Is a sincere apology in this situation enough?
October 6, 2010 8:22 PM Subscribe
I made a stupid mistake and sent an email to my lecturer in which I told her to "chill the %^%$% out." Yes, I didn't even write "fuck". Should an instant and sincere apology be accepted, and should I be concerned about my final mark from this person?
I am in the process of getting everything together for my Masters application. I'm entirely stressed; finishing the last paper in my Hons course. My dad passed away earlier this year, and at a cellular level, I am still dealing with that (I was in New Zealand at the time, he in South Africa and I wasn't able to fly home).
This particular lecturer is also the MA coordinator. Every time I have asked her a question about my enrollment, she's given me the official, standard reply, which I can respect, but I also feel that she should understand why I am asking so many questions. Applying for a Masters is kind of a big thing, right? She seems to get very worked up when I ask anyone else in the faculty about it.
I have secured a provisional (awesome) supervisor, who I went to see this morning so he could provisionally sign my application form. I also emailed the head of school to ask him if I need him to sign off on it, or whether I should wait until just before I submit my official proposal to get his approval. His reply was most helpful and courteous; he also cc'd the MA coordinator on his reply. She in turn, sent him and me an email in which she said she was "disturbed" by the fact that I seemed to think that all I needed was the head of school and supervisor's signature to complete my application.
Every time I have asked her a question about the MA I have told her, "I know I have to submit an official proposal; all I'm doing is getting the necessary signatures required for the application form. I may not be here at the end of term; these people may not be here. I am doing this now for convenience sake."
So this morning I lost my pip and unfortunately, instead of bitching to my pal, I sent the email to her. The exact line was "Someone needs to take a **&^%$%%$ chill pill, right? Jesus H."
I immediately realised I had sent it to the wrong person. So I picked up the phone, called her and humbly apologized. She was pretty non-responsive and five minutes later I received an email saying that she has referred my MA application to the head of school and will have nothing further to do with it.
My supervisor says, while the event was unfortunate, he is on my side completely, and that he will talk to the head of school, and that I don't need to worry. I know it's a pretty bad thing to have done, but surely this happens all the time? It was a clumsy, yet honest mistake. Should the fact that I sincerely apologized, with good reason, not be enough? Furthermore, this lecturer still has to mark one of my assignments and my forthcoming exam. Should i be worried that what has happened will influence my grade?
I am in the process of getting everything together for my Masters application. I'm entirely stressed; finishing the last paper in my Hons course. My dad passed away earlier this year, and at a cellular level, I am still dealing with that (I was in New Zealand at the time, he in South Africa and I wasn't able to fly home).
This particular lecturer is also the MA coordinator. Every time I have asked her a question about my enrollment, she's given me the official, standard reply, which I can respect, but I also feel that she should understand why I am asking so many questions. Applying for a Masters is kind of a big thing, right? She seems to get very worked up when I ask anyone else in the faculty about it.
I have secured a provisional (awesome) supervisor, who I went to see this morning so he could provisionally sign my application form. I also emailed the head of school to ask him if I need him to sign off on it, or whether I should wait until just before I submit my official proposal to get his approval. His reply was most helpful and courteous; he also cc'd the MA coordinator on his reply. She in turn, sent him and me an email in which she said she was "disturbed" by the fact that I seemed to think that all I needed was the head of school and supervisor's signature to complete my application.
Every time I have asked her a question about the MA I have told her, "I know I have to submit an official proposal; all I'm doing is getting the necessary signatures required for the application form. I may not be here at the end of term; these people may not be here. I am doing this now for convenience sake."
So this morning I lost my pip and unfortunately, instead of bitching to my pal, I sent the email to her. The exact line was "Someone needs to take a **&^%$%%$ chill pill, right? Jesus H."
I immediately realised I had sent it to the wrong person. So I picked up the phone, called her and humbly apologized. She was pretty non-responsive and five minutes later I received an email saying that she has referred my MA application to the head of school and will have nothing further to do with it.
My supervisor says, while the event was unfortunate, he is on my side completely, and that he will talk to the head of school, and that I don't need to worry. I know it's a pretty bad thing to have done, but surely this happens all the time? It was a clumsy, yet honest mistake. Should the fact that I sincerely apologized, with good reason, not be enough? Furthermore, this lecturer still has to mark one of my assignments and my forthcoming exam. Should i be worried that what has happened will influence my grade?
She has been professional with you in the past while you were asking questions and incredibly professional when you apologized. While you may have doubts because you are so stressed out now, it seems like she will do the same for your remaining time with her.
I'm fairly certain she has had to deal with difficult students before. You are hers this semester.
If you have gmail, one of the labs is having a feature that delays actually sending the e-mail for like 10 seconds. It usually takes that long for me to realize a typo or I forgot to attach the attachment. In your case, you should train your eye to the "To:" line.
posted by spec80 at 8:36 PM on October 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
I'm fairly certain she has had to deal with difficult students before. You are hers this semester.
If you have gmail, one of the labs is having a feature that delays actually sending the e-mail for like 10 seconds. It usually takes that long for me to realize a typo or I forgot to attach the attachment. In your case, you should train your eye to the "To:" line.
posted by spec80 at 8:36 PM on October 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
I would start applying to other schools...
posted by WhiteWhale at 8:38 PM on October 6, 2010 [6 favorites]
posted by WhiteWhale at 8:38 PM on October 6, 2010 [6 favorites]
Are your assignments/examinations submitted anonymously (i.e. student number, with the marker not being able to correlate student number with name)? If so, I guess you don't have to worry too much, but if this person is the MA coordinator then you may still have to work with her *after* you've been accepted for the Masters programme, at least on administrative issues, and her cooperation and goodwill would probably make life slightly easier for you.
