How do you know if the other person is as emotionally invested as you are?
September 14, 2009 7:07 AM Subscribe
I suspect that my boyfriend doesn't think that our relationship would last long term. Would like personal experiences from people who have been in this situation before.
I have been in a relationship with this wonderful man for little less than a year now. We met at work, started dating, and we both love each other very much. We have talked about marriage in the past, and we have both agreed that we saw each other as a potential The One.
Lately, however, there are these small things which lead me to suspect that he might not think our relationship has the potential to last long-term. Little things like: him not saying "I love you" for the past month (when he usually says it every week or so), not spending any real or substantial time together for the last two weeks despite him being relatively not busy (we used to spend at least part of the weekend together, and one weekday night), not calling me as frequently (we used to call each other twice or three times a day, and now it has dropped to once). I still haven't met the family, although this doesn't concern me so much because his ex of three years never met the family.
When I am around him, our interaction seems relatively normal and cosy. He is still as kind and as affectionate as before. But he seems to seek my company less regularly, when I want to see him a lot.
I know that guys (to use a general stereotype here) have the propensity to keep a relationship going, even if they might not think it would lead anywhere. I really, really don't want to be in a relationship where I am more invested in than he is. I would much rather be single than commit emotionally to a relationship that will not work out.
Of course, I have tried asking him about this, but he isn't the type to discuss feelings and emotions, or even investigate and analyze what he is feeling -- which is the opposite of me. I respect his need to be private, just like he respects my need to discuss and analyze all my feelings, so I hope that Mefites won't use this as evidence for, "omg, incompatibility: DTMFA!"
Anyway, is this an example of a woman's intuition, or an example of overanalysis? I read this question where the poster wants more me time, but where is the line between wanting more 'me' time and wanting to be away from the significant other?
Finally, he had been in a three-year old relationship where he didn't think anything would work out long-term, but maintained the relationship anyway. From what I know, the girl had been quite happy in the relationship, and was shocked when he broke up with her ... for me (which is another really long story).
Anyway, I would really like to hear from people who have been in similar situations, from either perspective.
I have been in a relationship with this wonderful man for little less than a year now. We met at work, started dating, and we both love each other very much. We have talked about marriage in the past, and we have both agreed that we saw each other as a potential The One.
Lately, however, there are these small things which lead me to suspect that he might not think our relationship has the potential to last long-term. Little things like: him not saying "I love you" for the past month (when he usually says it every week or so), not spending any real or substantial time together for the last two weeks despite him being relatively not busy (we used to spend at least part of the weekend together, and one weekday night), not calling me as frequently (we used to call each other twice or three times a day, and now it has dropped to once). I still haven't met the family, although this doesn't concern me so much because his ex of three years never met the family.
When I am around him, our interaction seems relatively normal and cosy. He is still as kind and as affectionate as before. But he seems to seek my company less regularly, when I want to see him a lot.
I know that guys (to use a general stereotype here) have the propensity to keep a relationship going, even if they might not think it would lead anywhere. I really, really don't want to be in a relationship where I am more invested in than he is. I would much rather be single than commit emotionally to a relationship that will not work out.
Of course, I have tried asking him about this, but he isn't the type to discuss feelings and emotions, or even investigate and analyze what he is feeling -- which is the opposite of me. I respect his need to be private, just like he respects my need to discuss and analyze all my feelings, so I hope that Mefites won't use this as evidence for, "omg, incompatibility: DTMFA!"
Anyway, is this an example of a woman's intuition, or an example of overanalysis? I read this question where the poster wants more me time, but where is the line between wanting more 'me' time and wanting to be away from the significant other?
Finally, he had been in a three-year old relationship where he didn't think anything would work out long-term, but maintained the relationship anyway. From what I know, the girl had been quite happy in the relationship, and was shocked when he broke up with her ... for me (which is another really long story).
Anyway, I would really like to hear from people who have been in similar situations, from either perspective.
It could be a sign that he feels secure enough in the relationship that he doesn't need to call you or see you all the time. Or that something else is going on in his life that requires more alone time for him (stress at work, money troubles). There is no way to know without asking him, but I'd chill out for awhile longer. A month of lessened contact is nothing when you've been dating nearly a year. (and have discussed possible marriage!)
Busy yourself with friends and hobbies. You'll find out where you stand with this guy.
posted by desjardins at 7:25 AM on September 14, 2009 [1 favorite]
Busy yourself with friends and hobbies. You'll find out where you stand with this guy.
posted by desjardins at 7:25 AM on September 14, 2009 [1 favorite]
I really, really don't want to be in a relationship where I am more invested in than he is. I would much rather be single than commit emotionally to a relationship that will not work out.
There are two possibilities here: either his interest is waning, or he's settling in to a pattern of behavior (not communicating his feelings, et cetera) that is natural for him, but anxiety-inducing for you. You really need to sit him down and say something like "So you haven't said 'I love you' in a month. What's up with that?" Really, don't let him be evasive. And don't justify his evasiveness. Why? Well, because it sounds like you might be the sort of person that needs that kind of verbal reassurance--which is fine. And his behavior has changed drastically. If it's just a matter of "Oh, things are fine; I just haven't felt the need to express myself that way", then he needs to tell you that, so you can decide if you want to be with someone for whom not expressing this sort of affection verbally, and not seeking out your company regularly, is normal.
