Fight the power! Itunes Power!
June 17, 2008 6:27 AM Subscribe
Is there a legal reason that I should not install Itunes on a higher ups computer here at work?
We have recently implemented a very strict "no users are administrators, they cannot install their own programs, and no non-work related programs on work computers" policy.
I'm being directed by upper mgmt to install itunes on the laptops of several higher ups, because they do not have computers at home.
Yeah.. People who make 10X as much as me cannot afford to get a PC at home.
Anyway. I know the only way I can fight this, is to give them a legal issue as to why they can't download their itunes crap on work PCs. Is there any licensing issues I can mention, perhaps if they left the company, and the music was still on the computer. Or if since its company property, and my company doesn't own the liscense for the music on the PC, it could be an issue.
Yeah, I know I should probably be kissing these peoples asses. But its a policy, a policy that upper agreed on, I have to enforce it on lower people on the food chain, so...
I know YANOBL (You are not our business lawyer). But I am just looking for some input, or if I should just kowtow and do what they want and sell another piece of my soul to the man..
We have recently implemented a very strict "no users are administrators, they cannot install their own programs, and no non-work related programs on work computers" policy.
I'm being directed by upper mgmt to install itunes on the laptops of several higher ups, because they do not have computers at home.
Yeah.. People who make 10X as much as me cannot afford to get a PC at home.
Anyway. I know the only way I can fight this, is to give them a legal issue as to why they can't download their itunes crap on work PCs. Is there any licensing issues I can mention, perhaps if they left the company, and the music was still on the computer. Or if since its company property, and my company doesn't own the liscense for the music on the PC, it could be an issue.
Yeah, I know I should probably be kissing these peoples asses. But its a policy, a policy that upper agreed on, I have to enforce it on lower people on the food chain, so...
I know YANOBL (You are not our business lawyer). But I am just looking for some input, or if I should just kowtow and do what they want and sell another piece of my soul to the man..
You are going to lose if you fight this. But not fighting doesn't mean kissing their asses, either. If you feel like you are truly compromising your values, find a new job.
posted by Cat Pie Hurts at 6:36 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by Cat Pie Hurts at 6:36 AM on June 17, 2008
More to the point, there is NOTHING regarding the law involved in your situation. At all.
posted by Cat Pie Hurts at 6:36 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by Cat Pie Hurts at 6:36 AM on June 17, 2008
Install it, move on - you can't win, and honestly, it doesn't matter. If some lower minion complains, let them have it out with management.
posted by ellF at 6:40 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by ellF at 6:40 AM on June 17, 2008
Response by poster: So if my friend has Itunes, and he copies all his music onto my computer, thats legit and legal?
posted by Jonsnews at 6:41 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by Jonsnews at 6:41 AM on June 17, 2008
What exactly does iTunes have to do with this question?
Other than a personal religious vendetta against iTunes, I still don't understand the objection.
posted by gregvr at 6:43 AM on June 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
Other than a personal religious vendetta against iTunes, I still don't understand the objection.
posted by gregvr at 6:43 AM on June 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
Just wait until you're checking your backup logs and you see that you've been backing up 10gb of mp3s in someones home directory for the past 6 months. Work computers are for work. But like Cat Pie Hurts said, if you can't live with it find a new job. The kind of thinking your management is doing isn't likely to change.
posted by wavering at 6:44 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by wavering at 6:44 AM on June 17, 2008
You said nothing about copying music, only installing Itunes. Installing Itunes in and of itself is legal.
posted by Cat Pie Hurts at 6:44 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by Cat Pie Hurts at 6:44 AM on June 17, 2008
Another option is to suck it up and deal and push your way into management and control IT policy. That's what I did. Everyone has $musicplayer in my company.
posted by Cat Pie Hurts at 6:45 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by Cat Pie Hurts at 6:45 AM on June 17, 2008
So if my friend has Itunes, and he copies all his music onto my computer, thats legit and legal?
No, but if your friend has iTunes and copies music onto his personal-use work-computer, I'm pretty sure that is, in fact, legal.
Look, fact of the matter is, personal activities on work laptops are far from unusual. A lot of my coworkers travel quite a bit, and there are plenty of games, music, movies, etc, on their machines, because they become their personal computers for weeks at a time. I suggest you drop your vendetta against management and just install iTunes and be done with it.
posted by Tomorrowful at 6:46 AM on June 17, 2008
No, but if your friend has iTunes and copies music onto his personal-use work-computer, I'm pretty sure that is, in fact, legal.
Look, fact of the matter is, personal activities on work laptops are far from unusual. A lot of my coworkers travel quite a bit, and there are plenty of games, music, movies, etc, on their machines, because they become their personal computers for weeks at a time. I suggest you drop your vendetta against management and just install iTunes and be done with it.
posted by Tomorrowful at 6:46 AM on June 17, 2008
Response by poster: Sorry let me be more in depth.
They do not have a home computer.
They feel since they are special their work computer is their home computer.
They have a ipod of some sort.
