Ask MetaFilter questions tagged with liberal

Building a new (church) family in Charlotte

tigerjade — Mon, 07 Jan 2013 08:35:01 -0800

My family is nuts. The church I grew up in is nuts. My husband suffers from post-Southern Baptist stress disorder. Help us find a new (liberal) church home! We have two small kids and while our religious beliefs are agnostic/questioning (in my case) to actively hostile to organized religion (in the DH's case), we want to find a church home for a few reasons. We want to build a new family that's outside the people I was born with; we want our kids to have more people that love and trust them and will watch out for them; we want to expose them to religion and God so they can make an informed decision about their own religious beliefs (or lack thereof) when they grow up.

But most churches around here are pretty socially conservative. Even the one I grew up in, which is Presbyterian and relatively socially liberal, houses a metric sh*t-ton of gay-hatin', gun-lovin', liberal-bashin' conservatives and I don't feel AT ALL welcome there any longer.

I've found all of one thread online for liberal churches in/around Charlotte and it's 5 years old. I'm hoping someone here on the hivemind has some more current/recent information.

As a bit of snowflakey detail, I'm a rather socially anxious person and the idea of going to a church where I know no one, and leaving my kids with strangers in the nursery, is kinda freaking me out. It's part of the reason I've let inertia trap me in one place for so long.

Liberal magazines for my Mother Jones-loving Mom?

rednikki — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 17:58:48 -0800

Last year, I got my mom (a dedicated Northeastern liberal) subscriptions to several liberal magazines for Christmas. She loves Mother Jones hugely, and is OK on American Prospect and The Nation. This year, I want to renew the magazines she likes and send her more as well. The Atlantic is definitely in the mix, but are there others that I'm missing? Liberal books are good as well. Sadly, websites are a no-go: she loves her Kindle but hates her Kindle Fire and hates computers in general.

No true scottsman?

jsturgill — Fri, 19 Oct 2012 10:07:05 -0800

Is it fair and accurate of me to believe that my liberalism is not tainted by the massive harm caused by communist dictators and other historical "leftist" movements that have caused great harm? I've heard some conservative people bring up the specter of Mao, the Khmer Rouge, Russia, China etc. as endemic of the problems with liberalism and socialism. Conceptually, however, I do not feel any kinship with those governments' actions and associate many of their excesses with core conservative values: restrictions of inidividual liberty, lack of political and religious freedom, narrow range of acceptable beliefs, groupthink, etc.

A liberal or left society is one that would have the following attributes/represent the following beliefs:

Respect for science: if something can be proven, it must be so. Other beliefs that conflict must adapt.

Respect for skepticism: if something cannot be proven, it's open to debate. Disagreement within the boundaries of what has not been proven is healthy and good, but some evidence is respected more than no evidence.

The belief that due process is worth more than short-term efficacy in police actions. Crimes that cannot be proven should not be punished.

Torture, imprisonment without trial, segregation along racial, political, or religious lines, and unfettered state surveillance are poisonous to a healthy society and are never worth any short-term stability gains.

Absolute separation of political and religious power/spheres of influence.

Wide latitude when it comes to freedom of expression and peaceful protest.

Wide latitude when it comes to criticizing the ruling party and other elites, without fear of official or unofficial reprisal.

Freely available and mandatory education for all citizens that emphasizes skepticism, evaluation of facts, and core skills such as close reading, writing, and number literacy (particularly statistics and how to parse scientific results).

The value of freely available community resources such as libraries that contain information and perspectives not limited by the state.

Imprisonment and other state restrictions of individual liberty exist to protect society, not to punish wrongdoing. Any individual whose liberties have been restricted by the state must be shown to be an active danger to others, and as soon as that is not the case, the restrictions should be lifted. Fines, therapy, and other actions are always to be preferred over imprisonment due to moral and practical (better results for less money) concerns.

Forced and unfree labor (in the sense that the laborers have no realistic alternatives open to them) are anathema to good government and good business.

Every communist country I've ever read about violates most or all of the above precepts. I feel as though my political beliefs are entirely untainted by those governments' excesses and abuses, and that it is a red herring when they are brought up as "left" or "liberal" governments simply because the new elites used the rhetoric of communism and progress in order to take over a country.

