Ebay Scam?
December 2, 2004 10:57 PM Subscribe
I am selling a minor item on ebay and just received a question from a member with 100+ positive feedbacks. It's odd enough that I suspect a scam [mi]
Here is the text of the question:
Hi, my best friends are having a wedding in 10 days and I would like to make a present for them. I want it to be something special. For example your lipstik packed in a gift wrap with a card inside . Also I want to to send $670 via Western Union to a bridegroom as an additional part of my present. The only problem is I want to make them surprised and doesn't want them to know that the present is from me. I am looking for a seller who could help me with that. I will pay for a necklace, packaging, express shipping and WU fees of course. They live in Ukraine, not in the USA. Please let me know if you could help me with that! I want you to ship everything to him directly and to send the money present via Western Union either. I could even pay you for a trouble let's say $200 - please understand it's very important for me! I hope to hear from you soon!
I'm highly suspicious, but I don't understand how this would even work, as there would be no way that I would do anything without receiving the money first. What's the deal here?
Here is the text of the question:
Hi, my best friends are having a wedding in 10 days and I would like to make a present for them. I want it to be something special. For example your lipstik packed in a gift wrap with a card inside . Also I want to to send $670 via Western Union to a bridegroom as an additional part of my present. The only problem is I want to make them surprised and doesn't want them to know that the present is from me. I am looking for a seller who could help me with that. I will pay for a necklace, packaging, express shipping and WU fees of course. They live in Ukraine, not in the USA. Please let me know if you could help me with that! I want you to ship everything to him directly and to send the money present via Western Union either. I could even pay you for a trouble let's say $200 - please understand it's very important for me! I hope to hear from you soon!
I'm highly suspicious, but I don't understand how this would even work, as there would be no way that I would do anything without receiving the money first. What's the deal here?
Scam. Pretty much any time "Western Union" is mentioned in conjunction with a transaction, assume it's a scam. WU isn't intended to be a transactional payment system.
posted by majick at 11:08 PM on December 2, 2004
posted by majick at 11:08 PM on December 2, 2004
I'd say no. Rings all my alarm bells. Vaguely reminiscent of those "and then I'll send you a [fake] cashier's check for $1000, and you send me back $500." Maybe they're just testing your greed level in advance of another scam. Because who gives someone $670 AND A LIPSTICK for their wedding? Scam, scam, scam.
posted by GaelFC at 11:08 PM on December 2, 2004
posted by GaelFC at 11:08 PM on December 2, 2004
I don't know how the scam would work but I've never heard of a "send $$ to another country via Western Union" plan that WASN'T a scam. If you know all about how Western Union operates in a former Soviet republic then by all means do it; otherwise I would steer clear.
posted by coelecanth at 11:09 PM on December 2, 2004
posted by coelecanth at 11:09 PM on December 2, 2004
Sounds like a scam to me. It's possible the eBay account has been hacked. IF you're interested in finding out, go to their feedback and find someone they've sold to. Then, email that person a query saying that you are an eBay seller and received a very suspicious email (don't send the email) from someone they've bought from before. You're wondering if they still have the contact email address for the seller as you'd like to contact them and be sure that the account is on the up and up. If/when that person sends you the email, email the person and ask them if they've recently contacted you about something you're selling on eBay.
I've done this many times when buying items that look suspicious and have found scammers this way.
Or, you could just forget the whole thing as it's more than likely a scam.
How is it a scam? Well, I'm making some assumptions. If either is incorrect, then I don't know how it's a scam:
1. Your item has already ended and this person has won OR (more likely) you have a buy it now option on your item.
2. You accept Paypal.
If those are correct, here's how I see it working: they buy the item from you for your buy it now, then they paypal you the payment, plus shipping, plus $200 plus $670. You then WU the money. They then then cancel the payment through paypal claiming they sent the wrong amount. Paypal agrees that it doesn't match the closing fee of the auction (which is identified in the payment email) and credits the buyer back the difference.
posted by dobbs at 11:09 PM on December 2, 2004
I've done this many times when buying items that look suspicious and have found scammers this way.
Or, you could just forget the whole thing as it's more than likely a scam.
How is it a scam? Well, I'm making some assumptions. If either is incorrect, then I don't know how it's a scam:
1. Your item has already ended and this person has won OR (more likely) you have a buy it now option on your item.
2. You accept Paypal.
If those are correct, here's how I see it working: they buy the item from you for your buy it now, then they paypal you the payment, plus shipping, plus $200 plus $670. You then WU the money. They then then cancel the payment through paypal claiming they sent the wrong amount. Paypal agrees that it doesn't match the closing fee of the auction (which is identified in the payment email) and credits the buyer back the difference.
posted by dobbs at 11:09 PM on December 2, 2004
The user probably just got hijacked, that's been happening a lot lately on other boards I frequent.
posted by asterisk at 11:09 PM on December 2, 2004
posted by asterisk at 11:09 PM on December 2, 2004
ANY mention of Western Union anywhere in connection to eBay is a scam. eBay accounts get hacked all the time. Avoid, avoid, avoid, and report to eBay.
posted by humuhumu at 11:11 PM on December 2, 2004
posted by humuhumu at 11:11 PM on December 2, 2004
There are three uses for the phrase "I hope to hear from you soon!".