I would pull out most of the stops on this one: try to see the MA coordinator in person, consider bringing a small gift like a small box of artisanal chocolates (something that would function as an appropriate token of apology but not be construed as a bribe... actually I'm not really sure about whether this part is a good idea, you make the call), and explain that you have been stressed by external circumstances e.g. death of your father. It seems important that you prevent this bridge from burning up completely.
posted by nihraguk at 8:39 PM on October 6, 2010
I would pull out most of the stops on this one: try to see the MA coordinator in person, consider bringing a small gift like a small box of artisanal chocolates (something that would function as an appropriate token of apology but not be construed as a bribe... actually I'm not really sure about whether this part is a good idea, you make the call), and explain that you have been stressed by external circumstances e.g. death of your father. It seems important that you prevent this bridge from burning up completely.
posted by nihraguk at 8:39 PM on October 6, 2010
You're most likely ok. Any sort of retribution would be seen as very unprofessional on her part, and her reputation is at stake here, too.
You've been (pretty rightfully) embarrassed, but beyond being humble for the rest of the term, I don't think any other action is in order.
posted by Gilbert at 8:41 PM on October 6, 2010
You've been (pretty rightfully) embarrassed, but beyond being humble for the rest of the term, I don't think any other action is in order.
posted by Gilbert at 8:41 PM on October 6, 2010
Don't stress out about it. This happens to me all the time (emails that were not meant to be copied to me, that blast about some aspect of the course or my handling of something). It's funny and I never care. People just get wound up - that's life. Your supervisor has your back and knows the circumstances.
There is no way that your lecturer would even consider retaliation. It would be unprofessional and this is too unimportant to bother with, in the scheme of things. It will have happened to her lots of times before -- and it will doubtless happen again.
Let it go.
posted by Susurration at 8:48 PM on October 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
There is no way that your lecturer would even consider retaliation. It would be unprofessional and this is too unimportant to bother with, in the scheme of things. It will have happened to her lots of times before -- and it will doubtless happen again.
Let it go.
posted by Susurration at 8:48 PM on October 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
Yeah, I guess I don't see what the issue is. You made the mistake of talking shit about her behind her back and then sending it to her; she referred your application to someone else to maintain impartiality. In this particular situation, she is behaving professionally and you, in spite of your initial fuck-up, also did the right thing by calling immediately to apologize. Everybody was an adult. What more do you need?
Generally, if somebody in a bureaucracy seems defensive of their turf and their procedures, just follow their lead. Convenience is not the point of bureaucracy; reason is not what drives a bureaucracy. Keep your head down and your mouth shut until you've actually been wronged (not inconvenienced).
posted by McBearclaw at 8:53 PM on October 6, 2010
Generally, if somebody in a bureaucracy seems defensive of their turf and their procedures, just follow their lead. Convenience is not the point of bureaucracy; reason is not what drives a bureaucracy. Keep your head down and your mouth shut until you've actually been wronged (not inconvenienced).
posted by McBearclaw at 8:53 PM on October 6, 2010
I'm a DGS, albeit not a DGS wherever you are.
You did the right thing by apologizing; she did the right thing by recusing herself from further handling your graduate application. Given that at least one other person is aware of your contretemps, I'm guessing that she will do her best to be professional when it comes to marking your papers.
However, this:
I know it's a pretty bad thing to have done, but surely this happens all the time? It was a clumsy, yet honest mistake. Should the fact that I sincerely apologized, with good reason, not be enough?
Well...actually, no, it doesn't really happen all the time. I mean, I'm perfectly well aware that my students may be thinking evil thoughts about me, given my reputation as a short but cranky dragon, but those thoughts tend not to wind up in my in-box by accident.
(On another note: it's not clear to me exactly what sparked this conflict. What were you asking that couldn't be adequately handled with "official, standard" responses? I can think of some questions that, as a DGS, I pretty much can't answer any other way. Incidentally, in my neck of the woods, "provisional signatures" can cause real problems later ["but Instructor X signed off on it!"], so it's quite possible that that's what made her balk.)
posted by thomas j wise at 8:53 PM on October 6, 2010 [2 favorites]
You did the right thing by apologizing; she did the right thing by recusing herself from further handling your graduate application. Given that at least one other person is aware of your contretemps, I'm guessing that she will do her best to be professional when it comes to marking your papers.
However, this:
I know it's a pretty bad thing to have done, but surely this happens all the time? It was a clumsy, yet honest mistake. Should the fact that I sincerely apologized, with good reason, not be enough?
Well...actually, no, it doesn't really happen all the time. I mean, I'm perfectly well aware that my students may be thinking evil thoughts about me, given my reputation as a short but cranky dragon, but those thoughts tend not to wind up in my in-box by accident.
(On another note: it's not clear to me exactly what sparked this conflict. What were you asking that couldn't be adequately handled with "official, standard" responses? I can think of some questions that, as a DGS, I pretty much can't answer any other way. Incidentally, in my neck of the woods, "provisional signatures" can cause real problems later ["but Instructor X signed off on it!"], so it's quite possible that that's what made her balk.)
posted by thomas j wise at 8:53 PM on October 6, 2010 [2 favorites]
I know it's a pretty bad thing to have done, but surely this happens all the time?
No, no it does not. I am an academic and I have never even heard of someone trying to get into a program behaving this badly.
It was a clumsy, yet honest mistake.
