Grey/Gray Market Selling of High End Outerwear
March 15, 2010 9:09 AM Subscribe
Hi there -
Some years ago, I was working at a high end outdoor clothing store (think Patagonia, Arc'teryx, Marmot - etc.) and we had a Japanese gentleman who came in 1-2 times a season and usually cleaned us out of one particular style (usually men's Patagonia jackets) - therefore, we came to refer to him as "Gray Market Guy".
I've always been curious, is there any real money to be made in doing this?
e.g. Bringing items from the US to other countries - specifically high-end outwear? I did see some threads re: jeans - but what about outerwear? Has anyone done this? If so, how did you go about selling the items (such as international eBay sites, flea markets, Craigslist)? And what countries have the best market for this? Not sure if this is something I even want to pursue - but I've always been curious since working in that store what is possible - and what the logistics involve. Thanks!
e.g. Bringing items from the US to other countries - specifically high-end outwear? I did see some threads re: jeans - but what about outerwear? Has anyone done this? If so, how did you go about selling the items (such as international eBay sites, flea markets, Craigslist)? And what countries have the best market for this? Not sure if this is something I even want to pursue - but I've always been curious since working in that store what is possible - and what the logistics involve. Thanks!
It's somewhat common for whitewater kayakers from the US to send their gear to New Zealand, boat for a week to a year, and sell their gear before returning; plenty of kayaking out there but not many gear manufacturers.
posted by craven_morhead at 9:15 AM on March 15, 2010
posted by craven_morhead at 9:15 AM on March 15, 2010
Anectdotally, I've heard of the reverse being true, people loading up on football (soccer kind) jerseys in South America and selling them for a profit online or in the US.
posted by yellowbinder at 9:27 AM on March 15, 2010
posted by yellowbinder at 9:27 AM on March 15, 2010
You can definitely do this in reverse with some Nike sneakers. Nike have certain sneaker stores in major cities (think London, Tokyo, New York), that get extremely limited quantities of some sneakers. These stores are called "Tier 0" or "Hyperstrike" accounts. Sneakers get hyped on sneaker blogs and forums, so that when a particularly coveted sneaker releases in low quantities, people will queue overnight on the day of release to buy it. Nike never sell a sneaker for more than about $200, and some of these pairs then end up on eBay or in specialist reseller stores selling for more than $1000. FlightClub is the most well known US store that profits entirely from this Nike aftermarket, but bricks n mortar resellers are also common in Tokyo, Hong Kong and Singapore.
posted by roofus at 9:35 AM on March 15, 2010
posted by roofus at 9:35 AM on March 15, 2010
Anecdote: in 1990 I was walking through Paris' Metro, and four French teenagers came up to me and offered me 100 francs on the spot for my sneakers. I was wearing those old Reebok hightop pump sneakers (the kind with a pneumatic pump in them, which when pressed repeatedly, would inflate a bladder around the ankle, ostensibly to stabilize the ankle.)
posted by dfriedman at 9:48 AM on March 15, 2010
posted by dfriedman at 9:48 AM on March 15, 2010
It's my understanding that there is a limit on the number of Levi's one can buy from their stores - I'd heard 4 pair, but it looks like it's 6 now - to keep people from exporting them in bulk. Regardless, there was always a tour bus parked in front of the Levi's store on Geary in San Francisco. It seemed to be part of the tour.
posted by The Light Fantastic at 10:40 AM on March 15, 2010
posted by The Light Fantastic at 10:40 AM on March 15, 2010
You don't even need to sell them out of the country. People selling on eBay will drop ship you stuff from Overstock or whereever they can get the lowest price after you win an auction.
posted by mkb at 10:57 AM on March 15, 2010
posted by mkb at 10:57 AM on March 15, 2010
Best answer: It can be very difficult to find specific foreign (American) brands in Japan, especially if there is no importer or distributor. As well, rather than eBay, Japan's online marketplace is Yahoo! Auctions Japan, and Rakuten. While eBay and Yahoo! Japan recently signed an agreement to collaborate on online auctions, in practice it's very difficult for Japanese folks to purchase online goods that are not on Yahoo! Auctions Japan or Rakuten or a similar domestic service. There's language issues, cultural preferences, credit and payment challenges...