1) You have just proposed sex.
2) You want a job.
3) It's a scam.
posted by Caviar at 11:32 PM on December 2, 2004 [1 favorite]
1) You have just proposed sex.
2) You want a job.
3) It's a scam.
posted by Caviar at 11:32 PM on December 2, 2004 [1 favorite]
Or all three.
posted by NortonDC at 11:36 PM on December 2, 2004 [1 favorite]
posted by NortonDC at 11:36 PM on December 2, 2004 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thanks dobbs. I was sure it was a scam but I wasn't sure how they expected to actually make a profit. Paypal seems to be the answer.
posted by hindmost at 11:57 PM on December 2, 2004
posted by hindmost at 11:57 PM on December 2, 2004
I wouldn't deal with any odd countries like that except like this:
Money in hand via TT (wire transfer). Period. Then, AFAIK, there's no way to take it back, even from a hacked bank account.
Sorry, but too many scams from those places.
posted by shepd at 12:34 AM on December 3, 2004
Money in hand via TT (wire transfer). Period. Then, AFAIK, there's no way to take it back, even from a hacked bank account.
Sorry, but too many scams from those places.
posted by shepd at 12:34 AM on December 3, 2004
Well, I've sold to "odd countries" with Paypal without a single incident. Every non-paying bidder or troublemaker I've had has been American.
posted by dobbs at 12:38 AM on December 3, 2004
posted by dobbs at 12:38 AM on December 3, 2004
Sounds much like the P-P-Powerbook on The Metafilter. Hint: that Ukrainian WU money order will be about as genuine as a 3-dollar bill.
posted by planetkyoto at 3:19 AM on December 3, 2004
posted by planetkyoto at 3:19 AM on December 3, 2004
Definitely a scam. The person who is emailing you is not the account holder who earned 100+ feedback. The account was phished. The hacker sent a mass email to eBay users with a fake message made to look like it's from eBay security, claiming that their account has been compromised and they must log in within a day or risk being banned. The login link in the email, though, is a phony one designed to look like an eBay page, but actually just captures the username and his password. Then the hacker can use the account freely to scam people, who assume the hacker is trustworthy because his newly captured account has 100+ feedback.
They make money either by getting you to log in to an escrow site they control, or by sending you a fake cashier's check.
posted by MegoSteve at 4:13 AM on December 3, 2004
They make money either by getting you to log in to an escrow site they control, or by sending you a fake cashier's check.
posted by MegoSteve at 4:13 AM on December 3, 2004
I wouldn't be surprised to see scams like this increasing as the phishing e-mails get more sophisticated. I received an e-bay phishing e-mail the other day that looked pretty darn convincing (complete with e-bay logo, legal mumbo jumbo and a link to an ebay.com address). All the previous phishing e-mails I have received have been blatantly obvious (typos and grammar errors etc.).
posted by Otis at 5:18 AM on December 3, 2004
posted by Otis at 5:18 AM on December 3, 2004
It's a scam... growing very frequent. I was selling on ebay, and someone wanted to send me a fake WU money order in exchange for shipping my item to Nigeria. Crazy Africans.
posted by ac at 6:49 AM on December 3, 2004
posted by ac at 6:49 AM on December 3, 2004
As an aside, I'm of the opinion that ebay totally sucks, and it's going downhill. My girlfriend has been an avid ebayer for the past 5 years or so, and in the past year she's been subject to more BS than ever before. I think the scammers and shady characters are taking it over, and ebay doesn't really seem to care. (i.e. They don't get involved in fraudulent transactions and force you to go through the PAY service Square Trade. They also make it exceedingly difficult to contact them, and they're supposed to respond in 48 hours but often it takes over a WEEK.)
The most recent scam she had involved a buyer asking to ship the product to a 3rd party, because it was a "gift". She complied, and it turned out the buyer had his own auction for a similar (but better) product going, and he had her ship the product to HIS high bidder (who paid $100 more for it). This person has been scamming people repeatedly under multiple ebay accounts, and the worst ebay does is delete his account... Sorry for the rant, but I just had to get it out. I've been scammed on ebay personally, and I won't be using it anymore.
