Comments on: Sources for cheap lead or other heavy things

Question: Sources for cheap lead or other heavy things

amfea — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 19:23:12 -0800

We have a couple of large copper planters outside that have been in my roommate's family for many years. We've been lucky so far, but a lot of things made of copper are getting stolen and I want to weigh these down so they'll be nearly impossible to move. Where can we get a lot of lead (or something heavier) on the cheap?

The planters are about the size of an oil barrel but shorter and weigh around 30 pounds when empty. I'd like to fill the bottoms with 250 pounds of lead so would be thieves won't be able to lift them. The perfect weights would be fishing line weights but buying 2 x 250 pounds worth will be too expensive.

The plants in them are only decorative so I am not concerned about lead poisoning. But if there is another denser/heavier option that's cheap, I am open to that too.

By: mumkin

mumkin — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 19:34:16 -0800

Where can we get a lot of lead (or something heavier) on the cheap?

The only thing heavier than lead which is also not radioactive I assume that would be a deal breaker for you is bismuth. (Bismuth is technically radioactive, but its half life is much longer than the age of the universe).

By: lia

lia — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 19:35:28 -0800

have you considered concrete?

By: crapmatic

crapmatic — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 19:39:00 -0800

Why won't concrete or sand work? You're talking about 150 lbs per cubic foot... not much to scoff at.

By: Mitheral

Mitheral — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 19:42:17 -0800

You can buy used wheel weights from scrap yards or possibly even direct from tire changing places. They aren't pure lead but probably close enough for your purpose. If you were to pour a layer of envirotex into the planter after the weights would be thieves couldn't just dump the weights out and the plants/enviroment would be somewhat protected from the lead.

PS: tungsten is also heavier than lead (about 70% heavier) and it's half life is also such that it's considered stable. It is, however, a lot more money than lead.

By: tomierna

tomierna — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 19:47:04 -0800

You don't say if they are sitting on soil or concrete, but if they are on concrete, why not mount them to the slab with bolts?

By: aubilenon

aubilenon — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 19:49:50 -0800

Osmium is wicked heavy and is not radioactive. You'd need less than a cubic foot of lead, or a few big sacks of sand.

By: winston

winston — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 20:12:36 -0800

Sand weighs about 100 pounds per cubic foot.

An oil barrel (42 US gallons) is about 5.6 cubic feet.

Rocks should do the trick too.

Is there a reason that it needs to be lead or heavier?

By: amfea

amfea — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 20:14:29 -0800

They are sitting on the grass, so bolting them is not an option. They also have a bunch of little narrow slits at the bottom for draining but nothing that much of a bolt could go through.

I thought about pouring concrete in, but my roommate nixed the idea of anything permanent. Maybe bits of crushed concrete with sand filling in the gaps would be heavy enough.

I was trying to think of cheap things made of lead but could not come up with much. The wheel weights seem like a good idea too.

By: Cool Papa Bell

Cool Papa Bell — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 20:21:55 -0800

I thought about pouring concrete in

Hah. No pouring!

Pour the concrete into molds to create concrete blocks. Then put the blocks into the planter.

Or better yet, just buy concrete blocks from Home Depot.

Plus, are you sure these planters are copper? They could be cast aluminum with a plating (which may not even be copper). Copper thieves generally go after the real thing that can't be faked, like from within air conditioners and power stations and such.

By: Project F

Project F — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 20:26:37 -0800

I don't think broken concrete will help you here, as it will end up being the same or lighter than sand / cu ft after you break it.

You could mix gravel into the sand to boost the density a bit, cover that all with some top soil, and plant something in it, and you're good to go. Soil is a bit lighter than sand, but it's still mighty heavy.

By: Mitheral

Mitheral — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 20:41:57 -0800

Unless you're just interested in security theatre you've got to either attach the weight to the planter or construct a weight that is one piece. Anything you can lift into the planter a would be thief can lift out. Even worse they can just tip the planter over and dump the material out. A man movable mass isn't a deterrent, thieves will steal car batteries for scrap and they're only worth $3.

By: MadamM

MadamM — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 20:44:46 -0800

The father of a friend of mine got his hands on a chunk of tungsten that had formerly been part of some kind of medical equipment, maybe a ct scanner or an x-ray machine. I'm not sure if he bought it off of ebay or got it through work (he's a doctor). My friend brought it in to school and it was *dense*.

By: Kid Charlemagne

Kid Charlemagne — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 20:59:36 -0800

I got some lead bricks that I used for repousse and chasing work but I got them when a friend was involved in closing down a radioactive lab. Not exactly something that you stumble over every day. (For those terrified by my casual disregard for all that is Holy, wanding them revealed them to be less "hot" than my sugar bowl or the bricks in my walls.)

Here is what I'd recommend. Get yourself a couple dog tie out stakes. Two or three for each planter if they're as I'm envisioning them. If at all possible get them in stainless steel as mild steel and copper will create a galvanic reaction and your stakes will go into solution shockingly fast. Also get a couple stainless fender washers (or just e-mail me and I'll drill you some half inch holes in some scrap stainless for far less what you'll be charged for the washers). Finally, drill two holes somewhere in the bottom just big enough for the tie out stakes to go through (unless they'll go through the drainage slots you mention) and screw the planters to the earth.

This also means that if YOU want to move them you have to dig all the dirt out and unscrew them.

By: hortense

hortense — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 21:38:08 -0800

Paint them with red barn paint or white wash, or make ponds/water gardens/fountains.

By: mumkin

mumkin — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 23:26:55 -0800

I wish to retract my suggestion of bismuth. I was thinking atomic mass, but of course density is what you're after, and for that, there are many options, including but not limited to those proposed by others above. Please do not begin stockpiling bismuth.

Have you considered the possibility of using these lovely planters indoors? Couldn't your place use a nice potted ficus or two?

By: zengargoyle

zengargoyle — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 04:33:43 -0800

Gun shop. You can buy big bags of lead shot for reloading shotgun shells. We bought them to fill tennis balls for juggling, but you can get a heavy assed bag of lead for not much.

By: electroboy

electroboy — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 06:53:12 -0800

Here's what you do:

1. Drill a 1/2-5/8" hole in the center of the bottom of the planter.
2. Rent a hammer drill and concrete bit and drill a corresponding hole in the concrete.
3. Cut a piece of stainless all-thread to length, so that an inch or so sticks up through the bottom of the planter.
4. Epoxy the all-thread into the concrete.
5. Place planter on top, place a nut on the all thread, tighten down accordingly.
6. Fill with soil or whatever.

If you want to get really fancy, round off the nut with an angle grinder so you can't remove it with a regular wrench. You'll either have to use vice grips or a cut-off wheel to get it off.

By: SuperSquirrel

SuperSquirrel — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 07:02:40 -0800

This thread has helpful suggestions on how to fill a planter with cement so it can be removed fairly easily later.

By: tallus

tallus — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 08:45:38 -0800

Lead scrap goes for a third of the price of braziery copper, heavy copper about 10% more than that (based on UK prices per tonne).

Filling it with lead would be an extra incentive for thieves not a deterrent.

By: limeonaire

limeonaire — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 09:15:45 -0800

If there are slits at the bottom for drainage, please do not fill this container with lead, as it will end up leaching into the soil nearby. There has to be a better way.

By: sadiehawkinstein

sadiehawkinstein — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 12:16:07 -0800

Also - ball bearings or stones may be easier to transport from vehicle to planter.

A friend of mine had a great way of dealing with plant/planter theft: he planted poison oak, poison ivy, and poison sumac in his front porch planters. Of course, this is a scary, scary solution for most people - he wasn't allergic, and warned all friends of the danger.