Did my girlfriend cheat on me, or am I thinking too much?
February 2, 2009 4:42 PM Subscribe
I discovered my girlfriend recently went to the apartment of an ex lover to "hang out". Did she cheat on me?
OK, so I have been dating a girl seriously for three months now. Everything has been great. Amazing sex, lots in common, and we are spending a huge amount of time together.
A couple of weeks ago, I asked her out on a Friday night. She said she was busy that night, as she was meeting up with Friend X (a guy). Now, Friend X is a guy she has mentioned several times before, and happens to come from the same country as me. She has never offered to introduce Friend X. Anyway, late on that Friday night I call her to check up and she tells me she is drinking with Friend X in his apartment. It is obvious she has had a few drinks by this point. An hour or so later she gets in a cab and we later have a discussion. She says she is sorry for "causing a misunderstanding" and that the guy is just an old friend.
Days later, she leaves my apartment with her email account open on my computer. I notice several emails from this guy. (please, no admonitions about breaking her trust by reading her email.) From previous emails it is clear that until not long before meeting me she was in a fairly passionate sexual relationship with this guy. But was deeply unhappy because he would not commit.
Now here's the thing. I have no reason to suspect she has met this guy at all since we started dating, apart from that one night. And I don't think she has met him again since then. She appears totally happy with our relationship and I have no reason to doubt that.
But should I be worried? Could this have just been an innocent meeting to gain some closure before moving on with me? Am I right to be suspicious that she had to go to his apartment to do this? I am particularly interested to hear any girls' opinions on this aspect of it.
OK, so I have been dating a girl seriously for three months now. Everything has been great. Amazing sex, lots in common, and we are spending a huge amount of time together.
A couple of weeks ago, I asked her out on a Friday night. She said she was busy that night, as she was meeting up with Friend X (a guy). Now, Friend X is a guy she has mentioned several times before, and happens to come from the same country as me. She has never offered to introduce Friend X. Anyway, late on that Friday night I call her to check up and she tells me she is drinking with Friend X in his apartment. It is obvious she has had a few drinks by this point. An hour or so later she gets in a cab and we later have a discussion. She says she is sorry for "causing a misunderstanding" and that the guy is just an old friend.
Days later, she leaves my apartment with her email account open on my computer. I notice several emails from this guy. (please, no admonitions about breaking her trust by reading her email.) From previous emails it is clear that until not long before meeting me she was in a fairly passionate sexual relationship with this guy. But was deeply unhappy because he would not commit.
Now here's the thing. I have no reason to suspect she has met this guy at all since we started dating, apart from that one night. And I don't think she has met him again since then. She appears totally happy with our relationship and I have no reason to doubt that.
But should I be worried? Could this have just been an innocent meeting to gain some closure before moving on with me? Am I right to be suspicious that she had to go to his apartment to do this? I am particularly interested to hear any girls' opinions on this aspect of it.
Maybe ask her?
posted by turgid dahlia at 4:49 PM on February 2, 2009 [3 favorites]
posted by turgid dahlia at 4:49 PM on February 2, 2009 [3 favorites]
Chilling at his place, getting tipsy, passionate sex with him right up until meeting you, unhappy because he wouldn't commit to her?
Sorry to break it to you, but I would bet good money that genitals were part of that evening's activities.
posted by jayder at 4:49 PM on February 2, 2009 [7 favorites]
Sorry to break it to you, but I would bet good money that genitals were part of that evening's activities.
posted by jayder at 4:49 PM on February 2, 2009 [7 favorites]
She's still into him.
posted by otherwordlyglow at 4:53 PM on February 2, 2009 [8 favorites]
posted by otherwordlyglow at 4:53 PM on February 2, 2009 [8 favorites]
I think you should be a little worried that you seem hesitant to talk to her about it, and are relying on other general cues which may or may not provide guidance about your particular concern. (she appears totally happy with our relationship).
And what nonmerci said about trust is key. It seems that you don't trust her. I'd be a little worried about that as well. Perhaps you could talk to her about your perspective and how you feel about it - which is that you feel suspicious. Not saying your suspicions are wrong, mind you. Just that this is a big moment in any relationship - when one person feels vulnerable (which pretty much ALWAYS happens over some point), do they reach out to the other person in the relationship to communicate about the concern? And when they do, how do they do it? And how does the other person respond? (defensively, compassionately, etc.)
I think the answer to those questions will help you figure out if you should be worried or not. It's like you're halfway through the story - and you need to see it through to see what the moral is.
posted by anitanita at 4:58 PM on February 2, 2009
And what nonmerci said about trust is key. It seems that you don't trust her. I'd be a little worried about that as well. Perhaps you could talk to her about your perspective and how you feel about it - which is that you feel suspicious. Not saying your suspicions are wrong, mind you. Just that this is a big moment in any relationship - when one person feels vulnerable (which pretty much ALWAYS happens over some point), do they reach out to the other person in the relationship to communicate about the concern? And when they do, how do they do it? And how does the other person respond? (defensively, compassionately, etc.)