They want itunes.
They want to download music onto one or our work computers.
If they leave, the music they downloaded would be on a company asset, when the company did not buy the liscenses for said music.
Plus its going to be taking up space on our backups.
I know its a uphill battle. I know I could quit my job. I know I will probably end up having to do it regardless. But I wouldn't feel right if I didn't at least try to find a out.
And it is not a personal vendetta against itunes. It is a personal vendetta against asshats that feel that work PCs are for shit other than work. Personally I like itunes. I have it installed on my home pc.
posted by Jonsnews at 6:50 AM on June 17, 2008
They do not have a home computer.
They feel since they are special their work computer is their home computer.
They have a ipod of some sort.
They want itunes.
They want to download music onto one or our work computers.
If they leave, the music they downloaded would be on a company asset, when the company did not buy the liscenses for said music.
Plus its going to be taking up space on our backups.
I know its a uphill battle. I know I could quit my job. I know I will probably end up having to do it regardless. But I wouldn't feel right if I didn't at least try to find a out.
And it is not a personal vendetta against itunes. It is a personal vendetta against asshats that feel that work PCs are for shit other than work. Personally I like itunes. I have it installed on my home pc.
posted by Jonsnews at 6:50 AM on June 17, 2008
The issue is that you have a new policy that says "no non-work apps on work computers," but the higher-ups are asking you to violate this policy. To cover your butt, I'd recommend asking each of them for an email explaining why iTunes is necessary for their work (podcasts, perhaps?) then you can go ahead and install the apps for them.
posted by nkknkk at 6:51 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by nkknkk at 6:51 AM on June 17, 2008
I know I will probably end up having to do it regardless.
If you're a front-line tech, you aren't going to be making policy decisions. Your best bet is to bring this up with your immediate superiors and have them deal with it. You need them to go to bat for you—if they don't, you're probably out of luck.
posted by oaf at 6:54 AM on June 17, 2008
If you're a front-line tech, you aren't going to be making policy decisions. Your best bet is to bring this up with your immediate superiors and have them deal with it. You need them to go to bat for you—if they don't, you're probably out of luck.
posted by oaf at 6:54 AM on June 17, 2008
Response by poster: Yeah. I travel for work. You know what I do when I travel for work? Bring my own shit along if i want to do something other then watch a movie on the work laptop, or play solitaire. I think maybe pinball is on there too.
We have policies like this, because of issues we have had in the past.
I don't know how many times I've had to uninstall weatherbug or happy-smiley-email-bullshit 2.0 because someone felt they NEEDED it to do their job. Or that they could not function without being administrator on their PC. It's a policy, I just don't like people feeling that policies and rules do not apply to them, but making a point to enforce them on everyone else.
posted by Jonsnews at 6:55 AM on June 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
We have policies like this, because of issues we have had in the past.
I don't know how many times I've had to uninstall weatherbug or happy-smiley-email-bullshit 2.0 because someone felt they NEEDED it to do their job. Or that they could not function without being administrator on their PC. It's a policy, I just don't like people feeling that policies and rules do not apply to them, but making a point to enforce them on everyone else.
posted by Jonsnews at 6:55 AM on June 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
There is no way you are breaking any laws by installing iTunes. Trying to make it sound like you are doing something illegal is a losing game, and you will look like you are just making excuses, which you are.
If you are not breaking any company rules to install it, then do it and get on with your life.
If you are concerned that you are breaking a rule by installing it, then you can certainly explain your concern. But if upper management made the rule, they can break it. It's common in every business for upper management to have different rules than the peons.
So if my friend has Itunes, and he copies all his music onto my computer, thats legit and legal?
I'm not clear on how this relates to your original question. But Apple allows you to authorize 5 computers to play music downloaded from the iTunes store. Music imported from CDs has no such restrictions. The legality of sharing such music is a constant question, but installing iTunes on a computer does not in any make you liable, legally or otherwise, for what someone else does with that software.
posted by Fuzzy Skinner at 6:56 AM on June 17, 2008
If you are not breaking any company rules to install it, then do it and get on with your life.
If you are concerned that you are breaking a rule by installing it, then you can certainly explain your concern. But if upper management made the rule, they can break it. It's common in every business for upper management to have different rules than the peons.
So if my friend has Itunes, and he copies all his music onto my computer, thats legit and legal?
I'm not clear on how this relates to your original question. But Apple allows you to authorize 5 computers to play music downloaded from the iTunes store. Music imported from CDs has no such restrictions. The legality of sharing such music is a constant question, but installing iTunes on a computer does not in any make you liable, legally or otherwise, for what someone else does with that software.
posted by Fuzzy Skinner at 6:56 AM on June 17, 2008
Best answer: So if my friend has Itunes, and he copies all his music onto my computer, thats legit and legal?
iTunes songs (the files themselves) are unplayable unless iTunes is "authorized" (semi-permanant log-in). The user could log themselves out of iTunes ("deauthorize") and the music would be so much garbage data.
