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Best way to educate a child who is a follower in large groups but independent in small groups.

lynnie-the-pooh — Wed, 30 Sep 2009 07:54:18 -0800

Need advice: what is the best way to educate a child who is a follower in large groups but an independent leader in small groups? Hello:

My five year old daughter is in public Kindergarten right now and the teacher tells me she is not independent and that she is a follower. She does not speak up and does not show confidence. At home, my child is talkative, independent, assertive, and a negotiater; the complete opposite of her school situation. Plus she is reading at a first grade level.

But I also see this independence outside of home, as long as it is a small group or only a few people. For example, she is a model/actress for a company, and can get up and do a monologue that she memorized in front of a small group. And one time I introduced her to a lady that she never met before (who was a choir instructor), and my daughter got up on the stage in front of this person and began belting out a song from the sound of music, using her arms and face to express the song and everything.

She used to go to Montessori school for preschool, where supposedly an independent child will thrive. The teacher there did tell me that my child was on the quiet side and seemed to be a follower. Now that we are in public school, it seems to be the same thing.

My question is, should I put her back in Montessor, in hopes that she will become independent? Should I keep her in public school, since those schools are more geared toward telling children how and what they are going to do and learn, or should I homeschool her and then put her in a lot of activities? I do homeschool her in the summer, so it's not like I don't know anything about that.

What I'm concerned about, is that a child who appears to be free and independent and assertive, is now changing her personality with every experience she has at public school. And eventually she will see herself as the quiet, unsure, follower in the group.

Any advice?

Lynnie-the-Pooh

A "top" school district-- how important?

Bardolph — Tue, 23 Jun 2009 19:11:26 -0800

Public education filter: if you went to school in a good district, a not-so-great district, or an in-between district, how did it affect the quality of your education and your success later in life? The husband and I have been having a debate (not entirely academic, since we're in the process of moving) about the importance of school quality in producing a well-educated and successful child.

He was educated in one of the top-rated districts in the state, with lots of money and mostly professional families; I went to school in a middling-to-slightly-subpar semi-rural district, with mostly blue-collar families. We both excelled in school and got into the same Ivy League university, both did well there, and I consider us approximately equally well-equipped by our respective educations. Naturally, he places a lot of stock in the importance of "good" schools, while I'm more skeptical, assuming we're not talking about absolutely abysmal schools (violence, rampant crime, etc).

He feels that since good school districts are better funded, can afford better teachers, more enrichment activities, more varied coursework, and better facilities, that must make a difference in kids' education.

I contend that a bright kid with involved parents will do most of his/her learning outside the classroom anyway-- if you're reading interesting books and having intelligent family discussions and taking the odd university class, then why does it matter whether your classroom has a SmartBoard or your school sponsors field trips to Europe? In addition, I worry about the small-fish/big-pond effect of attending a district where all the students are super-successful and motivated; I knew a professor, for instance, whose daughter got into no top colleges despite having an awesome GPA and activities at one of the most prestigious private schools in the nation, simply because all her classmates were equally successful and there wasn't any way to distinguish herself from the pack.

Finally, maybe I've just watched too many showings of Traffic and My Super-sweet 16, but I wonder about the character issues associated with wealthier, high-achieving communities. Poor communities have their problems too, but it seems as though it'd be easier for a nice middle-class kid to get sucked into materialism/cliquishness/shallow hypersexuality/whitecollar drugs than meth use or cow-tipping, or whatever.

By way of broadening our knowledge-base, I'd love some additional perspectives on this (some useful answers here, but that question focused on private v. public school). Did you love or hate your good (or bad) public-school experience? What factors really do make a difference in the quality of education a public school district provides?

Please help me understand people's objections to year-round public school.

cheapskatebay — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 10:20:57 -0800

Please help me understand people's objections to year-round public school. I'll confess right up front that my grasp on this issue is not as firm as it could or should be, but, based on what I've seen, the pros of year-round schooling seem to have the cons considerably outweighed. I live in a part of the U.S. that does not seem to have much in the way of year-round schooling and I’d be interested in learning more about this, whether anecdotally, with links to discussions online, or what have you. Nayre has been an interesting, albeit partial, source of information.

