How to find cities to move to
October 21, 2010 6:07 AM   Subscribe

How can I find out which cities (in the US or India) would be good places for me to live in? I'm in my mid-30s, single, female, and Indian-American.

For eight years, I've been working and living in a relatively small (American) town as an engineer. Most of my coworkers were much older than me and had families. My "friends" were the other single coworkers, also considerably older than me. On top of that, I was the only non-white person in the group. (I'm Indian-American.) I liked my coworkers, so it didn't seem like a big deal. Now I realize that it was. I feel like the Indian part of my upbringing has been brushed aside for eight years, and apparently it's a lot more important to me than I used to think it was.

Add to that little things like the fact that I have a more dressed up, polished dressing style and worked in an office with an informal, T-shirt/sweatshirt dress code. Or the fact that I like to meet new people or learn about other cultures, while no one else in my workplace did. (Nothing wrong with that. Different people just have different interests.)

I should have realized eight years ago that I wasn't a good cultural fit for this town or office. I could just kick myself for not taking steps to change my life sooner. As it is, it took a layoff for me to finally come to my senses. I've been very isolated for far too long but was too busy working to notice.

I'd like to have a (real) social life that consists, at least partially, of people like me (w.r.t. age, background, etc.), but where? I'm pretty sure NYC fits the bill, but I don't want to restrict my search to just one city. How can I find out which cities in the US or India have sizeable populations of 30-something, single, Indian-American (or perhaps for Indian cities, Indians with more westernized values) professionals in them? Once I find the cities, how do I find the right neighborhoods? After spending the last eight years not fitting in, I want to find a place where I do.

Also, the job opportunities don't have to be in engineering. I'm willing to take a job in another field as long as it's analytical and teamwork-oriented. I'm trying to be flexible here.

I'd like to do some web research to narrow down the cities. Once I have a job offer, maybe I can visit. I'm unemployed, so I don't have the money to visit right now. So, what website or web search tricks do I use to get the information I want? A lot of sites about cities to live in focus on factors I care less about, like weather, pollution, or cost of living.

Please guide me, hive mind. I'm really lost. Thanks in advance for your help.
posted by anonymous to Grab Bag (23 answers total) 2 users marked this as a favorite
 
Um, I don't know how you go about searching, but here are some suggestions for cities that fit your description:

In the US: New York, Chicago, Boston, LA, San Francisco, Houston, Atlanta, Seattle, to name a few. Most of the big cities in the US will have sizeable populations of 30-something, single, Indian-American professionals. It surprises me a little that you aren't aware of this.

In India: Delhi, Mumbai, and Bangalore, for certain. Calcutta, also, I would guess, although I'm less certain.

You don't mention what religious background you come from, but that can be significant in choosing an Indian city.

To find the right neighborhoods within the cities, in the US, you could first check where the Indian restaurants and/or groceries are concentrated. That's one good initial indicator. There's probably an organization of Indian Engineers in North America, or some such. That could be a good source of information.

Is it important to you that the people be Indian or would South Asian be sufficient? That could broaden your sources of information, as well.
posted by bardophile at 6:27 AM on October 21, 2010 [1 favorite]


Hyderabad in India, I would have thought, too.
posted by Infinite Jest at 6:28 AM on October 21, 2010


Well, Google quickly turned up this list, which might provide a few useful leads. If you search for US cities of decent size, with substantial Indian populations and reasonably functional economies, it'll probably be safe to assume that there will be people there who tick all of your boxes.

I'll also put in a plug for Cleveland. I'm Caucasian, but Cleveland has a healthy Indian-American population, which I'm especially aware of because my brother married a half-Indian girl whose father is a sort of pillar of the Indian community here.
posted by jon1270 at 6:30 AM on October 21, 2010


It seems to me that most larger cities will have an indian-american population. Cincinnati, Detroit, and Kansas City all do. I suppose you just need to know where to look.
posted by dpx.mfx at 6:36 AM on October 21, 2010


As an engineer and for quality of life reasons I would suggest Hyderabad, Bangalore or Mysore
posted by london302 at 6:36 AM on October 21, 2010


Chicago has a pretty large Indian community, both in the city itself & in the surrounding suburbs. I'm not sure about the suburbs (because I hate suburbs), but in the city itself the largest concentrations are up along Devon, and down at UIC.