I think the answer to those questions will help you figure out if you should be worried or not. It's like you're halfway through the story - and you need to see it through to see what the moral is.
posted by anitanita at 4:58 PM on February 2, 2009
"Look, I'm not exactly sure what you meant when you said 'causing a misunderstanding'. The only misunderstanding is that I'm not clear on the situation regarding him, and I don't feel comfortable with it. Could we talk about it?"
That's what you should have said to her before coming and asking us to give you support for whatever you want the answer to be. We have no idea if she cheated on you. If you think she did, either dump her, or (better) talk to her about it. If you have this sneaking suspicion but think it's completely irrational, put it out of your head. But only if you are certain that you don't think it's a serious possibility.
The last thing you want is to let this fester, which means you need to talk to her about it, rather than asking us what's going on. She's the only one who can help you with that question. And if you're not comfortable enough to communicate with her, you should consider the health of the relationship in other ways - not just potential sexual impropriety.
posted by Picklegnome at 5:04 PM on February 2, 2009
That's what you should have said to her before coming and asking us to give you support for whatever you want the answer to be. We have no idea if she cheated on you. If you think she did, either dump her, or (better) talk to her about it. If you have this sneaking suspicion but think it's completely irrational, put it out of your head. But only if you are certain that you don't think it's a serious possibility.
The last thing you want is to let this fester, which means you need to talk to her about it, rather than asking us what's going on. She's the only one who can help you with that question. And if you're not comfortable enough to communicate with her, you should consider the health of the relationship in other ways - not just potential sexual impropriety.
posted by Picklegnome at 5:04 PM on February 2, 2009
Response by poster: Thanks all. I probably should elaborate a little. We did have a big discussion the day following that night (of course before I had read the emails). I felt that it was suspicious and told her my feelings. As I said she assured me it was a misunderstanding. She also admitted it was inappropriate for her to be hanging out drinking late at night in another guy's apartment and said it wouldn't happen again. And she offered to introduce me to the guy some day. Like I said I have no evidence she has had any contact with him since then. Obviously she lied to me about his just being a friend, but I am hesitant about whether it is worth bringing up the whole email issue and pushing it further, rather than just monitoring the situation for a while...
posted by aussie_in_NY at 5:06 PM on February 2, 2009
posted by aussie_in_NY at 5:06 PM on February 2, 2009
Girl here: okay, it's understandable that you're suspicious. That's human nature. But unfortunately, that's your problem and not hers. If she "appears totally happy with your relationship", then you just have to trust that she is being faithful.
Am I right to be suspicious ...?
Call me old-fashioned, but I think that reading her emails has reversed the situation somewhat. Of course, being nosy is human nature too! But it does make your concern about HER trustworthiness a bit rich. Sorry if that sounds harsh.
posted by Weng at 5:09 PM on February 2, 2009 [3 favorites]
Am I right to be suspicious ...?
Call me old-fashioned, but I think that reading her emails has reversed the situation somewhat. Of course, being nosy is human nature too! But it does make your concern about HER trustworthiness a bit rich. Sorry if that sounds harsh.
posted by Weng at 5:09 PM on February 2, 2009 [3 favorites]
Hanging out alone in ex-lover's apartment. Check.
Alcohol. Check.
Sex. Check.
If she didn't cheat on you this time she certainly wanted to.
posted by Justinian at 5:13 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
Alcohol. Check.
Sex. Check.
If she didn't cheat on you this time she certainly wanted to.
posted by Justinian at 5:13 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
it doesn't matter if they fucked or not - you think they did. you'll think they did for the rest of your relationship no matter how true or untrue the statement is. the trust here has already been broken (on both sides). time to move on and try again. and next time don't let someone else's bad behavior be a reason to compromise your own trustworthiness.
posted by nadawi at 5:21 PM on February 2, 2009 [3 favorites]
posted by nadawi at 5:21 PM on February 2, 2009 [3 favorites]
Why are you asking us? The only way you'll ever know is if you ask her, and trust her when she says 'no'. If you can't trust her saying 'no', then you're shit out of luck, and no strangers on the internet will be able to convince you otherwise.
Know this: I hang out and drink with past flames all the time- and never once have I cheated. Do you feel any better?
posted by sunshinesky at 5:24 PM on February 2, 2009
Know this: I hang out and drink with past flames all the time- and never once have I cheated. Do you feel any better?
posted by sunshinesky at 5:24 PM on February 2, 2009
It could be nothing! I mean, I've hung out with my exes without having anything my boyfriend wouldn't approve of happening, plenty of times. Plus, you mentioned that none of her emails gave any indication that she's been flirting with him all this time. Honestly? I think nothing happened.
posted by lizzicide at 5:32 PM on February 2, 2009 [2 favorites]
posted by lizzicide at 5:32 PM on February 2, 2009 [2 favorites]
I'm willing to look past the peeking at the e-mail - she had left it open, and had given you ample cause to be suspicious. The larger point is that you don't trust her (with good reason), and that's bad enough.
My guess is that she is using you for leverage against this guy, and hoping that he'll commit to her once his jealousy is triggered by seeing her with another man. Clearly she was willing to have sex with him, and if she didn't, it was because he didn't want to. Even if she behaves perfectly from here on out, you'll always resent her for attempting to cheat on you.
