To live an hour outside of the city

April 19, 2008 1:34 PM

If you wanted to live an hour outside of Manhattan by train, which city would you recommend moving to (in any direction)?

Cost of living (the lower the better) being the biggest deciding factor.

posted by (bb|[^b]{2}) to travel & transportation (26 comments total)

I've got to shill for Long Island (aka, Lawn Guyland), or Brooklyn/Queens. Do you want a suburban area, with backyards & quiet, or would you prefer a more urban type place, with easy walking distance to restaurants & shops? Near water (sound or ocean)? How important are schools? Own or rent?
posted by kellyblah at 2:13 PM on April 19

I'm really looking to see how far out I can get from the city, and still remain within an hour's commute via train.
posted by (bb|[^b]{2}) at 2:16 PM on April 19

Where do you do what you do in New York? The answer to your an-hour-away question is different depending on whether your focus is Downtown, MIdtown, the Upper West Side, or somewhere else.
posted by gum at 2:23 PM on April 19

you could live in New Jersey as far out as Princeton, just depends on what you are looking for ?

If you looking to rent an apartment, you have plenty of options in the Garden State
posted by Mr_Chips at 2:25 PM on April 19

I would go north across the river toward Albany, because I would want to be closer to Boston in case I wanted to go there for a change. I haven't been to the East coast for many years, so I don't remember how far away an hour on the train gets you. If I remember right, my one trip from Albany to Manhattan was about an hour, but I could be wrong.

Similarly, if you went West into Pennsylvania, you could leave yourself closer to Philly, Baltimore, DC, etc.
posted by ctmf at 2:26 PM on April 19

for that matter: downtown Philadlephia is about an hour train ride to NY Penn station on Amtrak
posted by Mr_Chips at 2:28 PM on April 19

Looking at a map, it was probably more than an hour from Albany. I don't remember it being a 125 mph bullet train.
posted by ctmf at 2:29 PM on April 19

I can only help with the NY side of things, you can catch trains into the city from either suburban Long Island, looking up some stats for towns around here (it's suburban sprawl, so the towns are all up against each other) the population density varies from almost 10,000 people per square mile to as little as 800 (nice neighborhoods where your property is huge). While there are urban areas on LI, none of them match NYC. However, if you don't require being surrounded by sky scrapers, you'll be fine. There are plenty of options for owning and renting. While most places you'll see will be houses, there are apartment, condo and co-op complexes. Want to see how far you can get from the city? Check the LIRR site for train schedules and you'll see how far you can go on an hour long train ride. Personally, I'm close enough to the city that it is trivial to get there if I want to be there (concerts, museums, etc) but far enough away from to it not feel like I live there. At the same time, Town of Hempstead, where I live, has almost three quarters of a million residents, making it as large as San Francisco population-wise, so I'm not in the middle of no where either.

Alternatively, there's upstate NY. Can't help you as much with this one since I don't live there, but I've found it to be more rural than Long Island is for the most part.

You can look into Jersey and CT, but I know nothing about them.
posted by Brian Puccio at 2:36 PM on April 19

I'm pretty sure Amtrak is too expensive to be viable for a daily commute - I just looked now and it's over $100 round trip. For commuting you would have to look at where the commuter rail lines go. You can take a look at the online maps forMetroNorth (Westchester), Long Island Railroad, or NJTransit to get an idea of how far out they go. You can also use the maps to see how far average train ride into Penn Station or Grand Central will take. Personally, I would focus on Westchester or NJ but that's just cause I don't like Long Island.
posted by amethysts at 2:42 PM on April 19

Are you asking for the cheapest living accomodations within 1 hour of a certain location in Manhattan? I agree with others that it depends on what part of Manhattan you are talking about, since it can take an hour to get from one end to the other of the island via subway.

How far can a boathouse go in 1 hour?
posted by billtron at 2:44 PM on April 19

Um. Here's a 2 bedroom rental in Denville, NJ, 70 minutes by train from Penn Station, for $1295 a month. Is that the kind of answer you are looking for?
posted by billtron at 2:53 PM on April 19

I live almost exactly an hour from Penn Station, on the Raritan Valley Line (Leave from NY Penn, transfer at Newark), and do the commute every workday (and a good number of weekends). However, if the hour number is really truly important to you, and you've never used NJTransit, you may want to go closer to the city or towards LI/Westchester/CT maybe. NJTransit has a fairly poor on-time record, going only from personal experience. Sometimes it's a larger number than others, but you definitely wouldn't want to set your watch to it.

And if you're planning for the near term be aware that Amtrak is replacing something like 26 miles of concrete ties on the rails on the NorthEast Corridor (they own these rails), which delays NJTransit, Amtrak, and the freight trains, which all delay each other. NJT is trying to change their NorthEast Corridor and Coast Line schedules like every 6-8 weeks to try to adjust for delays.