Is this sophistry on my part? If there are meaningful ties between my values and those governments, what are they exactly?

Please give only careful, considered, precise answers. I'm very interested in examining this aspect of my political thinking and I do not want this question closed.

Links to essays examining this train of thought with rigor would be appreciated.

Needed: politically biased "data" on energy use

timepiece — Mon, 02 Apr 2012 19:27:01 -0800

My brother is asking for research help, and it's definitely not my area of expertise. Can anyone help him out? He needs books on energy use, but he wants them biased. Yes. His actual request:

"Two books on energy use, preferably with some economic analysis. Ideally one from a liberal author and the other from a conservative author. I want to compare their "data". The leanings of the author is where it gets challenging. Oh, and I need to be able to get them within a few days, I have some resources but I need to have a rough draft in in two weeks or so."

So, no ILL. We're in southeast Virginia, so if you happen to know anything available at William & Mary, or University of Richmond, or anywhere else reasonably close, we can work with that.

Help me, help them, help us all

MiltonRandKalman — Wed, 07 Dec 2011 13:53:02 -0800

I need a book recommendation for my conservative parents, something of critical thinking subject matter but not tip them off its picked to change the way they think. My dad is a retired union dockworker turned Fox News watcher. My Mother is conservative-lite, after getting Palin's book last X-mas stated, "She's not a politician but is a patriot.".

I can't give them anything as obvious as the books suggested in this thread. If the book is about a former conservative's journey to the left or Howard Zinn diatribe, they will be a tipped off and not read it. The title or subject matter needs to be aligned with general interests but maybe have them think in more critical terms. Maybe something along the lines of A Short History of Everything, but you know...fact checked. Its a tall order, I know you won't let me down.

Somehow I doubt it worked fine the first time somebody tried it.

edguardo — Mon, 21 Nov 2011 08:15:04 -0800

What are some examples of "proto-liberal" revolutions, or liberal revolutions attempted before those in the United States and France? I'm looking for anything of that kind before about 1776. Protestant uprisings with an explicit political content would also be interesting to me, as I have the feeling the two have some overlap.

Any leads whatsoever will be appreciated!

How did mainstream liberals lose their direction (and cojones)?

evil holiday magic — Sun, 18 Sep 2011 14:16:25 -0800

[Distraught Progressive Filter] I need a postmortem on liberalism in the United States. [Feel free not to agree with me regarding my fundamental assumptions about conservatism, but please take arguments to Talk or MeMail, and respect the point of this question. I'm interested in relevant answers, though they needn't be flattering ones. Thank you.]

Background: I've been reading about right wing politics; the psychological motivations (e.g. Fromm's Escape from Freedom, Blumenthal's Republican Gomorra, Zaitchik's Common Nonsense), the ideology which — for lack of a better term — informs the perspective (Ayn Rand, Hobbes, Schaeffer, Hayek, Adam Smith), and the think tanks which translate the dystopian philosophies into mainstream propaganda.

But it's difficult to draw a bead on the current state of things only studying one side's pathology. I have plenty of left-progressive texts in my library; while many of them can eschew the trite idealism of, say, stinking hippies, and provide systematic ideas, they remain impersonal and disinterested in the specifics of how the progressive mindset has evolved. It doesn't tell me anything about how the leftist mainstream got how it is today.

Bear with me (or stop reading), as I'm operating under the premise that something has gone deeply wrong with progressives/liberals/leftists/Democrats, in terms of their ability to clearly see and push a clear ideological framework; to stick to their convictions, and stop reflexively responding to every little twitch of reactionary bullflop chucked out by right wing PR flacks.

Coming finally to the question, how did this happen? How did we lose a firm, unshakable belief in human rights, labor, social issues, and start blindly making compromises that deign to acknowledge validity in bankrupt ideas we thought we defeated decades ago? I'm aware of Reagan and the rise of neoconservatism; what I don't know is what psychological circumstances lead us to what our views were, and how they easily degenerated into appeasement.