As for India itself, Bangalore. For one thing, the weather is approximately nine million times better than Mumbai (IMHO). The traffic is also better, but some areas of B'lore have equally staggering traffic jams so that's not quite so cut & dried. Visit first, of course.

It isn't clear from your question whether you're originally from India or not, so the following remark may not be relevant: if you haven't been to India in a few years prepare to be surprised. Expats frequently return home to find it isn't home any more (speaking from personal experience).
posted by aramaic at 6:56 AM on October 21, 2010


Houston has a HUGE Indian/Indian-American community, and tons and tons of engineering jobs.

Houston area school children speak more languages than any other city in the US, other than NYC. Houston is an extraordinarily international city and so far has had almost no ill effects from the recession.

Come on down!
posted by pomegranate at 7:16 AM on October 21, 2010


Have you considered Canada? Toronto is a great city and has a large Indian population on all levels of the assimilation spectrum. I'm more familiar with Vancouver's East Asian population, but I'm guessing they have a fairly decent Indian population as well.

The obvious (and somewhat stereotypical) suggestion would be any place with lots of tech/IT folks, like Silicon Valley. That's still a pretty casual atmosphere. However, in my experience at a larger company that recruited a lot of Indian-Indian and Indian-American folks, they do try to not just recognize but have fun with the cultural diversity, particularly when such a large part of the work force comes from one culture on the other side of the planet. So we'd have some Indian dishes mixed into the cafeteria food, or celebrate certain Indian holidays (the only one I can think of is Diwali, but I know there were others that didn't just serve as "the one kind of near Christmas").
posted by Madamina at 7:31 AM on October 21, 2010


New Jersey has Indians a-plenty! Boston, too… but a lot are trapped in grad schools.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 7:34 AM on October 21, 2010


Pittsburgh has a biggish Indian population and lots of engineering jobs. Westinghouse is adding a thousand or so positions in the next couple years.
posted by oreofuchi at 8:06 AM on October 21, 2010


Having been in a similar situation long ago, I made the leap to NYC and have never regretted it. Not sure why you wouldn't restrict your search to just one city if you know it's a better fit in every one of the ways you've described. Keep in mind, NYC's a big city — there are many different lifestyles you could choose here.
posted by anildash at 8:14 AM on October 21, 2010


I'll plug Pittsburgh a little bit. It's full of scientists, engineers, and doctors, and a lot of them are single male Indian/Indian-American guys. It doesn't have quite as vibrant of a social scene as NYC or other big cities, but what is there is good. There are plenty of nice restaurants and bars if that's your thing, a lot of good music, plenty of museums/galleries, plenty of outdoor recreation opportunities, and if you're looking to settle down and start a family, it would be a very nice city for child-raising.

In terms of neighborhoods, if you want to live in the city, I would look at the more-upscale neighborhoods near the universities, particularly Shadyside and Squirrel Hill. If you like the suburban life, I would go for the eastern suburbs (especially Monroeville, where a huge proportion of the Indian population seems to be concentrated: that is where the Hindu temple is, and also where the best vegetarian Indian restaurant in town is to be found.)

Disclaimer: I'm a white American girl. That said, I'm in grad school with a LOT of Indian and/or Indian-American people, most of whom seem to have a pretty good time -- my university here has a really big South Asian community, and the student group puts on all kinds of cultural events all year long, including a giant Diwali celebration.
posted by kataclysm at 8:17 AM on October 21, 2010


There might be something specific I don't know about Houston's Indian-American community, but in my experience (as a white person), if you don't like living in a place with a bland, insular, small-town vibe, you shouldn't consider Houston. It's not a very cosmopolitan place at all, and most people live in homogeneous suburbs. It also doesn't strike me as a city with a big singles scene.