Yes, you could wait around for her to screw up, and once you've "built your case" you can stick her nose in it... but honestly, it's not worth your time. You shouldn't be "monitoring" a girl you're in a relationship with, as if she's just a troublesome employee. You deserve better.
Dump her.
posted by BobbyVan at 5:38 PM on February 2, 2009 [2 favorites]
My guess is that she is using you for leverage against this guy, and hoping that he'll commit to her once his jealousy is triggered by seeing her with another man. Clearly she was willing to have sex with him, and if she didn't, it was because he didn't want to. Even if she behaves perfectly from here on out, you'll always resent her for attempting to cheat on you.
Yes, you could wait around for her to screw up, and once you've "built your case" you can stick her nose in it... but honestly, it's not worth your time. You shouldn't be "monitoring" a girl you're in a relationship with, as if she's just a troublesome employee. You deserve better.
Dump her.
posted by BobbyVan at 5:38 PM on February 2, 2009 [2 favorites]
I am a girl.
"Could this have just been an innocent meeting to gain some closure before moving on with me?"
I doubt it. In all honesty, if I met up with my ex now (we broke up 4+ years ago, he dicked me around and wouldn't commit) in his apartment and alcohol was involved, even if I didn't fuck him it would be cheating. I'd know it, my partner would know it, and I'd be taking the piss out of him if I pretended it was anything else.
Conclusion: she probably fucked him for closure, and she's a selfish cow for going to his apartment/misrepresenting the relationship to you even if she didn't do the nasty. But you need to be brave/honest and ask her, tell her how you feel, gauge her response and ask yourself if it really matters if you're both happy as you are now.
posted by saturnine at 5:41 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
"Could this have just been an innocent meeting to gain some closure before moving on with me?"
I doubt it. In all honesty, if I met up with my ex now (we broke up 4+ years ago, he dicked me around and wouldn't commit) in his apartment and alcohol was involved, even if I didn't fuck him it would be cheating. I'd know it, my partner would know it, and I'd be taking the piss out of him if I pretended it was anything else.
Conclusion: she probably fucked him for closure, and she's a selfish cow for going to his apartment/misrepresenting the relationship to you even if she didn't do the nasty. But you need to be brave/honest and ask her, tell her how you feel, gauge her response and ask yourself if it really matters if you're both happy as you are now.
posted by saturnine at 5:41 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
D'oh. I need to learn to read, scrap the last part of that comment.
posted by saturnine at 5:42 PM on February 2, 2009
posted by saturnine at 5:42 PM on February 2, 2009
I think the best policy is to trust her until you know for sure what happened. You two are in a relatively new relationship, and this is a good opportunity to start building the trust and open communication that you two will need if you're going to be happy together long-term. Also, I know you specifically asked posters not to admonish you about reading her email, but ignoring that part is sort of ignoring the elephant in the room here. Trust is a two-way street, and both of you need to earn it. Reading her email--even if it's printed out in neat, highlighted stacks on your desk--is not cool, and is a breach of trust. I think it's important to admit this error on your own part when you approach her about your ex-related concerns.
posted by teamparka at 5:43 PM on February 2, 2009
posted by teamparka at 5:43 PM on February 2, 2009
Hate to say it, but it does sound like she still cares about him. BUT, it's quite possible for her to be working through some lingering old feelings for him and still very much want a relationship with you. People are capable of all sorts of conflicting desires; she might be totally in love with you and be as physically attracted to you as ever, and still have an attraction to him (maybe one that she has no intention of acting on). Tell her what's going through your head. Remember that you have nothing to lose by keeping your cool and not being accusatory, but getting defensive could be destructive.
posted by cymru_j at 5:45 PM on February 2, 2009
posted by cymru_j at 5:45 PM on February 2, 2009
Response by poster: Thanks all for the helpful suggestions. It's obvious I need to talk to her more. I am inclined to think the best policy is to trust her until I have more information. I have encountered cheating before, and apart from what I have mentioned, none of the usual danger signs are present at all.
posted by aussie_in_NY at 5:50 PM on February 2, 2009
posted by aussie_in_NY at 5:50 PM on February 2, 2009
Who knows what happened that particular night, but she is definitely still into him.
posted by caddis at 5:54 PM on February 2, 2009
posted by caddis at 5:54 PM on February 2, 2009
I have had drinks with old flames in my apartment and not had sex, or intentions of sex. This is by no means a foregone conclusion.
I am also neither witty nor physically attractive and generally pretty clueless when someone is trying to seduce me, so ymmv
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 5:57 PM on February 2, 2009 [5 favorites]
I am also neither witty nor physically attractive and generally pretty clueless when someone is trying to seduce me, so ymmv
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 5:57 PM on February 2, 2009 [5 favorites]
Cheating or not, I view that as an unreasonable thing to do. Having been the other male party in this situation a few months ago (where, when I learned what was going on, I immediately became constantly busy and never actually hooked up with the would-be cheater because I'm not a fucking dick), I can pretty much guarantee that she doesn't value you highly. Either: (A) you are an expendable prop to make the other guy jealous or (B) she's playing you both and cares about neither. Forget the narrow definition of cheating for the moment: she's wasting your time and investing time and emotional availability that should be between the two of you on a person who is not part of your relationship.
