Ask MetaFilter questions tagged with debate

If it can ride in it, why not on it?

cloax — Thu, 17 Dec 2009 11:03:16 -0800

While moving out of an apartment my humongous couch would not fit into the elevator. With the promise of 6 flights of tight stairwell looming, I posited the following: "We're on the 5th floor and have the service elevator to ourselves. Let's put it on the 4th, put the couch on top of it, take the elevator to the basement, and carry the couch out the front of the building on the first floor." My friends refused and we suffered greatly getting the couch down and out via the stairwell. I still contend my idea would have worked and my friends think I'm insane. Am I?

Blue balls of the mind

Anonymous — Tue, 01 Dec 2009 11:17:49 -0800

Argumentative types: how do you avoid becoming this guy? I love debating. It's less about any passionately-held political convictions (I tend to lean conservative/libertarian, but am enough of a reactionary that I can find reasons to disagree with almost anything) and more about the logic of it. Inaccurate statements, poor reasoning and tendentious language get at me like off-key singing, and I get this wave of energy compelling me to point it out and fix it. I'm guessing most naturally pugnacious people will be able to relate to this: the endorphin rush, the elevated heartrate, that slightly bloodthirsty feeling, and the subsequent frustration and depression if you can't engage.

In the few instances where I actually have the opportunity to thrash things out with a willing and competent partner, all's well; win, lose, or draw, I generally end up in excellent humor with myself, my partner, and the world. Unfortunately, I've found that both online and off, most people either don't like arguing or aren't very good at it. Since I do try hard not to be a dick about things, that's an awful lot of debates I just can't have. And I really don't have time to waste composing long recycling-bin-bound posts, baiting my husband, and waking up at 3AM to assemble syllogisms just because I strayed into the wrong part of the blue that evening, or flipped past some ridiculous story on NPR.

I do like being a critical thinker-- probably one of my favorite things about my brain-- but would love it to be a facultative, rather than an obligate, thing. The obvious solutions-- exercise, meditation, repeating, "It's not about logic. You're not going to change anybody's mind."-- just don't help much. (Oddly, alcohol does, but I really don't need the calories.) What else might I do to help dissipate all that excess argumentative energy? Has anyone out there found serenity now?

Weasels are not all bad!

sio42 — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 06:52:05 -0800

Will taking a logic class really help me in talking about things like socieconomic issues that are often emotionally charged? For instance, I was recently discussing an article I had read about the disparity of grade school education between poor urban areas and more affluent suburban areas. One of the terms used was "income inequality", which is a term used to describe the difference in income between the poorest and wealthiest. I was told this was a "weasel word" - that inequality was a weasel word!!!

I was a bit flabbergasted. It's kind of obvious when two things aren't equal. In this instance, the difference between tax bases of schools meant that some schools had recess, art, well-paid teachers, new textbooks, and computers. And others have bathrooms that don't work, bad lunches, overcrowded classrooms etc.

I was then asked if it wasn't the responsiblity of the parents to make sure their children were educated. Everything I said that related to socioeconomic realities was disregarded as not based in reality.

These aren't idiotic people I'm dealing with. Some of them aren't necessarily conservative. But sometimes having conversations about "issues of the day", so to speak, is mind-boggling.

Is there a way to frame socioeconomic issues that doesn't come across as emotional and filled with "weasel words"?

How do you get someone to listen?

Anonymous — Mon, 18 May 2009 09:18:23 -0800

Why am I constantly be dismissed in conversation? In the last few months I've found myself in situations where people are just ignoring, or explicitly dismissing my opinion out of hand (you are too young, you don't get it, you are weird - or worse, the knowing glance and the roll of the eyes), and basically working around me. Each time, I feel totally powerless, frustrated and generally angry.

What I don't know how do is to give my opinion enough force in the conversation that this stops or at the individual(s) have to at least give it a fair shake - but doing that without becoming a screaming lunatic.

Don't get me wrong - I'm a generally a introverted soft spoken person. I don't generally want to beat people into my point of view, and am totally willing to follow the crowd if thats how it ends up. But in these groups (all different), there are these strong figures who are suddenly ignoring every word that I say and I'm struggling with the need to attack them to be heard. I'm not sure what to do.