You're also engaging in a lot of gender stereotyping here. "Men stay with women they don't like." "Women's intuition." All of these are excuses not to honestly communicate with your SO. So sit him down and talk with him. Be open and honest.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 7:44 AM on September 14, 2009 [7 favorites]
There are two possibilities here: either his interest is waning, or he's settling in to a pattern of behavior (not communicating his feelings, et cetera) that is natural for him, but anxiety-inducing for you. You really need to sit him down and say something like "So you haven't said 'I love you' in a month. What's up with that?" Really, don't let him be evasive. And don't justify his evasiveness. Why? Well, because it sounds like you might be the sort of person that needs that kind of verbal reassurance--which is fine. And his behavior has changed drastically. If it's just a matter of "Oh, things are fine; I just haven't felt the need to express myself that way", then he needs to tell you that, so you can decide if you want to be with someone for whom not expressing this sort of affection verbally, and not seeking out your company regularly, is normal.
You're also engaging in a lot of gender stereotyping here. "Men stay with women they don't like." "Women's intuition." All of these are excuses not to honestly communicate with your SO. So sit him down and talk with him. Be open and honest.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 7:44 AM on September 14, 2009 [7 favorites]
I also would suggest talking with him -- but not necessarily having it be about how often he says "I love you." You say he's not one to talk about his feelings much; so having the whole conversation be about the "I love you" may feel like you're trying to get him to quantify emotions, and that's not necessarily what you want to do as such.
Instead, maybe take the approach that "look -- you're doing X, Y, and Z, and I feel A, B, and C about it. My theory about why you're doing X, Y, and Z is D, E, and F, and that's based on G, H, and I. But that's just a theory, and I wanted to know if there's any other explanation."
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:51 AM on September 14, 2009 [1 favorite]
Instead, maybe take the approach that "look -- you're doing X, Y, and Z, and I feel A, B, and C about it. My theory about why you're doing X, Y, and Z is D, E, and F, and that's based on G, H, and I. But that's just a theory, and I wanted to know if there's any other explanation."
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:51 AM on September 14, 2009 [1 favorite]
Of course, I have tried asking him about this, but he isn't the type to discuss feelings and emotions, or even investigate and analyze what he is feeling -- which is the opposite of me
I'm going to guess that you hinted around and did not ask directly. I cannot speak for all men, but I work best when asked directly. Such as: "I'm only human and I couldn't help but notice that you seem to be drifting away from me. You call, less, tell me you love me less and we hang out less." Works even better if you have stats.
I'm serious here. Ask him point blank. Don't take mumbling for an answer.
posted by Ironmouth at 7:51 AM on September 14, 2009 [17 favorites]
I'm going to guess that you hinted around and did not ask directly. I cannot speak for all men, but I work best when asked directly. Such as: "I'm only human and I couldn't help but notice that you seem to be drifting away from me. You call, less, tell me you love me less and we hang out less." Works even better if you have stats.
I'm serious here. Ask him point blank. Don't take mumbling for an answer.
posted by Ironmouth at 7:51 AM on September 14, 2009 [17 favorites]
I have been in at least two relationships I knew would not last long-term and did what you mention your guy is doing... slowly winding down and distancing myself, etc. because I was afraid that breaking up outright would cause knee-jerk reactions of a violent and/or self-harming nature in my S.O.
In both cases, I was right, and the S.O.s in question responded very badly. However, both of them were live-ins; it doesn't sound like you guys are co-habitating, so your boyfriend doesn't have the same motivations I had (financial, fear of physical violence/manipulative retribution).
What I would do is say, "Look, boyfriend. It feels like we're drifting apart. Is it just me, or are you losing interest in this relationship? I'd rather it be a clean break if that's the case than slowly building up resentment until there's a 'concrete reason' for us to break up. This way, we can walk away with fond memories instead of being bitter."
Or some variation thereof that doesn't make it sound like you are dumping him, in your own words, but genuinely asking him if he realizes what he's doing and how you perceive it in light of your current relationship's own beginning.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 7:57 AM on September 14, 2009
In both cases, I was right, and the S.O.s in question responded very badly. However, both of them were live-ins; it doesn't sound like you guys are co-habitating, so your boyfriend doesn't have the same motivations I had (financial, fear of physical violence/manipulative retribution).
What I would do is say, "Look, boyfriend. It feels like we're drifting apart. Is it just me, or are you losing interest in this relationship? I'd rather it be a clean break if that's the case than slowly building up resentment until there's a 'concrete reason' for us to break up. This way, we can walk away with fond memories instead of being bitter."
Or some variation thereof that doesn't make it sound like you are dumping him, in your own words, but genuinely asking him if he realizes what he's doing and how you perceive it in light of your current relationship's own beginning.
posted by Unicorn on the cob at 7:57 AM on September 14, 2009
You deserve to know where this relationship is going. Ask him. Don't settle for less than a straight answer. I've come across men who do not like to speak directly about how they feel, but this is one conversation that needs a straight answer.
He may just be getting comfortable, or he may be checking out entirely. Either way, keep your social life up and don't let it drag you down. And talk to him. Different guys react differently to things. What you perceive as him losing interest may be that he's stressed and doesn't realize he's neglecting you.