As I see it:

Pros:

1. Year-round schooling seems to improve students’ retention of subject material, so that more classroom time can be spent learning new material.
2. The boredom some students experience over a lengthy summer vacation can be ameliorated.
3. Multiple tracks – i.e., having students stagger their vacations – can be used in school districts with burgeoning student populations, reducing the need for additional buildings (which advantage may be partially offset by higher year-round costs of staffing the buildings, utilities, etc).
4. Families can vacation during the summer break (however much shorter it may be) and during breaks in the traditional “school year” as well.
5. For the most part, we’re not an agrarian society, so that traditional rationale for summer vacations has diminished considerably.
6. Other industrial nations have moved to this type of schedule with positive results.
7. Year-round schooling would seem to be a natural gateway toward lengthening the school year and/or school day. (That’s a pro for me; I know others might disagree.)
8. I’ve read that year-round schooling can allow more time and resources to be spent with children who are struggling – I’m not exactly sure how that works, although I think retention would be a significant issue for kids with learning disabilities or who otherwise simply would benefit from having shorter breaks.

Cons:

1. I can see how this could be a nightmare for families with kids in different schools, with differing schedules. Arranging after-school care or “vacation” care for kids on a year-round schedule could definitely be tough for many.
2. Finding time for summer jobs and interscholastic athletics for older children (I’m guessing high school age?) would be tough with year-round school; although I’d personally want to see more emphasis placed on academic achievement, I know these are important to many older kids and their families. That doesn’t present much of an objection for the K-8 crowd, though.
3. There’s inertia, the tradition of lengthy summer vacations, and fear of the unknown, of course, and I imagine they play a very large role in debates around this issue.
4. One possible disadvantage might be for teachers – I’ve known many public school teachers who paint houses or otherwise work separate jobs in the summers to earn more money, and year-round schooling would cut into that.
5. Is there any evidence that year-round schooling is “better,” however that may be defined (test scores, “happier” or well-adjusted kids, socially, etc.)?

On balance, year-round schooling seems to have the much better argument. Which pros and cons am I missing? As the title of the question indicates, I’m more interested in an argument that might favor the traditional schedule – not out of ideology, but out of genuine curiosity that I’m somehow giving the traditional schedule short shrift in my admittedly simplistic comparison.

I know there are many hot-button issues currently being discussed that concern education and educational policy - such as charter schools, the possibility of paying higher-performing teachers (however that's measured) more than their peers, and debates over No Child Left Behind - but I'd prefer comments focused on the relative merits of the traditional schedule versus the year-round schedule.

I'm mostly interested in this question as it pertains to the United States, but international perspectives would also be interesting to read.

Thanks!

Does cost/benefit compute?

Xurando — Wed, 02 Apr 2008 15:10:14 -0800

What, if anything, are the advantages of attending an expensive private prep school over a local public high school. Help me justify the $31,000 tuition cost of prep school. My 14 yr. old daughter has applied and been admitted, as a day student, to a top 50 prep school. My wife who works at the local high school says nothing can justify the cost (we have been granted significant financial aid.) Is this true? What would she get out of this experience that she might not get from a public school education?

I want this NYC Public School to give me a piece of furniture they might be throwing away in the near future.

AnyGuelmann — Tue, 15 Jan 2008 12:21:20 -0800

I want this NYC Public School to give me a piece of furniture they might be throwing away in the near future. Last week I came upon two amazing cabinets left on street with a pile of trash. I'm talking vintage 1950's Heywood Wakefield, going on Craig's List and E-bay for up to 2,000. My head almost exploded when my building's admin wouldn't let me bring it in because it was Sunday and I didn't have a "move in" scheduled. Obviously, the beautiful cabinets were gone before I had time to arrange the damn move in for Monday.

As I dashed up and down the street trying to look for some place to temporarily store it, I learned from a doorman that the stuff belonged to the Public School on the corner. The PS maintenance guys just brought the stuff out and left it there for trash.

So now I'm thinking the school could have another simmilar piece they might (or might not) be getting rid of in the future. And I want it. Bad. Before I make a total fool of myself going up to front desk and asking please can I have an old desk you may or may not have, I need some clues.

I am more than willing to pay them for the furniture, but I figure they probably can't sell school property just to anyone, right?

So in my mind the way it plays out perfectly is this: I manage to get a hold of the principal (maybe someone else?) and make sure they have what I want. I tell tem how bad I want it, and that I'd be happy to, say, give the kids a lecture about my country (Brazil), my profession (architect and urban planner), maybe even free Portuguese lessons in exchange for the cabinet/desk/whatever. They say it'd be great and we are all happy and I get myself some vintage Hey-Wake.