Schedules are also quite a bit more spaced out on the weekends and late nights, so your hour commute during the regular day may balloon a bit if you are out in the City at night. My line actually goes hourly around 8pm and skips an hour at one point.

It's nice to live out in the 'burbs, with the lower rent, ability(/need) to own a car, and peace and quiet, but getting in "on time" may be a bit of a trial some days. (And it's not always easy trying to get your NY friends to make the long trip out to the suburbs on a regular basis)

I'm only really knowledgeable about central-ish Jersey-- for low(er) cost of living, check out Dunellen and Piscataway. New Brunswick has gotten very expensive in the last couple of years (I lived there when it wasn't quite so shiny). Woodbridge/Iselin/Fords are easy commutes to MetroPark station, which has 2 huge parking structures and a 38 minute express trip to New York Penn (according to the schedule.....). MetroPark parking is $5/day for up to 16 hours of parking. I think it tops out at $9 for 24 hours. Which brings up that issue-- if you have a car, few of the NJ Transit stations have adequate parking. Living in Edison would be good and can have a decent cost of living, but Edison station's daily-pay parking lot fills by around 6am and their permit parking waitlist is about 7-9 years, last I checked. If you have someone dropping you off or can get a place within walking/biking distance, it's an express station with I think a little under an hour commute to NY Penn.

I pay $260/mo for my commuter pass, and $50/mo for my parking permit (and my station has the cheapest parking I've found).

If you give more info about what kind of rent costs you're looking for, we might be able to more accurately whittle down the options.
posted by GreenTentacle at 3:18 PM on April 19

...which city would you recommend moving to?

In addition to rent costs, define "city" too.

Is 60 minutes a hard-and-fast rule? And are you factoring in driving to/parking at the train station? I used to catch the 7:09 out of Fairfield, CT (I'm from Bridgeport, but my ride would drop me in Fairfield, it was on his way), and I'd be in Grand Central by 8:24 (scheduled, but 9 out of 10 times we were at least 5 minutes early). In my experience, the New Haven Line of Metro North is on-time...most of the time (shit happens, but it was usually ontime/early). It gets crowded, but that's why (imho) getting on further up the line is better. I was more than happy to get up 15 minutes earlier than the Stamford folks (they have a quick commute because it expresses after that), but I liked having a comfy seat by the window, as opposed to being in the middle of a 3-seater or leaning on the door.

BUT, even though it was only a little over an hour on the train, it was 2 hours door-to door. I'd leave the house at 6:50ish, get to the station a few minutes past 7 (and I didn't even have to worry about parking), then be at GCT by 8:20. Then I'd get on the subway (6 train), go to 23 St. and walk a few blocks. My class started at 9, I'd usually get there around 8:55 (after grabbing a coffee). Also, 3 years ago, my monthly train pass was around $310.

Also agreeing that off-peak schedules are sporadic. If I missed a train at 9-something pm, I'd be waiting in Grand Central for 45-60ish minutes until the next train. And then I wouldn't get home til 11:30 or so.
posted by AlisonM at 3:46 PM on April 19

Wow. A lot of the above comments are full of indirection, and counter-questions. Try this plain and simple recommendation from my experience:

I have spent many many days (and weeks) over the years in Norwalk CT, where my sister lives. There are two Norwalk stops on the MetroNorth commuter train from Grd Ctrl. One is "So. Norwalk," which is where most middle-class whites don't want to get off at night, and then there's the next stop, "Norwalk". It takes about 50-60 min. from Grd. Ctrl, depending on which train. I don't know real estate prices or rental prices, but I do know that there are quite a few plain-jane, not-yet totally McMansion updated properties, many at a real bargain rate compared to the NEXT STOP on the train (Westport). Norwalk seems like the maids' quarters compared to Westport, yet it is pretty, and quiet, and convenient. Numerous residential blocks are near waterways and inlets (off the Sound), as is the case of my sister's. Sis used to jump on that train and work in midtown Manhattan every day. A nice ride.

For many years I thought of relocating there, but not now, because of intrafamilial emotional stresses. Sigh... (Note: perhaps not many rental units... but not sure.)
posted by yazi at 3:55 PM on April 19

Beacon, NY. About an hour on the metro-north Hudson line. Small city ambiance, was pretty downtrodden for many years, in recent years spruced up with some galleries, cafes, and one hell of an art museum. Great town.
posted by gyusan at 3:56 PM on April 19

If you are <3>
You will have a car at ($ four figures) per year.
Commuting at some hundreds per month.
Time spent commuting--a one-hour ride is generally two hours door-to-door:
= (get to train/bus)+(ride to city)+(get from GrandCentral/PennSta/PAth to destination)
The LAST TRAIN/BUS out of the city--(1AM or so)--no late nights for you!
Did I mention the people who already live in the suburbs?