Don't choose a city just because there are a lot of engineers there, otherwise you will be in exactly the same situation all over again.
posted by Sara C. at 8:56 AM on October 21, 2010


Canada has roughly ten times the South Asian (mostly Indian) population that the US does, per capita. You will find what you are seeking in any of Vancouver, Calgary (which just elected the continent's first big-city Muslim mayor- and he's Ismaili to boot), Edmonton, Toronto, or Ottawa.

Montreal has a relatively tiny East Indian community, however. Per capita, it's Vancouver-Toronto-Calgary. Come on up.
posted by ethnomethodologist at 8:56 AM on October 21, 2010 [1 favorite]


OP, I'm Indian-American, late 20's, and an engineer. These are the places I would consider- Along with some thoughts as to some other towns:

Also, a dictionary for everyone else with some terms, so that this doesn't come of as racist:

desi - first-generation indian. Our parents were the ones that came from India. We grew up here, having pretty American cultural values. We tend to idolize our Indian background, and we often participate in things to help us keep in touch with our culture. Our parents signed us up for Indian dance classes, tabla classes, hindi classes, etc. Generally, we view being Indian as kind of an oddity growing up, b/c we were a huge minority, but now that we're expanding, we find it pretty cool and want to keep in touch with our roots.

fob, import, straight from india. These are the guys that come straight from India to work in the US. They go the H-1B -> Greencard route. Their kids will be desis. While they may look the same, culturally we're a lot different. They have distinct Indian values, we have American values with Indian paint. They view being Indian as normal, tend to know 2-3 different Indian languages (whereas we only know Hindi), and will spend insane amounts of time discussing Indian politics.

I've seen desis and fobs be friends, but I've never seen it work in a large-scale setting. In college and in life afterwards, everyone seems to stick to their own group. Non-indians usually don't understand why, as they kind of view us as the same. I've actually NEVER seen a desi-fob couple get married.

So with those caveats and explanations:

1) San Francisco - This is the tech hub of the world. Lots of Indians here, both Desi and Indian-born.

2) Houston - Houston has a lot of Indians in the late 20's and 30's b/c their parents came there in the late 1970's to 1980's to work at oil companies.

3) Dallas (where I currently live) - Dallas has a huge Indian scene, but not a huge desi scene for anyone past 30. We're an extended suburb, so a lot of families, etc. Most of the Indians that are single in their late 20's and 30's are straight from India - which is culturally different.

4) Chicago - Chicago has a vibrant Indian scene, as Indians have been there since the late 1970's and 1980's.

5) DC - DC is a city full of transplants, and a lot of young people are in that area. TONS of desis working for the government, different consulting agencies, etc.

-----

Cities I would cross off that would mention:

1) Seattle - I love Seattle, but it's not really that good for "desi-ness". If you think about it, Seattle didn't explode until the mid-1980's on the tech scene - that's when all the Indians moved in. There are a lot of older Indians there (from India), but all the first-generation desi's are currently 15-20 years old. I have a lot of male desi friends in the 25-30 age bracket, and they really struggle finding other single desi's, as most of the Indians that age in Seattle are "imports"

2) NYC - I absolutely do not like the Indians that live in the tri-state area. A lot of them are very uneducated, the kids are basically gangsters, and the three times I've been to an Indian party I've seen a fight break out. That being said, NYC is very, very large, and enough of a smorgasboard that there is usually something for everyone. But I believe the prevailing stereotype is pretty poor.
posted by unexpected at 8:56 AM on October 21, 2010 [3 favorites]


If you are well-educated and will be running in white collar circles, I wouldn't worry about unexpected's classification of the NYC South Asian scene. I know lots and lots of professional Indian-Americans in their 20's and 30's who are not hoodlums. Attorneys, accountants, engineers, and the like.
posted by Sara C. at 9:12 AM on October 21, 2010 [1 favorite]


unexpected, I'm a desi half of a desi-fob marriage - I get that you were making a generalization, but there's many, many different types of people in what you classify as desi's and fob's

OP - as others have mentioned, most sizeable US cities have reasonable south asian populations. I think you're better off thinking about the type of lifestyle you want to live (urban vs. suburban, that sort of thing), and then narrowing from there.