Don't assume the worst, but have a calm, serious conversation about where his head is lately.
posted by caveat at 8:02 AM on September 14, 2009
He may just be getting comfortable, or he may be checking out entirely. Either way, keep your social life up and don't let it drag you down. And talk to him. Different guys react differently to things. What you perceive as him losing interest may be that he's stressed and doesn't realize he's neglecting you.
Don't assume the worst, but have a calm, serious conversation about where his head is lately.
posted by caveat at 8:02 AM on September 14, 2009
The fact that you haven't met his family, and that he never introduced his previous long-term girlfriend to his family is a giant red flag. Have you met any of his friends? Has he met your family and friends? I dated a guy for a year and half who refused to meet my family and only reluctantly met a handful of my friends. One evening, we ran into a group of his co-workers and he blantantly ignored me and made no introductions. I should have dumped him right then and there, but I stuck it out for several more months until he dumped me out of blue (but after he took me out for dinner). I found out later that the relationship hadn't been working for him for at least 4 months previously. He never said anything, but his actions spoke volumes.
Looking back, there were other signs it wasn't going to work, the biggest one being that I just felt so very lonely even being in the same room together. I wish I taken control of the situation when I suspected something was up. Now I'm married to a fabulous man who was more than willing to be part of my life and make me part of his.
I say take matters into your own hands and ask him again if anything is going on. If you don't get a satisfactory answer this time, sit on it for a month or so, see if anything changes. If not, trust your gut and act accordingly.
posted by socrateaser at 8:04 AM on September 14, 2009 [2 favorites]
Looking back, there were other signs it wasn't going to work, the biggest one being that I just felt so very lonely even being in the same room together. I wish I taken control of the situation when I suspected something was up. Now I'm married to a fabulous man who was more than willing to be part of my life and make me part of his.
I say take matters into your own hands and ask him again if anything is going on. If you don't get a satisfactory answer this time, sit on it for a month or so, see if anything changes. If not, trust your gut and act accordingly.
posted by socrateaser at 8:04 AM on September 14, 2009 [2 favorites]
We have both agreed that we saw each other as a potential The One.
If I could transmit the sonic quality of a police siren over the Internet, I would.
There is never only One. Once you realize this, I think his actions may seem unfortunate—no one wants to be more invested, like you said—as opposed to totally tragic.
posted by trotter at 8:06 AM on September 14, 2009 [5 favorites]
If I could transmit the sonic quality of a police siren over the Internet, I would.
There is never only One. Once you realize this, I think his actions may seem unfortunate—no one wants to be more invested, like you said—as opposed to totally tragic.
posted by trotter at 8:06 AM on September 14, 2009 [5 favorites]
In the worser case scenario, he started operating in a mode where he is managing down your expectations so that the current status quo of relationship is maintained, and further even less effort is required from him. This can be utterly, totally subconscious, and does not mean that he has an evil plan (he has no plan, most likely, except to not carry through with any of 'your' plans as he perceives). Passive aggression is however a tenet of personality, a key attitude on how to treat other people. I hate to offer anything borderline unethical, but seemingly the best line of advice from relationship coaches in these situations is: a woman should have (and enjoy) a flock of suitors without inducing a cockfight before she receives real commitment from The One. That's it. It is for you to decide if you want to tell him "Of course you can have all the time you need, you just can't have me all to yourself while you're deciding."
About asking vs. hinting, intuition vs. overanalysis: honestly, your own answer is enough: is he trying to learn things about you that would help him to determine whether you would become a lifetime partner? When you are in a trying situation, let's say hiking in the wilderness, and you ask "so did the last days reveal something about me to you?" did he answer "I do not think of it in this way (I'm having fun!)"?
I might very well be that woman from the 3 years long relationship, so here. One woman's bad guy can totally be another's hero, but shouldn't it take some time for the actual person to go from a stringer to a conscientious person who loves not only himself?
You, on the other hand, seem to have the right mindset of introspection, do not ever doubt yourself.
posted by Jurate at 8:20 AM on September 14, 2009
About asking vs. hinting, intuition vs. overanalysis: honestly, your own answer is enough: is he trying to learn things about you that would help him to determine whether you would become a lifetime partner? When you are in a trying situation, let's say hiking in the wilderness, and you ask "so did the last days reveal something about me to you?" did he answer "I do not think of it in this way (I'm having fun!)"?
I might very well be that woman from the 3 years long relationship, so here. One woman's bad guy can totally be another's hero, but shouldn't it take some time for the actual person to go from a stringer to a conscientious person who loves not only himself?
You, on the other hand, seem to have the right mindset of introspection, do not ever doubt yourself.
posted by Jurate at 8:20 AM on September 14, 2009
"I have tried asking him about this, but he isn't the type to discuss feelings and emotions, or even investigate and analyze what he is feeling"
This is, far and away, the bigger problem. Differences will come up in relationships. They always do. More "me" time, or less "me" time, doesn't matter. You need a partner that can tell you how he's feeling, who can process what's going on.
Maybe he does need more time, but he needs to be able to come to you and say, "Hey honey, I love being with you. Additionally, because of the way I'm wired, I recharge by having some time to myself. How can we work out our lives where you feel loved and valued and desired, but I also have some time alone?"