How to not care what people think of me.

Anonymous — Fri, 27 Mar 2009 20:22:50 -0800

How do I not care what strangers think of me, especially on the internet? In particular, on internet forums (not metafilter). I try to stay within a certain bounds and keep my opinions on the subject at hand. I try to never make it personal.

But sometimes when someone is especially vicious back, attacks, it really affects me. And I hate this because I know it shouldn't; I know they're probably only trying to get a rise out of me. But I sit there trying to type and my hands actually tremble.

I've tried just leaving the conversation, but I find I'm still thinking about hours later at the book store, or at work, or while sleeping. How can I stop this behavior? I feel so dumb asking this question, but but I hate this about myself.

For what it's worth, in face to face / real life situations, I'm actually fine in this regards. Only on the internet do I have this problem.

Name that website: annotated multi-user arguments reaching consensus?

ajp — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:25:51 -0800

Name that website: annotated multi-user arguments reaching consensus? I'm sure that I saw a website, many moons ago, that allowed collaborative "arguments", or discussions. It might have been intended as some sort of reconciliation service, allowing multiple people with differences to debate their points.

The aim was to encourage productive, rational discussion, rather than a free-for-all.

Some of the features:

# Paragraphs or sections of text were given a reference number -- like a Biblical verse, or a legal sub-paragraph reference number type of thing.

# Once the parties had agreed on a point, I think the previous cruft of the debate was hidden, leaving only the jointly agreed wording.

# Multiple users could contribute to any discussion.

# The aim of any discussion was to remove anger, aggression, and all that nonsense; and to produce a final written statement or consensus that all parties could agree with.

I might have this all slightly wrong, it's from a fuzzy memory. But I'm sure there's something similar out there. Somewhere. Trawling Google and del.icio.us has not revealed what I'm trying to find.

Much obliged.

Debate tournament tips

LSK — Mon, 12 Jan 2009 10:29:38 -0800

How to win a high-level policy debate tournament? I've asked about policy debate here before. Since then, I have managed to qualify for Chicago's city debate championship at the varsity level. What advice do you have to win?

Name that rhetorical device!

moxiedoll — Sat, 03 Jan 2009 14:56:11 -0800

Linguists and debaters! Does this type of argument have a name? There's a particular type of argumentation that I come across all the time, and I wonder whether there's a term for it. Here's an example:

Here in Country X, we have a policy of sending our boys to school while our girls stay home and clean house. Detractors of the policy, who arrogantly and snobbishly believe that scholars are better than those who clean homes, reveal their sexism by devaluing the work traditionally performed by women in our country.

Obviously this particular example is appealing to the idea of complimentary gender roles, but I've seen this form of rhetorical judo used by apologists for other forms of inequality as well. It's basically - by stating that X is disadvantaged, you are disadvantaging X.

Do you recognize this tactic? Do you know what it's called?

Affirmative v. Negative Action

LSK — Thu, 11 Dec 2008 09:21:05 -0800

Preparing a speech on college affirmative action policies for a debate tournament, could use some help... My debate group was one of eight selected to be in a special tournament. I would like some prior arguments to use to base mine off of. I've read a decent amount of literature on this already (the two relevant supreme court cases, for example), but found no formally presented speeches or formal essays arguing a side. I believe that these would be helpful because they'd give me a sense of what the biggest arguments are. Does anyone know where to find these or have links to any?

(FYI: They're the Motorola-sponsored Abraham Lincoln Bicentennial Debates. They're tomorrow. They're available for public viewing. I have arguments prepared, but I see no harm in making them better.)

The great debaters?

LSK — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 16:35:42 -0800

First-year debater looking for advice on rebuttals. My team - none of whom had debated before - is having an easy time with constructive speeches, but not rebuttals. We're in the Chicago Debate League, which helpfully provides evidence to read from which can be mixed-and-matched for affirmative speeches, but we have nothing to refer to for rebuttals and we don't know what they ought to look like. I know what their goals are - I just don't know what to say in them to extend them beyond "Our 1AC evidence says this, which goes against your evidence."