Also, if you have a large extended family, consider whether you want to move to cities where you have a support network (assuming you're close to family members) already. I found that I am more likely to partake in 'Indian' activities, like going to the temple, navratri, bhangra night at one of Boston's many universities etc, when I have a large group of folks who 'get it' to go with - and in a new city, you're may be more able jumpstart that with family.
posted by darsh at 9:14 AM on October 21, 2010


that's cool darsh! Now I can throw it out there! I just make that point b/c most desi's I know (myself included) would never do it. It'd be really tough, and I'm sure you can speak to some of the cultural challenges that you guys have overcome. You're a dude, right? Out of curiousity, have you seen it the other way? The hardline stance is usually from girls- they never want to consider a fob guy- and their parents don't want to either. I suspect that with guys it's much more likely.

and the family thing is totally true. Large extended family = cousins = friends of cousins = built in support circle!
posted by unexpected at 9:22 AM on October 21, 2010


You can be a mid-thirties single woman in Hyderabad without problems even though it is ostensibly a somewhat traditionalist Muslim majority city. Facebook, Google, Microsoft and a bunch of other American companies have established large campuses there.

As a result it has attracted a lot of young, ambitious grads. You might feel somewhat older than many of them. There are plenty of reasonable apartment complexes within a close drive of Gachibowli and HITEC City. No idea of prices, but inflation generally is 10-15% per annum.

Hyderabad is developing a lot, but it's still a cultural backwater in lots of respects. Shopping is OK at best. There are some decent restaurants. I'm reliably informed by people I've met that live there that it's a nicer place to live than, say, Delhi - not least because the climate is better.

The new generation of Indian graduates are Westernizing culture a fair bit - it's still a slightly two tone town in the sense of the more traditional old city and the newer campuses that have sprung up. There is still a noticeable difference in the freedom that young men and young women have. For example, in the offices I've been, it's still common for half the women to be wearing more traditional clothing. When I met up with a (single, female) acquaintance, she still got the odd raised eyebrow for being on her own, out, at night.
posted by MuffinMan at 10:01 AM on October 21, 2010


The DC metro area would be an obvious choice. Perhaps depending on what you mean by engineering, but government contractors are doing well and use a ton of technical staff.

Also, living out in the Virginia burbs, I've noted that at least two of the multiplexes have started consistently devoting a screen to Bollywood films, indicating a pretty massive Indian population out here.
posted by Naberius at 10:26 AM on October 21, 2010


Well, for one, desi and fob are terms not limited to Indians. Pakistanis also identify and are identified as desi, as are Bangladeshis, etc. Also, the desi fob dichotomy isn't nearly as stark, in my experience. And it doesn't take into consideration people like me, who have gone back and forth between the US and the home country, and so tend to have stronger ties with both places than the desi a la unexpected or the fob a la unexpected.

I'd be really really wary of deciding without checking it out that you could only fit in with Indian-Americans who were born in the US, as opposed to Indian-Americans who were immigrants to the US.

And plenty of Pakistani-Americans are married to Pakistanis who only migrated *after* getting married, so the whole "they can't really get along without a lot of extra effort" really rings false to me. And yes, of both genders.

But OP, to get back to your question, I think you need to do some traveling, if you can afford it. I know that a lot of Pakistanis love Michigan. I also know that I would never live there if I could help it, but the only reason I know that is that I have spent a significant amount of time there. I think anildash makes a good point about NYC being big enough and multicultural enough that there is room for a variety of groups, even within the desi scene.
posted by bardophile at 11:17 AM on October 21, 2010


After spending the last eight years not fitting in, I want to find a place where I do

Unfortunately, some people are just born to stand out. Striving to go with the flow and yet maintaining your identity works much better.

Email is in profile, if you want to discuss more.
posted by xm at 12:47 PM on October 21, 2010


Not the kind of answer you asked for, but you might think about Australia too.
posted by AmbroseChapel at 2:44 PM on October 21, 2010


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