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	  <title>Ask MetaFilter questions tagged with meta</title>
      <link>http://ask.metafilter.com/tags/meta</link>
      <description>Questions tagged with 'meta' at Ask MetaFilter.</description>
	  <pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:57:51 -0800</pubDate> <lastBuildDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:57:51 -0800</lastBuildDate>

      <language>en-us</language>
	  <docs>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss</docs>
	  <ttl>60</ttl>	  
	<item>
	<title>What is the best list of Science Fiction books?</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/127327/What%2Dis%2Dthe%2Dbest%2Dlist%2Dof%2DScience%2DFiction%2Dbooks</link>	
	<description>Show me the Best Online Science Fiction book list... Not a title, but a list! Since I have limited time, I like to read the &quot;best&quot; of whats out there in a genre, I so far have read these recently in Sci Fi: &lt;br&gt;
Slaughterhouse, Snow Crash, 1984, Neuromancer, Ender&apos;s, Dune,&lt;br&gt;
2001, Foundation, Stranger, Do Androids, Clockwork, etc. (these may or may not be the best in your opinion)&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
Now I&apos;d like metafilter to do what it&apos;s designed for, create a list of lists! I really want to know where I should go to find the list of the top sci fi books of all time, the last 100 years, the list of the most awarded, whatever. Please don&apos;t give me what you think is the top book, there are plenty of threads regarding this, I want a &quot;true&quot; metafilter a &quot;list of lists&quot; the list of top sci fi books lists. Then I can use those to make my selections. Also if you have a reason why this list is the best list to use, that would be appreciated.</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2009:site.127327</guid>
	<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:57:51 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>fiction</category>
	<category>lists</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>novels</category>
	<category>science</category>
	<dc:creator>samuel1613</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Can anyone help me find this shirt?</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/118870/Can%2Danyone%2Dhelp%2Dme%2Dfind%2Dthis%2Dshirt</link>	
	<description>Try out your web meta-search skills: can anyone help my good friend find out where to get this &lt;a href=&quot;http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_3d1Ri67HVoQ/SdrncOMsvTI/AAAAAAAAAT8/_tMC4sr7mNI/s1600-h/n597078029_1769218_3736974.jpg&quot;&gt;Bob Dylan T-Shirt&lt;/a&gt;? So far my searching has led me to determine that Warner Music did a promo for Jenny Lewis&apos; new album, &quot;Acid Tongue&quot; featuring a bunch of youtube videos where people show up with those balloons at her doorstep. So the girl in the shirt is Jenny Lewis, but that&apos;s all I got. No luck on the identity of the shirt. If anyone can help me find out where this shirt was made, and (perhaps more interestingly) share &lt;em&gt;how&lt;em&gt;&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/em&gt; they came to find the answer, I would be greatly appreciative!&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
Thanks,&lt;br&gt;
bc</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2009:site.118870</guid>
	<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 10:59:53 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>bobdylan</category>
	<category>dylan</category>
	<category>jennylewis</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>search</category>
	<category>shirt</category>
	<category>tshirt</category>
	<dc:creator>quickasfoxes</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Meta-Median from other medians?</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/114911/MetaMedian%2Dfrom%2Dother%2Dmedians</link>	
	<description>[Statistics Filter]: What&apos;s the best way to calculate a meta-median? I&apos;m working with aggregated benchmarking data, and don&apos;t have access to the the raw data behind them. The benchmarks include averages, percentiles, number of measurements, and medians (usually no standard deviations or variances).&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
What would be the best way to calculate a meta-median, i.e. a median based on several median values from different benchmarks? Should I:&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
- take the median of medians&lt;br&gt;
- average median values (maybe weighted?)&lt;br&gt;
- use any other kind of approximation from the data I have?&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
Thanks for your help!</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2009:site.114911</guid>
	<pubDate>Mon, 23 Feb 2009 04:34:54 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>average</category>
	<category>median</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>statistics</category>
	<dc:creator>lord_yo</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Meta Descriptions and Keywords for MediaWiki </title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/103292/Meta%2DDescriptions%2Dand%2DKeywords%2Dfor%2DMediaWiki</link>	