I want to read about the socio-psychological development of progressives, and how it's become such a strange, scatter-shot movement, with no clear purpose — at least over the aggregate of mainstream culture. I hope it goes without saying, but I'll dismiss anything by imbeciles like Beck, Coulter, Malkin, O'Reilly, et al. I'm looking for something much more nuanced and detailed.

Apologies for the broad request; it's the best I could describe it.

Liberal Catholic Church In Houston? Is it possible?

Anonymous — Sat, 16 Jul 2011 10:20:05 -0800

Just moved to Houston; my girlfriend is looking for a Catholic church with liberal leanings - is that even possible? My girlfriend has been selected as the godmother of her newly-born nephew. The church where he is being baptized requires that she be a member in-good-standing and take some classes at a local church. We just moved to Houston and we're looking for a liberal-leaning Roman Catholic church. Does anyone with knowledge of the area have suggestions? Thanks!

Robber barons, in reverse

titantoppler — Fri, 22 Apr 2011 06:36:56 -0800

What is the moral obligation that the wealthy have towards the less-well-off? Let me preface this by saying that I'm a left-of-centre social liberal, insofar as free or subsidised healthcare, social welfare and social safety nets are concerned. However, I am not a US citizen, and so some of its cultural mores may have escaped me.

I believe that the government has a role to play in redistributing wealth from the top to the bottom of the income pyramid. This is done through higher tax rates on the rich and using that income to pay for social programs like Social Security.

What I cannot understand, however, is the implicit expectation that most social liberals I know have. They expect the wealthy to donate their money to the less fortunate and pay significantly higher taxes on their income (as opposed to higher rates, but not prohibitively so). It feels rather opportunistic, as though saying, "Hey, thanks for your hard work in earning that money, now we'll take it."

I understand the need to redistribute income, but sky-high taxation rates and voluntary donations are, to me, a nice gesture on the part of the rich, but certainly I feel there is no moral obligation to do so. I'm not sure I understand this obligation. Why are they expected to do significantly more, as a proportion of their income, than say, a middle-class family, and excoriated if they do not? It has been argued that because it will hurt them in the pocket less (because they can't spend that much anyway), but it seems patently unfair to me that they are being asked to do contribute significantly more, and are castigated if they refuse, even though they earned that money (in this instance I'm thinking along the lines of self-made men like Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, Steve Jobs et al).

P.S. Mods, I'm not sure if this strays too much towards chatfilter, but if it does, please feel free to delete it. No hard feelings, promise.

Where can I find satirical lyrics for Billy Bragg songs inspired by his support for Nick Clegg

bonecrusher — Thu, 21 Apr 2011 16:20:41 -0800

Where can I find satirical lyrics for Billy Bragg songs inspired by his support for Nick Clegg I vaguely remember some blog (not Lenin's Tomb or Crooked Timber according to google) posting satirical lyrics for Billy Bragg songs (or at least songs sung by Bragg - I'm aware that the Internationale isn't actually a Bragg tune) inspired by his public support for Clegg. But I can't find it anymore. Can anyone help me?

Voting turnout in different countries

espada0 — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 15:59:53 -0800

“A citizen of America will cross the ocean to fight for democracy but won't cross the street to vote in a national election” Why is there an apparent apathy of political participation in America, and to extend it a bit, how come voting turn-out is higher in some countries in others even if the countries in comparison are both recognized liberal democracies?

Austin vs. Chicago

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Nov 2010 10:02:30 -0800

Which city is a better place for a divorced woman in her early 40s to find a male partner (mid-30s to late 40s, roughly); a group of likeminded liberal, intellectual friends, and a decent technical writing job -- Austin or Chicago? I am starting over and would like advice about where to go to begin this new chapter of my life, which will focus on professional and relational development. These two cities are at the top of my list based on research I've already done, and now I'm looking for people from both locations to give me their take on which would be more suitable for me. Thanks, MeFi!