How naive am I?
Will I get kicked out? Called crazy?
Help.

Help me out of my housing and schooling nightmare

visual mechanic — Sat, 11 Aug 2007 11:11:35 -0800

How can I enroll my children in a school in LA without having a house? I'm moving to LA for schooling at UCLA (currently live in Maryland). I have 2 children, 7 and 4. Late last month, my wife and I and our kids flew out and picked out a place to live in the Pacific Palisades, right by the public charter elementary school there. We applied, were approved. Got the lease.

I had a question about one of the terms (Said we were responsible for all repairs under $150, even if we weren't responsible for it, that seemed odd to me).

The owner never replied to my question (which I send via email), so finally I decided who cares I needed a place to live so we signed the lease, sent the certified deposit check, and I emailed her to let her know we did so. She said that was great, she thought we were going to back out about the $150.

Things seemed settled. Then after the lease was in the mail, she emailed me to say that she decided she didn't want to rent me the place because I had questioned the lease. She said that she would return the check if I had already sent it. She hasn't responded to my emails or calls since.

We're flying out on the 29th, the kids school starts in early September, and now we face the very real prospect of living in a hotel while we find something else. (And if you have any good leads, that's a bonus help, we are already checking craigslist and westsiderentals.com – if we're missing anything, let me know!)

I'm not really looking for help with the Palisades home, the owner seems a little illogical to me and maybe it's good that we don't live there with her as a landlord. But it has certainly left us hanging.

My question: How in the world do we enroll our kids in school when we don't yet have a home? Is it possible? We want them in a good school, so we're targeting Santa Monica / Westwood / etc. But I doubt any of those schools will let us in until we have a signed lease, right? What should we do until we find a place?

I HEARD her, loud and clear.

PhatLobley — Wed, 20 Dec 2006 07:13:34 -0800

My athiestic leanings make me feel extremely unwelcome in my workplace. It's a public school. No one there even knows I'm an athiest. I need advice. I've read the first 2-or-so chapters of Dawkins's God Delusion. In it, he talks about athiests "coming out" and how there are probably a lot of us hiding out there. I was thinking about this a lot as it relates to my life. I feel pretty much "out" and very well accepted, even by my most religioius friends. The only place where I would consider myself "in the closet," as it were, is at work. The situation there:
I work in a public, urban elementary school. It's been clear since I've gotten here (and has gotten more and more clear over the time I've spent here) that the vast majority of the staff is openly, proudly Christian. Teachers stand up and sing songs about Jesus at all-school assemblies. My colleagues frequently appeal to Jesus to help them with their jobs and assert that he's the only thing getting them through working in a difficult situation like we do. I've never really had any problem with this. I thought the songs might cross the line in a public school, but I figure teachers can sing whatever they want- nobody was forced to sing along. I didn't even get upset about there being no "Holiday" celebrations- only "Christmas" ones. We have an all-school "Christmas Program" today and last night the staff had its annual "Christmas Party." I didn't think this was exactly in line with what should happen in a public school, but given the overwhelming majority of the staff and students who consider themselves Christians, I didn't figure it worth it to quibble over semantics. And I really didn't want to get Bill O'Reilly mad at me.
But then, last night, at the "Christmas Party" (held in the school's library), as I was already thinking about how maybe I should "come out" to some of my colleagues (something I've always avoided in order not to rock the boat as a new teacher), my principal did something that I think completely crossed the line and made me feel completely unaccepted and uncomfortable.
Before we started eating, she announced that we would first have to "give thanks to the lord." I thought this was out of line, but okay. So they'll pray and I'll stare at the food. Then she continued: "And those of you who don't believe in the lord, well you can close your ears or whatever you wanna do, but you're gonna HEAR TODAY." This last part was not said in a hopeful, friendly, come to God kind of way, but had a disrespectful, nasty, judgmental tone. It was greeted with a chorus of affirmations from my colleagues. Our PE teacher then gave thanks to Jesus and we ate.
Whew... My questions:
Is it worth it to "come out" around here?
How much of this should I tolerate? I'm pretty sure protesting would solve nothing and maybe just make it worse for me around here, but can I really let a public school principal get away with saying something like this? It was incredibly insulting- even threatening- to me and surely to anyone else in the room who is a nonbeliever. My Christian girlfriend said it offended her when I related the story. Is it time to take a stand? If not now, when?
Thank you, AskMe, for your wisdom.