	<description>I have a MediaWiki wiki that I&apos;ve started. Unfortunately, it doesn&apos;t seem to automatically generate meta keywords and meta descriptions from the articles. What is the best solution for this? I tried to find out how Wikipedia does it, but my Google Fu is weak.</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2008:site.103292</guid>
	<pubDate>Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:04:37 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>descriptions</category>
	<category>keywords</category>
	<category>mediawiki</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>metadata</category>
	<category>wiki</category>
	<dc:creator>entropicamericana</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Give Me the Low-Down on Putting Together a Meta Site</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/97880/Give%2DMe%2Dthe%2DLowDown%2Don%2DPutting%2DTogether%2Da%2DMeta%2DSite</link>	
	<description>What are the components that make a successful Meta site? I&apos;d like to start a new venture that would be similar to Meta in some ways - in that people may ask questions and inquire the hive mind - but these questions are all relative to one subject.  &lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
Is the word Meta copyrighted or can anyone use it? &lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
What is needed to get started? What kind of programming knowledge and skills are needed? I&apos;d like to charge people a nominal fee for signing up as well. So what&apos;s involved in that? And as for publicity - do I dare ask how to start a campaign? Would you let it take on a life of its own or to do it virally and unabashedly all out focused?&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
In short, I need the low-down of starting a meta site devoted to one subject and how to make it a phenomenal success.</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2008:site.97880</guid>
	<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 07:05:01 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>focused</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>site</category>
	<category>start-up</category>
	<dc:creator>watercarrier</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Stories that take place in Hell, Purgatory, comas, nightmares, memory etc etc</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/87272/Stories%2Dthat%2Dtake%2Dplace%2Din%2DHell%2DPurgatory%2Dcomas%2Dnightmares%2Dmemory%2Detc%2Detc</link>	
	<description>I&apos;m looking for narratives (books, movies, games) in which the protagonist is dead, dying or unconscious, and discovers they are not in the &apos;real&apos; world at all, but Hell, heaven, purgatory, a coma, a nightmare, memory, or similar. Examples which contain spoilers below the fold. Obvious examples would be &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Third_Policeman&quot;&gt;The Third Policeman&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stay_%282005_film%29&quot;&gt;Stay&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1573222739/metafilter-20/ref=nosim/&quot;&gt;The Coma&lt;/a&gt;, the game &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.fasco-csc.com/works/viridian/index_e.php&quot;&gt;Viridian Room&lt;/a&gt;, and so on. &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice&apos;s_Adventures_in_Wonderland&quot;&gt;Alice in Wonderland&lt;/a&gt; sort-of counts but I&apos;m more interested in protagonists who investigate their situation, rather than vanilla &apos;...and then I woke up&apos;. Bonus points if the narrative involves escaping.&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
For the purposes of the question, stories like &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_Sunshine_of_the_Spotless_Mind&quot;&gt;Eternal Sunshine&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Nightmare_on_Elm_Street&quot;&gt;a Nightmare on Elm Street&lt;/a&gt; and so on don&apos;t count because the protagonist is not completely immersed in the meta-world. I&apos;d let &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/If_On_a_Winter&apos;s_Night_a_Traveler&quot;&gt;If on a Winter&apos;s Night a Traveler&lt;/a&gt; slide in though.</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2008:site.87272</guid>
	<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 05:52:20 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>coma</category>
	<category>dream</category>
	<category>film</category>
	<category>game</category>
	<category>hell</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>narrative</category>
	<category>novel</category>
	<category>purgatory</category>
	<category>reveal</category>
	<dc:creator>unSane</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Narrative/fiction movies with unexpected moments of &quot;reality&quot; or fourth wall-breaking or other interesting metaness?</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/61902/Narrativefiction%2Dmovies%2Dwith%2Dunexpected%2Dmoments%2Dof%2Dreality%2Dor%2Dfourth%2Dwallbreaking%2Dor%2Dother%2Dinteresting%2Dmetaness</link>	
	<description>Narrative/fiction movies with unexpected elements of &quot;reality&quot; or fourth wall breaking or other interesting metaness?  Illustrative examples inside (without spoilers): Sling Blade, Bamboozled, Shortbus, Timecode, South Park, etc.  