That's what you need in a partner. If he can't give it to you, find someone who can. You deserve no less.
posted by ericc at 8:36 AM on September 14, 2009 [4 favorites]
This is, far and away, the bigger problem. Differences will come up in relationships. They always do. More "me" time, or less "me" time, doesn't matter. You need a partner that can tell you how he's feeling, who can process what's going on.
Maybe he does need more time, but he needs to be able to come to you and say, "Hey honey, I love being with you. Additionally, because of the way I'm wired, I recharge by having some time to myself. How can we work out our lives where you feel loved and valued and desired, but I also have some time alone?"
That's what you need in a partner. If he can't give it to you, find someone who can. You deserve no less.
posted by ericc at 8:36 AM on September 14, 2009 [4 favorites]
he isn't the type to discuss feelings and emotions, or even investigate and analyze what he is feeling
It's one thing to be more private about these things, but another to make them completely inaccessible. People like this want the comfort and status of a relationship without having to do any of the work, and their partners wind up working twice as hard.
You're beginning to feel ready to take things to the next level, and you want to know if he is too. You should be able to talk about this.
Finally, he had been in a three-year old relationship where he didn't think anything would work out long-term, but maintained the relationship anyway. From what I know, the girl had been quite happy in the relationship, and was shocked when he broke up with her ... for me (which is another really long story).
After nearly a year, if he isn't prepared to give you a list of reasons why you and he aren't anything like him and her, then you'd have to be crazy to stick around.
posted by hermitosis at 9:03 AM on September 14, 2009 [2 favorites]
It's one thing to be more private about these things, but another to make them completely inaccessible. People like this want the comfort and status of a relationship without having to do any of the work, and their partners wind up working twice as hard.
You're beginning to feel ready to take things to the next level, and you want to know if he is too. You should be able to talk about this.
Finally, he had been in a three-year old relationship where he didn't think anything would work out long-term, but maintained the relationship anyway. From what I know, the girl had been quite happy in the relationship, and was shocked when he broke up with her ... for me (which is another really long story).
After nearly a year, if he isn't prepared to give you a list of reasons why you and he aren't anything like him and her, then you'd have to be crazy to stick around.
posted by hermitosis at 9:03 AM on September 14, 2009 [2 favorites]
Of course, I have tried asking him about this, but he isn't the type to discuss feelings and emotions, or even investigate and analyze what he is feeling
Seconding what ericc said, basically: outside of any silly "men watch football and grunt while punching each other" sitcom tropes, this is just ridiculous. "Discuss[ing] feelings and emotions" is THE JOB. If a person can't do that, he can't be in a serious relationship with another human being.
posted by drjimmy11 at 9:05 AM on September 14, 2009 [2 favorites]
Seconding what ericc said, basically: outside of any silly "men watch football and grunt while punching each other" sitcom tropes, this is just ridiculous. "Discuss[ing] feelings and emotions" is THE JOB. If a person can't do that, he can't be in a serious relationship with another human being.
posted by drjimmy11 at 9:05 AM on September 14, 2009 [2 favorites]
Sadly, I think our intuitions are always right.
I would talk to him, but keep in mind that guys tend to say the right things in order to avoid conflict right away, and then later you find out they didn't really feel what they were saying. Once again, pay attention to the intuition.
posted by KateHasQuestions at 9:07 AM on September 14, 2009 [5 favorites]
I would talk to him, but keep in mind that guys tend to say the right things in order to avoid conflict right away, and then later you find out they didn't really feel what they were saying. Once again, pay attention to the intuition.
posted by KateHasQuestions at 9:07 AM on September 14, 2009 [5 favorites]
There can be a lot of reasons for his change in behavior and some of them having absolutely nothing to do with you or your relationship. This warrants an honest, direct conversation. It's great that you understand & respect how he relates to the world and handles his emotions, but this is causing you great (and understandable distress). Every couple needs to do a state of the union talk once in a while, to assess where they've been, where they are, and where they're going, and to make sure they're in agreement about it. Have this talk with him, acknowledge that you know it's difficult for him to do this kind of thing, but also let him know how you are feeling and ask your questions. If this has nothing to do with you, but with work or some other situation, things can't improve if he doesn't know what he's doing that upsets you, and he can't reassure you, unless you voice your specific concerns. Conversely, if you need to make some changes to make this work, this will be your opportunity to find out about those, too. Good luck!
posted by katemcd at 9:08 AM on September 14, 2009
posted by katemcd at 9:08 AM on September 14, 2009
You guys may very well want different things from a relationship. The only way you will get the things you want, which are all reasonable things to want, is to ask. You might not get them if you ask, because he might not want those things, but if you don't ask, you will NEVER get them.