No it was not an "honest mistake." It was you being an asshole with a temper and poor impulse control.
I coordinate an MA program, and if anyone sent an email like that to one of my colleagues, the sender would be kicked out of the program. I would not care if you were in the right over the issue, or if the person you sent it to is an ass, or that your dad had died. Our graduates go on to represent our program in the community and in the profession. I can't have someone prone to this kind of behavior representing us. You'd be out.
That said, you have done the best you can in repairing this and should now STFU and hope it blows over. In the meantime, you might want to talk to someone about your temper and about learning to own your mistakes.
posted by LarryC at 9:07 PM on October 6, 2010 [29 favorites]
No, no it does not. I am an academic and I have never even heard of someone trying to get into a program behaving this badly.
It was a clumsy, yet honest mistake.
No it was not an "honest mistake." It was you being an asshole with a temper and poor impulse control.
I coordinate an MA program, and if anyone sent an email like that to one of my colleagues, the sender would be kicked out of the program. I would not care if you were in the right over the issue, or if the person you sent it to is an ass, or that your dad had died. Our graduates go on to represent our program in the community and in the profession. I can't have someone prone to this kind of behavior representing us. You'd be out.
That said, you have done the best you can in repairing this and should now STFU and hope it blows over. In the meantime, you might want to talk to someone about your temper and about learning to own your mistakes.
posted by LarryC at 9:07 PM on October 6, 2010 [29 favorites]
It may or may not be enough to get you out of the hole you dug yourself into, but it's the best you can do. Now you're up to the part where you stop digging.
posted by flabdablet at 9:19 PM on October 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by flabdablet at 9:19 PM on October 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
From what you've said here it seems that your questions may have been outside of the norm and beyond what most applicants are asking. If every time you've asked her a question she's given you the standard official reply, that probably means there is no other reply she can give, or the answer to your question is dependent upon other variables which are unknown to her at this time. If your questions are beyond what others are asking, then she might think you're looking for special treatment, and then if you then go on to ask other faculty members because you're not happy with her reply, it reinforces that perception.
If someone persistently and frequently questioned me and my colleagues over and above what I felt was reasonably expected of me, and then suggested *I* was the one who needed to take a chill pill when I told them to slow down and go through official channels, I would not be happy. She's acknowledging that by recusing herself from your application; she is a professional and is making sure her personal feelings about you will not affect your chances one way or the other.
In other words, she is doing the right thing by you, you did the right thing by making a personal apology, now you need to let it go. You can't make things any better with more contact with her. Leave it in the hands of your supervisor.
posted by andraste at 9:25 PM on October 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
If someone persistently and frequently questioned me and my colleagues over and above what I felt was reasonably expected of me, and then suggested *I* was the one who needed to take a chill pill when I told them to slow down and go through official channels, I would not be happy. She's acknowledging that by recusing herself from your application; she is a professional and is making sure her personal feelings about you will not affect your chances one way or the other.
In other words, she is doing the right thing by you, you did the right thing by making a personal apology, now you need to let it go. You can't make things any better with more contact with her. Leave it in the hands of your supervisor.
posted by andraste at 9:25 PM on October 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
Your email would have been inappropriate even if you had sent it to your supervisor, no matter how great his personality is. People print out and forward and mention emails in ways you can't predict. So it's a little disturbing that you're presenting this as a mere mistake by virtue of sending it to the wrong person instead of your "pal" (your supervisor). Save the vituperative language (including punctuation marks that are obviously supposed to be vocalized as "fuck" when read aloud) for when you're talking with an actual pal and no one else is around.
I'm not sure why some of the comments are suggesting that you're entitled not to suffer any consequences from this. Character matters. I don't think it would be unprofessional of them to take your unprofessional conduct into account during the application process. Seems like you're lucky the MA coordinator decided to "have nothing further to do with it."
I agree with the others who said you did all you can by apologizing. What are you going to do -- apologize again, even more profusely? Giving chocolates are any other gift would be inappropriate, and the last thing you need to be doing now is continuing to behave inappropriately.
posted by John Cohen at 9:26 PM on October 6, 2010
I'm not sure why some of the comments are suggesting that you're entitled not to suffer any consequences from this. Character matters. I don't think it would be unprofessional of them to take your unprofessional conduct into account during the application process. Seems like you're lucky the MA coordinator decided to "have nothing further to do with it."
I agree with the others who said you did all you can by apologizing. What are you going to do -- apologize again, even more profusely? Giving chocolates are any other gift would be inappropriate, and the last thing you need to be doing now is continuing to behave inappropriately.
posted by John Cohen at 9:26 PM on October 6, 2010
Don't worry about it, what's done is done. flabdablet has it exactly right.
While I agree with LarryC, it's not really an "honest mistake" because you shouldn't have sent the e-mail in the first place to anyone. However, if I were staff in the department I probably wouldn't be too concerned about that e-mail in particular. What I would be more concerned about is your pattern of persistent backdoor attempts to get into the program.
So my advice to you is to take a chill pill yourself, and stop digging. Go through the official channels from now on, and leave any unofficial stuff to your supervisor.
posted by grouse at 9:29 PM on October 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
While I agree with LarryC, it's not really an "honest mistake" because you shouldn't have sent the e-mail in the first place to anyone. However, if I were staff in the department I probably wouldn't be too concerned about that e-mail in particular. What I would be more concerned about is your pattern of persistent backdoor attempts to get into the program.
So my advice to you is to take a chill pill yourself, and stop digging. Go through the official channels from now on, and leave any unofficial stuff to your supervisor.
posted by grouse at 9:29 PM on October 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
I made a stupid mistake and sent an email to my lecturer in which I told her to "chill the %^%$% out."