So you will still be living in car-alarm-land. You just need to escape enough to keep up the requisite appearance of sanity:

You can make small vacationy trips a priority.
Visit friends in the suburbs. Bring a cheesecake. Or good sausage.
If you have $, buy a small place in three-hours-away PA and go there on some weekends.
If you have $$ and ski--Vermont.
posted by hexatron at 4:23 PM on April 19

If you are <35 and childless (or with tiny kids) and have a job, friends, and activities in NYC, living in the suburbs is a big loser.

(it would be nice if < didn't look like < in the live preview, guys)
posted by hexatron at 4:25 PM on April 19

I currently live a 55 minute train ride via Metro-North from Grand Central. My area is probably too expensive for you (I have a special family arrangement), but I can probably advise you about Westchester/Fairfield counties, particularly if you list your rent/buy budget.

That said, the towns I keep up with real estate listings for are Port Chester, Bronxville/Yonkers, Tarrytown, and Beacon (all NY state). Those places are where I'd want to live if I had the choice. Not only that, but if I won the biggest lottery in the world, I still wouldn't move into Manhattan/Brooklyn, even though I work there and probably always will.

To hexatron's points:
- Two cars cost us $1400 a year for insurance.
- The train costs me $233 monthly.
- For reference, if I had to be anywhere in Manhattan at 9 am, I'd get on a train at 7:35 (arrives 8:22). The last train I can take home leaves GCT at 1:53 am, getting me home at quarter-to-three. If I'm visiting out in Brooklyn, I tend to miss that last train because the subways are so slow late at night, so if I'm going out there I would drive.
- I have absolutely no local friends, nor have I met anyone out here or on my commute that I see friend-potential with. However, this is great for me because I go out after work with my friends, then I read books on the train home, and when I'm home, I do my own thing and no one stops by unannounced or asks me to help them move. Friends are fairly reluctant to come out and visit; in fact, they act like they're traveling to the ends of the earth and need to spend the night.
- As to the suburbs being a big loser, well, it depends on how you manage the situation. In our space we've edited films, recorded albums, rehearsed for live shows, staged photographs and directed music videos.
- Please do bring cheesecake and sausage.
posted by xo at 5:12 PM on April 19

Slightly on a side note, but still relevant, I think I'm going to have to second the sentiment about suburbs being "a big loser" if you're under 35, childless, unmarried, etc. I was all of those things when I moved from Brooklyn to a characterless, white-trashy, vinyl siding-coated suburb in NJ, 30 miles outside Manhattan, back in 2000. When I was all of 25. A variety of things (being in jobs that were wrong for me, chronic depression, lifelong issues with being socially anxious and kind of anti-social) had soured me on the New York "dream," and I got so into the imagined thrill of owning my own place and having way more room, out in the 'burbs, then I needed, let alone more than Brooklyn afforded me.

I lived there for six years, and while I now live in a city again (Baltimore this time, instead of New York), I can't help but think those six years took me down a different path than I'd have been on if I were more patient with New York. In a few ways, maybe, it's been better, but overall, I think I really robbed myself of lots of potential experiences, and I guess I'll never fully know what kind of lasting impression that six-year detour has made on my life.

It'd be about 35 minutes on a train (to Metropark), plus 15ish driving. The godforsaken hell on earth town is called Parlin, NJ. To use the parlance of our times, you "do not want."

But a much better suggestion, which someone mentioned earlier: Princeton. It's right about at the hour mark from Penn Station, and is a nice, cultured, university town with all that entails. It's not the cheapest place you could live, but the cute, charming town of Kingston -- which borders Princeton to the north -- can be almost shockingly cheap if you look in the right spots, and it's uncannily gorgeous in spots.
posted by CommonSense at 6:18 PM on April 19

Norwalk, CT is pretty cheap, and will cost you $300 / month Metro North.
posted by jenkinsEar at 7:43 PM on April 19

One consideration in CT is that parking at the train stations ranges from difficult to impossible. You need a monthly permit to park at many of the lots, and quite a few of the towns restrict them to residents, and there may be multi-year waiting lists.
posted by smackfu at 7:50 PM on April 19

I've worked in the city while living on Long Island (Lindenhurst and Long Beach). I like it, but I'm biased. It's a little pricey, but cheaper than Manhattan.
posted by ObscureReferenceMan at 8:49 PM on April 19

Take the Metro North Hudson River line to either Garrison or Cold Spring. You will find what you seek.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 9:11 PM on April 19

Hoboken: you can get to pretty much anywhere in the city save for far east brooklyn or queens or the bronx, within an hour, at any time of the day and night.
posted by spacefire at 9:15 PM on April 19

Explore Northern Westchester County. White Plains, the county seat, is about 45 minutes from Grand Central Terminal. Real Estate is expensive, but it's definitely worth doing research on. Spend a weekend driving around after you explore what you can on the Web.
posted by Lucy2Times at 9:27 PM on April 19

@spacefire: Except hoboken could rarely be thought of as "low cost of living". Apartment rents are about as high as in Manhattan, if not more.
posted by GreenTentacle at 10:28 AM on April 20