said yes to bad quote; screwed?
June 16, 2009 7:06 PM Subscribe
Got overcharged by a shady plumber, paid the ridiculous cost. Do we have any recourse?
Here in sunny southern California we recently had some plumbing work done. The pilot light on our standard water heater kept going out. My wife called the plumber out, he quoted her about $500 to replace the thermocoupler. Then he told her that, after a routine check, he found our water pressure to be very high. He then quoted a combo deal where he would fix the water heater and replace the pressure regulator for $1200. My wife called me at work and we talked about it - it seemed like a high bid but neither of us really knew about how much this stuff should cost to repair.
So we approved the quote, plumber did the work and we paid (by Amex).
My wife then started doing research and discovered that all the parts cost about $250 to replace (!) so roughly the guy charged us five hundred dollars an hour for labor. Needless to say, we were upset.
We spoke with several other plumbers that said they would have charged about $500 for the job. I wish we had hired one of them two days ago.
My wife talked to the company manager today. Long story short, he said he would knock off $300 from the bill. But it still feels like we're still getting burned. Do we have any recourse, or just another hard lesson learned?
Here in sunny southern California we recently had some plumbing work done. The pilot light on our standard water heater kept going out. My wife called the plumber out, he quoted her about $500 to replace the thermocoupler. Then he told her that, after a routine check, he found our water pressure to be very high. He then quoted a combo deal where he would fix the water heater and replace the pressure regulator for $1200. My wife called me at work and we talked about it - it seemed like a high bid but neither of us really knew about how much this stuff should cost to repair.
So we approved the quote, plumber did the work and we paid (by Amex).
My wife then started doing research and discovered that all the parts cost about $250 to replace (!) so roughly the guy charged us five hundred dollars an hour for labor. Needless to say, we were upset.
We spoke with several other plumbers that said they would have charged about $500 for the job. I wish we had hired one of them two days ago.
My wife talked to the company manager today. Long story short, he said he would knock off $300 from the bill. But it still feels like we're still getting burned. Do we have any recourse, or just another hard lesson learned?
You could call the Contractors State Licensing Board at (800) 321-CSLB to see if you have any recourse, but it sounds like you may have just made an expensive mistake.
posted by Pants! at 7:18 PM on June 16, 2009
posted by Pants! at 7:18 PM on June 16, 2009
I was in a very similar situation with a plumbing company several years ago. I did file a complaint with the BBB and they declined getting involved for the very reason already mentioned: I'd been quoted the price and had accepted it.
So... what I did was blog about my experience -- naming the company by name -- and, because they were stupid people who hadn't yet developed much of a web presence, it wasn't long before my very critical blog post was coming up on the first page of any Google search on their company name. And then other people began leaving comments on my blog about their negative experiences with the company.
This went on for about a year and my Google ratings for that page kept rising.
Then I got the letter from the plumbing company's lawyers threatening me with "action" of some sort if I didn't remove my blog post.
I wrote a very politely worded letter back, basically telling them to shove it. And I never heard anything from them again.
The whole experience turned out very well for me. I like to believe that they lost more money on the business of people who, reading my blog post, chose NOT to hire them than they'd ever gouged out of me.
[If you don't have your own blog, Yelp is a very good site for posting about your experiences with local companies.]
posted by rhartong at 7:28 PM on June 16, 2009 [4 favorites]
So... what I did was blog about my experience -- naming the company by name -- and, because they were stupid people who hadn't yet developed much of a web presence, it wasn't long before my very critical blog post was coming up on the first page of any Google search on their company name. And then other people began leaving comments on my blog about their negative experiences with the company.
This went on for about a year and my Google ratings for that page kept rising.
Then I got the letter from the plumbing company's lawyers threatening me with "action" of some sort if I didn't remove my blog post.
I wrote a very politely worded letter back, basically telling them to shove it. And I never heard anything from them again.
The whole experience turned out very well for me. I like to believe that they lost more money on the business of people who, reading my blog post, chose NOT to hire them than they'd ever gouged out of me.