So this morning I lost my pip and unfortunately, instead of bitching to my pal, I sent the email to her. The exact line was "Someone needs to take a **&^%$%%$ chill pill, right? Jesus H."
OK, your story changes within a few paragraphs. Maybe not in a way that you think is important. But I think it's indicative of the way you are telling this story, to us and to yourself. It has the sound of a story that's taking shape as it goes. I think you are losing track of what has actually happened in an attempt to come up with something that sounds good.
Sometimes you just have to sit with that feeling of "Oh crap, I did something stupid." The self-justification just adds to the problem. As grouse puts it, stop digging.
I'm entirely stressed; finishing the last paper in my Hons course. My dad passed away earlier this year, and at a cellular level, I am still dealing with that.
I'm really sorry to hear that. For what it's worth, you do sound very stressed out. If this other professor is as supportive as he sounds you might try having a talk with him about the pressure you've been under.
posted by BibiRose at 10:18 PM on October 6, 2010
So this morning I lost my pip and unfortunately, instead of bitching to my pal, I sent the email to her. The exact line was "Someone needs to take a **&^%$%%$ chill pill, right? Jesus H."
OK, your story changes within a few paragraphs. Maybe not in a way that you think is important. But I think it's indicative of the way you are telling this story, to us and to yourself. It has the sound of a story that's taking shape as it goes. I think you are losing track of what has actually happened in an attempt to come up with something that sounds good.
Sometimes you just have to sit with that feeling of "Oh crap, I did something stupid." The self-justification just adds to the problem. As grouse puts it, stop digging.
I'm entirely stressed; finishing the last paper in my Hons course. My dad passed away earlier this year, and at a cellular level, I am still dealing with that.
I'm really sorry to hear that. For what it's worth, you do sound very stressed out. If this other professor is as supportive as he sounds you might try having a talk with him about the pressure you've been under.
posted by BibiRose at 10:18 PM on October 6, 2010
As grouse puts it, stop digging.
All credit to flabdablet!
posted by grouse at 10:36 PM on October 6, 2010
All credit to flabdablet!
posted by grouse at 10:36 PM on October 6, 2010
I'd also go with other posters' mentions above about not messing with the standard procedure for the application. Unless you know in detail the academic politics of the place where you're trying to get accepted, this kind of "tweaking the channels" thing can have lots of consequences you're not able to see or foretell. This may explain your MA coordinator's reluctance to do anything that doesn't follow closely the established protocols. On personal experience, this kind of stupid blowout doesn't happen all the time, no, though it's not completely unheard of as some posters say. This depends a lot on the place and the (again) state of local academic politics, and from their reactions I would think the people in your future place don't see this as an application-killer. You might want to tread lightly for the first year or two, though (get someone to explain to you the local politics to see what/if your blowout might have shaken up). As for additional apologizing, not sure. Perhaps try a short e-mail to your coordinator (with cc to everyone else in the institution that is aware of the original blowup) offering a written up apology for her records and everyone else's? That's much more professional than phoning or even more e-mailing, and if she says no need or not wanted, well that's that for you.
posted by Iosephus at 10:47 PM on October 6, 2010
posted by Iosephus at 10:47 PM on October 6, 2010
(Written up as in a formal paper letter with copies for everyone's records, I mean.)
posted by Iosephus at 10:49 PM on October 6, 2010
posted by Iosephus at 10:49 PM on October 6, 2010
If you call someone names (for example) and then do it to their face by accident, you don't say "sorry, you weren't supposed to hear that". You may sincerely mean it, but that's not a real apology. A real sincere apology involves contrition and introspection - identifying where your behavior was unacceptable or unnecessarily hurtful, figuring out why you acted in that way, realizing that what you did was wrong, deciding that you owe someone an apology, and then apologizing, without making excuses for your behavior. Given the way you've written this question, there's no way you really went through this process.
Everyone else is right when they say "stop digging". I think a lot of us are sensing that while you are certainly sorry for saying nasty things to her face by accident, you don't think the nasty things themselves are unfair. This will come through in whatever further communications you produce on the matter. Best to keep your mouth shut, unless you come to a realization that the nasty things themselves are unfair and you wish to (sincerely) apologize for that.
posted by PercussivePaul at 12:12 AM on October 7, 2010 [5 favorites]
Everyone else is right when they say "stop digging". I think a lot of us are sensing that while you are certainly sorry for saying nasty things to her face by accident, you don't think the nasty things themselves are unfair. This will come through in whatever further communications you produce on the matter. Best to keep your mouth shut, unless you come to a realization that the nasty things themselves are unfair and you wish to (sincerely) apologize for that.
posted by PercussivePaul at 12:12 AM on October 7, 2010 [5 favorites]
Wait, so you sent the email to the woman completely unintentionally, right?
Was the "pal" to whom you meant to send it your supervisor or some other person?
It seems like some people are confused on these points - and I'm not sure whether I'm one of them or not.
posted by two or three cars parked under the stars at 12:20 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
Was the "pal" to whom you meant to send it your supervisor or some other person?
It seems like some people are confused on these points - and I'm not sure whether I'm one of them or not.
posted by two or three cars parked under the stars at 12:20 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
Let me add something. The motivation behind your apology seems to be entirely self-serving: you want to minimize the negative consequences to yourself. It's understandable. But a real sincere apology would be motivated by the desire to heal the pain your actions caused someone. I don't think you have sincerely apologized and I wouldn't go around claiming you had.
posted by PercussivePaul at 12:24 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by PercussivePaul at 12:24 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
Your supervisor is taking your side and speaking to the head of the school about it. In terms of internal politics, that will really help. I think it's possible that if you're otherwise quite qualified, they will overlook this mistake or file it under some non-dealbreaker category, like "a bit obnoxious" or "needs to grow up a bit." For that to work, you need to stay on everyone else's good side!