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:19 AM on September 14, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:19 AM on September 14, 2009 [1 favorite]
Just to offer a slightly different perspective, many of the items listed here don't necessarily read to me as definitive evidence of a guy losing his interest in a relationship as much as it appears to be behavior associated with the normal cooling down that occurs when a relationship goes from being a brand new one to a more established one. This doesn't negate the common sense advice to simply talk to him if you're feeling uncomfortable, but I'm not sure this is necessarily red flag behavior either unless his apathy toward the relationship is stronger than you've indicated thus far in your examples.
posted by The Gooch at 9:45 AM on September 14, 2009 [2 favorites]
posted by The Gooch at 9:45 AM on September 14, 2009 [2 favorites]
So your choices are be dumped instantly or gradually? What about the scenario where he still loves you but is just a little bored and distracted? Maybe he's being a jerk and taking you for granted, or maybe he's just naturally spending less time trying to woo you because he wants comfort and security in a LTR rather than excitement, but there is 0 evidence besides your nervous intuition that he is indubitably actually drifting away from you rather than just drifting.
There are different ways of standing up for yourself. One of them is to sit him down as the posters above have suggested and have a Big Relationship Come-to-jesus Talk. This may work well if you focus on the fact that that this is your worry not his failure and you just want to clear it up and make sure everything's OK. Don't bring his ex up. Like, ever. All this talk is going to do is make you feel better. If he does want to break up with you, then you will anyway. Sorry.
But another way to stand up for yourself is to stop worrying about it by concentrating on positives. You said your time together was good, so enjoy it. When he's off doing whatever else, instead of wondering why--do something awesome. This is a win either way--either he IS losing his spark for you and snaps out of it in the course of you becoming a much less anxious race car driver or whatever, OR he isn't and you get to drive race cars and have a cool, slightly self-involved, BF. OR he breaks up with you, but still, VROOM! On to someone less losery.
Oh and tell him you love him. If he doesn't respond in kind that's more than intuition, that's just rude. Feel free to bring on the BRC2JT if that's the case.
In summary, communication is not always the answer to all relationship worries, especially if they are communication based. Sex and/in Race Cars is more efficacious in my humble O.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:54 AM on September 14, 2009
There are different ways of standing up for yourself. One of them is to sit him down as the posters above have suggested and have a Big Relationship Come-to-jesus Talk. This may work well if you focus on the fact that that this is your worry not his failure and you just want to clear it up and make sure everything's OK. Don't bring his ex up. Like, ever. All this talk is going to do is make you feel better. If he does want to break up with you, then you will anyway. Sorry.
But another way to stand up for yourself is to stop worrying about it by concentrating on positives. You said your time together was good, so enjoy it. When he's off doing whatever else, instead of wondering why--do something awesome. This is a win either way--either he IS losing his spark for you and snaps out of it in the course of you becoming a much less anxious race car driver or whatever, OR he isn't and you get to drive race cars and have a cool, slightly self-involved, BF. OR he breaks up with you, but still, VROOM! On to someone less losery.
Oh and tell him you love him. If he doesn't respond in kind that's more than intuition, that's just rude. Feel free to bring on the BRC2JT if that's the case.
In summary, communication is not always the answer to all relationship worries, especially if they are communication based. Sex and/in Race Cars is more efficacious in my humble O.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:54 AM on September 14, 2009
Sadly, I think our intuitions are always right.
I would talk to him, but keep in mind that guys tend to say the right things in order to avoid conflict right away, and then later you find out they didn't really feel what they were saying. Once again, pay attention to the intuition.
Dear OP. I'd try getting real information instead of relying on stereotypes and guessing. Becasue that's what "intuition" really is--guessing. I would not listen to your "intuition" about what anyone, man or woman, believes. I found out a long time ago that my "intuition" was me trying to deal with difficult feelings about loss of control by positing an ability to read other people's minds that I did not have.
Inform yourself rather than avoiding the question with him.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:18 AM on September 14, 2009 [5 favorites]
I would talk to him, but keep in mind that guys tend to say the right things in order to avoid conflict right away, and then later you find out they didn't really feel what they were saying. Once again, pay attention to the intuition.
Dear OP. I'd try getting real information instead of relying on stereotypes and guessing. Becasue that's what "intuition" really is--guessing. I would not listen to your "intuition" about what anyone, man or woman, believes. I found out a long time ago that my "intuition" was me trying to deal with difficult feelings about loss of control by positing an ability to read other people's minds that I did not have.
Inform yourself rather than avoiding the question with him.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:18 AM on September 14, 2009 [5 favorites]
Not meeting the parents doesn't sound like a red flag to me. They might live far away, or he might not be close to them.
posted by vickyverky at 10:24 AM on September 14, 2009
posted by vickyverky at 10:24 AM on September 14, 2009
I think you are worried about these changes because of the way you two started. He was in a relationship with someone else, (I assume) kept you a secret for a while, then dumped her for you. So, you know that he's the type of person to string one girl along while starting up with someone else. I agree with everyone who says you should talk to him directly and specifically about your concerns, but I think you should include in that discussion the underlying reasons why you are worried (if that's the case). It will help him put everything into your perspective, so he can see it's not just number of calls per day, but also an understanding that tigers rarely change their stripes.
posted by Houstonian at 10:26 AM on September 14, 2009 [2 favorites]
posted by Houstonian at 10:26 AM on September 14, 2009 [2 favorites]
Nthing asking him point blank.
Until you do, though, I wanted to add that from the information provided in the question, you sound a little paranoid. I don't mean that in a bad way -- it's natural to worry about it some -- so to put things in perspective...
We have talked about marriage in the past, and we have both agreed that we saw each other as a potential The One.