DTMFA.
posted by Inspector.Gadget at 6:00 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
DTMFA.
posted by Inspector.Gadget at 6:00 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
Seems weird that she left her e-mail account open--either she did so as some weird way of showing you she has trust in you and you should do the same, or she wants you to know something is going on. - Or she just left her email account open
Just ask her straight up- it's the only thing to do.
posted by mattoxic at 6:07 PM on February 2, 2009
Just ask her straight up- it's the only thing to do.
posted by mattoxic at 6:07 PM on February 2, 2009
Honestly? I have quite a few past flings with guys that I don't consider serious enough to be called "relationships" and I don't even call them "exes." They're just friends that I hooked up with in the past, and that I continue to be friends with. I don't consider it worth upsetting my current partner to give him a blow-by-blow of what those engagements entailed. He trusts me, whoever I happen to be hanging out with (drinking or otherwise). What makes it more likely that she'd cheat on you with this guy, than with any other? You may as well be suspicious of every guy she knows.
posted by Pomo at 6:08 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by Pomo at 6:08 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
There's no way of knowing for sure whether she did or didn't. It's still shitty, though, and she should have talked to you about it before she went over there.
One time my friend wrote elaborate tales of her relationship with the guy she was cheating on within the sights of her then-boyfriend. He read it and found out. I still wonder whether she left it out on purpose. Maybe she is too timid to tell you the full story, hence leaving her email open?
posted by fructose at 6:09 PM on February 2, 2009
One time my friend wrote elaborate tales of her relationship with the guy she was cheating on within the sights of her then-boyfriend. He read it and found out. I still wonder whether she left it out on purpose. Maybe she is too timid to tell you the full story, hence leaving her email open?
posted by fructose at 6:09 PM on February 2, 2009
Best answer: I'm rather amazed that so many people think she is cheating. She left her e-mail account open on your computer. She told you who she was going to hang out with (even if she didn't tell you her relationship with him). She even answered the phone while she was there. How could someone look at this situation and think this is a woman who has something to hide? She clearly had no idea that you would see anything wrong with those e-mails or the fact that she is drinking with this man.
Now whether or not she's still interested in him, I can't tell you. But I'll be damned if she is cheating.
I spend a lot of time with my ex, too, and it is definitely completely platonic. I haven't introduced him to my current boyfriend just because I'm a little worried it might be awkward, plus my he has expressed no interest in meeting him.
I'm sorry if I sound rude, but you seem to be acting a little paranoid. If you were at all paranoid before this incident, then I imagine that is exactly why she didn't want to introduce you to her ex. If this paranoia is new, then that's another thing and you will simply need to discuss with her why she didn't introduce you.
posted by giggleknickers at 6:13 PM on February 2, 2009 [5 favorites]
Now whether or not she's still interested in him, I can't tell you. But I'll be damned if she is cheating.
I spend a lot of time with my ex, too, and it is definitely completely platonic. I haven't introduced him to my current boyfriend just because I'm a little worried it might be awkward, plus my he has expressed no interest in meeting him.
I'm sorry if I sound rude, but you seem to be acting a little paranoid. If you were at all paranoid before this incident, then I imagine that is exactly why she didn't want to introduce you to her ex. If this paranoia is new, then that's another thing and you will simply need to discuss with her why she didn't introduce you.
posted by giggleknickers at 6:13 PM on February 2, 2009 [5 favorites]
She already lied to you; the guy is not just some old friend. I say, if you spend so much time together, it shouldn't be difficult to talk about such things with her. Just under no circumstances tell her you read her email. She might have left it open on purpose as some sort of evil female death trap. Kekeke...
Start with that you're feeling antsy about that friend because she seemed to act strange about it and never introduced you, et cetera. Go from there. You know the truth. If she continues to lie, just break-up. No explanations to her are necessary... just say you're not interested anymore. She'll know why (if she's as smart as she thinks she is).
In my opinion, after 3 months, don't invest any more time in someone who is acting like this, especially if she doesn't come clean.
posted by Timen at 6:20 PM on February 2, 2009
Start with that you're feeling antsy about that friend because she seemed to act strange about it and never introduced you, et cetera. Go from there. You know the truth. If she continues to lie, just break-up. No explanations to her are necessary... just say you're not interested anymore. She'll know why (if she's as smart as she thinks she is).
In my opinion, after 3 months, don't invest any more time in someone who is acting like this, especially if she doesn't come clean.
posted by Timen at 6:20 PM on February 2, 2009
Seems weird that she left her e-mail account open--either she did so as some weird way of showing you she has trust in you and you should do the same, or she wants you to know something is going on.
- Or she just left her email account open
posted by mattoxic at 9:07 PM on February 2
I don't believe in coincidences like that, where the human subconscious is involved. Somewhere inside her head, she decided to leave it open.
