Signs a New York rental apartment is not infested with vermin?
November 10, 2010 9:34 PM   Subscribe

In New York, when searching for a rental apartment, what are some rule-of-thumb features usually associated with NOT having pests or vermin -- features that you might be able to find just by looking at, say, the Craigslist ad (e.g. refurbished apartments with granite countertops generally a good bet, high-up apartments, etc.)?
posted by shivohum to Home & Garden (17 answers total) 5 users marked this as a favorite
 
As you noted, basement or ground floor apartments are good to avoid if you're looking to minimize pests, as are apartments over businesses that deal with food.

Newer buildings will probably be better. Also, smaller buildings -- the best apartment I've ever lived in WRT pests had only three units, and we were on the top floor.

You might also have better luck with buildings owned by private individuals as opposed to management companies, particularly if you'd be in the same building as your landlord.
posted by Narrative Priorities at 9:58 PM on November 10, 2010 [1 favorite]


It should NOT be above a restaurant. (Or also maybe next door to a restaurant?) That's your best bet right there.

Recently renovated places with nice fixtures mean nothing.

High up is good, but if your neighbors are slobs that won't matter.

Beyond that, you're going to have to actually look at the place.

I have to say, I've had a vermin problem in exactly one apartment, in my decade of hopping around NYC living situations. And that was a commune with 15+ residents, half of whom were on drugs (the other half of whom were hippies who composted and didn't believe in cleaning supplies). None of my friends seem to have problems, either. Sure, you'll see the occasional mouse in winter*, or a fly will sneak in when you habitually have your windows open in summer. But vermin? Not really all that big a deal.

*If this happens, you want a course of strategically placed snap traps, a deep clean of your kitchen, and a thorough search for tiny holes around the baseboards which should be plugged with steel wool. The mouse will leave. I promise.
posted by Sara C. at 9:59 PM on November 10, 2010 [1 favorite]


Best answer: I'd love to know this, but I don't think it exists, sadly.

My guess it would need to be an apartment (brand new construction?) that does not contain any food ever and is sealed up airtight because mice can fit through a 1/4 of an inch or larger. Perhaps a steel bubble? All it takes is one entry point, and you've got mice. And just because you're tidy and never leave a single crumb of food around, doesn't mean that your neighbors are as neat. Mice are typically a building-wide issue.

Mice are excellent climbers and are capable of gaining entry through holes around soffit vents and around cables entering the building, through holes in gable vent screens, and through turbine and box vents on roofs.

“Every building has a pipe that goes through a wall somewhere,” he said. “And most times, the space around the pipe is big enough for a mouse to get through.”

Exterminators will plugged up holes with expanding foam and steel wool but ours always warns that at some point, the mice would chew through it. And some apartments cannot be fully mouse-proofed.

I would be wary of HVAC units (have had mice come in by squeezing in between the HVAC unit and the floor) and I would also get on my hands and knees and inspect the baseboards in the kitchen. Also open cabinets underneath the sink. Check the stove, the fridge, the dishwasher (if you have one), etc. to look for holes or activity. The design of the kitchen can matter because any applicance could be either covering up a mouse hole or creating a weakness, where if a mouse did get in, you couldn't patch it up.
posted by kathryn at 10:14 PM on November 10, 2010


Kathryn's mention of dishwashers reminds me - in most cases, dishwasher = engraved invitation for roaches. I wouldn't say absolutely don't move in somewhere with a dishwasher, but if it's an older building and the unit hasn't been renovated in a long time, that's definitely points off.
posted by Sara C. at 10:36 PM on November 10, 2010 [2 favorites]


I lived in 2 buildings, one of them had intermittent roach problem, and the other did not. That's a small sample size but here's what I noticed: in the first building, basement was dark, wet and unkempt and the apartments were much better heated. In second, basement is very neat and clean, apartments are *much* colder, and an exterminator constantly makes the rounds like once in ~3 weeks (in the other building that happened maybe twice a year).
posted by rainy at 10:43 PM on November 10, 2010


Look for an exterminator sign-up sheet in the lobby or elevator, and see how mnay apartments have signed up, for which pests, and how frequently the service comes. Most vermin problems are building-wide and that will tell you a lot about your potential neighbors.

Also inspect common trash collection areas.
posted by peanut_mcgillicuty at 4:55 AM on November 11, 2010 [2 favorites]


Oh god dishwashers I forgot about that...