Separately, you need to get back on this woman's good side. The instant apology on your end was good. Her response was also good. So, for now, let the tension die down. Then in a month or two, unrelatedly, find something to give to her, such as a comment about how much value you got from the lecture series you organized that semester or an interesting magazine article that relates to her focus area. You can send it or knock and deliver the message, with or without a comment about the past ("sorry for our rocky start") or not. Be sincere and don't make a huge deal about it. It's just a little "I'd like to eventually be on good terms again" offering. Repeat this every two to three months, and otherwise be unfailingly polite and generous. Manners and professional relationships are important in academia, and academic departments are small worlds. You want to repair this damage rather than have to dodge her for the next three years.
Finally, the more introspection you can do about why this event happened and what was causing tension between you and her, the easier it will be for you to ensure you don't make any other missteps and that you move on from this with her.
posted by salvia at 12:42 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
Separately, you need to get back on this woman's good side. The instant apology on your end was good. Her response was also good. So, for now, let the tension die down. Then in a month or two, unrelatedly, find something to give to her, such as a comment about how much value you got from the lecture series you organized that semester or an interesting magazine article that relates to her focus area. You can send it or knock and deliver the message, with or without a comment about the past ("sorry for our rocky start") or not. Be sincere and don't make a huge deal about it. It's just a little "I'd like to eventually be on good terms again" offering. Repeat this every two to three months, and otherwise be unfailingly polite and generous. Manners and professional relationships are important in academia, and academic departments are small worlds. You want to repair this damage rather than have to dodge her for the next three years.
Finally, the more introspection you can do about why this event happened and what was causing tension between you and her, the easier it will be for you to ensure you don't make any other missteps and that you move on from this with her.
posted by salvia at 12:42 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
from the lecture series *she* organized that semester, I meant. (NOW who needs the 10-second delay??)
posted by salvia at 12:43 AM on October 7, 2010
posted by salvia at 12:43 AM on October 7, 2010
As a recent Master's applicant, I understand the stress - at least in my case, as a person who needs to understand what the hell every point, dotted i, and crossed t means, the process was a bit too translucent for my comfort. It helped that I was applying for a project that my supervisor was desperate to get off the ground; it didn't help that the (automated) process routed my application to the wrong faculty and wasn't actioned until the last possible minute.
That said, I agree with everybody else - including thomas j wise, LarryC, and andraste, who are offering advice somewhat contrary to the others. That's OK, I'm about to do it too ;-).
If it were me - and I'm talking about what I'd want to do, not what I could do to repair the damage - I'd write a short reply to her last email again sincerely apologising (but not grovelling!) for your actions, explaining (but not justifying!) that you're stressed from your studies and the application process, and thanking her for the professionalism she's shown in her dealings with you.
Something like:
Then leave sleeping dogs lie and let fate run its course, safe in the knowledge that if your application is rejected it's wholly your fault.
posted by Pinback at 1:36 AM on October 7, 2010 [2 favorites]
That said, I agree with everybody else - including thomas j wise, LarryC, and andraste, who are offering advice somewhat contrary to the others. That's OK, I'm about to do it too ;-).
If it were me - and I'm talking about what I'd want to do, not what I could do to repair the damage - I'd write a short reply to her last email again sincerely apologising (but not grovelling!) for your actions, explaining (but not justifying!) that you're stressed from your studies and the application process, and thanking her for the professionalism she's shown in her dealings with you.
Something like:
Dear M,…etc.
I apologise again for my email; it was rude and totally uncalled for. The only explanation I can offer is that, in a moment of pique, I allowed myself to be overwhelmed by personal issues and the looming deadline for my Honours thesis. While no apology can excuse my comment made in the heat of frustration, I thank you for all the assistance you have provided in the past and the helpful and professional manner in which it was given.
Sincerely,
Then leave sleeping dogs lie and let fate run its course, safe in the knowledge that if your application is rejected it's wholly your fault.
posted by Pinback at 1:36 AM on October 7, 2010 [2 favorites]
OP, you're probably lucky that the co-ordinator is the kind of person who gives "standard, official" type responses to things, because that same character trait is quite possibly the reason she has recused herself from your application process. I think you've done pretty much all you can about your application. I would be surprised if this affected your grade in the course for which she is the lecturer. You, should, however, think about how significant her role would be in your life if you do get into the masters program. My guess is you need to mend your relationship with her if you're going to do this program.
posted by bardophile at 2:09 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by bardophile at 2:09 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
Seeing the understanding reactions from supervisor and head of school, the MA coordinator seems to be an internally known nitpick. Probably effective (is why they keep her) but over-zealously stick-to-the-rules-y or something similar. Every department seems to have somebody like that. So you weren't telling anybody anything new, is my guess.
Apologizing was good; let go now, or (that's what I'd do) do what Pinback says.
As an aside, as soon as you're out of your present stress, look into methods of time managing and dealing with stress for students. Your school might have resources, otherwise there's loads of resources and books out there. The sooner you work out your personally satisfying version of performing under pressure the better. (The MA coordinator is very likely also stressed. Wherever you sit in academia, its always the same).
posted by Namlit at 2:36 AM on October 7, 2010
Apologizing was good; let go now, or (that's what I'd do) do what Pinback says.