Planning suggestions for taking an 8th grade science class through a pretend town meeting?

Anonymous — Thu, 16 Oct 2008 12:41:28 -0800

Have you got any logistical or planning suggestions for leading an 8th grade earth science class through a pretend town meeting on an environmental topic? We have the topic - it will be about whether or not a local mining company should be allowed to dig a new mine, when their previous mine collapsed, likely due to the mine company's negligence. The collapse caused a certain amount of ongoing environmental damage. This is loosely based on some real life events in our area, some years back.

So far it looks like we will have the following stakeholders: (1) Mine Owners (2) Miners (3) Local Farmers (suffered damage to land) (4) local concerned citizens (5) Mayor (6) Dept of Envir. Conservation (7) Factory Owners (suffered damage to property)

I'm looking for logistical and planning tips for running this activity. The kids will mostly be given roles to play and talking points, and will have read up a little bit, but we only have one 60 minute class period to prepare, and then the following day's period for the actual town meeting simulation.

So - got any tips on running events like this with 13 year olds? Any ideas for follow-ups or assessments, so we can analyze what they took away from it? Any ideas for ways to make it exciting or shocking? (The material is interesting, but a surprise is always good.)

Who said it's funner to interpret people so you can agree with them?

rwhe — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 03:10:54 -0800

QuotationFilter: Who said it's more fun to construe people so that you can agree with them, than to argue with them? (I believe this was couched as a private mental game useful for dealing with boors.)

I missed it!

platinum — Tue, 07 Oct 2008 20:25:11 -0800

Ack! I completely missed the presidential debate tonight. Any idea where I can find the full video online? CNN only has clips and nothing's been posted on Youtube as of yet. Thanks a million!

He said, she said...

TeachTheDead — Tue, 07 Oct 2008 13:02:54 -0800

Where or how could one go about getting the proper transcript from the VP debate held last week. My big concern right now is that I need it in paper or electronic form but I do not want to watch the debate over and write down each question and each answer. And a trillion zillion billion points for finding a free an/or immediate copy.

Must...Find...Bar

foxy_hedgehog — Tue, 07 Oct 2008 12:04:32 -0800

Hello fellow Americans and concerned citizens around the world. Please help me find a bar in downtown Manhattan where I can watch the presidential debate tonight. That's about the extent of it. The only place I've found is in Time Square, which I would like to avoid.

Thanks and happy watching.

I want the debates to be annotated after the fact, a la pop-up video.

vytae — Fri, 03 Oct 2008 17:08:30 -0800

Has anyone seen a pop-up-video style version of the presidential or VP debates that checks facts and names? If not, is there any organization I could suggest this to with any reasonable hope of having them implement it? I know FactCheck.org and other various news agencies have published lists of selected falsehoods and mistakes, but I would really love to have "true"/"not true"/"his real name is..."/"the actual number was..." info show up on my screen as I watch the recorded version of each debate. I feel like this idea would have enough mass appeal that somebody on the internet (if not a major news outlet) should have done it already, but my searches turn up nothing. Have you seen this anywhere? Can you think of anyone I could suggest this to, who could put this kind of thing together? (I'm half hoping that someone like CNN would love to make this happen, they just haven't come up with the idea yet. Maybe I'm crazy.)

I assume that black licorice babies would be in bad taste.

rokusan — Thu, 02 Oct 2008 08:13:49 -0800

Food suggestions for tonight's debate party? Having friends over for a debate party-slash-dinner-slash-salon, and probably next time too, so I need theme food suggestions for (a) tonight's VP debate and (b) the next two Presidential debates, both of the dinner and snack variety.

Mooseburgers seems like a slam dunk winner tonight, but I'm not sure I can find a butcher shop in Manhattan with moose meat. Help?

Other than that all I can think of are waffles.

Help me, hive mind!