I&apos;m less interested here in pervasively-meta movies (like Adaptation or Being John Malkovich) and more interested in traditional narrative movies that have unexpected real/meta moments or elements.  Some examples, of various kinds:&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;A) UNUSUALLY EXPLICIT INVOLVEMENT OF THE VIEWER&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;br&gt;
&#8226; in Sling Blade: Billy Bob Thornton&apos;s long look into the camera during his walk around town (which he&apos;s called a purposeful fourth wall break, meant to remind the viewer he&apos;s spinning a tale).&lt;br&gt;
&#8226; in Bamboozled: the real reactions of shock and confusion we see from the studio audience during the filming of the TV pilot (apparently the extras playing the audience were told they&apos;d be filmed as a studio audience, but were not told what they&apos;d see onstage), which adds an interesting element to the end viewer&apos;s own reactions/shock.&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;B) REAL ACTS WHERE SUCH ACTS ARE USUALLY SIMULATED&lt;/strong&gt; &lt;br&gt;
&#8226; in Shortbus, Bound, Brown Bunny, Baise Moi and others: unsimulated sex, either obvious onscreen or reported by the actors involved.&lt;br&gt;
[&#8226; all the movies in my &lt;a href=&quot;http://ask.metafilter.com/58655/Fiction-movies-in-which-actors-portraying-musician-characters-actually-play-the-instruments-andor-sing&quot;&gt;actors who play their own instruments&lt;/a&gt; thread.]&lt;br&gt;
[&#8226; all movies in which actors do either stunts or other acts you&apos;d expect to see done by doubles (this is less interesting to me unless something about the situation overlaps other categories like A or C).]&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;C) INTERESTING SELF-REFERENCE&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;br&gt;
&#8226; in Timecode: film director character proposes shooting a movie using the multiscreen technique used to shoot Timecode, and other characters think this idea is pretentious.&lt;br&gt;
&#8226; in South Park: four-letter words discovered to have direct, life-saving utility (movie is based on a show often criticized for &quot;gratuitous&quot;/useless explicit language).&lt;br&gt;
&#8226; in Full Frontal: a few meta-twists for the standard &quot;movie in a movie&quot; idea (such as the scene from The Limey that fits into one of Full Frontal&apos;s existing scenes without any change of nesting level).&lt;br&gt;
&#8226; in Dancer in the Dark, Lost in Translation and others: especially self-referential casting (famously childlike-whimsical-fanciful musician as character with same qualities; iconic aging actor as iconic aging actor; etc.).&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
... So which other examples should I check out?  Please let me know why if possible, BUT PLEASE NO SPOILERS (no revealing plot developments/surprises).  Thanks for your help!</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2007:site.61902</guid>
	<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 15:08:01 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>casting</category>
	<category>film</category>
	<category>fourthwall</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>movie</category>
	<category>performance</category>
	<category>reality</category>
	<category>selfreference</category>
	<category>sex</category>
	<category>stunts</category>
	<category>unsimulated</category>
	<dc:creator>lorimer</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Help me organize the photos at work please!</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/54293/Help%2Dme%2Dorganize%2Dthe%2Dphotos%2Dat%2Dwork%2Dplease</link>	
	<description>Creatives Asset Management: Any suggestions for organizing creatives, mostly photos but some otherwise, across a network that doesn&apos;t cost thousands of dollars? I just started at a company and all our creative assets are on cd, and we have to browse through a binder with thumbnail printouts to find what we need. I got to thinking about how easy using istockphoto.com at my previous job was because of the fantastic keyword searching. One thing lead to another, and now I&apos;m in charge of finding an inexpensive solution that we can put our photos into and add keywords to so we can have the same flexibility and ease of use.&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
I searched ask already and while there are a lot of hits I could have missed, two things seem to come up so far. Either a network/server/shared solution that costs thousands of dollars, or really good, inexpensive (sometimes free!) solutions that are for local organization. Is there anything inbetween? Like Picassa for networks? Or is that crazy talk?</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2007:site.54293</guid>
	<pubDate>Wed, 03 Jan 2007 11:16:38 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>creatives</category>
	<category>image</category>
	<category>keywords</category>
	<category>management</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>organization</category>
	<category>photo</category>
	<category>photographs</category>
	<category>tags</category>
	<dc:creator>[insert clever name here]</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>What font should I pick for my tattoo?</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/45760/What%2Dfont%2Dshould%2DI%2Dpick%2Dfor%2Dmy%2Dtattoo</link>	