As an aside, as soon as you're out of your present stress, look into methods of time managing and dealing with stress for students. Your school might have resources, otherwise there's loads of resources and books out there. The sooner you work out your personally satisfying version of performing under pressure the better. (The MA coordinator is very likely also stressed. Wherever you sit in academia, its always the same).
posted by Namlit at 2:36 AM on October 7, 2010
I also feel that she should understand why I am asking so many questions. Applying for a Masters is kind of a big thing, right?
It is for you. For her, it's everyday business - she deals with loads of students in your position. Giving the official, standard reply to questions in that position isn't a brush-off; it's a combination of a time-saving method (so she doesn't have to type out slightly different variations of effectively the same thing to dozens of applicants every day) and a professional way of making sure you know exactly what's expected of you, re: whatever you were asking. If I had to answer every student enquiry about presentation guidelines for written work (for example) with an individual reply rather than 'student handbook, section 2', for example, I'd never get any actual teaching done.
That said, I do get your frustration from the way she seems (from what you've said) to have totally misread you - and like Namlit says, it's a good thing your supervisor and head of school seem to be sympathising. Don't dig any further, though, and really don't try justifying your actions to anyone involved in this situation in any way!
posted by Catseye at 3:58 AM on October 7, 2010 [3 favorites]
It is for you. For her, it's everyday business - she deals with loads of students in your position. Giving the official, standard reply to questions in that position isn't a brush-off; it's a combination of a time-saving method (so she doesn't have to type out slightly different variations of effectively the same thing to dozens of applicants every day) and a professional way of making sure you know exactly what's expected of you, re: whatever you were asking. If I had to answer every student enquiry about presentation guidelines for written work (for example) with an individual reply rather than 'student handbook, section 2', for example, I'd never get any actual teaching done.
That said, I do get your frustration from the way she seems (from what you've said) to have totally misread you - and like Namlit says, it's a good thing your supervisor and head of school seem to be sympathising. Don't dig any further, though, and really don't try justifying your actions to anyone involved in this situation in any way!
posted by Catseye at 3:58 AM on October 7, 2010 [3 favorites]
Echoing all the academics here, this does NOT happen all the time, your demands were unreasonable. Adding: calm down. Maybe work a year or two outside of academia and learn professional etiquette-- it applies to the academy as well.
posted by vincele at 4:58 AM on October 7, 2010
posted by vincele at 4:58 AM on October 7, 2010
Seeing the understanding reactions from supervisor and head of school, the MA coordinator seems to be an internally known nitpick.
OP, you've told a confused story, and I agree BibiRose that this is probably indicative of a larger problem. So far you have no idea how the head of school is going to handle this, and frankly I don't trust your narration enough to feel like I can sympathize with you about this woman's behavior. I have the sense that while you paint her as a pain in the butt, you may be a worse one.
I just wanted to echo those who point out that this is not something that happens all the time. It is something you should be concerned about. Even with your stressful year, applying is unlikely to be the most stressful part of the program. You should treat your relationships, especially your petitioning relationships, in an advanced study course as if they were relationships within a place of work. There is actually a looser set of interactions in play overall in academia, but when you are asking for something, especially something official, your behavior needs to reflect your seriousness. Imagine if you had sent your email to someone to whom you were applying for a job, or a promotion. They, and you, would be rightly appalled.
posted by OmieWise at 5:12 AM on October 7, 2010 [4 favorites]
OP, you've told a confused story, and I agree BibiRose that this is probably indicative of a larger problem. So far you have no idea how the head of school is going to handle this, and frankly I don't trust your narration enough to feel like I can sympathize with you about this woman's behavior. I have the sense that while you paint her as a pain in the butt, you may be a worse one.
I just wanted to echo those who point out that this is not something that happens all the time. It is something you should be concerned about. Even with your stressful year, applying is unlikely to be the most stressful part of the program. You should treat your relationships, especially your petitioning relationships, in an advanced study course as if they were relationships within a place of work. There is actually a looser set of interactions in play overall in academia, but when you are asking for something, especially something official, your behavior needs to reflect your seriousness. Imagine if you had sent your email to someone to whom you were applying for a job, or a promotion. They, and you, would be rightly appalled.
posted by OmieWise at 5:12 AM on October 7, 2010 [4 favorites]
There's a wise saying that goes "Less said, sooner mended."
While I don't know if your particular situation can be mended... don't say anything more. You've apologized. Now just keep your head down and do what you need to do, professionally, without any added commentary.
I know people who have been in your shoes who have made "honest" mistakes and were genuinely surprised when their ill-formed remarks turned out to bite them in the ass later. These people truly didn't mean to cause any harm or any disrespect, but their words and attitudes showed that they weren't mature enough to handle the stresses of the academic programs they were involved in.
There's nothing wrong with not being ready for this, and it sounds like that's where you're at - whether it's your personality or dealing with your grief or whatever. If this doesn't work out and you get dropped from the program, use it as an opportunity to do something else and gain some experience and maturity to not make mistakes like this in the future.
(These words coming from someone who has made more than her fair of professional mistakes, albeit not in an academic setting. It honestly takes time to learn how to communicate without crossing the line.)
posted by sonika at 6:28 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
While I don't know if your particular situation can be mended... don't say anything more. You've apologized. Now just keep your head down and do what you need to do, professionally, without any added commentary.
I know people who have been in your shoes who have made "honest" mistakes and were genuinely surprised when their ill-formed remarks turned out to bite them in the ass later. These people truly didn't mean to cause any harm or any disrespect, but their words and attitudes showed that they weren't mature enough to handle the stresses of the academic programs they were involved in.