So no, the ownership is tied to the account that buys the songs. Were you left with a logged-in iTunes, those songs are not the company's and you would be obligated to deauthorize iTunes as you might disable the auto-login of AIM or whatever.
Satisfy your grudge by wiping spit over the keyboard or something. :P
posted by cowbellemoo at 6:57 AM on June 17, 2008 [2 favorites]
iTunes songs (the files themselves) are unplayable unless iTunes is "authorized" (semi-permanant log-in). The user could log themselves out of iTunes ("deauthorize") and the music would be so much garbage data.
So no, the ownership is tied to the account that buys the songs. Were you left with a logged-in iTunes, those songs are not the company's and you would be obligated to deauthorize iTunes as you might disable the auto-login of AIM or whatever.
Satisfy your grudge by wiping spit over the keyboard or something. :P
posted by cowbellemoo at 6:57 AM on June 17, 2008 [2 favorites]
Are you the legal department also? They're your boss, install what they want unless it poses a significant security risk, hurts network performance or is blatantly illegal. Don't treat the top like a temp.
posted by geoff. at 6:58 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by geoff. at 6:58 AM on June 17, 2008
I've worked for companies in the IT department. The fact is, unless it is a huge law breaker, you gotta do what the upper people want. That's just life. They also get to eat lunch on the company's dime fairly often, whatchagonnado?
And please don't do what nkknkk says. Just do what you've been told. Making trouble for higher ups is a bad idea.
Also, these folks probably do have home computers, but they also travel for work. Would you also argue against them having a DVD player on their work laptop to watch movies on the plane?
PS, be happy that the computers are locked down. Where I worked they were not locked down and we had all sorts of shit on everyone's computers - kids' games, MP3s, porn, whatever. Guess how much work was involved in not "supporting" that stuff, but fixing problems that resulted from it. And then, when their laptop tanked or it was time for them to get a new one, it was a huge hassle. At least at your workplace, everyone's laptop is the same, more or less.
posted by k8t at 7:00 AM on June 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
And please don't do what nkknkk says. Just do what you've been told. Making trouble for higher ups is a bad idea.
Also, these folks probably do have home computers, but they also travel for work. Would you also argue against them having a DVD player on their work laptop to watch movies on the plane?
PS, be happy that the computers are locked down. Where I worked they were not locked down and we had all sorts of shit on everyone's computers - kids' games, MP3s, porn, whatever. Guess how much work was involved in not "supporting" that stuff, but fixing problems that resulted from it. And then, when their laptop tanked or it was time for them to get a new one, it was a huge hassle. At least at your workplace, everyone's laptop is the same, more or less.
posted by k8t at 7:00 AM on June 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
More to the point: tell the managers you must clear it with your direct supervisor. Get an answer from your supervisor in writing, and follow that direction.
posted by Fuzzy Skinner at 7:03 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by Fuzzy Skinner at 7:03 AM on June 17, 2008
PS, why the heck do you let people save stuff to their laptops and then back them up? Isn't that what network storage is for?
At my last work place we left a former employee's computer on the shelf for 2 weeks just in case and then wiped it clean. People knew better (generally) than to save on the C: drive.
Some workplaces don't even let users have access to the local hard disk.
posted by k8t at 7:04 AM on June 17, 2008
At my last work place we left a former employee's computer on the shelf for 2 weeks just in case and then wiped it clean. People knew better (generally) than to save on the C: drive.
Some workplaces don't even let users have access to the local hard disk.
posted by k8t at 7:04 AM on June 17, 2008
If they leave the company and the company laptop still has music that they bought on it, you can wipe the hard drive just as you normally would. The company wouldn't be "liable" in any way, because the company didn't steal the music - a former employee bought it, and they left, and they left their stuff on company property. If they backed their music up on their iPod, that's fine, that's legal, and you can do what you want with the company laptop.
posted by rtha at 7:05 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by rtha at 7:05 AM on June 17, 2008
Best answer: Welcome to the corporate world. The rules for the upper levels are different than the rules for the peons.
Ask for clarification: "I just want to be clear on the policy about non-work applications on computers..."
And then do your job. Which is, basically, to do what you are told as long as you are not breaking the law.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 7:06 AM on June 17, 2008
Ask for clarification: "I just want to be clear on the policy about non-work applications on computers..."
And then do your job. Which is, basically, to do what you are told as long as you are not breaking the law.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 7:06 AM on June 17, 2008
They feel since they are special their work computer is their home computer.
They are special.
We have recently implemented a very strict "no users are administrators, they cannot install their own programs, and no non-work related programs on work computers" policy.
"This policy applies to all employees we really mean it" is bullshit boilerplate that never ever applies to anyone above middle management. Get used to it, or get out of a corporate IT environment.
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 7:07 AM on June 17, 2008
They are special.
We have recently implemented a very strict "no users are administrators, they cannot install their own programs, and no non-work related programs on work computers" policy.
"This policy applies to all employees we really mean it" is bullshit boilerplate that never ever applies to anyone above middle management. Get used to it, or get out of a corporate IT environment.