Chillin' to the debates

Cat Pie Hurts — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 22:42:52 -0800

Where can I go to watch the VP debate tomorrow night in the Cambridge, MA area? In an attempt at expanding my sphere of social interation, I want to actually drag my extremely socially isolated ass out of the house on Thursday night to watch the debate. I'm hoping for a somewhat lowkey, fairly liberal stronghold where a cool, dare I say hip non-hipster thirtysomething geek can sit, watch the debate, do some writing in off-cycles, sip some G&Ts* and possibly strike up some interesting conversation with like-minded individuals. I considered the People's Republik, but I expect it to be mobbed. I'm open to anything near Cambridge (preferably closer to home in Waltham), but not Downtown Boston (PITA). Any suggestions?

*Current favorite beverage. Desired, not required.

I'll get back to you on that, Katie

spamguy — Tue, 30 Sep 2008 19:35:25 -0800

Where can I go to watch Thursday's VP debate in Austin, TX? Normally I loathe debates. However, with Palin involved, Thursday's VP debate will be, how shall I say, different. And I want to be around other people as I watch.

Who in Austin is having a VP debate watching event? Bonus points if everyone is there for the same reasons I am.

VP Debates near the Smokies?

Science! — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:55:49 -0800

Where can I observe the vice-presidential debates next Thursday (10/2) near the Smokey Mountains (TN) or near Jonesborough (for the storytelling festival)? I will be near the Cades Cove area of the park on the day/night of the debates and I'd really like to watch the debate. Are there any places that will be showing the debate to the public near there? (Places that serve beer or food are a plus, but not required at all.)

I might also end up being at the National Storytelling Festival in Jonesborough that night, so if there is a location there that fits the bill please let me know. (I won't know where I will be until that evening.)

Finally what radio stations in either area will be airing the debate, if I can't make it to a TV?

No TV! Online streaming for the presidential debate?

stance — Fri, 26 Sep 2008 15:39:39 -0800

Where can I watch the presidential debate online? I don't have a TV! Can I stream the debate online? Video feed preferable.

Debate watching in Minneapolis?

wocka wocka wocka — Fri, 26 Sep 2008 07:01:44 -0800

If there is a debate to watch tonight, where can a girl get a drink in Minneapolis and watch it? I have reserved seats at the UBS Forum to watch the debate tonight. Instead I'd rather be able to watch (and listen) to the debate but enjoy a cocktail while doing so. My BF and I couldn't find any bar/restaurant that had Obama's acceptance speech on the night of. Instead I had to resort to watching it on YouTube the day after.

If I or anyone else I knew had TV that got reception, or had cable that would be an option, but as it stands, it is not.

Help a girl out Minneaoplis MeFites!

How to record streaming presidential debate?

maus — Thu, 25 Sep 2008 17:42:09 -0800

How can I record a video stream from CNN this Friday? I follow US politics and elections like other people follow professional sports, and there's a playoff tomorrow that sounds like it's going on whether or not one of the teams shows up. Unfortunately, I have play rehearsal tomorrow night and will be unable to watch it. I don't have cable TV, and was planning on watching it on CNN's or Fox's stream. Is there a simple way to record it for when I get home? Alternatively, is there a reliably-seeded bittorrent tracker for political videos like this?

Where can I get drunk and watch the debate?

Beardman — Thu, 25 Sep 2008 11:23:02 -0800

Anybody know of any bars in Toronto that are screening the presidential debate on Friday? (Assuming McCain doesn't cut and run.)

Short & Sweet Truth About Obama?

jeanmari — Thu, 04 Sep 2008 10:35:15 -0800

On behalf of my parents, where is a source that they can use to look up short and sweet responses to counter to the attacks on Obama leveled by their Republican neighbors? My parents (who are voting Democratic this year for the first time in, well, ever) keep getting inflammatory chain letter emails that attempt to spread misinformation about Obama. They've been asking me for short and sweet ways to counter these attacks.

I've given them some "elevator speech length" talking points with sources, but I can't find a collection of these on the internet to address the rumors that they've been sent. I've had to do my own research and give them brief statement myself. There has to be something out there, yes? I'm finding the lengthy information and the sources and documents, but nothing that has been condensed.

The information we're looking for is not the Fight The Smears site. The rumors involve distortion or denial of his record.

(P.S. We are donating gas cards to college students who want to travel for the campaign. Any websites that show the major gas stations per state? Would hate to give these guys a Mobil card for a BP state.)