There's nothing wrong with not being ready for this, and it sounds like that's where you're at - whether it's your personality or dealing with your grief or whatever. If this doesn't work out and you get dropped from the program, use it as an opportunity to do something else and gain some experience and maturity to not make mistakes like this in the future.
(These words coming from someone who has made more than her fair of professional mistakes, albeit not in an academic setting. It honestly takes time to learn how to communicate without crossing the line.)
posted by sonika at 6:28 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
As a side note -- when you have a complex and slightly special situation, and the person you're emailing isn't able to be helpful in email, the correct solution is to talk to them in person. Physical is best, phone or skype is ok. Something like, "Here's what my situation is, here's what I've done, here's what I expect to have to do, do you recommend a different strategy, given X, Y, Z?" Obviously, it's way past that point with you. But I think part of the reason this got so frustrating for you is that you don't seem to have sat down and talked with her.
posted by endless_forms at 6:58 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by endless_forms at 6:58 AM on October 7, 2010 [1 favorite]
grouse and flabdablet, sorry for the misattribution.
OP, earlier I was scolding you for spinning what happened. I wanted to add that it's a tendency I recognize in myself. Just recently I made a dumb mistake at work and almost reflexively started talking to myself about how it wasn't so bad. I had to pull back and say, "Wait a minute. What exactly happened here, and how?"
My theory is that I hasten to minimize because I grew up in a home where people freaked out over the slightest thing wrong. As soon as you made a mistake, you had to worry about some adult coming down like a ton of bricks and you would try to have a story ready to reduce the inevitable blowup. I still have to consciously allow myself the time and space to figure out what happened and then figure out what to do about it, and what (if anything) is to be learned from it. Once I do slow down like that, it almost feels like a luxury.
In your professional life, you will make mistakes. Don't become that person who always has an excuse (often involving some other person being a problem) on the tip of their tongue. Nobody likes or trusts that person.
posted by BibiRose at 8:11 AM on October 7, 2010 [2 favorites]
OP, earlier I was scolding you for spinning what happened. I wanted to add that it's a tendency I recognize in myself. Just recently I made a dumb mistake at work and almost reflexively started talking to myself about how it wasn't so bad. I had to pull back and say, "Wait a minute. What exactly happened here, and how?"
My theory is that I hasten to minimize because I grew up in a home where people freaked out over the slightest thing wrong. As soon as you made a mistake, you had to worry about some adult coming down like a ton of bricks and you would try to have a story ready to reduce the inevitable blowup. I still have to consciously allow myself the time and space to figure out what happened and then figure out what to do about it, and what (if anything) is to be learned from it. Once I do slow down like that, it almost feels like a luxury.
In your professional life, you will make mistakes. Don't become that person who always has an excuse (often involving some other person being a problem) on the tip of their tongue. Nobody likes or trusts that person.
posted by BibiRose at 8:11 AM on October 7, 2010 [2 favorites]
My friend, a PhD admissions dude, tells me lots and lots of stories about horror applicants. I don't know if you're in the same category, but he often has back and forths with over-eager, under-qualified, can't bother to read all the materials readily available on the website for answers, wants to be hand-held through the process, thinks he or she is the only student applying, wants to be the exception to any or all rules, etc..
To all those scenarios, he sticks firmly to "official/standard" replies because he doesn't get to tell that student to "Chill the fuck out. Jesus H!"
The lecturer, if she is an ethical professional, will grade you based on your merit. She will likely not give you any recommendation if asked about your possible admission to the program, but thankfully, decisions are usually made by committee or multiple faculty. You've apologized which should earn you points in the 'redeemable' sense. I wouldn't worry too much. You probably aren't her worst interaction and this won't be the last either.
posted by loquat at 11:32 AM on October 7, 2010 [2 favorites]
To all those scenarios, he sticks firmly to "official/standard" replies because he doesn't get to tell that student to "Chill the fuck out. Jesus H!"
The lecturer, if she is an ethical professional, will grade you based on your merit. She will likely not give you any recommendation if asked about your possible admission to the program, but thankfully, decisions are usually made by committee or multiple faculty. You've apologized which should earn you points in the 'redeemable' sense. I wouldn't worry too much. You probably aren't her worst interaction and this won't be the last either.
posted by loquat at 11:32 AM on October 7, 2010 [2 favorites]
Was the "pal" to whom you meant to send it your supervisor or some other person?
It seems like some people are confused on these points - and I'm not sure whether I'm one of them or not.
This is unclear. The OP says:
As others pointed out, you were also inconsistent about what you said in the email. When you're asking other people for help, you'll want to write clearly so you make things as easy as possible for people to help you. If your writing here reflects how you write emails, that could partly explain why you didn't get the results you wanted from your MA coordinator.
posted by John Cohen at 3:31 PM on October 7, 2010
It seems like some people are confused on these points - and I'm not sure whether I'm one of them or not.
This is unclear. The OP says:
I have secured a provisional (awesome) supervisor, who I went to see this morning so he could provisionally sign my application form. I also emailed the head of school to ask him if I need him to sign off on it, or whether I should wait until just before I submit my official proposal to get his approval. His reply was most helpful and courteous; he also cc'd the MA coordinator on his reply. She in turn, sent him and me an email in which she said she was "disturbed" by the fact that I seemed to think that all I needed was the head of school and supervisor's signature to complete my application. ...I read this over and over and had a hard time telling who the "pal" is. My earlier comment was assuming that "pal" = "supervisor." But looking at it again, I think the "pal" has to be "the head of school," since that's the person who emailed the OP, CC'ing the MA coordinator. Since I now realize you sent that email to the head of the whole school, that makes it even more inappropriate than I thought.