School Vouchers and Private Indoctrination

deep_sea_diving_suit — Sun, 23 Jul 2006 12:33:00 -0800

What do people opposed to school vouchers think of private schools in general, and is supporting them hypocritical? (This is admittedly naive, but please bear with me...)

I am trying to justify positions concerning school vouchers. I take the stance that if the public is already paying for public schools, why should a few "lottery-winning" individuals be favored into a private institution, also payed for by the public? Obviously simplified, this is laid out in essays all across academia.

Elementary class analysis leads me to assume that school vouchers serve the capitalistic interests of the upper class. Private schools can choose which students they accept, so not everyone with a voucher can use it. Likewise, vouchers usually only cover a portion of the tuition, and the families have to come up with the rest.

My problem in understanding is with private schools, as they are, in terms of class. Do most people who oppose vouchers also oppose private schools, as only those with enough disposable income can afford to send their kids to them? On the other hand, having the state dictate what is taught in public schools isn't necessarily good for the community...

I oppose school vouchers because it is shortsighted and creates an inherent hierarchy in education. Private schools obviously reinforce hierarchy and are generally supported by upper-middle class families, who supposedly get a better education. Ideally (not to be read as "utopian"), I would argue that to truly benefit society, all institutionalized schools should be abolished. But I digress...

How do you get high school students to do their homework?

scazza — Fri, 07 Oct 2005 09:15:54 -0800

How do you get high school students to do their homework? My friend has just started teaching in public high school. She has 126 sophomores in her English class, and half of them are failing. They all come in with excuses, and her teaching partner says the students are just trying to pull the wool over her eyes. I agree, since they're not frankly admitting that they just don't care, but I don't have any advice on how to get through to them.

A particular assignment, outlining, the students haven't learned since all their past teachers have let it slide, and she's not about to do that. She could send them all to detention but there's no penalty for not going to detention; there's no outside structure for enforcing punishment. This is extremely frustrating for her, she feels responsible, she wants them to know that there is the potential for them to go to college if they do well, she just wants them to please god try. She doesn't know how to get into their heads. And needs advice.

I know mefites are good at talking about when they were in high school, many have children themselves, maybe some are still in high school. Tricks, lectures, punishments, persuasion, give me your ideas.

Transitioning to First Grade

Irontom — Mon, 09 Feb 2004 08:04:12 -0800

PublicSchoolFilter! My son is entering the local public school system in the fall (1st grade). He's currently in a Montessori kindergarten, and is reading, writing, doing addition and subtraction. The question is, should we push for gifted and talented designation for him? [more inside] I just talked to a G&T liason for the school system, and she was poo-poohing the idea that we needed to pursue this for him at this early age. The lady said that he'd need to be tested and go through a couple rounds of committee review of his scores to see if he meets their requirements (all because he's not currently in public schools).

I think he's pretty far ahead of the curve, but I'm his dad and my perspective is (obviously) skewed. I hate sounding like the typical suburban "my kid is so special!" drone, but I want him to avoid the problems I had in public school because I was never challenged.

Thoughts? Experience with this kind of thing? The school system is the Fairfax County Public Schools, in Virginia

School fundraisers

whatnot — Thu, 08 Jan 2004 11:09:26 -0800

Our elementary school's PTA is looking for an ethical and/or fair trade fundraiser. I have only found one decent resource. Anyone else had experience with this? [more inside ...] We only like to do one schoolwide fundraiser per year, in the fall. There are only 240 kids in the school, and we can count on 80-100 of them to participate. In the past, we have had plenty of success, raising $8-12K per year, but the companies we were working with were not always desirable for the following reasons:

Sally Foster: A small catalog of quality products (the wrapping paper is especially good), but they couldn't verify the origin of their cocoa and the turnaround is very slow.

Kathryn Beich: A huge catalog with a wide variety of price points, but they are owned by Nestle. *cue Darth Vader theme*

The Nestle thing was the last straw, and now we are looking for an ethical annual fundraiser that can bring in $10K or more. Any ideas? What successful fundraisers have you been a part of?