I need a liberal but-not-too-liberal political book to give my dad.

dpx.mfx — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 12:43:37 -0800

I have agreed to read a book by Bill O'Rielly that my dad wants me to read, if I can pick out the next book he reads. What should I pick? My dad is 75 and staunchly republican (mostly staunchly pro-life). He is generally willing to engage in debate and to listen. He's agreed to read something I pick out. Unfortunately I haven't read much of all lately. I'll read whatever it is first. I'd like to to be center to left-of-center politically. He seems to like the O'Rielly book because it reminds him of his growing up. I've considered Obama's books. I want it to be a book that we can talk about that doesn't make him think "all liberals are crazy" or "all democrats are commies". What else should I consider?

God Bless Liberals!

AzraelBrown — Tue, 20 Jul 2010 13:48:39 -0800

Where are the liberal, progressive, Christian blogs and media? Short story: when driving through Wisconsin, we passed a huge sign that simply said, "God Bless America". Progressive, liberal me winced at the percieved conservatism, evangelism, and other ickiness I attribute to that sort of sentiment. However, there's nothing overtly Republican, Tea-Party, or conservative about that phrase -- so where are the people using it in any other way? The wonderfully liberal side of Jesus gets trotted out by modern progressives ironically, but I don't see any genuine deeply-christian progressives promoting those sentiments unironically. A Google for the phrase "God Bless Obama" finds some things along those lines, but it's pretty sparse. Does anyone know a good source for non-conservative, progressive, liberal Christian politics? Such an animal may not exist, but I still hold out some hope...

James and Mary we're not

Anonymous — Mon, 28 Jun 2010 08:04:05 -0800

Help me navigated the political differences between me and my spouse! My husband and I do not share the same political beliefs. We have known this all along, but it is becoming an issue. I am posting anonymously since I hope to avoid any responses being swayed by the respective parties' political preferences. Because it is anonymous, I will try to give as much detail as possible.

Before we dated and were just friends, we could have political debates with each other that could get quite "heated" but they were never hostile. We would debate and then it would be over. When we first started getting together as more than just friends, things started changing in our political interactions. He seemed to get much more defensive and much more hostile and personal in our political interactions. For example, when we first started being more than friends, he once said "I could never end up with someone who has ever voted for a democrat/republican/independent"...knowing full well that I had on many occasions. This hurt me quite a bit, but obviously he changed his mind since we are married now.

I am much more into politics than he is currently and spend a good deal of time listening to both liberal and conservative talk radio on XM channels (although admittedly more time on the side I agree with) and reading as much as I can on current political issues. I disagree with both major parties on many issues so I do not self-identify with either (although I agree with one on more issues than the other). My husband definitely has a party of choice.

I like to talk about politics (especially with those whom I disagree) and while my mind is rarely changed, I like trying to find out why others might hold a differing opinion. I can have these debates with other people without them getting angry and like to think I am respectful in these debates. I do not call names or think the other person is stupid for having their beliefs.

I have seen my husband have political debates with others without getting defensive or hostile. He just can't seem to do that with me and I hate it. He wants to have a no-political-talk policy in our house but I think that is a bad idea and I get resentful that he finds it so abhorrent to even listen to my opinions.

The other night, politics came up, it was going along alright when I said something like "I think the __________administration is/was brilliant/disastrous" and he got up and walked out of the room. I knew when I said it that he would not agree and that my statement was provocative, but I just wish he would have respected me enough to hear me out as to why I might feel that way.

It feels like he is so deeply entrenched in his own ideology that even hearing differing opinions from me is threatening in some way. I feel like he is completely closed off to the possibility of being even remotely influenced (not changed) by something I might say that he simply walks away. That kind of stings. I do not expect him to abandon his beliefs or agree with me, but I do wish he would be open to having them intellectually challenged and thoughtfully considered. He is otherwise very intellectually curious and the fact that he is so closed off from me on this subject hurts my feelings.

I feel like he thinks by my criticism or praise of this or that administration is a personal affront to him in some way. He reacts as though I have just directly attacked him in some way that I just don't understand. I know I have not always handled myself perfectly in these debates, but I have never personally attacked him, his intelligence or character. I have, however, gotten very frustrated because he tends to obfuscate and divert the arguments. Once he started arguing over my assessment that Massachusetts/Texas tends to be a more liberal/conservative state despite the fact that I think this is pretty widely accepted and it was merely tangential to the point I was making. I think he did this because he couldn’t argue with my main point so he went on the attack on the mostly unrelated side issue.