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 7:07 AM on June 17, 2008
Response by poster: I'll bow my head, and do as I'm told.
Yeah, when I got brought into a conference room this morning, I was told they were allowed to break the rules because they did not have a home computer.
I'm all for them watching dvds on their laptop, I would be against them watching divx movies on their laptop.
I didn't plan on making a stand on this issue, but if there was a legal issue, I wanted to make sure they were aware of it, and were in full understanding of it before I went ahead and did it.
posted by Jonsnews at 7:08 AM on June 17, 2008
Yeah, when I got brought into a conference room this morning, I was told they were allowed to break the rules because they did not have a home computer.
I'm all for them watching dvds on their laptop, I would be against them watching divx movies on their laptop.
I didn't plan on making a stand on this issue, but if there was a legal issue, I wanted to make sure they were aware of it, and were in full understanding of it before I went ahead and did it.
posted by Jonsnews at 7:08 AM on June 17, 2008
Response by poster: PS, why the heck do you let people save stuff to their laptops and then back them up? Isn't that what network storage is for?
If they have itunes dumping to their "My Documents" folder, roaming profiles grabs it all when they log in. Caches it all to the server, and then transfers it each time they log in and out.
Also has the side effect of making their log ins and log outs VERY slow if its caching 12 gigs of music, and movies.
posted by Jonsnews at 7:12 AM on June 17, 2008
If they have itunes dumping to their "My Documents" folder, roaming profiles grabs it all when they log in. Caches it all to the server, and then transfers it each time they log in and out.
Also has the side effect of making their log ins and log outs VERY slow if its caching 12 gigs of music, and movies.
posted by Jonsnews at 7:12 AM on June 17, 2008
We also have this strict no personal info on work computers, but we always get requests from the CEO CIO CTO etc, to install something not quite kosher. However iTunes is quite kosher if simply for business related podcasts. We also have creative people who need to use music files when creating presentations, or playbacks of conference calls etc. As far as hogging backup resources you could state that mp3 files will not be backed up. At least that's what we do here.
I know where you are coming from, and you want to fight the elite abusing IT policies, but this is a battle you should not necessarily fight.
posted by Gungho at 7:25 AM on June 17, 2008
I know where you are coming from, and you want to fight the elite abusing IT policies, but this is a battle you should not necessarily fight.
posted by Gungho at 7:25 AM on June 17, 2008
Best answer: Get the request in writing, print out a paper copy, bring that paper copy home, and then do it. If anyone gives you static about it in the future, break out your hardcopy instructions - they're tough to refute.
posted by deadmessenger at 7:40 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by deadmessenger at 7:40 AM on June 17, 2008
Anyway. I know the only way I can fight this
Stop fighting it. This is your chance to network with the higher ups and be their Go-To-Guy for stuff, which means when you need a favor you got friends in high places.
If this bothers you greatly, you should get out of corporate IT.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:45 AM on June 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
Stop fighting it. This is your chance to network with the higher ups and be their Go-To-Guy for stuff, which means when you need a favor you got friends in high places.
If this bothers you greatly, you should get out of corporate IT.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:45 AM on June 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
Most higherups dont have home computers. Theyve always been taken care of by their IT staff. Most dont have lives (or personal email accounts) outside of work like you do.
If youve been told to do this and come up with a BS reason not to, then that's probably bad for your career. Even if the My Music directory has been redirected to the server, you can still move it the local disc. Just dont claim to be liable for music backups.
I'll bow my head, and do as I'm told.
Look, you can choose to make it a big classist struggle or not. Up to you. This is nothing compared to bad policies like "What? We cant install itunes? Make everyone at the company a local admin pronto." Comparatively, this is a walk in the park. Small concessions to the right people make enforcing policy on the rest a little easier.
posted by damn dirty ape at 7:46 AM on June 17, 2008
If youve been told to do this and come up with a BS reason not to, then that's probably bad for your career. Even if the My Music directory has been redirected to the server, you can still move it the local disc. Just dont claim to be liable for music backups.
I'll bow my head, and do as I'm told.
Look, you can choose to make it a big classist struggle or not. Up to you. This is nothing compared to bad policies like "What? We cant install itunes? Make everyone at the company a local admin pronto." Comparatively, this is a walk in the park. Small concessions to the right people make enforcing policy on the rest a little easier.
posted by damn dirty ape at 7:46 AM on June 17, 2008
Can't you set your backups to ignore MP3s and other music files? Our IT guy did it to reduce the load on our backups. Users understand that music won't be saved in the event of a laptop loss.
posted by NotMyselfRightNow at 8:02 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by NotMyselfRightNow at 8:02 AM on June 17, 2008
If you make the roaming profiles script skip all files with .mp3, .m4p, mp4 extensions, that'll probably keep the backups from being a problem.
posted by zsazsa at 8:03 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by zsazsa at 8:03 AM on June 17, 2008
Right, or you will have to manually point itunes to download its stuff to the regular c drive. I understand your hatred of profile hogs. it makes the network very crappy. We had our my docs just a network share, so that anything in there wasn't replicated as part of the profile. just the desktop was the nasty part of the profile.
posted by Amby72 at 8:27 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by Amby72 at 8:27 AM on June 17, 2008
I'll bow my head, and do as I'm told.