And, as others have noted, whether flesh met flesh or not, there was emotional cheating going on. And maybe more, but the bigger problem is the emotional side.
posted by IAmBroom at 6:33 PM on February 2, 2009
- Or she just left her email account open
posted by mattoxic at 9:07 PM on February 2
I don't believe in coincidences like that, where the human subconscious is involved. Somewhere inside her head, she decided to leave it open.
And, as others have noted, whether flesh met flesh or not, there was emotional cheating going on. And maybe more, but the bigger problem is the emotional side.
posted by IAmBroom at 6:33 PM on February 2, 2009
Response by poster: Just as an aside, I don't believe leaving her email open was deliberate. She had to leave in a hurry that day because of something urgent and simply forgot to close out.
posted by aussie_in_NY at 6:35 PM on February 2, 2009
posted by aussie_in_NY at 6:35 PM on February 2, 2009
How could someone look at this situation and think this is a woman who has something to hide? She clearly had no idea that you would see anything wrong with those e-mails or the fact that she is drinking with this man.
That would be the lying about the "old friend" part. This stinks to high heaven. I don't see how someone could look at this situation and think this is a woman who has something to hide. I'm also creeped out by the fact the dude is from the same country. Thell at adds an angle of trying to find someone "just like the other guy."
You should have a sit down with her in a coffee shop and talk this out. If you have any belief that she is not being honest with you, break up with her. Don't let her talk you into anything and delete her number. Do not contact her again.
Here's the thing--this is month 3. It isn't "gee the magic wore off." At that point if she's fooling around on you, she's the "I take all I can get whenever I can" type.
You have to look out for yourself on this.
posted by Ironmouth at 6:37 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
That would be the lying about the "old friend" part. This stinks to high heaven. I don't see how someone could look at this situation and think this is a woman who has something to hide. I'm also creeped out by the fact the dude is from the same country. Thell at adds an angle of trying to find someone "just like the other guy."
You should have a sit down with her in a coffee shop and talk this out. If you have any belief that she is not being honest with you, break up with her. Don't let her talk you into anything and delete her number. Do not contact her again.
Here's the thing--this is month 3. It isn't "gee the magic wore off." At that point if she's fooling around on you, she's the "I take all I can get whenever I can" type.
You have to look out for yourself on this.
posted by Ironmouth at 6:37 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
Weng's comment above is right-on. Sounds more like she was inappropriate (as she admits). Rather than talk endlessly about it, accept her apology, tell her you forgive her, and move on. Meet the guy ASAP too, you'll feel better once you can look him in the eye and give him the old "yeah that's right she's with me buster booya in your face" grin.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:44 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:44 PM on February 2, 2009 [1 favorite]
I think this talk of leaving her email on as an indirect way of clueing him into the past relationship with the other guy is a bit of a stretched. There is something to be said for "benefit of the doubt." If you trust your girlfriend, and she is not giving off signs that indicate a trouble relationship (poor communication, bad eye contact, answers with short sentences, etc) then I wouldnt doubt her veracity here. I do however thing it is uncouth to visit the ex's house. The reason why she is not being upfront about it is because she knows it is something that would upset you. (rule #1 - if you must do something that will upset your significant other, not telling the other what you will do because you dont want to hurt them is ALWAYS more hurtful than being upfront -- we all have forgotten this from time to time).
Talk to her, and tell her how you feel. Express to her that you want to keep the lines of communication open. Do this calmly and she will lay it down for you exactly what happened.
From the sound of it, it could be as simple as the other guy having troubles, and felt compelled to help. But she knows the boundaries... she did come home that night in a cab, not stay over. I think it better to assume she is innocent until proven guilty.
posted by FireStyle at 6:51 PM on February 2, 2009
Talk to her, and tell her how you feel. Express to her that you want to keep the lines of communication open. Do this calmly and she will lay it down for you exactly what happened.
From the sound of it, it could be as simple as the other guy having troubles, and felt compelled to help. But she knows the boundaries... she did come home that night in a cab, not stay over. I think it better to assume she is innocent until proven guilty.
posted by FireStyle at 6:51 PM on February 2, 2009
OK, so I have been dating a girl seriously for three months now. Everything has been great... She appears totally happy with our relationship and I have no reason to doubt that.
Jealousy and suspicion will not make your relationship better.
She has told you nothing happened and, as giggleknickers points out above, she doesn't appear to be acting like someone who is trying to hide things. Ask if you must know, but I can't for the life of me imagine what you can gain from it beyond possibly satisfying your curiosity. If it were me, I would give a good long think to whether that is worth risking appearing as insecure and needy.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 6:57 PM on February 2, 2009
Jealousy and suspicion will not make your relationship better.
She has told you nothing happened and, as giggleknickers points out above, she doesn't appear to be acting like someone who is trying to hide things. Ask if you must know, but I can't for the life of me imagine what you can gain from it beyond possibly satisfying your curiosity. If it were me, I would give a good long think to whether that is worth risking appearing as insecure and needy.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 6:57 PM on February 2, 2009
A couple of thoughts:
(1) If she slept with him that night, it may not have felt like cheating, because he was a guy she had banged a million times already. In their minds, it was just a romp for old times' sake. So I think it is possible for her to rationalize to herself that it was okay, or at least forgivable, for her to sleep with him again after the alcohol started flowing and things loosened up.