We otherwise get along very well and agree on most things. He can get defensive in our other rare arguments, but those are personal so I understand that. Should I just agree to the no-political-debate rule? It is the easiest solution, but it makes me feel like if we can't figure out how to discuss politics in a healthy way, it can't be a good sign in other areas of eventual discord. Are there some people that are so ideological that they can’t discuss these things in a respectable way? Am I on the receiving end of the “spousal discount factor” here? How do I not take it personally when I feel like he would rather gnaw his arm off to get away than say “Wow, that’s an interesting/valid/legitimate idea. I hadn’t thought about it that way before.”? Are there any "mixed" couples out there with practical advice?

How to quit grad school and start a career?

earlofrochester — Tue, 25 May 2010 20:17:28 -0800

I want to quit grad school and start a career. I'm 25 with a BA in English. I know times are tough, but this PhD program -- and the quality of life that accompanies it -- are even tougher. I can do this, right? I'm on summer break right now from my first very successful year of what's supposedly a 5 year program (though no one seems to finish it in fewer than 6). I hate it though -- I hate the hours, the social life that the hours preclude, and mostly, most damagingly, I hate the city I had to move to in order to enter this program.

I'm now back at home, living with the folks for the summer and with really no pressure. I've got money saved so I can sort of just chill, but I tell everyone I'm gonna get a 'summer job' until I go back to school. Thing is, that summer job is going to (hopefully) be an entry level copy writing/web-based marketing gig. I've applied for a few but have no results yet. This seems daunting, even impossible -- like I'm too old for this since all my friends got jobs right out of college. I volunteered for a year and then went to grad school.

Is this a dumb move?

P.S. Yes, I'm sure I want to quit. I know I would love the eventual career that would most likely come after PhD, but I also know it's not the only career I can love. And that some careers don't require you to give up your twenties for some extended adolescence-type purgatory.

Thanks in advance.

A world without straw men

yersinia — Fri, 07 May 2010 09:25:03 -0800

Inspired by this question-- what are some liberal writers who start from a position of comprehension of, and respect for, conservative viewpoints? I've been frustrated and depressed lately by the polarization and lack of dialogue in American politics. To cheer myself up, I'm looking for writing by liberals who appear to understand and respect conservative positions on various issues. In particular, I'd like to find writing that doesn't make (or pretend to make) the maddening assumption that conservatives must believe as they do because they are simply:
--stupid, ignorant, or misinformed
--"crazy" or "evil" or otherwise burdened with psychological issues (!)
-- naively fearful (of Change, or The Other, or Women's Sexuality, or whatever)
-- hateful, racist, or bigoted, interested in harming particular races/genders/sexualities/the environment for purely selfish reasons, or just for the hell of it
-- somehow duped by or under the control of some mysterious larger entity, like The Corporations or The Man

In other words, I guess I'm looking for liberal writing addressing what an educated conservative would recognize as actual conservative arguments. Either fiscal or social topics are fine, and the conclusions can be as far-left as necessary, as long as the writer has a fair, intelligent and accurate (and preferably, nuanced and respectful) sense of what can be said for the opposing position. Any ideas?

What does "liberal" and "conservative" mean to you?

lhude sing cuccu — Thu, 06 May 2010 18:24:12 -0800

What does it mean to colloquially say "That city is so liberal" or "That school is so conservative"? I ask because I am applying to schools, and I spent a year at an art school thinking I wanted to get away from conservative backwoods Virginia, but I hated it. A bunch of hipsters, atheists, militant Greenpeace volunteers, and recycling boxes in every dorm room (oh, you had to recycle or you'd get looks) and everyone, I mean everyone, was discussing how they were going to vote for Obama. That's what "liberal" means to me now—and it has a really bad connotation. When I came back to Virginia, I noticed that the so-called closed-minded conservatives actually seem to think through their beliefs more (and, believe it or not, I feel like I hear more diverse viewpoints here too), whereas everyone I knew at this extremely liberal school simply seemed to go along with what they deemed "progressive".