(So the "good" people flee in droves as the "bad" come in, that means the odds of getting scammed on ebay are increasing over time.)
posted by knave at 7:30 AM on December 3, 2004
The most recent scam she had involved a buyer asking to ship the product to a 3rd party, because it was a "gift". She complied, and it turned out the buyer had his own auction for a similar (but better) product going, and he had her ship the product to HIS high bidder (who paid $100 more for it). This person has been scamming people repeatedly under multiple ebay accounts, and the worst ebay does is delete his account... Sorry for the rant, but I just had to get it out. I've been scammed on ebay personally, and I won't be using it anymore.
(So the "good" people flee in droves as the "bad" come in, that means the odds of getting scammed on ebay are increasing over time.)
posted by knave at 7:30 AM on December 3, 2004
Hey - what do you guys think of the policy of only shipping to paypal confirmed addresses? Does this help?
posted by Caviar at 9:23 AM on December 3, 2004
posted by Caviar at 9:23 AM on December 3, 2004
as there would be no way that I would do anything without receiving the money first
To summarize and extend the discussion: There are probably three parts to this scam. First, the buyer is using an account he has broken into (via phishing). Second, you'd be paid by what appears to be a valid cashiers check, but in fact is a counterfeit (more below). Third, Western Union doesn't require identification by people receiving money (the receiver must have other information), so the scammer is at no risk in collecting the $670.
The key to this is step 2: when you get a cashiers check and deposit it, the bank will tell you (initially) that it's okay. Then ten days later your bank informs you that the cashier's check was fraudulent and that you're responsible for any money you've drawn against it . That's why the scammer has a hard deadline (wedding date) -- he doesn't want you to wait for (say) two weeks to really, really make sure that cashier's check is good.
posted by WestCoaster at 9:34 AM on December 3, 2004
To summarize and extend the discussion: There are probably three parts to this scam. First, the buyer is using an account he has broken into (via phishing). Second, you'd be paid by what appears to be a valid cashiers check, but in fact is a counterfeit (more below). Third, Western Union doesn't require identification by people receiving money (the receiver must have other information), so the scammer is at no risk in collecting the $670.
The key to this is step 2: when you get a cashiers check and deposit it, the bank will tell you (initially) that it's okay. Then ten days later your bank informs you that the cashier's check was fraudulent and that you're responsible for any money you've drawn against it . That's why the scammer has a hard deadline (wedding date) -- he doesn't want you to wait for (say) two weeks to really, really make sure that cashier's check is good.
posted by WestCoaster at 9:34 AM on December 3, 2004
Yes, it is a scam!
Check out these previous AskMe threads hereand here.
[google search is a beautiful thing]
It's also common on Craig's List as I found out when I posted my IKEA sofa for sale.
The Ebay Trust & Safety board is really where you should be posting this question. Those are the people who are experts in detecting scams. They're really good at hunting down scammers and getting Ebay to ban them.
posted by Juicylicious at 10:02 AM on December 3, 2004
Check out these previous AskMe threads hereand here.
[google search is a beautiful thing]
It's also common on Craig's List as I found out when I posted my IKEA sofa for sale.
The Ebay Trust & Safety board is really where you should be posting this question. Those are the people who are experts in detecting scams. They're really good at hunting down scammers and getting Ebay to ban them.
posted by Juicylicious at 10:02 AM on December 3, 2004
NortonDC: that'd be a prostitution scam?
posted by Non Serviam at 10:29 AM on December 3, 2004
posted by Non Serviam at 10:29 AM on December 3, 2004
There's an interesting phishing quiz you can take to test your level of intelligence/paranoia and see how many phishing versus genuine e-mails you can flag.
A couple of pieces of advice to avoid getting phished:
1) If the e-mail threatens to close or restrict your account, it's almost certainly a phishing attempt.
2) Never click on links provided in e-mail, use your bookmarks to go to the site itself or type the address into your location field yourself (genuine PayPal e-mail actually tell you to do this, the phishers provide the links they want you to click)
posted by filmgoerjuan at 8:39 AM on December 4, 2004
A couple of pieces of advice to avoid getting phished:
1) If the e-mail threatens to close or restrict your account, it's almost certainly a phishing attempt.
2) Never click on links provided in e-mail, use your bookmarks to go to the site itself or type the address into your location field yourself (genuine PayPal e-mail actually tell you to do this, the phishers provide the links they want you to click)
posted by filmgoerjuan at 8:39 AM on December 4, 2004
Must. Resist. Snark. Compulsion. But. I. Cannot.
NortonDC: yes, NortonDC dear, yes it was. <rolls eyes/>
posted by Non Serviam at 7:41 PM on December 5, 2004
NortonDC: yes, NortonDC dear, yes it was. <rolls eyes/>
posted by Non Serviam at 7:41 PM on December 5, 2004
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by quadrinary at 11:06 PM on December 2, 2004