While people certainly change their minds, I think it's a little unfair to him to say he must have either changed his mind or was perhaps lying when you discussed marriage. Things you say later give me the impression that his saying this has lead you to construct a whole schema of behavior that, if he doesn't follow it, means he doesn't think you're The One. People behave differently in relationships and need different levels of alone and together time, and you probably wouldn't like it much if he picked apart your behavior for evidence that you don't love him. For example, wouldn't you be offended if he had taken your desire for lots of together time to mean that you're insecure, and thus only desperate to be with anyone, and you don't actually love him in particular? Or that you obviously don't have enough faith in the relationship because you're worried? I've seen both those things come up more than a few times, as crazy as they sound. There's really a ton of ways we can play this game, but it's better not to play it at all.
But! you might say. He'd be twisting all the evidence that I love him into something negative! Well, that's what it seems like you're doing. I'll point out more instances as I go along.
That you guys discussed marriage should be a positive thing. It concerns me a bit to see you second-guessing it so much. While there are certainly circumstances where people will lie or cover up their feelings, it's generally not productive to doubt others when they express those sorts of things to you. It's hurtful to the other person and can create a situation where nothing they do or say will ever be good enough to prove it. Indulging anxious thoughts in a relationship can have a self-fulfilling prophecy effect. Your post doesn't provide any great reasons for doubting him, just suspicions that, if dwelled on too long, will certainly doom the relationship.
Lately, however, there are these small things which lead me to suspect that he might not think our relationship has the potential to last long-term. Little things like: him not saying "I love you" for the past month (when he usually says it every week or so)
It might mean that he's pulling away, but I'd bet he's just not keeping track of it like you are. I don't mean any offence by this, but the fact that you know it's been a month gives the impression that you're watching far too closely for every slam-dunk hint that he loves you. Some people just don't express love by saying "I love you," and the fact that he only said it weekly before seems to me more evidence of that than his not loving you.
You go on to give plenty of evidence -- though you don't realize it -- that he loves you. If he doesn't express it in words then you should look for the other ways he expresses it instead of expecting something out of character from him. (Although if you want to hear it more, bring it up when you talk to him. I did that with my husband and he's comfortable saying it now.)
not spending any real or substantial time together for the last two weeks despite him being relatively not busy (we used to spend at least part of the weekend together, and one weekday night)
It's two weeks. If you're at the "little less than a year mark now," it's only natural that the initial flurry of spending a ton of time together has cooled off a bit. Also, if you guys have been spending that much time together for that long, it's only natural that he might want a few weeks to himself.
You'll find out whatever the reason is when you ask him, but you ought to believe him if he tells you that's all it is. If you let it, it will become a "oh, he just said that, but he really doesn't love me and is just treating me like his ex" situation. Before you talk to him, you need to ask yourself honestly if anything he says will be enough to make you quit thinking that.
not calling me as frequently (we used to call each other twice or three times a day, and now it has dropped to once).
He's talking to you every single day. You should not take that as evidence of his disinterest!
Two or three times a day is really just a ton. I can't imagine ever calling anyone that frequently, for what it's worth, no matter how much I loved them. Maybe early on in a relationship. People are different, after all. Anyway, I'm really not surprised the volume of calls has decreased by this point. I'm more surprised that it stayed that high for so long.
I still haven't met the family, although this doesn't concern me so much because his ex of three years never met the family.
This is another thing that made me think you're just feeling anxious. If it doesn't concern you, then you wouldn't bring it up, right? But when you're going through everything in your head it offers itself as another point of evidence. That's not rational.
For what it's worth, meeting the family has always struck me as an antiquated sort of thing. I don't even know when I met my husbands' parents, it was such a random, casual thing, and I never gave any thought to whether it meant I was ~special~ if he took me to meet them. Neither of us were family-oriented. Not saying that it doesn't hold special meaning for some, but from the sound of it, your boyfriend clearly doesn't place any special meaning on it.
This strikes me more as another example of your holding him up to an artificial standard of behavior for someone who has met The One. It doesn't matter how other people behave when they want to be with someone long term, and if that's what you're looking for, you're going to be disappointed. For example, if you had been dating someone like my husband you might have read a lot into it when you met his parents even though it would have meant nothing to him and he might not see any long term potential at all. Someone can call you and see you a lot and not see long-term potential either. Flowers from one person might mean barely anything, while flowers from another person mean a huge deal. It's a bit like deciding one Bingo card is the only TRUE Bingo card: you'll get disappointed when other numbers are called, but when your numbers are called it seems like validation. Try to get out of that mindset.
When I am around him, our interaction seems relatively normal and cosy. He is still as kind and as affectionate as before.
Then you must realize it's not rational to take this as an indication of disinterest.
But he seems to seek my company less regularly, when I want to see him a lot.
That's the real problem here. You want to see him more than he seemingly wants to see you. I have been in a relationship like that before, and I doubted my boyfriend's love for me until it drove him completely insane. By the time he broke up with me, he pretty much hated me.