(2) The fact that she is with you now, and likes you very much, doesn't mean she wouldn't leave you in a minute if she thought that other guy would commit to her.
posted by jayder at 7:25 PM on February 2, 2009
(1) If she slept with him that night, it may not have felt like cheating, because he was a guy she had banged a million times already. In their minds, it was just a romp for old times' sake. So I think it is possible for her to rationalize to herself that it was okay, or at least forgivable, for her to sleep with him again after the alcohol started flowing and things loosened up.
(2) The fact that she is with you now, and likes you very much, doesn't mean she wouldn't leave you in a minute if she thought that other guy would commit to her.
posted by jayder at 7:25 PM on February 2, 2009
The variety of answers is kind of fascinating!
Maybe you should decide whether she seems more like the people who think she of course had sex with the guy, or the people who think that there's no real reason why she would have.
Anyway if she's excellent and seems to be excited about you and she realizes that she was making you suspicious by what she was doing and wants to build your trust... then, pfft!, give her another chance, how the hell often does that happen?
posted by Casuistry at 8:00 PM on February 2, 2009
Maybe you should decide whether she seems more like the people who think she of course had sex with the guy, or the people who think that there's no real reason why she would have.
Anyway if she's excellent and seems to be excited about you and she realizes that she was making you suspicious by what she was doing and wants to build your trust... then, pfft!, give her another chance, how the hell often does that happen?
posted by Casuistry at 8:00 PM on February 2, 2009
Regarding the email: It's not necessarily a deliberate or subconscious signal at all... when I check my email at a kinkos, I am 100% paranoid and SIGN OUT. but when I check email at a friend's or a boyfriend's.... sometimes you go onto the next page (assuming she has web-based email) and forget about it. I've definitely gone to an email page on my own computer and found that a guest was still signed in - and I IMMEDIATELY SIGN OUT WITHOUT READING ANYTHING. I'm not a saint, but reading other people's email is incredibly wrong.
Regarding the visit: Again, I've hung out with exes and other dudes in PRIVATE HOMES OMG with drinking and without any intention or actuality of hooking up. I *do* think it's reasonable to expect that people in relationships will reveal which of their friends are exes... but if you haven't had those conversations yet, I wouldn't jump to conclusions or berate her for breaking an agreement that was never made. Ask her about the relationship, and tell her how you feel. See what she says... no one here knows what, if anything, went down that night.
posted by moxiedoll at 8:01 PM on February 2, 2009
Regarding the visit: Again, I've hung out with exes and other dudes in PRIVATE HOMES OMG with drinking and without any intention or actuality of hooking up. I *do* think it's reasonable to expect that people in relationships will reveal which of their friends are exes... but if you haven't had those conversations yet, I wouldn't jump to conclusions or berate her for breaking an agreement that was never made. Ask her about the relationship, and tell her how you feel. See what she says... no one here knows what, if anything, went down that night.
posted by moxiedoll at 8:01 PM on February 2, 2009
If you believe she cheated on you, it doesn't really matter whether she did or not. What matters is that you don't trust her. It's possible that she slept with someone else; it's also possible that she did nothing wrong. If it's the former, you may find out someday if you catch her in act, but you'll probably have to spy on her and behave unscrupulously in order to do that. If it's the latter, you'll never be able to prove it, and she'll never be able to prove it to you. There's no way to prove a negative (that she didn't cheat). You can't be certain that she's not banging total strangers in bar bathrooms every night you're not with her. You either believe her when she says she's in a committed relationship with you or you don't.
You've already shown by reading her email that you're not sure whether she's trustworthy. If you can't believe in her, despite the fact that there's no actual evidence that she did anything wrong, you have a problem. Because nothing she or anyone else, especially strangers on the internet, can tell you will allow you to dismiss your doubts. If you don't trust her, you should dial down the seriousness of your relationship until you're ready to make a decision about whether you can get over your fears in the long-term. If you can't, your relationship is doomed whether she cheated on you or not.
posted by decathecting at 8:45 PM on February 2, 2009
You've already shown by reading her email that you're not sure whether she's trustworthy. If you can't believe in her, despite the fact that there's no actual evidence that she did anything wrong, you have a problem. Because nothing she or anyone else, especially strangers on the internet, can tell you will allow you to dismiss your doubts. If you don't trust her, you should dial down the seriousness of your relationship until you're ready to make a decision about whether you can get over your fears in the long-term. If you can't, your relationship is doomed whether she cheated on you or not.
posted by decathecting at 8:45 PM on February 2, 2009
count me in the " she isn't necessarily cheating on you" camp. lots of people remain friends with their exes
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 11:56 PM on February 2, 2009
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 11:56 PM on February 2, 2009
Back in june I was hooking up with a girl pretty regularly and then immediately after she started going out with her current boyfriend. We still hang out pretty often, are really close friends, get drunk with each other almost every time we hang out.... but there's not really a chance of anything physical happening with us. In that time between just hooking up we became really good friends, and her boyfriend really has nothing to worry about from me. I'm not hung up on her and I've had a few-month relationship since then.