What does it really mean when someone says "That school is very liberal", and why does "conservative" have such a bad connotation when talking about schools (I know what they mean by definition, but apparently there is more to it that I'm not getting)? Does it have to do with the administration, the students, the teaching?

How to work for evil corporations?

Anonymous — Tue, 20 Apr 2010 20:51:20 -0800

How do I get over working for a company that I am morally and ethically against? This is my first job out of college. After working happily at a PR/Comm firm for almost two months now, I am starting to feel uneasy after being assigned to team projects a few weeks ago for clients that I am politically and ethically against. I'm not just talking about working with clients that are vaguely bad - I'm talking about straight up evil (I am a very vocal liberal, and their practices are constantly subject to mass criticism on the Blue to which I have always agreed.)

This isn't to say that this firm specifically works with improving the public image of evil companies. When I applied for a job there, they also had some awesome clients in their portfolio - fantastic non-profits and innovative start-ups, and they did some excellent work for them too. But I guess they always kept their clients with a negative public image on the down-low (they weren't listed on the website), and I guess I'm learning that my passion for doing the right thing is greater than my passion for good PR.

It's only been two months, so it's not like I can just quit, and even if I started looking for new jobs now I feel like I have this wart on my resume, as well as this extremely short employment term that would make hiring managers suspicious. But I'm feeling trapped - and not to get all melodramatic, but I feel like I'm getting more "blood" on my hands every day for playing for the wrong side. I also feel like a self-righteous ass...I know that I should be lucky that I even found a job. But it's wearing down on me - I can't tell anyone about the specifics due to confidentiality so I hold all of this in, and I work my butt off (which I have no problem with, if it weren't for corporations I disagreed with). I can't fall asleep, I drink at night, and I get a tightness in my chest from feeling like such a hypocrite.

How do I deal with this? Any other Mefites been in this position and been able to switch over to the good guys, AND turn out sane?

Well designed t-shirts for the liberal gentleman?

entropicamericana — Thu, 25 Feb 2010 11:30:31 -0800

I'm looking for stylish, well-designed Democrat / liberal / left-wing t-shirts. I can find a lot of shoddy or ugly looking ones. I'm looking for something with a little more vintage / thrift-shop vibe. Shirts that are less strident and more tongue-in-cheek and/or humorous would be ideal.

Why can't I just be a liberal?

hiteleven — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 15:54:34 -0800

When and why did modern liberals, especially bloggers, begin to label themselves as "progressives"? Why do they do so? I'm well aware of the history of various progressive movements and Progressive parties in the United States. But, speaking as an outsider (I'm from Canada), it seems that recently, particularly in the past year or two, left-wing liberals have begun to use the term "progressive" increasingly to describe themselves.

I've been following American politics quite closely since the early 90s, and this seems to be a new phenomenon. Political commentators in the mainstream media refer more and more to the "progressive" political perspective, and this is echoed by politicians and pundits who embrace the label. Previously, as far as I know, these people would have been described as liberals or "far-left" Democrats, perhaps.

I'm aware that there is a Congressional Progressive Caucus in Congress that has been around for nearly 20 years, but, again, the term "progressive" itself just seems to have caught on recently.

I have to say that this trend annoys me for several reasons. Firstly, it seems to imply that being a regular old "liberal" (which I consider myself to be) is a bad thing. Secondly, progressives, particularly bloggers, seem to be turning into the Tea Partiers of the left, so that if you don't agree with their beliefs and worship their heroes such as Paul Krugman (which I don't), then you're the enemy. Finally, using a term that decades-old allows conspiracy nuts like Glenn Beck to link modern progressives to their older counterparts, however speciously, making it easier for him to weave his vast webs of insanity.

Any places similar to Koh Phangan?

mikeand1 — Mon, 18 Jan 2010 21:29:07 -0800

What other places in the world are like this place: Koh Phangan in Thailand? My wife and I finally ventured out of the Western hemisphere, and went to Koh Phangan in the Gulf of Thailand. We really, really loved it.