I have a friend whose hobby is flipping Nikes and Murakami prints. He finds Murakami prints on Yahoo Japan and sells them on eBay. He finds Nikes on eBay and sells them on Yahoo Japan. He works with a Japanese partner, and he also is able to read both English and Japanese.
So what this Patagonia fellow has going for him is access to a desirable good, convenience, and knowledge of the marketplace (this includes understanding English, which many Japanese folks are intimidated by).
posted by KokuRyu at 11:43 AM on March 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
I have a friend whose hobby is flipping Nikes and Murakami prints. He finds Murakami prints on Yahoo Japan and sells them on eBay. He finds Nikes on eBay and sells them on Yahoo Japan. He works with a Japanese partner, and he also is able to read both English and Japanese.
So what this Patagonia fellow has going for him is access to a desirable good, convenience, and knowledge of the marketplace (this includes understanding English, which many Japanese folks are intimidated by).
posted by KokuRyu at 11:43 AM on March 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
I knew of a guy from Tokyo doing this with Ralph Lauren and L.L.Bean stuff from the Maine outlets in the late 1980s/early 1990s. I think he'd arrive with a small overnight bag, go to Maine and buy luggage, and then shop until the luggage was full. Sold it in a small boutique or somehting.
posted by wenestvedt at 11:45 AM on March 15, 2010
posted by wenestvedt at 11:45 AM on March 15, 2010
Adding to what KokuRyu answered, in his book "Let My People Go Surfing" Patagonia's founder Yvon Chouinard tells a story about an event he attended in Japan, and in walks a collector in an old Patagonia fleece jacket. Chouinard goes on to say that the crowd went speechless then did some breath/inhale thing, that meant they were impressed. Evidently, there's a sizeable black market for older Patagonia goods in Japan, and this guy in the original question is playing his part.
posted by fijiwriter at 11:47 AM on March 15, 2010
posted by fijiwriter at 11:47 AM on March 15, 2010
Exchange rates are also a factor here, back when 2 US dollars = 1 British pound, I bought some jeans on sale at the Gap while in the US that I decided I didn't want after all. I then sold them as new on ebay in the UK for almost triple what I payed. Since they were Gap with known sizes and styles it made them easy to describe (and probably sell) on a site like ebay.
Some of these plans may hit a snag if you get "caught" and end up having to pay tax and\or customs - that would certainly eat into your profit.
posted by peanut butter milkshake at 12:44 PM on March 15, 2010
Some of these plans may hit a snag if you get "caught" and end up having to pay tax and\or customs - that would certainly eat into your profit.
posted by peanut butter milkshake at 12:44 PM on March 15, 2010
A friend from school with relatives in the USA used to always go and visit them with empty suitcases - clothes were so much cheaper in the US that she'd buy clothes for herself and her family out there. If he was over every so often visiting family for example, he was doing the same thing as her - but for money rather than family duty!
I don't know about margins or logistics, but I take it as a given that apart from some nation specific items (like the football shirts mentioned above) that all stuff in the USA is waaaaaay cheaper than it is in the UK.
posted by Coobeastie at 1:15 PM on March 15, 2010
I don't know about margins or logistics, but I take it as a given that apart from some nation specific items (like the football shirts mentioned above) that all stuff in the USA is waaaaaay cheaper than it is in the UK.
posted by Coobeastie at 1:15 PM on March 15, 2010
I read this article awhile back about international travelling to the U.S. to buy luxury goods for cheap and found it pretty interesting (from 2004, but still relevent.)
That article focuses on Ireland, and certainly isn't specific to outerwear, but is quite interesting.
posted by haveanicesummer at 6:41 AM on March 16, 2010
That article focuses on Ireland, and certainly isn't specific to outerwear, but is quite interesting.
posted by haveanicesummer at 6:41 AM on March 16, 2010
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posted by griphus at 9:13 AM on March 15, 2010