So this morning I lost my pip and unfortunately, instead of bitching to my pal, I sent the email to her.
As others pointed out, you were also inconsistent about what you said in the email. When you're asking other people for help, you'll want to write clearly so you make things as easy as possible for people to help you. If your writing here reflects how you write emails, that could partly explain why you didn't get the results you wanted from your MA coordinator.
posted by John Cohen at 3:31 PM on October 7, 2010
I read this over and over and had a hard time telling who the "pal" is. My earlier comment was assuming that "pal" = "supervisor." But looking at it again, I think the "pal" has to be "the head of school," since that's the person who emailed the OP, CC'ing the MA coordinator. Since I now realize you sent that email to the head of the whole school, that makes it even more inappropriate than I thought.
I assumed the pal was just a friend, maybe someone going through the same application process as the OP.
Anon, I hope for your sake that this was the case, because to email either the supervisor or the head of school bitching about the lecturer would be really inappropriate and presumptuous.
Assuming the best (that you'd intended to let off steam to a friend)--I think you did exactly right in the aftermath, and there is no more you can do. I once wrote an email complaining about how men were paid more in my company than women were, and instead of sending it to my (female) friend, sent it to the male coworker I was complaining about. I was mortified, picked up the phone immediately, and apologized. He was a good guy and understood how this kind of thing could happen; in fact, he said he'd already deleted the email. No long-term damage done.
I will say, too, that I still believed my complaint was valid. I was not apologizing for what I'd said, but for saying it to the wrong person. I don't believe it's inherently unprofessional to discuss this kind of thing with coworkers; I do think (as I learned the hard way) you have to be very careful. And that, if you screw up, you can't believe that you are owed forbearance. Forgiveness is a mercy, not something you can assume will come your way if you say the right words.
I was lucky; I hope you are too! Keep your head up, know you did the right thing, and carry on.
posted by torticat at 4:18 PM on October 7, 2010
I assumed the pal was just a friend, maybe someone going through the same application process as the OP.
Anon, I hope for your sake that this was the case, because to email either the supervisor or the head of school bitching about the lecturer would be really inappropriate and presumptuous.
Assuming the best (that you'd intended to let off steam to a friend)--I think you did exactly right in the aftermath, and there is no more you can do. I once wrote an email complaining about how men were paid more in my company than women were, and instead of sending it to my (female) friend, sent it to the male coworker I was complaining about. I was mortified, picked up the phone immediately, and apologized. He was a good guy and understood how this kind of thing could happen; in fact, he said he'd already deleted the email. No long-term damage done.
I will say, too, that I still believed my complaint was valid. I was not apologizing for what I'd said, but for saying it to the wrong person. I don't believe it's inherently unprofessional to discuss this kind of thing with coworkers; I do think (as I learned the hard way) you have to be very careful. And that, if you screw up, you can't believe that you are owed forbearance. Forgiveness is a mercy, not something you can assume will come your way if you say the right words.
I was lucky; I hope you are too! Keep your head up, know you did the right thing, and carry on.
posted by torticat at 4:18 PM on October 7, 2010
I assumed the pal was just a friend, maybe someone going through the same application process as the OP.
No, I think the reason the OP dwelled on the fact that the head of the school CC'ed the MA coordinator was to say that's how the OP ended up accidentally emailing the MA coordinator. Otherwise, it would be a little weird for the OP to have mentioned the CC.
posted by John Cohen at 4:23 PM on October 7, 2010
No, I think the reason the OP dwelled on the fact that the head of the school CC'ed the MA coordinator was to say that's how the OP ended up accidentally emailing the MA coordinator. Otherwise, it would be a little weird for the OP to have mentioned the CC.
posted by John Cohen at 4:23 PM on October 7, 2010
Perhaps try a short e-mail to your coordinator (with cc to everyone else in the institution that is aware of the original blowup) offering a written up apology for her records and everyone else's? That's much more professional than phoning or even more e-mailing, and if she says no need or not wanted, well that's that for you.
Whatever you do, don't do this. If you want to apologize to her, you can do it. But don't CC everyone that you think may be "involved"- keep this between you and the coordinator. Sending a "I sent this to the MA coordinator and I'm sorry" to anyone BUT the coordinator sounds like a high schooler who wants attention and is going to make sure that EVERYONE hears their apology, regardless of whether or not it's warranted.
posted by kro at 8:03 PM on October 7, 2010
Whatever you do, don't do this. If you want to apologize to her, you can do it. But don't CC everyone that you think may be "involved"- keep this between you and the coordinator. Sending a "I sent this to the MA coordinator and I'm sorry" to anyone BUT the coordinator sounds like a high schooler who wants attention and is going to make sure that EVERYONE hears their apology, regardless of whether or not it's warranted.
posted by kro at 8:03 PM on October 7, 2010
Hmm, well, I see kro's point. Ignore that part of my answer then, please (may have been different academic culture speaking, somehow I fixed on how the OP already involved other people in the institution in discussing the blowup, so perhaps the coordinator might feel a shared apology saves more face for her - not a very nice thought, but in some of the places I've been it could well have been foremost in the person's mind in such a situation).
posted by Iosephus at 10:26 PM on October 7, 2010
posted by Iosephus at 10:26 PM on October 7, 2010
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by xammerboy at 8:36 PM on October 6, 2010 [14 favorites]