You aren't bowing your head, you're scratching their back.
posted by cCranium at 8:55 AM on June 17, 2008
You aren't bowing your head, you're scratching their back.
posted by cCranium at 8:55 AM on June 17, 2008
And it is not a personal vendetta against itunes. It is a personal vendetta against asshats that feel that work PCs are for shit other than work.
Most people aren't enamored of going out and spending the money on another computer when they're provided with a perfectly good one by their workplace. It's a simple fact of life.
I really think you need to quit your job. I'm completely serious. It's easy to tell from your continued resentment and classist attitude about being forced to do this kind of work that corporate IT is not for you, since you will be asked to do similar "bend the rules" things for execs all the time.
posted by mkultra at 8:55 AM on June 17, 2008
Most people aren't enamored of going out and spending the money on another computer when they're provided with a perfectly good one by their workplace. It's a simple fact of life.
I really think you need to quit your job. I'm completely serious. It's easy to tell from your continued resentment and classist attitude about being forced to do this kind of work that corporate IT is not for you, since you will be asked to do similar "bend the rules" things for execs all the time.
posted by mkultra at 8:55 AM on June 17, 2008
Jonsnews, you sound like I did, when I was young. And you're just as wrong.
This is not a you vs. them situation. Your job is to serve them. You're paid to do so. Your interest is in presenting yourself as intelligent and cooperative, a team player, from their point of view..
These people can do good things for you. And it is not wrong to go the extra mile for these people, for that reason, and because that's your job. It is business. It is networking. It is the key to moving up. In IT, the higher up you go, the less different you are from the other big dogs. And it's good.
posted by Goofyy at 9:07 AM on June 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
This is not a you vs. them situation. Your job is to serve them. You're paid to do so. Your interest is in presenting yourself as intelligent and cooperative, a team player, from their point of view..
These people can do good things for you. And it is not wrong to go the extra mile for these people, for that reason, and because that's your job. It is business. It is networking. It is the key to moving up. In IT, the higher up you go, the less different you are from the other big dogs. And it's good.
posted by Goofyy at 9:07 AM on June 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Jonsnews, you sound like I did, when I was young. And you're just as wrong.
This is not a you vs. them situation. Your job is to serve them. You're paid to do so. Your interest is in presenting yourself as intelligent and cooperative, a team player, from their point of view.
These people advocating kissing ass with the higher ups are full of shit.
This is wrong - you know it and I know it. Some animals are more equal than all the others, donchaknow? While they may be able to force you to do it, this doesn't make it right.
You will have to do this - grin and bear it. But know that they are ethically corrupt and it's this sort of horseshit little inequalities that's making life in America more and more difficult everyday.
Don't give up your hope or the fire in your stomach.
posted by unixrat at 9:17 AM on June 17, 2008
This is not a you vs. them situation. Your job is to serve them. You're paid to do so. Your interest is in presenting yourself as intelligent and cooperative, a team player, from their point of view.
These people advocating kissing ass with the higher ups are full of shit.
This is wrong - you know it and I know it. Some animals are more equal than all the others, donchaknow? While they may be able to force you to do it, this doesn't make it right.
You will have to do this - grin and bear it. But know that they are ethically corrupt and it's this sort of horseshit little inequalities that's making life in America more and more difficult everyday.
Don't give up your hope or the fire in your stomach.
posted by unixrat at 9:17 AM on June 17, 2008
The issue with the backups can be solved technically, don't pretend that you're going to have to back up gigs of music. If you can't find a way around that (change the iTunes music folder to somewhere outside of their profile) then you're in the wrong line of work.
posted by nomad at 9:33 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by nomad at 9:33 AM on June 17, 2008
Response by poster: The roaming profile/backup issue is allready resolved, thats not my concern, I was just agreeing with wavering when he was questioned by someone else.
Unixrat. You are my hero and new inspiration. I appreciate your comment.
posted by Jonsnews at 9:39 AM on June 17, 2008
Unixrat. You are my hero and new inspiration. I appreciate your comment.
posted by Jonsnews at 9:39 AM on June 17, 2008
Sounds like you're trying to avoid having to spend all your time in the future supporting this kind of thing?
Installing the program doesn't take much time.
It's the additional requests for support, etc. that worry you; especially because you think that iTunes is the beginning of a slippery slope where soon work PCs will be full of user-installed crap.
If there is no policy, make one and get it approved:
1) You support only (list enclosed) approved company software. You can assist in the installation of other software in special cases to make sure it is done properly, but you are not responsible for supporting that software.