On the other side of things, her boyfriend knew about me from the very start, and I've met him multiple times. But just because your girl wasn't as up-front about things as my friend is, doesn't mean shady stuff is going on in he background. It's perfectly reasonable to not want to go through the awkwardness of introducing current lovers to ex-lovers, but at the same time it leaves you uneasy about the situation.
posted by meowN at 12:59 AM on February 3, 2009
On the other side of things, her boyfriend knew about me from the very start, and I've met him multiple times. But just because your girl wasn't as up-front about things as my friend is, doesn't mean shady stuff is going on in he background. It's perfectly reasonable to not want to go through the awkwardness of introducing current lovers to ex-lovers, but at the same time it leaves you uneasy about the situation.
posted by meowN at 12:59 AM on February 3, 2009
FWIW, I met up with my ex-GF last weekend. I'm single, she has recently met someone else I haven't met yet. She was at a loose end, asked what I was up to and whether she could join me. I said yes, she came back to my place and, rather than go home, we both slept in my bed.
I don't know what she told the other guy but nobody cheated on anybody.
Things that look suspiscious aren't necessarily. Ask her, and if you trust her believe her answer. If you don't trust her you don't have anything worth sticking around for.
posted by vbfg at 9:16 AM on February 3, 2009
I don't know what she told the other guy but nobody cheated on anybody.
Things that look suspiscious aren't necessarily. Ask her, and if you trust her believe her answer. If you don't trust her you don't have anything worth sticking around for.
posted by vbfg at 9:16 AM on February 3, 2009
@giggleknickers
The smart cheater acts as though he/she has nothing to hide. In turn you would never have reason to doubt her. This could be exactly what she wants.
I would still remain skeptical.
posted by Macallister Vagabond at 9:42 AM on February 3, 2009
The smart cheater acts as though he/she has nothing to hide. In turn you would never have reason to doubt her. This could be exactly what she wants.
I would still remain skeptical.
posted by Macallister Vagabond at 9:42 AM on February 3, 2009
I share giggleknickers' shock at the fact that everybody is so certain that she's cheating on you.
Personally, I don't know. And unfortunately life isn't a crappy mystery novel; we can't tell you if she did it or she didn't based on a small collection of facts like the one you've laid out. Life is more like a Dashiell Hammett novel; even if you laid things out over 500 pages, we still wouldn't have the facts we'd need to know exactly what happened; only she does.
Ah, but you'd like it if you could figure it out too, wouldn't you?
The truth is, you might confront her, make a big deal out of it, alienate her, and later find out that nothing happened and that you'd ruined a relationship over pointless jealousy. Or you might stay with her, build a relationship, and have her up and leave you for him and break your heart.
Tough game, life. I imagine the best thing to do in your situation is to let her know
(a) that fidelity is important to you
and
(b) that you trust her.
Or move on. It's your call.
posted by koeselitz at 10:28 AM on February 3, 2009 [1 favorite]
Personally, I don't know. And unfortunately life isn't a crappy mystery novel; we can't tell you if she did it or she didn't based on a small collection of facts like the one you've laid out. Life is more like a Dashiell Hammett novel; even if you laid things out over 500 pages, we still wouldn't have the facts we'd need to know exactly what happened; only she does.
Ah, but you'd like it if you could figure it out too, wouldn't you?
The truth is, you might confront her, make a big deal out of it, alienate her, and later find out that nothing happened and that you'd ruined a relationship over pointless jealousy. Or you might stay with her, build a relationship, and have her up and leave you for him and break your heart.
Tough game, life. I imagine the best thing to do in your situation is to let her know
(a) that fidelity is important to you
and
(b) that you trust her.
Or move on. It's your call.
posted by koeselitz at 10:28 AM on February 3, 2009 [1 favorite]
I'd suspect she left the e-mail account open intentionally so you would learn something she feels guilty about, but doesn't want to have to actually say. It's not that uncommon for people who want a secret out without SAYING it to set themselves up to get "caught." I have a friend whose ex once went so far once as to videotape himself cheating on her with obvious indications of when it happened in frame, then left it out for her to find -- when she didn't dump him over it, he assumed forgiveness and moved on with a clear conscience as if nothing had ever happened.
She didn't necessarily cheat... it could be guilt over having gone over there at all, given their history. No way to be certain without asking.
posted by Pufferish at 10:41 AM on February 3, 2009
She didn't necessarily cheat... it could be guilt over having gone over there at all, given their history. No way to be certain without asking.
posted by Pufferish at 10:41 AM on February 3, 2009
She told you who she was going to hang out with (even if she didn't tell you her relationship with him). She even answered the phone while she was there. How could someone look at this situation and think this is a woman who has something to hide?
...Ages ago, while dating one guy, I told him where I would be, who I would be with, and even answered my phone while there. I cheated on him at the place and with the dude I'd told him, and immediately before answering my phone to reassure him that I wasn't cheating on him.