[If you don't have your own blog, Yelp is a very good site for posting about your experiences with local companies.]
posted by rhartong at 7:28 PM on June 16, 2009 [4 favorites]
if you hire a hooker for a blowjob and agree on her $500/hour services, you can't get mad when you find out that other girls on the corner would have done it for $50.
next time hold the work off for a day or two while you get different quotes. any time you hire a contractor, ask for a break down of costs. you just learned a very expensive lesson. feel free to do a write up on yelp or whatever about them, but really, they didn't do anything wrong. they offered a service for a fee and they did the service they promised.
posted by nadawi at 7:42 PM on June 16, 2009 [4 favorites]
next time hold the work off for a day or two while you get different quotes. any time you hire a contractor, ask for a break down of costs. you just learned a very expensive lesson. feel free to do a write up on yelp or whatever about them, but really, they didn't do anything wrong. they offered a service for a fee and they did the service they promised.
posted by nadawi at 7:42 PM on June 16, 2009 [4 favorites]
He quoted you a price, you accepted, and then he performed the work he proposed. If he hadn't done the work as proposed, then you would have recourse, but while his price was high, you did agree to it. As it is, he knocked $300 off because he knew he whacked you on the bill in the first place.
Did you get the quote in writing or was it all verbal? Did he write out a work ticket? Did you sign the ticket? Either way, you paid already, and the leverage is gone.
If he's a licensed master plumber in your state, you can call the licensing board as Pants! suggested upthread, but I would be surprised if they took any action.
posted by crankylex at 7:47 PM on June 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
Did you get the quote in writing or was it all verbal? Did he write out a work ticket? Did you sign the ticket? Either way, you paid already, and the leverage is gone.
If he's a licensed master plumber in your state, you can call the licensing board as Pants! suggested upthread, but I would be surprised if they took any action.
posted by crankylex at 7:47 PM on June 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
Others have pretty much covered your (probably disappointing) possible recourses.
Here's a strategy for dealing with possible gouging the next time you have an emergency repair (you can't wait and get multiple quotes, or are really averse to waiting) and you don't have a trusted company to deal with:
When you or your wife is looking up plumbers/HVAC-people/whatnots on the internet or in the yellow pages, jot down a few of them. If you suspect that the first one is trying to pull a fast one on you, excuse yourself and call the next one on the list. Explain the problem that the first person has found and ask what they'd charge for the same repair. If it's considerably less, thank the first one for their time (you may have to pay a visit/quote fee) and tell them you'll have someone else do the work.
If you want to be a real hardass, you could make the call in front of the gouger.
They may try to haggle you down, but, personally, I'd rather go with the company charging the uninflated price from the start.
posted by CKmtl at 8:12 PM on June 16, 2009
Here's a strategy for dealing with possible gouging the next time you have an emergency repair (you can't wait and get multiple quotes, or are really averse to waiting) and you don't have a trusted company to deal with:
When you or your wife is looking up plumbers/HVAC-people/whatnots on the internet or in the yellow pages, jot down a few of them. If you suspect that the first one is trying to pull a fast one on you, excuse yourself and call the next one on the list. Explain the problem that the first person has found and ask what they'd charge for the same repair. If it's considerably less, thank the first one for their time (you may have to pay a visit/quote fee) and tell them you'll have someone else do the work.
If you want to be a real hardass, you could make the call in front of the gouger.
They may try to haggle you down, but, personally, I'd rather go with the company charging the uninflated price from the start.
posted by CKmtl at 8:12 PM on June 16, 2009
I don't know what the laws in CA are, but as a seasoned do it your selfer I can tell you that those prices are a little suspect. The first time I came across a bad thermocouple happened to be on the coldest day of the year and a Sunday to boot. Fortunately I have a friend in the HVAC business (in this case the thermocouple was on my furnace) and he came out, it was a standardized part that he had on his truck, and he replaced it in 10 minutes and told me buying him a beer would be sufficient compensation.
Since then I have replaced the thermocouple on my mom's water heater and a furnace at another house; if you at all mechanically inclined it is almost a trivial job (although since you are working with the potentially explosive mixture of gas and electricity attention to detail is essential). Once again it is a job that takes a few minutes to replace a part that costs less than ten dollars.
In case you don't know what role the thermocouple plays in a furnace, water heater, or stove, it simply detects whether the pilot light is on or not (it sits above the pilot light and senses the heat from it) and if the pilot is not lit it shuts off the flow of gas to the main burner so that unburned gas won't flow freely into the building if there is no pilot light to ignite it.
As for your water pressure, that is also something I have dealt with, and it has nothing to do with the thermocouple. A pressure gauge is pretty cheap (I paid about $10 for one at a big box store) and I used mine to find out that my water pressure was 80 to 120 PSI; this explained why my toilets tended to run all the time and various plumbing fixtures wore out faster than normal. On the other hand, it only took a couple of impulse sprinklers to water my whole yard, as they squirted out water far further than expected. Less than 80 and about 50 PSI is typical residential water pressure; did your plumber give you any numbers? Local codes can give more exact numbers.