2) You do not back up any part of anyone's C: drive. If you have a company network (I'm pretty sure you do) then all company work belongs on it and should be saved there. If someone has signed the company policy that all work gets saved to the network, then calls you pleading for help recovering their lost document saved to C:, then they're in non-compliance and SOL (unless you have some political reason for saving their bacon so they owe you personally)
Company computers should be commodity devices; someone's work PC dies, you can replace it with another, quickly, without having to do hours of individual customization. The only way to do this is to make it clear what a company machine is, and that you're responsible only for maintaining company machines.
That way if someone high up has spent their workweek customizing their wallpaper and desktop themes, re-indexing their iTunes library, etc., then spills a latte on their laptop, then it's clear that your responsibility ends at getting them a fully functional work computer for doing company work; the other crap is play, and not your responsibility.
Teach them how to do their own personal backups and give them a USB HD for doing so if they complain.
That direction, if you can get CLEAR policy IN WRITING will keep you sane and employed.
Oh, and the internet port that the iTunes music store keeps open is a potential security risk, not to mention using the company bandwith for dowloading music, blahblah.
posted by bartleby at 9:41 AM on June 17, 2008
Installing the program doesn't take much time.
It's the additional requests for support, etc. that worry you; especially because you think that iTunes is the beginning of a slippery slope where soon work PCs will be full of user-installed crap.
If there is no policy, make one and get it approved:
1) You support only (list enclosed) approved company software. You can assist in the installation of other software in special cases to make sure it is done properly, but you are not responsible for supporting that software.
2) You do not back up any part of anyone's C: drive. If you have a company network (I'm pretty sure you do) then all company work belongs on it and should be saved there. If someone has signed the company policy that all work gets saved to the network, then calls you pleading for help recovering their lost document saved to C:, then they're in non-compliance and SOL (unless you have some political reason for saving their bacon so they owe you personally)
Company computers should be commodity devices; someone's work PC dies, you can replace it with another, quickly, without having to do hours of individual customization. The only way to do this is to make it clear what a company machine is, and that you're responsible only for maintaining company machines.
That way if someone high up has spent their workweek customizing their wallpaper and desktop themes, re-indexing their iTunes library, etc., then spills a latte on their laptop, then it's clear that your responsibility ends at getting them a fully functional work computer for doing company work; the other crap is play, and not your responsibility.
Teach them how to do their own personal backups and give them a USB HD for doing so if they complain.
That direction, if you can get CLEAR policy IN WRITING will keep you sane and employed.
Oh, and the internet port that the iTunes music store keeps open is a potential security risk, not to mention using the company bandwith for dowloading music, blahblah.
posted by bartleby at 9:41 AM on June 17, 2008
While they may be able to force you to do it, this doesn't make it right.
While on the street, homeless, for want of a job, you can comfort yourself with the warm inner glow of being right and feed yourself from the nutrients in being ethically superior.
Or, alternatively, do what the people who pay you tell you to do, or just find another job.
Just don't pretend to yourself that you won't see the same thing in any IT department, because you'll be in for a big letdown. Telling managers that they can't do something because of rules they themselves enacted is never likely to get you a pat on the back and/or thanks. Telling them that they are ethically corrupt and they're what's wrong with America today is equally unlikely to garner any respect.
Frankly, reading your messages, you may not be cut out for a support job if your employers actually expect you to provide that support without trying to finagle your way out of it because you feel that they have an easier life than you do or that you get to make policy, not them.
I mean, "sell another piece of my soul to the man" because they ask you to install iTunes? Seriously, overdramatize much? If that's the way you feel, you should just quit and find another field to work in.
Or, you know, use that fire in your belly to enact a complete change at work and have the higher-ups take orders from you instead of the other around. Good luck.
posted by splice at 9:47 AM on June 17, 2008 [5 favorites]
While on the street, homeless, for want of a job, you can comfort yourself with the warm inner glow of being right and feed yourself from the nutrients in being ethically superior.
Or, alternatively, do what the people who pay you tell you to do, or just find another job.
Just don't pretend to yourself that you won't see the same thing in any IT department, because you'll be in for a big letdown. Telling managers that they can't do something because of rules they themselves enacted is never likely to get you a pat on the back and/or thanks. Telling them that they are ethically corrupt and they're what's wrong with America today is equally unlikely to garner any respect.
Frankly, reading your messages, you may not be cut out for a support job if your employers actually expect you to provide that support without trying to finagle your way out of it because you feel that they have an easier life than you do or that you get to make policy, not them.
I mean, "sell another piece of my soul to the man" because they ask you to install iTunes? Seriously, overdramatize much? If that's the way you feel, you should just quit and find another field to work in.
