not be able to tell which is which, so you might wonder which wire to attach to which wire. Don't sweat it - on a lighting circuit it does not matter. Just attach one wire to one on the other, and the other to the other. There is no chance of connecting the wrong ones
posted by Flood at 6:57 AM on December 12, 2010
First, will you over-load the circuit. This is not a safety concern, because if you do over-load the circuit, you will trip a circuit breaker. But, just keep in mind, you can only put so many lights on one circuit. The basic plugs around your house are either 15amp or 20amp circuits. You can put about 2100watts of lighting on a 20amp circuit.
Second, and your only safety concern, can you make a good splice. You need to cut the wire, strip back the insulation to reveal the two copper wire inside, then make your splices. You should use a wire-nut to make the splice. It will safer. Then, after the wire-nut is attached, wrap it in phase tape (electrical tape). The only danger you face is, if you make a bad splice, and wire comes loose will being energized. So, use a wire-nut, and then tape to hold it tight and act as a second insulator.
Also just to note, when you strip the wire, there will be two wires inside. A nuetral and hot. You might not be able to tell which is which, so you might wonder which wire to attach to which wire. Don't sweat it - on a lighting circuit it does not matter. Just attach one wire to one on the other, and the other to the other. There is no chance of connecting the wrong ones
posted by Flood at 6:57 AM on December 12, 2010
Do not do this. If you don't understand the difference between series and parallel AND you think that it is a normally ok thing to take a tin snip to an electrical plug, you don't know enough to do this.
Speeding 5mph over the limit and taking the tags off of mattresses are in an entirely different league and are No Big Deal. Messing with electricity is stupid if you don't understand it.
posted by swhitt at 7:33 AM on December 12, 2010
Speeding 5mph over the limit and taking the tags off of mattresses are in an entirely different league and are No Big Deal. Messing with electricity is stupid if you don't understand it.
posted by swhitt at 7:33 AM on December 12, 2010
Flood writes "Also just to note, when you strip the wire, there will be two wires inside. A nuetral and hot. You might not be able to tell which is which, so you might wonder which wire to attach to which wire. Don't sweat it - on a lighting circuit it does not matter. Just attach one wire to one on the other, and the other to the other. There is no chance of connecting the wrong ones"
It makes a difference. One way will energize the shell of the light sockets and the other way won't. Touching an energized shell is the same as touching a live wire; energizing the shell is something you want to avoid.
posted by Mitheral at 8:59 AM on December 12, 2010
It makes a difference. One way will energize the shell of the light sockets and the other way won't. Touching an energized shell is the same as touching a live wire; energizing the shell is something you want to avoid.
posted by Mitheral at 8:59 AM on December 12, 2010
Your post brings genius ideas like this to mind. Electricity is not for the idiot. You can kill yourself or your family. The fact that you asked this question means you don't know enough about electricity. Go learn, take a course, read some books. But don't just barrel on ahead ignorantly, you can hurt somebody.
posted by defcom1 at 3:32 PM on December 12, 2010
posted by defcom1 at 3:32 PM on December 12, 2010
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posted by hattifattener at 1:54 AM on December 12, 2010