Yeah, one of the most horrifying experiences I ever had while looking at apartments was when I made the mistake of opening a dishwasher in one of them.
posted by Narrative Priorities at 6:13 AM on November 11, 2010


Every building has vermin, it would be naive to think that over 1.5 million people (I'm assuming manhattan) can live so close together without them entering your building somehow.

Having said that, keep your apartment as clean as possible and don't leave food out. You may still get the roach or mouse that is passing on by, but they won't tell their friends about the awesome free lunch they had in 5B.
posted by darkgroove at 6:16 AM on November 11, 2010 [1 favorite]


I'm embarrassed to admit this utter stupidity on my part, but in the spirit of helping out someone who might be as clueless:

If you see giant wads of old steel wool stuffed around the base of a radiator, run. I learned the hard way.

(I had an appalling mouse problem in that place. It was an older building - not pre war, or post war, just war - and when construction began across the street, we were suddenly overrun with mice. Now I live in a newer building and it's blessedly clean and hole-free.)
posted by CunningLinguist at 7:55 AM on November 11, 2010


There's nothing in a Craigslist ad that would help you. You'll have to see the building and the apartment.

Renovated means nothing. Landlords renovate apartments as they are vacated, so if the empty apartment you're looking at is renovated, other apartments adjacent might still be hovels. Also, "renovations" can be very superficial, which does not address underlying, behind-the-wall problems.
posted by thebazilist at 7:59 AM on November 11, 2010 [2 favorites]


Instead of relying on rules of thumb, check the building's violation history on the HPD website.
posted by Mavri at 8:07 AM on November 11, 2010 [1 favorite]


Best answer: I agree that your best best is a new building. Next best is a building that's just been completely gutted. Next best is a building with really low turnover of residents, and the residents being older and middle class or above.

But, I've had the opposite experience to Sara C., where in all but one of the apartments I and my friends have ever lived in in NYC, there was at least one sighting of a mouse or roach.

Even in the brand spanking new building my friend moved into in Chelsea, which was extremely shi-shi, looked clean, and was filled with rich yuppies and models, it only took a couple years for the roach/mouse problem to start.

Last thing: DEFINITELY don't move in over a restaurant, and DEFINITELY don't move in where major construction will be ongoing anywhere on the block (it drives out the vermin to look for other place to go).
posted by Ashley801 at 9:14 AM on November 11, 2010


Oh, and when you do go to look at the buildings, look at the basement first. As someone said upthread, if the basement is nasty, you're a lot more likely to have a problem. And even if it's not nasty, if there is a vermin/roach problem, there's a good chance you'll get a sight of it maybe even in one visit down there.
posted by Ashley801 at 9:16 AM on November 11, 2010


I think the difference, to me, is that "at least one sighting" is not the same as "vermin problem". This is a city. As darkgroove says, with millions of people living in such close quarters, it would be ridiculous to think you could somehow avoid ever seeing a mouse or a roach. If you don't want to have at least one sighting of some sort of pest in your home, stay in suburbia.

The issue you can control, however, is infestation. And that's a situation where the above pieces of advice apply.

(I'd revise the "exterminator sign-up sheet" thing to be: you should ask your landlord when you look at the apartment how often the exterminator comes by. If he doesn't know what you're talking about, run. If he says some ridiculously low number like "twice a year", seriously consider how much you want to live there. Monthly is a good answer. My landlord is shit and my building is rather run down, but we still have a monthly exterminator visit.)
posted by Sara C. at 9:41 AM on November 11, 2010


Also, you can ask other tenants. When I moved recently, I spent an evening hanging around outside the building I was considering, button-holing people about stuff like noise issues and vermin.
posted by CunningLinguist at 9:43 AM on November 11, 2010


My apartment should be totally infested based on things people are suggesting you avoid (my building has restaurants on the first floor, it's a century old, and my apartment's on a low floor), which freaked me out when I moved in, but I have yet to see a single pest/signs of any little visitors. We keep the kitchen spotless, which I'm sure helps, but frequent extermination seems to be the most important thing-- our building has a monthly exterminator visit, and I've never seen more than 3 reported roach sightings (in a 10-story building) on the sign-up list at a time. So, my vote's with 1) finding out how often your prospective landlord has an exterminator visit, and then 2) keeping food sealed up at all times wherever you end up.
posted by oinopaponton at 11:07 AM on November 11, 2010


Response by poster: Thanks everyone!
posted by shivohum at 3:59 PM on November 11, 2010


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