Or, you know, use that fire in your belly to enact a complete change at work and have the higher-ups take orders from you instead of the other around. Good luck.
posted by splice at 9:47 AM on June 17, 2008 [5 favorites]
I'm missing something. If they leave the company, then just delete all the music. Done.
posted by desjardins at 10:00 AM on June 17, 2008
posted by desjardins at 10:00 AM on June 17, 2008
The notion that the rules apply equally to everyone in the corporation is one that is not grounded in reality. I can understand that you regret that the world does not work that way, but I think this is an unchangeable aspect of the world. When I go to lunch or get a beer after work to discuss work, the company picks up the tab. If I wanted to install a video game on my PC, it would be done. If I decide to go home at noon, I get paid the same. If I want to work from home today, I do it. I get benefits (insurance and the like) for free that others in the company have to pay for. My boss does even better, he gets a cool free car and flies in a private jet and stays in the best suites in the best hotels. Corporations are hierarchical and the people who make the rules make exceptions where they are concerned.
A well-conceived computer use policy defines who is empowered to make exceptions and if that person has said it is OK, then it is OK. In the absence of a formally defined policy for exceptions, then there would be some vague sense of which "higher ups" are high enough to define the exceptions.
posted by Lame_username at 10:24 AM on June 17, 2008
A well-conceived computer use policy defines who is empowered to make exceptions and if that person has said it is OK, then it is OK. In the absence of a formally defined policy for exceptions, then there would be some vague sense of which "higher ups" are high enough to define the exceptions.
posted by Lame_username at 10:24 AM on June 17, 2008
Again, I worked as a help desk person for years.
Being the "go-to girl/guy" for higher ups usually pays off, by the way. Those folks (and often their admin assistants), in my experience, are more than happy to pay it back to you.
At my old office there was a personal massuse for higher ups. If they were out of town or canceled a spot, the admin assistant in charge always called me or the guy who was the main accountant for the higher ups. (This happened at least once a month.) Same deal with any leftovers from big lunch meetings.
Or, little 'hook ups' (new version of MS Office, first of the new laptops) often paid off in good recommendations as a "team player" or lots of freebies (I worked for a company that made stuff).
I didn't mind taking an hour out of my day to help clean out the spyware on the kids' computer either.
I also got to go to tons of conferences, big events and other cool shit... just to be "on hand." It was tons of fun to stay in a hotel for a week and dine on the company dime and maybe fix a wireless router here and there at an event.
And, FOR SURE these folks will mention your name to people that need to hear that you are doing a good job. I heard that kind of feedback a lot from my immediate supervisor that his immediate supervisor heard from so-and-so or so-and-so that I was really quick and helpful to so-and-so.
I'm not saying that it is ethical or right, but just to let you know what can happen on the other end.
posted by k8t at 11:11 AM on June 17, 2008
Being the "go-to girl/guy" for higher ups usually pays off, by the way. Those folks (and often their admin assistants), in my experience, are more than happy to pay it back to you.
At my old office there was a personal massuse for higher ups. If they were out of town or canceled a spot, the admin assistant in charge always called me or the guy who was the main accountant for the higher ups. (This happened at least once a month.) Same deal with any leftovers from big lunch meetings.
Or, little 'hook ups' (new version of MS Office, first of the new laptops) often paid off in good recommendations as a "team player" or lots of freebies (I worked for a company that made stuff).
I didn't mind taking an hour out of my day to help clean out the spyware on the kids' computer either.
I also got to go to tons of conferences, big events and other cool shit... just to be "on hand." It was tons of fun to stay in a hotel for a week and dine on the company dime and maybe fix a wireless router here and there at an event.
And, FOR SURE these folks will mention your name to people that need to hear that you are doing a good job. I heard that kind of feedback a lot from my immediate supervisor that his immediate supervisor heard from so-and-so or so-and-so that I was really quick and helpful to so-and-so.
I'm not saying that it is ethical or right, but just to let you know what can happen on the other end.
posted by k8t at 11:11 AM on June 17, 2008
At my old office there was a personal massuse for higher ups. If they were out of town or canceled a spot, the admin assistant in charge always called me or the guy who was the main accountant for the higher ups. (This happened at least once a month.) Same deal with any leftovers from big lunch meetings.
So we know what you did for the free massages. I wonder what the main accountant did...
Anyway, more to the point, here's how I would handle it. "I've had a lot of requests lately to install iTunes. Let me contact [Manager/Person Who Wrote the Policy] and see if we can get iTunes added to the list of approved software." Then one of a couple things will happen:
1) The requester will back down because he doesn't want anyone else to know he needs iTunes.
2) The policy person will allow iTunes, and now you can make everyone happy.
3) The policy person will deny iTunes, and now you can make everyone pissed (but at least point to a concrete reason).
4) The question will languish in committee forever and eventually be will dropped from the agenda because no one can remember why the question came up anyway. Then you can say "it's being considered" truthfully and pass the buck to someone else.
I think (4) is the most likely outcome.
posted by sbutler at 12:19 PM on June 17, 2008
So we know what you did for the free massages. I wonder what the main accountant did...
Anyway, more to the point, here's how I would handle it. "I've had a lot of requests lately to install iTunes. Let me contact [Manager/Person Who Wrote the Policy] and see if we can get iTunes added to the list of approved software." Then one of a couple things will happen:
1) The requester will back down because he doesn't want anyone else to know he needs iTunes.
