what marine/engineering issues building an underwater eco habitat?
December 3, 2010 7:02 PM Subscribe
Marine/Engineering issues building an underwater eco habitat?
I was shown this project the other day
I am not an engineer, this makes no sense to me, and I reacted by scratching my head and wondering about several design and engineering issues (form and function)
1. a square shape?
Wouldn't the pressures be structurally uneven and extremely inefficient?
2. the 24 hr. tidal flow; tidal hydraulics; wouldn't the shape cause some potentially dangerous pressures? (inertia, drag, pressure differential, vortexes? what is the term for this, hydro-dynamics?)
3. shifting sand; 5 minutes just standing in an ocean and sand has covered my feet; wouldn't there be severe shifting and build-up? (I think of shifting dunes)
4. would it be realistic to sink this to the actual ocean bed? how stable is that, or can an engineering study determine? but regardless, would it make more sense to elevate the habitat on adjustable legs, allowing the water free movement below? (and easier construction/removal)
(see these Projects from the South Pole)
5. and even consider a hydro-kinetic feature; propellers, or some technology to harness the constant tidal movement?
But lastly, without getting into a discussion on aesthetics, I personally would be looking at the Space Station, curved shapes with equalized pressure; marine life; submarines; a shape that would allow the tidal movement to pass; bio-mimetics; coral reefs?
This is a statement from the Project"s Sponsors-
"The base itself will comprise three floors constructed in the shape of a Mayan pyramid in homage to the civilization that once flourished in Belize."
This actually fascinates me as a very challenging design/engineering problem, but I do not understand the issues; can anyone help clarify them?
(e.g. how would water, constantly moving back and forth around a square shape, affect the object? similiar to, but much more extreme, to wind and rain on the ext./corner of my apartment building? but we know how to reinforce for that, and don't have to build round buildings)
Thanks. Ebesan
I was shown this project the other day
I am not an engineer, this makes no sense to me, and I reacted by scratching my head and wondering about several design and engineering issues (form and function)
1. a square shape?
Wouldn't the pressures be structurally uneven and extremely inefficient?
2. the 24 hr. tidal flow; tidal hydraulics; wouldn't the shape cause some potentially dangerous pressures? (inertia, drag, pressure differential, vortexes? what is the term for this, hydro-dynamics?)
3. shifting sand; 5 minutes just standing in an ocean and sand has covered my feet; wouldn't there be severe shifting and build-up? (I think of shifting dunes)
4. would it be realistic to sink this to the actual ocean bed? how stable is that, or can an engineering study determine? but regardless, would it make more sense to elevate the habitat on adjustable legs, allowing the water free movement below? (and easier construction/removal)
(see these Projects from the South Pole)
5. and even consider a hydro-kinetic feature; propellers, or some technology to harness the constant tidal movement?
But lastly, without getting into a discussion on aesthetics, I personally would be looking at the Space Station, curved shapes with equalized pressure; marine life; submarines; a shape that would allow the tidal movement to pass; bio-mimetics; coral reefs?
This is a statement from the Project"s Sponsors-
"The base itself will comprise three floors constructed in the shape of a Mayan pyramid in homage to the civilization that once flourished in Belize."
This actually fascinates me as a very challenging design/engineering problem, but I do not understand the issues; can anyone help clarify them?
(e.g. how would water, constantly moving back and forth around a square shape, affect the object? similiar to, but much more extreme, to wind and rain on the ext./corner of my apartment building? but we know how to reinforce for that, and don't have to build round buildings)
Thanks. Ebesan
1. a square shape?
Wouldn't the pressures be structurally uneven and extremely inefficient?
The pressure is the same everywhere. The strength of the structure will not be the same everywhere. This will likely not be a big deal, because they intend to place the base in 60' of water, pressurizing the interior to 21'. Pressures will be in the car tire ranges, nothing crazy.
2. the 24 hr. tidal flow; tidal hydraulics; wouldn't the shape cause some potentially dangerous pressures? (inertia, drag, pressure differential, vortexes? what is the term for this, hydro-dynamics?)
I suppose this depends where you place it, but in most places the tidal flows are very weak. Only in certain constricted channels are there tides that would pose a huge problem.
posted by ssg at 9:00 PM on December 3, 2010
Wouldn't the pressures be structurally uneven and extremely inefficient?
The pressure is the same everywhere. The strength of the structure will not be the same everywhere. This will likely not be a big deal, because they intend to place the base in 60' of water, pressurizing the interior to 21'. Pressures will be in the car tire ranges, nothing crazy.
2. the 24 hr. tidal flow; tidal hydraulics; wouldn't the shape cause some potentially dangerous pressures? (inertia, drag, pressure differential, vortexes? what is the term for this, hydro-dynamics?)
I suppose this depends where you place it, but in most places the tidal flows are very weak. Only in certain constricted channels are there tides that would pose a huge problem.
posted by ssg at 9:00 PM on December 3, 2010
I think this is sort of like the Freedom Ship: an impractical dream which will never come to fruition.
Anybody can create a web site, and put pretty pictures on it, and try to get people to invest. That doesn't mean they really have a plan that makes sense, or that anything will ever come of it.
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 11:56 PM on December 3, 2010 [2 favorites]
Anybody can create a web site, and put pretty pictures on it, and try to get people to invest. That doesn't mean they really have a plan that makes sense, or that anything will ever come of it.
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 11:56 PM on December 3, 2010 [2 favorites]
You, ebesan, ask good, critical questions.
I'd recommend finding a good civil engineer in your friend network and having this chat. You'll get the terminology you need to explore further, and many land problems involve water issues, though not to the extent that this one would. Still, I'd start there.
I am with Chocolate Pickle's assessment that square structures are easier to make in Google Sketchup, and sometimes, all it takes is a concept to separate folks from their money.
Not sure from your profile what your age and experience is, but if you are pre-college, you may want to explore being something technical. You ask very good questions, and I've found over the years, good questions are an indicator of a good mind.... much more so than having all the answers.
posted by FauxScot at 5:05 AM on December 4, 2010
I'd recommend finding a good civil engineer in your friend network and having this chat. You'll get the terminology you need to explore further, and many land problems involve water issues, though not to the extent that this one would. Still, I'd start there.
I am with Chocolate Pickle's assessment that square structures are easier to make in Google Sketchup, and sometimes, all it takes is a concept to separate folks from their money.
Not sure from your profile what your age and experience is, but if you are pre-college, you may want to explore being something technical. You ask very good questions, and I've found over the years, good questions are an indicator of a good mind.... much more so than having all the answers.
posted by FauxScot at 5:05 AM on December 4, 2010
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posted by spacefire at 7:33 PM on December 3, 2010