I'm not proud of it, but I'm here to say that it does happen. What this means with regard to the OP's issue, I don't know.
posted by alpha_betty at 11:13 AM on February 3, 2009
...Ages ago, while dating one guy, I told him where I would be, who I would be with, and even answered my phone while there. I cheated on him at the place and with the dude I'd told him, and immediately before answering my phone to reassure him that I wasn't cheating on him.
I'm not proud of it, but I'm here to say that it does happen. What this means with regard to the OP's issue, I don't know.
posted by alpha_betty at 11:13 AM on February 3, 2009
it doesn't matter if they fucked or not - you think they did.
This. When/if you meet the right person, you won't worry about such (sorry to say it) childishness -- you'll simply trust, and that will be enough.
Time to do both of you a favor and move on.
posted by coolguymichael at 11:58 AM on February 3, 2009
This. When/if you meet the right person, you won't worry about such (sorry to say it) childishness -- you'll simply trust, and that will be enough.
Time to do both of you a favor and move on.
posted by coolguymichael at 11:58 AM on February 3, 2009
I don't get all these comments saying, "The problem is that you don't trust her." He hasn't said he doesn't trust her; he is asking us whether he should trust her. They've only been dating for three months, so it's reasonable that he may have some questions about what this behavior means. People manage to deceive their partners for three months, and when the guy found out she was tipsy, hanging out at an ex's house, it is certainly reasonable to wonder "should I trust her?" His question, I believe, was "should I be worried?"
Having read all the contributions to this thread, I'm still of the camp that thinks this her behavior is mightily suspicious.
We know that she and the ex-boyfriend did a mean horizontal mambo before aussie_in_ny entered the picture; what's another whirl around the dance floor for old times' sake?
posted by jayder at 3:03 PM on February 3, 2009
Having read all the contributions to this thread, I'm still of the camp that thinks this her behavior is mightily suspicious.
We know that she and the ex-boyfriend did a mean horizontal mambo before aussie_in_ny entered the picture; what's another whirl around the dance floor for old times' sake?
posted by jayder at 3:03 PM on February 3, 2009
@jayder, we say he doesn't trust her because he read her email. that is not the actions of someone who is trusting someone else.
posted by nadawi at 6:49 PM on February 3, 2009
posted by nadawi at 6:49 PM on February 3, 2009
I'd just like to say that trust is earned, OP. I feel like some of the answers imply that you should trust automatically. I disagree. There is no automatic trust without actions to back it up. And some of those actions don't look good for her. Certainly, there are plenty of people who have just fine relationships with exes. Those people don't lie about them being their exes, however. A person with nothing to hide would not hide that fact from you. I, frankly, having unfortunately been through this situation before, would not trust bald assertions that she is not cheating on you.
If what happened left you with some questions, there is nothing wrong with you. If those questions caused you to look in a spot that you shouldn't, it is wrong to do so, but does not void out the fact that you had some serious concerns. In the end, the only person who is going to look out for your interests is you. Keep that in mind. No matter how nice a person she is, if it turns out that she isn't treating you with respect, you would be well-advised to break off the relationship.
I do agree that the behavior is something that would be troubling. I'd love to say that if someone says that they aren't doing something, they should be automatically trusted, but I don't think that is wise. People lie about this stuff all of the time--they answer the phone while there, they insist nothing is going on, they cover their tracks. That is how this stuff works.
Your problem is that you have already had the "talk" and to discuss it again would just make you paranoid and would also reveal that you looked at her E-mail. You may not want to reveal that. I think you need to keep your eyes open and also be honest about other parts of the relationship. Try to set your feelings of attachment aside and ask yourself is this thing good for you? If so, continue. If not, move on with the "its not you its me" excuse.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:28 AM on February 4, 2009
If what happened left you with some questions, there is nothing wrong with you. If those questions caused you to look in a spot that you shouldn't, it is wrong to do so, but does not void out the fact that you had some serious concerns. In the end, the only person who is going to look out for your interests is you. Keep that in mind. No matter how nice a person she is, if it turns out that she isn't treating you with respect, you would be well-advised to break off the relationship.
I do agree that the behavior is something that would be troubling. I'd love to say that if someone says that they aren't doing something, they should be automatically trusted, but I don't think that is wise. People lie about this stuff all of the time--they answer the phone while there, they insist nothing is going on, they cover their tracks. That is how this stuff works.
Your problem is that you have already had the "talk" and to discuss it again would just make you paranoid and would also reveal that you looked at her E-mail. You may not want to reveal that. I think you need to keep your eyes open and also be honest about other parts of the relationship. Try to set your feelings of attachment aside and ask yourself is this thing good for you? If so, continue. If not, move on with the "its not you its me" excuse.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:28 AM on February 4, 2009
This thread is closed to new comments.
You shouldn't be anything in particular until you sit down and talk to her about this. You're going to need to take ownership of violating her privacy and trust (because reading someone's private e-mails is indeed a trust issue), and see how she reacts from there. If she's defensive, it's a bad sign. On the other hand, she may be a skilled liar.
There's really no advice that can be given other than that. Talk to her about this before it progresses, or before your distrust in her grows and consumes you and your relationship.
posted by nonmerci at 4:47 PM on February 2, 2009