2) The policy person will allow iTunes, and now you can make everyone happy.
3) The policy person will deny iTunes, and now you can make everyone pissed (but at least point to a concrete reason).
4) The question will languish in committee forever and eventually be will dropped from the agenda because no one can remember why the question came up anyway. Then you can say "it's being considered" truthfully and pass the buck to someone else.
I think (4) is the most likely outcome.
posted by sbutler at 12:19 PM on June 17, 2008
Jesus, rather than stewing, make this an opportunity.
As you're installing iTunes for a higher-up, take the opportunity to establish rapport, then suggest, "you know, I bet mid-level employees would consider it a great perk to have their personal iTunes libraries on their PCs too, and I bet whomever sugested that would be a real hero to the working stiffs, and to management, since it's a cost-free way for the business to increase employee morale and retention."
Then get some career advancement of your own "I'd be glad to spear-head the IT end of a small trial project."
posted by orthogonality at 3:26 PM on June 17, 2008
As you're installing iTunes for a higher-up, take the opportunity to establish rapport, then suggest, "you know, I bet mid-level employees would consider it a great perk to have their personal iTunes libraries on their PCs too, and I bet whomever sugested that would be a real hero to the working stiffs, and to management, since it's a cost-free way for the business to increase employee morale and retention."
Then get some career advancement of your own "I'd be glad to spear-head the IT end of a small trial project."
posted by orthogonality at 3:26 PM on June 17, 2008
Oh, and don't be so hung up on "the rules". Striving for fairness and equal treatment is great, but no one likes Barney Fife-esque rule drones. Work to get things done, not to slavishly enforce the rules; you're an IT guy, not a cop or a lawyer.
posted by orthogonality at 3:33 PM on June 17, 2008
posted by orthogonality at 3:33 PM on June 17, 2008
I have iTunes on my work computer so that my iPhone will sinc with Outlook and so that I can watch the occasional work related podcast. It's not just for music anymore.
posted by tamitang at 10:01 PM on June 17, 2008
posted by tamitang at 10:01 PM on June 17, 2008
I support the OP in this, at minimum the spirit of what he's after. My thoughts about how it may be a problem follow.
1. Every application that uses the internet is susceptible to external attacks. Apple has always been really good, but they are not perfect. 0 Day exploits are the scariest thing I can think of in terms of dataloss/compromising data.
2. You are hammering the moral of the staff that arepunished not rewarded for complying with the company policy.
3. An iPod is a HUGE security risk as far as data security. How much confidential data can you squeeze onto a 160 gb hard drive?
So... You cannot openly fight the policy as being simply unfair. (At least, not and maintain a good relationship with the higher ups.)
In my industry we are heavily regulated. If someone were active breaking company policy by doing this our company could be in big trouble. Reporting this to their supervisor would bring a big hand down on it. Reporting it to our auditors might cost us money.
I'd simply be honest about it, but focus on the risks. I'd put iTunes on the PC of anyone who wanted it. If I were asked to uninstall it I would remove everyone's. (music and all)
I'd start looking for articles where the iPods/iTunes/shared music caused problems and share those with my supervisor. Each time a problem was reported with the backup servers you mention the cause would be listed as "%Higherups% iTunes folder exceed the total storage space remaining. " I'd then forward the report to %Higherups% supervisor and mine.
I might even suggest some alternatives.
"Instead of compromising our whole network, backup server, etc. Why not put a PC in the break room that employees whocan't afford don't own a PC can use to surf the web and sync with iTunes. We'll put it on it's own router to minimize risk to the business unit and everybody wins."
posted by TheDukeofLancaster at 2:29 PM on June 18, 2008
1. Every application that uses the internet is susceptible to external attacks. Apple has always been really good, but they are not perfect. 0 Day exploits are the scariest thing I can think of in terms of dataloss/compromising data.
2. You are hammering the moral of the staff that are
3. An iPod is a HUGE security risk as far as data security. How much confidential data can you squeeze onto a 160 gb hard drive?
So... You cannot openly fight the policy as being simply unfair. (At least, not and maintain a good relationship with the higher ups.)
In my industry we are heavily regulated. If someone were active breaking company policy by doing this our company could be in big trouble. Reporting this to their supervisor would bring a big hand down on it. Reporting it to our auditors might cost us money.
I'd simply be honest about it, but focus on the risks. I'd put iTunes on the PC of anyone who wanted it. If I were asked to uninstall it I would remove everyone's. (music and all)
I'd start looking for articles where the iPods/iTunes/shared music caused problems and share those with my supervisor. Each time a problem was reported with the backup servers you mention the cause would be listed as "%Higherups% iTunes folder exceed the total storage space remaining. " I'd then forward the report to %Higherups% supervisor and mine.
I might even suggest some alternatives.
"Instead of compromising our whole network, backup server, etc. Why not put a PC in the break room that employees who
posted by TheDukeofLancaster at 2:29 PM on June 18, 2008
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by gregvr at 6:29 AM on June 17, 2008