Nothing is wrong with either of you, but you need to resolve that issue. When you ask him why you're seeing each other less, you can try to decide on an amount both of you can agree with; hopefully there is a middle ground that is not too much for him, or too little for you. In the end, there might not be a middle ground. But I will say this: as the person who wants more time, the absolute WORST thing you can do is think that he doesn't love you just because he needs time to himself. If he spends time with you, and then tries to spend even more, and you still don't believe that he loves you enough, or properly, or whatever, then he's going to (rightly) get very frustrated. Would you bother maintaining a relationship with someone who never believed you loved them? Keep that in mind.
I know that guys (to use a general stereotype here) have the propensity to keep a relationship going... is this an example of a woman's intuition, or an example of overanalysis?
Cringing at the gender stereotypes here. To me, this comes across as more of the expecting people to fit a pre-constructed set of behaviors in your head. Guys act one way, women act another... not true. (I always make a face at the idea of "women's intuition," and I am a woman.) What things mean is a function of the individual they originate from, not anyone else.
And to answer your question, it sounds to me like overanalysis.
Finally, he had been in a three-year old relationship where he didn't think anything would work out long-term, but maintained the relationship anyway. From what I know, the girl had been quite happy in the relationship, and was shocked when he broke up with her ... for me (which is another really long story).
He broke up a relationship of three years to be with you, and you're taking it as evidence of his disinterest. I hope by now it's clear how you're probably twisting things around to feed your anxiety. Do not be that person.
posted by Nattie at 9:36 AM on September 15, 2009 [2 favorites]
Until you do, though, I wanted to add that from the information provided in the question, you sound a little paranoid. I don't mean that in a bad way -- it's natural to worry about it some -- so to put things in perspective...
We have talked about marriage in the past, and we have both agreed that we saw each other as a potential The One.
While people certainly change their minds, I think it's a little unfair to him to say he must have either changed his mind or was perhaps lying when you discussed marriage. Things you say later give me the impression that his saying this has lead you to construct a whole schema of behavior that, if he doesn't follow it, means he doesn't think you're The One. People behave differently in relationships and need different levels of alone and together time, and you probably wouldn't like it much if he picked apart your behavior for evidence that you don't love him. For example, wouldn't you be offended if he had taken your desire for lots of together time to mean that you're insecure, and thus only desperate to be with anyone, and you don't actually love him in particular? Or that you obviously don't have enough faith in the relationship because you're worried? I've seen both those things come up more than a few times, as crazy as they sound. There's really a ton of ways we can play this game, but it's better not to play it at all.
But! you might say. He'd be twisting all the evidence that I love him into something negative! Well, that's what it seems like you're doing. I'll point out more instances as I go along.
That you guys discussed marriage should be a positive thing. It concerns me a bit to see you second-guessing it so much. While there are certainly circumstances where people will lie or cover up their feelings, it's generally not productive to doubt others when they express those sorts of things to you. It's hurtful to the other person and can create a situation where nothing they do or say will ever be good enough to prove it. Indulging anxious thoughts in a relationship can have a self-fulfilling prophecy effect. Your post doesn't provide any great reasons for doubting him, just suspicions that, if dwelled on too long, will certainly doom the relationship.
Lately, however, there are these small things which lead me to suspect that he might not think our relationship has the potential to last long-term. Little things like: him not saying "I love you" for the past month (when he usually says it every week or so)
It might mean that he's pulling away, but I'd bet he's just not keeping track of it like you are. I don't mean any offence by this, but the fact that you know it's been a month gives the impression that you're watching far too closely for every slam-dunk hint that he loves you. Some people just don't express love by saying "I love you," and the fact that he only said it weekly before seems to me more evidence of that than his not loving you.
You go on to give plenty of evidence -- though you don't realize it -- that he loves you. If he doesn't express it in words then you should look for the other ways he expresses it instead of expecting something out of character from him. (Although if you want to hear it more, bring it up when you talk to him. I did that with my husband and he's comfortable saying it now.)
not spending any real or substantial time together for the last two weeks despite him being relatively not busy (we used to spend at least part of the weekend together, and one weekday night)
It's two weeks. If you're at the "little less than a year mark now," it's only natural that the initial flurry of spending a ton of time together has cooled off a bit. Also, if you guys have been spending that much time together for that long, it's only natural that he might want a few weeks to himself.
You'll find out whatever the reason is when you ask him, but you ought to believe him if he tells you that's all it is. If you let it, it will become a "oh, he just said that, but he really doesn't love me and is just treating me like his ex" situation. Before you talk to him, you need to ask yourself honestly if anything he says will be enough to make you quit thinking that.
not calling me as frequently (we used to call each other twice or three times a day, and now it has dropped to once).
He's talking to you every single day. You should not take that as evidence of his disinterest!
Two or three times a day is really just a ton. I can't imagine ever calling anyone that frequently, for what it's worth, no matter how much I loved them. Maybe early on in a relationship. People are different, after all. Anyway, I'm really not surprised the volume of calls has decreased by this point. I'm more surprised that it stayed that high for so long.
I still haven't met the family, although this doesn't concern me so much because his ex of three years never met the family.
This is another thing that made me think you're just feeling anxious. If it doesn't concern you, then you wouldn't bring it up, right? But when you're going through everything in your head it offers itself as another point of evidence. That's not rational.
For what it's worth, meeting the family has always struck me as an antiquated sort of thing. I don't even know when I met my husbands' parents, it was such a random, casual thing, and I never gave any thought to whether it meant I was ~special~ if he took me to meet them. Neither of us were family-oriented. Not saying that it doesn't hold special meaning for some, but from the sound of it, your boyfriend clearly doesn't place any special meaning on it.