So what other places in the world are like this? And I'm not talking about the Full Moon Parties. By "this", I mean somewhat exotic, isolated, and comparatively undiscovered, yet really hip, relaxing, and adventurous all at once. And liberalized with respect to the rule of law, etc. If you've been there, you know what I mean.

Big plus for tropical islands, but it doesn't have to be one.

So Mephites, where should we go next? Is there any other place like this, or should we just go back to Koh Phangan?

Looking for a nice enlightening magazine

thirteenkiller — Mon, 14 Dec 2009 07:44:42 -0800

Can you help me find a good progressive magazine to get? I'm looking for something that has in-depth, credible reporting, isn't too shrill, and covers a variety of political, scientific/environmental, and cultural topics. I don't want a weekly magazine since I don't find time to read one thoroughly and it generates too much waste. I want something with lots of content in the issues and not too much advertising. I'm pretty sure I want something with a strong liberal/progressive perspective, but articles need to be well-sourced.

Mother Jones seems to fit the bill, but I'm wondering if there's something else I should look at. Utne Reader seems pretty interesting and maybe a little too esoteric, but I'd like to hear what other people think.

Help me back in the church...

Anonymous — Sun, 18 Oct 2009 09:26:57 -0800

Help me reconcile my liberal beliefs with a church family again... Background details - I'm in my late 20's. In high school, I was a very active member of a church, until my liberal beliefs came into conflict with the conservative evangelical approach that the church I was with had. While I was with the church, I had ... effectively a large family of the other people in my youth group -- they were good people, but I was unable to compromise my true feelings and beliefs (more details about those later), and unwilling to lie about them.

I would like to reconnect with a church (I do believe in God, although my perspectives on Him and the way of relating with Him differ from the fundamental Christian beliefs)... My relationship with God has not suffered, but I do miss the connection with the people there.

I hold pretty strongly with a few liberal beliefs that are at odds with the fundamentalist church:
1) I support the LGBT community strongly, although I am hetero myself (Straight but not narrow, one of my LGBT friends likes to call me). I have zero tolerance for persecution or other poor behavior towards that community.
2) I don't buy into the whole celibacy before marriage thing. Lots of reasons that would make an Ask in themselves; I don't know that going into them will help here.
3) Evangelists ANNOY ME. A ton. I just don't see pushing your beliefs onto another person...

So, oh, brilliant hivemind, is there any way to reconcile such liberal beliefs and thoughts with the family of a church? Are there churches that aren't ultraconservative? I'm considering going to a service tomorrow morning that ... looks fairly modern and open, but am TERRIFIED that I'm going to run into the conservative bigotry of the church I left.

(Since it seems like a contradiction -- The people individually were AMAZING people... it was the church groupthink that I couldn't stand).

I've opened a throwaway for this one - you can mail me at meta.church.avoidance@gmail.com if you don't want to post here.

"Liberal Catholic" doesn't have to be an oxymoron

pised — Mon, 05 Oct 2009 10:03:20 -0800

Looking for liberal Catholic parishes in Toronto. My partner and I don't live in Toronto, but we'll be getting married there in 2011 (the hall is booked) and would like to find a liberal priest to marry us. I'm from the GTA originally, but I don't have a home church there anymore because my family stopped going to church when I was about 12. My partner and I have started going again in the city where we live and we love how liberal our (university-based) church and our priest are, and we'd really like to find that with wherever we get married in Toronto. We live together and would like a priest who wouldn't look down on that so much; an accepting outlook on things in general would be most welcome. If you're Catholic and in Toronto and have an awesome liberal priest and/or church community, where do you go? We'd prefer downtown-ish or west GTA (to Mississauga at the most western limit).

To pre-empt some potential questions:
As much as we'd like to be married in our current city with our current priest, it's too difficult to work out logistically with travel for family and friends. We live about 2 hours away from Toronto, so can't go to church there every Sunday, but we do visit my parents often and can put in appearances whenever we are in town. We'd also probably do all the pre-marriage counselling stuff at the church we choose in Toronto. I'll answer any other questions as they come up.