	<description>TattooFilter:  I&apos;m going to get a tattoo of the word &quot;Tattoo&quot; on my bicep.  I have a few aesthetic questions: most importantly, I need a good font suggestion.  1) I&apos;m looking for a font that is at once modern and staid, with perhaps a splash of cartooniness.  No scripty-type fonts please.  I&apos;m no font geek; the closest font that Word includes to what I&apos;m looking for is Monaco, but this is not very close indeed.&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
2) Should the tattoo run from the shoulder towards the elbow, or cut horizontally across the bicep?  Alternately, one friend has suggested that I get the word repeating around the circumference of the upper arm, in the style of those barbed wire tattoos that are popular with some young men.  I don&apos;t have any strong feelings here.&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
3) Exclaimation point (&quot;Tattoo!&quot;) or not (&quot;Tattoo&quot;)?  I&apos;m leaning towards the exclaimation point, but I thought I might as well take a poll.&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
I am a 24 year old straight white male graduate student, 6&apos;2&quot;, 205.  My upper arms are pretty unimpressive.  This will be my first, and most likely last, tattoo.  Editorial comments regarding what a stupid idea this is will be cheerfully ignored.  Thanks!</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2006:site.45760</guid>
	<pubDate>Fri, 01 Sep 2006 21:38:00 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>font</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>tattoo</category>
	<dc:creator>Kwine</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Smash the phone?</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/35661/Smash%2Dthe%2Dphone</link>	
	<description>What are cellphones good for? I just got my first one and I certainly love it. The phone part and everything, but what more can I do to it? I&apos;m sorry but I have 2 WRT54G and two Xboxes and I&apos;ve hacked them all, is there aything cool you can do with a cellphone like that? Probably not smashing the hardware out of wack, but software wise? I have a Sony Ericsson 7520a. I need to at least figure out how to get ringtones etc onto it.</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2006:site.35661</guid>
	<pubDate>Mon, 03 Apr 2006 21:03:11 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>for</category>
	<category>gods</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>sake</category>
	<category>tags</category>
	<dc:creator>Napierzaza</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Stupid Face</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/34237/Stupid%2DFace</link>	
	<description>I have constant skin outbreaks and I don&apos;t know why. Sometimes I will be clear for a week and sometimes I break out. I know it must have to do with what I&apos;m eating but I usually keep fairly consistant on how I eat. What are the types of foods that might be doing this? I have a weakish stomach and I was thinking maybe I&apos;m eating food that is too acidic, does this have merit? I&apos;m 20ish but I still think this shouldn&apos;t be so bad. &lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
Also what might the winter have to do with it? In Canada it&apos;s cold like crazy so I don&apos;t really leave the house much. I&apos;m reasonably active though.</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2006:site.34237</guid>
	<pubDate>Mon, 13 Mar 2006 06:27:50 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>acne</category>
	<category>hate</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>outbreak</category>
	<category>sick</category>
	<category>tags</category>
	<dc:creator>Napierzaza</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Where did I read that before?</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/33193/Where%2Ddid%2DI%2Dread%2Dthat%2Dbefore</link>	
	<description>Does a meta index of books that reference each other exist? For some reason, it&apos;s always a pleasant surprise when I am reading  and it references something I have previously read.  But sometimes I have no idea where I read it.  Googling it is hit or miss.</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2006:site.33193</guid>
	<pubDate>Thu, 23 Feb 2006 08:00:06 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>books</category>
	<category>index</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>reference</category>
	<dc:creator>MrMulan</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Montreal is cold - Need Compensation</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/26242/Montreal%2Dis%2Dcold%2DNeed%2DCompensation</link>	
	<description>My apartment has had no heat (which is included) since the beginning of the month. Basically the landlord has had no furnace for about a year and has only this past month started installing everything. I&apos;m not sure how to proceed with compensation. I have talked to him about it and he claims that he has been dealing with the people since May and they have only recently been able to start work on it. He says that there isn&apos;t much he can do and though the work is finally finished, they now have to wait for the city to make some modifications on the line as well.&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