This strikes me more as another example of your holding him up to an artificial standard of behavior for someone who has met The One. It doesn't matter how other people behave when they want to be with someone long term, and if that's what you're looking for, you're going to be disappointed. For example, if you had been dating someone like my husband you might have read a lot into it when you met his parents even though it would have meant nothing to him and he might not see any long term potential at all. Someone can call you and see you a lot and not see long-term potential either. Flowers from one person might mean barely anything, while flowers from another person mean a huge deal. It's a bit like deciding one Bingo card is the only TRUE Bingo card: you'll get disappointed when other numbers are called, but when your numbers are called it seems like validation. Try to get out of that mindset.
When I am around him, our interaction seems relatively normal and cosy. He is still as kind and as affectionate as before.
Then you must realize it's not rational to take this as an indication of disinterest.
But he seems to seek my company less regularly, when I want to see him a lot.
That's the real problem here. You want to see him more than he seemingly wants to see you. I have been in a relationship like that before, and I doubted my boyfriend's love for me until it drove him completely insane. By the time he broke up with me, he pretty much hated me.
Nothing is wrong with either of you, but you need to resolve that issue. When you ask him why you're seeing each other less, you can try to decide on an amount both of you can agree with; hopefully there is a middle ground that is not too much for him, or too little for you. In the end, there might not be a middle ground. But I will say this: as the person who wants more time, the absolute WORST thing you can do is think that he doesn't love you just because he needs time to himself. If he spends time with you, and then tries to spend even more, and you still don't believe that he loves you enough, or properly, or whatever, then he's going to (rightly) get very frustrated. Would you bother maintaining a relationship with someone who never believed you loved them? Keep that in mind.
I know that guys (to use a general stereotype here) have the propensity to keep a relationship going... is this an example of a woman's intuition, or an example of overanalysis?
Cringing at the gender stereotypes here. To me, this comes across as more of the expecting people to fit a pre-constructed set of behaviors in your head. Guys act one way, women act another... not true. (I always make a face at the idea of "women's intuition," and I am a woman.) What things mean is a function of the individual they originate from, not anyone else.
And to answer your question, it sounds to me like overanalysis.
Finally, he had been in a three-year old relationship where he didn't think anything would work out long-term, but maintained the relationship anyway. From what I know, the girl had been quite happy in the relationship, and was shocked when he broke up with her ... for me (which is another really long story).
He broke up a relationship of three years to be with you, and you're taking it as evidence of his disinterest. I hope by now it's clear how you're probably twisting things around to feed your anxiety. Do not be that person.
posted by Nattie at 9:36 AM on September 15, 2009 [2 favorites]
Sorry, only read OP's post........ 6am here :/
One thing....... you say he's stopped saying 'I love you!'
When he used to tell you on a regular basis that he loved you, did you ever say it to him first sometimes, or did you just wait for him to say it because you new he would?
I couldn't stop telling my girl I loved her prolly 10 times a day (nothing heavyly emotional.... was just like "I love you so much my baby" stroking or patting her or what not)......... and she would always respond, "I love you" or "I love you tooooo" but the fact of the matter is she never beat me to it, she never once in 6 months said it first. I would have loved to wake up with a cuddle just once with her whispering it to me before I had a chance to, but it never came :/
Obviously if you did do the 'I love you thing' then he has something troubling him. I think the best remedy with people who simply will not talk about their issues is to just ask them a simple question. 'Is it something to do with me?' I was capable of getting the answer 'no' from my seriously emotionally closed off girlfriend. Once I knew it wasn't me, I let her be to deal with whatever it was she apparently needed to deal with on her own.
If he's lying about it not being you, then you'll see that with only a little more time where you can evaluate your situation a bit better.
posted by Hinny at 9:47 PM on April 5, 2010
One thing....... you say he's stopped saying 'I love you!'
When he used to tell you on a regular basis that he loved you, did you ever say it to him first sometimes, or did you just wait for him to say it because you new he would?
I couldn't stop telling my girl I loved her prolly 10 times a day (nothing heavyly emotional.... was just like "I love you so much my baby" stroking or patting her or what not)......... and she would always respond, "I love you" or "I love you tooooo" but the fact of the matter is she never beat me to it, she never once in 6 months said it first. I would have loved to wake up with a cuddle just once with her whispering it to me before I had a chance to, but it never came :/
Obviously if you did do the 'I love you thing' then he has something troubling him. I think the best remedy with people who simply will not talk about their issues is to just ask them a simple question. 'Is it something to do with me?' I was capable of getting the answer 'no' from my seriously emotionally closed off girlfriend. Once I knew it wasn't me, I let her be to deal with whatever it was she apparently needed to deal with on her own.
If he's lying about it not being you, then you'll see that with only a little more time where you can evaluate your situation a bit better.
posted by Hinny at 9:47 PM on April 5, 2010
This thread is closed to new comments.
Personal experiences? Um, yeah, the "suddenly he doesn't want to hang out with you any more" thing is usually what happens to me before dumping.
posted by jenfullmoon at 7:22 AM on September 14, 2009