I had a pressure regulator installed on my water line at the meter and even with a couple of other small jobs the plumber did (he is also a friend, but not the type that would do work for less than a fair price) it was only about $300. Once the regulator is installed adjusting it is a simple matter of turning a nut on the valve body; the aforementioned $10 pressure gauge is sufficient for fine tuning
posted by TedW at 8:23 PM on June 16, 2009
Since then I have replaced the thermocouple on my mom's water heater and a furnace at another house; if you at all mechanically inclined it is almost a trivial job (although since you are working with the potentially explosive mixture of gas and electricity attention to detail is essential). Once again it is a job that takes a few minutes to replace a part that costs less than ten dollars.
In case you don't know what role the thermocouple plays in a furnace, water heater, or stove, it simply detects whether the pilot light is on or not (it sits above the pilot light and senses the heat from it) and if the pilot is not lit it shuts off the flow of gas to the main burner so that unburned gas won't flow freely into the building if there is no pilot light to ignite it.
As for your water pressure, that is also something I have dealt with, and it has nothing to do with the thermocouple. A pressure gauge is pretty cheap (I paid about $10 for one at a big box store) and I used mine to find out that my water pressure was 80 to 120 PSI; this explained why my toilets tended to run all the time and various plumbing fixtures wore out faster than normal. On the other hand, it only took a couple of impulse sprinklers to water my whole yard, as they squirted out water far further than expected. Less than 80 and about 50 PSI is typical residential water pressure; did your plumber give you any numbers? Local codes can give more exact numbers.
I had a pressure regulator installed on my water line at the meter and even with a couple of other small jobs the plumber did (he is also a friend, but not the type that would do work for less than a fair price) it was only about $300. Once the regulator is installed adjusting it is a simple matter of turning a nut on the valve body; the aforementioned $10 pressure gauge is sufficient for fine tuning
posted by TedW at 8:23 PM on June 16, 2009
Best answer: Take the $300 before that goes away.
posted by Conrad Cornelius o'Donald o'Dell at 8:50 PM on June 16, 2009
posted by Conrad Cornelius o'Donald o'Dell at 8:50 PM on June 16, 2009
Join Angie's List. Let the plumber know you've done so, and see if they come back to you with a more reasonable adjustment to the bill.
In future, use Angie's List to find contractors with excellent reviews.
If it helps, most homeowners can relate to that sickening feeling that you've been had and there's not much you can do about it.
posted by palliser at 8:54 PM on June 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
In future, use Angie's List to find contractors with excellent reviews.
If it helps, most homeowners can relate to that sickening feeling that you've been had and there's not much you can do about it.
posted by palliser at 8:54 PM on June 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
Pulled a homer on that one did ya?
In all seriousness though, you need to perform due diligence when hiring anyone to perform a service for you. A guy comes in and says it'll cost $1200 to fix something and you didn't even get a second opinion.
A. Always get a second opinion
B. Don't tell plumber B what plumber A offered to fix it for. Nor C, D , or E.
C. Never accept the low bid simply because it is low.
D. Never accept the high bid because you think it will equal quality.
When it comes to fixing something, being in a hurry causes trouble every time. This is more a learning experience than anything else. Chalk it up to knowledge and be happy you'll never get worked over like that again.
As a bonus I'll leave you with a joke about Plumbers:
Wanna know where plumbers do it?
In the manhole. (_1_) <====8
posted by Gravitus at 10:18 PM on June 16, 2009
In all seriousness though, you need to perform due diligence when hiring anyone to perform a service for you. A guy comes in and says it'll cost $1200 to fix something and you didn't even get a second opinion.
A. Always get a second opinion
B. Don't tell plumber B what plumber A offered to fix it for. Nor C, D , or E.
C. Never accept the low bid simply because it is low.
D. Never accept the high bid because you think it will equal quality.
When it comes to fixing something, being in a hurry causes trouble every time. This is more a learning experience than anything else. Chalk it up to knowledge and be happy you'll never get worked over like that again.
As a bonus I'll leave you with a joke about Plumbers:
Wanna know where plumbers do it?
In the manhole. (_1_) <====8
posted by Gravitus at 10:18 PM on June 16, 2009
Response by poster: Just joined Angie's List. Learned an expensive lesson. Will take a hot, steamy shower and enjoy the hot water I overpaid for (sic). :)
posted by shino-boy at 10:51 AM on June 17, 2009
posted by shino-boy at 10:51 AM on June 17, 2009
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by MegoSteve at 7:12 PM on June 16, 2009