I&apos;m pretty pissed off, it has been very cold (Montreal, Que, Canada) and it&apos;s been hard to live. My girlfriend isn&apos;t so happy to come by (still does though, whew) and my roomate is more or less irrate. Apparently someone in the building is talking to the Housing people.&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
My roomate is demanding that I ask for a reduction in rent, I&apos;m having trouble figuring out how much though and how to put it out there; my roomate is more clueless. &lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
Any suggestions on how I can go about this one?</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2005:site.26242</guid>
	<pubDate>Thu, 27 Oct 2005 19:39:09 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>entry</category>
	<category>hate</category>
	<category>i</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>montreal</category>
	<category>rent</category>
	<category>settlement</category>
	<category>tag</category>
	<dc:creator>Napierzaza</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Homeless server space... WTF?</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/18404/Homeless%2Dserver%2Dspace%2DWTF</link>	
	<description>Does anybody know the backstory behind &lt;a href=&quot;http://furtivecode.com/pics/your_office.gif&quot;&gt;this&lt;/a&gt; image of a guy with many computers plugged into a streetlamp? It keeps showing up in MeTa threads.  &lt;br&gt;
&lt;img src=&quot;http://furtivecode.com/pics/your_office.gif&quot;&gt;</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2005:site.18404</guid>
	<pubDate>Sat, 07 May 2005 02:03:27 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>legends</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>metafilter</category>
	<category>urban</category>
	<dc:creator>thedevildancedlightly</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Is there any way to use Google (or another search engine) to search Metafilter for the exact string &quot;Metafilter: &quot;?</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/8949/Is%2Dthere%2Dany%2Dway%2Dto%2Duse%2DGoogle%2Dor%2Danother%2Dsearch%2Dengine%2Dto%2Dsearch%2DMetafilter%2Dfor%2Dthe%2Dexact%2Dstring%2DMetafilter</link>	
	<description>re : &lt;a href=&quot;http://metatalk.metafilter.com/mefi/8067#161691&quot; title=&quot;Either it really is impossible, or everyone was too busy being jocular. Either way, I&apos;d love to know!&quot;&gt;this&lt;/a&gt;.  This has been bugging me for a while - is there any way to use Google (or another search engine) to search Metafilter for the exact string &quot;Metafilter: &quot;?</description>
	<guid isPermaLink="false">tag:ask.metafilter.com,2004:site.8949</guid>
	<pubDate>Sun, 25 Jul 2004 17:46:28 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>google</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>taglines</category>
	<dc:creator>stavrosthewonderchicken</dc:creator>
	</item>
	<item>
	<title>Meta</title>
	<link>http://ask.metafilter.com/3901/Meta</link>	
	<description>how many levels of meta are possible, in practice? [more inside] &quot;going meta&quot; means going to a higher level of abstraction - a formal way of defining &quot;thinking outside the box&quot;.&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
you can go to an unlimited number of levels trivially with tricks like repeatedly asking &quot;why?&quot; (like a child, questioning each answer), or with &quot;i know that you know that i know that...&quot;.  but non-trivial examples only seem to go a few levels before bottoming-out.  does anyone have any examples of non-trivial abstraction to more than a couple of levels?&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
in functional programming it&apos;s common to have higher order functions. functions that return functions are common.  functions that manipulate functions that manipulate functions sometimes exist.  but i don&apos;t think i&apos;ve ever gone beyond that.&lt;br&gt;
&lt;br&gt;
in philosophy, the ability to &quot;go meta&quot; is closely linked to consciousness (or perhaps self-consciousness) - but that only seems to require one level.  dennett, in elbow room, mentions this and makes the observation that we seem to be limited in our ability to go to higher levels.  he cites nietzsche, but his example (valuing values) isn&apos;t exactly mindblowing (to little ol&apos; me, at least).&lt;br&gt;
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in askmeta a few threads below i posted an answer discussing how limits in maths are one level of abstraction above the normal way of thinking.  taking that another level gets us to conversations like this, which discuss going meta.  but what&apos;s the level above this?&lt;br&gt;
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if there are no good examples of deeply nested meta-abstraction then what&apos;s the source of the limit?  are we simply too stupid?  or is abstraction so powerful that after a few applications it includes &quot;everything&quot;, making further use pointless?&lt;br&gt;
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has anyone got any good references to discussions of this problem in the literature?</description>
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	<pubDate>Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:11:10 -0800</pubDate>
	<category>abstraction</category>
	<category>examples</category>
	<category>howmany</category>
	<category>inpractice</category>
	<category>levels</category>
	<category>meta</category>
	<category>number</category>
	<dc:creator>andrew cooke</dc:creator>
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